Bailout deal reached; Update: ACORN, other pork removed
posted at 10:24 am on September 28, 2008 by Ed Morrissey
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Negotiators on Capitol Hill finally reached an agreement on a sweeping bailout of the financial sector by the Treasury early this morning, attempting to head off bank runs and panics around the world when the Asian markets open tonight. The plan includes options for asset insurance that House Republicans demanded, as well as broad accountability for actions taken by Treasury in purchasing assets. The deal also allows a wider group of banks to rid themselves of the toxic assets, created in large part by Congress over the last ten years:
A summary of the tentative agreement released by Ms. Pelosi’s office said the plan “gives taxpayers an ownership stake and profit-making opportunities with participating companies; puts taxpayers first in line to recover assets if a participating company fails; (and) guarantees taxpayers are repaid in full — if other protections have not actually produced a profit.” (See Ms. Pelosi’s summary.)
Additionally, the summary said the legislation will expand the range of firms that can sell troubled assets to the government to include pension plans, local governments and community banks serving “low- and middle-income families.” …
The summary issued by Ms. Pelosi’s office said the legislation will include provisions giving Treasury the ability to work with cash-strapped homeowners whose mortgages are purchased by the federal government to refinance into a more affordable mortgage. Other foreclosure-prevention measures included in the agreement are an extension of the tax holiday for homeowners who face foreclosure, as well as a tax break for community banks who held shares of Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac. The rescue plan will allow affected banks to take an immediate tax deduction on losses from investments in the two firms, which were taken over by the federal government earlier this month.
Lawmakers also included provisions allowing them to keep a close eye on the Treasury program, including a bipartisan oversight board appointed by members of both parties in Congress, an inspector general to monitor Treasury decisions, and regular audits from the Government Accountability Office. Additionally, Treasury will be required to make transactions made through the troubled asset program available publicly online. Unlike the original Treasury proposal, which would have given the department legal immunity in the program, the tentative agreement reached late Saturday allows for judicial review of Treasury decisions.
This looks like the rare occasion when Congress manages to improve an idea. The original Paulson plan would have imposed immunity from legal action on any moves made by the Treasury, exactly the wrong direction for a crisis already caused by unchecked government manipulation. In the new plan, Treasury officials have accountability for their management of the $700 billion plan.
The new agreement may have made the plan larger, but the politics of this probably required it. In the original Paulson plan, the bailout focused solely on the institutions choking on the government-mandated Mortgage Backed Securities (MBS) and credit swaps based on them. Congress broadened this to give more direct relief to homeowners facing foreclosure and eviction. While more painful in the short run, it will probably make the economy more stable in the long run, and give the securities the Treasury buys more value, as foreclosures are a severe loss for the lenders. If we can keep people in the homes and help them to pay back the mortgages, we may not lose much money at all over the next 25 years.
Some will complain that this will bail out foreign institutions as well as American banks. That is the result of the government’s creation and sale of MBSs as investment products to people around the world. Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac sold MBSs to anyone who would buy them, and both Americans and foreigners bought them with the implicit backing of the US government. Congress made that grave error in the 1990s and created an entire class of junk bonds worse than anything seen in the 1980s, although with some handholding, we may get to see value out of them yet.
This will still be a painful lesson for us about government manipulation of markets. We will have to tighten belts and cut spending to pay for the initial outlay from this bailout, and we still have another financial crisis coming on entitlements to resolve. However, this agreement — as painful as it is — will probably make the difference between a recession and a global collapse. Those of us with market assets will almost certainly not have to worry about Monday, and the possibility of watching them get wiped them out in a panic.
After this, we need to demand humility from Congress on economic policy. Government-imposed “fairness” led to this catastrophe, and we’ll pay the price for the Community Reinvestment Act and the manipulations of Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac for a generation. Had we allowed the market to work normally, this never would have happened.
