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Is Obama a socialist?

posted at 11:44 am on July 20, 2008 by Ed Morrissey
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This seems to be the question of the weekend, with e-mails a-plenty arriving with links to Jim Geraghty, Worldwide Standard, and the Kansas City Star.  About the best that can be said was said, in fact, by John McCain: ““I don’t know. All I know is his voting record, and that’s what people usually judge their elected representatives by.”  His other statement, that Obama’s voting record is “more to the left than the announced socialist in the United States Senate, Bernie Sanders of Vermont,” is unfortunately not terribly accurate.

National Journal made headlines earlier by declaring Barack Obama the most liberal Senator in 2007 — the basis for McCain’s claim. However, that calculation came from a limited number of bills considered by NJ, 99 in total, a significant sample but not comprehensive. Further, as NJ states, they picked their sample specifically to find differences between the candidates, not for overall voting patterns.

Instead, look at the Poole reports. Dr. Keith Poole compiles an index of roll-call votes for the House and Senate that have better than 0.5% opposition in each year, which in the Senate only excludes unanimous votes. In 2007, the sample was 388 votes, far larger than NJ’s 99. The index shows how often each member votes with their own party as a measure of partisan and ideological leaning. For 2007, that put Barack Obama as the 11th most liberal Senator, well behind Sanders at 3rd. (Russ Feingold and Chris Dodd finished 1-2.) That actually makes him more liberal in the 110th than he was in his freshman session in the 109th, where he finished 21st, much closer to the center of his caucus.

In 2007, McCain was the eighth-most conservative Senator, and in 2005-6, he was the second most conservative Senator, behind only Jon Kyl.

John McCormack then quotes this passage from Obama’s memoir, Dreams from My Father, in which Obama the college student attends socialist rallies:

In search of some inspiration, I went to hear Kwame Toure, formerly Stokely Carmichael of SNCC and Black Power fame, speak at Columbia. At the entrance to the auditorium, two women, one black, one Asian, were selling Marxist literature and arguing with each other about Trotsky’s place in history. Inside, Toure was proposing a program to establish ties between Africa and Harlem that would circumvent white capitalist imperialism. At the end of his remarks, a thin young woman with glasses asked if such a program was practical given the state of African economies and the immediate needs facing black Americans. Toure cut her off midsentence. “It’s only the brainwashing that you’ve received that makes it impractical, sister,” he said. His eyes glowed inward as he spoke, the eyes of a madman or a saint. The woman remained standing for several minutes while she was upbraided for her bourgeois attitudes. People began to file out. Outside the auditorium, the two Marxists were now shouting at the top of their lungs.

“Stalinist pig!”

“Reformist bitch!”

It was like a bad dream. I wandered down Broadway, imagining myself standing on the edge of the Lincoln Memorial and looking out over an empty pavilion, debris scattering in the wind. The movement had died years ago, shattered into a thousand fragments. Every path to change was well-trodden, every strategy exhausted. And with each defeat, even those with the best intentions could end up further and further removed from the struggles of those they purported to serve.

McCormack interprets this as Obama wanting to bring unity to the socialist movement, but that’s a real stretch. On its face, the passage acknowledges the death of the movemen; in tone, it resounds with exasperation.  Maybe Obama pined for its renewal, but this passage doesn’t do anything to prove that.  College students attend lots of rallies and say pretty stupid things, but life experience usually wrings the silliness out of them.  If we have to go back this far to find “proof” of Obama’s socialism, than I’d say the effort has already proven itself worthless.

However, that’s not to say that Obama doesn’t believe in the Leftist principles of top-down statist control and redistributionism.  One only need to consider his policies on capital-gains taxes, new federal spending, and massive expansion of regulatory and bureaucratic management to understand that much about him.  Obama may not be a Bernie Sanders Socialist, but his proposals rely heavily on the same philosophy.  Rather than concern ourselves about a couple of college rallies, let’s focus on Barack Obama’s current rallies and the policies he declares at them.  That’s enough.


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Comment pages: 1 2

Obama is a MARXIST. He votes for a Socialist agenda but he is a Marxist.

Dangerous times ahead if he gets elected in November for All Americans.

old trooper on July 20, 2008 at 11:50 AM

Obama is a Marxist.

Nahanni on July 20, 2008 at 11:52 AM

Does he think it is the role of the gov’t to take resources from people, according to their ability to provide, and give those resources to other people, according to their need? Sure looks that way to me.

trubble on July 20, 2008 at 11:54 AM

Why are we even asking this question?
He is much more a socialist than he is an African-American, in any case.

His tax plans are the most socialistic ones proposed by a Presidential candidate in many decades.

Of course he is a socialist, by any standard, and we should beat that drum over and over again until many of the MSM-deluded dipshits who are willing to turn our nation over to him become aware of that horrific fact.

TexasJew on July 20, 2008 at 11:54 AM

I’m really tired of looking at this Marxist’s goofy a$$ mug. Seriously. I want to slap his punk a$$ everytime I look at him.

Jungliszt on July 20, 2008 at 11:56 AM

If you are going to ask and answer your own question….

:)

Although I believe that Obama is a MARXIST.

CrimsonFisted on July 20, 2008 at 12:01 PM

Is Obama a socialist?

Hillary Clinton’s a socialist…
But Barack Hussein Obama’s background connections indicate him being a Marxist. He has a pathetic, liberal, leftist legislative voting record.

byteshredder on July 20, 2008 at 12:03 PM

Just take Obama’s positions and statements. Extrapolate those out to consequences and you wind up with some concerning potential: http://www.doomedreport.com what the news would be like under an Obama Administration. Its pretty darn concerning, if you have any feeling for individual liberty at all.

ilitigant on July 20, 2008 at 12:04 PM

Barack Obama is a Harvard socialist.

indythinker on July 20, 2008 at 12:04 PM

I see Obama as a opportunist with Marxist tendencies.

