We have walked in the Palins’ shoes
posted at 2:50 pm on September 1, 2008 by Ed Morrissey
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Allahpundit has a great thread on the announcement from the Palins that their eldest daughter, Bristol, is five months pregnant. Coincidentally, my daughter-in-law is at about the same point in her second pregnancy, and our second granddaughter will join our family at the end of the year. When our first granddaughter, the Little Admiral, joined us, it was in a similar situation that Bristol and her fiancé now face.
First, this is not some catastrophe, although it is hardly an optimal situation. As Harold Ramis remarked in Knocked Up, a hurricane is a catastrophe — which we can easily see today. A baby is new life, an addition to the family, and most people would welcome this. And many can never experience that joy, either. It is a blessing, as long as people don’t treat it like a catastrophe.
Our son and daughter-in-law had just started their senior year in high school when they became pregnant, and I use that pronoun deliberately. The two of them formed their own unit and held each other up during a terribly stressful year. Meanwhile, we parents had to support them as best we could, and make sure they knew we loved and supported them through it all. In return, we discovered two wonderful adults who had just been children shortly before, and when the Little Admiral came, two wonderful parents as well.
None of this was easy, and we certainly all had our moments during this stressful time. However, we took each day as it came, and we discovered that it really didn’t bring the world to an end or stop the two of them from pursuing their dreams Like Bristol, our son and daughter-in-law got engaged shortly afterwards, and this month celebrated six years of marriage. Both of them graduated from college this year, and my son will start graduate school this week. It took them a little longer, but they achieved their goals.
What does this mean politically? I think AP has done a good job in addressing this, but really I don’t think politics will enter into it. The Palins all chose life and lived their values. That doesn’t strike me as news, as we already saw that with her commitment to her son Trig. The Democrats won’t dare mention this as a campaign issue, and even the blogs will probably leave it alone soon enough. Most people, I’d say, will wish Bristol and the Palins well. None of us quit our jobs to help our son and daughter-in-law cope, and neither will Sarah Palin, because it’s unnecessary.
We would all do better just to admire the Palins for their love and support for Bristol, Bristol’s courage in pursuing motherhood when faced with a difficult but hardly unusual situation, and agree that this has little to do with whether Sarah Palin will make a good Vice President. Families have been dealing with this since … there were families. Neither side should use Bristol to score political points. Keeping them in our prayers would also be the kindest action we can take.
Update: Here are my two posts on the graduations of my son and daughter-in-law. Also, if we called the first granddaughter the Little Admiral, what should we call our second?
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Phil, I hate to break it to you, but bad enough that you steal someone else’s lines (TOPV already made that joke).
Worse, stealing lines from a fool doesn’t make you look any better than they did.
At least the best part of both Trig Palin and Bristol’s little one DIDN’T run down Mommy’s leg… pity you can’t say the same.
kiltedscotsman5 on September 1, 2008 at 3:59 PM
You can be imperfect and still not be a hypocritical slut
philnewkirk on September 1, 2008 at 4:00 PM
I can’t imagine how Bristol must feel to be the focus of this much discussion. And so much of it so mean. She doesn’t deserve this. Can we get a new subject?
petunia on September 1, 2008 at 4:00 PM
Tsk, tsk. Bristol Palin isn’t going to win over any liberals for her mother. Check out what’s going on:
Failed to have at least three children by the age of 17 with three different fathers–none of which want anything to do with their children.
She’s actually marrying the father of her child! What’s up with that?
She doesn’t want the government, and by extension YOU the taxpayer, to pay for her child. Those Alaskans are just SO out of touch with reality, ain’t they?
jaleach on September 1, 2008 at 4:00 PM
I was a “shotgun marriage” baby as they used to call it back in 19–. Even after marrying the father, in those days the couple got out of town for a year or two until the to do died down. It was hard on everyone and the way it’s accepted today has more pros than cons as I see it. Even when I was a teenager it was never discussed by family members and it took a good deal of maturation on my part to realize that it was “sound and fury…” and nothing more. When I married, I spent a lot of time assuring the family that history was not repeating itself as they were afraid it would. Now, I wonder why I bothered but that was then. Anyway, good luck and God bless both Sarah’s girl and her child.
jeanie on September 1, 2008 at 4:00 PM
hmmmmmm TOPV disappeared last time around the same time that Michelle Obama got shipped off to charm school.
coincidence? If not, it’s nice that they are letting you use a computer again, Michelle.
