Hey, you know who’s committed to public education? Sarah Palin!
posted at 6:40 pm on September 10, 2008 by Ed Morrissey
Sandrah Loh issues a cri de coeur in the opinion pages of the New York Times today as an advocate of public education. Despite Barack Obama’s extensive, if yet secretive, collaboration with William Ayers on the Chicago Annenberg Challenge to improve public education, she discovered that the Obamas have opted out of the public system for private education. So has Joe Biden, despite his standard Democratic statements of solidarity with teacher’s unions and educational monopolists. In fact, only one candidate in the presidential campaign has committed herself to working within the system to improve it … much to Loh’s dismay:
I do not know why Barack and Michelle Obama cannot send their children to a nice public school in Hyde Park. You understand that I am a bit unstable this election season (I voted for Hillary) and I do my research by erratically Googling from home. And all I know about Hyde Park — and, readers, I’d love to be corrected if I’m wrong — is that even though real estate prices seem high, the brave little public schools in its ZIP code seem to be flailing. Their scores on www.greatschools.net are largely 2’s and 4’s (on a scale of 1 to 10, 10 being the best). When you read the tea leaves as manically as I do, those low numbers suggest that few children of educated, middle-class children are attending the local schools. Rather, they’ve withdrawn, with nary a ripple, into their whispery private enclaves.
Let us not even touch the term “community organizer,” so buffeted about, by both sides, like a balloon at a rock concert. Let us just say that if Mr. and Mrs. Obama — a dynamic, Harvard-educated couple — had chosen public over private school, they could have lifted up not just their one local public school, but a family of schools. First, given the social pressure (or the social persuasion of wanting to belong to the cool club), more educated, affluent families would tip back into the public school fold. And second, the presence of educated type-A parents with too much time on their hands ensures that schools are held, daily, to high standards.
Maybe this is a good time to bring up the notion of “community organizer”. After all, the school district is usually the most local and closest political unit in any community. Had Obama wanted to commit to improving communities, why not his own? And if Obama wants to protect the educational monopoly, especially in urban areas, why didn’t the Obamas opt to send their daughters to public schools in the upscale Hyde Park area?
Loh wonders the same thing:
So it is with huge grief-filled disappointment that I discovered that the Obamas send their children to the University of Chicago Laboratory School (by 5th grade, tuition equals $20,286 a year). The school’s Web site quotes all that ridiculous John Dewey nonsense about developing character while, of course, isolating your children from the poor.
Sarah Palin provided exactly the kind of role model that Loh wants from her party:
As a Democrat I am horrified that Sarah Palin is the one who snagged the deeply profound — and absolutely ignored by professional smart people — emotional real estate of “P.T.A. mother.” I too am, in fact, not just “my kids’ mom” but their Title I Los Angeles public school P.T.A. secretary. This unheard female howl is, for better or worse, what Ms. Palin has set out to tap into; it is real, and I am sick that we’ve let the Republicans charge this ground.
Palin actually started her political career as a way to improve the education her children received. She started with the PTA, and kept succeeding until she became governor. In terms of “community organizing”, Palin succeeded where Obama retreated, and she made a real difference in her community and the lives of her children.
Loh understands the power of that grass-roots appeal. Palin got into politics for the right reasons, and committed to education in a manner that Obama and Biden never bothered to match. Loh may be “horrified” by Palin’s story, but only because she recognizes how appealing it will be to those who are tired of Washington elites doing a lot of talking without putting themselves out in the least.
Blowback
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What is wrong with Charles Krautheimer? Whose team is he on, anyway?
anniekc on September 10, 2008 at 6:46 PM
“Do as I say, not as I do”
– Barack Obama
VastRightWingConspirator on September 10, 2008 at 6:47 PM
Boy, do I ever hope education comes up in the debate…I get fidgety just imagining the contrasts Gov. Palin can draw when faced by Sen. Biden’s arrogance and his running mate’s hypocrisy.
Blaise on September 10, 2008 at 6:47 PM
And if Obama wants to protect the educational monopoly, especially in urban areas, why didn’t the Obamas opt to send their daughters to public schools in the upscale Hyde Park area?
Bekawz publik skool iz unly gude enuf four are kidz.
Typical demonrat, do as I say, not as I do.
Just say NO to school choice! Keep your kids in the govt socialist programming centers!
Tony737 on September 10, 2008 at 6:48 PM
Palin is the REAL DEAL. None of the standard attacks they use on Republicans work against her. She’s not an old white guy. She’s not rich. She’s a mom. She cares about education and has demonstrated that, not just talked about it. She is a strong woman of accomplishment. These people are actually suffering from something like cognitive dissonance as a result of Sarah Palin. She has achieved what feminists claimed they wanted. She cares about issues that effect the little guy. She has both a conservative message and populist appeal. Obama is a fraud and she is exposing him by comparison.