Update: The funding of the Housing Trust Fund, the slush fund that feeds ACORN and La Raza, is out. You can thank House Republicans for enough obstructionism to get that result. Other changes made to the final version of the bailout, according to a source on the Hill, were the removal of several provisions:
- Provision to provide unions and other activist groups with proxy access for corporate boards
- Provision to mandate shareholder votes on compensation issues (union priority)
- Diversion of funds into a housing fund to support left-wing activist groups like ACORN
- A provision to allow trial judges to arbitrarily adjust mortgages, creating bonanza for trial lawyers
- A provision to require the government to sell to state and local governments at a discount homes the government acquires as a result of foreclosure
It also suspends mark-to-market rules and requires a study on their effects on the collapse.
Update II: Just to clarify, the bullet points are items removed from the plan. Sorry; it was very unclear.
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Forgive my “ham-handedness.” Still, Jefferson was dealing with a monarchy. The concept of communism had not been developed in his time. Today we are being subjected to a revolution of the worse kind. “A little revolution” may serve to change the tactics of those who seek to take over this country, but it will not stop them. You show little respect for Jefferson to think that his concept of defending the republic would not change with the times. IMHO
But, I make no argument with you about this so as not to distract from the subject at hand. Perhaps, Jefferson would support a rebellion of a handful of farmers…but, to what end in today’s world?
genso on September 28, 2008 at 12:38 PM
Survey:
If you have money in the market today, are you going to keep it there?
Well, there it is.
CC
CapedConservative on September 28, 2008 at 12:39 PM
As far as I know right now, from all that I’ve read, the insurance aspect is only optional, not mandatory. And according to at least one Hill source to KLo, the ACORN stuff was just smoke and mirrors to begin with, to push the bill so far to the left that it could be “dropped” to make it look like the dems gave up something they wanted. The only thing that I see, from Ed’s post and the article, is that it the amount has been chopped up, but the scope has gotten bigger, which will in turn yield calls for more funding. In addition there will be a “bipartisan” oversight committee that, if it functions as well as the oversight committees of Freddie and Fannie, will become useless in no time. I’d like to believe that this will work, and that those involved will really try to make it work, and that there will be, from now on, a great amount of accountability over these funds in D.C., and that people will be held accountable, and that in the end the American people will make lots of money from this because the Govt will pay us all back with interest. But I’d also like to believe that fairies will fly down and kiss the earth with sweet kindness to heal all our aches and pains. I’d like to believe that the trolls under the bridge will come out and become gainfully employed. I’d like to believe…
Weight of Glory on September 28, 2008 at 12:39 PM
Michelle has some thoughts on this, and as usual she shows the flaws that democrats will be forced to deal with before the election. :oP
DannoJyd on September 28, 2008 at 12:40 PM
Ride the short-lived rally.
genso on September 28, 2008 at 12:41 PM
Hornet:
I don’t think so. Pelosi and Reid and Obama seem to be happy to take credit for this, so it is not going to be all about the Republicans and their fatcat friends.
I will be honest with you, I know a lot of people who were really worried about all of this. They were worried about their pensions and their 401k’s and their jobs and their futures. The fat cats took back seat to their concerns for their own political futures.
Most people won’t like the idea of having to do this, but they alternative even less. Which makes them just in general unhappy.
They do not some kind of assurance this won’t happen again. That faith and trust in the financial sector will take time to rebuild.
Terrye on September 28, 2008 at 12:41 PM
What rally would that be? The market already anticipated a deal last week, if I recall what everyone in favor of a deal was saying last week…
CC
CapedConservative on September 28, 2008 at 12:42 PM
Sure:
1. Drastic federal budget reductions, including elimination of all earmark spending and entire agencies.
2. Suspend all foreign aid.
3. Suspend the capital gains tax for 2 years at least; reduce federal income taxes for the 40% who pay them.
4. Abolish Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac
5. Start drilling for oil here
6. Eliminate red tape and encourage building nuke power plants
ManlyRash on September 28, 2008 at 12:43 PM
I am hopeless.
