The latest in counterterrorism efforts: the Luxury Pod
posted at 9:37 am on July 18, 2008 by Ed Morrissey
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How has the Pentagon spent counterterrorism funds? The Washington Post reports on one project funded through the CT appropriation that will certainly help keep America safe from al-Qaeda — or at least keep Air Force commanders comfortable during an attack. The Luxury Pod, officially called “comfort capsules”, contain plush chairs and full-length mirrors, both apparently necessities for top brass who cannot abide flying Coach:
The Air Force’s top leadership sought for three years to spend counterterrorism funds on “comfort capsules” to be installed on military planes that ferry senior officers and civilian leaders around the world, with at least four top generals involved in design details such as the color of the capsules’ carpet and leather chairs, according to internal e-mails and budget documents.
Production of the first capsule — consisting of two sealed rooms that can fit into the fuselage of a large military aircraft — has already begun. …
The effort has been slowed, however, by congressional resistance to using counterterrorism funds for the project and by lengthy internal deliberations about a series of demands for modifications by Air Force generals. One request was that the color of the leather for the seats and seat belts in the mobile pallets be changed from brown to Air Force blue and that seat pockets be added; another was that the color of the table’s wood be darkened.
Changing the seat color and pockets alone was estimated in a March 12 internal document to cost at least $68,240.
How much does the Air Force want to complete the Luxury Pod project? Over $16 million in CT funds initially, although that has declined to $7 million. Congress told the Pentagon twice where to stick the Luxury Pods, and yet the Air Force continues to work on this project and continues to ask for funding out of war-related appropriations.
The Luxury Pod Project got its start with current AF vice chief of staff Gen. Duncan McNabb, who determined that the Air Force did not have enough VIP-level resources for flight after 9/11. Arguing that the war brought more need to fly brass and civilian decision-makers around the world, McNabb proposed spending millions of dollars adding such capacity to a fleet that already had 100 planes or more with VIP accommodations.
Perhaps the Luxury Pod has some sort of application for actual counterterrorist operations that we cannot yet discern. Maybe they’re meant to replace Gitmo as an interrogation capsule that would pass muster with Amnesty International. However, I’d prefer that counterterrorist funds get spent on actual counterterrorist operations, and not featherbedding the travel accommodations of VIPs and Air Force staff. God forbid we have another terrorist attack in this nation, but if we do, I don’t want to have to wonder whether a stuffed chair on a pallet took priority over discovering whether that terrorist cell existed.
Update: Oh, no! Not … the comfy chair!
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Well, if Nancy can’t have her own 747, a pod will have to do.
Think_b4_speaking on July 18, 2008 at 9:40 AM
If this is real, there should be some pink slips in the offing.
ElectricPhase on July 18, 2008 at 9:42 AM
The Air Force sought to spend Tax Payer dollars on creature comforts instead of warfighting????
I am shocked, SHOCKED I say!
/sarc off
My Lhasa Apso says (with all respect to CyberCipher):
Squid Shark on July 18, 2008 at 9:43 AM
Nothing like a sedan chair to announce you have arrived.
Limerick on July 18, 2008 at 9:46 AM
not to start an inter-armed services war… But I wonder why marines never ask for these kind of seats? Or navy on ships… Or in the humvees. Airforce here is always been called the “civilian” service this is not helping their rep.
-Wasteland Man.
WastelandMan on July 18, 2008 at 9:47 AM
The, sealed, design may have more to do with privacy and secrecy than with luxury. Congress, of course, would hate the idea of generals being able to plan operations in secret. I would imagine that, on the ground, someone would be reporting everything they heard back to their political masters.
OldEnglish on July 18, 2008 at 9:48 AM
I can’t speak for the folks who have been in the C17 but I can tell you that his ‘pod’ has everything to do with the butt comfort of the brass/VIPs. If you ever spent 8 hours in a C-130 or C-141 web seat, complete with earplugs you know exactly why these fellas demanded ’something special’.
Limerick on July 18, 2008 at 9:54 AM
$300 hammers are sooo 1990s.
jgapinoy on July 18, 2008 at 9:55 AM
That wouldn’t explain their demands for table and seat color changes, making sure the seats are leather, and demanding a pocket pouch.
amerpundit on July 18, 2008 at 9:55 AM
Everything in the AF is about luxury
Squid Shark on July 18, 2008 at 9:57 AM
I find this surprising. I was on a commercial flight once with a four-star Air Force general. He sat in coach. I would have thought if four star generals fly coach, they wouldn’t demand special accomodations on their own planes.