OldPhart on July 20, 2008 at 12:06 PM

He is an elitist of some stripe or another, hopefully (for all our sakes) not an authoritarian one.

easy on July 20, 2008 at 12:09 PM

Let’s see:

In search of some inspiration, I went to hear Kwame Toure, formerly Stokely Carmichael of SNCC and Black Power fame, speak at Columbia.

Bambi wanted inspiration. So he went to listen to a guy who wanted to circumvent eeeevil capitalist imperialism:

was proposing a program to establish ties between Africa and Harlem that would circumvent white capitalist imperialism.

The conflict between the two Marxists

was like a bad dream.

Erm. Was it like a bad dream because he was happy the Marxists weren’t united?

And this:

The movement had died years ago, shattered into a thousand fragments. Every path to change was well-trodden, every strategy exhausted.

That’s not regret. That’s joy. It’s celebration. No way anybody in their right mind could think that Bambi regretted the death of the movement and might want to bring unity to it.

And with each defeat, even those with the best intentions could end up further and further removed from the struggles of those they purported to serve.

That’s Bambi dancing on the graves of the socialists. I’m sorry, “those with the best intentions.”

What do you want, Ed? “Hi, I’m Bambi, and I’m a socialist.”

misterpeasea on July 20, 2008 at 12:10 PM

Rather than concern ourselves about a couple of college rallies, let’s focus on Barack Obama’s current rallies and the policies he declares at them. That’s enough.

Once again, you nailed it, Ed.

Troy Rasmussen on July 20, 2008 at 12:11 PM

It’s a matter of semantics and a matter of degrees. Sticking a label on him is not as important as establishing that he most definitely is in favor of wealth redistribution and intrusive government and all the amenities they entail. Terms like Marxist and socialist have little meaning for voters born since 1980. These voters can, however, understand attacks on their finances and freedoms.

whitetop on July 20, 2008 at 12:25 PM

is he a democrat?

then he’s a socialist.

dems want to nationalize healthcare.
their biggest support comes from tax-takers seiu and afscme.
they want a larger govt role in markets, not smaller.

obama = dem = socialist.

AND DON’T ACCUSE ME OF EXAGGERTATING!!!!!

one of the many things i LOVE about europe is that over there their lefties call themselves what they really are:

roayl ran as a SOCIALIST, ditto zapatero. blair was “labour” which is socialist. and so on.

in the usa socialist is a dirty words, so lefties call themselves democrats.

if they were honest, then they’d change their name and drop the donkey and adopt the dove.

that’s who they really are.

reliapundit on July 20, 2008 at 12:29 PM

Representative Maxine Waters (D-CA) said this year that it was her intention to socialize the oil industry.

Now, I understand you can’t infer Obama’s stand from Maxine’s, they’re entitled to their separate opinions. All I want to do here is to establish that confiscatory socialism is not a relic of the past. It’s alive and well, and it’s starting to evolve beyond the whisper-stage in the democrat party. Obama knows this, and I would be very curious what he thinks about it.

I’m willing to be proven wrong, but I personally think we have a problem here.

jeff_from_mpls on July 20, 2008 at 12:30 PM

My opinion: I am concerned that we see evidence of potential megalomania. In that context, I believe he will be whatever he has to be to attain power: capitalist, Marxist, socialist, whatever. All said and done, I think history will categorize him as an Obama-ist. That’s my opinion.

shaken on July 20, 2008 at 12:35 PM

Without a definition of “socialist” and the list of criteria used to make the identification, the question is meaningless. Observe that some on this forum make a (very narrow, at best) distinction between Marxist and Socialist. (A Marxist is a type of Socialist, as was Marx.)

JDPerren on July 20, 2008 at 12:36 PM

Obama is a Communist…he moved that ‘one-step’ long ago, i.e. “Socialism is one-step from Communism.” Some say, that Socialism is the stage between Capitalism and Communism; however, both Communism and Socialism are about empowering the “State” or government, over the Individual.

Obama’s dad was a communist (under the guise of a “Soviet” socialist), his mother and maternal grandparents were communists (they may have never openly admitted it, but the connections to it are clear), his childhood mentor – Frank Marshall Davis – was the communist (brought in to mentor Obama by his grandfather), and Bill Ayers was/is a well-connected communist (“Maoist” if I recall correctly).

Obama’s – A New Era of Service – speech was a dead giveaway, IMO.

Karmi on July 20, 2008 at 12:42 PM

My parents left Cuba and my father who was a political prisoner there along with his brother specifically remember Fidel stating, “I am for change and I am change” to the glee of the drones that believe in his leftist garbage.
Doesn’t that sound familiar?

jencab on July 20, 2008 at 12:42 PM

Captain, I believe this question was asked and answered. But he is more than just a socialist. He is a full fledged marxist. He makes an old economics professor of mine look conservative.

Mooseman on July 20, 2008 at 12:44 PM

whitetop on July 20, 2008 at 12:25 PM

Yep. Similar to the shouting matches here as to which poster is really a true conservative and which is a dreaded RINO, due to a position on a certain issue. People don’t fit into neat cubbyholes with labels but they do demonstrate tendencies.

a capella on July 20, 2008 at 12:44 PM

Terming everything economically to the left of Milton Friedman as “socialist” is seriously beginning to dilute the meaning of the word.

AJB on July 20, 2008 at 12:49 PM

His other statement, that Obama’s voting record is “more to the left than the announced socialist in the United States Senate, Bernie Sanders of Vermont,” is unfortunately not terribly accurate.