I meant say they do want some kind of assurance this won’t happen again.
Sorry for the typos.
Terrye on September 28, 2008 at 12:43 PM
Very little volume. 700 billion will make the money come in for a short rally. Just my opinion, mind you.
genso on September 28, 2008 at 12:43 PM
Game over. McCain supports.
All welcome President Obama.
lorien1973 on September 28, 2008 at 12:45 PM
Manly Rush:
I heard McCAin say that they needed to make Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac go away. By the time the FBI gets done with its investigation, that might happen.
Terrye on September 28, 2008 at 12:45 PM
Don’t see anything in MM’s comments that hurt the Dems politically. They got what they wanted, and no blame. What’s the downside for them?
JiangxiDad on September 28, 2008 at 12:46 PM
Since Obama is taking credit for this, he obviously must vote fot it. McCain should vote against it. Come on Mav..
CC
CapedConservative on September 28, 2008 at 12:46 PM
Then you can look forward to an Obama presidency and the opportunity to cheer on the Dems some more. I have no doubt that if such were the case, much of that cheering would be…compulsory.
ManlyRash on September 28, 2008 at 12:46 PM
Good points but useless because this thing will become law before any of us have a chance to digest it.
a capella on September 28, 2008 at 12:48 PM
There is that whole business about gaining the whole world at the expense of one’s soul, but the Dems don’t put much stock in that narrative.
ManlyRash on September 28, 2008 at 12:48 PM
LOL. How would any of that increase the federal gov’t’s share of the private economy? Silly boy.
JiangxiDad on September 28, 2008 at 12:48 PM
You misunderstood me, yet again.
I am saying that the general public, those that get their news from the MSM “believe that this is a sellout of their money to the republican’s fat cat friends”.
I understand the problem that we face, remember. I was only against the ornaments.
I am angry because our Republican leadership is allowing the dems to take credit for the good work that the house repubs have done, they won’t fight back.
HornetSting on September 28, 2008 at 12:48 PM
Weight of Glory:
The scope is larger, but the actual money being asked for is either the same or less. The scope does not include outright outlays of cash. I did not get that impression.
You are making assumptions here. You assume if the scope is larger they will end up asking for more at some future date, you can’t know that.
Terrye on September 28, 2008 at 12:49 PM
Heh…don’t hold your breath.
ManlyRash on September 28, 2008 at 12:49 PM
*cringe*
What country do I live in again?
lorien1973 on September 28, 2008 at 12:51 PM
Hornet:
No, I understood you just fine. I am saying that if that were the case I don’t think Pelosi and Reid would standing up their with s*it grins on their faces talking about how they have saved the United States from economic collapse. I think there will be an effort to change public perception of this because it is in the interests of the Democrats to do so. Otherwise they would be sighing and acting like someone had a gun to their heads.
Terrye on September 28, 2008 at 12:51 PM
You’re kidding, right?
Weight of Glory on September 28, 2008 at 12:51 PM
Can we add:
-Secure the border and stop paying for benefits for illegal aliens?
-6% unemployment…force welfare recipients to find a job or their welfare will stop….oooh…watch the arrows fly.
-Stop welfare after two children-oooooh….taking fire.
HornetSting on September 28, 2008 at 12:52 PM
I still haven’t seen a response.
Who here has money in the market and is going to keep it there
or
Doesn’t have money in the market and is going to put it there?
Anybody?
CC
CapedConservative on September 28, 2008 at 12:52 PM
That’s the most depressing block quote I’ve yet read.
Weight of Glory on September 28, 2008 at 12:52 PM
LOL…silly dad. Danno asked for an alternative that woul not put America in greater debt. I gave him one.
I also have a blueprint for a robot pig that flies.