Now, I suggest you quit that high powered job and get back home to raise those children. Your man apparently isn’t willing (unlike Todd Palin) to stay home and help you out much. I do understand how bitter that must make you, to be stuck back in Chicago while he jets around to Washington, DC and all over the world.
funky chicken on September 1, 2008 at 4:00 PM
I wouldn’t wanna be around you when you get the biggest surprise of your eternity! Must be interesting, though.
Must be lonely at the top, right Mr. Perfect? Here. Have a blanket.
Jerk!
newton on September 1, 2008 at 4:00 PM
The Little Brigadier
dead bowie on September 1, 2008 at 4:00 PM
Note to philnewkirk: Throw in an “ROTFL” or perhaps a “Hardy-har-har” now and then, just to change things up. Don’t want to get too predictable.
Jim Treacher on September 1, 2008 at 4:01 PM
She knew what she was getting into when she opened her legs. It takes two to tango!
And when she chose to keep the baby, she knew what her family would be in for.
I guess personal responsibility is only a talking point and not something to live by! LOL!
philnewkirk on September 1, 2008 at 4:01 PM
Phiul she’s made of diamond and will be a credit to her faith and her mother’s party.
sven10077 on September 1, 2008 at 4:02 PM
ok dad
philnewkirk on September 1, 2008 at 4:02 PM
She isn’t a hypocrite. She has been living her principles and handled things with love for her family.
You, however, are showing to be the bigger slut.
newton on September 1, 2008 at 4:03 PM
You never got your “human being” merit badge, did you?
What planet are these creatures coming from? Anyone? Bueller?
jaleach on September 1, 2008 at 4:04 PM
Well said.
rockhauler on September 1, 2008 at 4:04 PM
I guess personal responsibility is only a talking point and not something to live by!
Seems phil missed the part about Bristol deciding to keep the baby and marry the father who is also facing his responsibilities.
You can lead a liberal to knowledge but you can’t make them think.
Bishop on September 1, 2008 at 4:04 PM
LOL!!!
Jim Treacher on September 1, 2008 at 4:04 PM
Ha!
Barack Obama just announced, that if anybody on his campaign were involved in this smear, they would be fired!!
You don’t say….
Mcguyver on September 1, 2008 at 4:04 PM
Change your tone, sir. That’s the only warning you’ll get.
Allahpundit on September 1, 2008 at 4:04 PM
She’s assuming responsibility – something you know nothing about, or wouldn’t care!
You’re still the bigger slut!
newton on September 1, 2008 at 4:04 PM
Allah, man, help us here! Thanks!
newton on September 1, 2008 at 4:05 PM
Tony Rezko knows that Obama will pardon him when the One becomes president.
PrettyD_Vicious on September 1, 2008 at 4:06 PM
So can we ask Joe biden to resign because he used his office to make his son rich ?
Biden was an adult and he could keep his legs closed either
William Amos on September 1, 2008 at 4:07 PM
Obama was right to come out against this, even he knows that overt attacks against Bristol will backfire. I say good for him.
Bishop on September 1, 2008 at 4:07 PM
No, you’d be the first to pick up a brick and stone the poor child to death.
It’s really easy to excuse a mistake. It’s harder, though not impossible, to forgive an actual hoser like yourself.
Tennman on September 1, 2008 at 4:08 PM
Worse here in this thread is that someone dared to insult Cap’n Ed – after he has written repeatedly about his family’s personal triumph!
I’m a lot more outraged by that! Who’s with me?
newton on September 1, 2008 at 4:08 PM
Wow looks like the left is coming out full force to post on blogs to try and create drama.
I can only hope the point of this post is that you announcing the Sarah Palin/ Ed Morrissey ticket for Pres in 2012.
