Lefty heart-ache: McCain might have lifted three sentences from Wikipedia for speech
posted at 10:03 pm on August 11, 2008 by Allahpundit
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Three background sentences, that is, one of which closely tracks Wikipedia’s entry on Georgia, two more of which contain some phrases in common, plus a third passage that’s being offered as evidence of plagiarism and … just isn’t.
On a day when Russia’s threatening to absorb one of its satellite states, this is actually the top story on Memeorandum. Yes, really.
In 2003, Shevardnadze (who won reelection in 2000) was deposed by the Rose Revolution, after Georgian opposition and international monitors asserted that the 2 November parliamentary elections were marred by fraud. The revolution was led by Mikheil Saakashvili, Zurab Zhvania and Nino Burjanadze, former members and leaders of Shavarnadze’s ruling party. Mikheil Saakashvili was elected as President of Georgia in 2004. Following the Rose Revolution, a series of reforms was launched to strengthen the country’s military and economic capabilities. (Wikipedia)
vs.
Following fraudulent parliamentary elections in 2003, a peaceful, democratic revolution took place, led by the U.S.-educated lawyer Mikheil Saakashvili. The Rose Revolution changed things dramatically and, following his election, President Saakashvili embarked on a series of wide-ranging and successful reforms.(McCain)
As Bill Beutler notes, McCain’s version actually adds the detail about Saakashvili having been educated in America; beyond that, the “plagiarism” appears to hang on the uncanny, one-in-a-million similarity of the phrase “series of … reforms.” I was going to offer a little glass-half-full spin on behalf of Team Maverick but one of TPM’s commenters already made my point and I wouldn’t want to “plagiarize.” Your exit question, then: Never mind lifting text. Is McCain’s camp actually getting its facts from Wikipedia?
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He should’ve used Conservapedia.
jgapinoy on August 11, 2008 at 10:07 PM
Oops–they don’t have a Republic of Georgia entry.
jgapinoy on August 11, 2008 at 10:09 PM
What exactly does the phrase ‘Google It!’ mean then.
AUINSC on August 11, 2008 at 10:09 PM
Hmm, is it possible that the McCain got the info from a source that Wikipedia borrowed from? I.e., both Wikipedia and McCain used the same original source? A NY Times piece? CIA factbook?
Seems unlikely; but possible.
SteveMG on August 11, 2008 at 10:10 PM
Well whereever he is getting his facts he seems to be the only one that understands the problems and has a quasi peaceful way to solve the problem. The quasi comes from what Russia will do once the peacekeeping force is depolyed. McCain will not start war but would put our soldiers in harms way. which is the only option we have to possible aviod a decade of gathering tensions leading to the final conculsion of world war 3 with the West fighting China and Russia for world resources and domination.
unseen on August 11, 2008 at 10:11 PM
They missed this one:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Homo_georgicus
Georgia is home to the oldest fossils of human ancestors ever found outside of Africa.
Mark1971 on August 11, 2008 at 10:11 PM
Where did Wikipedia get them?
bnelson44 on August 11, 2008 at 10:11 PM
Good grief.
Purple Fury on August 11, 2008 at 10:12 PM
Precisely.
Connie on August 11, 2008 at 10:14 PM
How many ways can one state the given facts? How many resources state those same facts in a similar fashion? I don’t know where they got them from, but I don’t think stating similar facts constitutes plagiarism.
Perhaps the Wikipedia editor needs a vacation - he’s seeing Wiki words everywhere!
rsb1 on August 11, 2008 at 10:19 PM
Stalin was from Georgia.
McCain referenced Georgia.
So…
McCain = Stalin
It’s quite easy when you do things the way liberals do.
Bishop on August 11, 2008 at 10:22 PM
Most of it is a standard “gist of it” type of response you would expect from any newspaper or book doing a quick summary of a subject. I think people are nitpicking here.
DanStark on August 11, 2008 at 10:25 PM
Jindal: We need people who can look stuff up in wikipedia in the White House (except that stuff on evo-loo-shun).
alphie on August 11, 2008 at 10:29 PM
There have been countless studies that prove Wiki actually has fact based information, more so than encyclopedias due to participation of people with broad knowledge of a particular entry and the constant updates, as well as the monitoring of the people behind Wiki.
When I worked in a newspaper a few years ago, some of the journalists went to Wiki for info on their assignments. Of course, they would go to other sources. The problem is that they would subjectively include data while disregarding other information for their own agenda.