Accuracy? Who cares about accuracy. That’s so 1980s. He’s a Marxist, doncha see? At least according to a preponderance of clueless commenters on this thread.

Grow Fins on July 20, 2008 at 12:52 PM

When Obama had just started out running for President nearly two years ago, one of his former colleagues from the Illinois Senate had this to say:

“Nice guy, but he had a voting record to the Left of Mao Tse Tung.” — Fmr. IL State Senator Steve Rauschenberg

It’s not just Obama’s current record in the Senate that is Neo-Marxist, it’s his past record in Illinois that’s even worse.

ericdondero on July 20, 2008 at 12:53 PM

…John McCain: ““I don’t know. All I know is his voting record, and that’s what people usually judge their elected representatives by.”

Funny that McCain would bring up voting records.

Zorro on July 20, 2008 at 12:58 PM

I’m not sure pointing out yet another “Senior Moment” on McCain’s part was worth the lame attack on Obama.

Slow news day?

alphie on July 20, 2008 at 12:58 PM

National Journal made headlines earlier by declaring Barack Obama the most liberal Senator in 2007 — the basis for McCain’s claim. However, that calculation came from a limited number of bills considered by NJ, 99 in total, a significant sample but not comprehensive. Further, as NJ states, they picked their sample specifically to find differences between the candidates, not for overall voting patterns.

Well thank God you helped debunk that, Ed. That myth could’ve really hurt us in November.

In 2007, McCain was the eighth-most conservative Senator, and in 2005-6, he was the second most conservative Senator, behind only Jon Kyl.

Impossible. I’m constantly told that he’s a liberal, if not a socialist himself.

amerpundit on July 20, 2008 at 12:59 PM

Gee Ed, your headline should have used an exclamation point, not a question mark.

Maxx on July 20, 2008 at 12:59 PM

Terms like Marxist and socialist have little meaning for voters born since 1980. These voters can, however, understand attacks on their finances and freedoms.

whitetop on July 20, 2008 at 12:25 PM

I agree. McCain’s people need to be explaining to voters that Obama wants to take more money away from the people who work and earn and save, so that he can give more money to the people who don’t.

It doesn’t matter what label you put on it, it’s unfair and un-American. Voters will understand that — even voters who don’t have a clue what Socialism and Marxism are.

AZCoyote on July 20, 2008 at 1:00 PM

so·cial·ism
a theory or system of social organization that advocates the vesting of the ownership and control of the means of production and distribution, of capital, land, etc., in the community as a whole.

Could someone point out where Obama advocates putting the “means of production” into the hands of the state? At most, you could call him a welfare statist. But I don’t see where he advocates socialism.

AJB on July 20, 2008 at 1:01 PM

I am not sure how to define his social/economic approach to things. But he has an extreme arrogance about him and lacks a sense of humour. He fits in well with the Pelosi and Gore crowd of angry souls. I CAN say that he constantly is speaking about changing America, doing this, doing that. Creating a civilian corp of drafted youth. Creating a militia, independent of the military and equally funded (shades of Mugabe). Maybe the term Fascist would apply. The negotiations he has gone through for his visit to Germany makes me think he has an affection at some level for Hitler. I guess we will know if after his election he holds a Rose Garden news conference and shows off the new Youth Corp uniforms. Brown shirts, red scarves, maybe little berets.

JonRoss on July 20, 2008 at 1:02 PM

I’m not sure pointing out yet another “Senior Moment” on McCain’s part was worth the lame attack on Obama.

alphie on July 20, 2008 at 12:58 PM

It wasn’t a senior moment. Many, many people are misinterpreting what the survey said. If that survey were accurate, Obama would be to the left of Sanders.

By the way, keep up the attacks on McCain’s age. That worked wonderfully against Reagan. Here’s a hint: The under-30 crowd isn’t the most reliable voting block.

amerpundit on July 20, 2008 at 1:02 PM

Obambi is a Marxists, in the tradition of Karl Marx. Just not as good as people like Hillary in camouflaging the real goal. Obambi may support socialism around the edges, but his inherent tendency towards things like an ‘internal security force’ with the strength of the army says a lot about what he really believes. As he inherently knows, no Marxist system can exist with overt oppression by force.

And you sure can’t have radio show hosts and bloggers spouting off every day about what you are up to.

Examine his friends, his associates, his church, his Illinois record, even his books, you get your clues there.

tarpon on July 20, 2008 at 1:04 PM

The guy wants to expand pretty much every government program and is going to have to tax the hell out of us to do it. Close enough for me.

WisCon on July 20, 2008 at 1:05 PM

..Just not as good as people like Hillary in camouflaging the real goal.
tarpon on July 20, 2008 at 1:04 PM

Hillary’s – It Takes a Village

She focuses on the impact individuals and groups outside the family have, for better or worse, on a child’s well-being, and advocates for a society which meets all of a child’s needs.

Karmi on July 20, 2008 at 1:11 PM

Is Obama a socialist?

He can’t be much more of a socialist than much of the “capitalist” financial “houses” in this country have become. When their gambling doesn’t pay off and they want a taxpayer funded bailout it’s, “We’re all socialists now”.

MB4 on July 20, 2008 at 1:12 PM

Like the right has found a line of attack that works on Obama, Amer.

The anger management school dropouts of the right are less reliable voters than the under 30 crowd.

Why not try some lame flip flop attack ads?

*yawn*

Back to bumpkinville after November.

alphie on July 20, 2008 at 1:12 PM

I agree with the poster above who said it was more a case of meglomania than anything else. I don’t think he is a marxist or socialist…he is an leftist, cluelessist and an opportunist.