ManlyRash on September 28, 2008 at 12:52 PM
lorien:
Well, the folks in New York are not real popular right now and for good reason. They helped make this happen, they are not a bunch of helpless little orphans. They screwed up. A lot of them were the ones giving money to the Democrats to ask for and fund a lot of these programs. We can blame a lot of this on the politicians, but not all of it. I was a realtor, I remember those guys bragging when they got some help for a new initiative for home buying.
Terrye on September 28, 2008 at 12:54 PM
Those investigations will disappear shortly after the election unless McCain picks up his game.
a capella on September 28, 2008 at 12:55 PM
These people are not in danger of being ousted. You have to judge everything that happens with the basic concept that Dems like all legislation that increases the size of government. ManlyRash is right in saying that the government needs to be reduced, but it isn’t likely to happen.
genso on September 28, 2008 at 12:55 PM
If we had not included the junk MBS’s held by foreigners, they would have been pissed and then NEVER bought any more or our securities and we’d be in real trouble.
Sapwolf on September 28, 2008 at 12:55 PM
With direction, prodding and approval from Washington. The CRA existed for decades before Washington opened it up and made this mess possible.
Yes, they played their role, but Washington made it possible and in fact encouraged it.
Dodd Frank, etal should be in jail, not at the negotiations table.
lorien1973 on September 28, 2008 at 12:56 PM
And amongst all the Yelling and Screaming…
The US Government has just set up funds to buy a large portion of the Mortgage industry. They will by mandate tell companies what they can pay staff, and will take a profit from companies FUTURE earnings for this investment, above and beyond what a normal investor would get.
This money, according to Paulson, will only go to a select few companies, which HE will choose. These companies, now under strict government oversite, will use the Liquidity that the market will give THEM (due to the restructured balance sheets) to buy up companies who will NOT get credit, due to the government not bailing them out.
Expect Paulson, who leaves office in a few months, to get a really GREAT deal to run one of said banks (oh, and does anyone know if Paulson has stock in Goldman Sachs? as a prior CEO I would expect so, Goldman will be one of the winners of this).
No serious effort will be put forth to fix the underlieing problem of creating bad debt by the Social Engineering of loans… Fannie and Freddie will not be let out of the government owned and funded sphere, but will be used to fund bad loans at direct govenment expense.
This Bank consolidation gives the main players MORE seats on the Federal Reserve Board… thus more power to directly influence FED policy.
Folks are screwed here…
Romeo13 on September 28, 2008 at 12:57 PM
I think you misunderstood me. Your suggestions are great, and would help tremendously. I was being sarcastic by suggesting the dem controlled gov’t wouldn’t like those ideas because those ideas would not help the gov’t garner greater control of the economy.
JiangxiDad on September 28, 2008 at 12:57 PM
I’m retired, and took my IRAs out of the market and into CDs 6 months ago.
a capella on September 28, 2008 at 12:58 PM
I did answer you. I have money there and will keep it there for a short rally. Then plans will be made to shelter as much as possible for another selloff. The economy is in bad shape and may not really turn around until mid 2009 at the earliest. Home sales have to rebound for the economy to pick up again.
genso on September 28, 2008 at 12:58 PM
Yep, that’s why I said we ought to be careful who we borrow from, especially if we are borrowing for our daily bread.
JiangxiDad on September 28, 2008 at 12:58 PM
And I’m sure Goldman Sachs will be WAY back in that line…. NOT
CC
CapedConservative on September 28, 2008 at 12:58 PM
McCain also said on TV that he would “go over it [the bailout deal] with a fine-toothed comb” before making a decision on it.
If the bill passes, and is less onerous (expensive) than the original Paulson proposal, McCain can claim credit for bringing the House Republicans into the deal and saving lots of taxpayer money. If Obama tries to claim credit, McCain can say that Obama “blew up” the September 26 meeting, then left town to campaign, while McCain followed the negotiations through their conclusion.
But for now, McCain is doing his homework–unlike Obama.
