McCain: Hey, how about a Nuremberg trial for Bin Laden?
posted at 8:33 pm on July 25, 2008 by Allahpundit
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Have we reached the circle-the-wagons stage of the campaign or can I get away with another jab at Maverick after the timetable post for him stupidly agreeing in substance with one of Obama’s stupid ideas? As atonement before we get to the critique, here’s a link to the transcript of McCain’s “audacity of hopelessness” speech to vets today in Denver, righteously laying out Barry O for his knee-jerk defeatism on the surge. There’s not much there that hasn’t been said over the past few weeks, but as a summation you can do worse.
Now, to Nuremberg:
Sen. John McCain on Friday said as president he would consider bringing Osama bin Laden to justice through a Nuremberg-like international trial.
He told CNN’s Wolf Blitzer, “We have various options. The Nuremberg Trials are certainly an example of the kind of tribunal that we could move forward with. I don’t think we’d have any difficulty in devising an international — internationally supported mechanism that would mete out justice. There’s no problem there.”
McCain said it would be a “good thing to reveal to the world the enormity of this guy’s crimes, and his intentions, which are still there.”
By all means, let us reveal this fiend’s top-secret intentions to the world. See my post from last month after Obama floated this turd of a proposal for why it’s so wrong on the merits; it makes sense politically at least in his case because he has to signal to his internationalist base that he prefers the criminal-prosecution approach to the war on terror, but what’s McCain’s excuse? Yesterday’s Rasmussen poll reminded us that Americans aren’t overly concerned about full due process when it comes to trying terrorists, and I’m reasonably sure the conservatives he’s trying to win over won’t be impressed with his concern for “international mechanisms.” Even worse, this constitutes a partial flip-flop. Via Ben Smith, remember this statement issued as a response to Obama’s Nuremberg comments?
Unfortunately, it is clear Senator Obama does not understand what happened at the Nuremburg trials and what procedures were followed. There was no habeas at Nuremburg and there should be no habeas for Osama bin Laden. Senator Obama cannot have it both ways. In one breath he endorses habeas for terrorists like 9/11 mastermind Khalid Sheikh Mohammed and in the next he denies its logical conclusion of habeas for Osama bin Laden. By citing a historical precedent that does not include habeas, he sends a signal of confusion and indecision to our allies and adversaries and the American people.
Let me be clear, under my administration Osama bin Laden will either be killed on the battlefield or executed.
It’s only a partial flip-flop because McCain’s not insisting now on habeas rights for anyone, but like Smith says, if he’s promising to kill Bin Laden one way or another, what’s the point of a trial? A show trial only plays into Osama’s hands by letting him demagogue the supposed corruption of western institutions. Just lock him away or kill him, and let the media retrospectives about 9/11 that inevitably follow take care of “revealing” his crimes to the world.
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You have and have always had the option of discontinuing your participation in this thread at any time. You hang around arguing because you like it. I like it too but I don’t get upset when people argue against me too forcefully.
aengus on July 25, 2008 at 11:39 PM
If you do not want to be made fun of stop acting so dumb and whiny and stop annoying me on what seems like every thread that both of us are on.
MB4 on July 25, 2008 at 11:39 PM
wisefoolish/dim_man onJuly 25, 2008 at 11:07 PMwhatever comment I make.Wanting to ban your so-called “trolls” puts you in good company with the likes of Stalin, Hitler, Mussolini, Castro, Mugabe, etc.
Did it ever occur to you that you might be the ultimate troll by hijacking this thread with your OT accusations about trolls?
Debate the merits of any or your comments and leave the rest up to HA.
Chimpy on July 25, 2008 at 11:40 PM
wise_man on July 25, 2008 at 11:35 PM
TheBigOldDog on July 25, 2008 at 11:40 PM
There will not be a trial for Osama. It never will be necessary.
Entelechy on July 25, 2008 at 11:44 PM
Yes, and I said:
S we’re talking about how McCain gave the wrong answer on Bin Laden. He’s said the correct thing many times over and his only fault was answering this question as asked “what do you do if he’s brought to you alive. And McCain answered hypothetically.
wise_man on July 25, 2008 at 11:45 PM
:P I’m number one! All the rest of you are number two and lower. :)
FloatingRock on July 25, 2008 at 11:45 PM
After going through hundreds of threads, you seem to have this problem a lot.
TheBigOldDog on July 25, 2008 at 11:47 PM
That’s the final straw- I formally withdraw my support for McCain ‘08.