HawaiiLwyr on July 20, 2008 at 1:14 PM

Terming everything economically to the left of Milton Friedman as “socialist” is seriously beginning to dilute the meaning of the word.

AJB on July 20, 2008 at 12:49 PM

I’m not concerned about properly identifying the taxonomic variants what is ultimately a toxic feature common to them all: coercive utopianism.

As the German resistance posters put it, during the 30s, referring to the choice between Nazi Socialism vs Stalin’s Communism, “Spuds or Potatoes?”

This isn’t about definitions, it’s a gut check, in which we ask if Obama’s thinking is at home in a family resemblance sort of way among coercive utopian ideologies that were found to be very destructive in the 20th century.

jeff_from_mpls on July 20, 2008 at 1:14 PM

Ed, do some research to discover Obama’s core values. I’m sure he has some, I just don’t know what they are. For me, Bill Clinton was most interested in the value of education and civil rights, values formed while growing up in Hot Springs, in a biracial community where education was the way up and out. Obama’s character was forged as a community organizer in South Side Chicago, getting the government to help poor blacks who typically saw themselves as cogs in the wheel of humanity subject to the whims of the Man. If Obama sees himself as the vehicle to lift people up materially, then he’s going to be another LBJ. Healing the earth, giving people jobs, health care for everyone — these are his words. That sounds pretty socialistic to me. Maybe his idealism will be tempered by experience after 4 years as prez. That still means 4 years of bad policy. He’s so green. And yes, probably pink inside. No wonder he’s so conflicted about his racial identity.

Paul-Cincy on July 20, 2008 at 1:17 PM

No, he’s a Marxist.

johnsteele on July 20, 2008 at 1:22 PM

Socialist- Check
Communist-Check
Marxist-Check

The media in this country obviously want communism, with the way they are shilling for this empty suit/Soro’s sock puppet………Will 2008 become the year the United States became Communist? Pretty scary….Where can I move to???

adamsmith on July 20, 2008 at 1:24 PM

Obama is not a strong personality, he’s a non-threatening one (unlike his wife or his former minister), which is the only way he could get elected, and why Democrats and the big media are orgasming over the idea of his candidacy and possible election.

But unless he’s a master at hiding his true personna, a personality like that as president is very likely to get rolled by the more forceful people within his inner circle, at least at the very outset of an Obama Administration. So like Bill Clinton, who was pushed to the left by his wife, along with Howard Wolfson and others in 1993, I would expect a pretty sharp lurch in that same direction in the opening days of an Obama presidency, because that’s where the most forceful people within his inner circle are. And even if the results begin to show a 2010 backlash similar to 1994, I would expect several decks of race cards to be tossed at those opposed to Barack’s policies by his supporters (who might actually be more enthusiastic about the president’s plans than Obama himself, since as of now he’s never shown a desire to take a forceful stand on any controversial issue).

jon1979 on July 20, 2008 at 1:25 PM

alphie on July 20, 2008 at 1:12 PM

The last person to come to power on a such a tide of hysteria with such a total lack of bona fides of any type in this hemisphere was Fidel Castro. I am sure you get a warm and fuzzy feeling when his name is mentioned.

JonRoss on July 20, 2008 at 1:25 PM

He’s a Gramscian Marxist, to be more precise. He opposes the hegemony and supports revolution by political evolution. The goal is to give strength to “oppressed” minority groups by banding them together until they outnumber the erstwhile majority that oppresses them. Then they can impose a socialistic system that supposedly gives all groups the opportunities that were once reserved for the dominant group alone. It sounds so benevolent and good, doesn’t it? Too bad it’s completely unrealistic and ignores the formation of a new fascistic hegemony.

I have gleaned that this is Obama’s worldview from rhetorical analysis of statements he’s made, how he votes, and passages from his books. There is ample evidence to support this conclusion.

aero on July 20, 2008 at 1:27 PM

“Is Obama a socialist?”

This IS a joke, right? The real question is ‘is Obama a Marxist’. He passed socialist years ago.

JIMV on July 20, 2008 at 1:28 PM

Marxist: the political, economic, and social principles and policies advocated by Marx; especially : a theory and practice of socialism including the labor theory of value, dialectical materialism, the class struggle, and dictatorship of the proletariat until the establishment of a classless society.

Marxist/socialist, just different words for the same thing.

Socialism: any of various economic and political theories advocating collective or governmental ownership and administration of the means of production and distribution of goods2 a: a system of society or group living in which there is no private property b: a system or condition of society in which the means of production are owned and controlled by the state3: a stage of society in Marxist theory transitional between capitalism and communism and distinguished by unequal distribution of goods and pay according to work done.

Here is what the RIGHT believes in, in American politics.

Short List of what American conservatives believe in:

1. Lower taxes
2. Freedom of speech & religion
3. Small government, strong National defense
4. Free enterprise
5. Sovereign borders
6. Strong property owner rights
7. And of course Right to Bear Arms.

Socialist/communist/fascist/Nazis and Marxist are all just about the same. They are leftist in American politics.

What socialist/communist/fascist/Nazis/Marxist believe in:

01: High progressive taxes
02: Big government and government control of all business
03: Abolishment of property rights
04: Abolishment of all public (and eventually private) expressions of religion
05: Abolishment of free speech
06: Abolishment of gun rights
07: Abolishment of the traditional family
09: No God (government is god)
10: Appeasement of American enemies
11: Special Rights for groups they favor, rather than rights for all
12: Promotion of Globalism, destruction of National sovereignty

I could go on, but these are some of the main points. Democrats have the same goals as socialist/communist/fascist/Nazis/Marxist which are all basically the same thing, just change the uniform. They are all totalitarian in nature, that is the common thread. They all abhor religion and private property rights. They all abhor freedom and free enterprise. And Democrats are exposing themselves more and more as blatant totalitarians and haters of freedom and of the Republic everyday. And they are becoming much more bold about it. Yes, Obama is a Marxist/socialist.

