ABC: McCain “now seriously considering” Lieberman for VP

posted at 9:29 pm on July 30, 2008 by Allahpundit

He’s going to transform the party — by turning us into hawkish Democrats? Nuance.

There’s a bigger point — and this initial volley, they say, lays the groundwork for it. They will be sharpening McCain’s message that he, not Obama, is the true change agent, a man who’s repeatedly taken unpopular stands, made the hard calls and forged bipartisan alliances.

Part of the calculus now is how his VP choice will further sharpen that message. There is significant support among top McCain advisers that he make a “transformative” pick who would change the Republican Party — someone who would appeal to moderate Republicans and Democrats…

A person who fills that bill, these advisers say, is Joe Lieberman.

Lieberman, an Independent Democrat, flatly denied his interest to ABC’s Ron Claiborne earlier this month, but McCain is now seriously considering him as that “transformative” pick, sources tell ABC News…

What’s more, some McCain advisers believe Lieberman would dramatically enhance the point they are now trying to make about Obama in this “celebrity” ad campaign.

McCain and Lieberman are anti-celebrities, the argument goes. They have, as one top adviser said, felt the heat after taking unpopular positions because they were willing to do “what’s right for the country” — whatever it meant for their own popularity.

Good news for that unpredictable five percent in the middle he needs to win, not so good for, er, everyone else in America. Are evangelicals going to vote for a guy who scored 100% on NARAL’s annual report card? Are Reagan conservatives jittery about McCain’s maverickiness going to feel reassured knowing Al Gore’s choice for VP is waiting in the wings? Is the left going to reach hitherto unscaled heights of apoplexy at the thought of the one pol they hate more than George Bush somehow ending up on the Republican ticket? (No, no, and yes, respectively, if you’re scoring at home.) Think of it in practical terms. Assume the worst happens and through some misfortune Vice President Lieberman becomes President Lieberman. Either the Democrats’ animus towards him results in hopeless gridlock in Congress or the breach is healed and we’ve got a lefty executive working with a lefty legislature towards common goals — Iraq excepted, of course. I like Liebs; I don’t like the idea. But the signs are there if you’re willing to look…

Exit question: Maybe the left, true to its proud tradition of honoring dissent, will forgive Joementum his apostasy? Hmmm.


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aero:

Please…this kind of speculation happens all the time. It is not about McCain. And how do we know where this is coming from? It might be from the campaign and it might not be or it might be exaggerated. What is he supposed to do about it? These are not children he is dealing with, he can’t threaten them with a time out.

Terrye on July 30, 2008 at 10:45 PM

Lieberman would be just fine as Secretary of State or of Defense I think. It would accomplish the “reach across the isle” thing without ticking off conservatives too much.

BryanS on July 30, 2008 at 10:47 PM

Well if McCain dies in office and Reid’s senate won’t confirm a new vice president, we will have an elderly Lieberman with Nancy Pelosi next in line.

Talk about CHANGE

KW64 on July 30, 2008 at 10:48 PM

Rexas jew:

Like it or not, McCain is probably the only Republican out there right now who could beat Obama. If you want articulate nominees, then find them and support them and bring them up in the party for the future.

Terrye on July 30, 2008 at 10:48 PM

I hope he takes Joe, and maybe reshape the Republican/Democrat Party…it will certainly help make it easier to vote third party.

Conservative Voice on July 30, 2008 at 10:48 PM

That should be Texas Jew. Sorry for the mistake. Time for bed. simple typing is beyond me.

Terrye on July 30, 2008 at 10:49 PM

TexasJew on July 30, 2008 at 10:40 PM

you know if hillary had won the nomination she would be up tremendously right now, especially after asking bambi to be her vp. and we could be looking realistically at 16 years of lib “leadership”. we got lucky and the worst candidate ver won the dem nomination, however we have the 2nd worst candidate ever. and he seems determined to become the worst candidate ever. the number of unforced errors between these two is ridiculous. mccain over the weekend backtracking on his no tax pledge is a major one, brings up “read my lips” comparisons.

chasdal on July 30, 2008 at 10:50 PM

I think it is a fundamental falacy that the VP needs to or can “bring states.” Back about 40 years or so, when America was far far more regional in focus, perhaps, hence the Kennedy-Johnson ticket, for example. But we are far less regional today than we once were. McCain needs a strong Conservative on the ticket with a solid track record and unimpeachable character. He also needs someone who can campaign on their own, stick on message, suffer the flak with dignity and conviction, and also appeal to Independents and a good portion of the Dem voters as well.

Palin, well, she is pretty much busy right now…has a different set of priorities, and McCain can easily be looked at as pandering…and ruin Palin’s chances farther down the road, like 2012, for example.

He needs a VP who isn’t almost instantly divisive…so a Romney isn’t, to me at least, a good candidate, though he has some pretty sterling credentials…but that Mormon thing, well, for some that is enough to harm the ticket, unfortunately, I thought we had matured past that by now.

Giuliani is a bust. Huckabee as well, at this point.

Still think McCain could do a lot of good with Steele on the ticket.

coldwarrior on July 30, 2008 at 10:50 PM

If McCain flips off the republican party with Lieberman it will be the last straw for me. I hope he can get the votes of Hillary democrats because he won’t get mine.

Dollayo on July 30, 2008 at 10:51 PM

Terrye on July 30, 2008 at 10:48 PM

thats a load of garbage. if Fred! had got the nomination he would be spanking bambi in a ridiculous way. when a conservative nominee sticks to conservative principles, takes the time to explain to the electorate why its a better way he/she will always win. it was scandal and spending, i.e., not being conservative that lost us the congress in 2006. it will be returning to conservative ways that can win them back.

chasdal on July 30, 2008 at 10:53 PM

And how do we know where this is coming from? It might be from the campaign and it might not be or it might be exaggerated.

Terrye on July 30, 2008 at 10:45 PM

It’s from the campaign.