Rbastid on September 1, 2008 at 4:08 PM
On second thought, Obama was probably more worried about what might be found in his own past.
Bishop on September 1, 2008 at 4:09 PM
Politico’s Carrie Budoff Brown reports: At a press avail in Monroe, Mich., Barack Obama on Palin: “Back off these kinds of stories.”
“I have said before and I will repeat again: People’s families are off limits,” Obama said. “And people’s children are especially off-limits. This shouldn’t be part of our politics. It has no relevance to Gov. Palin’s performance as a governor or her potential performance as a vice president. So I would strongly urge people to back off these kinds of stories. You know my mother had me when she was 18 and how a family deals with issues and teenage children, that shouldn’t be a topic of our politics.”
On charges that his campaign has stoked the story via liberal blogs:
“I am offended by that statement. There is no evidence at all that any of this involved us,” he said. “Our people were not involved in any way in this, and they will not be. And if I thought there was somebody in my campaign who was involved in something like that, they would be fired.”
Good on you Obama; now can you please rid your party of sicko losers such as alphie!
Keemo on September 1, 2008 at 4:09 PM
Alphie musta felt overwhelmed at losing the argument so badly she had to call for re-enforcements.
rockhauler on September 1, 2008 at 4:10 PM
As I said before, it’s time for the “Ban Hammer”. The lefty trolls can’t help themselves because their blogs are full of this stuff!
Vince on September 1, 2008 at 4:11 PM
I can only hope the point of this post is that you announcing the Sarah Palin/ Ed Morrissey ticket for Pres in 2012.
Rbastid on September 1, 2008 at 4:08 PM
That path you have chosen is opening doors much quicker than we thought; huh Ed… :)
Keemo on September 1, 2008 at 4:11 PM
newton on September 1, 2008 at 4:08 PM
Ditto’s newton!
Keemo on September 1, 2008 at 4:12 PM
My sister did the same thing. They got married when the little guy turned one. Yes, it was quite the scandal at the time. In the long run no big deal. My brother-in-law is about to head to Iraq for his second tour. Oh by the way, they now have two kids. Both are mildly special needs. The first has a language disabllity that is similar to autism. The second, was born nearly deaf. They are doing good with them. So, good for the Palin’s to be able to handle this as well as they are.
boomer on September 1, 2008 at 4:14 PM
Nope, I’m pro-life.
And I actually live my life responsibly instead of certain people we are giving a pass. We should be treating this like we treat O(s)bama’s decision to associate with a terrorist.
Both are choices. It all comes down to personal responsibility.
philnewkirk on September 1, 2008 at 4:16 PM
Obama is not stupid, he knows what alphie and his ilk do not comprehend. This kind of thing comes back on people.
Besides, people might start talking about that poverty stricken brother of his living in a hut.
Terrye on September 1, 2008 at 4:19 PM
Now that you’ve calmed down, maybe you can explain how anyone involved here is trying to avoid personal responsibility. Bristol is keeping the baby, she’s surrounded by her loving family, and they’ve told the world about it. Where’s the dodge?
Jim Treacher on September 1, 2008 at 4:19 PM
Palin-assosciates with her daughter and soon to be granchild
Barry-hangs with an unrepentant terrorist and goes to a Black version of the KKK revival meeting for 20 years and doesn’t notice….
Yeah Phil just the same champ….”just the same”
sven10077 on September 1, 2008 at 4:19 PM
Wow… so choosing to have sex outside of marriage is, according to you, morally equivalent to tacitly condoning a would-be mass murderer?
… yeahhhhh, you’ve got a good clear perspective that everyone should be listening to.
kiltedscotsman5 on September 1, 2008 at 4:19 PM
And I actually live my life responsibly instead of certain people we are giving a pass. We should be treating this like we treat O(s)bama’s decision to associate with a terrorist.
Last time I checked, Bristol wasn’t running as veep, though if anything changes on that I will let you know.
Terrorism equates to pregnancy….jeebus, that’s right out of Think Progress or KOS. Comedy gold.