/yawn

Maxx on July 20, 2008 at 1:29 PM

Could someone point out where Obama advocates putting the “means of production” into the hands of the state?
AJB on July 20, 2008 at 1:01 PM

I’m sure he’s rearticularated several times since then, but I heard the Obamessiah say (approximately) “There is only one direction in which we can move, and that is single-payer health care.” With that, the gubmunt will determine what will be paid for, how much of what, and how much money will be paid for it. Although that is distribution, it’s effective control of production. “Sure, you can produce it- but we’ll only pay you 8 cents for it. And, I haven’t heard BHO condemn Maxine Waters: Oil-igarch.

eeyore on July 20, 2008 at 1:29 PM

At least you’ve accepted that Obama is going to win, Jon.

As for Obama’s qualifications, he meets all the Constitutional requirements….and he ain’t a Bush or a Clinton.

Good enough for me.

alphie on July 20, 2008 at 1:31 PM

He’s a marxist and he plans to use his brownshirt thugs to enforce his ideology on the proletariat, but not himself or his elite friends. Their lives of wealth and comfort will continue, you know, the way it worked in the former soviet union and NAZI germany.

dogsoldier on July 20, 2008 at 1:33 PM

As for Obama’s qualifications, he meets all the Constitutional requirements….and he ain’t a Bush or a Clinton.

Good enough for me.

alphie on July 20, 2008 at 1:31 PM

Cool! Then you would vote for me if I were running! I’m a suburban housewife in Texas with no political experience whatsoever, but I’m over 35 and a natural-born citizen. I am neither a Bush nor a Clinton, so I’m at least as deserving of your vote as Obama. You’re a generous person, alphie!

By the way, McCain is “good enough for you,” too, by your own declared standards.

aero on July 20, 2008 at 1:34 PM

As for Obama’s qualifications, he meets all the Constitutional requirements….and he ain’t a Bush or a Clinton.

Good enough for me.

alphie on July 20, 2008 at 1:31 PM

My god. An Obamist that believes the U.S. Constitution is operative somehow. Keep that up and you will find yourself working the sugarcane fields outside Havana come the spring of 2009.

JonRoss on July 20, 2008 at 1:38 PM

As for Obama’s qualifications, he meets all the Constitutional requirements….and he ain’t a Bush or a Clinton.

Good enough for me.

alphie on July 20, 2008 at 1:31 PM

You know who else met Constitutional requirements and wasn’t a Bush or Clinton? Jimmy Carter. Worked out fabulously as president.

Why not try some lame flip flop attack ads?

alphie on July 20, 2008 at 1:12 PM

The flip-flop attack worked on Kerry. The age attack didn’t work against Reagan. You can decide not to flip-flop. You can’t decide to be a certain age.

Funny thing is, much of the left thinks Obama’s flip-flopped, too. Remember FISA?

amerpundit on July 20, 2008 at 1:44 PM

Sorry, aero…

McCain has suckled at the government teat his entire life…I’m afraid he may be…a Socialist.

No vote for him.

Amer…are you comparing John McCain to Ronald Reagan?

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!

alphie on July 20, 2008 at 1:48 PM

Amer…are you comparing John McCain to Ronald Reagan?

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!

alphie on July 20, 2008 at 1:48 PM

No? I’m comparing the success of lines of attack. Age attacks tend to not work. Flip-flop attacks do. People know damn well you can’t do anything about your age. But they do know you can do something about flip-flops.

And again, even much of the left acknowledges Obama’s flip-flopped.

amerpundit on July 20, 2008 at 1:49 PM

I hope the Democrats take the time to help McCain this much.

TheBigOldDog on July 20, 2008 at 1:51 PM

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!

alphie on July 20, 2008 at 1:48 PM

This pretty much tells us what we need to know, don’t ya think ?

JonRoss on July 20, 2008 at 1:51 PM

Accuracy? Who cares about accuracy. That’s so 1980s. He’s a Marxist, doncha see? At least according to a preponderance of clueless commenters on this thread.

Grow Fins on July 20, 2008 at 12:52 PM

Why don’t you demonstrate why this

aero on July 20, 2008 at 1:27 PM

is wrong?

a capella on July 20, 2008 at 1:57 PM

B.O. is a Socialist.

Tomorrow he will be a Marxist.

The day after, he’ll be a Stalinist.

Next day, he’ll be a Capitalist.

After that, depends on which way the wind is blowing.

Remember, we are talking about B.O. here.

pilamaye on July 20, 2008 at 2:02 PM

Iran bombs Israel. President Obama: “I, uh, this event which occurred today in Israel (pauses 10 seconds and looks at the floor), is, uh, it’s against the … vision the United States has promoted for a, uh, peaceful middle east, and is against everything I believe and stand for. Let me be clear on this. We will work with our allies to use aggressive diplomacy to, uh … ensure this action will be condemned, in the strongest possible terms.”

Paul-Cincy on July 20, 2008 at 2:05 PM

Obama admitting during a debate this spring that raising captital gains taxes would ultimately lower government revenue but said it should be done anyway because it would be fair, tells me all I need to know about his economic beliefs.

KW64 on July 20, 2008 at 2:06 PM

Capt: sorry, on this one you just have not been paying attention! I understand McCain & and his campaign not having a clue; McCain is addelpated and his campaign is incompetent!

Barack HUSSEIN Obama (PBUH)(SAW)(SAW) is a Marxist/Socialist/Communist Muslim, who is practicing “Taqiyah“.
Just read here, and here!