D0WNT0WN on September 10, 2008 at 6:48 PM
Interesting read. But that’s the fundamental conservative position, no? Don’t like something, don’t rely on the government to come sweeping in, rather get involved. Palin did it.
I do think our education system fails some of our kids. But we’ve got to do something about the teachers’ union in the long-term. I’d be happy if they reformed themselves, but barring that…
Spirit of 1776 on September 10, 2008 at 6:48 PM
I’m looking forward to the VP debate.
Hopefully, the Governor from AK will ask Biden how the Dem. ticket actually supports public schools by sending their children to the neighborhood PS and goes to PTA meetings, or repudiates them.
BTW – SNL season debut this Saturday. Any good ideas for skits? Maybe “foot-in-mouth” Joe’s admission today that he is not the best for the #2 slot??
fred5678 on September 10, 2008 at 6:49 PM
How can this be? Just this morning I saw Barack saying that he’s the education candidate.
TooTall on September 10, 2008 at 6:49 PM
Every turn, and Palin is there…
All the Dems and the “we must improve the schools”, but my kid goes to private.
Now I understand for state department and officials, there is security risks. If Palin goes to Washington she will have to have her kids in private for security reasons.
But these Senators, why, they can live any where in the state. They can have their kids go to any public school…but they don’t.
right2bright on September 10, 2008 at 6:49 PM
This just in:
Intrade Flips for McCain
Intrade Real Time Quote:
McCain: 50.1
Obama: 48.8
_________________________________________
Earlier today it was a tie at 49.something, yesterday Obama lead by about 4 points or so. Last week Obama led by 10.
His stock is falling faster then Enron.
Damiano on September 10, 2008 at 6:49 PM
Again, the liberal elite are all talk about public schools while they send their own kids to private school, and Palin is actually involved in the real world.
forest on September 10, 2008 at 6:49 PM
“Do as I say, not as I do”
- Barack Obama – VRWC
– me
See? Proof that the VRWC using mind control on us!
Tony737 on September 10, 2008 at 6:49 PM
He’ll get hit with that too come debate time, or heck the way that McCain turns out commercials they should just throw one up tomorrow
spacekicker on September 10, 2008 at 6:50 PM
I find it shocking how many elected democrats who pander to the teachers union send their children to private schools.
I recently just learned that in addition to not having residence in his district, congressman Robert Wexler sends his kids to a pricey private school in Maryland.
Topsecretk9 on September 10, 2008 at 6:50 PM
I am watching him right now. It sounds like he has converted and became an Obamite.
Stand up! Charles Krautheimer! Stand up!
Oh…
TheSitRep on September 10, 2008 at 6:54 PM
Confusing….she condemns Obamas and praises Palins…but she is upset by both?? She has the honesty to point these things out, but can’t let go of the LibTard mentality…
Strange….
BigWyo on September 10, 2008 at 6:54 PM
A hypocritical liberal. Who’da thunk it?
powerpro on September 10, 2008 at 6:55 PM
Not so, Joe!
One of the Bush girls teaches in a public school in D.C. The Secret Service can handle this.
Leopold Stotch on September 10, 2008 at 6:56 PM
Palin started her political career seeking to improve education, while Osama Obama fell into it because it was a way to draw attention to himself.
Big difference.
He might have done better promoting speech classes. For himself.
MrScribbler on September 10, 2008 at 6:56 PM
I read about the Obama kids going to that pricy private school quite awhile ago. This is an excellent talking point for Palin, she talks the talk and walks it. A true “community organizer” if there ever was one.
kellyjane on September 10, 2008 at 6:57 PM
Loh howls with grief over Sarah “PTA Mom” Palin but fails to grasp the point of Palin getting involved to begin with. She didn’t call on the state or federal government to help or “change” anything, she got involved at the local level. That’s where the majority of all decisions should be made, not fed up the endless bureaucratic chain until the only answer is shoveling money at the problem.
What Palin has that’s appealing is she doesn’t want, or expect the government to solve all her problems.
darwin on September 10, 2008 at 6:58 PM
Très beau. Wait until Nov. 05. That will be a beauty.
