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Oy: Palin’s daughter is pregnant; Update: Althouse on Palin vs. Edwards; Update: Obama tells media to lay off Palin’s daughter; Update: Media knew

posted at 12:23 pm on September 1, 2008 by Allahpundit
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Supposedly McCain knew. Did he?

The 17-year-old daughter of Republican vice presidential candidate Sarah Palin is pregnant, Palin said on Monday in an announcement intended to knock down rumors by liberal bloggers that Palin faked her own pregnancy to cover up for her child.

Bristol Palin, one of Alaska Gov. Palin’s five children with her husband, Todd, is about five months pregnant and is going to keep the child and marry the father, the Palins said in a statement released by the campaign of Republican presidential candidate John McCain…

Senior McCain campaign officials said McCain knew of the daughter’s pregnancy when he selected Palin last week as his vice presidential running mate, deciding that it did not disqualify the 44-year-old governor in any way

McCain officials said the news of the daughter’s pregnancy was being released to rebut what one aide called “mud-slinging and lies” circulating on liberal blog sites.

And here’s the statement, via Team McCain, from Palin and her husband:

“We have been blessed with five wonderful children who we love with all our heart and mean everything to us. Our beautiful daughter Bristol came to us with news that as parents we knew would make her grow up faster than we had ever planned. We’re proud of Bristol’s decision to have her baby and even prouder to become grandparents. As Bristol faces the responsibilities of adulthood, she knows she has our unconditional love and support.

“Bristol and the young man she will marry are going to realize very quickly the difficulties of raising a child, which is why they will have the love and support of our entire family. We ask the media to respect our daughter and Levi’s privacy as has always been the tradition of children of candidates.”

Gathering my thoughts. Stand by for updates.

Update: It shouldn’t hurt Palin but it will, because like I said in my pessimism post on Friday, any sort of embarrassment that she brings to the campaign will be used by the media to push the Dan Quayle/disastrous gamble meme, whether or not the embarrassment’s her own fault or not. (They’ll spin it as a comment on McCain’s “judgment” in picking her.) The left, normally all for teen sex, will naturally use it as an excuse to call her daughter a whore in the guise of criticizing Palin herself for her position on abstinence-only education, which is why I’m thinking maybe McCain really did know about it: Per KP’s analysis, the nastier and more personal the left gets, the greater the risk of a backlash that benefits Palin.

Belated exit question: Anyone find it amazingly coincidental that Daily Kos went after Palin’s own pregnancy right out of the chute on Friday, with no apparent evidence whatsoever, and now we find out that her daughter’s actually pregnant? I usually scoff at the idea of party researchers planting memes with bloggers, especially since the nutroots is so paranoid about that happening on the right, but that’s a simply remarkable stoke of good luck on their part, no?

Update: A second belated exit question: Did they really release this to quash nutroots rumors, which were already pretty well quashed this morning, or because between Gustav and the convention it’s the perfect time to bury it?

Update: Between CNN wondering why the mother of a special needs baby would head off on the campaign trail and Alan Colmes rolling around in the sewer, the left’s been itching since the announcement on Friday to paint her as an unfit mother. Expect a lot of very solemn tut-tutting about how selfish Palin is to have accepted the nomination knowing it’ll only throw a spotlight on her poor daughter, even as they themselves ratchet that spotlight up to nuclear-flash brightness.

Update: Since the dirty laundry’s all coming out today, sources close to Palin tell David Brody that Palin’s husband was arrested for DUI 22 years ago.

Update: A commenter suggests a title for when they make a movie of this saga: “Juneau.”

Update: KP was ahead of the game:

A McCain campaign official tells ABC News’ George Stephanopoulos that McCain knew of Bristol’s pregnancy and “didn’t believe Governor Palin should be disqualified” from the vice presidency because of it. “If Democrats try to attack, it will backfire spectacularly,” the official said.

Update: The more I think about it, the more I think McCain probably did know. The timing is simply perfect to release the news: You wouldn’t want to do it on Friday, lord knows, when she’s getting her intro to the country, and you wouldn’t want to do it later in the campaign when it’s closer to Election Day or even later this week when it’d distract from her convention speech. Now’s the time to do it, when it’ll be no higher than the third-most important story of the day.

If I’m right, then the nutroots’s smears about Palin’s own pregnancy gave McCain an amazingly fortuitous pretext here. Now he gets to play the victim — “we had to do it to stop those dastardly left-wing bloggers from hurting the family” — instead of just someone making an embarrassing admission.

Update: Jonathan Martin says social cons won’t be happy about the news. True, but they won’t be particularly upset about it either. The left will push this hard thinking that it’s some kind of dealbreaker for the Christian right, but to believe that you’d have to fundamentally misunderstand where the Christian right’s main emphasis lies. Says Goldstein:

Many on the left will believe, quite mistakenly, that such an announcement is likely to weaken Palin’s support among “the hard-right conservative base”. But in fact, it will do no such thing — first, because the “hard-right conservative base” that liberal Democrats consistently invoke is largely a caricature that lives only in their minds and as a convenient trope in their rhetoric, from whence it can be trotted out as a foil and a boogeyman on cue; and second, because those energized over the choice of Palin include many disaffected libertarians and classical liberals who were, until the announcement of the Governor’s candidacy, set to either sit the election out, or else cast a protest vote for Bob Barr.

Update: And as if right on cue to prove my last point, here’s David Brody of CBN explaining why this won’t hurt Palin with the base.

I’m sure lots of people will take their shots at the pro-life Christian woman but hold on a moment. If you think Evangelicals are going to ditch her for this, you’re totally misreading the situation. As a matter of fact, they are ready to fire back at any potential critics…

Look, this development will actually be positive for the most part with Evangelicals. First they hear that Sarah Palin chooses the life option even though she had a Downs Syndrome baby and once again the family (and Bristol) has chosen the life option in this recent case. That’s a double “ca-ching”. Let’s call this the Evangelical daily double. If anything, this whole situation will probably make more people around the country relate to her and her family. It makes them more real. Will there by some turned off by the whole pre-marital sex thing? Of course but this type of story doesn’t sink her at all with Evangelicals.