Valiant on July 25, 2008 at 11:47 PM
No. Just read their comments,
and
they attempted to hijack this page starting out by mocking me, and then continu to do so.
wise_man on July 25, 2008 at 11:49 PM
Obama is pleased.
wise_man on July 25, 2008 at 11:49 PM
I didn’t participate in those threads because I have mixed feelings on the topic. While I don’t want another holocaust and am not racist, I DO want Europe to survive and continue being European. I think it was either TheSitRep or PRCCallDude that got banned, both of which I have similar views as me regarding national security issues, so I was disappointed to learn one of them was banned. I don’t remember which it was, though, and the other one had nothing to do with the banning.
FloatingRock on July 26, 2008 at 12:08 AM
Basic training – E1 – 2 months.
AIT – E2 – 2 months.
OCS (Field Artillery, the same one that Tommy Franks went to earlier and it is where the “handle” MB4 comes from) – E5 – 6 months
First dd214
O1 – 12 months
O2 – 12 months.
O3 – 7 months.
Second dd214
Promoted to civilian
It was no big deal. Tens of thousands did it the same way.
My OER’s where 93 and 92. Don’t know what it was in RVN, and didn’t care as I was not wanting to stay in any longer, because as soon as I got back from R and R I got a “drop” as was the norm then as the Army was coming back from RVN on an accelerated schedule.
Actually I am the Green Lantern.
Now “TheBigOldDog”, stop annoying me you smack and get back on your meds.
MB4 on July 26, 2008 at 12:20 AM
That sounds familiar although I’m not positive it’s the same thread I’m thinking of, but still, I don’t think it qualifies as evidence, at least not by itself, and also, I wouldn’t be surprised if Limerick would admit that his statement is inconclusive.
Still though, good job finding that. I’ve had a hell of a time finding specific posts here that are even a few months old.
FloatingRock on July 26, 2008 at 12:22 AM
Yeah, Lim made peace a few weeks ago.
Spirit of 1776 on July 26, 2008 at 12:30 AM
No, sorry. Unlike you, I’ve actually contributed to this thread in substantive ways, even if some may disagree with me.
FloatingRock on July 26, 2008 at 12:30 AM
Given how often people annoy you, you are the one who needs medication and a really good psychiatrist because you are one messed up individual. You spend all of your time here spamming and hijacking threads, insulting people and getting into fights. You are in serious need of professional help. I hope you are indeed a Vet so that you can check yourself into a VA and get the help you desperately need.
TheBigOldDog on July 26, 2008 at 12:32 AM
You ever heard of RIF? Happened to lots and lots of Officers in the early 1970s. There are lots of other reasons that officers leave the service earlier than ‘by the book’ generalities, and still under honorable conditions.
I was one of the first here to question his military credentials… Probably on the first day he started posting, we got into a huge argument over some war related stuff. and I thought he was faking, and said so several times.
Since then I have become pretty convinced that MB4 is/was pretty much what he says he is…. SO, MB4; I think I sort of apologized for that, later… But in case I didn’t, or you missed it, Let me take this opportunity to say I’m sorry for casting aspersions upon your military service.
Really guys, If he were faking, he wouldn’t claim having been a Field Artillery guy, for God’s Sake. He’d pick something glamorous or at least somewhat macho. ;-)
LegendHasIt on July 26, 2008 at 12:32 AM
Pardon me for a moment while I haul your slimy scaled carcass into the hull of my boat. Now where did I stash my club??? No doubt you’ll continue to flop around for a while until I find it.
FloatingRock on July 26, 2008 at 12:34 AM
Was this recent thread? If so, it’s not the one I’m thinking of at all—that one was about a year ago.
FloatingRock on July 26, 2008 at 12:37 AM
Yeah, basically said same thing Legend just did. Was recent, I don’t remember what the thread was. One the NASA ones maybe.
Spirit of 1776 on July 26, 2008 at 12:40 AM
What kind of Boat do you have? The only fish I club are Blues.
TheBigOldDog on July 26, 2008 at 12:41 AM
wise foolish/dim_man on July 25, 2008 at 11:45 PM
As usual, your reply didn’t address my point. You just basically repeated what you’ve said earlier, as if I didn’t read all the comments in this thread before I posted my $.02. Pathetic!
See second sentence above and add all caps, bold and more exclamation points to “Pathetic!”
Paranoid and unable to recognize sarcasm.
On the other hand you didn’t call for me to be banned from HA. I guess that’s a start.