Bishop on September 1, 2008 at 4:20 PM
phil:
You know better. I don’t believe you even mean half of what you type. You are just looking for a reaction.
Suffice to say, stuff happens, no one is perfect. Even you.
Terrye on September 1, 2008 at 4:20 PM
phil is a fraud.
Terrye on September 1, 2008 at 4:21 PM
Yeah Phil just the same champ….”just the same”
sven10077 on September 1, 2008 at 4:19 PM
Well yeah, DUH. Campaigning for a year and a half is now experientially the same as all of McCain’s foreign policy and military experience.
Please read your DFL memos with more care.
Bishop on September 1, 2008 at 4:22 PM
The difference being this: You are talking about a 17-year-old girl in a moment of passion vs a Daley-Democrat.
Oh, and it’s nice to know that you live all of your life responsibly and don’t make any gaffs on, say, public forums, at work, at home, in your thoughts, in all you do. Man, I just have to admire you for that. Seriously. You’re the only other person I’ve known besides me who’s never made a mistaaak.
Pfft.
Tennman on September 1, 2008 at 4:23 PM
What part of “family values” are the Palins not adhering to?
Carrying a Down Syndrome baby to term, and caring for him despite the challenges such a decision brings? Check
Continuing to love and support their pregnant 17 year old daughter? Check.
Oh wait, I see what you’re getting at: The Palins are obviously hypocrites! So what you’re saying is that, had the Palins been detached and uncaring parents who aborted their Down baby and were laissez-faire about teen pregnancy, they would have escaped the smear of HYPOCRISY, and thus, would be free from criticism from the likes of philnewkirk. Because then they’d all just be victims, but at least they wouldn’t be hypocrites, right?
You do realize how utterly simple-minded your argument is, don’t you?
holygoat on September 1, 2008 at 4:27 PM
No… he really, really doesn’t.
kiltedscotsman5 on September 1, 2008 at 4:29 PM
Hey buddy, that “Party of Family Values” you speak of, also includes us LIBERTARIANS!!!
We Libertarians have been called a lot of things in the past, but Family Values advocates is not one of them.
Ms. Palin, while not 100% pure libertarian, firmly comes from the libertarian wing of the GOP. One might even say she’s got moderately libertarian cultural values. So, where’s the contradiction?
ericdondero on September 1, 2008 at 4:29 PM
And every word is so bittersweet
Out is in and in is out
When with the other side you must compete
When done by those on the other side of town
What was then pronounced a sign of decedent weakness
Is now found fitting enough to bestow a crown
God, when did man lose his reason?
Save us, dear God, if you’re there
BlakeneyP on September 1, 2008 at 4:32 PM
Tsk, tsk.
Yes trolls are annoying, but the more one feeds them, the more annoying they get.
Aylios on September 1, 2008 at 4:32 PM
Bueller is out sick, but I’ll take a stab at it: these creatures come from the planet Rectum Prime?
ManlyRash on September 1, 2008 at 4:35 PM
LOL????? Please don’t ban me Hotair, but philnewark, you’re a dolt.
Personal responsibility means taking responsibility for ones own actions. It doesn’t mean one is perfect. Hopefully you’ve now learned something today lefty troll!
Oink on September 1, 2008 at 4:37 PM
LOL…. and apparently they went through the Rectal Cranium Inversion Field as they left that planet…
Romeo13 on September 1, 2008 at 4:38 PM
Best line, Ed.
Like I said in AP’s thread, always was, always will be so.
Little Commander?
Entelechy on September 1, 2008 at 4:40 PM
Good Lord…apparently Alphie has spawned.
ManlyRash on September 1, 2008 at 4:40 PM
Then again, calling somebody a troll just because I disagree with them isn’t fair. I try to give people the benefit of the doubt, and/or scathing mockery.
Jim Treacher on September 1, 2008 at 4:41 PM
In Alphie’s case, you can lead a whore to culture, but you can’t make her think.
ManlyRash on September 1, 2008 at 4:42 PM
Who is this pretentious bore? Anyone?