Update: The boss notes the contrast with Obama’s notorious “punished with a baby” comment, something else that’ll make it hard for him to capitalize on this with Christians.

Update: Every post Althouse has written about Palin is worth reading, but this is especially sharp:

Oh, that looks like a meme. Sarah Palin must stay home with her special needs baby. Sarah Palin must stay home with her about-to-be-married, pregnant daughter. Ladies: Put your career on hold until everything in you’re family stops happening… Would a man forgo his career to be there for a family member who is experiencing an important life transition?

Remember when John Edwards decided to go on with his campaign after his wife got a diagnosis of inoperable cancer? Now, I think Elizabeth Edwards was probably excited about the campaign and wanted to go on with it. In that light, why are you assuming that Bristol Palin isn’t excited about her mother’s campaign? Unlike Elizabeth Edwards, Bristol is not facing her last days. She’s just starting out — all caught up in life. Presumably, she intense and positive about her pro-life beliefs, her love for the baby’s father, her impending wedding, and the new baby on the way.

Update: Needless to say, for a variety of reasons you won’t be hearing anything about this from Team Barry. But in case any more reason was needed, people are e-mailing to remind me that The One’s mother was also a teenager when she gave birth to him and married his father just six months before he was born. That won’t stop the left from attacking, of course — remember, the ostensible sin here is hypocrisy, not teen motherhood, even though the point clearly enough is to try to shame Palin with her daughter’s morals.

Update: And here’s NBC pushing the abstinence-only angle.

Update: For once, Dobson sounds the right note:

“In the 32-year history of Focus on the Family, we have offered prayer, counseling and resource assistance to tens of thousands of parents and children in the same situation the Palins are now facing. We have always encouraged the parents to love and support their children and always advised the girls to see their pregnancies through, even though there will of course be challenges along the way. That is what the Palins are doing, and they should be commended once again for not just talking about their pro-life and pro-family values, but living them out even in the midst of trying circumstances.

“Being a Christian does not mean you’re perfect. Nor does it mean your children are perfect. But it does mean there is forgiveness and restoration when we confess our imperfections to the Lord. I’ve been the beneficiary of that forgiveness and restoration in my own life countless times, as I’m sure the Palins have.

“The media are already trying to spin this as evidence Gov. Palin is a ‘hypocrite,’ but all it really means is that she and her family are human. They are in my prayers and those of millions of Americans.”

Update: Like I’ve been telling you all along, The One may be many things, but he’s no dummy. Consider this the equivalent of McCain’s “congratulations” ad last week: Classy, and also shrewd.

Mr. Obama, campaigning here, also noted that his own mother was 18 when she gave birth to him.

“People’s families are off limits,” he said. “People’s children are especially off limits. This shouldn’t be part of our politics. It has no relevance to Gov. Palin’s performance as a governor or her potential performance as a vice president. ”

“I would strongly urge people to back off these kinds of stories,” he added. “That shouldn’t be a topic in our politics.”

He vehemently pushed back against an unnamed McCain aide suggesting his campaign had any ties to the blogs that were spreading rumors before the news broke, saying he was “offended” by that and if any of his staff was involved in spreading the issue, “they’d be fired.”

Update: Your must-read of the day: Time reporter Nathan Thornburgh on how he’d already heard all about the pregnancy from people in Wasilla and how they — and he — agreed that it was nobody’s business but the Palins’.

All weekend they had the decency not to pretend that they didn’t know the governor’s eldest daughter was pregnant. But they also expected decency in return, that I wouldn’t be the kind of person to make sport out of a young girl’s slip…

As for the idea — sure to be floated—that the avowedly anti-abortion Palin may have pressured her poor daughter to ruin her life by carrying an unwanted baby to term, I wouldn’t bet on it. The Palin family seems to share the same pro-life values going back at least as far back as anyone here can remember, and it wouldn’t be at all surprising if Bristol wore those values, however imperfectly, as her own. At least, that’s what the town thinks. And Wasilla, above all, is pretty sensible.

Update: Lee Stranahan does the math for Trig Truthers: “Some people are still holding onto the fake pregnancy rumor. Let’s just do some math. Trig was on April 18, 2008 – about four months and a week ago. Bristol is said to be five months pregnant. Now, if you want to pretend that the five month date is a total lie then you’d also have to believe that the 17 year old had a Down’s Syndrome baby then turned right around and got pregnant again presumably because the first premature birth was so freakin’ awesome!”


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with 8 weeks left in this race we have to be answering stupid questions about a stupid pregnancy and it is a complete distraction and will not help us.

I agree. It’s understandable that some are trying to find silver lining here, but the bottom line is that McCain has saddled himself with a huge distraction that will cost him precious time and energy.

Until today I thought McCain would win. Now I think he probably won’t. People will see his selection of Palin as evidence of poor judgment. And they are probably right.

Of course Palin has not been officially nominated yet. It’s not too late for her to make this statement: “I didn’t realize my daughter would be dragged through the mud. In deference to her at this crucial time in her life, I am withdrawing from the ticket.”

This might be her only chance to save her party, her family, and incidentally her own political future.

sauropod on September 1, 2008 at 4:54 PM

sauropod on September 1, 2008 at 4:54 PM

And for people to suggest that it is sexist off us to suggest that a pregnant teenage daughter is “baggage” because Palin is a woman, give me a break. People would react the same way if we’d selected Pawlenty and the same thing happened to him. Like you said, it reflects most poorly on McCain’s judgment than anything else.

jimmy the notable on September 1, 2008 at 5:03 PM

… and AllahPundit is a Beta Male …
Loxodonta on September 1, 2008 at 3:51 PM

…who has spent an entire holiday weekend fielding posts about pregnant women, leaking amniotic fluid and obstetric advice. Just making note that I appreciate the sacrifice.