Entelechy on September 10, 2008 at 6:58 PM
The more they dig the better she’ll look…
sven10077 on September 10, 2008 at 6:58 PM
I’m surprized no one has brought the fact that obama had a 5 car convoy for his girls on their first day back to school. Of course it’s only tax payer money…
AMartinez on September 10, 2008 at 6:58 PM
Okay – that’s funny in concept in regards to Slow Joe Biden as reported this morning. But using it in conjunction with Krautheimer feels…… wrong. Poor taste. Bad show, old man.
juanito on September 10, 2008 at 6:59 PM
Better the Vast Right Wing than the Half-vast left wing…
psrch on September 10, 2008 at 6:59 PM
Please note that whatever topic McCain/Palin discuss, the AP writes an article with the opposite effect.
Entelechy on September 10, 2008 at 6:59 PM
She’s really only upset because the fantasy that all Republicans are child hating elitists who send their kids to public school and use the monies they get from fleecing average Americans to send their kids to private school has been ripped away.
It always hurts to rip off a scab. Funny how they keep picking at it. Don’t they know it will never heal if they don’t leave it alone?
Lily on September 10, 2008 at 7:01 PM
Then of course there’s the Jackass Party assumption that all evangelical conservatives automatically think all children should be homeschooled, using nothing more than a Bible and a broken pencil.
CurtZHP on September 10, 2008 at 7:01 PM
The wheels on the bus fall off and off.
The wheels on the bus fall off and off.
The wheels on the bus fall off and off.
jukin on September 10, 2008 at 7:01 PM
I tend to think that government schools are un-constitutional.
Johan Klaus on September 10, 2008 at 7:02 PM
What a loon!
This woman is pissed off at the fact that Palin makes her kids go to regualr public run schools and no one else does it… but then complains about it.
Good grief woman, get a clue!
upinak on September 10, 2008 at 7:02 PM
Hmmm… may have to do a new hit site….
Congressmen who take the Teacher Union bribes… er… campaign contributions… who then send their own children to private schools.
Just shows how out of touch Washington is.
Romeo13 on September 10, 2008 at 7:03 PM
Maybe they don’t want their kids to be exposed to sex education? Or maybe they’re just uppity, elitists sphincters.
SouthernGent on September 10, 2008 at 7:04 PM
Excellent question re : Obamas’ sending their kids to public school.
I sent my kids to their local (not particularly good) school and as we worked to improve their school, they were improved by contact with friends of all stripes.
As I always say to them –I did what the liberals talk of, but don’t do!
changein25 on September 10, 2008 at 7:04 PM
GW himself advocated for a national university.
Spirit of 1776 on September 10, 2008 at 7:05 PM
All politicians end up in it for themselves regardless of how they got into the game.
The Race Card on September 10, 2008 at 7:10 PM
Well,at least in regular school,
the one I went to,the teachers
weren’t to keen on UM and AH
in your sentence’s on a consistent
basis!!
canopfor on September 10, 2008 at 7:11 PM
Being an adult and teaching, is different from being a vulnerable child as a student.
Sorry, but the secret service can better handle the protection of a child in Washington D.C at a private school set up to monitor the kids from a security stand point then a private school.
The last thing anyone wants is to have a Veep child kidnapped and held for ransom…or worse.
I would never hold it against any President or cabinet member to have their children in a secure private school. I want my leaders to concentrate on issues not related to the safety of their child.
In the state you live like a senator or congressman then no excuse, a public school fits.
But the Pres and Veep are a different animal. 24/7 security on all of the family.
Even Chelsea as an adult, at Stanford, 24/7 security in the room next to hers. And she was an adult at a school that is used to high profile people.
right2bright on September 10, 2008 at 7:11 PM
BARACK: I trust public school teachers with YOUR children, just not MY OWN.
originalpechanga on September 10, 2008 at 7:15 PM
Too cynical…
I think most Senators and Congressman end up like that…most. But some find value far beyond serving themselves.
I think Reagan was like that, I thing Elizabeth Dole is like that, I think Bob Dole was like that, I even think Carter was like that (as inept as he was). People like Biden, Kennedy, in it because it is easy, like acting, it is an easy way to make money and have power.
right2bright on September 10, 2008 at 7:15 PM
What do you mean by “government schools?” Is there a federal education system?
I thought each state set their own standards and that the only way feds got involved was by hanging funding over their heads. I am unaware of any federal standards or requirements placed upon my education.
Doesn’t our Constitution enumerate such rights to the states to handle as they see fit?
***
I do think that compulsory education can actually be a detriment to some families.
The Race Card on September 10, 2008 at 7:16 PM
fred5678,
“SNL season debut this Saturday. Any good ideas for skits? ”
How about Palin at a shooting gallery, with the targets being Biden- and Obama-faced ducks; everytime she shoots, she hits one, and it flips over and goes the other direction.
exhelodrvr on September 10, 2008 at 7:16 PM
I’ve been wondering the same thing. Wonder what’s up?