Maybe the information that McCain received on Georgia is probably from a different source copied onto Wiki.
jencab on August 11, 2008 at 10:30 PM
little people with little minds.
Terrye on August 11, 2008 at 10:33 PM
Lets play by the same rules as the Left,
just like Obama has done over and over!
-it was probably one of McCains staffers!
canopfor on August 11, 2008 at 10:34 PM
I said this on the other thread, but just two days ago the complaint from the left (including Obama and the Kremlin) was that McCain was too close to Georgia because he was being advised by a paid (former)lobbyist for Georgia.
Now the knock seems to be that McCain knows so little he needed to lift information from Wikipedia.
Doesn’t this seem kind of silly?
MayBee on August 11, 2008 at 10:34 PM
*Yawn*
wake me up when it word for word..
DaveC on August 11, 2008 at 10:35 PM
The end of the world is near…unless Obama wins.
Entelechy on August 11, 2008 at 10:36 PM
.. it’s word for word..
I have to slow down.. been skipping words when I type lately..
DaveC on August 11, 2008 at 10:36 PM
Obama steels whole speeches and slogans from Deval Patrick. I know. I’ve been listening to this crap non-stop for like the last 3 years.
TheBigOldDog on August 11, 2008 at 10:37 PM
As noted above, the McCain lines in question could have come from the same source that used Wikipedia or could have come from a source that Wikipedia used.
Occam’s razor: it came from Wikipedia.
SteveMG on August 11, 2008 at 10:39 PM
isnt jimmy carter from georgia?
yep, thought so
carbon_footprint on August 11, 2008 at 10:41 PM
I can just see The Obamuhhs rolling their eyes at Russia interrupting their vacation like this! I also wonder if Michelle was proud for a moment knowing that Atlanta was under siege by Communists until she found out otherwise.
SouthernGent on August 11, 2008 at 10:45 PM
The first two instances cited sure look like I-borrowed-my-roommate’s-essay 101.
Dave Rywall on August 11, 2008 at 11:00 PM
Lettuce hope not, they could make all kinds of silly mistakes.
Maxx on August 11, 2008 at 11:01 PM
LOL!!! Seriously, as much plaigerism as is committed by The One, how is this an issue? I’ve heard Obama rip direct lines from Lincoln’s Gettysburg Address, John F Kennedy’s speech about going to the moon, and even the Declaration of Independence with the only notice given being about what a fantastic orator he is. Gag me with a xerox! Even his speeches are frauds and he lends no credit to where he lifted those lines. So McCain may have take a couple of sentences? It’s the first time I know of, and it in no way compares to Obama.
thedecider on August 11, 2008 at 11:01 PM
“one of the world’s first nations to adopt Christianity as an official religion” is a fact.
How do you steal a fact cited in a speech.
How many other ways are you supposed to say “one of the world’s first nations to adopt Christianity as an official religion” ? The CIA factbook says ‘Christianity became the state religion in the 330s’. It also says that it’s location is in Southwestern Asia, bordering the Black Sea, between Turkey and Russia. If you mention this are you supposed to randomize it and say it’s location is in Southwestern Asia, bordering Russia, the Black Sea and Turkey so it wont sound similar to another source.
As others have said, it’s unclear if the wiki entry had been annotated from a previous edition(possibly print) from another source. Seems like the same people who mention Edwards’ “McCain cheated too!” line, and are now going to run with this new meme that McCain plagiarized his speech because someone found similar facts.
wise_man on August 11, 2008 at 11:02 PM
Notice that the first extract from Wikipedia is not directly referring to Georgia; if that’s plagiarized it took a lot of effort. “…the Kingdoms of Colchis and Iberia. The latter, one of the first countries in the world to adopt Christianity as an official religion early in the 4th century, subsequently provided a nucleus around which the unified Kingdom of Georgia was formed early in the 11th century.”
http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Georgia_(country)&oldid=231358332
Every researcher, and probably speech writer, knows that CIA and State have summaries of countries. I don’t know what the CIA summary said a week ago (it’s been updated). But look at the phrasing from the Department of State: “In the early 4th century Georgia adopted Christianity, the second nation in the world to do so officially.”
http://www.state.gov/r/pa/ei/bgn/5253.htm
HotWeaver on August 11, 2008 at 11:02 PM
4th graders get to vote now? Anyone trotting this out as plagiarism most certainly has not gotten passed the 4th grade. And I am giving them the benefit of the doubt as to how many times they’ve repeated grades 1 through 4.
jdkchem on August 11, 2008 at 11:09 PM
McCain getting his facts from wiki?