Even the Chicago Tribune admits his family has the Communist/Socialist background, as well as Obama being a Liar.

How about his proven ties to Anti-American/Anti-Semitic Radical Arabs & Muslims? Will you ever see stories like this about Obama, in the MSM?

How about the women in his life, who HATE America, including his wife and his mother?

Read not only this article, but ALL the sources that he links too: Obama and his campaign, have Lied continually about his family’s Muslim past; his own Muslim upbringing and ties, etc.

Read this indepth article and research about what his father was REALLY like, a hardcore Communist and he is the person that Obama seeks to emulate!

In addition, there’s a very good chance, despite people saying they’ve seen the “divorce” papers, that Obama’s parents weren’t even married, a fact his WIFE just admitted several days ago:

Heck, even the title of his book is an exercise in “Taqiyah”

Need more proof; read this article and the links to AP reports, for gosh’s sake:

How about more about his ties to radical, Anti-American/Anti-Semitic Palestinians and Arabs:

Do you need more proof, of this ties to radical Shiites from Iran ?

How about a closer examination of what was really going on, inside his “church”, and more about his radical Palestinian ties?

How about the radical Anti-American/Anti-White “Black Liberation Theology” that he followed for 20 years, by a James Cone, BLT, etc.; well here’s some more.

Make no mistake, “Black Liberation Theology”; aside from being Anti-American, Anti-White, Anti-Semitic, it IS a Marxist based “theology“! And there is no doubt about it, Obama was a subscriber for TWENTY years, in the Trinity “Church” in Chicago.

Check out the blatant lies he tells about his background, already debunked by many articles above.

More myths about his background debunked.

PROOF he practiced Islam, at a minimum, when he was young.

Since he’s a liar and a fraud, can you trust his judgement??

Icing on the cake.

How about a teenaged Obama’s Anti-American/Anit-Semitic/Anti-White Black Communist Mentor, Frank Marshall Davis.

How about his own Childhood friends saying he was “quite religious” in Islam?

How about the FACTS that his Grandfather was a Communist Sympathizer, moved his family to Washington State so his daugher (Obama’s mother) could study as a Communist High School; the family could join a Communist “Church”, and then moved them to Hawaii again, so he could hang out with the local Communist party, headed by Frank Marshall Davis, and have him mentor a young Barack Obama:???

And this is Midwest/Kansas “family values”???

Ever wonder about the multitude of ties betwween Louis Farrakhan, “Reverend” Jeremiah Wright, the Nation of Islam, the Trinity Chuch, Barack Obama, Black Liberation Theology, the trip by Farrakhan & Wright to Libya to meet Muamar Ghadhaffi, the why’s and wherefores of all that tying into “Black Liberation Theology”, the NOI/Farrakhan’s fascination with Ghadhaffi, and how it all ties into Barack Obama???

Then, read this Direct Quote from Ghadhaffi’s “Little Green Book”, about “Black People”!

Does it all make sense now? Does it all start to tie in together now?

I’ve been researching, following (as in career, not physically), watching, and studying this man, Barack HUSSEIN Obama, for 4 years now.

I am now 50 years old.

I have NEVER, in my entire life, seen such a fraud, liar, deceptive, empty-suited and most important DANGERIOUS “Politician” in my Lifetime!

This man, scares the living crap out of me!

If he is elected President of the United States; it will make Jimmy Carter and Bill Clinton look like Chuchill and Ronald Reagen!

I challenge any of you, to read all the source material I’ve put above, and which I’ve been gathering for three years, and tell me I’m wrong?

Let me say it again: Marxist, Muslim, and “Taqiyah”

Dale in Atlanta on July 20, 2008 at 2:10 PM

Ding. Ding! DING!!

We have a winner.

Maxx on July 20, 2008 at 1:29 PM Pay particular attention to the obamanator’s “Theology of Liberation” rhetoric for these marxist intonations.

BTW: the KC (red) Star link doesn’t work, unless one truncates it.

Good post. Thanx.

locomotivebreath1901 on July 20, 2008 at 2:11 PM

KW64 on July 20, 2008 at 2:06 PM

Obama admitting during a debate this spring that raising captital gains taxes would ultimately lower government revenue but said it should be done anyway because it would be fair, tells me all I need to know about his economic beliefs.

That’s exactly right. Charlie Gibson said that in a question to Obama, for which he was excoriated by the left. And Obama didn’t dispute the premise of Gibson question, which he certainly could have. Instead he said, let’s do what’s fair. Fairness in place of prosperity. Everyone gets to be equally poor. That’s socialism in a nutshell.

Paul-Cincy on July 20, 2008 at 2:11 PM

The only reason Obama is not known to be socialist is that he is such a good prevaricator.

More and more real democrats are moving away from the party to become independents. What will be left in the party will be socialists and the terminally clueless.

Mark Levin believes O. is a Marxist, but I have to assume that if O. is, he is unaware of it because he (ahem) doesn’t seem to have studied much history!

redneck hippie on July 20, 2008 at 2:14 PM

I wandered down Broadway, imagining myself standing on the edge of the Lincoln Memorial and looking out over an empty pavilion, debris scattering in the wind.

What the hell is Barry babbling about? There is no Lincoln Memorial in New York City.

If we have to go back this far to find “proof” of Obama’s socialism, than I’d say the effort has already proven itself worthless.

Is this “proof” in and of itself? No, but we certainly can look at the preponderance of the evidence, and his past statements (and past relationships) are a part and parcel of what can and should be evaluated in the court of public opinion.

Indeed, if anyone has any exculpatory evidence that he has evolved into a free-market Capitalist over the years, I’d love to see it.

