As usual, there’s another side to the story.

The pallets and capsules provide worktables, communications, and sleeping accommodations for VIPs who must travel to austere or hostile locations.

Air Force officials pointed out that the demand for VIP travel has been high since 9/11, and USAF simply hasn’t had enough official VIP transports to satisfy high-ranking officials of the Administration, Congressional parties, and the military services needing to visit places like Afghanistan and Iraq.

Complaints from Congress about the availability of appropriate airlift were piling up.

Rather than buy more VIP airplanes, USAF decided to buy the interchangeable, roll-on, roll-off pallets and pods so that VIPs could travel on aircraft also delivering cargo, yet still be able to communicate, work, and rest at a comfort level comparable to a VIP aircraft.

As a bonus, standard airlifters like the C-17 and C-130 attract less attention than the white VIP jets which say “United States of America” on the side. And the airlifters are equipped with defensive systems.

Further, USAF said it downsized the comfort-pallet requirement when it was able to buy defensive systems for more VIP airplanes.

The service saw the requirement as an unfunded mandate and because it supported a unique-to-the-war need, it sought global war on terror funds to pay for it. When Congress said no, USAF found the funds elsewhere.

catmman on July 19, 2008 at 10:47 AM

As long as the sister services poke fun at my choice of service I will make sure to poke fun at their lack of intelligence.

After my ASVAB score came in the Navy wanted me for nuke engineering. I personally did not want a head start on something that sunk, nor did I want to hot-bunk like my Uncle did.

I agreed with Squid about tradition in the AF, and agree with you as far as it goes. But your just picking now. You were probably a “my Dad can beat up your Dad” kind of kind huh?

Each service has it’s own problems and it’s own bennies.

Am I envious? Honestly, sometimes I am. I wish the AF had a deeper tradition. There are probably a lot of AF people who feel he same way I do.

But you just want to bash the AF for some perception that we either don’t work or aren’t as committed to our own as other services. You can speak to personal examples all day, so can I. But I’m not stupid enough to denigrate an entire service for the inequiteis of a few – like you.

I have never met a member from a sister service or my own that I would not lay down my life for. I don’t give a shit what service tab they have over their left chest pocket.

At least I understand some things transcend a service patch.

I was talking to a fighter pilot once in VN and said that I didn’t know how they did it (fly into flak and missiles)…his response was that he didn’t know how we (Grunts) did it. The pods probably started out as a good idea but then some dilettantes got into the act. Most of the AF guys that I know would probably not use them out of embarrassment unless there was a pressing operational reason to do mission planning etc. But, there are prima donnas in all of the Services.

Also since the Air-Force operates from a fixed base

Hey! That’s fixed platform in AF speak. They liken their bases to aircraft carriers.

It should not be so surprising that an F15mech could bring Sat TV to a squadron.

All it takes is a SAT dish and some wire.

Sat dish was easy one of the intelligence squadrons upgraded and did not need the old dish anymore.

While the sat TV system only received 3 or 4 channels, it was enough to get CNN/MTV before our golf courses were built. /sarc

Sorry your Navy buds were not up to the challenge.

never to business

s/b never do business…

That allowed the F-15 to be fitted with a larger compressor which fixed quite a few engine problems in the process.

Considering that the AF shoved the F-15 on us, you shouldn’t be surprised, they are quite accomplished at buying useless stuff for no good reason.

Put the Misty’s in charge of everything and you will see a positive change.

Bishop on July 18, 2008 at 12:05 PM

Please are you serious?

The Navy was pissed because the AF shoved the worlds most successful fighter/interceptor on you?

BTW the Navy left the F-X (F-15) program and it cost the AF 110 million in the process.

Now I know why the rule at Skunk Works is to never to business with the Navy.

I’ve seen army guys envious of us AF pukes for getting three MRE’s a day instead of one, so there is plenty of evidence from all the services of their personnel being bent over at one time or another.

Envious? That’s like 10,000 calories! You eat all that in one day you not only are going to be a bit “stopped up” but you won’t fit in those flight suits for long. You sure the Army guys weren’t laughing? ;-0

I will say that if you think a Marine feels any more for his comrades than anyone else in any other service, frankly your full of it.

I do and I don’t. Spent a year around the AF at Maxwell AFB. Not the same environment as the sea services at all when it comes to mentoring and helping personnel, especially junior personnel. AF is more cliquish along MOS/speciality while both Navy and Marines are more oriented around the command.

I was trying to make the point that each service overemphasizes certain things which lead to lack of funding – personal or otherwise. The Navy has more different uniforms and uniform combinations than any other -it’s a waste of money and resources.