Buy Danish on July 30, 2008 at 10:53 PM

Still think McCain could do a lot of good with Steele on the ticket.

coldwarrior on July 30, 2008 at 10:50 PM

steele is a very good choice. and it will be great watching the dems smear him on a national stage showing what true racists they are. condi and clarence get a fair amount but i dont think the average American hears about it the way they would in a presidential election.

chasdal on July 30, 2008 at 10:55 PM

Keane or Sebelius, perhaps…but if his mantra is “change” Daschle or Hillary would pretty much suck the life out of that meme.

coldwarrior on July 30, 2008 at 10:36 PM

If McCain keeps closing the gap with him in the polls he just might feel forced to pick HildaBeast and just hire a food taster. If he were to pick HildaBeast it would probably be game over as it would pretty much totally unite the dims.

MB4 on July 30, 2008 at 11:00 PM

luv joe.

but this would be suicide.

reliapundit on July 30, 2008 at 11:01 PM

MB4 on July 30, 2008 at 11:00 PM

the more he screws up the less likely she would accept. that makes a floor fight at the convention more likely. damn that would be so great!!

chasdal on July 30, 2008 at 11:03 PM

Calm down – this is just the part of the beauty pageant when the finalists each take one last stroll before our adoring eyes.

CK MacLeod on July 30, 2008 at 11:04 PM

the more he screws up the less likely she would accept. that makes a floor fight at the convention more likely. damn that would be so great!!

chasdal on July 30, 2008 at 11:03 PM

Don’t get your hopes up.

MB4 on July 30, 2008 at 11:05 PM

If McCain keeps closing the gap with him in the polls he just might feel forced to pick HildaBeast and just hire a food taster.

Not a problem, since he only drinks “ensure” from a straw.

Har. Har. Har.

wise_man on July 30, 2008 at 11:05 PM

As much as John McCain may dislike it, he will be the nominee for the REPUBLICAN PARTY and even his maverickness knows his VP will have to be a Republican.

This sort of speculation is silly.

EJDolbow on July 30, 2008 at 11:06 PM

Long shot. Obama could always pick Medal of Honor winner Bob Kerrey.

MB4 on July 30, 2008 at 11:07 PM

Wow, I see a lot of you are not liking Lieberman for VP. Shockingly I think it is a fairly good idea. I mean if all we want is for McCain to win. I am not happy that I am going to have to vote for McCain no matter who he picks, but that is the way it is.

kahall on July 30, 2008 at 11:08 PM

Rexas jew:

Like it or not, McCain is probably the only Republican out there right now who could beat Obama. If you want articulate nominees, then find them and support them and bring them up in the party for the future.

Terrye on July 30, 2008 at 10:48 PM

Sarah Palin is fine with me. I voted for and like Romney, even though I continually shake in fear at the diabolical revelations of “The Book of Moroni”.
Palin seems about 9 evolutionary levels higher in the cortical gray matter area than McCain.
Of course, a Taco Bell Stufft Chicken Burrito is about 3 levels above McCain on that scale..

TexasJew on July 30, 2008 at 11:09 PM

Not a problem, since he only drinks “ensure” from a straw.

Har. Har. Har.

wise_man on July 30, 2008 at 11:05 PM

Are you sure that is not your hombre Juan? He turns 72 very soon.

MB4 on July 30, 2008 at 11:09 PM

Something in me thinks it would be an inspired choice: Lieberman is like the old-time Democrats of the 60s–the guys who were basically populists, not Marxists. Plenty of Democrats are alive now who remember those days. Plus, Lieberman has more character than most politicians. There’s a market demand for character.

It’s so crazy, it just might work!

ahem on July 30, 2008 at 11:10 PM

OTOH: Michael Steele would be perfect!

ahem on July 30, 2008 at 11:17 PM

this was posted on NRO the other day. makes a very good point about not rewarding GOP players. and that is exactly what picking lieberman would do. its a slap in the face to loyal republicans. its admitting that we dont have what the people want. it will be exploited terribly. “they had to come get one of ours to have a chance”. this is what a “maverick” nominee gets us. half the GOP members of congress will have to run against mccain due to his extremely unpopular positions that they have to oppose to keep the base. he has the potential to put the GOP in the minority for a long time

chasdal on July 30, 2008 at 11:17 PM

It’s so crazy, it just might work!

ahem on July 30, 2008 at 11:10 PM

But you can always say that about every stupid idea, like that drunk idiot who tried to put jet fuel into his car’s gas tank the other day.

And that drunk would have had a better chance of surviving that idiocy (about .00000001%) than McCain’s campaign would have after nominating Mr. “Anti-drilling anywhere” himself, Joe Lieberman, for VP.

TexasJew on July 30, 2008 at 11:17 PM

That would be one way to get me to vote for a third party.

mgtanner on July 30, 2008 at 11:18 PM

If this turns out to be true then McCain will have longer Democrat coat-tails then I imagined. People are going to have to reappraise their political alignment and decide; do they share more in common with Republicans Democrats, or Democrats Socialists?

I just hope a conservative party will spring up by ’12 and dominate the new political landscape for generations to come.

FloatingRock on July 30, 2008 at 11:18 PM

We all agree that Lieb’s only good quality (to R’s) is foreign policy, so why not float the idea of Sec. of State? It would bolster McCain’s image as a maverick, gets moderate dems who lean towards defense instead of social issues, and shows his commitment to Israel while giving a finger to Iran.

I could live with it…better than say….Sec of State John Kerry…

Butters on July 30, 2008 at 11:21 PM

I just hope a conservative party will spring up by ‘12 and dominate the new political landscape for generations to come.

FloatingRock on July 30, 2008 at 11:18 PM

Tell you one thing: if McCain loses this lay-down election because he is as stupid as he seems to be, he will be reviled forever by Republicans. And good riddance to him and all his phony crap.

TexasJew on July 30, 2008 at 11:21 PM

I hasten to add, one difference from the normal beauty pageant is, of course, that in this one the winner may not appear among the finalists – the Miss Universe pageant does other things to generate drama and suspense. For some of the candidates, just being mentioned by whatever mysterious mentioner is part of paying them their due, though others really don’t want to take a stroll. For some, like Lieberman, just being mentioned seriously is a reminder of the message that the McCain camp wants to send to indies and disaffected Dems, and it marginally helps McCain to be seen to be taking “non-traditional” candidates seriously, especially if, in the end, he’s going to go boring on purpose, reinforcing his Obama’s-a-fake message by picking someone who (novel concept here), McCain really thinks would be the best person for the job, atmospherics and politics be damned.

