Is George Soros funding pro-Obama Catholic groups?
posted at 11:15 am on October 22, 2008 by Ed Morrissey
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Since I’ve been covering the Catholic beat at Hot Air, I’ll tackle the latest revelation on pro-choice Catholic groups stumping for Barack Obama. George Soros has nurtured these groups, which should come as no great shock to anyone except those deluded Catholics who join them (via Michelle):
A Catholic pro-life group says new information adds to the criticism a couple of Catholics organizations have already received for trying to make Barack Obama seem pro-life on abortion. Leading abortion activist and billionaire George Soros is behind the groups.
Catholics in Alliance for the Common Good and Catholics United have been working overtime to mask Obama’s pro-abortion views. The groups have called him pro-life even though he supports unlimited abortions throughout pregnancy for any reason.
In comments sent to LifeNews.com today, Catholic League president Bill Donohue exposes the nexus between George Soros and two left-wing Catholic groups.
In 2006, Soros’ Open Society Institute gave Catholics in Alliance $100,000 (double the amount he gave in 2005), Donohue indicates. In the same year, Catholics in Alliance listed Catholics United on its 990 as an organization with which it has a formal relationship.
Donohue says John Podesta, who runs the Soros-funded organization, Center for American Progress, admits that he works closely with Catholics in Alliance and Catholics United.
I’m inclined to see Soros as a bare-knuckle political operative rather than a monster, but this seems a little odd under any circumstances. Soros isn’t a Catholic, and his interest in Catholic theology is thoroughly self-serving. It’s not even really about abortion per se, but in electing Democrats by confusing Catholic voters, the largest voting religious voting bloc in the US.
Catholics who support or join such groups should be aware of the true intentions of their backers. They don’t have anything to do with salvation in the next life, but political power in this world. They want others to believe that this represents a grassroots movement within the church, but it’s really just another political manipulation by a man who has dedicated his life to the Democratic Party.
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I really wish someone would put plutonium in his soup…
JAM on October 22, 2008 at 11:19 AM
I’m not confused at all….
unclesmrgol on October 22, 2008 at 11:19 AM
I’m surprised there have been few, if any articles, about how much $$$ hedge fund manager George Soros, and key Democratic sugar-daddy, has made during this financial crisis. I wonder why he’s keeping a low profile?
furytrader on October 22, 2008 at 11:20 AM
The sheep’s clothing fits that wolf quite nicley!
Grafted on October 22, 2008 at 11:20 AM
Soros is funding anyone he can in the hopes of overturning American democracy. I need to go find my English-Esperanto dictionary now.
Vashta.Nerada on October 22, 2008 at 11:20 AM
I’d be surprised if these phony groups attracted anyone but cafeteria “catholics” who attend political meetings daily but haven’t attended Mass in years.
Churchgoers know who attends Mass and who does not. They aren’t going to listen to a bunch of interlopers.
NoDonkey on October 22, 2008 at 11:20 AM
I don’t get pro-abortion Catholics.
Just go join the Unitarians….I think you can marry a tree there.
Let’s roll.
ex-Democrat on October 22, 2008 at 11:20 AM
I love how the left bemoans “corporations” as being the big money behind politics.
This hedge fund manager, though? No ill will. How ironic.
Vigilante needed.
MadisonConservative on October 22, 2008 at 11:21 AM
They are trying to befuddle as many people as they can.
I don’t understand why Catholics aren’t responding to the Palin pick with her pro-life cred and why Mccain’s numbers are still behind Bush’s. After all, catholics went hard for Hillary and Obama had problems with them.
promachus on October 22, 2008 at 11:21 AM
I’m very used to politicians putting spin (or ‘nuance’, if you will) on their positions in order to make them more appealing.
But I don’t know if I’ve ever seen a campaign out and out LIE as much as Obama’s does.
Here in Pennsylvania I keep getting Obama mass mailings stating that Obama is all FOR gun rights.
What’s next? Trying to convince us that Obama is pro-capitalism?
Religious_Zealot on October 22, 2008 at 11:21 AM
but, but what? He is certainly monstrous. And that picture is absolutely hideous.