Seems more like Mister “I strongly condemn the outbreak of violence in Georgia, and urge an immediate end to armed conflict,” is plagiarizing from this man. Can’t we all just get along?
Well, he’s one of Obama’s 4,500 adjunct foreign policy advisers, in any case.
wise_man on August 11, 2008 at 11:18 PM
Slow news day. Too bad they don’t have time to do any investigative reports on all of THE CHOSEN ONE’s legislative and bipartisan accomplishments over the last several years. Oh, excuse me, they did. Took all of about 2 minutes.
GarandFan on August 11, 2008 at 11:20 PM
You know, Democrats talk and all I hear is “wah wah wah, wah wah wah wah wah, wah wah wah.”
Merovign on August 11, 2008 at 11:21 PM
Uh, McCain can’t even send an email, remember? Nice to see he went from computer illiterate to computer plagarist in 6.0 seconds.
Dems like to use the “wall of accusations and see what sticks” play.
Rhinoboy on August 11, 2008 at 11:22 PM
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Allahpundit
Kaptain Amerika on August 11, 2008 at 11:26 PM
Headline should be: “Has McCain Caught the Dreaded Biden Disease”?*
*Usually fatal to presidential aspirations.
Dr. Charles G. Waugh on August 11, 2008 at 11:28 PM
Allah… you anonymous bastard… lol although I might change the entry on wikipedia to infamous instead of famous…
Kaptain Amerika on August 11, 2008 at 11:31 PM
Maybe this is why the left makes up facts all the time. They don’t want to plagiarize the truth. :P
lorien1973 on August 11, 2008 at 11:35 PM
LOL at Obamites whining about sentences lifted from other speeches. Baracks speeches are comprised almost entirely of other famous speeches with some historical innaccuracy and hope and change thrown in for good measure.
“Just words.”
BKennedy on August 12, 2008 at 12:41 AM
Are we all clear on how Wikipedia works? Pardon me if I am in correct in my assertion. But, it does not sound that way.
The Race Card on August 12, 2008 at 12:52 AM
It says a lot about Dems that his name is even considered for Veep. One would think that actual plagiarism would be a career-derailing error.
The Race Card on August 12, 2008 at 12:54 AM
Ahem… Paging Deval Patrick
D2Boston on August 12, 2008 at 1:03 AM
I really appreciate the humor in the insinuation that McCain himself is perusing Wikipedia for speech material, for that speech that he is writing himself.
DaveS on August 12, 2008 at 1:25 AM
How is this plagiarism at all? Those passages are not similar at all. Even if McCain based his speech on the Wikipedia entry, which doesn’t have to be the case (and so what if it is?), it is clearly paraphrased and rewritten in original language. That’s what you’re supposed to do. You can’t reinvent history. Well, the Left enjoys doing that, but you shouldn’t reinvent history.
Seixon on August 12, 2008 at 3:35 AM
Plagiarism is presumably not an issue when organizations issue collective unsigned works since they do not assign credit for originality to particular people. For example, the American Historical Association’s “Statement on Standards of Professional Conduct” (2005) regarding textbooks and reference books states that there is no question about taking credit for someone else’s ideas. Since textbooks and encyclopedias are summaries of other scholars’ work, they are not bound by the same exacting standards of attribution as original research. However, even such a book does not make use of words, phrases, or paragraphs from another text or follow too closely the other text’s arrangement and organization.
JiangxiDad on August 12, 2008 at 6:07 AM
According to the CIA, since 1991, US taxpayers have provided Georgia nearly $2billion in aid. Also mentioned @ the CIA website in the MILLENIUM CHALLENGE CORPORATION that Georgia signed a 5 year assistance package for nearly $3million as of Sept.12, 2005.
So remind us all who the Millenium Challenge Corporation is. The name has an ominous ring to it similar to chosen “front” Newspeak words for progressively global socialists of the “compassionate conservative” genre.
maverick muse on August 12, 2008 at 7:03 AM
Yes, the Soros/Georgia ties exist. Google it.
