Must-listen: Karl Rove on how Obama and Pelosi blew the bailout
posted at 8:10 pm on September 29, 2008 by Allahpundit
Share on Facebook | printer-friendly
Apparently neither one of them lifted a finger to pressure their toadiest toadies, which means either they’re not taking this seriously or they’re too stupid and/or gutless to lean on their colleagues effectively. You’d think The One at least could flip 12 Democrats by promising to swing by their districts while he’s on the road and turn some water into wine or whatever to help get them reelected. After all, if the polls hold, this is going to be his mess to clean up come January. Waiting only makes it worse. Grab a mop, Messiah. Click the image to listen.
Update: Most members of the Congressional Black Caucus, many of whom come from safe districts and aren’t at risk politically, voted no. Good work, Barry.
You must be logged in to post a comment.
Blowback
Note from Hot Air management: This section is for comments from Hot Air's community of registered readers. Please don't assume that Hot Air management agrees with or otherwise endorses any particular comment just because we let it stand. A reminder: Anyone who fails to comply with our terms of use may lose their posting privilege.
Trackbacks/Pings
Trackback URL
Comments
Comment pages: « Previous 1 2 3 4 Next »
He has 2 days. If he does it tomorrow. 2 days – on the news shows. Every channel. Every network. Press conferences. Sure, there is time. Word of mouth on the right wing blogs will generate phone calls, just like the immigration debate. It’d be colossal.
55% of the people have a good view of him. they do think he’s a straight shooter. Also, offering a plan that has to be passed that guarantees to fix the problem is a sure fire winner.
What’s Obama gonna do? Support this bill; which does not offer to fix the problem? He’d look stupid. It wouldn’t be feasible.
People love solutions; they don’t want bailouts.
lorien1973 on September 29, 2008 at 9:40 PM
Buckeye:
I am from Indiana. I sent Pence an email today and told him that if I lost my job over this I expected him to stop cashing his check from the US Treasury. After all, if he is so all fired up to let the market do its thing, he can go down with the rest of us.
But he won’t.
There was an option for an insurance provision in the bill he voted down. The tax cuts are not a bad idea of course, but then again, this does not address a lot of the problems that are causing the most problems right now.
Plus the fact that Pence is in the minority and so is McCain and they can not make the Majority bring up a vote anyway and there is not much likelihood the Democrats would ever support this. And without them you can’t get it passed.
Terrye on September 29, 2008 at 9:40 PM
And?
TheBigOldDog on September 29, 2008 at 9:41 PM
God, when did man lose his reason?
Save us, my God, if you’re there
God, can you not feel the terror like a fire in the air?
Flash, slash!
Glisten and gash!
Tav on September 29, 2008 at 9:41 PM
lorien1973 on September 29, 2008 at 9:40 PM
Good points all and I hope he goes for this, cause his inaction is starting to frustrate me.
Cardiganfox on September 29, 2008 at 9:43 PM
Asian markets are open and appear to be down 3-4%… no giant drop.
CC
CapedConservative on September 29, 2008 at 9:44 PM
Exactly!
FloatingRock on September 29, 2008 at 9:45 PM
CC:
The Fed pumped 730 billion into the market today?
Well, it lost 1.1 trillion.
It is a credit crisis. Wall Street is just a part of it, if it keeps up the smaller banks will be effected eventually and then smaller businesses.
Terrye on September 29, 2008 at 9:45 PM
I just read in the afternoon newspaper that both Hawaii Democrat Reps. voted NO. I cannot figure that out for the life of me.
HawaiiLwyr on September 29, 2008 at 9:46 PM
Sounds like Roger Waters is concern troll.
Big John on September 29, 2008 at 9:46 PM
Gohawgs:’
If we dedicate weeks and months to “fixing” the root problems we might begin to resemble a third world country. If not that, we will be damaged for years and run by Democrats. Tell me, how likely do you think it is that Barny Frank and Barack Obama and Nancy Pelosi will get to the bottom of anything, but a barrel?
See what I mean? When you are a minority {and we are} you get the best deal you can. Besides right now, we have to stop the bleeding.
Terrye on September 29, 2008 at 9:48 PM
It was a setup. I knew it. I knew it. I knew it. It was just an intuitive reaction to Pelosi’s presser last week, but I knew it to my bones. (Posted the same then also.)