CK MacLeod on July 30, 2008 at 11:23 PM

ahem on July 30, 2008 at 11:10 PM

You know, I used to be a Democrat. Why on earth would I want an old “populist” tax-and-spend Democrat on the ticket (and a heartbeat from the Presidency) unless I was still a Democrat?

Lieberman as veep is not an inspired choice, it’s just plain nuts.

Buy Danish on July 30, 2008 at 11:24 PM

I love the idea of Lieberman as VP. Seriously. I even suggested it on another thread just this morning. I honestly like the idea. Hell, I might even eat my words and vote for the lying two faced back stabbing S.O.B. if he picked Lieberman.

Lieberman, while he may be detested by the far left, is respected by a majority of middle of the road Dems. With McCain we could very well see a President Lieberman. I’m cool with that, and I bet the far left wing loonies would like it in the long run.

Most Conservatives approve of Lieberman on a number of issues, including the war on Terror. It’s sort of like a pale version of Zell Miller on the ticket that way. The Maverick picks a Maverick independent Senator. One who is sort of a Democrat. I love it. I guess I’ll go write McCain and tell him how much I approve of this rumored choice.

I wonder who he’ll pick for Secretary of State? Any guesses?

Snake307 on July 30, 2008 at 11:24 PM

OTOH: Michael Steele would be perfect!

ahem on July 30, 2008 at 11:17 PM

Why, are we short a liberal Republican on the ticket? Do you even know what he stands for or in what direction he is trying to take this party?

EJDolbow on July 30, 2008 at 11:26 PM

Lieberman? Hell Goddamn NO! The full shove carbon taxes, cap and trade up our asses ticket? Jack my gas and electrical bills through the roof? I don’t think so!

Can this election get any worse? Please pick Romney so I can actually vote and have some hopes McCain does not turn the economy into the third world.

Poptech on July 30, 2008 at 11:27 PM

Lieberman will always have to deal with his association with the Goracle…and among Republicans this will be a tough sell. Secretary of State Lieberman, why not? But VP? A lot of baggage a disorganized McCain campaign cannot afford to deal with.

coldwarrior on July 30, 2008 at 11:28 PM

You know, I used to be a Democrat. Why on earth would I want an old “populist” tax-and-spend Democrat on the ticket (and a heartbeat from the Presidency) unless I was still a Democrat?

Lieberman as veep is not an inspired choice, it’s just plain nuts.

Buy Danish on July 30, 2008 at 11:24 PM

Not at all Amigo. You see, by picking the other Maverick, they can claim to transcend party politics while at the same time taking a bunch of the votes away from the Democrats.

For example, at the meeting where it was decided that Michigan and Florida would only have half votes instead of the historic precident of 3/5ths, a Jewish woman, self identified, swore she’d never support Obama. Others have said that the Jewish population would never vote for Obama.

Perhaps this will sew up that ever so important category of people who are Democrats in name only, and who voted for Lieberman for the Senate even though he was running as an independent. It puts Connecticut into play, which may have implications around the North East.

Also, with the choice of Lieberman, he doesn’t play to the traditional white gun toting racist demographic that the Press loves to claim the Republicans constantly pander to.

Snake307 on July 30, 2008 at 11:30 PM

Lieberman will always have to deal with his association with the Goracle…and among Republicans this will be a tough sell. Secretary of State Lieberman, why not? But VP? A lot of baggage a disorganized McCain campaign cannot afford to deal with.

coldwarrior on July 30, 2008 at 11:28 PM

However that association with Goracle also solidifies McCain’s credentials as a true Environmentalist which could even put the green vote into play. Did you think of that?

Snake307 on July 30, 2008 at 11:31 PM

Lieberman, while he may be detested by the far left, is respected by a majority of middle of the road Dems. With McCain we could very well see a President Lieberman. I’m cool with that, and I bet the far left wing loonies would like it in the long run.
Snake307 on July 30, 2008 at 11:24 PM

I kinda don’t see Lieberman running on the republican ticket in 8 years. Lieberman is kinda like Cheney – the end of the road. (my opinion, just a guess.) If McCain chooses a younger man or woman, who was a republican(hopefully), then that’s the next logical step. Jindal or Palin would be excellent choices. And who cares if they don’t have the expreience yet. Neither does Obama. And after 8 years with a young Jundal or Palin, they would be in a much better place to make the transition to being elected president, if the conditions where favorable.

wise_man on July 30, 2008 at 11:32 PM

Michael Steele = the GOP token black Candidate that is only being mentioned because Obama is black. Sorry, he is a nice guy but has would not even be considered if he was not black. Pretend Steele is white and then tell me why you would want him. Please stop suggesting affirmative action picks, unless you can find a former black GOP governor with serious conservative street cred we can skip Steele. Just like Condi has done absolutely nothing of value to make her qualified to be VP outside of being the ultimate affirmative action pick – a black + woman. Stop with the pandering and lets get back to real reasons to select a VP as in Romney’s more than 800 Budget Line-Item Vetoes and extensive private sector CEO experience.

Poptech on July 30, 2008 at 11:35 PM

Why risk the center and right in order to appeal to the enviro-green left? Lieberman’s association with the Goracle did Lieberman no good at all, even from the Dems.

Have known Michael Steele for years…I used to live in Maryland…and as a Conservative he is far more Conservative than McCain ever was. He can also throw into dissaray decades and decades of Democrat pandering to the Black vote. His demographics in the campaign can easily transcend race, something Obama seems to have as a consistent underlying theme in his campaign.

coldwarrior on July 30, 2008 at 11:39 PM

Snake are you insane? The Jewish vote is ridiculously small just as the worthless green vote – of which we do NOT want in the freakin party! The socialists can go vote for Nader. Why are we pandering to those who believe in the environmental religion?

Environmentalism as Religion

Poptech on July 30, 2008 at 11:39 PM

for reals—that’s a winning ticket

i disagree with sen.lieberman on most things but he supports the war on terror and that’s the issue at the fore i.m.o.

devadevadasa on July 30, 2008 at 11:42 PM

If anyone thinks that Michael Steel will make a dent in the locked 99.9% black vote for Obama (which votes 99.9% Dem regardless) then you need to get more black friends. The only way the GOP will get any of the black vote is if Obama became republican. We never have had this vote and it does not matter.