Steve Z on September 28, 2008 at 12:59 PM
ditto. And diversify overseas if you haven’t already. Your purchases are not exclusively dollar denominated anymore so your funding sources shouldn’t. You take too much exchange risk, and single market risk.
JiangxiDad on September 28, 2008 at 1:00 PM
Terry, read this:
Terry, money flows one way in D.C.: IN. What Heritage is pointing out is that the budgets presented and approved in bills don’t cover the amount required for the cost of all the entitlements. In other words: the scope got bigger, and they asked for more money, nay, they took more money. You are correct that I’m assuming, but I do have a reality upon which my assumptions rest. Do yours?
Weight of Glory on September 28, 2008 at 1:01 PM
Absolutely. And not only global assets, but global banking as well.
genso on September 28, 2008 at 1:03 PM
So you are going to get out… me to. And the market will do what then….
As far as real estate goes, I live in south Florida. Unit sales have taken off huge. However, these are sales of homes that sold for $350K that are selling for $80K. What is the government going to do? Take ownership of the 30,000 or so foreclosures pending? Cut the grass? Pay the electricity to keep mold from forming? Do routine maintenance for the years and years it will take for that price to recover? I doubt it. They will sell at a huge loss, just like the banks that have foreclosed already are doing. A plan created by the very people that caused the problem… I’m sure it’s a terrific idea.
CC
CapedConservative on September 28, 2008 at 1:04 PM
Lets take these 1 at a time …
That will add not a single dollar to the lending institutions, and that is what the debate is all about.
See above comment.
Works for me.
Not right now. Not if we want to keep Wall Street from crashing. The best we can hope for is to restructure those.
Not on topic as that will do nothing to assist lending institutions. One thing at a time.
See answer to 5.
See that? We are on the same map even if we disagree on how to reach our destination.
Damn shame our Congress isn’t as wise. :o)
DannoJyd on September 28, 2008 at 1:05 PM
Here you go… Brazil claiming they will get through this problem caused by United States just fine…
http://malaysia.news.yahoo.com/rtrs/20080928/tbs-brazil-us-crisis-7318940.html
In the mean time, a month ago, Soros put $811 million in a Brazilian company… what a coincidence…
CC
CapedConservative on September 28, 2008 at 1:07 PM
I agree. But even the sale of these homes, even at reduced costs, will reduce the inventory so that homebuilders can began building again. Home values won’t rise until that happens. That is the only aspect of this whole thing that remains market-driven.
genso on September 28, 2008 at 1:08 PM
I still think the Pubs, esp. in the House, should make the Dems come up w/ the votes to pass this. Some support, yeah, but make the Dems carry the burden.
either orr on September 28, 2008 at 1:13 PM
When you say global banking, do you mean a foreign currency denominated brokerage account on a foreign exchange? Or forex holdings? Or actual deposits in foreign banks outside of the US? All?
JiangxiDad on September 28, 2008 at 1:14 PM
Its a tough spot for the Repubs standing for election. Until the election, the market will perform well and help the Dems as they have taken credit for this pig. Only then will you see the true nature of the economy reflected in the market. Unfortunately, as right as the Repubs are on this issue, it won’t help them that much.
genso on September 28, 2008 at 1:17 PM
All. It gets a little tricky with the bank accounts, however. Most countries, those that you would want to have accounts in anyway, require some form of direct investments.
genso on September 28, 2008 at 1:19 PM
This is how I see it too. (But I am right only a little more than I am wrong–I sold my bank stocks, including GS, before they flew back up).
Is your reasoning that inflation and a weak dollar will take their toll? That’s what I foresee.
JiangxiDad on September 28, 2008 at 1:19 PM
That’s why I asked you. I don’t (yet) have any accounts registered oversees. I believe, but aren’t sure, that Schwab facilitates its customers having brokerage accounts on some foreign exchanges. Do you know anything about that?