Yossarian on July 18, 2008 at 9:59 AM
They can cry me a river and take a damn FFG through the North Atlantic in the winter and tell me they are uncomfortable.
Squid Shark on July 18, 2008 at 10:00 AM
Obviously you are a commie because otherwise you would know that everything the military does must come with a cool acronym! In the case of the “Luxury Pod,” it is called a SLICC – or “Senior Leader Intransit Comfort Capsules.” Don’t you think that Air Force generals, men and women who have dedicated over 30 years of their lives to public service, deserve to travel in something SLICC? They are old guys primarily, which means eight hours in a jump seat or a standard commercial airliner seat is going to affect them more than a 20 year old airman or 30 year old junior officer. These guys need to be fresh when they hit the ground in Iraq or Afghanistan to do their war planning stuff. Still, I find it a little creepy that all the troops would be in jump seats right next to these giant palletized boxes with Air Force stars across the door… That can’t be too good for morale.
Outlander on July 18, 2008 at 10:00 AM
They rarely do, they probably over booked in 1st class
Squid Shark on July 18, 2008 at 10:02 AM
Well,they sure are awfully pretty,but where the
h#ll are the fluffy throw pillows!haha!
canopfor on July 18, 2008 at 10:04 AM
Government waste is the national pastime.
For the person who can wrangle a job getting paid 1 cent for every dollar of wasted government spending saved, riches await.
Jaibones on July 18, 2008 at 10:05 AM
During DESERT SHIELD, an Air Force officer assigned to my Army division, as an Air Liaison Officer, told this story.
After a month in the Saudi desert with our unit, eating MREs and swatting flies and enduring 120 degree heat, he came back to Air Force HQ in Dammam (?) for some briefings and R&R.
He went to the chow hall, and stood behind an officer who was complaining that the orange juice wasn’t chilled to his satisfaction.
Different services, different priorities…
smagar on July 18, 2008 at 10:05 AM
When I was deployed with NATO, the Admirals flew coach with the rest of us. When onboard, he slept in the CO’s inport cabin which is only slightly larger than an officers stateroom and is mostly an office space.
This is SOP for the AF. Particularly the brass.
Spend 10 minutes listening to AF guys on a carrier (which are far more luxuriant than most Navy Ships) or listening to the Augmentees in Iraq (even though their tours are half as long as everyone else, including the Navy).
Squid Shark on July 18, 2008 at 10:07 AM
gawd…
This is what Brits must feel like when they hear about the state of their military.
Theworldisnotenough on July 18, 2008 at 10:08 AM
Now,that would be really sweet,if they could
shoe horn one of these pods into a BUFF,and
let me tell you,if they could do it,it would
be a technology wonder!(kidding!)haha!
canopfor on July 18, 2008 at 10:14 AM
When we read history books, this is what it looks like before great civilizations fall.
It is not so much the buying of the chairs that is the sign, but the inability of those in power to see the ‘wrongness’ of it all.
The peasants don’t have comfort pods… Let them fly first class.
al sends
afterdarknesslight on July 18, 2008 at 10:22 AM
Next thing you know,Nancy Pelosi will
be b#tching for the same,I would imagine
Nancy would want a love nest design,for
those long hauls to secure peace in Syria!
canopfor on July 18, 2008 at 10:24 AM
Re: my 9.48 am post, thanks for the correction guys. I’m not military, and did not know that the Air Force brass saw themselves as special. I must admit, I focused on “sealed” and jumped to the wrong conclusion.
OldEnglish on July 18, 2008 at 10:35 AM
Having spent more time than I care to recall herderd into the belly of C-130’s with dozens of other big ass Marines and our war gear making coast to coast and trans-continental hops, I can attest to the cold, noisy (think tractor trailer with the top down doing about 100 mph), uncomfortable (think fold down webbed becnch) conditions.
I agree that sr level officers need a suitable workspace, but a simple insulated container type office shouldn’t cost as much as this article suggests.
Alden Pyle on July 18, 2008 at 8:51 AM from the articles section
Alden Pyle on July 18, 2008 at 10:36 AM
Mandarines.
pseudonominus on July 18, 2008 at 10:41 AM
Methinks it is time to fold the Air Force back into the Army.
thekingtut on July 18, 2008 at 10:49 AM
Only if her maiden voyage in it includes launching the pod out the back of the plane over the Marianas Trench.
highhopes on July 18, 2008 at 10:56 AM
Spoken like someone who has never been in the Air Force.