Quisp on September 1, 2008 at 5:06 PM

Oy = yiddish for enlightened. A little elitist isn’t it?

Fuquay Steve on September 1, 2008 at 4:52 PM

Well, you might consider that “Oy” is also an exclamation to gain attention, often used by British Beta Males.

Loxodonta on September 1, 2008 at 5:07 PM

Quisp on September 1, 2008 at 5:06 PM

Agree. I too appreciate Ed and AllahPundit.

Loxodonta on September 1, 2008 at 5:08 PM

May this be an entree into the issue of “it’s no big deal,” perhaps? Responsibility, and all that?

Nichevo on September 1, 2008 at 4:39 PM

Forgive me, but I’m not following the questions. *doped up on antihistamines* I’m not surprised if I was unclear in my rambling. I think it (teen pregnancy) is a big deal. I think failing to take the responsibility is much worse.

pannw on September 1, 2008 at 5:12 PM

Stay strong guys. No need to panic over this. Newt rightly called Governer Palin “authentic”. I only see this as reinforcing that notion. No one is perfect, no family is. If anything this may help the GOP where they need it most. Winning back Independents, and Reagan Democrats, who are a must to overtake Obama. With the leftist going unhinged on a young girl will only help with those voting blocs. Wait until the GOP introduces Governer Palin to America. I have a very strong feeling that millions of Americans are going to fall in love with the Governer as they get to know her. Her smile is infectous, her personality is inviting, and her policies on lower taxes, cutting spending, and fighting corruption will draw many votes to McCain in the election.

chief on September 1, 2008 at 5:13 PM

Just how distracting is having a pregnant teenage daughter when you are a two-parent, economically-secure family with at least one set of nearby grandparents handy? Should Palin step down as governor of Alaska because of this supposed distraction? It just smacks of sexism that because the politician is the mom, and not the dad, she should gear down her political efforts because of an all-to-common family matter (pregnant teen).

I don’t have the patience to do the research, but I would be surprised to find a major male politician to whom this standard was applied. If someone can point us to such an example, that would be illuminating. Personally, I agree with those who have compared Palin’s current quandry to Edwards’ situation — there’s a guy who had a family issue that needed tending to (but we know what he was tending to instead, don’t we boys and girls?).

If the people of Alaska start an effort to recall their governor, I might be persuaded that Bristol’s pregnancy is relevant. If not, let’s drop it.

Y-not on September 1, 2008 at 5:13 PM

I think failing to take the responsibility is much worse.
pannw on September 1, 2008 at 5:12 PM

Who’s failing to take the responsibility ?
Just askin’

Tony Soprano on September 1, 2008 at 5:14 PM

It’s understandable that some are trying to find silver lining here, but the bottom line is that McCain has saddled himself with a huge distraction that will cost him precious time and energy.

You think everybody’s going to ask for their money back, too?

Try to give people some credit for sense. Barack has already stepped up to say “back off,” and pretty much any hay the leftosphere tries to make from it is going to end up right in Barry’s eye. Chin up.

Jim Treacher on September 1, 2008 at 5:15 PM

This conversation is above my paygrade since I am not really comfortable discussing the ongoings of a 17-year-old’s vagina.

The Race Card on September 1, 2008 at 5:18 PM

mikkins on September 1, 2008 at 4:12 PM

I should have been more clear. You aren’t a fool because you think teenage pregnancy is a good thing (I didn’t really think you did), you’re a fool because you seem unable to appreciate that, to many, many people, an unplanned teen pregnancy reflects somewhat badly on both of the teens’ parents. I’m sorry if that rather obvious fact hits a nerve.

But cheer up, Americans seem increasingly willing to absolve parents of any and all responsibility for their children and more and more inclined to think that society as a whole should, without criticism or complaint, absorb the social and financial costs of children run amuck. The village, it seems, is almost upon us.

This discussion is supposed to be about how this morning’s revelation will effect the upcoming election, not about ex’s religious preoccupations, your personal demons, or my status as a parent. We can debate the culture war component, but I don’t see how that’s a winner for you. Are you sure you wouldn’t be more comfortable on Kos?

Infidoll on September 1, 2008 at 5:18 PM

Y-not on September 1, 2008 at 5:13 PM

Quite right. Always a double standard applied to women. My mother was a doctor and was better than most of her male counterparts but they still cr@??#d all over her.

Tony Soprano on September 1, 2008 at 5:18 PM

pannw on September 1, 2008 at 5:12 PM

I get it now. Edwards. Nothing about that over at DKos.

Tony Soprano on September 1, 2008 at 5:20 PM

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132×6867229

I hope folks keep digging and do not let them slide this curve ball by. Nothing but a smoke screen,now, with tight scrutiny, I do think it will come out that Bristol is NOT pregnant now, but DID give birth to Trig. Only 2 months to expose these lying folks for what they are. And NO it is not a “private family matter” It could have been, But Ms. Palin rendered that argument moot.

These people are insane.

Enoxo on September 1, 2008 at 5:21 PM

Who’s failing to take the responsibility ?
Just askin’

Tony Soprano on September 1, 2008 at 5:14 PM

Oh, boy…

No one in this case. Everyone in the Palin family is living up beautifully to their responsibilities.

I was pointing out that I think kids (any kids) getting into the situation is not ‘just one of those things’ or ‘no bid deal’ as some comments seem to imply, but it still would be far worse if they did not accepted the responsibility. That’s all.

Also, I would hate to see this cause Sarah Palin to pull her name from the ticket. As Ed wrote in another post, families that deal with this don’t make a habit of quiting their jobs over it. Sarah shouldn’t have to either.

pannw on September 1, 2008 at 5:24 PM

pannw on September 1, 2008 at 5:24 PM

I got to the thread late so I thought it was part of a previous exchange. Thanks to type it all up so nicely. As I stated earlier, if anyone is shirking responsibility it’s John Edwards. Try to find anyone making a point of that at DKos. They’re banning people for bringing it up.

Tony Soprano on September 1, 2008 at 5:29 PM

These people are insane.