4shoes on October 22, 2008 at 11:23 AM
Senatano Barack Obama estas socialisma ilo
Vashta.Nerada on October 22, 2008 at 11:26 AM
I’m not quite sure what to call him but with his wealth and extreme socialist beliefs the man is dangerous to this nation and certainly there must be a legal way to contain him.
And where are the Conservative counterweights to this guy?
DerKrieger on October 22, 2008 at 11:26 AM
It’s ok though when elite rich people control everything, as long as they aren’t Republican fascist racists.
Riposte on October 22, 2008 at 11:29 AM
They should all be excommunicated.
TheHat on October 22, 2008 at 11:29 AM
Soros was convicted of insider trading; he funds other fraudsters like ACORN.
So I am not surprised in the least. When faced with some left-wing group, it’s always a better question to ask if it’s not funded by Soros.
Karl on October 22, 2008 at 11:30 AM
Soros’ dirty fingerprints are all over The One. What are the odds that the Puppetmaster’s fingerprints will be found in the mortgage backed securities meltdown?
http://www.americanthinker.com/2008/10/hedge_funds_politics_and_the_m.html
Angry Dumbo on October 22, 2008 at 11:30 AM
They should all be excommunicated.
TheHat on October 22, 2008 at 11:29 AM
Done.
Bishop on October 22, 2008 at 11:32 AM
OK, maybe it was a little obscure:
Vashta.Nerada on October 22, 2008 at 11:35 AM
I’m not sure these particular Catholics really care about Soros’ intentions, Ed. To these folks, abortion is the only sacrament that matters.
…it’s really just another political manipulation by a man who has dedicated his life to the
Democratic Partydestruction of the United States as we know it. IMHO.ManlyRash on October 22, 2008 at 11:36 AM
Soro’s looks like he has been on a coke binge! Goodness gracious alive! As I said on another thread. Soro’s is one dangerous SOB. The freaks are starting to come out by the numbers.
sheebe on October 22, 2008 at 11:38 AM
Remember the hub-bub over the SNL skit. what little play it received commented on the Sandlers, but the redo took out the part about Soros as the “owner” of the democratic party. Fear him!
Laura in Maryland on October 22, 2008 at 11:39 AM
and a slippery eel that manages to get off of sinking ships at the last possible moment with the other passengers’ money.
JiangxiDad on October 22, 2008 at 11:39 AM
If they’re out there, they’re probably laying low to avoid having the MSM rip into the private lives of their friends and family. I know I would.
4shoes on October 22, 2008 at 11:39 AM
So the son of the creator of a one-world language is arranging the election of someone who the world supports for president. Sounds one-world orderish to me.
Wait, I forgot, that’s supposed to be BOOOOOOSH! I mean, he only has a couple months left, but JUST WAIT! ALEX JONES TOLD ME SO!
MadisonConservative on October 22, 2008 at 11:40 AM
Barack Esperanto does have a ring to it…
Vashta.Nerada on October 22, 2008 at 11:42 AM
Ed, aren’t some of these Catholics willing accomplices of Soros? By having these groups, they get to have their cake and eat it too– pro-abortion and members in good standing in the church.
JiangxiDad on October 22, 2008 at 11:42 AM
A reminder, The Father, The Son, and the Holy Spirit aren’t too keen on excuses like………..
Enjoy your time in Purgatory, or Hell for that matter, one eternity for every butchered aborted or born baby who survived an abortion that was left to die.
Seven Percent Solution on October 22, 2008 at 11:43 AM
While not Catholic myself, I believe a friend of mine who says, “You can’t be Catholic and pro-choice.” Simply put, these people are not Catholics. The Pope has stated that support of abortion is grounds for ex-communication, giving truth to this. Since the Pope, who as head of the Roman Catholic Church gets to define what being Catholic means, says you can’t be Catholic and pro-choice it must be true. This should be repeated to these “pro-choice Catholics” as often as possible.
Buford on October 22, 2008 at 11:44 AM
I’m a pro-life Catholic and I’m more than able to recognized evil when I see it. G. Soros is a very evil man who wants to destroy this great nation. People need to wake up and see the true before is too late.
pukara61 on October 22, 2008 at 11:44 AM
We ARE?