Buy Danish on July 20, 2008 at 2:15 PM

Obama admitting during a debate this spring that raising captital gains taxes would ultimately lower government revenue but said it should be done anyway because it would be fair, tells me all I need to know about his economic beliefs.

KW64 on July 20, 2008 at 2:06 PM

But don’t call him a socialist okay? He’s only ONE of the most liberal members of the Senate and not THE most liberal member. Evidently, It’s important that we keep that straight for some reason.

TheBigOldDog on July 20, 2008 at 2:16 PM

Is it fair to point to this as evidence that Barry has Socialist (or Marxist) tendencies to this day?

If the people he surrounds himself with are any indication of his core beliefs, a higher capital gains tax to punish the rich, even if it diminishes actual tax revenue, may be only the beginning. Obama’s Official campaign blogger, Sam Graham-Felsen, a former writer for the leftist Nation magazine and a contributor to the Socialist Viewpoint, is certainly a believer in class warfare.

[Sam Graham-Felsen wrote:]

The capitalist ruling class of the United States exercises a virtual dictatorship not only over American society, but also over the entire world. This capitalist class rule is the basic cause of the poverty, wars and the degradation of the natural environment.

After being expelled from Socialist Action in 1999, we formed Socialist Workers Organization in an attempt to carry on the project of building a nucleus of a revolutionary party true to the historic teachings and program of Marx, Engels, Lenin and Trotsky.

Buy Danish on July 20, 2008 at 2:44 PM

Maybe the right should put a bag over McCain’s head at the Republican convention and fantasize he’s Ronald Reagan, Jon?

Should work until he opens his crazy mouth…

alphie on July 20, 2008 at 3:04 PM

I a lot of us are splitting hairs and focusing too much on the semantics and technical differences. Whether he is a socialist, a Marxist, or a communist, he is for the redistribution of wealth, attacking capitalism and a adding to an already massive central government.

More people have to speak up though, say it like it is. Bill O’Reilly recently said; “I think he has socialist beliefs, but I don’t think he is a socialist.” That’s kind of like saying; “Sure, he beats his wife, but I don’t think he is a wife beater.”

Star20 on July 20, 2008 at 3:06 PM

An example of Gramscian Marxism in action at Barack Obama’s official site. I know you probably don’t want to give him a click, but encourage you to take a look at this particular page for its amazing jaw-droppingness. His people have created a different Obama logo/symbol for each “oppressed minority” he hopes to help unite and uplift in a united effort to peacefully overthrow the current hegemony, or ruling class (he doesn’t put it in those terms, of course, but that’s what it is). Don’t see yourself on the list? Then you must be part of the ruling class and therefore scheduled for demolition. It’s what someone recently aptly called “rainbow fascism.” If you were previously part of the privileged class, be prepared to have your wallet lightened significantly as “fairness” is imposed by the new utopian socialist hegemony. Oh, and by the way, it’s global. There is no such thing as American exceptionalism. Quite the opposite.

aero on July 20, 2008 at 3:19 PM

alphie on July 20, 2008 at 3:04 PM

Ain’t workin’ alphie. Good defense and pitching wins championships. Constantly trying to go downtown makes you vulnerable.

a capella on July 20, 2008 at 3:21 PM

Dr. Keith Poole compiles an index of roll-call votes for the House and Senate that have better than 0.5% opposition in each year, which in the Senate only excludes unanimous votes. In 2007, the sample was 388 votes, far larger than NJ’s 99. The index shows how often each member votes with their own party as a measure of partisan and ideological leaning

That’s a silly way to label anyone “conservative” or “liberal”. The two parties don’t match up well with mere political labels. It measures “partisan” leaning, but not ideological.

flenser on July 20, 2008 at 3:23 PM

Whether he is a socialist, a Marxist, or a communist, he is for the redistribution of wealth, attacking capitalism and a adding to an already massive central government.

That describes both McCain and Obama in equal measure.

flenser on July 20, 2008 at 3:25 PM

Obama admitting during a debate this spring that raising captital gains taxes would ultimately lower government revenue but said it should be done anyway because it would be fair, tells me all I need to know about his economic beliefs.

I’m all in favor of lowering government revenue!

flenser on July 20, 2008 at 3:26 PM

[flenser on July 20, 2008 at 3:25 PM]

Equal measure? You don’t know what those words mean.

Dusty on July 20, 2008 at 3:40 PM

aero on July 20, 2008 at 3:19 PM

He says it a more refined way than Ayers et al. “Death to the capitalistic pigs”, or “Up against the wall, M**F” probably aren’t good campaign slogans.

a capella on July 20, 2008 at 3:47 PM

He says it a more refined way s/b he says it in a more refined way.

a capella on July 20, 2008 at 3:50 PM

But don’t call him a socialist okay? He’s only ONE of the most liberal members of the Senate and not THE most liberal member. Evidently, It’s important that we keep that straight for some reason.

TheBigOldDog on July 20, 2008 at 2:16 PM

Heh. Don’t want to be unfair to the Messiah. And all that embarrassing crap he’s done in his life? Come on, don’t bring that up.

“Right-leaning” people who claim to be fair and balanced and mature and reasonable, and therefore think things like gays in the military and gay marriage are perfectly ok, as a mature adult must?

They irritate the crap out of me.

misterpeasea on July 20, 2008 at 3:52 PM

I suspect Obambi is what used to be called a ‘fellow traveler’, or a ‘comsymp’, one sympathetic to, and easily manipulated by, hardcore Communists. These terms came into great disrepute because they were used by Senator Joseph McCarthy, who set back the fight against the Red Menace for decades with his egregious and truculent tactics, but perhaps it is time to revive them.

