Abortion rates drop again

posted at 9:20 am on September 23, 2008 by Ed Morrissey

The rate of abortion has reached the lowest point since Roe v Wade, according to a study by the Guttmacher Institute and the LA Times.  Disparities attributable to either race or income levels have become more stark, though, and the question of targeting minorities for abortion services will likely get more attention:

Although the overall U.S. abortion rate is at its lowest level since 1974, the drop has been far more dramatic for whites than for African Americans, who in 2004 had abortions at five times the rate of white women, according to a report released Monday.

The abortion rate for Latinas was about three times that of whites.

The Guttmacher Institute, a New York-based research group that supports abortion rights but whose statistics are generally respected by antiabortion groups, analyzed 30 years of data since the 1973 Roe vs. Wade Supreme Court decision legalizing abortion.

The good news was that abortion rates fell across the board.  However, the drop was most dramatic among whites, while abortions for African-Americans and Latinas fell at a much slower rate.  Why?  The Times quotes one San Francisco expert as claiming that ignorance and poverty were the underlying causes. “Oftentimes, living in poverty they experience so many other challenges in their lives that they don’t always know that they’re eligible for family planning services or have transportation to services,” said Dr. Claire Brindis of the University of San Francisco.  Not so, says Day Gardner:

But Day Gardner, founder and president of the National Black Pro-Life Union in Washington, disagreed. She blamed the high rates on the number of inner-city clinics that performed abortions.

“It doesn’t have as much to do with poverty as that the abortion facilities are there, ingrained in the neighborhoods,” she said. “We as a community don’t talk about this. . . . This is a silent killer among us.”

This echoes a protest against Planned Parenthood in April by pastors and activists from prominent black churches, who see the abortion industry as a genocide targeting their communities.  Planned Parenthood got caught exploiting racist sentiments in their fundraising, which certainly lends itself to Gardner’s view.

Regardless of this particular controversy, though, this shows that the push against abortion has had a positive effect.  Fewer babies get killed through abortions, and that’s true of all demographics.  The most interesting aspect of this will be the effect it has on politicians who pay lip service to seeing fewer abortions while blocking any and all attempts to limit them.  Will they cheer this drop in abortions, or will they claim that it proves that more intervention is needed to ensure “access”?

Blowback

Note from Hot Air management: This section is for comments from Hot Air's community of registered readers. Please don't assume that Hot Air management agrees with or otherwise endorses any particular comment just because we let it stand. A reminder: Anyone who fails to comply with our terms of use may lose their posting privilege.

Trackbacks/Pings

Trackback URL

Comments

Ignorance & poverty? No, I think Blacks & Hispanics are more likely to have abortions because they are more likely to be liberals. Well, maybe you can chalk that up to ignorance.

jgapinoy on September 23, 2008 at 9:23 AM

Crime rate will greatly increase in about 15 yrs.

marklmail on September 23, 2008 at 9:24 AM

I am heartened.

Abby Adams on September 23, 2008 at 9:32 AM

Hmm…Is it possible that the reality of the situation has finally penetrated the dura matta?

It takes intentional ignorance to define life as not beginning with conception…DEFIES the definition of cellular reproduction.

:|

Marine_Bio on September 23, 2008 at 9:33 AM

jgapinoy on September 23, 2008 at 9:23 AM

Blacks and Hispanics are more likely to have abortions because they are specifically marketed to by Planned Parenthood. This is consistent with the mission of their foundress, Margaret Sanger, who endeavored to decrease the alleged surplus of “mongrel” races, particularly Blacks. Given that this attitude is accompanied by unstable family life, it is inevitable that crime will continue to be disproportionately high among these groups, especially violent crime.

manwithblackhat on September 23, 2008 at 9:35 AM

Abortion rates drop again

While this is welcome news, one murdered baby is too many. I hope those of us who value life don’t rest on our laurels.

jgapinoy on September 23, 2008 at 9:35 AM

Sounds like it’s time for some wild-eyed loon ethics professor at some nationally known university to get up and start wringing his or her hands over the results of their latest study of issues with overpopulation and have them implore on how we need to immediately instigate Zero Population Growth or civilization as we know it is doomed, etc etc etc blah blah blah.

pilamaye on September 23, 2008 at 9:35 AM

manwithblackhat on September 23, 2008 at 9:35 AM

Agreed, but I wanted to point out an additional factor.

jgapinoy on September 23, 2008 at 9:35 AM

The sign the lady is holding quoting Margaret Sanger says it all…. Why the black population continues to support liberal Democrats is beyond comprehension. Even the founder of the Black Panthers recognized the welfare society as the anti-black tool it was.