Pelosi intends to string this crisis out as long as politically expedient. Simple as that.
This is war. Team McCain and RNC don’t seem to ‘get it’. Often it seems only one side is fighting.
petefrt on September 29, 2008 at 9:49 PM
Plus I think Roger had some sinister hand in Riick Wright’s untimely demise.
Big John on September 29, 2008 at 9:49 PM
HawaiiLyr:
I heard that a lot of Democrats wanted a stimulus package and all kinds of extra stuff and would not vote for something like this without it.
Terrye on September 29, 2008 at 9:50 PM
Maybe I phrased it incorrectly… I meant “market” in a general sense. The fed pumped $630 billion into the CREDIT market today helping keep credit readily available. Those gamblers that chose to keep their money in the stock market lost $1.1 trillion today. Fortunately, I wasn’t one of those. Then again, maybe some folks weren’t aware that there was a bit of turmoil going on this past week…
CC
CapedConservative on September 29, 2008 at 9:50 PM
mmm hmmmm
yeah, thats it.
anything substantive to say Big John or does the fact that you have no rebuttal to my argument just an admission that you dont understand the issue and therefore have nothing to offer?
Roger Waters on September 29, 2008 at 9:50 PM
petefrt:
That could backfire if it is true. This thing is the real deal.
I don’t know. Whatever else, Pelosi sucks at her job.
Terrye on September 29, 2008 at 9:52 PM
“Plus I think Roger had some sinister hand in Riick Wright’s untimely demise.
Big John on September 29, 2008 at 9:49 PM”
Waters had to fire the geek during The Wall sessions. Wright could never forgive him for that. It was Wright’s fault, he wasnt contributing and wanted 25% of the dough. the dude was always flipped out on cocaine.
Roger Waters on September 29, 2008 at 9:52 PM
CC:
I heard that Bush might sign some kind of Executive Order to try and keep funds available.
Terrye on September 29, 2008 at 9:53 PM
Here, let me explain this in Kindergarten terms for you. If you have a 401K, you are invested in stock. You own as many shares this afternoon as you did this morning. Ten years from now you will still own all those shares which will be worth exponentially more within the next 6 months, once this farce of a crisis passes. Alternatively, if you have a good plan, you will by up tons of cheap, undervalued shares and retire 10 years from now with exponentially more money than you have planned.
Either way, you cannot cash in your 401K before 65 and will likely not remain working until 75, so your argument is as pointless as it is naive.
Folk need to calm down. Everyone still owns the same crap they owned yesterday and has the same debt today as yesterday. If you were with WaMu or Wachovia, you will write the same check to a different lender under the same terms as you always have.
Sure, companies are going to hold off on hiring and cut back on unnecessary employees. Fortunately, most companies have already done that, so even that is a limited risk.
The sooner everyone starts crying over the fact that we were spared the most pathetic, tooth fairy economic plan in history (along with the pending false rebound that would have lasted long enough for Wall St. to admit that is accomplished nothing) the sooner things will stabilize.
The problem is less about a legitimate crisis than it is about uncertainty and panic. You want certainty? Stop the gov’t from making BS promises, engaging in unfounded speculation and making stupid and false announcements.
You think I am naive? Look at last weeks market- when things actually did go legitimately wrong. The market rebounded within days from a panicky sell off and came out stronger for getting rid of deadbeat companies and a bunch of air.
Damiano on September 29, 2008 at 9:53 PM
I’m not sure he needs to… they are currently working off some new monetary theory that operates on the basis that since the money is based on the “full faith and credit” and all that jazz… that the supply of money is infinite. I’m not kidding… Really. On that basis, the Fed can put out as much as they want whenever they want. The skids will be greased but those holding the credit default swaps won’t be bailed out. I couldn’t believe it but I read it a couple of days ago…
CC
CapedConservative on September 29, 2008 at 9:56 PM
See? You just dont get it. This isnt a stock market crisis. Its a credit crisis. When companies can no longer borrow, they will be forced to retrench.
Roger Waters on September 29, 2008 at 9:35 PM
Much that is weak may be destroyed, and if so, new sources of power will emerge afterward. Meanwhile, millions of new homes have been built. After their prices have crashed, perhaps I will buy one.
