I’d vote for McCain in a heartbeat if I could see him do a full jumping jack. :]

an_abstraction on September 13, 2008 at 4:06 PM

I’d vote for Obama if you could last 10 rounds with McCain.

Bubba Redneck on September 13, 2008 at 5:25 PM

J_Gocht:

Here is your answer to your question below:

Bill Bell, a veteran of Vietnam and former chief of the U.S. Office for POW/MIA Affairs – also said this…!

“There were infantry guys — grunts on the ground — who had more than 7,000 hours in combat [I spent more than 18,902 hours on the ground in the jungles of Vietnam, Laos and Cambodia from 1962 to 1966] and I can tell you that there were times and situations where I’m sure a prison cell would have looked pretty good to them by comparison.

The question really is how many guys got that number of medals for not being shot down?

My question is; how many pilots not the son of an Admiral would have recieved 27 medals for 20 hours in combat…?

J_Gocht on September 13, 2008 at 5:03 PM

For the record the following is from:

http://www.boston.com/news/nation/articles/2008/05/07/navy_releases_mccains_military_record/

McCain was awarded a Silver Star Medal for resisting “extreme mental and physical cruelties” inflicted upon him by his captors from late October to early December 1967, the early months of his captivity, according to the citation. The North Vietnamese, according to the Navy, ignored international agreements and tortured McCain “in an attempt to obtain military information and false confessions for propaganda purposes.” . . His captors tortured him and held him in solitary confinement. Still, he declined an offer of early release until those who had been at the prison longer than him were let go.

That decision earned McCain a Navy Commendation Medal. Although McCain was “crippled from serious and ill-treated injuries,” he steadfastly refused offers of freedom from those holding him prisoner. “His selfless action served as an example to others and his forthright refusal, by giving emphasis to the insidious nature of such releases, may have prevented a possibly chaotic deterioration in prisoner discipline,” the citation says. . . .Several citations mention his achievements either as a prisoner or as a lieutenant commander flying bombing runs off the deck of the USS Oriskany. . . .The citations refer to his “accurate ordnance delivery” and his “aggressive and skillful airmanship.” He earned his Bronze Star the day before he was shot down, for participating in a mission over an airfield in Phuc Yen, 11 miles north of Hanoi. . . . The citation for his Distinguished Flying Cross sums up McCain’s misfortune the following day:

“Although his aircraft was severely damaged, he continued his bomb delivery pass and released his bombs on the target. When the aircraft would not recover from the dive, Commander McCain was forced to eject over the target.”

Years later, as his Navy career approached its end, McCain received the Legion of Merit Medal. By then, his missions were in the halls of Congress as a liaison to the Senate from the Navy’s Office of Legislative Affairs.

McCain was wounded trying to rescue a fellow pilot trapped in his aircraft during the USS Forestal’s massive fire, and he may have received a Purple Heart for that as well, depending on where the carrier was at the time (others can say if she was inside or outside of a combat zone). Vice Admiral Stockdale, a former A-4 drive like McCain, received the Medal of Honor for his resistance to his North Vietnamese captors and his role in organizing fellow POWs in addition to four Silver Stars for other acts. Secretary of Defense Robert McNamara personally awarded Cdr. D. Bellinger a Silver Star for downing a MiG-21 while piloting a F-8 on 9 Oct. 1966, one of the first MiG-21s to be shot down in the war, onboard the USS Oriskany. On page 44 of “F-8 Crusader Units of the Vietnam War” the author, P. Marsky, states that a Silver Star was customary for those pilots downing a MiG in combat (I will leave it to others to comment on the truth of that statement). Jet fighter dogfights do not last long. The point I am making is that combat is combat is combat be it in the air or on the ground or on the water or under the water or in the blackness of space and medals get awarded for actions in combat. Each type is different and offers its own version of hell-on-earth. Being a POW does not take you out of the fight, it keeps you in it 24/7. I do not mean to put down others’ service to this great country of ours but I seriously doubt any grunt would have wished for the beatings and torture that McCain received at the hands of the NVA, especially since the NVA knew his father was Commander-in-Chief of the U.S. Pacific Command at the time.

McCain, like the vast majority of others earned his medals.

By the way, I hear BHO was up for an Order of Lenin from the old USSR back in ‘86…well it could be true! . . .I had to slip one in!

Now, can we put this medal topic to rest.

Next question J_Gocht………

Bubba Redneck on September 14, 2008 at 1:46 AM