BacaDog on September 10, 2008 at 7:17 PM
By the way…$20,000 plus per year? Is that each? How did he afford that? Does community organizing pay that well?
Blaise on September 10, 2008 at 7:17 PM
Ed, I feel like you’ve misused the “Hey…” headline meme.
DaveS on September 10, 2008 at 7:19 PM
Or, quacks “distwaction” every time one is hit.
BacaDog on September 10, 2008 at 7:19 PM
Yeah, she does, Ed. And I’ll lay odds this hypocritical b!tch still votes for Obama. Anyone want a piece of the action?
ManlyRash on September 10, 2008 at 7:23 PM
She admits as much in the article.
BacaDog on September 10, 2008 at 7:24 PM
I saw the caption you have under the pic….
Did you know “community organizer” is the new black? Just can’t go throwing that phrase around…don’t want to offend any community organizers out there.
jbh45 on September 10, 2008 at 7:28 PM
Has anyone calculated the carbon footprint of the Obama campaign so far and the O-Farce One?
Chakra Hammer on September 10, 2008 at 7:30 PM
Not ALL. But certainly too many.
Guardian on September 10, 2008 at 7:30 PM
But seriously, School Choice needs to be the Center point of this campaign.
Chakra Hammer on September 10, 2008 at 7:31 PM
anniekc on September 10, 2008 at 6:46 PM
Charles is a dumbazz this cycle.
Griz on September 10, 2008 at 7:31 PM
Or at least one of them.
Chakra Hammer on September 10, 2008 at 7:32 PM
Well, if she’s “committed to public education”, then I hope she talks McCain out of some of his more stupid talking points on it.
The problem with education today is NOT bad teachers (yes, there ARE bad teachers, but that is not the main problem.)
And the sole solution ISN’T vouchers (although I support them).
The main problem with education today is No Child Left Behind (NCLB). Here’s why
1) NCLB pushes metrics for measuring the ‘effectiveness’ of schools and teachers. Nice sentiment, but as Scott Adams (Dilbert) once accurately opined – all metrics lead to weasel behavior. Schools now “teach to the test”, meaning that education isn’t about learning, it’s about passing a particular test.
2) NCLB removes the parents from the equation on why kids fail. Successful education requires 3 parties working together: the school, the child and the parent(s). Teachers can not instill in kids that which parents don’t lift up and emphasize. Without parental buy-in (or even understanding the importance of parental involvement), schools don’t have a chance at educating the child.
3) NCLB falsely believes that all children CAN learn the same thing. This is flatly wrong. We are NOT all born with the equal amount of talent and brain power. And college is NOT the prime/optimum outcome for ALL grade school children. Schools tout the percentage of graduates going on to college, but they don’t want you to know how many of those students actually go on to GRADUATE college. There has also been a de-emphasis on vo-tech (teaching kids a skill so they can go right into the job market).
4) NCLB focuses on ‘raising the floor’ but does so by ‘lowering the ceiling.’ Schools focus all their time and effort on getting poor performing students to get better that they almost completely ignore the high performing kid. Factor that in with growing political correctness (some schools are removing honor rolls since it ‘offends’ those who aren’t on them (I thought that was part of the point?)), and we have a system that puts out a mediocre product and holds in near contempt the especially gifted. If we don’t get to Mars soon we will never be able to since we won’t produce the future NASA scientists who can do that.
5) NCLB doesn’t understand that some kids CAN’T learn and a lot more don’t WANT to learn and that there is nothing a teacher/school can do about that. Especially when high schools are overcrowded and the average class size is 30+. There’s no way that any teacher can reach EVERYBODY in their class.
The solutions:
1) Get rid of NCLB
2) Build more high schools and reduce class sizes to between 12 and 15.
3) Build and staff more alternative schools for low performing and disruptive students (different schools).
4) Get back to teaching basics instead of ‘self esteem’ based education.
5) Bring parents back into the ‘success triangle’ and give them roles and responsibilities toward their children’s educational success.
6) Pass laws that protect schools from stupid lawsuits. Schools shouldn’t be sued because Johnny failed a test, Cindy didn’t make the basketball team, or the teacher actually -gasp- yelled at Timmy to be quiet in class!
Religious_Zealot on September 10, 2008 at 7:34 PM
Is this the same Loh who writes an edu blog at LA Times and was fired from NPR?
I don’t remember exactly why, but she’s kinda grates my cheese.
The Race Card on September 10, 2008 at 7:40 PM
It will be. Don’t worry.