But bankers will remember to lend. That’s what they do.
Kralizec on September 29, 2008 at 9:56 PM
Rep Thaddeous McCotter’s proposed bill – I like the name!
“Expedited American Recapitalization — Now” Act
(EARN Act)
1. Expedited American Recapitalization — Now (EARN) Proceedings: A sunset bill that makes available to financial institutions a pre-packaged recapitalization (EARN) proceeding in which debt forgiveness is expedited. (This is similar to expedited bankruptcy proceedings. The strike warrant price will determine values.)
2. Inducement to EARN Proceedings: To induce financial institutions to undergo EARN proceedings, future government recapitalization (if necessary) may not be offered to a financial institution which does not go through an EARN proceeding.
3. Incentivize Private Recapitalization: If, within a limited one year window (commencing upon this legislation’s enactment into law), a person invests in (i.e., recapitalizes) a financial institution that has undergone an EARN proceeding, this investment over its lifetime is subject to a ZERO capital gains tax rate. If, within the same one year window, a person purchases a toxic asset, this investment over its lifetime is subject to a ZERO capital gains tax rate.
4. Government Backstop: If no private capital is forthcoming, the government can take a preferred equity stake in an EARN financial institution. No dividends may be paid to any other investor until the taxpayers’ claim is redeemed with appropriate interest. The government shall also hold voting rights, as determined by the percentage of its equity shares owned, in an EARN financial institution only until such time as the taxpayers’ claim is redeemed with appropriate interest. (This addresses CEO salaries and bonuses without permanently vitiating the private sector’s setting of compensation.)
5. Distressed Homeowner Relief: 5% of all government recapitalization invested in an EARN financial institution must be dedicated to an across-the-board reduction in the face value of “toxic” mortgages. This will help keep people in their homes; stabilize the foreclosure crisis; and begin to stabilize and raise all homeowners’ values.
6. Non-EARN Financial Institutions: Financial institutions choosing not to participate in an EARN proceeding, may wall off their toxic assets (as determined by the Secretary of the Treasury) which were purchased between December 2003 and August 2007. For these toxic assets, the current mark-to-market rule will be suspended and replaced with a more accurate three year rolling average mark-to-market; and for a fee, insurance of these toxic assets can then be purchased from the federal government. If, within the above referenced one year window a person purchases a toxic asset, this investment over its lifetime is subject to only HALF the capital gains tax rate applicable at present; if the capital gains tax changes, the toxic asset’s purchaser possesses the option, upon alienating the toxic asset, of being taxed at the capital gains rate applicable at the enactment date of this legislation into law.
7. Market Transparency and Congressional Oversight: To ensure Market Transparency, the Secretary of the Treasury is empowered to examine any and all appropriate financial records at any time of financial institutions and individuals covered under this act; and Congress at any time may request of the Secretary of the Treasury any and all information required to protect the taxpayers’ investment incurred under this act.
8. End “Too Big To Fail”: Make an express commitment to a future, pro-active regulatory system in which a market share cap provision is imposed upon financial institutions to prevent future taxpayer bailouts and market meltdowns due to entities deemed “too big to fail.”
9. American Families’ Prosperity Package: Make an express commitment to further American families’ prosperity in a free market future by enacting pro-growth legislation, including, but not limited to: an “all of the above” American energy security plan; income tax and capital gains relief; the repeal of Sarbanes-Oxley; suspend the mark-to-market rule for all financial institutions for six months and replace it with a more accurate three year rolling average mark-to-market; GSE privatization; and dollar stabilization. (See Gingrich and RSC proposals.)
10. Ultimate Cost to Taxpayers: ZERO!
sandspur on September 29, 2008 at 9:58 PM
I live in SW Florida. Come on down.. you can currently buy a number of homes that sold for $350K 2-3 years ago for $80-$90K. You can also get all the money you want from local banks for a mortgage (assuming your credit is good… no CRA to worry about). You can get up to $10K down payment assistance with local programs and get a 3% FHA mortgage. It’s still easy, if you have decent credit.
CC
CapedConservative on September 29, 2008 at 9:59 PM
Yes, and it’s fun to feed them sometimes, with a sharpened stick.