The pods are a great idea, but they should have been told to take the super luxury out of the equation.
Rogue Traveler on July 18, 2008 at 10:56 AM
Forget about necessity. Logistically speaking, how feasable is this? Is every 4-star general going to have a pod assigned to them, waiting for them on the flight line?
And yes, I’ve flown in the jump seats in a C-130,141 and 17. I’ve also flown in the rear facing passenger deck on a C-5 from Virginia to Rota, Spain, to Kuwait.
BohicaTwentyTwo on July 18, 2008 at 10:57 AM
The USAF has always been more of a organization devoted to purchasing the latest military equipment than anything else. Try spending a few months floating around the Indian Ocean and south China Sea to see what discomfort is really like; nothing like sleeping top rack right under the ductwork for gaining perspective.
I wonder if Colonel Bud Day would consider coming out of retirement?
Bishop on July 18, 2008 at 11:19 AM
The original pod design.
Alden Pyle on July 18, 2008 at 11:20 AM
I have been on enough A.F. Bases to know where their priorities are.
Squid Shark on July 18, 2008 at 11:22 AM
I can think of one thing that the AF holds in higher priorities.
Golf Courses and O-clubs
Squid Shark on July 18, 2008 at 11:23 AM
Lawsuit from Steve Jobs (pbuhn) incoming…
Asher on July 18, 2008 at 11:40 AM
In no particular order:
(1) I don’t mind top strategists and their aides being kept comfortable and, if possible, well-rested.
(2) Who chose brown instead of Air Force blue? Stupid-#ss.
(3) Who forgot the seat pockets?
(4) Delays are everywhere. Matters rarely proceed along a straight path.
(5) When every change of materials and every additional piece of equipment must be evaluated from the standpoint of safety in an emergency, costs are much higher.
(6) Does it seem good to trust the Washington Post to make this report without slanting it?
(7) “The Luxury Pod Project got its start with current AF vice chief of staff Gen. Duncan McNabb, who determined that the Air Force did not have enough VIP-level resources for flight after 9/11.” I somewhat trust his judgment.
(8) $16 million is approximately 0.0001% of the last seven years’ federal budgets.
(9) It seems that envy is a problem that must be taken into account by those who think about national security.
Kralizec on July 18, 2008 at 11:41 AM
It’s about time that someone who has tasted blood, guts and mud in combat be put in charge of the USAF! Way too many butt kissers and politicians running the show! While our best and brightest are killing bad guys and are being killed and wounded these morons are worried about the color of seat-belt? Please, Mr. Gates, fire some of these pricks!
sabbott on July 18, 2008 at 11:46 AM
Haven’t you heard the AF riff on their bases? They liken them to fighting platforms (the equivelent of an aircraft carrier). All that infrastructure is simply enhancing their warfighting capability- as if the war would be lost for the lack of an expresso machine in the BEQ.
Ever been to McGuire AFB/ Fort Dix? McGuire has beautiful facilities. Dix is a dump. Guess which side the Navy had to build their BRAC-related projects on? Why? Because putting a Navy hangar on AF property would “taint” their platform.
highhopes on July 18, 2008 at 11:49 AM
Danger Room at Wired has been covering for awhile the AF’s lack of effort in the GWOT and Gates’ efforts to throw out top brass and replacing them with officers who are ready and willing to fight. This pod idea only proves just how screwed up the priorities of the Air Force really are.
Vatican Watcher on July 18, 2008 at 12:00 PM
I think the bigger issue here is that they were attempting to fund them with CT dollars. Great idea or not, is this really a legitimate use of CT appropriations? And for that matter, why is this such a priority for the AF that they keep attempting to sneak funding into war appropriations bills?
highhopes on July 18, 2008 at 12:04 PM
Considering that the AF shoved the F-15 on us, you shouldn’t be surprised, they are quite accomplished at buying useless stuff for no good reason.
Put the Misty’s in charge of everything and you will see a positive change.
Bishop on July 18, 2008 at 12:05 PM
This is at least gross mismanagement of public funds. Almost $70K in cosmetic changes? If the Martha Stewart wannabe Generals had wanted baby blue seats, they should have said so before the contract was executed.
highhopes on July 18, 2008 at 12:10 PM
Ahhh… no… I get it… it really IS a good IDEA!!!
See, this is Gates way of getting rid of a certain type of Senior Officer!
Its like a Roach Motel… and psych test rolled into one!