CC

CapedConservative on September 23, 2008 at 9:40 AM

Blacks and Hispanics are more likely to have abortions because they are specifically marketed to by Planned Parenthood.

manwithblackhat on September 23, 2008 at 9:35 AM

Marketing might make someone buy one car over another or maybe one soda over another, but most people have strong feelings on whether they want to have a baby or not.

dedalus on September 23, 2008 at 9:43 AM

I hope those of us who value life don’t rest on our laurels.

jgapinoy on September 23, 2008 at 9:35 AM

And do what? Can’t say I believe picketing is the answer.

Esthier on September 23, 2008 at 9:43 AM

Genocide curtesy of your friendly “Family Planning” services.

shick on September 23, 2008 at 9:43 AM

Marketing might make someone buy one car over another or maybe one soda over another, but most people have strong feelings on whether they want to have a baby or not.

dedalus on September 23, 2008 at 9:43 AM

The difference in this case, as the quote above states, is that this type of marketing has made abortion a way of life for people in those areas.

Esthier on September 23, 2008 at 9:44 AM

Jesus wept.

Fuquay Steve on September 23, 2008 at 9:46 AM

“[We propose to] hire three or four colored ministers, preferably with social-service backgrounds, and with engaging personalities. The most successful educational approach to the Negro is through a religious appeal. And we do not want word to go out that we want to exterminate the Negro population, and the minister is the man who can straighten out that idea if it ever occurs to any of their more rebellious members.” Commenting on the ‘Negro Project’ in a letter to Dr. Clarence Gamble, December 10, 1939.

Do a little research next time…

sburg57 on September 23, 2008 at 9:48 AM

“But during all the long years this matter has been discussed, advocated, refuted, the people themselves—poor people especially—were blindly, desperately practicing family limitation, just as they are practicing it today. To them birth control does not mean what it does to us. To them it has meant the most barbaric methods. It has meant the killing of babies—infanticide,—abortions,—in one crude way or another.” Margaret Sanger My Fight for Birth Control, 1931, page 133.

You just got served…

sburg57 on September 23, 2008 at 9:51 AM

This will only irritate The One.

I’m beginning to wonder if The One has an obsession with dead babies. He is the most ardent supporter of abortion, ever. It also seems that he is interested in having research conducted to identify the causes of still-birth and Sudden Infant Death Syndrome. Apparently, he wants to be able to counsel pregnant women about the likelyhood of their babies being stillborn or dying of SUID.

Is there any question the real purpose is to increase the number of abortions by scaring expectant mothers with tales of “your baby could die, so lets kill it now”.

BobMbx on September 23, 2008 at 9:52 AM

The good news was that abortion rates fell across the board. However, the drop was most dramatic among whites, while abortions for African-Americans and Latinas fell at a much slower rate. Why?

Simple: The modern abortion industry was conceived of and designed in the late 1800′s and early 1900′s by the Eugenicists and their fellow travelers, the Fascists. To put it more bluntly; The modern abortion industry is Hitler’s ethnic cleansing dream come to life in slow motion.

Once again, modern “Progressives” show their true colors: Nazi Black, white, and blood red.

wearyman on September 23, 2008 at 9:53 AM

Just the fact that murder is considered and supported as birth control leaves a mark on this nation. Forty million plus exterminations should never be forgotten, and should be cause to end abortion to a civilized, compassionate people.

Hening on September 23, 2008 at 9:57 AM

As has been noted above, the higher rates of abortion for black and hispanic mothers can be traced back to the racism inherent in the founding of Planned Parenthood.

However, the overall drop in the number of abortions: this can probably be attributed to a transition from penetrative sex to oral sex among the demographic. It’s ‘safe’, easy, non-committal, and more acceptable to the peer group, perhaps?

karmatis on September 23, 2008 at 10:05 AM

The difference in this case, as the quote above states, is that this type of marketing has made abortion a way of life for people in those areas.