Poptech on July 30, 2008 at 11:42 PM

Snake307 on July 30, 2008 at 11:30 PM

Not at all Amigo. You see, by picking the other Maverick, they can claim to transcend party politics while at the same time taking a bunch of the votes away from the Democrats.

Oh goody! We can finally get rid of the two party system and all be Democrats.

For example, at the meeting where it was decided that Michigan and Florida would only have half votes instead of the historic precident of 3/5ths, a Jewish woman, self identified, swore she’d never support Obama. Others have said that the Jewish population would never vote for Obama.

Wow. You’re giving us one anecdote about one woman and extrapolating that out to represent…what exactly? And if Jews won’t vote for Obama anyway, what the hell do we need Lieberman for?

Buy Danish on July 30, 2008 at 11:42 PM

Oh the war on terror is your issue until you lose $10,000 in income to global warming regulation that McCain and Lieberman will push through.

Cap-and-Trade Could Cost the Average Family $10,800 in Lost Income

Poptech on July 30, 2008 at 11:44 PM

BTW isn’t McCain enough to lock the war on terror issue as in good hands?

Poptech on July 30, 2008 at 11:45 PM

Snake are you insane?

Poptech on July 30, 2008 at 11:39 PM

That’s one possibility.

Oh the war on terror is your issue until you lose $10,000 in income to global warming regulation that McCain and Lieberman will push through.

Poptech on July 30, 2008 at 11:44 PM

Yep, it’s going to be awfully difficult to fund the W.O.T. if we’re all flat broke from excessive taxation, and the Federal Revenue stream dries up.

Buy Danish on July 30, 2008 at 11:48 PM

Man o man, now we know for sure ol’ Juan “Z-Visa” McCain is serious about Securing our border and enforcing our immigration laws eh? What a show of strength that ticket would be.

McCain/Leiberman. Geeeesshhhh

DfDeportation on July 30, 2008 at 11:49 PM

Considering…
1] Right elbow squeezin’
2] Right ear whisperin’
3] Shiite or Sunni believin’

I’m goin’ with Holy Joe!

J_Gocht on July 30, 2008 at 11:49 PM

I love the idea of Lieberman as VP.
Snake307 on July 30, 2008 at 11:24 PM

I’ll pretend that you are serious, and that this is not just a brilliant put-on.
To love Lieberman as VP, one must love $10 gasoline, too.
And crawling at 55 MPH on empty Interstates and over 6 trillion dollars in Global Warming Taxes sucked out of our wallets and no jobs and no electricity and our economy in shambles.
And (of course) an Obama Presidency.
“I guess I’ll go write McCain and tell him how much I approve of this rumored choice.”
I’ll one-up you and write Scarlett Johannson how much I approve of her derriere. Of course, she will still have a job after November…

I’m Jewish (of course!) and the thought of a Leftwing dud like Lieberman within 64 1/2 miles of a Republican Presidency puts me into a catatonic state.

TexasJew on July 30, 2008 at 11:49 PM

If anyone thinks that Michael Steel will make a dent in the locked 99.9% black vote for Obama (which votes 99.9% Dem regardless) then you need to get more black friends. The only way the GOP will get any of the black vote is if Obama became republican. We never have had this vote and it does not matter.
Poptech on July 30, 2008 at 11:42 PM

It’s not just about black democrats.

In addition to moderates and undecideds, who also vote in elections. Sometimes they decide elections, because most democrats vote for the democrat. And most republicans (usually) vote for the republican.

wise_man on July 30, 2008 at 11:52 PM

I’m a partisan, but not so much so that I’m ready to watch America fall into an Obama-Reid-Pelosi abyss. If the numbers suggest that that Lieberman would energize the campaign and make a difference in a couple of key states, he’s my man.

Infidoll on July 30, 2008 at 11:55 PM

Hey J-Mac, I’ve got an idea for a transformation. How about you pick Palin and transform the GOP into a party of conservatism.

That would be a real transformation.

Purple Fury on July 30, 2008 at 11:56 PM

Guys, look at it this way. McCain got the nickname Maverick not from doing what we the population, the voters, the Conservatives, or even the Republican Base thought was the best thing, he got it doing what HE thought was best.

McCain can seriously solidify that whole Maverick thing by selecting the only other Maverick in the Senate, and I might add, you can count on all those great Maverick plans making it through the senate. We won’t have Gridlock to deal with. It will be smooth sailing in the senate.

All of McCain’s brilliant proposals will sail through Congress, and we’ll have a very successful Presidency, but to do that we need to get at least the blue Dog Democrats on our side. To do that, we need to get someone like Lieberman who’s integrity is beyond question to help us get these very important policies and plans through Congress. Lieberman can do it with McCain calling the shots. He’s a great running back for our side. With McCain calling the plays, and Lieberman pushing the Congress, we’ll be kicking ass in no time.

What a brilliant choice. What an absolutely brilliant choice.

Snake307 on July 31, 2008 at 12:00 AM

Infidoll on July 30, 2008 at 11:55 PM

Other than reliable hawkishness, is there a discernable difference between McCain/Lieberman and Obama/Reid/Pelosi?

It can be argued that McCain by himself has a few conservative ideas, but match him up with Lieberman and that goes totally out the window.

Buy Danish on July 31, 2008 at 12:03 AM

Snake307 on July 31, 2008 at 12:00 AM

what brilliant plans?? amnesty? cap-and-trade? more 1st amendment restrictions? raising payroll taxes? (yep, its on the table even though a year ago he said he “no.none.none.” the lies are racking up johnny)

republican leadership needs to nip this in the bud. he has gotten way to much from the party to pull this kinda crap.

chasdal on July 31, 2008 at 12:04 AM

Here it is…

I’m sorry Iran is training extremists…not al queda!

J_Gocht on July 31, 2008 at 12:06 AM

Snake what proposals?

Legalize millions of illegals?

Raise the price of gas to $10 a gallon or just double my electrical bill all in the name of fighting the evil CO2?