Spirit of 1776 on September 10, 2008 at 7:40 PM
Excellent points. Another big problem with NCLB is that the standardized tests the students take have no effect on their grade. Most kids don’t bother to try once they realize the test judges the school and not them individually.
Disturb the Universe on September 10, 2008 at 7:45 PM
Oh, one more solution to my list:
7) Partner with local businesses to create technical training so that the non-college bound/able students can have find employment after graduation.
The bottom line is this – we’ve forgotten what the purpose is of public education. What it SHOULD be is to prepare students for life outside of school – whatever that looks like.
Religious_Zealot on September 10, 2008 at 7:46 PM
Back in the eighties, I held executive positions on 3 PTAs at the same time. The job got more difficult and time-consuming as more moms entered the work force and fewer came to meetings. By the time I left the elementary school PTA, the meetings were attended by 5 people. The principal, one teacher, the PTA president and his wife, who was the treasurer, and me.
One mom who served on PTA Council (for all 6 schools in the district) with me used PTA as a learning experience and ended up County GOP Commissioner.
Our schools are still fairly safe, but they too have had to make major changes to make up for the decrease in the quality of parenting since the mid-eighties. The public schools directly reflect the stability of the families who send their kids to them.
The Dems wanted to have it both ways. They promoted social policies which led to the increase of unstable families and neighborhoods and the teachers’ unions saw an opportunity to promote their leftist agendas as teachers ended up having to do the child-rearing that parents were no longer doing.
Democrats need to start looking in the mirror if they want to understand why so many schools are failing.
The Obamas are entitled to send their kids wherever they want, although at over $20K per year per child, it seems they are more concerned with status than education.
As I stated earlier in regard to a different topic, Obama is not as politically astute as everyone seems to think. If he were, his children certainly would be enrolled in a public school so he could at least claim some actual knowledge of the problems therein.
Connie on September 10, 2008 at 7:48 PM
Man, these people: “I’m horrified that someone on the other side is trying to improve public education.”
Gee, I wonder why folks question their patriotism all the time.
misterpeasea on September 10, 2008 at 7:53 PM
School Choice would Reduce the size public schools and help them to better address the students that they have, and would make increased demand for more private schooling.. more Private schools would pop up, you would have competition in education, competition breeds excellence.
Chakra Hammer on September 10, 2008 at 8:10 PM
I live in Chicago.
Hyde Park is an historic, gorgeous neighborhood. Lots of beautiful architecture and mansions. But it’s still “The South Side.”
Not much in the way of public schools or magnet schools there yet. And, as my friend Sharif puts it, it’s “one of the most integrated communities in America; but naturally there’s a score of police to keep it that way.”
The Obamas would NEVER send their kids to a CPS school in Hyde Park. Never, ever, ever.
Heck, I doubt the Obamas would send their kids to somewhere like Lincoln or Nettlehorst primary schools on the North side if they lived up here.
However, I will say it’s unfair to compare the public schools in Hyde Park to, say, a sleeper community like Wasilla, Alaska.
Holt, MI to Wasilla, AK would be more apt. Obama would NEVER send his kids to generic CPS in Hyde Park. Then again, neither would most parents.
So I get where you’re coming from, but comparing Obama to Palin on this score is just silly. If Sarah Palin lived in Hyde Park, she probably wouldn’t send her kids to CPS, either. Heck, I know she wouldn’t. And even if she were on the PTA of her kids’ schools there, it wouldn’t mean much.
Just sayin’.
lansing quaker on September 10, 2008 at 8:12 PM
the buzz is at about 35. the top story is around 350 votes. So we need to hit that button. this is so true. Palin will own education issue. All she has to say is I lived it.
unseen on September 10, 2008 at 8:12 PM
Errr. I meant “private/charter.” Not public. My bad!
lansing quaker on September 10, 2008 at 8:13 PM
Competition alone won’t fix what’s wrong with public education.
Remember, with NCLB there are limits on the ways that schools can do things. And basically, NCLB MAKES public schools uncompetitive and unresponsive.
Moving kids from public to private schools without changing how public schools do business just means there are LESS kids being screwed out of an education.
Religious_Zealot on September 10, 2008 at 8:14 PM
Also, then the parents could choose to send their children to whatever schools were doing the best, Make the public schools work for the their money and not get a free ride.
Chakra Hammer on September 10, 2008 at 8:14 PM
Blaming testing on schools that cant cut it, is useless.