ManlyRash on September 1, 2008 at 4:43 PM
So, how does accountability fit into this?
Send_Me on September 1, 2008 at 4:45 PM
I concur. Allah and Ed, please! This place is becoming infested and I’m running out of insults.
ManlyRash on September 1, 2008 at 4:48 PM
Dickhead.
ManlyRash on September 1, 2008 at 4:50 PM
careful MR I don’t want to lose you to the banhammer, there is a succint way to put him in his place.
Frag Toi Phil.
sven10077 on September 1, 2008 at 4:51 PM
Call her by the name she is given. Tell her that she is the apple of your eye and the joy of your life. You can do nothing less than that, Ed.
ManlyRash on September 1, 2008 at 4:53 PM
All that matters is the responsible steps are now being taken. Bristol and her family should now be focusing on this beautiful baby and his or her well being. I’m not of the blessings sort, but it is amazing what a baby’s smile can do to all the people involved, and I’m wishing many smiles on this family.
oakpack on September 1, 2008 at 4:55 PM
He has the impertinence to keep himself a secret from you all
And the arrogance to make you guess
No, you should not care to know his identity nor his address
BlakeneyP on September 1, 2008 at 4:56 PM
Can’t help you on the nickname, Ed (AF, not Navy, wife), but congratulations! A baby should always be seen for what it is: an absolute joy. Not a “punishment.”
As the proud aunt to a “shotgun” nephew, I must now say to philnewkirk: You, sir, are a complete and utter jerk.
pookysgirl on September 1, 2008 at 4:58 PM
Really nice post, Ed. One of your best. I think most normal people, whether they read your post or not, left or right, are going to come out on this as you do, because all of us have been there.
james23 on September 1, 2008 at 5:08 PM
Whose? Mine? The Parents’? Bristol’s?
I’m assuming that was an honest question, deserving an honest answer. I’ll give you my take.
My niece, an Iraq war veteran, became pregnant out of wedlock and had the baby. He’s a year and a half old now. We drove to 11 hours one way our location to be with her because her mom and dad couldn’t get a flight in from across the country. We’ve been down to see her now three times. Her little fella was born at a pound and a half. We were there with her when the doc suggested she not authorize any more treatment for a class 5 bleed on the right hemisphere of his brain.
Well, to cut it short, she didn’t agree, made them work with and help heal that little guy. He’s going to have some form of epilepsy, but still too early to tell.
I love my niece. I love my grand nephew. There’s nothing to forgive. Only prayer for them both and for their situation.
BTW, I would be classified as a far right neocon by some. Except I try to live my life by the precepts of the Son of God. His judgment is absolute. But the funny thing is, Scipture guarantees us that Mercy triumphs over Jugment. Every time.
I continually thank God that I won’t get what I deserve because of his Mercy. Why would I subject my family or your family or Sarah Palin’s family to any other measure of judgment?
Tennman on September 1, 2008 at 5:08 PM
Wow, so because you can’t beat them with rational arguments (nor ad hominem attacks… or as you said, “insults”), you seek to silence folks with whom you disagree?
“The remedy to bad speech is not less speech. It’s more speech.” Justice Breyer
Is it wrong to question the role the family, and society, in how it treats the issue of premarital sex and pregnancy, both as an idea and as a reality? Sure, she’s not applying for the job of church “deacon” or “elder,” but wouldn’t it be prudent to expect that a leader be “good managers of their children and their own households” and that her children are not “accused of dissipation or rebellion?” Are these not legitimate concerns, especially for those who attempt to live by the Bible?
Send_Me on September 1, 2008 at 5:17 PM
Thank you ED. I’m glad you shared. You didn’t have to.
AND FOR ALL THE TROLLS>>>>>>>>>>>>
The only difference between your definition of CHOICE and ours is that we respect that CHOICES MUST BE LIVED WITH, whatever they may be.
Pro-Lifers may not be virgins, but we sure as hell aren’t KILLERS.
seejanemom on September 1, 2008 at 5:17 PM
Good on your niece for standing up for her son when the doctor wanted to give up. And good on you for being there for her when she needed it most. I am constantly amazed at doctors that want to stop treatment because they want to give up – babies, I’ve found, can be very tenacious in their fight to live.