Spanglemaker on October 22, 2008 at 11:44 AM
This is something that does not exist.
PappaMac on October 22, 2008 at 11:45 AM
Das Volk! Wir brauchen keiner Führer.
JiangxiDad on October 22, 2008 at 11:46 AM
Every anti-American hate group is worshipping Obama. Soros is at the top of that list. He will do anything to destroy our country and Obama is the best man for the job.
volsense on October 22, 2008 at 11:48 AM
Because there aren’t any.
neuquenguy on October 22, 2008 at 11:51 AM
Sorry, I have two gripes with Catholics.
First, the hierarchy and parishioners who either actively covered up or turned a blind eye toward the priest scandals were a disgrace. At some point, society gained a true understanding of what pedophilia is all about, and it couldn’t be addressed by shuffling offenders from parish to parish. I never understood the lack of universal outrage against the betrayal by Catholic leaders. The unwillingness to stand up against church authority was astounding. That’s why I’ve always loathed Obama for his cowardice in not confronting Wright’s views at Trinity. Obama was a coward, agreed, or politically calculating, or some of all three–no qualities of which I admire.
Second, too many Catholics buy into the notion that our federal government is to be a tool of Christian good and, hence, that somehow rationalizes support for Obama and other Democratic candidates. I’m looking forward to the day when the Obama adminstration starts revoking tax-exempt status from denominations that don’t celebrate the gay and lesbian lifestyles, won’t perform gay and lesbian wedding ceremonies, and won’t hire openly gay and lesbian employees. We’ll see how these Catholic (and evangelical) supporters feel about Obama then.
Anyway, maybe I don’t read my Bible enough, but my general understanding is that God instructs us to respect civil authorities, but the work of the church is accomplished in our daily lives–what we do in our families, in our local churches, in our workplaces, and in geographical communities. And these should be the sources for solutions to social problems–not Obama’s federal government. Catholics across the country need to wake up to see where some of their contributions are being used to support.
BuckeyeSam on October 22, 2008 at 11:55 AM
Just another example of the shading dealings of the evil Dark Lord, Darth Soros.
pilamaye on October 22, 2008 at 11:55 AM
Not being Jewish I hold off on telling my friends whether they are good Jews or not.
A Catholic’s baptized into the church and devoted to the sacraments has a relationship to the faith that suffuses their life much more deeply than a vote in a single U.S. election.
dedalus on October 22, 2008 at 11:56 AM
Seriously, considering how strongly Obama defends abortion and if it turns out a majority or even anything close to that of Catholics (or any Christians or any religious group that feels abortion is what it is, the termination of a beating heat, the death of a child) then organized religion will be even more dead to this agnostic than it already is. Hell, I might just go full blown atheist if the majority of the religious/faithful in this country sell their souls for the false promises of socialism.
Yeah, I know that was a bit dramatic and judgmental of me but if the majority in this country are indeed Christian then the results of a McCain victory should be comfortable and welcoming. If not, then religion is just a title with no real merit or bearing on the souls of those voter.
Yakko77 on October 22, 2008 at 11:57 AM
Pro Obama Catholic Groups? LOL. Lets go Unicorn hunting too.
Lets get this damn election over with so this crap can stop.
If he wins he’s gonna wish he didnt, and of he doesnt win, we’ll all be better off, so its a win win.
I myself am praying for rain because I know Dems dont vote in bad weather being the jellyfish that they are.
johnnyU on October 22, 2008 at 12:03 PM
Ich suche nicht einer Fuhrer, aber wir brauchen jemand mit viele geld zu helfen.
DerKrieger on October 22, 2008 at 12:05 PM
Good post, Ed.
Judging by the comments there probably aren’t any true Catholics that are pro-choice, but the deception that Soros is attempting is what needs to be thwarted.
Have you seen any ads by the National Republican Trust debunking these distortions?
Mcguyver on October 22, 2008 at 12:08 PM
You will notice I didn’t say they couldn’t be pro-choice Christians. However, since the Pope says you can’t be a pro-choice Catholic it must be true. While many Catholics in the U.S. tend to think they can go their own way on things, the fact remains that the Pope is the head of the church and that he gets to define what it means to be Roman Catholic. Since the Pope says you can’t be pro-choice and Roman Catholic it must be true. You see it isn’t me that is saying who is or is not a good Catholic, but the Pope. I am just paraphrasing him, and acknowledging that he has the ability to define what does and does not constitute Roman Catholicism.