More like getting our ass kicked back to the third world.

Poptech on July 31, 2008 at 12:07 AM

Guys, can’t McCain in fact sew up the change moniker by picking someone who’s Independent? Won’t Obama in fact have to pick someone markedly different in order to counter the “change in McCain/Lieberman” ticket?

Why our party would really be recognized as reaching across political lines and embracing new ideas?

Snake307 on July 31, 2008 at 12:07 AM

Can’t you see the debates held in the oval office between John McCain and Lieberman? In the end, they toss a quarter and decide to split the difference down the middle. All is well. It’s awesome really.

Snake307 on July 31, 2008 at 12:09 AM

Snake pay attention!

What proposals?

Legalize millions of illegals?

Raise the price of gas to $10 a gallon or just double my electrical bill all in the name of fighting the evil CO2?

Poptech on July 31, 2008 at 12:09 AM

you can count on all those great Maverick plans making it through the senate. We won’t have Gridlock to deal with. It will be smooth sailing in the senate.

Snake307 on July 31, 2008 at 12:00 AM

That would be the worst thing that could happen. I don’t want McCain or Obama to have smooth sailing. Let’s save that for after ’12, maybe. Until then, the more gridlock the better, aside from the war.

FloatingRock on July 31, 2008 at 12:09 AM

Snake 307 is kidding. I won’t go so far as to call it “brilliant” parody, but parody it is.

Buy Danish on July 31, 2008 at 12:13 AM

Why our party would really be recognized as reaching across political lines and embracing new ideas?

Snake307 on July 31, 2008 at 12:07 AM

You’ve got to be kidding. Forgive me if I’m wrong, but aren’t the the guy who’s been saying that McCain was so bad you were going to vote for Obama hoping it would straighten out the GOP?

FloatingRock on July 31, 2008 at 12:16 AM

Legalize millions of illegals?

Raise the price of gas to $10 a gallon or just double my electrical bill all in the name of fighting the evil CO2?

Poptech on July 31, 2008 at 12:09 AM

Wait a minute, for the last month, everyone on here has been telling me what an awesome Conservative McCain is, now at the rumor of his nominating Lieberman, you all are up in arms over his actual platform? Are you conservatives? Or are you Republicans? I’ve been called a Liberal plant for pointing out how Liberal McCain’s campaign promises really are, and now you all are telling me how dangerous a Lieberman pick would be?

I thought that Reagan was alive and well in John McCain. Now, I hear he wants to raise my gas prices and energy bills via his cap and trade idea? Well. I don’t know about that after all. Perhaps we hope that the Vice President will manage to reign in McCain, no one else has been able to do it. Might as well give up those Reigns, they aren’t attached to anything.

Yeah, Lieberman is a great choice. We’d have a democrat who isn’t a Democrat as Vice President. We’d have a Republican who isn’t a Republican as President. I swear this here and now, I will vote for McCain if he picks Lieberman. I’ve previously sworn that I would not vote for him under any circumstances. (I had considered this and then tossed it as too wild to even waste time thinking about.) However, I’ll eat my words and vote for McCain/Lieberman. Of course, I’ll increase my investments in canned food and shotgun shells, but that aside, I will vote for him. I will even take a picture of my vote, and post it online, linked here, to prove it. If and only if he picks Lieberman

Snake307 on July 31, 2008 at 12:16 AM

You’ve got to be kidding.

FloatingRock on July 31, 2008 at 12:16 AM

Bingo.

Buy Danish on July 31, 2008 at 12:17 AM

Not all “new” ideas are good ideas. All that “change” stuff Obama has been bantering about means exactly what?

Should McCain choose Lieberman, Lieberman ceases to be Joe Lieberman of the Senate and becomes the President of the Senate…and a lot of Dem Senators who put up with Lieberman, or in fact supported him, will address the new President of the Senate in whatever they feel is an appropiate manner. Given that the President of the Senate is merely the tie-buster, Lieberman’s ability to operate in the Senate in any manner similar to what he has been doing for years stops…cold. He’s a great guy, but when it comes to dealing with Congress he is no Lyndon Johnson.

Lastly, should McCain choose Lieberman…a maverick choosing another maverick…the GOP is going to become history, and fast. The polls since McCain sewed up the nomination demonstrate that less than half of the GOP is enamored with McCain at the masthead. His views on everything from amnesty and taxes, social security and energy are not at all in line with GOP planks…but, he is what we have to elect…sort of an anyone but Obama ticket. The demographics among Dems, and Independents favoring Obama are a lot larger than the demographics favoring McCain among Republicans and independents. Obama may be an empty suit, but we have a hell of a lot of vacuous voeters out there who will vote for Obama simply on the “Change” meme. That is how we got Jimmy Carter…and Bill Clinton the first time around.

I personally don’t want to see a replay of the 1976 election nor ’92 election. Too much serious stuff is in front of us. A maverick is not what we really need, but it is what we got. Screw the pooch and pick Lieberman as VP and the GOP is toast.

coldwarrior on July 31, 2008 at 12:20 AM

Wait a minute, for the last month, everyone on some people here ha[ve] been telling me what an awesome Conservative McCain is,

Snake307 on July 31, 2008 at 12:16 AM

FloatingRock on July 31, 2008 at 12:21 AM

Hey folks…
Check this…!

J_Gocht on July 31, 2008 at 12:06 AM

J_Gocht on July 31, 2008 at 12:22 AM

Snake307 on July 31, 2008 at 12:16 AM

put the broad brush away there pilgrim! theres a fair amount of us that are in the boat with you. wise_man has accused me of being a liberal plenty of times, along w/ suggesting i should be banned for not getting gooey eyed about mccain.

and i am relieved that your posts were parody, it was kinda disheartening to read that drivel thinking it was serious

chasdal on July 31, 2008 at 12:24 AM

Snake, please stop with the propaganda as you have obviously never seen my anti-McCain posts.

Perhaps we can hope the VP pick will offer some economic wisdom instead of a yes man to insane proposals.

So you don’t think Cap and Trade is going to raise your gas prices? Well you better go do some research.