Every child, regardless of the circumstances of conception, adds a distinctive and much-needed new spark to our lives.
Anna on September 1, 2008 at 5:19 PM
Hmmm, yeah, who is breaking the “terms of use?”
Send_Me on September 1, 2008 at 5:20 PM
O/T: I really hate the multi-page comment format. Aside from making the idea of catching up on threads seem daunting, it makes word searching comments, when you’d like to respond to something you’ve read, a major pain and a real time waster.
JM Hanes on September 1, 2008 at 5:21 PM
I’ve seen the disruptive trolls come in here every time there is an open enrollment. Eventually some come around and actually change their perspective, some just leave and the rest learn to respectfully argue. It just takes time. Iraq wasn’t liberated in a day.
oakpack on September 1, 2008 at 5:23 PM
ericdondero on September 1, 2008 at 4:29 PM
Really? How exactly is she Libertarian? Pro Life? Pro-ID teaching in PUBLIC schools? Pro-Nation Building? Pro-Big Government?
DanKenton on September 1, 2008 at 5:24 PM
Uh. A VERBOSE pretentious troll. The worst kind.
ManlyRash on September 1, 2008 at 5:24 PM
Except when they don’t… “A foolish son is a grief to his father and bitterness to her who bore him.” ~Proverbs 17:25
Send_Me on September 1, 2008 at 5:25 PM
???? Sorry for being obtuse.
ManlyRash on September 1, 2008 at 5:26 PM
O.K., so are we all in agreement that the same kind of people, (I use the term “people” with great regret) that are posting trash about the Palin family, are the same mental giants that think Obama would make a fine president? No wonder Obama wants to distance himself from them. As for myself, I’m grossed out that I even live in a world with pigs who think like that.
anniekc on September 1, 2008 at 5:31 PM
Spare me your smarmy palaver. There are those who wish to engage in forthright, vigorous dialog and there are trolls. I’ve been here and elsewhere long enough to distinguish between the two.
ManlyRash on September 1, 2008 at 5:32 PM
Spoken like a true ferret.
ManlyRash on September 1, 2008 at 5:35 PM
I’m an atheist that hasn’t read the Bible in years. Spare me your inane assuption that I’m religious. Children are precious because through them, through their genes, accomplishments, and deeds, we gain some small measure of immortality.
Anna on September 1, 2008 at 5:35 PM
Send_Me,
This is what you call a “winning argument”:
And this:
That “argument” deserves no “rational” response, because it is nothing but juvenile taunting.
Spiny Norman on September 1, 2008 at 5:39 PM
Send_Me on September 1, 2008 at 5:25 PM
“She says I am the one…but the kid is not MY son” ~Michael Jackson (as thought by the so-called “fiance”)
DanKenton on September 1, 2008 at 5:41 PM
seejanemom on September 1, 2008 at 5:17 PM
You mean fetus killers. You’ve got no problem with killing all other stages and walks of life.
DanKenton on September 1, 2008 at 5:49 PM
May God watch over this family. No one is perfect and this is why Christians love the Lord–He forgives us and loves us despite our failures. Would the Palins have preferred that Bristol had waited, matured more, married and then become pregnant? Of course they would, but this is thier child, they love and support her and will welcome the baby as a blessing. They have my best wishes.
Pat in NC on September 1, 2008 at 5:50 PM
philnewkirk on September 1, 2008 at 4:00 PM
I didn’t think a human existed that equals alphie in the category of moral ineptness; as is the case far to often in life, I was wrong once again. The elevator ride to hell has more floors than I thought. This thing is a few floors below alphie.
Keemo on September 1, 2008 at 5:51 PM
Can you be more specific, please? I have a hunch as to what you are talking about, but I would prefer to get specifics and not have to assume anything.
kiltedscotsman5 on September 1, 2008 at 5:52 PM
Instead of engaging my comments through rational discourse, you’ve chosen to dismiss them as “smarmy palaver.” This, by definition, is a fallacy of relevance.