Buford on October 22, 2008 at 12:09 PM
Rush?
JiangxiDad on October 22, 2008 at 12:11 PM
At Discover the Networks they have an interactive site on everything/one connected to Soros. His “web” puts all spiders to shame.
Tom
marinetbryant on October 22, 2008 at 12:16 PM
Who made the Pope infallible?
dedalus on October 22, 2008 at 12:16 PM
The books to read are Michael Burleigh’s Earthly Power and Sacred Causes.
Radical leftists and revolutionaries don’t just confront religion head on with ridicule (like Dawkins, Hitchens, etc), they infiltrate it and pervert it from within, then they co-opt its symbolism and appropriate it to secular causes.
Soros is working on the perversion part.
Obama is co-opting the concept of the Messiah figure.
Get used to this. More to come, for sure.
jeff_from_mpls on October 22, 2008 at 12:18 PM
I had a bad feeling that Soros is behind the scenes of the concerned efforts to bring down rhe republic. No proof just a bad feeling.
El Coqui on October 22, 2008 at 12:20 PM
If Soros or anyone, for that matter, thinks that a couple of idiot groups masking themselves as standard-bearers of the Catholic faith are going to fool anyone into thinking Barack Obama is anything but a supporter of infantacide, he’s delusional.
D2Boston on October 22, 2008 at 12:25 PM
The Pope isn’t infallible.
You have been deceived, and now you are deceiving.
Sad.
jeff_from_mpls on October 22, 2008 at 12:27 PM
Wir werden Ihnen eine Nationale Zivilsicherheitskraft geben.
jeff_from_mpls on October 22, 2008 at 12:30 PM
You think I’m going to let this go? Come on, you put it out there. . . Imagine a Catholic blaming it on the Jews. . . Surprise Surprise Surprise. ‘Self serving’, ‘manipulative’. . .
It’s a good thing you Catholics are so ‘tolerant’. And so humble too what with the ‘Catholic Pride’ of being the largest voting bloc – THAT VOTES DEMOCRAT.
Of course that’s because ‘Protestant’ isn’t a denomination. . . but there are far more non-Catholic Christians than Catholics in this country. Keep that humble Catholic spirit though. . . such servants of the Lord.
ThackerAgency on October 22, 2008 at 12:33 PM
Underestimate George Soros at our peril. There is something about this guy that doesn’t jive with what he says.
Do a thorough investigation into what he has done in Europe. the billions spent on demonizing the US and changing the culture in the former Soviet satellites. Check out Kyrgyzstan and the rest of the stans. He helped undermine our image with his many little reform institutes overseas.
He owns Obama.
This man does not wear a white hat.
eaglesdontflock on October 22, 2008 at 12:33 PM
It’s a little more nuanced than that. Strictly speaking, the Catholic faith is defined by the Magisterium of the Church in concert with Sacred Tradition and Holy Scripture. The pontiff has no authority to create doctrine or dogma on his own, only to affirm what is already accepted.
According to the Church: Jesus did. The First Vatican Council in the late 19th century defined that infallibility very precisely and it has been invoked by the papacy only twice, to my knowledge, in 1854 when the pope proclaimed the Immaculat Conception of the Blessed Virgin and a hundred years later in 1954 when Piux XII proclaimed as dogma the Assumption of the Blessed Virgin into Heaven.
ManlyRash on October 22, 2008 at 12:34 PM
Of course that’s because ‘Protestant’ isn’t a denomination
It’s not a denomination, it’s an umbrella term for thousands and thousands of theological errors.
Sorry, but that’s the case.
jeff_from_mpls on October 22, 2008 at 12:34 PM
ManlyRash on October 22, 2008 at 12:34 PM
Just a minor point, the Pope, the man, is not infallible. Some of his doctrinal statements are.
Otherwise, you’re right on.
jeff_from_mpls on October 22, 2008 at 12:36 PM
Your knowledge of Catholicism and Catholics in the U.S. is…quaint.