Enoxo on September 1, 2008 at 5:21 PM

You’re just realizing this?

There’s the evil underbelly of politics, and then there’s the far-left underbelly of politics, which is so vile that even Lovecraftian eldritch dark gods like Cthulhu would be embarassed by them.

Vyce on September 1, 2008 at 5:31 PM

pannw on September 1, 2008 at 5:24 PM

That’s no ‘big’ deal, in case it isn’t obvious. And Tony Soprano, Edwards definitely would apply, but I’m afraid I can’t take credit for thinking of him. ;)

pannw on September 1, 2008 at 5:31 PM

Without the left wing nutroots this 5 months pregnancy may have turned off some hard line evangelicals; however, the revelation coming on the heals of of pure defamation only puts a human, middle class, these-people-are-like-us, face on the whole issue. Many independents and bona fide feminists will identify with the Palins. More and more, this family and the Governor look like them and us. The left wing is looking so hypocritical and sanctimonious. And to think Kos and his ilk will never have pregnancy issues in their lives makes it downright laughable. How low can these people go before they come up with worms and slime?

sbynyc on September 1, 2008 at 5:32 PM

I wish all of Gov. Palin’s family my best wishes. That’s really all that needs to be said on the subject, we should let it drop, its none of our business. Lets move on to the facts of electing the most qualified candidate, who can run the government most effectively and efficiently.

eaglesailor72 on September 1, 2008 at 2:42 PM

Full disclosure – this is my other half speaking. I agree with him though. This entire weekend our house has been abuzz with the news of Palin being McCain’s pick – and how I’m finally able to vote for him. This news doesn’t make me think poorly of Sarah or her daughter – it makes me feel poorly about the people who are attempting to spin this into something horrible. I would never want to be judged by my mother’s actions nor my daughters… we are all individuals with free will, as is Bristol.

I think Sarah will make a wonderful grandmother, and a wonderful Vice President. I say the first as a mother, the second as a voter.

Anna on September 1, 2008 at 5:32 PM

Our beautiful daughter Bristol came to us with news that as parents we knew would make her grow up faster than we had ever planned

Sorry but I don’t think much of parents who raise a young girl that becomes pregnant in high school. If teenage girls across the country see this type of behavior in a White House family, what messages does that send?

On the other hand, Palin helps McCain appeal to the white track voting block. You can see the brilliance of his VP pick shining through.

bayam on September 1, 2008 at 5:41 PM

Sorry but I don’t think much of parents who raise a young girl that becomes pregnant in high school. If teenage girls across the country see this type of behavior in a White House family, what messages does that send?

Bayman, if you think that ANY parent can prevent a child from pregnancy, or that parenting has anything to do with it, you’re either not a parent or totally clueless.

I don’t understand why this is even a political story.

orlandocajun on September 1, 2008 at 5:49 PM

with 8 weeks left in this race we have to be answering stupid questions about a stupid pregnancy and it is a complete distraction and will not help us.

That really depends. If McCain gets elected, will she be pushing moral issues down our throats? No stem cell research, less emphasis on the science of evolution in the classroom, no sex education outside the family?

If Palin didn’t have a very specific agenda on morale issues, I agree this would be a non-issue.

bayam on September 1, 2008 at 5:52 PM

CONVENTION UPDATE ..

Of course, war protesters are starting fires, breaking windows, and slashing tires.

.. for peace, that is.

cgoode777 on September 1, 2008 at 5:52 PM

bayam on September 1, 2008 at 5:41 PM

idiot.

unseen on September 1, 2008 at 5:57 PM

if you think that ANY parent can prevent a child from pregnancy, or that parenting has anything to do with it, you’re either not a parent or totally clueless.

I completely disagree. The behavior of children largely reflects the quality of parenting. It’s true that pregnancy and drug abuse can occur regardless of how well a parent prepares a child for the world. However, if you’re saying that parents aren’t responsible, you’re wrong.

bayam on September 1, 2008 at 5:57 PM

Why does obamatheliar keep trying to play the nice guy when we know his people, his web-sites are behind the negative attacks?

From: Bama Will Never Vote Obama
Date: Aug 31, 2008 11:43 PM

Obama Campaign Behind Anti-Palin Smear Site?
Posted by adminat August 30, 2008Suddenly appearing among the Google search results for “sarah palin gay,” a web site titled: Sarah Palin Supports Gay Rights.

Sarah Palin (GOV-Alaska-Republican), supports gay rights, says Anchorage Daily News.

Quote “Gov. Sarah Palin vetoed a bill Thursday that sought to block the state from giving public employee benefits such as health insurance to same-sex couples.” Quote “”It is the Governor’s intention to work with the legislature and to give the people of Alaska an opportunity to express their wishes and intentions whether these benefits should continue,” the statement from Palin’s administration said.

Coghill said he’s interested in a new plan that would allow state employees to designate one person — maybe a same-sex partner, but also possibly a family member or roommate — who would be eligible for state-paid benefits. But the employee would have to pay to add that person to his or her benefits.

Sarah Palin’s veto gave gays the same rights as married couples in Alaska.

A vote for McCain/Palin is a vote for gay marriage.

Interesting. There’s nothing else on the page.
This sure looks like the work of the dastardly right-wing anti-gay attack machine, doesn’t it?

But look who’s really behind this.

In the Linux console, if you enter the following commands, you can learn the secrets of a political dirty trick.
First, look up the host of ‘sarahpalingayrights. com’ to get the site’s IP address.

host sarahpalingayrights. com sarahpalingayrights. com has address 74. 208. 74. 232

Then use the same command to look up the domain name pointer of that IP address.

host 74. 208. 74. 232 232. 74. 208. 74. in-addr. arpa domain name pointer obamadefense. com

Well, well.
“Obamadefense. com,” eh?

And what happens if you enter obamadefense. com on your browser’s address line?

Why, you’re redirected to none other than FightTheSmears. com, the official Barack Obama site that’s supposed to be defending him against smears.