Chimpy on July 26, 2008 at 12:41 AM
Dude, you posted that in the AnwR conference call thread just after noon time. How many other last straws has McCain given you today? Stuff like this just makes me smile and shake my head. McCain is being exactly what I expected him to be. I’m glad I went into this campaign loathing him; all he’s doing now is digging a tunnel under my remarkably low expectations for him. I feel sorry for the folks on the fence who want to support him; seems like every time he makes the news he’s smacking you with something else distasteful.
austinnelly on July 26, 2008 at 12:49 AM
I grew up around boats, living next to the Puget Sound, but as an adult my only boat is a JY15 sailboat. I don’t fish much as an adult and was basing my comments on a family trip to Campbell River off Vancouver Island when I was a kid. It was a bottom fish, but I don’t remember what kind. I didn’t enjoy watching my dad beat a fish with a club when I was maybe eight years old. I was used to catching Rainbow Trout at the time and keeping them in a submerged fish-cage contraption designed to keep them alive and fresh.
FloatingRock on July 26, 2008 at 12:51 AM
TheBigOldDog on July 26, 2008 at 12:32 AM
On this one you are dead wrong. Please internalize that, and let it go. You two can spar all you wish, but do not haggle over MB4’s service.
LegendHasIt on July 26, 2008 at 12:32 AM
You’re a classy and great one. Dagny is proud.
Entelechy on July 26, 2008 at 12:54 AM
I think you are quite missing the point, but that’s okay. It’s a really long thread and I don’t expect people to actually take the time to read through it before they jump in the middle and accuse people of one thing or another.
TheBigOldDog on July 26, 2008 at 12:58 AM
Thank you, Milady!
To hear such praise from the one who is the most gracious among us, and among the wisest, is praise indeed.
LegendHasIt on July 26, 2008 at 1:04 AM
TheBigOldDog on July 26, 2008 at 12:58 AM
No, TBOD, I’m not missing the point, the only one I’m making, the ridicule of anything to do with anyone’s service.
You and MB4 can duel, verbally, all you want, about anything. His service, like all others’ are taboo. His is what he said repeatedly that it is. His family has sacrificed a lot, enough to grant him to be nutty, often, if he so desires.
Attack him, please, on the issues, but not on having to take meds, as a vet. It’s often hard for me to watch two commenters I like get into such nonsensical spats. Anyway, you two can fight all night, if it pleases you.
Entelechy on July 26, 2008 at 1:15 AM
No, you did miss the point. Please show me where I ridiculed anybody’s service. I asked a question and provided the answer.
TheBigOldDog on July 26, 2008 at 1:21 AM
LegendHasIt on July 26, 2008 at 1:04 AM
Reason cannot triumph over unreason until the unreasonable perish :)
How is your mom? Do you have the Alzheimer and Parkinsons under control, as best as possible? It’s not easy but I wish you strengths and endurance. I’ve taken care of several older people and it was hard, but I live well with the way I treated them, until the end. Best always,
Entelechy on July 26, 2008 at 1:33 AM
TBOD, where you refered to the meds, and the vet status. Out and clear, and do take care,
Entelechy on July 26, 2008 at 1:34 AM
Oh you mean where I gave him back what he had just said to me. Okay I got it now. Thanks for clearing that up.
TheBigOldDog on July 26, 2008 at 1:37 AM
TBOD, it doesn’t make him more noble for doing that to you either.
“Why can’t we all just get along?” ~ ~ Obama
“I’ll be president soon, and no one will ever fight again, in the whole world” ~ ~ Obama
Entelechy on July 26, 2008 at 1:40 AM
Legend, you might get a smile out of perusing this thread, again.
Entelechy on July 26, 2008 at 1:41 AM
Yet you came after me. Got it. No problem.
TheBigOldDog on July 26, 2008 at 1:42 AM
The first set of trials ended up in some hangings. What would we get for our money this time out?
Three hots and a cot?
Mojave Mark on July 26, 2008 at 1:46 AM
TBOD, I tried to read this thread on and off, but you are right that I didn’t read every comment. Do not worry – I have gone after MB4 in the past and will do so again.
At times it’s best to just let him be. He’s not a liberal, hates the war and shamnesty, more than other issues. They are both important to the country, and apparently to him, intensely.