ManlyRash on October 22, 2008 at 12:36 PM
Seldom sad. Many Catholics don’t tie their faith to a single issue in a U.S. election.
dedalus on October 22, 2008 at 12:37 PM
Yeppers. Which is why I pull my hair out whenever the pontiff starts riffing on economic or political matters.
ManlyRash on October 22, 2008 at 12:38 PM
Pro-abortion “Catholics” are like NAMBLA “Catholics”. They make the rest of us cock our heads and say “what the…”
SKYFOX on October 22, 2008 at 12:38 PM
True, that. Catholics in the U.S. are no longer a monolithic bloc, but fractured much like the rest of America, with red state Catholics on one side, blue state Catholics on the other and a sizable number of purple state Catholics inbetween.
ManlyRash on October 22, 2008 at 12:40 PM
It’s been a whiskey-tango-foxtrot moment for me for the past 25 years.
ManlyRash on October 22, 2008 at 12:41 PM
I remember as a kid reading the story about Mount Sinai, when Moses disappeared, for an extended period, the people instantly became pagans, started parading around with golden calf statues, etc. I thought it was so odd to have the truth in your possession, but the next day to forget it and find paganism attractive.
What I didn’t know then, that I know now, is that this is the default condition. People want to believe in their bodies, their will, their choice, their self-esteem, their power.
They have to be pried away from that train wreck, but even if they are, most people will gravitate back toward it.
The gospel isn’t a feel-good thing. It’s a challenge, it’s supposed to shake you up. Most Americans don’t want to be shaken up.
jeff_from_mpls on October 22, 2008 at 12:45 PM
Although, once shook up, it does feel good.
Abby Adams on October 22, 2008 at 12:48 PM
One difficulty we always run into in these discussions is the definition of what it means to be catholic.
More than with any other religious identification, there seems to be a very wide range of people who identify themselves as “catholics”, they typically will fall into one of these categories:
1)”Social Catholic”: Their self-identification as catholics is based on a number of external factors like ethnicity, family history, group identity, etc. Catholicism as a religion is not central to their life. They likely disagree with a wide range of catholic teaching and do not attend Mass weekly if at all.
2)”Independent Catholic”: Typically their catholicism is more central to their lives and has an impact on their external behavior. They are likely to attend mass weekly and be involved in the parish. Sometimes refereed to as “cafeteria catholics” because they might not accept all the definitive teachings of the church, specially on moral issues. Their actions or practices with respect of some of these issues (like support for abortion, practicing contraception, divorce and re-marriage outside the church) might separate them from communion with the church until they seek reconciliation).
3)”(fully)Practicing Catholics”: These are catholics ‘in full communion with the church’. They accept all precepts and definitive teachings of the church, and Catholicism is the single most defining aspect of their lives. The pursuit and development of their relationship with Christ is their highest priority.
According to recent studies more than 50% of people who identify themselves as catholics fall in the first category.
I think that when people make statements like “if you are pro-abortion you cannot be a catholic” they mean that you cannot be a catholic in “full communion” with the church.
neuquenguy on October 22, 2008 at 12:48 PM
That’s part of my point. It took almost 2,000 years for the Catholic Church to establish papal infallibility as dogma, and then it has been invoked infrequently. For non-Catholics to assert that “Pope says X” therefore “you’re no longer Catholic” is reducing a Catholic’s relationship to his faith to a very narrow part of the spiritual life.
The Church is clear–abortion is evil and the taking of a human life. I don’t know how individual Catholics resolve a pro-choice position, but I know some who practice their Catholicism deeply and sincerely who do.
dedalus on October 22, 2008 at 12:50 PM
Did someone just hit Soros with a shovel in that picture?
TheUnrepentantGeek on October 22, 2008 at 12:51 PM
That’s been my experience.
jeff_from_mpls on October 22, 2008 at 12:56 PM
However, it would be a mistake to believe that catholics only owe assent to those teachings of the Magisterium which have been promulgated in an infallible statement.
neuquenguy on October 22, 2008 at 12:58 PM
Sounds like American Jewry. Maybe it’s the way Americans do religion.