Esthier on September 23, 2008 at 9:44 AM

No amount of marketing will cause a woman who wants to become pregnant and have children to suddenly decide that she wants an abortion.

Day Gardner’s point relies on a demographic that is unaware of, or unable to get access to, birth control but who are persuaded to have abortions because of the marketing and convenience.

Also, to account for the discrepancy using Gardner’s reasoning you’d likely have to assume that women sometimes have a baby simply because it is too logistically complicated to find abortion services.

dedalus on September 23, 2008 at 10:06 AM

Tammy Bruce talks about this in her book “The New American Revolution”. The NOW hags wanted to protect abortion ‘doctors’ who were killing the mothers along with the babies in Black and Hispanic areas of L.A. to keep the minority populations down.
Sick.

Tony737 on September 23, 2008 at 10:12 AM

Esthier on September 23, 2008 at 9:43 AM

Discussing the issue, campaigning for & supporting pro-life candidates, donating to National Right To Life, supporting adoption assistance agencies.

jgapinoy on September 23, 2008 at 10:12 AM

White, black or latino, a world full of more American babies!

promachus on September 23, 2008 at 10:14 AM

Marine_bio,
“Is it possible that the reality of the situation has finally penetrated the dura matta?”

The drastically improved clarity of ultra-sounds, in utero-video, and in-utero surgeries has to have had at least some effect on convincing some people that it is a real human.

exhelodrvr on September 23, 2008 at 10:15 AM

yay!

Spirit of 1776 on September 23, 2008 at 10:16 AM

Day Gardner’s point relies on a demographic that is unaware of, or unable to get access to, birth control but who are persuaded to have abortions because of the marketing and convenience.

dedalus on September 23, 2008 at 10:06 AM

No, I think she’s talking about something that has taken over three decades. That by targeting these communities for over 30 years, these organizations have made abortion the norm. The women having abortions now, grew up with it being normal their entire life.

She’s not talking about normal marketing. She’s talking about a change in culture that came about through marketing.

I’m not saying she’s right, but there’s a huge difference.

Esthier on September 23, 2008 at 10:16 AM

Crime rate will greatly increase in about 15 yrs.

marklmail on September 23, 2008 at 9:24 AM

I see Mark has read freakonomics.

c.u.shoeless on September 23, 2008 at 10:17 AM

I wonder if they are factoring in the morning after pill? Pregnancies are still being terminated, just in a different way. I think more Christians talk themselves into this by assuming they aren’t pregnant….yet.

jjjen on September 23, 2008 at 10:24 AM

I’m not saying she’s right, but there’s a huge difference.

Esthier on September 23, 2008 at 10:16 AM

I was responding to the use of the term marketing in a previous post. I’d agree that there is something deeper going on, probably the most significant being the rate of unmarried teen pregnancy among different demographic groups.

dedalus on September 23, 2008 at 10:27 AM

But what about the poor abortion doctors? How will they feed their families?

fossten on September 23, 2008 at 10:34 AM

Has anyone done any kind of research as to how easy it is to get birth control from Planned Parenthood as opposed to an abortion? And whether what services they offer differ according to race?

I think I remember seeing something about how PP clinics are disproportionately placed in minority neighborhoods, even when poverty levels are taken into account, but now I can’t find it.

Mynuet on September 23, 2008 at 10:37 AM

Just wait until Sarah Palin is in the White House and let’s see how much they drop then

Sir Andrew on September 23, 2008 at 10:42 AM

Are more people accepting of their “punishments”?

Dr.Cwac.Cwac on September 23, 2008 at 10:45 AM

I think the drop in abortion rates are mostly due to the contraceptions methods used.

Has anyone done any kind of research as to how easy it is to get birth control from Planned Parenthood as opposed to an abortion?

Planned Parenhood primary role is to educate people about safe sex and contraception and only secondary to provide abortions. And newsflash:contraceptives don’t kill anything just prevent an unwanted pregnancy.

clemycali on September 23, 2008 at 10:55 AM

Oftentimes, living in poverty they experience so many other challenges in their lives that they don’t always know that they’re eligible for family planning services or have transportation to services,

How does this explanation even make sense? Blacks and Latinas have more abortions because… they don’t know that they can get abortions or how to get to the clinic?

Unless “family planning services” isn’t just a euphemism for a Planned Parenthood condom-hut/abortionist.