Kralizec on September 29, 2008 at 9:59 PM
Here, let me explain this in Kindergarten terms for you. If you have a 401K, you are invested in stock. You own as many shares this afternoon as you did this morning. Ten years from now you will still own all those shares which will be worth exponentially more within the next 6 months, once this farce of a crisis passes. Alternatively, if you have a good plan, you will by up tons of cheap, undervalued shares and retire 10 years from now with exponentially more money than you have planned.
Either way, you cannot cash in your 401K before 65 and will likely not remain working until 75, so your argument is as pointless as it is naive.
Damiano on September 29, 2008 at 9:53 ”
Hey stupid, what if you are 62 to 65 years old TODAY??? I guess then you are F’ed.
Stupid dude…real stupid
Roger Waters on September 29, 2008 at 9:59 PM
HT: Powerline
Wethal on September 29, 2008 at 10:01 PM
That is exactly what it is. Obambi at any cost. Even at the cost of a global depression.
Sick.
techno_barbarian on September 29, 2008 at 10:02 PM
I agree that the time is ripe for McCain to come out with a solution, but what are the odds he’ll do it?
AubieJon on September 29, 2008 at 10:02 PM
*shrugs*
Damned if I know. Obama is the same idiot as always and McCain is an enigma when he’s up to shenanigans. Look what happened to the “sure pick” of Pawlenty or Romney.
The catch is, McCain’s usually right when he starts playing things close to the chest. People can whine all they’d like about Palin’s quiz answers… fact is that McCain would have been twice as far behind with Romney or Pawlenty and Obama would have kept most of (or even increased) his convention bump.
McCain was also counted out in the primaries, with the surge and with countless other issues.
That said, he’s sure as hell driving me nuts and if this is a clever plan, he better spring it soon before he loses the party.
Damiano on September 29, 2008 at 10:02 PM
Well Genius, if you are 62 to 65 years old TODAY, then you should not have had that much of your savings in the stock market.
Genius dude…real genius
MB4 on September 29, 2008 at 10:02 PM
What arguement Roger, your as incoherent as Barney Frank!
dmann on September 29, 2008 at 10:03 PM
Well, if it were me, I’d have moved the money invested to t-bills…
Oh, that’s your third argument that someone is stupid because they disagree. Tell me, I’m curious. Is that a moonbat secret training requirement? To respond in a debate with “your stupid”? What’s next? Name calling? I’m rubber and you’re glue.. whatever you say bounces of me and sticks on you. Tell me the the secret phrases to use… I wanna be a moonbat too.
CC
CapedConservative on September 29, 2008 at 10:05 PM
Slim to none. That’s why he’s gonna lose in a landslide. And it’s going to be a bad decade or two for the republicans.
lorien1973 on September 29, 2008 at 10:06 PM
The only stupid person post here is you, you f**king imbecile. But, like most of the hopelessly moronic, you are far too stupid to even comprehend the depth of your ignorance.
If you are retiring next week… yeah, you may have problems and will have to hold off for a bit. If you are stupid enough to believe that today’s numbers will last past the next 60 days or so, then you should be in an institution without shoelaces or sharp objects.
Now drag your worthless, ignorant ass back to Kos or whatever similar sewer you crawled out of. Adults are talking here. When you learn to express an opposing view, engage in reasoned debate and speak without juvenile insults, you can come back.
Damiano on September 29, 2008 at 10:07 PM
Yes. The aftermath may be quite good for many who thought $200 / sq. ft. seemed just wrong.
Kralizec on September 29, 2008 at 10:08 PM
agree with lorien 1973
Roger Waters on September 29, 2008 at 10:09 PM
Those who voted no to this bill on the left are socialists to the extreme (or at least as far left as an American can get), many of the issues they wanted resolved (or seemed to think needed resolving) were not addressed in this bill and therefore they didn’t vote for it, the MAJORITY of Democrats voted for the bill, nonetheless.
What the genius that isn’t Karl Rove, doesn’t point out, is that this was a compromise piece of legislation (sure enough any legislation supported by the House Democrats, Republican White House, and the somewhat Independent Treasury is a compromised piece of legislation). Therein the majority of both parties should vote for the bill and therein it should pass. However, the House Republicans did not take to the compromise, they wanted things their way and they didn’t get it, and they showed the boss they didn’t get it (I guess in another sense they, still don’t get what they’ve done).