Obami has no public history of strong association with conservatives, only with a Communist mentor in Hawaii, and since then any number of left-wing thinkers, agitators, politicians, and worse, e.g. close association with the Ayers family and with the Black Liberation theocrat Jeremiah Wright. “By their friends ye shall know them.”

The evidence points to Obambi as a Manchurian Candidate, a personally appealing, well-spoken crowd-pleaser with little mind of his own, who can open the door to the White House and the government for the radical left to rush in. That makes him exceptionally dangerous to the Republic, as most of those who follow him, and will vote for him, have no idea who is behind him—or don’t care.

MrLynn on July 20, 2008 at 3:53 PM

For 2007, that put Barack Obama as the 11th most liberal Senator, well behind Sanders at 3rd. (Russ Feingold and Chris Dodd finished 1-2.)

Oh. Well. Alrighty then.

No problem that he will be entitled to [fill/replace with fellow Comrades] approx. 3,000 gov’t bureaucratic positions the minute he is sworn in.

RushBaby on July 20, 2008 at 3:59 PM

Judge a man by the company he keeps, the advice he solicits and the paths he follows.

Barack Obama, as seen by his close relationships with White, the Ayers Family, Saul Alinsky, Maxine Waters, etc., is a Marxist by any standard. What I fear is the Ayers Family influence, they are Maoists at heart and they are the people that ’sent’ Obama to Chicago politics.

SeniorD on July 20, 2008 at 4:09 PM

they are the people that ’sent’ Obama to Chicago politics.

SeniorD on July 20, 2008 at 4:09 PM

You got that right.

RushBaby on July 20, 2008 at 4:12 PM

Is Obama a socialist?
He can’t be much more of a socialist than much of the “capitalist” financial “houses” in this country have become. When their gambling doesn’t pay off and they want a taxpayer funded bailout it’s, “We’re all socialists now”.

MB4 on July 20, 2008 at 1:12 PM

It’s very true that there has been way too much socializing of the risk while privatizing the gain by the Wall Street/banking crowds. That fleecing of the American taxpayer is neither “capitalist” nor “conservative” and it needs to be stopped. However, I don’t see how putting Obama in the White House is likely to accomplish that. Some of his best friends and closest advisers (e.g., Dodd, Johnson) are some of the biggest offenders.

AZCoyote on July 20, 2008 at 4:16 PM

Back to bumpkinville after November.

alphie on July 20, 2008 at 1:12 PM

This, and at least another of your subsequent comments, in this thread, talk to Hillary about inevitability. You might have a premature orgasm, and you know how ugly they can be.

Obama is a socialist/Marxist, with an ananchyst wife. All else is a huge cover up, with mega-media help. If the American voters don’t wake up, they deserve him and all he’ll bring them.

Entelechy on July 20, 2008 at 4:18 PM

MrLynn on July 20, 2008 at 3:53 PM

I do not know if he is a Manchurian candidate but:

Birds of a Feather do Flock together and he does flock with some really strange left wing birds. Add in Pelosi and Reid and it does not sound like mainstream government would be in the offing if he wins.

KW64 on July 20, 2008 at 4:19 PM

S/b anarchyst wife…Michelle O.

alphie, do some reading, from one of your own.

Entelechy on July 20, 2008 at 4:20 PM

alphie, this is a great read for you too.

Entelechy on July 20, 2008 at 4:38 PM

Capt, are you going to release my post, or do I get nuked for “too long”??

Dale in Atlanta on July 20, 2008 at 4:50 PM

Entelechy on July 20, 2008 at 4:38 PM

alphie seems to have left the building. I assume he may be headed to one of those cash your paycheck before you receive it outlets that are the fashion these days. I don’t blame him a bit. From what I’ve read, the Denver Convention Fund is a little short, and money tends to flow towards a shortfall. Prudent financial behavior is a conservative trait and alphie may just be swinging over to the side of purity and light. Good for him and welcome.

a capella on July 20, 2008 at 4:51 PM

He usually doesn’t hang around very long trying to defend the indefensible.

misterpeasea on July 20, 2008 at 4:56 PM

Seeing bumpkins throw around economic terms they don’t understand just isn’t that amusing, ent.

I can see why McCain appeals to you guys, though.

alphie on July 20, 2008 at 5:36 PM

During the pre-Wrightian, Meccachurian-candidate phase, I was saying that the guy is a Marxist and, as a result, was getting called delusional (and, occasionally, an apologist for Islam).

Just wanted to point that out.

baldilocks on July 20, 2008 at 5:57 PM

And/or ignores responses to post more inflammatory crap.

He’s got a lot in common with DRywall and the other lefty trolls here at Hot Air.

misterpeasea on July 20, 2008 at 5:58 PM

In 2007, McCain was the eighth-most conservative Senator, and in 2005-6, he was the second most conservative Senator, behind only Jon Kyl.

Too bad half of HotAir commenters ignore this fact.
Heh–they even call Obama McCain a socialist!

jgapinoy on July 20, 2008 at 6:11 PM

Since the moderator of this board will not release my Comment, Proving that Barack HUSSEIN Obama (PBUH)(SAW)(SWT) is a Marxist and a Muslim, please read this thread, and list of sources, for definitive proof, including Obama’s own family, his own schoolmates, the Chicago Tribune, etc.!

Dale in Atlanta on July 20, 2008 at 6:17 PM

Dale in Atlanta on July 20, 2008 at 6:17 PM

Oh relax. Comments sometimes get stuck in a queue. Your comment has now appeared.

baldilocks on July 20, 2008 at 6:28 PM

Seeing bumpkins….
alphie on July 20, 2008 at 5:36 PM

clinging to their guns and their religion. Yeah, yeah, your Messiah has already covered that ground.

JonRoss on July 20, 2008 at 6:33 PM

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