JiangxiDad on August 12, 2008 at 7:07 AM
What’s with the snarky comment about Wikipedia? I hear this from lots of sources, and I’ll be damned if I know why so many have a negative opinion on this fantastic resource. The information on blogs and politics is sometimes slanted, but name me a resource on those issues that isn’t. On matters of practical knowledge, I think it’s a pretty damn powerful and accurate resource. Common sense lets us all know when to double-check the facts from any source.
connertown on August 12, 2008 at 7:09 AM
HA is primarily a political blog. The Wiki info on politics is always biased and often deceptive. However, I still use it frequently, for basic info. on Georgia, for ex.
JiangxiDad on August 12, 2008 at 7:22 AM
USA SOCIALIST GOVT. CORPORATIONS SPONSORED BY US TAXPAYERS, aka FASCISM WITHOUT ANY BENEFITS BUT WITH ALL THE COSTS AND LOSSES
Compassionate Bullshit US Government Corporations bleed our Constitution dry via diarrhea from the good intention bug.
I knew it.
The US Constitution does not provide for the US Government to be Fascistic, nor to own corporations that bleed taxpayers with ALL THE EXPENSES AND LOSSES AND NONE OF THE FINANCIAL REWARDS.
Look at what Bush is doing with all of his bail-outs of banks and private industry using taxpayer money. And we’re supposed to say “we love you” for the token “refund” that comes NO WHERE NEAR the expenses each of us are fined via “tax”. And don’t forget your Ps&Qs with China, Bush reminds Americans from the Olympics. (Ps, they own us now but are such wonderful hosts, not to worry.)
Backtrack a bit to Iraq, the “alliance” between the US/Georgia. Exactly what treaty benefits will the US be granted by Iraq for all of our aid? Nichts? So besides jabbing Russia in the ribs, Georgia and the US need some clarity in what Georgia has in mind with a US treaty.
If US treaties sind kaputt, referring all things to either NATO or the UN, then make our wimphood known now. Otherwise, exactly where’s the beef?
An effective debate stipulates exactly what is being defended in an onslaught attack. An ineffective debate vaguely references ideals such as “tolerance, patience, and all good intentions”.
Our State Department at least owes all of us taxpayers a damned accounting for our official Millenium Challenge Corporation US taxpayer investment in Georgia. Damned progressives and their financial corruption of our sovereign stability.
maverick muse on August 12, 2008 at 7:29 AM
Citation Needed
BohicaTwentyTwo on August 12, 2008 at 8:06 AM
OK. Let’s try the following:
Find 10 people with extensive knowledge of Georgia.
Put them is separate rooms with no internet or computer access.
Give the paper and a pencil.
Ask them to write a summary of recent Georgian history.
I bet after a careful analysis of what they write, we find they all managed to somehow “plagiarize” Wikidpedia.
taznar on August 12, 2008 at 8:36 AM
I would suggest that team Maverick buy a set of good electronic encyclopedias. Wikkipedia is mostly useless.
However, have they accidentally exposed the truth, do we now know where team McMaverick gets their global warming ‘facts’?
tarpon on August 12, 2008 at 8:46 AM
The Millennium Challenge program was a Bush Administration initiative that was championed by conservatives like Spencer Bachus, Katherine Harris, and Eric Cantor. It was intended to restructure U.S. foreign aid to the Third World, so that aid is going to countries that are committed to free markets, free trade, and free speech, and not going down ratholes of socialism and into the pockets of corrupt dictators. Countries that receive MCC funds have to sign an agreement that allows the U.S. to recapture the funds if they are not used to support development of market mechanisms. This is a sea change in U.S. foreign aid policy after years of throwing money at corrupt regimes that never reached the people on the street.
rockmom on August 12, 2008 at 8:51 AM
Lifting three sentences? Hmmm . . . that still means he committed less plagiarism than Monica Crowley. Maybe there’s a radio show and seat on “McLaughlin Group” in his future.
Debbie Schlussel on August 12, 2008 at 9:24 AM
Hey, how about this plagiarism?
Which brings us to a larger issue. I had not realized that David Axelrod was John Edwards campaign manager in 2004. [note to self: D'uh!]
Lot’s of speculation here that Edwards was nothing but a stalking horse for Obama against Hillary, with David Axelrod sitting in the saddle.
Makes perfect sense, and from that perspective it would not matter a whit to Obama if Edwards was a philandering, lying cad as long as the short term goal of deposing Hillary was accomplished.
Buy Danish on August 12, 2008 at 9:53 AM