Lehosh on September 23, 2008 at 10:56 AM

No mention of the rate of unplanned pregnancy for blacks and hispanics as compared to whites. Do these demographics get pregnant at 5 times(black) and 3 times (hispanic) the rate of whites?

No amount of marketing will cause a woman who wants to become pregnant and have children to suddenly decide that she wants an abortion.

This is totally different than convincing a young, unmarried woman that abortion is the safest and most convenient way to solve the problem of an unplanned pregnancy. This is what PP and other abortion supporters do.

Jvette on September 23, 2008 at 11:04 AM

Planned Parenhood primary role is to educate people about safe sex and contraception and only secondary to provide abortions. And newsflash:contraceptives don’t kill anything just prevent an unwanted pregnancy.

clemycali on September 23, 2008 at 10:55 AM

This assertion is laughable if you look at the history of Planned Parenthood and the culture of abortion that reeks through it’s rhetoric and supporters.

[I am not sure who your "newsflash" is aimed at, specifically whose comment you are directing the retort.]

geckomon on September 23, 2008 at 11:13 AM

…but most people have strong feelings on whether they want to have a baby or not.

Until they’re talked out of it by those to whom they would look for support — their parents, the father of the child — and they’re backed into a corner, having to face it alone. They are then easy prey for “target marketing.”

Most people who buy a car have more of a choice.

manwithblackhat on September 23, 2008 at 11:16 AM

This is totally different than convincing a young, unmarried woman that abortion is the safest and most convenient way to solve the problem of an unplanned pregnancy. This is what PP and other abortion supporters do.

Jvette on September 23, 2008 at 11:04 AM

Could it also be that they are located in areas where there is a higher percentage of pregnant teens who don’t have access to private physicians?

dedalus on September 23, 2008 at 11:18 AM

This assertion is laughable if you look at the history of Planned Parenthood and the culture of abortion that reeks through it’s rhetoric and supporters.

geckomon on September 23, 2008 at 11:13 AM

I am 100% pro-life but I have gone to Planned Parenthood for my yearly exams and contraception because it is cheaper than going to an Ob/Gyn. Especially important if one doesn’t have health insurance. I never got the impression that they were pushing or advertising abortions primarily. Of course, I wish that they would stop providing them and I do believe that Sanger did have some pretty evils motives in the founding of PP.

mrsmwp on September 23, 2008 at 11:25 AM

Until they’re talked out of it by those to whom they would look for support — their parents, the father of the child — and they’re backed into a corner, having to face it alone. They are then easy prey for “target marketing.”

Most people who buy a car have more of a choice.

manwithblackhat on September 23, 2008 at 11:16 AM

A guy buying a sports car or motorcycle can certainly face a lot of pressure from his wife to not make the purchase. That’s part of being a member of a family.

If a pregnant teen has parents who are enough a part of her life to give her direction, should she not consider their guidance? Should there be prohibitions against parents “target marketing” to their children?

dedalus on September 23, 2008 at 11:26 AM

This is great news. The crime rate will go up which is usually beneficial to getting more Republicans elected.

420sniper on September 23, 2008 at 11:28 AM

I think Sarah Palin will have a fantastic influence on our young women in this country.
They’ll’ strive to be more fit, more chaste and just all around more lady like.

She is the anti-Madonna/Britney.

What a fine role model.

TheSitRep on September 23, 2008 at 11:28 AM

Ultra-liberals don’t care about life–they only care that people have the maximum amount of freedom to do whatever they want: drugs, sex, abortion, etc., preferably with government assistance and money.

m064404 on September 23, 2008 at 11:30 AM

Could it also be that they are located in areas where there is a higher percentage of pregnant teens who don’t have access to private physicians?

dedalus on September 23, 2008 at 11:18 AM

So it is okay with you that they prey on poor, desperate teens?

Cloaking this horror in the guise of “service” is beyond despicable.

Abortion is not harmless. They are not doing these women a service, and they are not honest about the long term emotional and possible physical ramifications of abortion.
Adoption is also rarely discussed, even though some of these women would do that if that option was discussed and they are given the help and support they need.

Though they claim a non-profit status, PP takes in huge sums of money, including tax payer funds. They have a huge marketing budget and well payed executives. Money not used for operations is donated to other charitable organizations that then refer business to PP. This is not an altruistic endeavor by well meaning people, it is big business.