Looks like they may have a second purpose: to generate a few smears of their own.

(Hat tip: sk.
)

UPDATE at 8/30/08 11:14:12 am:

Here’s another site that traces back to obamadefense. com: ObamaTaxCut. com.

UPDATE at 8/30/08 11:24:46 am:

Two more web sites that share the IP address of obamadefense. com:

John McCain opposes the new GI Bill, but why? John McCain Prefers War

http://www. audacityofhypocrisy. com/2008/08/30/obama-campaign-behind-anti-palin-smear-site/

christene on September 1, 2008 at 5:57 PM

bayam on September 1, 2008 at 5:41 PM

White trash?!?

You are truly disgusting!

People like you need a good… banning!

newton on September 1, 2008 at 5:58 PM

unseen on September 1, 2008 at 5:57 PM

Your inability to articulate any kind of point speaks volumes.

bayam on September 1, 2008 at 5:58 PM

Bayam:

Sorry but I don’t think much of parents who raise a young girl that becomes pregnant in high school.

What are they supposed to do, place her under armed guard? Forbid her to ever go on a date? Lock her in a chastity belt? The best they can do is teach her their moral values; the rest is up to her.

Here’s a nickel: use it to buy a ticket to the real world.

irishspy on September 1, 2008 at 5:59 PM

completely disagree. The behavior of children largely reflects the quality of parenting. It’s true that pregnancy and drug abuse can occur regardless of how well a parent prepares a child for the world. However, if you’re saying that parents aren’t responsible, you’re wrong.

bayam on September 1, 2008 at 5:57 PM

that is pure bullcrap. A 17 year old makes their own decsions. 17 year olds are not children. You would be the type I would assume that would kick your daughter out of the house should she ever have “sex”

unseen on September 1, 2008 at 5:59 PM

Why is Cindy McCain dressed like a superhero?

… dripping in jewelry …

That was weird.

cgoode777 on September 1, 2008 at 6:01 PM

Your inability to articulate any kind of point speaks volumes.

bayam on September 1, 2008 at 5:58 PM

It is diffucult and foolhardy to debate with an idiot. You can not change the arguement of an idiot so I have found the best way to handle an idiot is to call a spade a spade and move on.

unseen on September 1, 2008 at 6:01 PM

completely disagree. The behavior of children largely reflects the quality of parenting. It’s true that pregnancy and drug abuse can occur regardless of how well a parent prepares a child for the world. However, if you’re saying that parents aren’t responsible, you’re wrong.

bayam on September 1, 2008 at 5:57 PM

Go ahead. Try tell that to Cap’n Ed’s face. I double dare ya!

You are truly disgusting and worthy of all our contempt.

newton on September 1, 2008 at 6:01 PM

christene on September 1, 2008 at 5:57 PM

You waaaay overestimate my ability to read with patience.

Waaaaay waywayway.

cgoode777 on September 1, 2008 at 6:02 PM

Infidoll on September 1, 2008 at 5:18 PM

and

bayam on September 1, 2008 at 5:57 PM

1955 is over, buy yourselves a clue. We don’t make people wear scarlet letters anymore. They appear to have been engaged and it’s not exactly a crime.

Shay on September 1, 2008 at 6:04 PM

the behavior of a child reflects on a parent when the child is small and is not old enough to make their own decsions. Once they reach the age that they can make their own choice it is no longer a reflection on the parent but that of the new adult. 16 is the age of consent in Alsaks. The people of Alaska thing 16 year old women are smart enough and old enough to make their own decsions regarding sex. Therefore it no longer is about thye parent. !8 year olds can vote, can figth for our country, can drive can live on their own yet they are too YOung to have a baby? People that believe crap like that need to get a clue.

unseen on September 1, 2008 at 6:06 PM

They appear to have been engaged and it’s not exactly a crime.

Shay on September 1, 2008 at 6:04 PM

They are engaged. She is seen wearing an engagement ring on Friday’s announcement.

She and the “baby daddy” are doing the right thing. Which is what really counts here.

Unlike bayam and his “white trash” comments.

newton on September 1, 2008 at 6:07 PM

that is pure bullcrap. A 17 year old makes their own decsions. 17 year olds are not children

I disagree. The reason that teenage pregnancy is much higher in the slums is because of irresponsible parenting. It’s that simple- there’s nothing in the water. As a mentor to a disadvantaged child, I have seen this first hand.

Can a parent ensure that a child doesn’t become pregnant or start abusing drugs? No, but it’s the responsibility of parents to ensure that children are prepared to make the right decisions.

bayam on September 1, 2008 at 6:10 PM

Unlike bayam and his “white trash” comments.

newton on September 1, 2008 at 6:07 PM

I think we need an Andrew Jackson again in the white house. White Trash my butt. It was white trash that built this country…

unseen on September 1, 2008 at 6:14 PM

Unlike bayam and his “white trash” comments.

Keep in mind that I never supported massive tax cuts for the rich- like the ones that Bush enacted for his special class of wealthy Americans. With the housing marking in shambles, it’s now clear that giving the rich a free ride didn’t actually create a “miracle” economy. It’s only indebted our children and given the next President an incredible problem to overcome.

bayam on September 1, 2008 at 6:14 PM

bayam on September 1, 2008 at 6:10 PM

Absolute bullsh*t. Preganancy is not higher in the slums, although childbirth may be. As much as Planned Parenthood likes to target minorities, it’s the uptown girls having the abortions.

Are you really equating pregnancy with drugs?? Are you a Democrat??

Shay on September 1, 2008 at 6:16 PM

bayam on September 1, 2008 at 6:10 PM

So you don’t think a 17 or 18 year old should be allowed to sign up for the army? They aren’t smart or mature enough to make that kind of life decsion. maybe you want to take away the right to vote for 18 year old adults also because you know they are just kids. 1 21 year old is not a child nor is an 18 year old. They are adults and the sooner we start to once again think of them as adults the quicker we can stopp this rising immaturity level in America.

unseen on September 1, 2008 at 6:17 PM

bayam on September 1, 2008 at 5:57 PM

You have no children obviously.
One of my school mates had the best parents in the world. Brilliant, educated, engaged, rational and even tempered.
When he was with them he was like a part of a well oiled machine. He was going to Harvard. He had earned their trust so many times it wasn’t even a question anymore.
He wanted more money than his allowance provided so he broke into a vacationing neighbors house, stole a pistol and a coin collection then murdered two people while robbing a store in the middle of the night.