I still don’t get your connection. Enlisted sailors get a small uniform allowance but the “overemphasis” on different uniforms (your words) really doesn’t have anything to do with quality of life issues. And, for the record, the Navy has traditional uniforms (blues/whites) variations of which are worn by virtually every sea service in the world. I’d hate to see that go away because some bean counter takes your view that maintaining tradition is a waste of money. Especially somebody connected to the AF which is woefully short of tradition once one gets by idol worship of Billy Mitchell, Hap Arnold, and other individuals.

The Navy has ships older than the AF, so I’m not sure you appreciate the role of tradition plays. I came to realize this when I heard a couple of AF guys giggle over the ship’s captain responding with a traditional “make it so” to a request from the bridge to strike eight bells on time. I guess the only time these guys ever heard that kind of talk was on episodes of Star Trek.

I tried to clarify my remarks on the uniforms above in a seperate comment. We both agree about the AF spending money on stupid crap.

As to Golf Courses…

* The Legends at Parris Island (S.C.), Marine Corps Recruit Depot, 843-228-2240, $23-$30.

* Leilehua G. Cse., Schofield Barracks, Oahu, Hawaii, 808-655-4653, $32.

* Marine Memorial G. Cse., U.S. Marine Corps Base, Camp Pendleton, Calif., 760-725-4704, $23-$28.

* Miramar Memorial G. Cse., Marine Corps Air Station Miramar, San Diego, 858-577-4155, $24-$29.

* Sound of Freedom G. Cse., Cherry Point Marine Corps Air Station, Havelock, N.C., 252-466-3044, $17-$19.

Trident Lakes G. Cse., Kings Bay Naval Submarine Base, Kings Bay, Ga., 912-5738475, $11-$13.

Unless our Navy doesn’t have subs anymore – is that a golf course at a Navy Base? And all of those Marine posts, the Marine Corps being part of the Department of the Navy and all…

Golf courses BTW being funded by “non-appropriated” funds NOT taxpayer dollars.

Believe me, I know what your saying about tradition and it is something the AF lacks.

And the Navy has it’s own share of boondoggles…

Perhaps the Navy would have more to spend on “creature comforts” if it weren’t spending all that money on the, what, 5,000 different uniform combinations you have?

Since I buy my own uniforms and the Taaxpayers are paying for the AF’s Golf Courses and O clubs, I must be missing the point you were going for.

highhopes on July 18, 2008 at 2:41 PM

I love when we agree, gives me the warm fuzzy.

The AF takes care of it’s people and people are bitching about it? You made the choice to serve in the Navy right? If you don’t like hotbunking, it’s your own damn fault.

I joined the Navy because I wanted to drive ships, and I am not qualified to fly. My mom desperately wanted me to join the AF. I did not want to become the “non-plane” AF guy and I loved the Ocean.

Also, I like a little side of tradition with my military service :)

The Air Force is plagued by “leaders” like Merrill McPeak. We don’t have any Hap Arnolds anymore.

You’ve pretty much nailed it there.

At the end of the day, the AF has just been the best at getting its crap funded. AF officers can make power points better than anyone I know. I didnt learn until I was a 0-3.

I was trying to make the point that each service overemphasizes certain things which lead to lack of funding – personal or otherwise. The Navy has more different uniforms and uniform combinations than any other -it’s a waste of money and resources.

Our uniforms suck. They are the least “military” of the military uniforms. I oughta know.

Um. All the services take care of their people. ***
highhopes on July 18, 2008 at 2:41 PM

The Marine Corps has a great esprit d’corps but is horrendously cheap. They actually make an effort to not spend all of their (paltry) Congressional appropriations, and tend to rely on a lot of “hand me down” equipment from other services. I appreciate “lean and mean,” but cultural cheapness and corner-cutting is not cool, no matter how you dress it up with slogans like “adapt, improvise, and overcome.”

I am sensitive on this issue.

What is funny is that I toss out some barbs and you give a response which takes me to task for doing exactly what others are doing.

I never said the other serivces don’t take care of their people and you’ve got it exactly backwards – the implication is from the other side.

I’ve seen army guys envious of us AF pukes for getting three MRE’s a day instead of one, so there is plenty of evidence from all the services of their personnel being bent over at one time or another.

I’m also not saying the AF is the end-all be -all of the military. Believe me, I come from a multiple service family and we have these discussions a lot.

The Air Force has it’s problems, yes it does. But I am not going to sit by and let the entire service be denigrated for the actions of it’s leadership. We can have friendly discussion about which service is “best”. But there was a lot of flamethrowing going on, so I jumped in.

The Air Force is plagued by “leaders” like Merrill McPeak. We don’t have any Hap Arnolds anymore.

