I think that the judiciary is the most trustworthy part of the government in Pakistan?

coldwarrior on August 18, 2008 at 12:07 PM

The operative part of that sentence is ‘IN PAKISTAN’. That opinion is mostly based on my opinion of the entire governmental apparatus that our ‘friendship’ with Pakistan is based around.

It is my opinion that every aspect of Pakistan is completely corrupt. It’s sort of like the thinnest person in a fat camp. . . they are still fat. It’s up to the highest bidder. Whoever pays the most has the power.

It is for this reason that I have felt that from the beginning of this ‘war on terror’, we needed to go into Pakistan and clean house like we did in Afghanistan and Iraq and set up a government that was accountable.

I appreciate your information. Basically my statement is based on a feeling. That feeling that there has to be some entity that can maintain control over the country. I never liked Bhutto or her husband. Many posters here and our government thought that they were going to help Pakistan. I didn’t. I would also believe that they were influenced heavily and forcefully by Bhutto and Sharif (speculation).

But you are correct that it is mostly a feeling. Not that I trust any of them. . . but of the ones that are there now, I’d trust judiciary more than any without guns.

What a guy.

I'm tempted to call this a positive development, but the truth is that there is a great deal of uncertainty about what will happen next: Pakistani President Pervez Musharraf announced Monday that he will resign, just days ahead of impeachment in p…

Ignoring demands from the Bush or any other US President will be very easy for the new Pakistani government. There’s limited internal will to help the US outside of the upper levels of the professional military.

Are you serious? Based on what? A feeling?

The cronyism of the judiciary in Pakistan is legendary as is the corruption. One case in point. There are hundreds of others, going down all the way to the local district level.

This cronyism and corruption along with Nawiz Sharif’s close ties to the Taliban, the same Nawiz Sharif who the Chief Justice of the Court tried to have removed for corruption and interference with the Constitution, and previously with Bhutto and her husband’s using the Pakistani Treasury as their personal ATM, with a sympathetic court, is what compelled Musharaf to act in 1999 when he took power,before Bhutto could unseat Sharif and open a new ATM account. All of this is documented. All of it.

Under the 1981 interim constitution, the one Pakistan operates under today (the Constitution those who forced Musharaf from office rely on) stipulated that an oath to the President be imposed on all supreme court, high court, and Shari’ah court judges, and all laws promulgated by a martial law regime were exempted from judicial review.

Further, as just about any Pakistani can tell you…the Pakistani judicial system is full of corruption and based on nepotism. And, Pakistan, operating under its Constitution, was in a state of martial law for many periods of Musharaf’s rule. Martial law imposed when the lawyers rioted, or when Islamists and Taliban supporters blew up market places and buses, and trains full of innocents all over Pakistan. Martial law imposed when the open political process was not up to the task of managing Pakistan’s best interests…but certainly managed the personal interests of dozens and dozens of Pakistani judicial and legislative felons.

It’s their Constitution. If they don’t like it. Let them write another. But neither Nawaz Sharif nor Bhutto chose to do so. Had ample time, Certainly had the graft and grease to make it happen.

The only trustworthy part of the Pakistani government is the professional officer corps of the armed forces. Where they go so goes Pakistan.

Which is why I asked a prior poster if anyone had heard from Ashfaq Pervez Kiyani.

The Pakistani’s got their wish…one should be very careful what one wishes for.

Don’t all our supply lines to the troops in Afghanistan run through Pakistan? The only other way in is through those various -stans to the north, which are quite close to Russia. Military guys care to weigh in on this?

I actually trust the (old) judiciary to do the right thing. How much power they have will depend on the government.

But to say Musharraf took a ‘risky stance’ by allying with the US after 9/11 is ridiculous. That was the ‘for us or against us’ day. If they decided to side with the Taliban, we’d have fought them through India (which we should have anyway). His decision spared him the wrath of the full force of the entire US arsenal. Not so much of a ‘risky stance’ when you also realize that we gave him 10 billion dollars.

But you make the call. On the one hand, complete destruction and obliteration of your military and the end to your rule (possibly at the end of a rope). On the other hand, money, expertise, and military might on your side.

Hardly a risky choice. All he had to do was shoot off some fireworks whenever a dignitary came into town and collect a check from the US. He’d pick from his least favorite Taliban to arrest from time to time to ‘prove’ he’s tough on terror and America would continue to give him a pass and money. For Musharraf, it was all about the power and the money. . . he never took a ‘risky’ stance on anything except sacking the judiciary that would have ended his rule.

Bad news.Prepare for a prolonged period of political infighting, until the next military takeover of course.
Gaurav on August 18, 2008 at 10:10 AM

Exactly. It seems that in Pakistan, we have shades of bad and worse. Musharraf rose to power from a coup. The people who tried to kill him repeatedly were islamic terrorists. While people like LimeyGeek are happy that he’s gone, I worry who is going to take his place.

Ain’t that the truth. Ain’t that the scary Kattie-bar-the-door truth.

On a more serious note…anything heard from Ashfaq Pervez Kiyani since the Musharaf resignation came out?

coldwarrior on August 18, 2008 at 10:48 AM

Oh, I recognized the satire, and a fine job of it you did. Sounds like things will be just as hunky-dory over there as things will over here just as soon as we put liberals in charge of all three branches of government. :)

In the context of my satire:

“…Pakistani’s got their wish. All things righted. Stability will break out all across Pakistan like a million flowers blooming.

“The now-unified government of Pakistan will be able to aptly deal with their internal terrorist threat. They will be able to satisfy the political demands of the electorate. They will be able to come to peaceful settlements with India, with Afghanistan, with Taliban remnants on their soil, with irredentism all across Pakistan, come to peaceful arrangements with al-Qaeda.”

It makes perfect sense.

peaceful arrangements with al-Qaeda

Isn’t that a contradiction in terms?

Without Musharraf to keep ‘em down, the jihadis are liable to run wild in Islamabad. The next regime in Pakistan will make Mahmoud Ahmadinejad looks like a harmless schoolboy.

Afghanistan on steroids, with nukes.
…

Pakistan is now ripe for a fundamentalist Islamic takeover.

Awww…like that’s a bad thing? Where’s your sense of sportsmanship?

;-)

His major error was that he seized power. From that point onward, his other options were limited. He certainly was no Ayub Khan. Thank God for that. He was no Bhutto, either, thank God for that, too.

So, the Pakistani’s got their wish. All things righted. Stability will break out all across Pakistan like a million flowers blooming.

The now-unified government of Pakistan will be able to aptly deal with their internal terrorist threat. They will be able to satisfy the political demands of the electorate. They will be able to come to peaceful settlements with India, with Afghanistan, with Taliban remnants on their soil, with irredentism all across Pakistan, come to peaceful arrangements with al-Qaeda.

I sincerely hope that Pakistan survives.

I sincerely doubt they will without wholesale bloodshed, or yet another coup.

We’ve lost one of our only allies in the region, just as Russia once more starts to throw its weight around… and we did it to ourselves with our blind faith in Democracy.

Expect to see more appeasement with Al Q, and infighting in the government. Pakistan is now ripe for a fundamentalist Islamic takeover.