Every C-130 flight which carries one of these will be ordered to slide them out the back door, at 30K ft…
So those Senior O’s who care about there men, who are fighting O’s… who would DREAM of being in one of these things live… while REMF types get ejected at 30K!
Pure Darwinian GeniuS!
Romeo13 on July 18, 2008 at 12:12 PM
Meant to say “would NOT dream of geing in one of those things”…
Grrrr
Romeo13 on July 18, 2008 at 12:13 PM
Good luck with that.
Squid Shark on July 18, 2008 at 12:20 PM
Oh my frickin GOD!!!
I’m sure there an’t a few mohogany desks and oversized ultra-leather, extra padded chairs polishing the ass of a Navy Admiral at the Pentagon, huh Squiddy?
Relativity works.
I think this is a complete waste, and does speak to deterioration of the culture of the Air Force. This is an absolute waste – no question. I’d be willing to bet more than a fair share of these AF asshats has McPeak as a rater on an OPR some time in the past…
That being said, I’ve NEVER seen the BRASS of ANY of the services “suffering” when it wasn’t absolutely necessary. I don’t give a good gdamn WHICH service it was.
But since the guantlet has been thrown, I offer this: Perhaps the Navy would have more to spend on “creature comforts” if it weren’t spending all that money on the, what, 5,000 different uniform combinations you have?
And members of ALL services are serving and dying during deployments. It doesn’t matter if the deployment is 1 day or 12 months.
I’m sick and effing tired about the AF being criticized for treating it’s people well. Sometimes AF personnel don’t spend as much time deployed in Iraq or Afghanistan, but we have plenty of people who spend 12-15 months over there.
The AF takes care of it’s people and people are bitching about it? You made the choice to serve in the Navy right? If you don’t like hotbunking, it’s your own damn fault.
I’ve spent 21 years in the AF and served my fair share of time getting effed over. BOHICA applies to everyone in the service at one tme or another. The AF is just curteous to lube us up first.
catmman on July 18, 2008 at 12:43 PM
Vatican Watcher on July 18, 2008 at 12:00 PM
I think this statment better be reworded!
The AF lack of effort in the GWOT?!!
I’m sure you meant to say that there may be a problem with the AF leadership or other “cultural” issues?
I bleed red just like any of my compatriots is the other services and deeply resent any implication to the contrary!
catmman on July 18, 2008 at 1:14 PM
Obviously anyone who is slamming this has never had to endure 10 hours inside a Military Transport plane. It’s not a picnic, Having conversations, forget it! Getting the least bit comfortable, not a chance. It’s cold, noisy and, hard on your ass.
Putting these pods inside the back is a good idea for key leaders and VIP’s. They have to make decisions that effect the lives of thousands of men and women. I would want them productive as possible, Try holding a meeting in the Back of a C-130 or C-17 cargo transport plane. Now, I don’t think they should go overboard with the concept and put in a Jacuzzi and a private chef but giving them a place to work and be comfortable while stuck in 10-14 hour flight makes sense and is a good investment in tax payer money. We have to spend less on leasing jets and can use flights that are already going to a destination to carry staff.
Egfrow on July 18, 2008 at 1:14 PM
Oh yeah Squiddy? There isn’t a nice real mahogany, oversized desk with an uber-soft, overplump ultra-leather chair or two polishing the ass of any admirals at the pentagon or various HQ’s across the land?
I’ve been in the AF for 21 years and NEVER seen the brass from ANY service “suffer” unless it was absolutely necessary.
We’ve gone from appropriately ridiculing a few AF asshats for doing something stupid and wasteful, to denigrating an entire service for how WELL it treats it personnel?
These are mutually exclusive people. I’m sick and tired of hearing the AF criticized for treating it’s people like people.
I’ll be the first to agree that sometimes it does go to extremes. But don’t even try to take the moral high ground with your implications that YOU wouldn’t avail yourself to the same good treatment as a matter of course.
Of course unless you prefer hotbunking to your own bed…
: )
catmman on July 18, 2008 at 1:19 PM
Bishop,
That’s why I joined the Air Force. Screw that. Fortunately, I had a choice.
Egfrow on July 18, 2008 at 1:19 PM
No one who has served in our military should be surprised by this.
The typcial story goes:
The Navy got an appropriation from congress and used it to build ships. When they ran out of money and needed to build base facilities, congress asked if they were ready to fight. The Navy replied ; “Well, technically, yes, we have the ships, we just don’t have any facilites ashore, so congress denied the additional funds.