Tony Soprano on September 1, 2008 at 6:17 PM

I can just hear Lindsay Graham now: “I told you to pick Lieberman. He wouldn’t have this problem – his daughters are past menopause.”

Can.Utility on September 1, 2008 at 6:22 PM

My three all time hero presidents are Reagan, Andrew Jackson, and teddy Rossevelt. They are the three that stand out in the history books for doing good. With McCain/Paklin we get the quailites of all three. Palin reminds me of Andrew Jackson the most. McCain reminds me of Teddy. And they both remind me of Reagan .

Enough said.

unseen on September 1, 2008 at 6:24 PM

cgoode777–LOL,..sorry-Here ya go ;
http://www.audacityofhypocrisy.com/2008/08/30/obama-campaign-behind-anti-palin-smear-site/

When ever you want to read it..: o )

christene on September 1, 2008 at 6:24 PM

He wanted more money than his allowance provided so he broke into a vacationing neighbors house, stole a pistol and a coin collection then murdered two people…
Tony Soprano on September 1, 2008 at 6:17 PM

I agree with you that even the best parents in the world can’t ensure that a grown child will make the right decisions. But to say that parents aren’t largely responsible for how their kids turn out is just as wrong. It’s important that parents reinforce their children’s understanding of the dangers of drug use, unprotected sex, and other types of behaviors. Good values start in the family.

And I’m not equating teenage pregnancy to drug use. My point is that neither outcome is one that I want to see for my child.

Preganancy is not higher in the slums

Are you serious? That’s only true if you ignore every study on teenage pregnancy that’s occurred over the past 20 years.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Teenage_pregnancy

bayam on September 1, 2008 at 6:32 PM

unseen on September 1, 2008 at 6:01 PM

true, and it’s the only way to deal with liberal & trolls

Janos Hunyadi on September 1, 2008 at 6:34 PM

I don’t have the patience to do the research, but I would be surprised to find a major male politician to whom this standard was applied. If someone can point us to such an example, that would be illuminating.

You make very interesting and good points.

bayam on September 1, 2008 at 6:34 PM

Heather MacDonald had an insightful column on Palin the other day, pointing out how the Right’s embrace of identity politics is an unwise tactic that, altho it may win the battle, will certainly lose the war.

http://www.city-journal.org/2008/eon0830hm.html

The Right’s response to “Bristolgate” stikes me as more of the same. To the extent such culture war issues matter, and conservatives have long insisted that they do, it’s a mistake to argue (as many here have) that teen pregnancy is no big deal and, in any case, not a reflection on the Palins.

Perhaps Palin’s pregnant teenage daughter will be no big deal to voters or, as Bayam suggests, a big plus with a certain demographic. Am I the only person here thinking this is getting a little surreal?

Infidoll on September 1, 2008 at 6:37 PM

Allahpundit,

This shouldn’t hurt Palin much at all. However, if the media finds two or three more situations then it will be perceived as a trend. Coupled with Palin low experience level she will be viewed as an unacceptable risk for Vice President and her support will drop off dramatically. End Game.

BDU-33 on September 1, 2008 at 6:39 PM

bayam on September 1, 2008 at 6:34 PM

So since Michelle is a full time worker and her husband his a full time politician who is raising there children? Don’t those two young girls need a full time stay at home mother. Who watches them when Michelle is working at her 300k/year job?

the liberals are nuts if they want to go down this trail.

Palin’s 18 year old son joined the army. Did this “child” make a bad decsion because he was not old enough. Why is it ok to risk your life for your country at 18 and that is a smart mature choice but it is immature to have a child at 18? This entire conversation is a LOL moment has the liberals run into a wall of their own mental madness.

unseen on September 1, 2008 at 6:40 PM

This discussion is supposed to be about how this morning’s revelation will effect the upcoming election, not about ex’s religious preoccupations, your personal demons, or my status as a parent. We can debate the culture war component, but I don’t see how that’s a winner for you. Are you sure you wouldn’t be more comfortable on Kos?

My demons? What are you talking about?

Anywho….

I would like to remind you that it was YOU who brought Mrs. Palin’s parenting skills to the debate. I only called you to back up your arrogant ignorance with some semblance of coherent thought to which you responded by faking reality to a whole nother level by making up my argument from thin air to try to fit your response. I cant even credit you with twisting my words around because I said nothing remotely close to resembling what you came up with. Amazing feat of mental gymnastics that was….. Bravo Sir!

As to the actually meat of the debate we kinda had…

I proved you to be the clueless Holier Then Thou blowhard I thought you were. With your subsequent posts continuing to make my point. A job well done.

My regards to your ego.

Mikkins

P.S. I think you and they Daily Kos would be a much better fit my friend. Delusion and sanctimony are what they do best. A perfect fit I say.

mikkins on September 1, 2008 at 6:43 PM

I see no reason for this to be a problem at all. Why should we care and what can the left do with it?

So now there is absolute proof that the left made fools of themselves (has it ever been any other way) by saying Sarah’s baby was actually Sarah’s daughters baby!!

allrsn on September 1, 2008 at 6:44 PM

So since Michelle is a full time worker and her husband his a full time politician who is raising there children? Don’t those two young girls need a full time stay at home mother

Are any of them engaging in behavior that’s likely to result in teenage pregnancy? I don’t know how to answer your question.

bayam on September 1, 2008 at 7:10 PM

Thanks for the link christine.

Whadda’ gal.