Now, not only do we not have legislation, but there is no whiff of any passable legislation down the line. As the Asian markets collapse this evening, and Washington turns to partisanship, you’d think in times of trouble the people would be working together to resolve the crisis. But the media that are the Blogs (like this one), that are the newspapers, and are the television news promulgate this partisanship effectivly stoking the flames of the citizenary’s idiocy (which got us into this mess) and assuring a swifter end to any light they may have existed on the other end of the tunnel.
PresidenToor on September 29, 2008 at 10:09 PM
A pessimist sees the difficulty in every opportunity. An optimist sees the opportunity in every difficulty.
- Winston Churchill
MB4 on September 29, 2008 at 10:09 PM
Terrye, I’ve resisted taking this position for what seems like a long time now, but I believe Pelosi and ilk would throw this country into crisis and turmoil in a heartbeat, whenever she thought it expedient. Yes, of course it could backfire. But she decides our fate on the basis of her calculation of the political risks versus political rewards, without regard to country. And she knows MSM will not just cover for her, but be her echo chamber, repeating her lies until eventually they are accepted as fact.
petefrt on September 29, 2008 at 10:11 PM
“If you are retiring next week… yeah, you may have problems and will have to hold off for a bit. If you are stupid enough to believe that today’s numbers will last past the next 60 days or so, then you should be in an institution without shoelaces or sharp objects.
Damiano on September 29, 2008 at 10:07 PM”
HA HA HA!! What a tool. How about 5 years to recapture whan the market is going to do over the next 45 days as the credit crisis led recession hits. Where do you get off saying it will only last 60 days. What a clown. People who do this for a living will tell you otherwise.
Roger Waters on September 29, 2008 at 10:12 PM
Most 401k’s offer varying levels of risk depending on the target horizon. Now if someone at 62 to 65 is in high risk and was planning on retiring next week then sounds like they’re SOL. Looks like they’ll be punching the clock for a few more years.
burnitup on September 29, 2008 at 10:12 PM
Why not a criminal prosecution?
Let’s start with the graft of ACORN and La Raza, and name the names of the Leftist politicians that enable them……… one of them is Obama.
Why not bring up and explain to the American people how this all started?
Seven Percent Solution on September 29, 2008 at 10:14 PM
Again, I cannot access the johnny dollar link. How about a youtube link or something that works with the accursed Vista instead of his site, if he can’t handle the traffic?
I did see Rove on O’Reilly, and I buy his explanation. Pelosi wanted to give cover to her vulnerable Dems, so she wanted the Reps to give her the passing votes. At the same time, a Dem was on NPR saying how they would use this vote against the Reps in November. The Reps rebelled, and the rest is history. Good for them!
Nice going, Nancy, fiddling while Rome burns. I hope this ends your sorry career.
PattyJ on September 29, 2008 at 10:14 PM
Screw that. I can deal with a Great Depression under McCain (even though it won’t come to that). I will not live with even a recession… or hell even a fair tale surplus… under Obama.
The day Obama wins is the day a bullet enters my skull, especially under these conditions. A world with Obama/ Pelosi and Reid pulling the strings where we are on the cusp of an Iran/ Israel war, Iraq barely getting stabilized, Afghanistan and Pakistan escalating, Russia stretching is muscles, the US military at it weakest in decades and the US economy on a nasty downward spike?
Nah… ya’ll enjoy yourselves. I will take the quick way out.
Damiano on September 29, 2008 at 10:14 PM
Oh yeah? Well I say that people who do this for a living say it will only last 6 days! (hey… this being a moonbat libtard thing is fun… you can just make shit up… whatever you like… sorta like being 12 again).
CC
CapedConservative on September 29, 2008 at 10:15 PM
And I thought I was pessimistic.
lorien1973 on September 29, 2008 at 10:16 PM
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2008/09/29/politics/politico/thecrypt/main4487883.shtml
There’s an interesting article on CBS saying that one reason why the bailout bill might have failed is a counter-proposal from FDIC chairman William Isaac, who had talked to several Republican Congressmen, including Darrel Issa (R-CA).