The Air Force got an appropriation from congress and used it to build O-clubs, BOQ’s, BEQ’s, golf courses and mess halls. When they ran out of money and needed more, Congress asked if they were ready to fight. The Air Force replied – “no, we need funds to build a runway”, so congress gave them more money.
The Marine Corps got an appropriation from congress, threw up a few dozen quonset huts, refurbished some rifles and tanks, then when they went back to congress. Congress asked if they were ready to fight, the Marines said “Ooh F’ing Rah!, we were ready yesterday!” and handed Congress a check.
Fatal on July 18, 2008 at 1:22 PM
Do we really have that many 4 star generals hopping on the last c-130 flight into Baghdad?
BohicaTwentyTwo on July 18, 2008 at 2:34 PM
A wee bit overly senstitive on this, aren’t you?
The “our AF uniforms are cooler” strategy. That’s really weak. Really, really weak. What does number of uniform combinations have to do with the fact that AF personnel are coddled compared to the other services. Besides, you all look like bus drivers in that one uniform for all occasions thing.
Um. All the services take care of their people. I’m sure you really meant that even though you imply otherwise. When it comes to looking out after one another, I’d put the Marines far ahead of any other service. The AF way of “taking care” of its people means clean sheets and single occupancy quarters. In other services the term goes a little deeper.
highhopes on July 18, 2008 at 2:41 PM
Bin Laden lives in caves and safe houses, our AF brass can make do with a stool and hand mirror for all I care.
ThePrez on July 18, 2008 at 3:12 PM
highhopes on July 18, 2008 at 2:41 PM
I am sensitive on this issue.
What is funny is that I toss out some barbs and you give a response which takes me to task for doing exactly what others are doing.
I never said the other serivces don’t take care of their people and you’ve got it exactly backwards – the implication is from the other side.
I’ve seen army guys envious of us AF pukes for getting three MRE’s a day instead of one, so there is plenty of evidence from all the services of their personnel being bent over at one time or another.
I’m also not saying the AF is the end-all be -all of the military. Believe me, I come from a multiple service family and we have these discussions a lot.
The Air Force has it’s problems, yes it does. But I am not going to sit by and let the entire service be denigrated for the actions of it’s leadership. We can have friendly discussion about which service is “best”. But there was a lot of flamethrowing going on, so I jumped in.
The Air Force is plagued by “leaders” like Merrill McPeak. We don’t have any Hap Arnolds anymore.
I will say that if you think a Marine feels any more for his comrades than anyone else in any other service, frankly your full of it.
catmman on July 18, 2008 at 3:35 PM
The Marine Corps has a great esprit d’corps but is horrendously cheap. They actually make an effort to not spend all of their (paltry) Congressional appropriations, and tend to rely on a lot of “hand me down” equipment from other services. I appreciate “lean and mean,” but cultural cheapness and corner-cutting is not cool, no matter how you dress it up with slogans like “adapt, improvise, and overcome.”
Outlander on July 18, 2008 at 3:36 PM
And I never said “Our AF uniforms are cooler” – your quotation is misplaced HH.
I was trying to make the point that each service overemphasizes certain things which lead to lack of funding – personal or otherwise. The Navy has more different uniforms and uniform combinations than any other -it’s a waste of money and resources.
Our uniforms suck. They are the least “military” of the military uniforms. I oughta know.
catmman on July 18, 2008 at 3:39 PM
Since I buy my own uniforms and the Taaxpayers are paying for the AF’s Golf Courses and O clubs, I must be missing the point you were going for.
I love when we agree, gives me the warm fuzzy.
I joined the Navy because I wanted to drive ships, and I am not qualified to fly. My mom desperately wanted me to join the AF. I did not want to become the “non-plane” AF guy and I loved the Ocean.
Also, I like a little side of tradition with my military service :)
You’ve pretty much nailed it there.
At the end of the day, the AF has just been the best at getting its crap funded. AF officers can make power points better than anyone I know. I didnt learn until I was a 0-3.
Squid Shark on July 18, 2008 at 5:42 PM
Squid,
I tried to clarify my remarks on the uniforms above in a seperate comment. We both agree about the AF spending money on stupid crap.
As to Golf Courses…
* The Legends at Parris Island (S.C.), Marine Corps Recruit Depot, 843-228-2240, $23-$30.
* Leilehua G. Cse., Schofield Barracks, Oahu, Hawaii, 808-655-4653, $32.
* Marine Memorial G. Cse., U.S. Marine Corps Base, Camp Pendleton, Calif., 760-725-4704, $23-$28.