You have to have testing of some sort, I had testing in my public HS and I graduated in the early 90′s way before NCLB was passed.. we has what was called ISTEP
Indiana Statewide Testing for Educational Progress-Plus
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ISTEP
If Rudy Giuliani didn’t have real time and baseline statistics for his successful CompStat Program then he would never have gotten crime and murder reduced in NY City! He would Never have Been able to get ANY reforms done.
Chakra Hammer on September 10, 2008 at 8:28 PM
You must have statistics and facts IF you need to know what needs to fixed.
If NOT, then why take polls every day?
Chakra Hammer on September 10, 2008 at 8:30 PM
Doncha just love it? Caviar socialists like Biden and Obama prattling on about the rich getting richer and the poor getting poorer, all the while living high on the hog.
Oh my, there is that pig thing again.
Terrye on September 10, 2008 at 8:37 PM
I’m a former school teacher and my wife has been a school teacher for 20 years.
Believe me when I repeat Scott Adam’s theorem that all metrics produce weasel behavior.
I’ve worked at a school that had students who couldn’t pass the test (failed it 3 times) recertified as learning disabled so that it wouldn’t count against the school.
I know of schools that give poorer performing kids different school codes for the SAT so that the school doesn’t take the ‘hit.’
I understand the need to want to measure education, but there are better ways than how they are currently being measured.
Off the top of my head I would use a comparison between those accepted to college and those who graduate college along with the percent of graduates who find and keep jobs.
And, yes, I think some basic ‘literacy’ tests should be used to gauge that the school is preparing the kids for the real world.
But metrics and private schools are neither the problem nor the solution. The cause of the current educational mess goes much deeper than these.
Religious_Zealot on September 10, 2008 at 8:38 PM
What does Charles Krautheimer have to do with this? Just asking…
CCRWM on September 10, 2008 at 8:48 PM
Oh, how gauche.
logis on September 10, 2008 at 8:49 PM
The “better” schools do have a capacity limit, though. Capitalism and competition are fine and good, but by the same token, as far as free and public education goes, your kid just might not get in.
You could choose to opt out of your “failing” school, sure.
But that doesn’t mean the school has to take you and then fail because they’re running over capacity.
School choice is a great slogan and a good mantra. It’s a good philosophy. But it’s not a panacea. It can help a few kids and families, but definitely not all of them.
Gotta pony up and pay for your kid to go to a private school if you want that. “School choice” won’t fix public education.
A “You screw up? You fail!” attitude would, but the entitlement complex of Americans won’t allow for any sort of discipline or consequence. THAT would fix public schools. But the way the money flow is structured (you failed too many kids; ergo, you are a BAD EDUCATIONAL INSTITUTION!) results in the continual lowering of the bar.
Sometimes you just have to say “step it up, or get cut.”
lansing quaker on September 10, 2008 at 8:50 PM
IF we are going to go into Vouchers and start a private school industry, some form of testing needs to implemented, to make sure that kids are actually learning in these schools. You don’t want “rogue” schools or something, where kids are just going to play.. you know you have to have some kind of test.. it’s not a big deal to have the tests it only takes a couple hours and it’s like 2 times a year.. big deal. It’s not really a pass fail thing where you fail the grade, it’s mostly used to gauge the school.(If they are NOT Performing, then the parents can pull the kids out and put them somewhere else, or help to make changes in that school)
Chakra Hammer on September 10, 2008 at 8:51 PM
Like I said, MORE Private Schools would be built, because a market would be made for them! They would be in demand..
You would have Private Secular Schools, Private Religious Schools. Everything.
Chakra Hammer on September 10, 2008 at 8:54 PM
Working for the teacher’s unions?
Parents that concerned about vouchers are not going to send their kids to rogue schools where they play all day. Frankly that description can be applied to far too many public schools where these kids are currently trapped now! I’m for vouchers because it gives parents choice and can help put kids in the school that is right for them instead of keeping them hostage in the socialist incubators of the NEA. No thinking or educated American should be anti-voucher. The only one that loses in the deal are the deadbeat teachers unions that are killing off our childrens’ futures.
highhopes on September 10, 2008 at 8:58 PM
Agreed in principle. But the reason Private Schools perform so well is because of their limited scope and selective standard (not just to get in, mind, but to continue forward).
You fully privatize — or grow in the privatization of — pre-college education, and you’ll eventually create a tier. Think of it in brands:
1. Generic (store cereal)
2. Brand (Kellog’s cereal)
3. “Superior” (something sold at Whole Foods, where I don’t shop)
So you’re effectively just re-creating public education but making the family pay for it directly, rather than pay it through their taxes (or in the case of those who send their kids to private school currently: taxed on public, pay for the “superior” private).
It won’t fix education, and outside the scope of certain government guidelines — like teacher certifications, for example — you can be buying an education from a crappy instructor.