According to Issa,
It’s not clear from the article what “tools” could be used by the FDIC, but it might be worth looking into. What does the FDIC chairman William Isaac have up his sleeve, that could save both the banks and taxpayer money?
Ed? Allah? What do you think of this?
Steve Z on September 29, 2008 at 10:18 PM
It’s quite simple, when the crap sandwich failed, it was bi-partisan.
tarpon on September 29, 2008 at 10:18 PM
Roger Waters on September 29, 2008 at 9:59 PM
Hey 401k and IRa can be tapped at 59 1/2 years old.
unseen on September 29, 2008 at 10:19 PM
Damiano on September 29, 2008 at 10:14 PM
Be more productive and lay the ground for something greater than yourself. Get into government or start a grassroots effort to take back the White House or a movement for secession or move to another country I don’t know, but these are all better things than suicide.
Cardiganfox on September 29, 2008 at 10:19 PM
To which you have made very apparent…does not include you. When we have a thread on the best way to change the oil in the french fry machine, we’ll kick you in the ass for an opinion.
BigWyo on September 29, 2008 at 10:19 PM
Terrye 9:48,
I don’t remember writing “waiting months to fix the root problem”…What’s stopping any ONE of the House Republicans from holding a press conference tomorrow to announce that when Nancy Lugosi turns the lights back on on Thursday that he/she will move to introduce a bill to fix the underlining problem. If the motion to consider the “fix” is not taken up all the cameras from CSPAN will record that moment. Then the people, and maybe even some pundits, will ask themselves “why not fix the problem before throwing money at it?”
All it would take is some gumption and few minutes, not months…
Gohawgs on September 29, 2008 at 10:20 PM
If you’re 62 to 65 years old, you’re–twelve years from being too old to work. You’re thirteen years from dying horribly, as most of us will. And you’re twenty years past the age at which you should have begun to view everything from the standpoint of the young–again.
Kralizec on September 29, 2008 at 10:21 PM
asian markets currently down about 4%
CapedConservative on September 29, 2008 at 10:23 PM
Holy Sh!t. Newt just mention this on Greta and I couldn’t believe it. I had to read it for myself:
Behind Insurer’s Crisis, Blind Eye to a Web of Risk
TheBigOldDog on September 29, 2008 at 10:25 PM
Nah, if it gets to that point, I’d rather go out with a bang than a whimper. If it comes to that point, I’d rather go out fighting. If it comes to a fight for our liberty, they’ll have to shoot me before I shoot them.
But then again, easy for me to say. I’m old enough not to fear death, but young enough still to fight.
petefrt on September 29, 2008 at 10:26 PM
Get this people: (from that linked above):
TheBigOldDog on September 29, 2008 at 10:32 PM
Credit defalt swaps…. let me repeat from other threads.
THIS IS WHAT THEY ARE TRYING TO BAIL OUT. The current balance of them is $60 TRILLION. To put that number in perspective, the total stock market at 2007 end was $22 trillion… all mortgages $7.1 trillion.
CC
CapedConservative on September 29, 2008 at 10:32 PM
Not fun. But I think the USA market will probably recover in 3-5 years, give or take a couple, and I’m too far down now (about 8%) to sell (except in panic). I haven’t been doing any day trading lately, and my portfolio seems reasonably balanced. So I plan to ride out the storm.
Yeeehawww! :(
petefrt on September 29, 2008 at 10:36 PM
Anyone remember this…………………….?
Republicans Wither Under Weight of Democratic Investigations
So……………… we have seen this coming for years, the Republicans tried to stop it, the Democrats blocked it, and now we are to understand we all have to take a bite of an enourmous sh%t sandwich.
………….. When will the Investigations start?
And no………….. I will not settle for {crickets chirping}. There is a Legion of American citizens so pissed off, we stopped the vote today.
The Democrats are caught on tape, along with thier votes, and the people who enabled this and took money are known.
Just think of Chis Dodd and Barney Frank in “Brokeback Mountain”.
THIS is the election.
THIS is the message that should be shouted every day.
THIS is the future of our Country.
Seven Percent Solution on September 29, 2008 at 10:38 PM
I am having trouble making up my mind. I’m not sure if Roger is someone who learns more and more about less and less and ultimately knows everything about nothing or if he is someone who learns less and less about more and more, and ultimately knows nothing about everything.