JiangxiDad on October 22, 2008 at 1:01 PM
What I don’t get is: what does the old doctor from Scrubs have to do with any of this?
LastRick on October 22, 2008 at 1:05 PM
You’re on to something.
There’s some tension between American values and Catholic principles. In my opinion, Americans are uncompromising on the value of self-determination. But to a Catholic, the idea of absolute self-determination is something to be very skeptical about. I understand that Americans absolutize it, but I honestly don’t get the point of making it the apex of all else. It’s pretty much the antithesis of faith, to my mind…
So, when you breathe the air in America, there’s a toxic element that makes you put yourself above everything else, clouds your thinking, and makes you into an instant authority on everything.
To be blunt, I feel like I’m required to subjugate that extreme self-determination to my faith, and that’s why I could never get any pleasure in “dissenting” from my Church. I think a lot of American Catholics “dissent” strictly for the personal buzz, that rush of self-determination, or self-deification. But again, it’s like a drug, and I have no need for it.
jeff_from_mpls on October 22, 2008 at 1:12 PM
One good thing to come out of this election season, and the endless grey socialist nightmare lying ahead of us: at least it will be easier to explain the Red Scare to our grandchildren. I caught a clip from an old 50s anti-communist movie the other day, and it didn’t seem as quaint and ridiculous as those movies used to.
The old-time Red hunters were foolish and contributed mightily to their own embarrassment and destruction, but they were essentially right about the threat. They just saw it coming from the wrong place. They saw Communist saboteurs as primarily agents of a foreign power, rather than collectivism itself.
Now we’re on the edge of a complete socialist takeover, with all of the country’s political systems completely dominated by proponents of collectivism: education, media, and all branches of the government. Even though the election hasn’t happened yet, we see the same techniques being deployed against the populace: intimidation, propaganda, absurd levels of outright lying without the slightest attempt to correct it. Arguing against socialism is being redefined as unacceptable, and will soon be redefined as illegal, or at least impossible – good luck to the Republican candidate in 2012 or 2016 who tries to take that “free” socialist medical program away.
None of this garbage is native to American political thought, or American’s traditional instincts. It’s been imported in drips since FDR, and now it becomes a flood. And presiding over it all is – surprise! – a foreign mastermind, loyal to his ideology and personal ambitions rather than a particular nation. Our grandfathers would have known better than to let George Soros within a thousand miles of the American political system, and if he kept pushing, they would have stopped him with bullets.
A few generations ago, the threat of collectivist takeover drove people into a blind frenzy. Now they yawn, roll over, and wait for the handouts those invisible, endlessly wealthy “rich” will be compelled to provide. Once upon a time, people went nuts hunting for barely-detectable “conspiracies.” Now the conspiracies are huge, obvious, and documented, with very little interest in hiding themselves, and nobody cares.
Doctor Zero on October 22, 2008 at 1:16 PM
My arguement isn’t based on teh Pope being infalliable. However, as the head of the Roman Catholic Church he does get to define what it means to be Roman Catholic. This is not a matter of infallibility but of the Roman Catholic Church’s right to define the requirements to claim you are Roman Catholic. The Roman Catholic Church by its hierarchal organization gives the Pope this right. As such he has stated (paraphrasing here) that you cannot be a member in good standing with the Roman Catholic Church unless you are opposed to abortion. This is not a matter of theology, but a matter of the right of the Roman Catholic Church to define what its beliefs are. You can disagree with this all day, but that doesn’t make you a member in good standing with the Roman Catholic Church.
I seriously doubt the “Pro-Choice Catholics” are claiming to be Eastern Orthodox or Coptics. Thus they are either trying to deceive others or deceiving themselves when they claim to be “Pro-Choice Catholics.”
Buford on October 22, 2008 at 1:16 PM
I generally agree with that statement, though most Catholics, even devout ones, aren’t fully versed on the types of Magisterium and the ones who are aren’t in full agreement over whether particular teachings constitute ordinary or extraordinary Magisterium.