JiangxiDad on September 28, 2008 at 1:21 PM
Interesting… not only are we taking our money out of the United States stock market, now we are talking about taking our money out of the United States. I see this bailout working really, really well….
CC
CapedConservative on September 28, 2008 at 1:24 PM
That and just the lagging effect of earnings. Earnings season will be in full force prior to the election and may be the last time we will see upsides from estimates for several quarters. That said, I do have an uneasy feeling that the market is a bit in the tank for Obama, GS is a good example. I don’t think they will allow the market to show its true colors until after the election. Don’t know anything for sure, but that’s where my money is.
genso on September 28, 2008 at 1:24 PM
Points:
1) If this does not CRA forever, it will all happen AGAIN as loaners KEEP making crap loans.
2) It must plan for the complete phase out and retirement of Fan/Fred.
If it does not remove the bad government coercing of bad loans to be made, it will all happen again.
If foreigners now begin to gradually sell off USD assets and the currency continues to devalue, the trade deficit grows, inflation grows, gas prices go higher.
Let O-man take credit for this mess, it will fail and he will be the worst one-termer we ever had.
Socialism is here and now will get worse IF Obama is elected.
Sapwolf on September 28, 2008 at 1:28 PM
I don’t know anything about Schwab, but if you are able to trade the Hong Kong and Tokyo markets, for instance, then you can exchange currencies and make some investments in those markets. You can also look at some foreign banks/brokerages that might make it easier for you to hold funds overseas or make direct investments. You don’t get out of paying taxes, but I think it helps one to be more flexible in these times.
genso on September 28, 2008 at 1:30 PM
When I was young, everything we bought was produced here. The raw materials were denominated in dollars, the wages for the workers were paid in dollars, the product was denominated in dollars, and the consumer earned their money in dollars. So even though back then the dollar was a much stronger currency, it wouldn’t have mattered nearly as much if we weakened vis a vis another currency. We weren’t buying their stuff anyway, so no effect on inflation rates or cost of the stuff we buy.
Today is much different. Most of our clothes, much of our food, most little shit from Target/Walmart is foreign made. Our energy is purchased in dollars, but OPEC is a cartel and can adjust the price/barrel if the dollar depreciates.
The point is, we are not immune from a dollar falling in value. It causes prices at home to rise on much that we buy. And the dollar falls when too much of it is out there. IMO, this 700 billion puts so much out there that I don’t see how it can’t affect inflation and the value of the dollar, and ultimately your costs at home. Therefore, you may wish to consider keeping some of your savings in a currency that has not deteriorated so much over time. One example would be the swiss franc.
JiangxiDad on September 28, 2008 at 1:31 PM
A minor related point…The mint has suspended sale of Gold coins…it seems there is too little gold and too many folk trying to stay solvent.
JIMV on September 28, 2008 at 1:33 PM
So far, I’ve only gone the ETF route for overseas. But believe me, I have considered a foreign registered account. If the gov’t is irresponsible with our national economy and currency, people will react by moving funds overseas. Good luck.
JiangxiDad on September 28, 2008 at 1:34 PM
That’s funny. I have an investment in PRC and was going to send a small birthday gift to the daughter of my contact there. LOL, I couldn’t find much of anything at a Hallmark store that wasn’t made in China.
genso on September 28, 2008 at 1:35 PM
If you want gold, and are comfortable with not holding physical gold in your possession (I am), you can purchase the gold ETF called GLD. It is fast, painless, and cheap to buy, if you have an online brokerage account. Another good gold holding is Barrick Gold–don’t know the sticker offhand.
JiangxiDad on September 28, 2008 at 1:35 PM
The times they are achangin’. I’m like JiangxiDad, I’m only right a little more than half the time. Diversification is the only way to protect yourself. The market is being attacked from every angle.
genso on September 28, 2008 at 1:39 PM
By the way, I like the ETF TIP. If you run a comparison chart on yahoo for ex, between it and FXF (swiss franc etf), you will see that TIPS have provided the same kind of stability of value that francs have. I still haven’t decided if one is preferable to another. At this point I use both, but am still trying to decided if I should favor one.