Pro-life clinics are helping. They need our support. Find one in your city and donate time and/or money to it if you want to help reduce the numbers of abortions. In Las Vegas, we located one right next door to the most prolific abortion mill in the city.Their business has declined and as it has, they have gotten more and more aggressive towards the clinic and their volunteers.

Jvette on September 23, 2008 at 11:34 AM

Because of experience in other countries, I have a question. Has there been a recent change/increase in tax rebates for children?

OldEnglish on September 23, 2008 at 11:36 AM

I am 100% pro-life but I have gone to Planned Parenthood for my yearly exams and contraception because it is cheaper than going to an Ob/Gyn.

mrsmwp on September 23, 2008 at 11:25 AM

All due respect, but did you type that with a straight face?

You claim 100% pro-life then say you support Planned Parenthood by patronizing them. Something in your line of reasoning indicates a denial.

geckomon on September 23, 2008 at 11:46 AM

Jvette on September 23, 2008 at 11:34 AM

You might make the case that liquor stores, lottery machines, cigarette vendors, or credit card marketing are despicable. You might make the case that some or all of these should be illegal, or if they were guaranteed by the Supreme Court that the Justices should be appointed to overturn their legality.

Given that all of the above are legal, as is abortion, is your point that we should restrict abortion especially in the case of poor teens but not so in the case of adults with private physicians? How is your point different from the idea that all abortions are wrong?

dedalus on September 23, 2008 at 11:46 AM

then say you support Planned Parenthood by patronizing being a patron of them.
geckomon on September 23, 2008 at 11:46 AM

Whop my Jaw! Fixed.

geckomon on September 23, 2008 at 11:53 AM

The question I have is this: is there a corresponding change in the number of live births? Are women carrying to term or not getting preggers in the first place?

Bob's Kid on September 23, 2008 at 11:53 AM

I don’t know why people here are happy that abortions are dropping for minorities. They usually wind up voting for democrats so anything that can help to reduce democrat voting rolls is a good thing right?

Choose life! Choose republican life!

420sniper on September 23, 2008 at 11:56 AM

Here’s what the LA Times article says, Bob’s Kid:

The drop in teenage abortion rates has been accompanied by a rise in teen births, the report said.

It attributed the rise to a greater societal acceptance of unwed mothers, more difficulties in obtaining abortions in some parts of the country and changing attitudes toward abortion.

More than half of the women obtaining abortions in 2004 were in their 20s, and 60% already had children, the report said.

jim m on September 23, 2008 at 11:57 AM

google James Taranto and the Roe Effect for insight into my more minority abortions comment.

420sniper on September 23, 2008 at 11:58 AM

Marketing might make someone buy one car over another or maybe one soda over another, but most people have strong feelings on whether they want to have a baby or not.

dedalus on September 23, 2008 at 9:43 AM

If their feelings were so strong as to whether they wanted to have a baby or not, why become pregnant in the first place? I am with Day Gardner. Abortion has become a means of birth control in this country.

Glynn on September 23, 2008 at 12:03 PM

If their feelings were so strong as to whether they wanted to have a baby or not, why become pregnant in the first place? I am with Day Gardner. Abortion has become a means of birth control in this country.

Glynn on September 23, 2008 at 12:03 PM

They want to have sex but don’t want to become pregnant and have children. The two are biologically and morally related but not always comprehended during moments of passion.

Abortion is a de facto method of birth control, but nearly all women would choose to prevent the pregnancy in the first place.

dedalus on September 23, 2008 at 12:10 PM

dedalus on September 23, 2008 at 11:46 AM

This is moral relativism. Abortion is the deliberate destruction of human life. With very few exceptions, each and every one will result in a death. Also, abortion is not a product that can be misused or abused or addictive.

This is what pro-aborts do, they throw out things like this and then try to say that abortion is no different. Do I believe that greedy businesses target poor areas? Yes, I do.
Do I think it is right? No, I don’t. Are these morally equivalent to PP targeting poor young women and offering them a solution that is nothing less than extermination of a human life? NO.

By the way, I don’t know if you are pro-abort or playing devil’s advocate. I’m merely pointing out that you used a typical pro-abort argument.