The encyclical Humanae Vitae which deals with contraception and abortion has been debated, but I believe the teaching from the bishops is that it is part of the Magisterium. Many Catholics struggle with the contraception instruction in the encyclical. They want to have loving sex with their spouse but are not prepared to have unlimited numbers of children. They may rely to some degree on natural family planning but they also balance it with the fear of a pregnancy, especially during financially precarious times.
dedalus on October 22, 2008 at 1:18 PM
(Emphasis Added)
This description appears to be a needlessly conservative description of Sen. Obama’s position on abortion.
Based on his Illinois State Senate voting record, he would appear to support post-natal as well as pre-natal abortions.
Blaise on October 22, 2008 at 1:21 PM
The discussion about Catholicism here is mind-boggling. You guys go ahead and fiddle while your whole friggin’ country goes down the tubes.
Why don’t you talk about what to do about Soros? Eh? The problem is NOT Catholic doctrine folks.
eaglesdontflock on October 22, 2008 at 1:22 PM
I have a figurative “Please Hurry and ****ing Die” list, and George Soros is A #1 On it.
Teddy on October 22, 2008 at 1:27 PM
A Catholic’s relationship with the Church supersedes a single Pope or questions on which of the Church’s teachings need to be translated into public policy.
Should we expect every Catholic voter to follow Pope John Paul II’s teaching on the death penalty? Should the Vatican’s teaching on contraception be American public policy or a private moral decision?
dedalus on October 22, 2008 at 1:34 PM
Vatican II teaches that both Extaordinary and Ordinary magisterium must be given a religious submission of intellect and will.
“The magisterium, moreover, is an authoritative teacher of Catholic faith and morals when it exercises its teaching authority in a manner that is not clearly intended to be infallible. When the bishops teach on matters of faith and morals in their capacity as bishops, they “speak in the name of Christ and the faithful are to accept their teaching and adhere to it with a religious assent (obsequium religiosum) of soul”
The difference is that a catholic can in conscience withhold “ascent of faith” on non-infallible teachings but they must still adhere to the teaching.
Yes, I understand the difficulties with Humane Vitae and I struggle with it myself, but it there is no question that it is a definitive teaching that requires the assent of the faithful. I also understand the fear of unintended results in NFP, but that fear must be to some degree replaced with trust in divine providence, we cannot insist on 100% control.
neuquenguy on October 22, 2008 at 1:45 PM
Unless I am on the wrong thread, the topic presented was about Soros funding groups whose purpose is to confuse catholic voters regarding catholic doctrine.
But you are right that Soros is a great threat to this country. I am amazed how the Democrats, who are always demonizing “big money” are very happy with Soros helping them buy the most expensive election in history.
neuquenguy on October 22, 2008 at 1:54 PM
I modified Ed’s quote a bit.
It’s certainly the largest religious sect in this country and, because Catholics obey a central authority figure and have a very tightly regulated hierarchy, it is potentially a huge voting bloc, unlike some denominations where it seems each minister has a lot of latitude in how he/she runs his/her congregation. Why else would Nancy and Biden try to paint themselves as “good Catholics?”
This is the first election in my life where the Catholic church — even the more liberal “American” CC (there is no such thing, but for a long time the Catholic bishops acted like there was) — has made an effort to clarify for its flock the evil that abortion represents and the fallacy that you can be a “pro-choice” Catholic. It’s very encouraging.
Y-not on October 22, 2008 at 1:54 PM
MY POINT: Catholicism is not the problem, doctrine is not the problem. SOROS is the problem. That he is trying to confuse Catholics is not a doctrine issue, it is a propaganda issue. It is a Marxist issue.
Suppose we talk about neutralizing Soros’ billions? You know, the billions he is using to fund the stupid Catholics. What do we do about that.
eaglesdontflock on October 22, 2008 at 1:59 PM
For the record, I am a Catholic. 16 years of Catholic education. Uncles, Aunts, cousins priests and nuns. 136 first cousins-big Catholic family.
Doctrine can not be argued. The Pope, when speaking on matters of faith and doctrine, is infallible. Period. It is not open to interpretation. If you choose to ignore doctrine, you are not a practicing Catholic.
eaglesdontflock on October 22, 2008 at 2:06 PM
I don’t think we can do anything in the short term other than doing our own little part to try aand get the truth about this election out.