Poptech on July 31, 2008 at 12:24 AM

If true McCain can write off most of the South. the white conservatives will stay home, the blacks will be out in force.

unseen on July 31, 2008 at 12:25 AM

Snake307 on July 31, 2008 at 12:16 AM

Well, since you’ve admitted that your posts were a parody, can I still write to Scarlett Johannson about her derriere?

TexasJew on July 31, 2008 at 12:28 AM

So you don’t think Cap and Trade is going to raise your gas prices? Well you better go do some research.

Poptech on July 31, 2008 at 12:24 AM

I know it’s going to raise my prices, I also figure it will lead to about a 10% to even 12% unemployment rate. That’s probably low in reality. When no one can afford the energy, then consumer purchasing power goes to nothing. That in turn means that lots of companies, not just manufacturing here in the US, but transportation, and that includes rail and truck as well as shipping, loses thousands of employees to try and stay in business. It gets better. Much better actually. Then with those additional people unemployed, the purchasing power drops even more, which means more unemployment unless something is done to get the money moving in the private sector again. McCain will never do that, never.

So Lieberman is a good choice for McCain, and I honestly (I’m actually being quite serious here) support it. I think it’s great that the Republicans have forgone the Conservative choices and picked a hawkish liberal. I do intend to follow through on my promise, and vote for McCain if and only if, he chooses Lieberman.

Snake307 on July 31, 2008 at 12:30 AM

unseen on July 31, 2008 at 12:25 AM

I really luv your dissertations on the economy!
Olde soldier sends…!

J_Gocht on July 31, 2008 at 12:31 AM

Snake307 on July 31, 2008 at 12:16 AM

Well, since you’ve admitted that your posts were a parody, can I still write to Scarlett Johannson about her derriere?

TexasJew on July 31, 2008 at 12:28 AM

Kind of partial to Shakira’s myself. Have you seen her hips don’t lie video?

Wow, what a performance. Yo Habla Espanol.

Snake307 on July 31, 2008 at 12:32 AM

Boys and girls take warning, if you go near the lake
Keep your eyes wide open, and look for sneaky snake
Now maybe you wont see him, maybe you wont hear
But hell sneak up behind you, and drink all your root beer

And then sneaky snake goes dancin, wigglin and a-hissin
Sneaky snake goes dancin, gigglin and a-kissin
I dont like old sneaky snake; he laughs too much you see
When he goes wigglin through the grass, it tickles his underneath

Well, sneaky snake drinks root beer, and he just makes me sick
When he is not dancin, he looks just like a stick
Now, he doesnt have any arms or legs, you cannot see his ears
And while we are not lookin, hes stealin all of our beer

And then sneaky snake goes dancin, wigglin and a-hissin
Sneaky snake goes dancin, gigglin and a-kissin
I dont like old sneaky snake; he laughs too much you see
When he goes wigglin through the grass, it tickles his underneath

-Tom T. Hall

FloatingRock on July 31, 2008 at 12:39 AM

So you don’t think Cap and Trade is going to raise your gas prices? Well you better go do some research.

Poptech on July 31, 2008 at 12:24 AM

Actually, it won’t raise prices, since we won’t have any gasoline anyway.

We’ll drive around in tiny golf carts fueled by chicken crap and live in carefully constructed zero-emission fenced-in human preserves like that caged Borneo “wildman” at the 1893 Chicago World’s Fair. And we’ll live out our impoverished little meaningless lives in enviromentally approved slavery until we finally get motivated enough to jump off the top of a tall solar-heated building and put ourselves out of our collective miseries.

It’s the New Gorean Future!

TexasJew on July 31, 2008 at 12:42 AM

Snake 307 is kidding. I won’t go so far as to call it “brilliant” parody, but parody it is.

Buy Danish on July 31, 2008 at 12:13 AM

Either that or “wise_man” spiked Snake’s bear with some the high test McKoolaid that he drinks.

MB4 on July 31, 2008 at 12:46 AM

I personally don’t want to see a replay of the 1976 election nor ‘92 election. Too much serious stuff is in front of us. A maverick is not what we really need, but it is what we got. Screw the pooch and pick Lieberman as VP and the GOP is toast.

coldwarrior on July 31, 2008 at 12:20 AM

Seriously for a moment, the high point of the Republican Party since Reagan left office has been the Clinton Presidency. Think for a moment.

We got welfare reform, which Clinton vetoed twice, and swore would end up with people in the streets homeless. We got job training and conditional assistance through. In other words, we started to teach people to fish, instead of giving them a fish. Great move in Conservative ideals. We got the Federal Budget almost under control. We actually got discussions about the multiple layers of people who do nothing but check the math of the person next to them in the Federally Funded School Lunch program. We got lots of things accomplished, each one was eventually signed by Clinton, with promises of doom and gloom as he did so.

Of course, I know he’s now taking credit for those great successes, which is my point. We changed the debate, we got the entire system working our way, while we were in power in congress, and had a Democratic President chasing skirts all over the West Wing.

When we got the Presidency and the Congress, many of us, myself included, thought we were going to move this country hard right for a change. We made some small progress, but we had lots to do. We immediately embraced the country club blue bloods of the McCain wing of the party, and tossed the conservative ideals out the window. Budget? Out the window went any hope of a budget worth anything. Out of control spending? We did our very best to put the democrats to shame in the spending department. Useless bickering and ignorance towards the people? Why Marie Antoinette would have been so proud of us.

What great Conservative ideals did we push? Bankruptcy reform, so businesses could write off debt, but the individual couldn’t. Nice for the businessmen out there, not so good for the average Joe. We took stupidity and pushed it to a level that even Dilbert thought was too insane to make jokes about. We shat upon the bill of rights with CFR (McCain Feingold) and the PATRIOT ACT. We got two with one there. We denied the people the security in their person and papers without due process, and we denied the people the right to contact an attorney. Not terrorist’s at Club Gitmo, citizens who got one of the National Security Letters that the FBI started waving like mad.

Some conservative ideals we pushed for six years that we were in charge. Not a one of them was conservative the way we did it, and we got upset when in 2006 the people got sick of our actions? Gee, what were the odds of that?

Give me Obama, and let’s get the next Contract with America and the Conservative ideals pushed again. This time, I bet we can clean up the Department of Education, but we’ll have to work at it.