I will say that if you think a Marine feels any more for his comrades than anyone else in any other service, frankly your full of it.

catmman on July 18, 2008 at 12:43 PM

A wee bit overly senstitive on this, aren’t you?

But since the guantlet has been thrown, I offer this: Perhaps the Navy would have more to spend on “creature comforts” if it weren’t spending all that money on the, what, 5,000 different uniform combinations you have?

The “our AF uniforms are cooler” strategy. That’s really weak. Really, really weak. What does number of uniform combinations have to do with the fact that AF personnel are coddled compared to the other services. Besides, you all look like bus drivers in that one uniform for all occasions thing.

The AF takes care of it’s people and people are bitching about it? You made the choice to serve in the Navy right? If you don’t like hotbunking, it’s your own damn fault.

Um. All the services take care of their people. I’m sure you really meant that even though you imply otherwise. When it comes to looking out after one another, I’d put the Marines far ahead of any other service. The AF way of “taking care” of its people means clean sheets and single occupancy quarters. In other services the term goes a little deeper.

Egfrow on July 18, 2008 at 1:14 PM

Do we really have that many 4 star generals hopping on the last c-130 flight into Baghdad?

The typcial story goes:

The Navy got an appropriation from congress and used it to build ships. When they ran out of money and needed to build base facilities, congress asked if they were ready to fight. The Navy replied ; “Well, technically, yes, we have the ships, we just don’t have any facilites ashore, so congress denied the additional funds.

The Air Force got an appropriation from congress and used it to build O-clubs, BOQ’s, BEQ’s, golf courses and mess halls. When they ran out of money and needed more, Congress asked if they were ready to fight. The Air Force replied – “no, we need funds to build a runway”, so congress gave them more money.

The Marine Corps got an appropriation from congress, threw up a few dozen quonset huts, refurbished some rifles and tanks, then when they went back to congress. Congress asked if they were ready to fight, the Marines said “Ooh F’ing Rah!, we were ready yesterday!” and handed Congress a check.

That’s why I joined the Air Force. Screw that. Fortunately, I had a choice.

I’ve been in the AF for 21 years and NEVER seen the brass from ANY service “suffer” unless it was absolutely necessary.

We’ve gone from appropriately ridiculing a few AF asshats for doing something stupid and wasteful, to denigrating an entire service for how WELL it treats it personnel?

These are mutually exclusive people. I’m sick and tired of hearing the AF criticized for treating it’s people like people.

I’ll be the first to agree that sometimes it does go to extremes. But don’t even try to take the moral high ground with your implications that YOU wouldn’t avail yourself to the same good treatment as a matter of course.

Of course unless you prefer hotbunking to your own bed…

: )

Putting these pods inside the back is a good idea for key leaders and VIP’s. They have to make decisions that effect the lives of thousands of men and women. I would want them productive as possible, Try holding a meeting in the Back of a C-130 or C-17 cargo transport plane. Now, I don’t think they should go overboard with the concept and put in a Jacuzzi and a private chef but giving them a place to work and be comfortable while stuck in 10-14 hour flight makes sense and is a good investment in tax payer money. We have to spend less on leasing jets and can use flights that are already going to a destination to carry staff.

I think this statment better be reworded!

The AF lack of effort in the GWOT?!!

I’m sure you meant to say that there may be a problem with the AF leadership or other “cultural” issues?

I bleed red just like any of my compatriots is the other services and deeply resent any implication to the contrary!

I’m sure there an’t a few mohogany desks and oversized ultra-leather, extra padded chairs polishing the ass of a Navy Admiral at the Pentagon, huh Squiddy?

Relativity works.

I think this is a complete waste, and does speak to deterioration of the culture of the Air Force. This is an absolute waste – no question. I’d be willing to bet more than a fair share of these AF asshats has McPeak as a rater on an OPR some time in the past…

That being said, I’ve NEVER seen the BRASS of ANY of the services “suffering” when it wasn’t absolutely necessary. I don’t give a good gdamn WHICH service it was.

But since the guantlet has been thrown, I offer this: Perhaps the Navy would have more to spend on “creature comforts” if it weren’t spending all that money on the, what, 5,000 different uniform combinations you have?

And members of ALL services are serving and dying during deployments. It doesn’t matter if the deployment is 1 day or 12 months.

I’m sick and effing tired about the AF being criticized for treating it’s people well. Sometimes AF personnel don’t spend as much time deployed in Iraq or Afghanistan, but we have plenty of people who spend 12-15 months over there.

The AF takes care of it’s people and people are bitching about it? You made the choice to serve in the Navy right? If you don’t like hotbunking, it’s your own damn fault.

I’ve spent 21 years in the AF and served my fair share of time getting effed over. BOHICA applies to everyone in the service at one tme or another. The AF is just curteous to lube us up first.