It might be that you’re now both mad at me, simply for trying to get both of you to be a bit more understanding of each other. Good intentions are often futile. Hoping that tomorrow will be a better day, I beg you both a good night, with the same regard as always,
Entelechy on July 26, 2008 at 1:48 AM
Only a “select” few of you annoy me. I am not the one who gets himself all upset when someone says something that I disagree with. That would be you.
No, that would be you talking about “taking me out” for just one example and wanting to ban people to the corn field who you get mad at. I’m not the humorless one who gets all mad and hysterical. That would be you.
I don’t spend all of my time here and disagreeing with you and responding to your attacks sometimes is not “spamming and hijacking” threads. Get over your Mussolini complex.
You drew “first blood”. I almost never do that. You are one of the few who gets all mad and insists on making things personal.
Because you get mad at me and completely lose your cool? Because you threaten to “take me out”? I think you have got that bass ackwards. Indeed. You are a quack.
MB4 on July 26, 2008 at 1:49 AM
Thanks for asking… Yeah, she is doing OK….. better than I am, anyway ;-)
I decided last week to up the Parkinson’s med by half a pill a day, and she has been able to feed herself with little trouble since then, without the significant degradation of mental facilities that the much higher doses were doing. Critical thinking is just slightly off with the increase, but she really doesn’t need to do much of that anyway…. And can still read and communicate fairly well…. and kick my butt in solving “Wheel of Fortune’ puzzles. (I get even playing along with Jeopardy though;-)
Seems I have found a pretty good balance for her… for the nonce, anyway
LegendHasIt on July 26, 2008 at 1:51 AM
I remember that one pretty well… was sort of a watershed moment in a couple of different ways.
LegendHasIt on July 26, 2008 at 1:54 AM
You’re back. Excellent. Shall I start posting all the people you’ve insulted and started fights with? I warn you the list is really, really long. How about all the threads you’ve hijacked going back over a year? Your call. I promise to be judicious and only run a “best of MB4 series.” How’s that sound?
TheBigOldDog on July 26, 2008 at 1:58 AM
Actually I was what was called “Voluntary Indefinite” back then and volunteered for the RIF. They sent out a letter saying that they had too many junior officers, with the big draw down from RVN, and asked for those who were not planning on staying in for 20 to say so, so that they would not RIF those who wanted to stay in for 20. I very likely could have stayed in as a lot choose to get out.
No problemo. We see so much eye-to-eye on Juan that I couldn’t be mad at you even if I wanted to be.
Actually if I were faking I would have said that I was in the medical corp. I know lots of doctor stuff. And no DogMan, sorry to disappoint you, not from care that I have received but from care that I have gotten or given for others.
MB4 on July 26, 2008 at 2:00 AM
TheBigOldDog on July 26, 2008 at 1:58 AM
Better to go to sleep and think things over.
Good night to all, and don’t take each other so seriously. The world has much bigger problems. We have it good in that all we do here is pontificate. I love you all, I really do. Please sleep on that, if it helps just a tiny bit.
Entelechy on July 26, 2008 at 2:08 AM
Goodnight, Entelechy.
Mmmmmmm…. once wise_man was filleted, battered and cooked, he’s actually quite tasty for a bottom feeder.
FloatingRock on July 26, 2008 at 2:27 AM
Goodnight, Floating Rock.
Some of the threads, or series of comments get a tad bit strange at times…
Entelechy on July 26, 2008 at 2:32 AM
No, really, you should try a bite of wise_man—he’s been thoroughly cooked. :)
FloatingRock on July 26, 2008 at 2:35 AM
A Swiss ‘extremist’ against Islamic law
One litmus test I applied to the many politicians on the European Right I’ve recently interviewed concerned their views on Israel. As supposed “extremists,” “fascists,” even “neo-Nazis,” what would they say?
I asked Freysinger where Israel fits into his worldview. “Our party has always defended Israel because we are well aware that if Israel disappears, we lose a vanguard,” he replied. “They are fighting now our fight in fact; and as long as the Muslims are concentrated on Israel, it is not so hard for us. But as soon as Israel will have disappeared, well, they will come to get the other part.”
I think by “the other part” he meant the rest of the West. In this outlook, Freysinger is by no means alone on the European Right: members of other such parties — for example, Belgium’s Vlaams Belang, the Danish People’s Party and Holland’s Freedom Party — explained to me how they find in Israel’s struggle against both Islamization and jihad common cause.
“The right-wing parties should join their forces to fight Islamization,” Freysinger said.
Good idea.