JiangxiDad on September 28, 2008 at 1:44 PM
So the financial center of the world in a few week will be???? Hong Kong? Certainly not New York.
CC
CapedConservative on September 28, 2008 at 1:47 PM
Don’t know. But the western world is the debtor nations. China, Japan, Russia, India have the world’s highest level of reserves in their central banks. Add Singapore, S. Korea, the Gulf states, and you know where the savings are.
When firms in the US need money, when the US needs money, these days it goes to Asia asking.
JiangxiDad on September 28, 2008 at 1:51 PM
I only buy the stuff I can see and hold…paper is paper
JIMV on September 28, 2008 at 1:53 PM
I don’t think McCain can win this election because he will not attack aggressively what caused all this in the first place and how HE, not Obama was the one to get Republicans on board.
This bailout goes against all that Sarah Palin believes. She needs to distance herself from McCain if he supports it. She should finish the debates and leave the ticket and head back to Alaska. She should wait. The bailout does nothing to prevent bad loan practices via CRA and the government is now even bigger. The country is in financial decline due to government intervention, and now will be even bigger.
Sapwolf on September 28, 2008 at 1:53 PM
You didn’t read the same article I did yesterday about the “new” monetary theory. It goes something like….
The money supply is infinite because it is backed by the full faith & credit yada yada yada and we can print all we want. They actually believe this crap. These are the people pushing the bailout.
CC
CapedConservative on September 28, 2008 at 1:54 PM
I like TIP. Good enough volume, nice yield, and a good level to get in, it seems. I have always liked the Swiss Franc. I have also traded the Japanese Yen.
genso on September 28, 2008 at 1:55 PM
LOL. I didn’t get paper, I got pixels.
JiangxiDad on September 28, 2008 at 1:55 PM
There damn well be a silver lining to this mess.
McCain can’t not support this. If he does, he will be full of arrows from every direction even before he reaches the period at the end of “I don’t support this.”
The is one glimmer of hope, as I see it. McCain’s been playing a quiet game close to his chest. When asked, he says “I HOPE to support it”. Let’s hope McCain is up to something.
This bill is bitter poison, but minus the major pork, it’s at least a slow poison. The only way I see out of total disaster is if McCain actually steps up to the plate and starts naming names and calling for accountability now that the gum has been stuffed into the dike.
I don’t care about anything else- there damn well not be a President Obama in January. Our nation can survive a financial crisis… we already are. Chicken Little has been screaming Armageddon for 2 weeks and it hasn’t happened. We cannot, however, survive a gov’t. run by Obama/ Reid/ Pelosi. No way. We are here BECAUSE of them and their buddies. Giving them carte blache will bring down the sky.
Damiano on September 28, 2008 at 1:55 PM
Carry trade? I don’t trade stuff actually. I hold it as inflation hedge. Am going to go much bigger into TIP after election I think.
JiangxiDad on September 28, 2008 at 1:58 PM
I will confess to being agnostic about the bailout. I don’t have enough info. But, if you held a gun to my head and said I had to say yes or no, I would say yes.
As for the full faith and credit, it’s all true. Just depends how much faith you have :)
JiangxiDad on September 28, 2008 at 2:00 PM
I agree. And to answer your previous question, the US is weakened enough with all of this that China is calling for another currency to take its place. Now, others have said this before and no one got too excited, but when our largest debt-holder says it, it might be good to pay attention. Where the financial center is will be less important than who the financial center is.
genso on September 28, 2008 at 2:00 PM
Actually, for low quality units in overbuilt areas, possibly the optimal choice is to demolish them for the raw materials. “Clear cut” several blocks, fence it off, plant grass — instant park — all owned by the Federal government. Reducing supply will support housing prices. Clearing them will prevent crime areas (no free crack houses or homeless squatter drug dens.)