In the long term, I would start by replacing the whole government school system with something that actually teaches people how to think as well as the basic principles of our republic. Next, we need to work at replacing the MSM with an independent and objective press that can serve the purpose of “watch dog” instead of being a propaganda machine. Finally, it would be nice if our institutions of higher learning where actual “institutions of higher learning” and not looney bins where the dumbed-down kids are processed into socialist zombies.
In the mean time maybe some legislation….forget that, McCain already tried and Soros is thanking him for it.
neuquenguy on October 22, 2008 at 2:15 PM
Thanks for the insight. One can make the point that Catholics who don’t follow Humanae Vitae on contraception are out of line with church moral teaching, though I find inappropriate when non-Catholics attempt to discredit someone’s relationship with the Church based on a single issue.
dedalus on October 22, 2008 at 2:23 PM
We have been saying the same thing for 25 years. All the while, the Marxists have been further securing their foothold in our society. Progressive Insurance Company, Berkshire Hathaway, employ tens of thousands of employees. They hire conformists and make sure they all keep thinking the same way. They fund programs in the schools that teach a progressive agenda. They buy media entities, advertising, and spend billions pushing their agenda. It is overwhelming and there is nothing but US – you and me and some of the others here – in the way of their tanks of thought.
We do not have a cohesive answer to George Soros, Peter Lewis, Warren Buffett and the rest of the people who have bought our country. I really hope it isn’t too late. It will take decades to reverse the damage they have done.
eaglesdontflock on October 22, 2008 at 2:31 PM
Agree. These are very deep issues and in the end they come down to each individual’s encounter with their God, and their own struggles along the way. I am grateful for the guidance of mother church, and for the authority that makes that guidance true.
neuquenguy on October 22, 2008 at 2:45 PM
Well, I was “inclined” to see UFOs, Bigfoot and pink elephants until I stopped drinking the same hootch you must be sipping…
Actually, Soros is all about Soros’ money. He bought Petrobras (Brazilian offshore drilling co.) last summer around $50/share ($811 million worth). Petrobras (PBR) is currently trading at $23. I’m sure he bought it because he knows he controls our congress and that there will really be no drilling under his watch. I can’t tell you how it breaks my heart that he is currently down over $400 million… I’m surprised he can still afford to continue to fund folks like “Good Will” in making their donations.
CC – BHO: “my Muslim faith”
CapedConservative on October 22, 2008 at 2:47 PM
I wish it was that simple. Soros has a twisted obsession to force his will on the world. Something really snapped in him during his childhood, living with a Nazi and accompanying him when the Jews were rounded up for the death camps and their property confiscated by his benefactor.
I think he hates religion, humanity, democracy and altruism. His opinion is that people are basically bad, so why legislate morality. Let the cannibals eat each other. More for the rest of us.
eaglesdontflock on October 22, 2008 at 3:37 PM
A better question is how much has Soros funded McCain and what will that be getting him?
Before anyone jumps me I am voting McCain (well, Palin really) but I am deeply troubled by how SOros seems to be betting across the board and covering all the angles.
McCain’s entire exile after 2000, full staff etc was supposedly bankrolled by Soros money. This should be a story.
America1st on October 22, 2008 at 3:48 PM
It looks like Soros has not given to Republicans.
But it is not uncommon for corporate types to hedge their bets and give to both sides.
In this case, I’d say Soros has made his political leanings pretty clear and they are too far left for McCain to cut any deals with him.
Y-not on October 22, 2008 at 4:22 PM
Soros doesn’t like this country as it is and is doing all he can to change it.
I have a simple solution for him that wouldn’t cost him a dime- GO BACK TO GREECE.
He would not be happy there either-I personally think it’s just a power game for him.
There are some things money can’t buy and this election must be quite the challenge for him.
God help us all if Soros/Obama wins.
Gulf Coast on October 22, 2008 at 5:06 PM
Soros has made a fortune short selling the market (in an organized and illegal way) in order to help his manchurian candidate, Barack Hussein Obama, win the election.
Yes George Soros did organize and create the economic meltdown three weeks before the election.
The man should be in prison.
SaintOlaf on October 23, 2008 at 10:00 AM
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