Snake307 on July 31, 2008 at 12:46 AM

FloatingRock on July 31, 2008 at 12:39 AM
My little daughter loves that song! We saw it on youtube and I remember it from ’74 or so.
WAY better than the hideously wimpy “I Love” and even “Watermelon Wine”.

TexasJew on July 31, 2008 at 12:47 AM

bear beer

MB4 on July 31, 2008 at 12:47 AM

Either that or “wise_man” spiked Snake’s bear with some the high test McKoolaid that he drinks.

MB4 on July 31, 2008 at 12:46 AM

LOL! Maybe that’s what he was doing during his absence these past few days.

FloatingRock on July 31, 2008 at 12:50 AM

unseen on July 31, 2008 at 12:25 AM

Hey unseen, I hear tell you’re the financial, economy guru and long range planner?

What’s your Intel about…? Oregon Freeze Dry [Mountain House Foods]?

The federalizes have bought up all supplies of #10 tin cans of their freeze dried products until the end of 2009.

So us citizens get nada?

What the hell do they know that they [and you know] and aren’t tellin’ us?

Unseen, my very best bud?

J_Gocht on July 31, 2008 at 12:53 AM

My little daughter loves that song! We saw it on youtube and I remember it from ‘74 or so.
WAY better than the hideously wimpy “I Love” and even “Watermelon Wine”.

TexasJew on July 31, 2008 at 12:47 AM

Dang, I took a quick look for it on YouTube earlier and didn’t notice it.

It was one of my favorite songs when I was little.

FloatingRock on July 31, 2008 at 12:55 AM

J_Gocht on July 31, 2008 at 12:53 AM

My stepson works there. Most of their products end up going overseas for famine relief and such.

innominatus on July 31, 2008 at 12:58 AM

Here’s Sneaky Snake

FloatingRock on July 31, 2008 at 12:59 AM

At least this would put an end to the “old” jokes.

Stephen M on July 31, 2008 at 12:59 AM

Olde soldier sends…
Check it out!

J_Gocht on July 31, 2008 at 1:06 AM

Snake307 on July 31, 2008 at 12:46 AM

Excellent analysis.

Even though that is part of the basis of my personal anti-McCain -> -> Conservativism (and therefore America in general) wins in the long run strategy, I never really thought of it in precisely that manner…

So my thanks and my kudos for that post.

LegendHasIt on July 31, 2008 at 1:08 AM

and Lieberman’s seat goes to a Democrat. Great plan.

TBinSTL on July 31, 2008 at 1:16 AM

Oh wow… now I just might change my mind and vote for McCain after all if Alfred E. Newman’s conflicted and partially retarded big brother is the VP running mate.

/face-palm

SilverStar830 on July 31, 2008 at 1:18 AM

innominatus on July 31, 2008 at 12:58 A

Very, very interesting, “innominatus” …!

A three [3] minute response…?

To a right wing blog site…?

WOW… that would incline me to believe “you’ve been hovering”, asshole!

And your second cousin twice removed works for “Oregon Freeze Dry”?

What a coincidence…!

Bee Jeebus…

Olde soldier sends congrats…”innominatus”

Did I spell it correctly, asshole?

J_Gocht on July 31, 2008 at 1:18 AM

a man who’s repeatedly taken unpopular stands, made the hard calls and forged bipartisan alliances.

Last night HA had a thread from the NYT and Obama’s professorship. He absolutely despised bipartisanship and preached against it to his university students.

Give me Obama, and let’s get the next Contract with America and the Conservative ideals pushed again. This time, I bet we can clean up the Department of Education, but we’ll have to work at it.

Snake307 on July 31, 2008 at 12:46 AM

This is not 1992, 93, 94, and no Reagan is waiting in the wings. By the end of an Obama reign there won’t be a recognizeable country either.

How any of you can even contemplate handing this still wonderful country, in such a critical time, over to a Child Emperor Romulus Augustus, only a few years after 9/11/01, is simply incomprehensible, and frankly unforgivable. Your children and grandchildren will hold you to account.

Legend, Dagny is watching you, shaking her head.

Entelechy on July 31, 2008 at 1:25 AM

“I’m John McCain and I have not approved the following message…”

Kind of partial to Shakira’s myself. Have you seen her hips don’t lie video?
Wow, what a performance. Yo Habla Espanol.

Snake307 on July 31, 2008 at 12:32 AM

It’s a Latin culture thing.
Down here on the border, one of the biggest insults that you could give a girl back in the old days was to call her “sin nalgas” – “no-butt”. Such is the inherent genius of border humor. It’s like “Ugly Betty” but even stupider, if that is humanly possible (although not as disgustingly hispandering).
Speaking of McCain’s best new friends..
One of the biggest shows in the history of Mexican TV was Brozo – the clown with green hair with a nasty gravelly voice like someone on “The Sopranos”. I used to love watching his show (my wife thought I was insane – I’d tell her that at least it was better than “Nightline”), it was amazing watching a guy in a clown suit and with phosphorescent green hair have intense interviews with various politicians and celebrities.
Listen to this interesting story from 2004:
“On March 3, the Mexico City mayor’s closest political ally, Rene Bejarano, went on a morning news program to decry the shady behavior and outright bribery seen on the first couple of videos. Filming in the neighboring studio was the country’s keenest news analyst, Brozo, who happens to dress up like a clown, complete with green hair and a bright red nose. As Bejarano launched into his lecture, a conservative politician handed Brozo a videocassette. Brozo put the cassette in a VCR and suggested that he and Bejarano watch it together. On the video, Bejarano watched himself accepting what appeared to be a $45,000 bribe from Ahumada and talking about what he was going to deliver in exchange. The money didn’t fit in the suitcase, and after a comic battle with the zipper, he resorted to stuffing wads of American dollars into various pockets in his suit. Bejarano departed Brozo’s studio looking suicidal; later that day he quit the party after linking a number of other prominent politicians to the money.”

…er, not that there’s anything wrong with that..

As for the “derriere” comment, I was just channeling an old Mark Steyn essay about Scarlett Johannson. He seemed pretty smitten with her posterior (if I remember it correctly), in a creepy Nabokovian sort of way…

I don’t know what any of this has to do with Joe Lieberman, but anything vaguely interesting usually has nothing to do with Joe Lieberman.