MB4 on September 29, 2008 at 10:38 PM
So I was at NewsBusters right before I came here and saw this headline about half way down
Now if true doesn’t this mean he can’t be POTUS?
tee866 on September 29, 2008 at 10:41 PM
I am very concerned about how bad things are going. Not about McCain or Obama winning (or not) that is irrelevant. It is how in the bag the MSM is for Obama and how willing many are to derail the economy (both pro Obama folks and those WTO conservative anarchists who want to see a melt down to bring on a mythical conservative age).
I do not like this government intervention either, but if we are going to Ron Paul route we need to be honest about what that means. The tough love route might work in the long term, but it only works if you are consistent. A hybrid Ron Paul hands off approach with a massive Democratic entitlement expansion is a recipe to Argentina style economics. This is a very big deal and people better start wrapping their heads around that.
Mr. Joe on September 29, 2008 at 10:43 PM
I certainly hope you’re being dramatic. Even if you eat the bullet what about the future generations that will inherit this crap.
Hey, if Obama wins, and despite these polls I really think McCain will pull it out, we will need every one of us to fight this filthy, evil, lying MSM/Marxist regime.
“Never give in, never give in, never; never; never; never – in nothing, great or small, large or petty – never give in except to convictions of honor and good sense.”
- Winston Churchill
mrsmwp on September 29, 2008 at 10:44 PM
What’s the former chief executive og Goldman doing inviting the current chief executive to the meeting, being the only outsider, when Goldman has $20B at stake in what happens to AIG? Why then does that former exec decide to bailout AIG and not Lehamn? What’s a current officer doing lying to the world about the size of their AIG risk:
$20B is immaterial?
This is why Goldman was being shorted so heavily. People knew. Then what did the former exec of Goldman (you know, the Treasury sec) do? He got the SEC to halt shorting of Goldman….man this all stinks to high heaven!
TheBigOldDog on September 29, 2008 at 10:45 PM
“we will need every one of us to fight this filthy, evil, lying MSM/Marxist regime.”
mrsmwp on September 29, 2008 at 10:44 PM
DAMN RIGHT
Cardiganfox on September 29, 2008 at 10:45 PM
Please, guys & gals, don’t feed the trolls! The more you do, the more they comment. If you don’t feed them, they will get bored and (hopefully) go away.
This thread has been a troll-feeding distraction.
Neocon Peg on September 29, 2008 at 10:45 PM
Roger=All those real men of genius commercials! LOL!
Especially Mr. Used Car salesman and the leisure suit one! Bring back the real men of genius commercials!
On a sad note, the Steelers suck this year. On the up side the Eggles lost! Yippeee! On a bizarre note, Ole Miss beat Florida and Alabama is for real.
freeus on September 29, 2008 at 10:46 PM
Whooa. Time for a second look.
petefrt on September 29, 2008 at 10:46 PM
Thanks, Seven. I needed that.
petefrt on September 29, 2008 at 10:51 PM
$14 trillion…
TheBigOldDog on September 29, 2008 at 10:52 PM
I guess 80% of Americans, including conservatives and liberals, would rather fight an all-out civil war than work together once every 5 years for the good of the country.
I hope you all are really happy with what’s coming.
indythinker on September 29, 2008 at 10:59 PM
Yeah Paulson should resign or be fired over the AIG thing. Paulson has been a screw up for the past few weeks though.
Shift gears … reduce capital gains to zero (flood market with private investment capital), cut corporate taxes to something around ten percent or less (give them incentive to work through this), and try Newt’s idea of shelving the “mark to market” accounting practice that we impose on these investment firms. Give it a try before flushing 700B down the drain … see what happens. Just give it two weeks and see.
HondaV65 on September 29, 2008 at 10:59 PM
I agree with Paulson resigning. If it gets more votes, do it.
indythinker on September 29, 2008 at 10:59 PM
When we hit the depression, come see me. I’ll give you a case of canned food.
csdeven on September 29, 2008 at 10:59 PM
Ecstatically happy! While all those who weren’t prepared for this sell their fancy cars and over priced homes for pennies on the dollar, I’ll be there to take them off their hands.
csdeven on September 29, 2008 at 11:01 PM
indythinker on September 29, 2008 at 10:59 PM
Kneel before Zod, kiss the ring of overlord Pelosi!