It won’t improve education. It may save some people some $ in the long run, but it won’t fix education. And if you get a higher rates of drop-outs because people can’t afford it, the democratic (small “d”) electorate will demand social programs to compensate and kick elected officials out.
Personally, I just think that public schools shouldn’t have funding tied to retention/passing rates which essentially lowers the academic bar.
Like a private school say “we tried, you didn’t, you fail. Here’s a vocational alternative.”
I’m all for capitalism and competition, but I don’t think privatizing schools — or expanding the privatized school market — is necessarily the answer.
Then again, I am one of those PUMAs. ;)
lansing quaker on September 10, 2008 at 9:03 PM
No, That is so Parents and the system has oversight.
Also, so you don’t have a place where kids are going and simply not learning, if it’s a bad enough problem the State can get involved. Could be considered child neglect.(If it’s bad enough)
I would Consider most of our Public School System Child neglect, despite how much money we pour into it.
Chakra Hammer on September 10, 2008 at 9:05 PM
Every election year we hear politicians on both sides blathering about how incredibly much they care about public education.
This is big. This is really big. I know I’ve said that several times about Governor Palin, but it’s been true each time. If you start adding these things together, it’s really really really big.
logis on September 10, 2008 at 9:10 PM
We seem to be talking past each other.
The problem isn’t with the concept of holding schools accountable, it’s with the fact that metrics (tests) can be beaten without actually raising the educational level.
Today’s curriculums are not built toward created well-rounded, well educated students. They are built to help students pass whatever particular test has been set in front of them.
Thus, a school can have a high percentage of those who pass and yet produce bushels of college drop-outs.
Thinking that testing and ‘competition’ will fix all the problems of public schools is naive and shows a fundamental lack of understanding of what the real problems are within schools.
Religious_Zealot on September 10, 2008 at 9:15 PM
Haven’t read all the comments, yet, so may be repeating, but why the hey would the Obamas sacrifice their daughers’ education at a 2-4 out of 10 school?
mikeyboss on September 10, 2008 at 9:31 PM
OK! Now that we can agree on..
However college-drop outs could be due to any sorts of things, and not necessarily tied to the same. Just because some people have lack of will and motivation to complete college(maybe they need money or don’t have the money and choose to go and get a job? Maybe some of them are just sick of school in general?, or sick of some of the other students and the atmosphere on the campus?) To say that its all the fault of the prior education may be flawed.
People make Choices, to succeed or to fail, or to do what they think is right for them.(College students are adults)
Chakra Hammer on September 10, 2008 at 9:32 PM
and she is sending one of her kids off to war to protect our freedom.
WoosterOh on September 10, 2008 at 9:38 PM
Of course, the ‘acceptable’ percentage of college graduates would NOT be 100%, but something that would take into consideration typical numbers of drop-outs.
The problem here that needs to be addressed is that schools (in part because of NCLB) really, really, REALLY push kids to go to college (as if becoming a hairdresser or mechanic was somehow ‘beneath’ them), and then celebrate the number (or %) of kids who are accepted into college.
If the goal of schools is to prepare kids for life after school, then one (just one of many) way of measuring this is how successful their college prep kids are.
Religious_Zealot on September 10, 2008 at 9:41 PM
Bingo!
And co-signed!
lansing quaker on September 10, 2008 at 9:44 PM
In light of the fact that the U.S. constitution is silent with regard to the federal level department of education, I suggest we abolish it and turn the matter over to the states, where it rightly belongs. And if the states had any sense, they’d turn it over to the localities.
ManlyRash on September 10, 2008 at 9:49 PM
Are you just advocating for more vocational type training in the schools?(trades) IF SO I’m all for it..
I took Vocational Machine Shop(3 hour Class)for 2 years, and also took vocational Welding in HS Also for a year that was also a 3 hour class. With those Skills right out of HS I was working and doing Industrial construction for a few years, after that I got a job at a machine shop and learned how to operate CNC Machines, then that job Paid for me to go to school.
Chakra Hammer on September 10, 2008 at 9:53 PM
BTW, After I graduated from High School they got rid of our Machine Shop they sold all the machines and the teacher retired he was old and taught like 30 or 40 years, it was there forever, now it makes me wonder where all the Machinists are going to come from.. However with the newer technology, it has made things a lot easier, but you still need people that are skilled especially when making prototypes than things like that.
production is cake, but a unique part with tight tolerances takes some skill.
Chakra Hammer on September 10, 2008 at 9:59 PM
About the Obamas daughters’ school
Obama Takes His Daughters Back to School
Besides needing 5 vehicles to take his 2 daughters to school, here are some of the good parts.