Jvette on September 23, 2008 at 12:13 PM

I don’t know why people here are happy that abortions are dropping for minorities. They usually wind up voting for democrats so anything that can help to reduce democrat voting rolls is a good thing right?

Choose life! Choose republican life!

420sniper on September 23, 2008 at 11:56 AM

Shooting blanks?

geckomon on September 23, 2008 at 12:20 PM

I doubt abortion has become de facto a primary birth control choice.

Here’s from the Physicians for Life website (I posted somewhat different statistics I can’t now find from a similar website awhile ago):

When birth control “fails” (i.e. the woman gets pregnant), abortion is pushed as “back-up birth control”. Yet, in a Wall Street Journal letter to the editor in 1991, the International Planned Parenthood Federation (IPPF) U.S. Medical Director Dr. Louise Tyrer, made public the fact that two-thirds (2/3) of unplanned pregnancies are due to the failure of birth control. That is about 67%! These women are statistically much more likely to have abortions than those who were not using birth control when they unexpectedly became pregnant.

The Centers for Disease Control (CDC) also has noted that a study conducted in 1994-95 [Alan Guttmacher Institute, The Lancet 17Aug96, p.469] found that 57.5% of the women procuring abortions had been using birth control methods the month they became pregnant [32.9% of the women in this study were 20-24; 45.6% were over age 24].

Similarly, researchers recently found that two thirds (about 67%) of France’s unplanned pregnancies were among women using contraceptives. A fifth of the unplanned pregnancies happened when women were on the Pill and a tenth were among those using the intra-uterine device (IUD) [Dr Nathalie Bajos and colleagues from Inserm, France's national medical research institute, studied 2,863 women, Human Reproduction, 4/03].

In other words, the birth control methods may “fail” to stop pregnancy the majority of the time.

Link to website: http://www.physiciansforlife.org/content/view/523/26.

jim m on September 23, 2008 at 12:22 PM

By the way, I don’t know if you are pro-abort or playing devil’s advocate. I’m merely pointing out that you used a typical pro-abort argument.

Jvette on September 23, 2008 at 12:13 PM

I’m not familiar with the pro-abort arguments. I am interested in seeing where there is some consensus among American voters. If Roe is overturned and the issue moves into the legislature access to abortion will be determined by majority vote. Currently, a very substantial majority of Americans oppose outlawing abortion all the way to the point of conception. With that majority arguments that rely only on life beginning at conception or every abortion is morally equivalent to killing an adult aren’t likely to prevail–at least not for decades.

dedalus on September 23, 2008 at 12:26 PM

Given that all of the above are legal, as is abortion, is your point that we should restrict abortion especially in the case of poor teens but not so in the case of adults with private physicians? How is your point different from the idea that all abortions are wrong?

dedalus on September 23, 2008 at 11:46 AM

Not sure what your point is here. I do think all abortions are wrong, and that making abortion illegal will reduce the numbers more than any birth control or sex education.
Many people equate legal with moral.

It seems that you have a tendency to use all of the talking point arguments pro-aborts have down pat. I repeat, it is not a service to poor women, or rich women to destroy the baby they carry in their womb.

I interpret your question here to mean, since rich women are able to get an abortion at a private doctor’s office, abortion should be legal for everyone and cheap so that even the poor can get them.

People engage in all kinds of illegal activities. Rich people can afford better attorneys and are therefore more likely to get off or get a reduced or suspended sentence. Should we just let poor people go instead of prosecuting? After all the system is unfair, why should they be unduly punished for their crimes when they don’t have the resources that rich people have?

Jvette on September 23, 2008 at 12:27 PM

People engage in all kinds of illegal activities. Rich people can afford better attorneys and are therefore more likely to get off or get a reduced or suspended sentence. Should we just let poor people go instead of prosecuting? After all the system is unfair, why should they be unduly punished for their crimes when they don’t have the resources that rich people have?

Jvette on September 23, 2008 at 12:27 PM

We do provide lawyers for the poor at tax payers expense.

dedalus on September 23, 2008 at 12:30 PM

Saenger and Darwin were both racists. Don’t mess with the liberals high priests of godlessness…and profit-making.
(Imagine the trees saved if you removed evolution crud from textbooks?)

saved on September 23, 2008 at 12:38 PM

FYI on a recent poll at http://www.pollingreport.com/abortion.htm.