- Diana West
MB4 on July 26, 2008 at 4:40 AM
Why should I circle my wagon with a train that left without me years ago?
spmat on July 26, 2008 at 9:43 AM
All of you who swore that McCain was the one candidate who could win this thing, are you sorry yet?
McCain is a weasel. He’ll embrace any position you have on the table, if he thinks the Press will shine the light of love upon him.
OK, for the sake of argument, we set up a sort of international military trial. Wait, we have military trials, and McCain denounced them and the site holding them. Damn, now where could we hold those trials since Gitmo is right out.
I know, lets have peace talks in Paris with Al Q. I’m waiting for McCain to propose that next.
Kind of interesting though, in what, two months McCain has gone from a hundred years, to sixteen months. Before this election is over, McCain will be swearing that if elected, he’ll be ready to order the troops home in sixteen days in an effort to maneuver himself to the left of Obama.
Snake307 on July 26, 2008 at 12:44 PM
hey wise_man, you see this??
give you three guesses who its directed at!! your pitiful attempts at censorship have been noticed!
chasdal on July 26, 2008 at 2:36 PM
Hmmm. Trial by Jury. I can see 12 earnest Hot Heads sitting around with instructions to debate the evidence and render a verdict, and instead, arguing and screaming with each other.
At least somebody ordered a fish dinner. Somebody toss the tartar sauce!
RushBaby on July 26, 2008 at 2:59 PM
I believe Osama should get a fair trial…followed by a first-class hanging.
packsoldier on July 26, 2008 at 3:05 PM
Heh, maybe. But even the nicest kid needs to know how to stand up to the bully on the playground.
Spirit of 1776 on July 26, 2008 at 3:09 PM
Nice kids. Yeah, even this motley bunch has a few of those!
RushBaby on July 26, 2008 at 3:36 PM
Pull up a chair; plenty of left-overs.
FloatingRock on July 26, 2008 at 4:14 PM
Internationally supported mechanism????
So if the rest of world thinks that it is funny that Bin Laden attacked us, we will go along with it?
Bin Laden needs an all-American .45ACP to the head, and a burial in a nice soft bed of pork rinds.
And if the rest of the world doesn’t like it, they can go to New Orleans (hell is underrated).
Spartacus on July 26, 2008 at 6:12 PM
Try him posthumously?
Johan Klaus on July 26, 2008 at 6:38 PM
No need to deprive the ants of sustenance.
Entelechy on July 26, 2008 at 6:43 PM
Buzzards gotta eat, same as worms.
FloatingRock on July 26, 2008 at 7:19 PM
mccain IRKS me with his STUPID pandering to the left.
he is just plain effin WRONG about this.
here’s why:
any trial that europe would agree to would NOT have a death penalty.
IF YOU THINK OBAMA DESERVES ONE THEN YOU CANNOT SEEK EURO APPROVAL FOR ANY JUDICIAL PROCESS WHICH MIGHT USE THE DEATH PENALTY FOR PUNISHMENT.
and punishment less than death is another CRIME.
therefore; anyone who advocates a world forum for trying binladen is an ass.
reliapundit on July 26, 2008 at 7:20 PM
McCain’s a fool if he thinks capture is an option vis-a-vis Bin Laden. It’s not. If he gets grabbed and put in a prison, anywhere in the world, AQ’s will start grabbing westerners left and right and sawing their heads off and posting it on YouTube in the hopes that, if enough western civs are kidnapped, tortured, murdered, and the process is displayed to the world, The West will fold faster than Superman on laundry day. (With good reason, considering the lack of testicular fortitude on this side of the battle it’s a distinct possibility.)
You don’t capture OBL. You snap him the first chance you get. Whether it’s a JDAM dropped from a Raptor, a Tommahawk fired from a Virginia class sub, a Predator launched Hellfire, or a good old fashioned Special Forces A-Team hit-and-run ambush, the only realistic endgame for this cretin is to kill him.
SuperCool on July 26, 2008 at 8:47 PM
“I don’t think we’d have any difficulty in devising an … internationally supported mechanism.”
Global Bro is smiling. Juan is his friend.
Christine on July 26, 2008 at 11:18 PM
McCain is an incompetent idiot and should not be our candidate. His campaign is laughable just like Bush the elder against Clinton. The RNC and the GOP are in a shambles and have put our country at severe risk. The future is grim with a liberal in the White House and a liberal House and Senate. I cannot fathom the cabinet Obama will put together. God help us, God help us…….
ultracon on July 26, 2008 at 11:49 PM
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