As for Brozo, I would like to see him take over at “Meet the Press”. Then we’d finally get to see photos of John Edward’s love child!

TexasJew on July 31, 2008 at 1:27 AM

Excellent analysis.

Even though that is part of the basis of my personal anti-McCain -> -> Conservativism (and therefore America in general) wins in the long run strategy, I never really thought of it in precisely that manner…

So my thanks and my kudos for that post.

LegendHasIt on July 31, 2008 at 1:08 AM

Personally, I think we’re spending too much time worried about an Obama Presidency, and too little time considering the implications of a McCain Presidency.

Do I think Lightning will strike twice? I think it’s far more likely that it will if Obama is President, than if McCain is President. Obama will have an uphill fight to get his agenda past the Republicans, and the Blue Dog Democrats we Conservatives can influence, like John Barrow.

I think we can’t influence McCain, and the Republicans will be pressured by the McCain run GOP to accept his ideals, which means we have what options left? The Blue Dogs? They alone won’t be able to stop the machine, and we’ll get the Obama Social program pushed through.

I think it’s possible, but only just, that we can bring back the successes we enjoyed in the Clinton Years. Fiscal Responsibility, being one, if we can get control of the House at least in 2010. We had the entire country talking about how Conservative Ideals worked, Liberals were insane with apoplectic rage at the changes we brought forth. Welfare reform? It was a disaster that would lead to millions of homeless all because of Newt and the Republicans. The result in reality, and the reason Clinton took credit? Fewer people living below the Poverty line. Even when Clinton moved the Poverty line up twice more there were still fewer below it. People were fishing for themselves, and proving Conservative ideals work.

We questioned wasteful items in the budget, and you heard fewer and fewer things like a Bus museum to commemorate Greyhound’s effect on society. You heard more about giving schools books and teaching kids. The idea that Bush did push through, barely, the voucher system to allow parents to decide where their children went to school.

Conservative ideals won the day in the 1990′s, all because we had a President who worried about his public approval numbers, and a Congress who was united behind Newt and the Conservative Leaders to accomplish things.

Under W. We got the Bridge to nowhere. We got the exit to nowhere thanks to Stevens. We got wasteful spending out the ying yang. We got the Department of Homeland Insecurity which near as I can tell, doesn’t do anything but read message boards and jack the warning color (Another stupid thing) up to Mauve. Warily Tense.

We played the Emergency broadcast alert sound so often I was wondering if it was on the top ten of Billboard. Always, it was a non specific threat of a terrorist attack. Gee, I could have gotten that from my Magic 8 ball.

We squandered the Conservative ideals until we were left with one, the War on Terror, which we managed so ineptly that I honestly wondered if the Marx Brothers were in charge. Yeah, I’m dissapointed, and I’m disgusted. Now I watch Conservative be redefined again, instead of faith in the powers of the individual, we’re redefining Conservative to mean that Government Programs are a good thing.

I have a sound bite on my computer, one I used to have played every time I booted up. “Government isn’t the solution to the problem, Government is the problem.”

Snake307 on July 31, 2008 at 1:33 AM

Ok, I’ll vote for Obama, then lay down and die. It would be the same for me to vote for a socialist/Marxist, with an anarchyst wife, and voluntarily throw this country in an unrecoverable direction. Socialism of this magnitude is not reversible, and I/we’d have to pay for it, with our taxes, and the next generations’ future.

Have at it. I lived in it and it’s hell on Earth.

Entelechy on July 31, 2008 at 1:47 AM

We squandered the Conservative ideals until we were left with one, the War on Terror, which we managed so ineptly that I honestly wondered if the Marx Brothers were in charge.

Snake307 on July 31, 2008 at 1:33 AM

Well, ring my bell!

That’s my queue!

And since I have now had a couple of MicroBrews, why not?

Sink me.

George W. Bush’s secret MySpace entry:
Hi. My name is United States President George Walker Bush. You can call me the Commander Guy if you want. Or you can just call me The Decider if you want. I am now in my second triumphant term after wining it by an even bigger landslide than I won my first marvelous term by.
I graduated from Yale in June 1968 in the top 99% of my class. Then I went into the Texas Air National Guard. I was a Top Gun and almost single handedly protected America from the Viet Cong. You didn’t see any Viet Cong in America, now did you? Well did you? See. See what I mean.
I am sure to go down in history as one of the greatest Presidents of all time in U.S. history. Probably only after that guy what’s his name George something. Hey, I just thought of it, he had the same first name as me!
After binging peace and tranquility and democracy to Muslim moms and dads in Iraq and the rest of the Middle East, I will now lead Republicans to a clean sweep in 2008 as all Republicans will run on my outstanding legacy. I don’t know how any of them will be able to lose that way. Just wait and see. One success will follow the other as everything I touch just seems to turn to gold.
I sometimes like to chill out after a long day of serving the American people by watching reruns of The Marx Brothers on TV. Don’t you just love those guys? I have learned so much from them and try to make all my cabinet level and department head selections based on their philosophy.
I would like to think that I am open minded, honest, trustworthy and polite except to those damn unpatriotic cut and runner surrender monkeys!!! What is wrong with them anyway? I just don’t get it. Can’t they understand how brilliant my strategy is? Fighting them over there so we don’t have to fight them over here. I know that is the opposite of my philosophy during Vietnam but hey, I like to keep the bad guys guessing! Pretty tricky huh? Kind of like that Niccolo Macaroni guy or that Sun Chop Suey guy. I must say that I am not too fond of that al-Maliki guy anymore, him balking at my status of forces agreement so that we can stay in Iraq forever, in fact I am thinking about what happened to that Ngo Dinh Diem guy in Vietnam. If al-Maliki doesn’t get with my program pretty damn fast and stop making me look bad! Know what I mean don’t you?
Who I’d like to meet:
…. Cool people who live close to Washington D.C. so that we can get together after work, kick back, and have a whole lot of fun while making more plans for more great nation building in the religion of peace part of the world, and maybe even in Iran, with my very best war time advisers Dick, my anointed successor John and his brain Joe.

MB4 on July 31, 2008 at 1:50 AM

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