No wonder she and Barack are having trouble paying their bills and dance lessons, too.
The word for His Holiness’ campaign is…..Hypocrite.
Dr.Cwac.Cwac on September 10, 2008 at 10:04 PM
I don’t think the most important thing here is where Obama’s kids go to school. It’s where Barack decided to put his energy and attention. Are you suggesting that even the Omighty Barack himself could not have improved the schools on the southside of Chicago, or anywhere else if he had decided to?
But….
He can fix health care for the entire nation.
He can fix the education system for the entire nation.
He can bring everyone together in the entire nation.
He can
cut taxessend checks to everyone to everyone in the entire nation.He can DO IT ALL!!! Just not on the south side of Chicago.
Sarah Palin started out solving small problems, Barack didn’t want to be bothered with small problems. Well, he has a big problem now. And her name is Sarah Palin.
How about that sweetie?
JeffinOrlando on September 10, 2008 at 10:37 PM
He’s the education candidate for those Americans who can afford to pay $20,000+ tuition per kid, per year, for private school.
For everybody else, he’s the former head of the Chicago Annenberg Challenge, where he managed to squander $150 Million in grant money and accomplish absolutely nothing in terms of improving Chicago’s public schools (at least, that’s what an independent group who reviewed his work concluded). Obama now wants to take his massive failure in the Chicago public school system and apply it nationwide. That’s the bad news. The good news is that Obama will make sure there’s plenty of government money available to pay for the schools’ Juneteenth and Kwaanza and MLK birthday celebrations.
AZCoyote on September 10, 2008 at 10:46 PM
Hey, now! I am NO Obama fan, and love Sarah Palin. Heck, I just ordered my Sarah Palin t-shirt 2 days ago (looks like the “Hillary” logo, but with Sarah Palin instead).
I think the “lipstick” comment was dumb and indicative of his sexism. And was SO glad to see HA reference him giving the finger to Hillary.
But I will be fair-minded enough to say that not one person can fix Hyde Park’s public schools in Chicago. And yeah, you’re right. Obama will not fix our problems nationally either.
Then again, I don’t think McCain-Palin will single-handedly fix them, either. I think they will do better, but I don’t think that it will be corrected, and that the Hyde Park schools will be better as a result.
We all know Obama’s “community organizer” stuff is BS. But linking it to “Hyde Park public schools” is giving him too much credit.
Obama could have done some good even during what he did do as a community organizer. But he didn’t. He instead organized shady development projects that left tenants — even without kids — freezing and in crappy conditions in poor neighborhoods.
Focus on that. I just think the school thing is a non-starter. No one could walk into a Hyde Park public school and turn the entire institution around. No one.
lansing quaker on September 10, 2008 at 10:51 PM
…now does reality feel? Sort of like that “short, sharp shock” WS Gilbert wrote about? Been playin’ you for a patsy, and now you have the numbers to prove it…shame when bubbles break, ain’t it?
Didn’t the Clintons do something like this? Promise to send Chelsea to public school in the District, then change horses and send her to Sidwell Friends? Amy Carter had public schooling in DC and look how she turned out….
Puritan1648 on September 10, 2008 at 10:58 PM
…that’s sort of how we do it here in Texas…with a healthy bit of screeching and posturing by the teachers union, no doubt, along with a juicy dollop of politicization thrown in.
Puritan1648 on September 10, 2008 at 11:01 PM
Yes.
College isn’t for everyone, and those who don’t go to college aren’t necessarily any better or worse.
Again, the bottom line is that schools should prepare students for life after school.
If a kid wants to go to college and has the talent, then the school should prepare them for college.
If a kid doesn’t want to go to college, then give them a marketable skill through vocational training.
Religious_Zealot on September 10, 2008 at 11:06 PM
Palin needs to bring this up about Obama sending his kids to private school for $20,000 per year. This will really grate on the average parents.
I’ve been pointing out this hypocrisy in Democrats and Libs for over 20 years.
Also mention the Democrats wanting to end the school choice programs in Washington D.C. which the parents love.
As a Catholic, I’ve watched over the years as excellent Catholic grammar schools in the inner cities have to close down due to fewer poor families that cannot afford to get out of the failed public schools.
And another thing,
MOST of our problems today can be traced back to the destruction of the family. When the family breaks, it fuels all the other failures and vices.
That’s why so many Americans are supporting the Palins. It is because they stick together to get through tough times as a family without all the freebie stuff that in the end would just ruin the family.
Sapwolf on September 10, 2008 at 11:21 PM
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