Time Poll conducted by Abt SRBI. July 31-Aug. 4, 2008. N=808 likely voters nationwide. MoE ± 3.

“Which of these positions best represents your views about abortion? A woman should be able to get an abortion if she wants one in the first three months of pregnancy, no matter what the reason. Abortion should be legal ONLY in certain circumstances, such as when a woman’s health is endangered or when the pregnancy results from rape or incest. Abortion should be illegal in all circumstances, even if the mother’s life is in danger.”

Always Legal in
First 3 Months (46%)

Legal in Certain
Circumstances (40%)

Illegal in All
Circumstances (10%)

No Answer/
Unsure (4%)

jim m on September 23, 2008 at 12:42 PM

With that majority arguments that rely only on life beginning at conception or every abortion is morally equivalent to killing an adult aren’t likely to prevail–at least not for decades.

dedalus on September 23, 2008 at 12:26 PM

When Roe v Wade was first decided, most people, including many Democratic elected officials were opposed. Over the years, the attitude has changed with the dominance of the pro-abort position. People’s attitudes have been subtly led to greater acceptance, especially since so many women who had abortions kept quiet about them. This meant that the actual harm to women was not known by a majority of people.

The pro-life movement has been slowly but surely changing people’s understanding. Millions of women have stood up to say that their abortion was the worst thing they had ever done. Some studies have indicated a link between abortion and certain womens’ health problems. The practice of partial birth abortion, and that of leaving to die survivors of botched abortion, are coming to the attention of the public at large.

We, who fight the pro-life cause are well aware of the enormity of the battle we face. We know that sheer will and determination is not enough to overcome years of apathy and ignorance about abortion. We do not give up, though because we know it is a just cause. We do not give up because we speak and fight for the least among us.

A person’s a person no matter how small. “Horton Hears A Who”, Dr. Seuss

Killing a baby in the womb is morally equivalent to killing an adult. Just cause some people don’t agree, doesn’t make it untrue.

Jvette on September 23, 2008 at 12:43 PM

We do provide lawyers for the poor at tax payers expense.

dedalus on September 23, 2008 at 12:30

Yes, we do, but is the service rendered and the justice meted out equivalent to that of a wealthy person? Aren’t most poor defendants more likely to go to jail than richer ones? How is that fair? The point was that we can’t legislate an equal outcome for those who have money and those who don’t. Life just doesn’t work that way. Just because wealthy women can afford to abortion with the help of a private doctor, doesn’t mean that that abortion is moral and should be available to poor women too.

Jvette on September 23, 2008 at 12:51 PM

Sorry, I can’t continue this conversation. I have a kid to pick up from school and other errands to run.

Jvette on September 23, 2008 at 12:55 PM

Killing a baby in the womb is morally equivalent to killing an adult. Just cause some people don’t agree, doesn’t make it untrue.

Jvette on September 23, 2008 at 12:43 PM

It is responded to differently though, even by people who are the most pro-life. Nearly all people would respond with more immediate effect if they knew of an adult, or a million adults, about to be murdered.

dedalus on September 23, 2008 at 1:02 PM

Sorry, I can’t continue this conversation. I have a kid to pick up from school and other errands to run.

Jvette on September 23, 2008 at 12:55 PM

Enjoy your day. Thanks for taking the time to respond to my comments.

dedalus on September 23, 2008 at 1:05 PM

Cap’n that picture is offensive and not necessary to make your point.

I bet you a donut that by days end you’ll see a Huff-n-Stuffer say “hey look, the riech wing nutballs at Hot Air want to exterminate Blacks.” Soon thereafter it will be on DKos then MSNBC then every major daily in the country. Then at the debate, moderators will demand that McCain repudiate it.

Am I paranoid or are there really ninja-wolves wearing wraparound Oakley’s chasing me?

Mike D. on September 23, 2008 at 1:09 PM

Here’s what the LA Times article says, Bob’s Kid:

Thanks. I’m at work and am only dropping in from time to time.

:)

Bob's Kid on September 23, 2008 at 1:55 PM

Crime rate will greatly increase in about 15 yrs.

marklmail on September 23, 2008 at 9:24 AM

Spot on marklmail.

Badger40 on September 23, 2008 at 4:13 PM