Interesting story too by the way.

cgoode777 on September 1, 2008 at 7:15 PM

Maybe this is the GOP’s own Murphy Brown moment? Time to throw this back in their laps…

Wyznowski on September 1, 2008 at 7:25 PM

This has gone far enough.

Allah why do you keep posting this crap?

Sarah had a beautiful baby boy. I have actually touched Sarah’s tummy when she was very much pregnant. So crap like this blows me away.

Also what in the hell does Sarah’s eldest daughter have anything to do with this? Girls and Women get pregnant all the time. It doesn’t matter if they are rich or poor or inbetween!

I, myself, was a teenager and pregnant. I decided not to go the route of an abortion and decided that I would be the better person and give my child up for adoption, due to many items goingon in my life. I know I did the right thing. Sarah’s daughter had to make the same decisions and I thnk she choice with the understanding of how hard it would be as well as the fect on what would be expected. Being a teenager and pregnant is probably one of the hardest things in the world. But airing this has made me wonder if you are all about ratings?

Give me a break. Leave the the Palin Family out of this.

upinak on September 1, 2008 at 7:28 PM

bayam on September 1, 2008 at 5:41 PM

Spoken like someone without children. If you have children, watch what you say because you may have to eat those words one day. Children making mistakes isn’t limited to a particular “class” of people as can be seen daily. I have three adult children who have never gotten into “trouble” but trust me, I don’t credit that with our fantastic parenting and I thank God daily.

Cindy Munford on September 1, 2008 at 7:34 PM

bayam on September 1, 2008 at 7:10 PM

Senator Obama’s girls are not yet teenagers. Get a clue.

Cindy Munford on September 1, 2008 at 7:35 PM

Unfortunately, all families have problems. Whether it’s premature sexual activity, addiction, abuse, or crime, we all know and love people with issues. When you are a public figure, your family’s problems get broadcast to everyone. Period, move on.

ashleymatt on September 1, 2008 at 7:36 PM

Bayman, if you think that ANY parent can prevent a child from pregnancy, or that parenting has anything to do with it, you’re either not a parent or totally clueless.
orlandocajun on September 1, 2008 at 5:49 PM

Which childhood behaviors can parents affect, and which ones are outside of their realm of influence?

Send_Me on September 1, 2008 at 7:39 PM

That’s quite enough Banyam.. or whoever you are.

You insult everyone that ever had anyone that did this in their family tree.

I am just guessing we don’t have to go that far back into yours to find such a thing.

I guess that would make you one of the trailer trash you accuse others of being.

For the record, we only have to go back as far as my grandparents for living together before marriage, and my great-grandparents for having to get married due to an unwed pregnancy, and I would maintain their class against your self-righteous, judgmental, priggish, liberal self any day.

Noelie on September 1, 2008 at 7:42 PM

WHAT IN THE FIRE TRUCK IS WITH THE NEW PEOPLE COMPARING THE PEOPLE WHO DISAGREE WITH THEM TO DAILY KOS. OR REQUESTING THAT OTHER PEOPLE BE BANNED. BIG ON THE FIRST AMENDMENT HERE AT HOT AIR!!!!

Cindy Munford on September 1, 2008 at 7:43 PM

upinak on September 1, 2008 at 7:28 PM

This is in the news and we are discussing this in a supportive way. After this, I doubt that we’ll make an issue of it here, (unlike at places like the daily kos and huffington post that will try to make this their issue to attack Palin’s family because she is McCain’s VP nominee.) Unless there is a report on some democrat/liberal/moonbat that brings it up. And then we’ll talk about their actions. Skimming this just a bit, we are all supportive, and the only exception is the liberal trolls who have responded predictably.

wise_man on September 1, 2008 at 7:44 PM

wise_man on September 1, 2008 at 7:44 PM

wise, let me put it this way.

Alaskans are getting ticked off. Including the “O” crowd who LOVE Sarah as much as the Conservatives up here.

Makes you really wake up when you see a BHO person throw the sign down at the State Fair and say “Screw it, I am voting for Mccain. Sarah is a better person.” And yes I saw that yesterday. Wish I would have had my camera… priceless!

upinak on September 1, 2008 at 7:52 PM

If teenage girls across the country see this type of behavior in a White House family, what messages does that send?

bayam on September 1, 2008 at 5:41 PM

How about the message that you don’t have to choose the death of an innocent baby just because you may have made a mistake.

This doesn’t bother me in the least other than for the fact that I am sure Sarah and her daughter would have much preferred the “marriage first then a baby route”. I know that when they have that little bundle of joy in their arms come this New Year all of this horrible crap will be but a bad memory.

mrsmwp on September 1, 2008 at 7:53 PM

This shouldn’t be part of our politics. It has no relevance to Gov. Palin’s performance as a governor or her potential performance as a vice president.

I don’t want to imply that he doesn’t sincerely mean it, because I am sure he probably does at heart, but knowing that this woman is suddenly loved by millions probably helped Obama pick the right response, no?

Just like how in international relations, being militarily strong and a courageous defender of your principles and allies helps your enemies make the wise choice to stay peaceful.

drunyan8315 on September 1, 2008 at 7:54 PM

upinak on September 1, 2008 at 7:52 PM

That would be something to see. Here’s hoping that this isn’t the last story like that we hear of. Would be so wonderful to see.

wise_man on September 1, 2008 at 7:56 PM

I decided not to go the route of an abortion and decided that I would be the better person and give my child up for adoption

upinak on September 1, 2008 at 7:28 PM

Upinak, I admire you so much for that choice. I am so sorry that you ever had to go through something like that. You are a very fine person.

Also, I AM SO JEALOUS OF YOU!

I wish I knew Governor Palin! I have admired her since I first heard about her back about a year ago. We are about the same age but she makes me look like such a slacker.

mrsmwp on September 1, 2008 at 7:57 PM

Its amazing that the left is focused on Palin and her family in such a way.

To me this is a victory for Sarah Palin because I do not believe she will avoid the heat and it will show her strength.