For your own edification, here is a fallacy of logic you may wish to research.
ip·se dix·it
Latin.
1. An unsupported statement that rests solely on the authority of the individual who makes it
Send_Me on September 1, 2008 at 5:54 PM
Great Peice Ed…
How about calling #2 the First Mate ?
Best wishes to your family as well as Palin’s
Children, Grandchildren, and so forth are blessings from God.
And, especially in this type of scenario, ultimately strengthens the bonds of family; the ties that bind us all together, and the true riches of life…
RocketmanBob on September 1, 2008 at 6:00 PM
kiltedscotsman5 on September 1, 2008 at 5:52 PM
Just trying to clarify the statement. We’re talking about abortion here and not all stages of life. For example, Bush is pro-life but also pro-war, pro-death penalty and he enjoys eating animals. So to claim that one is not a “killer” is not exactly a truthful comment when you enlarge the field of view.
DanKenton on September 1, 2008 at 6:01 PM
But your complaints ARE smarmy palaver, Send_Me.
Have you bothered to read this thread? The adolescent trolls, and that is all they are, who you feel we must “debate” with “rational arguments” have posted nothing but taunts and catcalls. They deserve no respect.
Spiny Norman on September 1, 2008 at 6:02 PM
Is it your contention, then, that killing during war, hunting and killing of animals for meat, and capital punishment comprise “murder” in the sense that pro-life conservatives understand the term when they apply it to abortion?
kiltedscotsman5 on September 1, 2008 at 6:07 PM
1. I was merely using the said proverb as I would any other quotation that I found wise, nothing more.
2. I fail to see how you, as an atheist, could come to such a conclusion about the worth of a child. If people are nothing more than animated dirt, then how did you come to the conclusion that anything beyond ourselves has any value? [My intention here is not to sound rude, but rather to engage in a philosophical discussion. ]
Send_Me on September 1, 2008 at 6:08 PM
kiltedscotsman5 on September 1, 2008 at 6:07 PM
Murder carries a different connotation, doesn’t it?
DanKenton on September 1, 2008 at 6:16 PM
I doubt you could “engage in forthright, vigorous dialog” if your very life depended on it and you don’t give the first evidence of even having a clue in the distinguishing department.
MB4 on September 1, 2008 at 6:17 PM
I have three children. That is how I came to value life. My daughter is like a miniature of me, only more evil and cunning (as most 5 year olds are), my first twin is my grandfather reborn, and my second twin is a lighter-haired smaller version of his father. Of course, they are each unique individuals with hopes and dreams of their own, but through each of them, my husband and I will live on.
One does not have to believe in the divine to love and protect our children. It is instinctual, and why would I seek to love and protect something that has no value? Of course every child is valuable beyond mention – without them, we would have no purpose, no future as a species.
I do not know if you’re a parent, but if you aren’t, perhaps when you cross that bridge you’ll understand. If you are, you would have no need to ask that question, because a mother’s love needs no explaination.
And we are more than animated dirt, but that is a subject for another thread. I was hesitant to use atheist, but sometimes it’s quicker than wasting three paragraphs to explain.
Anna on September 1, 2008 at 6:17 PM
Ed. Thank you, thank you, thank you. When I think about the “family” (?) histories of so many whose friends are in a frenzy to criticize Bristol and her mother (and father) I am grateful that my grandfather turned away from the Democratic party when FDR ran for his third term. And grateful for another grandfather who was raised in ancient Brooklyn by his emigrant parents who couldn’t speak English. This is a great country. This is the country I loved when I volunteered for a three year tour in the 82d during the Korean Conflict. This is the country for whose leaders I’ve worked and now at 80 can only contribute some green stuff. But I will, as long as I live, and glady as long as I can read and share stories such as yours. And those of many of your great posters on this column. God Bless America and God Bless y’all.
ich dien on September 1, 2008 at 6:20 PM
NOBODY on the internet is anonymous.
Anybody can be found, cheap.
OneEyedJack on September 1, 2008 at 6:21 PM
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