Nope, I’ll fight the good fight and die tryin’ rather than exist as a whore!
dmann on September 29, 2008 at 11:10 PM
bingo, if people understood this they’d understand and beg for some ‘bail out’.
I think Govt. needs to annul these contracts or buy all the bad mortages and thus ‘guarantee’ them.
This is a National Security issue at this point
jp on September 29, 2008 at 11:23 PM
dang, Kerry on O’Reily is just pathetic. what a scumbag
jp on September 29, 2008 at 11:24 PM
+1. He should be investigated along with Dodd, Franks and the others.
FloatingRock on September 29, 2008 at 11:33 PM
…I should clarify: possibly he should be investigated. Prior to TheBigOldDog’s comments about the NYT article I only thought Paulson was incompetent. It wouldn’t surprise me if there’s more to it than that, but I don’t have enough information to say there is.
FloatingRock on September 29, 2008 at 11:41 PM
I wonder if the House is thrilled with having caused a world wide recession? and then going off on holiday and ignoring it altogether. They should revel in their success–few folks in history have done anything like it.
jeanie on September 29, 2008 at 11:51 PM
I think that the chicken littles are overstating this. Create a crisis and then say that govt. is the ONLY way of fixing it. How about let’s do nothing this time around.
Mojave Mark on September 29, 2008 at 11:53 PM
What do the crazies think? This is a manufactured crisis, a la “Road to Serfdom” and Bush is doing this now(which hurts McCain and helps Obama) because he’s just getting ready to declare Dictatorship?
jp on September 29, 2008 at 11:56 PM
What’s hard about this? Pelosi and Obama didn’t want it to pass, they want an economic crisis. Why? Well, haven’t Obama’s poll numbers gone up since the meltdown? This is about getting him the White House, pure and simple.
Jim-Rose on September 29, 2008 at 11:57 PM
As you of course know, Bush sold ‘compassionate conservatism’ in the 90’s and thereafter. I say give me a break. Screw ‘compassionate conservatism’. The slogan itself insults us. If we can’t argue the moral grounds for capitalism any better than this, (and without ceding their basis premise we are uncompassionate), then we’re goners.
Besides, if I were to subscribe to compassionate capitalism, I’d say, “Compassionate capitalism, thy name is csdeven”.
:)
petefrt on September 29, 2008 at 11:59 PM
LOL! Sorry, JP, it’s nothing personal, but I finally had to laugh at all of you chicken-littles—running around, squawking about the end of the world being neigh, mystified that so few will listen, thinking they must be crazy…. Pretty funny stuff. Oh, I know, there’s nothing funny about the end of the world and all that. I get it… really, I do.
FloatingRock on September 30, 2008 at 12:03 AM
“..about getting(Obama)in the White House” Well, that would only make sense IF the majority of nay votes weren’t GOP. Because of that last fact, Obama WILL be in the White House. Depend on it! Conservatives have as they say” cut off their nose to spite their face”.
jeanie on September 30, 2008 at 12:06 AM
You’re making it too complicated. Yes, the GOP had the majority of nays, as expected. The Dems could have won if they’d “whipped” their members, but they didn’t and for the reason I stated.
Jim-Rose on September 30, 2008 at 12:12 AM
DO NOT USE KARL ROVE AS A REFERENCE FOR THIS TOPIC. HE IS AT FAULT.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vLUbb2DUYGk
bucktowndusty on September 30, 2008 at 12:16 AM
Men, it has been well said, think in herds; it will be seen that they go mad in herds, while they only recover their senses slowly, and one by one.
- Charles Mackay
MB4 on September 30, 2008 at 12:19 AM
I’m NOT making it complicated at all. It’s simple really. The media will point out repeatedly that the majority of nays were GOP, thus they are at fault. That’s how simple it will become.
jeanie on September 30, 2008 at 12:29 AM
That doesn’t make it right, and the Republican party shouldn’t be held hostage to MSM propaganda. I hope you’ll agree that it shouldn’t be countenanced but rather fought. If you disagree, why? If you agree, what was your point?
FloatingRock on September 30, 2008 at 12:35 AM
Comment pages: « Previous 1 2 3 4 Next »