SunSword on September 28, 2008 at 2:01 PM
Hank’s the new Rummy. When this goes bad, and by “bad” I mean the perception by the people, the Congress led by Democrats will again claim they were lied to, manipulated and misled. Again, the MSM will take their side and the people will give them a pass and blame it all on Boooosh.
As in Iraq, where we will never know how bad things would have gotten without military intervention,we will not know how much worse the economic pain would have been without a bailout. And I predict there will be no politician standing up to own that pain; to ask Americans to swallow it as a cost of enabling the corruption the free market.
shuzilla on September 28, 2008 at 2:02 PM
Interesting take. And you’re correct. Getting these houses off the market is the key to recovery…how its done is less important.
genso on September 28, 2008 at 2:04 PM
There isn’t.
In that case, just call him Sen. Porcupine.
You can hope in one hand and…well, you know the rest.
Agreed.
Barring rescue via political deus ex machina (Rezko implicates Obama, dramatic attack on the Dems by McCain naming names, a thrashing of Obama in the debates by McCain, a stellar performance in the VP debate by Palin) or an outright divine miracle (the Drive-Bys engage in fair and balanced reporting or Idjit voters actually become informed on the issues) I suspect you will be looking at the inauguration of Barack Hussein Obama as the 44th president of the United States.
The sky? No. The republic? Absolutely.
ManlyRash on September 28, 2008 at 2:30 PM
What a time to be alive. *sigh*
genso on September 28, 2008 at 2:37 PM
These are the times that try men’s souls. The summer soldier and the sunshine patriot will, in this crisis, shrink from the service of their country; but he that stands by it now, deserves the love and thanks of man and woman. Tyranny, like hell, is not easily conquered; yet we have this consolation with us, that the harder the conflict, the more glorious the triumph. What we obtain too cheap, we esteem too lightly: it is dearness only that gives every thing its value. Heaven knows how to put a proper price upon its goods; and it would be strange indeed if so celestial an article as FREEDOM should not be highly rated. – Thomas Paine, The Crisis, December 23, 1776
ManlyRash on September 28, 2008 at 2:46 PM
Well put TP & reminded ManlyRash. It appears to me that most folks here would have quickly folded their tent and stuck with the Crown, thinking they were protecting their fortunes. To trade your principle for money has a name.
CC
CapedConservative on September 28, 2008 at 2:51 PM
Yeah…Congress.
ManlyRash on September 28, 2008 at 2:59 PM
I had to take a break. My head was about to explode.
Turned on Fox News and see the One taking credit for all the good points of the bill. That McCain does not deserve credit for his work on this bill.
Waiting for a bolt of lightening to strike him down for lying…waiting…waiting.
My head is going to explode. I cry “uncle”.
HornetSting on September 28, 2008 at 3:05 PM
Times have changed since the days of Jefferson and Paine. The thought of armed revolution will not hold in this day of global finance and i-pods and Hollywood. But that does not mean that revolution is not possible…only the tactics.
genso on September 28, 2008 at 3:09 PM
I was thinking along the lines of secession, genso.
ManlyRash on September 28, 2008 at 3:19 PM
Only after you are broken can you be truly whole, Grasshopper.
ManlyRash on September 28, 2008 at 3:20 PM
This bill heralds a basic change in the Covenent between the American people, business, and the Government.
We were founded on the idea that the Government was supposed to stay out of the way, as much as possible. It was a Referee there to enforce fair rules, but it was not judging the even, ie, making winners and loosers.
This now changes the dynamic to not only will the Government be choosing winners and loosers, but will be in the PROFIT business itself. It will have a vested interest in some companies making money, as they will profit from it.
Fair business practice by the government just went out the window folks. You think corruption was bad BEFORE?
Romeo13 on September 28, 2008 at 3:20 PM
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