Sonosam on September 1, 2008 at 8:11 PM

what I have heard is that Palin has preached to others about this same thing…and she is a hypocrite. is this just the left fighting past ghosts in their own minds or is it true?

tomas on September 1, 2008 at 8:15 PM

So what if she’s pregnant. At least she’ll carry the baby to term and let it live.

If it was Obama’s daughter, maybe they would have killed it secretly at a hospital so nobody would know.

tx2654 on September 1, 2008 at 8:19 PM

She shouldn’t have talked about this today…that is no better than Biden.

tomas on September 1, 2008 at 8:24 PM

tx2654 on September 1, 2008 at 8:19 PM

I totally agree with you. We should make this a support Bristol Palin thread. Honey, we’re very proud of you for choosing life and taking responsibility for your mistake. :) What a great role model you are for other teens in similar situations!!

Illinidiva on September 1, 2008 at 8:26 PM

Bristol Palin isn’t killing life because it is inconvenient. That’s all that really needs to be said.

highhopes on September 1, 2008 at 8:29 PM

Its not uncommon for a teen to become pregnant, the fact the she has chosen to keep the baby shows the conviction that these parents have instilled in their kids.

Ok, this story is so yesterday. Move on to a real issue.

jbh45 on September 1, 2008 at 8:43 PM

Skimming this just a bit, we are all supportive, and the only exception is the liberal trolls who have responded predictably.

wise_man on September 1, 2008 at 7:44 PM

I like serious discussion, even with people with whom I disagree, and then I also have a wacky sense of humor that some might not like. But, I am having difficulty today because there seems to be a much higher percentage of trolling here than normal.

Loxodonta on September 1, 2008 at 8:49 PM

Despite all the happy talk, I still think this is a huge negative for McCain, and may be a game ender, rather than a game changer. And I still think it would be best if Palin were to withdraw from the ticket, citing personal reasons (which anyone would understand).

If it remains McCain-Palin, I can’t see any realistic path to victory. We’re screwed.

sauropod on September 1, 2008 at 8:55 PM

Believe it or not,its the family Palin’s own business,
and the baby will be born!

The triumph of life will prevail,and I’m pretty sure,if
the tables were turned,and we were talking about a Liberal,
we wouldn’t hear a peep about a pregnancy!

If it were a Liberal,there would be an abortion,so as not
to ruin their chances at winning an election!

And there in lies the difference in Party beliefs,the Palins
will celebrate LIFE,while the DEMOCRATS will condemn it as
per usual!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

canopfor on September 1, 2008 at 8:59 PM

bayam on September 1, 2008 at 6:32 PM

Bayam…you have at least one reader on this board in support of your contentions here.

Once again, I find the hypocrisy on this site absolutely amazing. Had this been the Democrats, and the nominee was Mary Landrieu, or someone like that, and her high school daughter got pregnant, the vast majority on this board would not be giving this story the “free pass” that they’re giving it now.

Likewise with Dobson, who should be ashamed of his stance here.

I 100% agree that the Left should not be using this to make points in the Presidential Election. That being said, people on the right seem to be celebrating this pregnancy. Were y’all celebrating when Jamie Lynn Spears got pregnant?

asc85 on September 1, 2008 at 9:05 PM

Are any of them engaging in behavior that’s likely to result in teenage pregnancy? I don’t know how to answer your question.

bayam on September 1, 2008 at 7:10 PM

give it about 10-12 years and they will be.

unseen on September 1, 2008 at 9:21 PM

I completely disagree. The behavior of children largely reflects the quality of parenting. It’s true that pregnancy and drug abuse can occur regardless of how well a parent prepares a child for the world. However, if you’re saying that parents aren’t responsible, you’re wrong.

bayam on September 1, 2008 at 5:57 PM

Wow. Judgmental much?

Someone in my family has three children. Raised all of them exactly the same. The first two turned out great. The third started smoking at 12, using drugs at 13, having sex at 14, and ended up addicted to meth and in rehab at 17. He lied to his parents, to me, to his doctors, even to his lawyer.

Len Bias had the greatest mom in the world, was an All-American, and the third pick in the NBA draft with a brilliant career ahead of him. The next night a scumbag friend talked him into doing some coke, and he died.

It is absurd and just plain wrong to blame any parent completely for the poor decisions of a child, especially a young adult child.

rockmom on September 1, 2008 at 9:39 PM

The thing is there is probably something on everyone that could and would come out when they were picked for this job.

Terrye on September 1, 2008 at 4:35 PM

Terrye, couldn’t agree more. If McCain had picked Huckleberry right about now we’d be watching the MSM frothing at the mouth over his son’s incident with that dog
AND pointing out that many serial killers get their start that way.

IMO the Palin’s are a family to be admired. They knew she was carrying a Downs baby and celebrated his birth. I think they will come thru this just fine. Personally, when Gov. Palin gives her speech at the convention I hope she takes a hint from those Alaskan grizzly bears and shows that she will protect one of her cubs!!

I don’t think this will hurt McCain/Palin. I think there will be thousands of families across the country who have dealt with this same situation who will empathize and other families who didn’t have to deal with it and are breathing a sigh of relief that they didn’t have to deal with it.

poodlemom on September 1, 2008 at 9:43 PM

Wow, the Moby patent must have expired.

Hey, traffic’s traffic, right?

Merovign on September 1, 2008 at 9:51 PM

Check these crazies…

http://mudflats.wordpress.com/2008/08/30/off-to-the-land-of-palin/

I was reading this one last night – wasn’t sure what to make of it.

I finally posted something toward the end.

They really should keep this stuff up.

Their idiocy is nearly breathtaking.

Queen0fCups on September 1, 2008 at 9:57 PM

Despite all the happy talk, I still think this is a huge negative for McCain, and may be a game ender, rather than a game changer. And I still think it would be best if Palin were to withdraw from the ticket, citing personal reasons (which anyone would understand).

I think you should tune in to the convention on Wednesday night for she speech and see for yourself how much of a game changer or ender it will be.

My guess it is the end of Obama.

Queen0fCups on September 1, 2008 at 10:01 PM

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