* Miramar Memorial G. Cse., Marine Corps Air Station Miramar, San Diego, 858-577-4155, $24-$29.
* Sound of Freedom G. Cse., Cherry Point Marine Corps Air Station, Havelock, N.C., 252-466-3044, $17-$19.
Trident Lakes G. Cse., Kings Bay Naval Submarine Base, Kings Bay, Ga., 912-5738475, $11-$13.
Unless our Navy doesn’t have subs anymore – is that a golf course at a Navy Base? And all of those Marine posts, the Marine Corps being part of the Department of the Navy and all…
Golf courses BTW being funded by “non-appropriated” funds NOT taxpayer dollars.
Believe me, I know what your saying about tradition and it is something the AF lacks.
And the Navy has it’s own share of boondoggles…
catmman on July 18, 2008 at 7:23 PM
I bet the push for these came from a high up Dem who said “if it is goode enough for Bush to have Air Force One then I want the luxury, even if I cannot have the jet.
davod on July 18, 2008 at 7:30 PM
Envious? That’s like 10,000 calories! You eat all that in one day you not only are going to be a bit “stopped up” but you won’t fit in those flight suits for long. You sure the Army guys weren’t laughing? ;-0
I do and I don’t. Spent a year around the AF at Maxwell AFB. Not the same environment as the sea services at all when it comes to mentoring and helping personnel, especially junior personnel. AF is more cliquish along MOS/speciality while both Navy and Marines are more oriented around the command.
I still don’t get your connection. Enlisted sailors get a small uniform allowance but the “overemphasis” on different uniforms (your words) really doesn’t have anything to do with quality of life issues. And, for the record, the Navy has traditional uniforms (blues/whites) variations of which are worn by virtually every sea service in the world. I’d hate to see that go away because some bean counter takes your view that maintaining tradition is a waste of money. Especially somebody connected to the AF which is woefully short of tradition once one gets by idol worship of Billy Mitchell, Hap Arnold, and other individuals.
The Navy has ships older than the AF, so I’m not sure you appreciate the role of tradition plays. I came to realize this when I heard a couple of AF guys giggle over the ship’s captain responding with a traditional “make it so” to a request from the bridge to strike eight bells on time. I guess the only time these guys ever heard that kind of talk was on episodes of Star Trek.
highhopes on July 18, 2008 at 7:47 PM
Please are you serious?
The Navy was pissed because the AF shoved the worlds most successful fighter/interceptor on you?
BTW the Navy left the F-X (F-15) program and it cost the AF 110 million in the process.
Now I know why the rule at Skunk Works is to never to business with the Navy.
F15Mech on July 18, 2008 at 11:31 PM
and BTW I want to thank the Navy for leaving the F-X program.
That allowed the F-15 to be fitted with a larger compressor which fixed quite a few engine problems in the process.
F15Mech on July 18, 2008 at 11:36 PM
s/b never do business…
F15Mech on July 18, 2008 at 11:39 PM
Also since the Air-Force operates from a fixed base and it’s members are highly trained…
It should not be so surprising that an F15mech could bring Sat TV to a squadron.
All it takes is a SAT dish and some wire.
Sat dish was easy one of the intelligence squadrons upgraded and did not need the old dish anymore.
While the sat TV system only received 3 or 4 channels, it was enough to get CNN/MTV before our golf courses were built. /sarc
Sorry your Navy buds were not up to the challenge.
F15Mech on July 18, 2008 at 11:59 PM
Hey! That’s fixed platform in AF speak. They liken their bases to aircraft carriers.
highhopes on July 19, 2008 at 1:38 AM
About the only AF folks that rough it (in comparison to the Army/Marines) are the TACPs…most of those guys have some real big ones and live like and with the grunts for the duration of the opertation.
I was talking to a fighter pilot once in VN and said that I didn’t know how they did it (fly into flak and missiles)…his response was that he didn’t know how we (Grunts) did it. The pods probably started out as a good idea but then some dilettantes got into the act. Most of the AF guys that I know would probably not use them out of embarrassment unless there was a pressing operational reason to do mission planning etc. But, there are prima donnas in all of the Services.
Dingbat63 on July 19, 2008 at 7:48 AM
highhopes on July 19, 2008 at 1:38 AM
I agreed with Squid about tradition in the AF, and agree with you as far as it goes. But your just picking now. You were probably a “my Dad can beat up your Dad” kind of kind huh?
Each service has it’s own problems and it’s own bennies.
Am I envious? Honestly, sometimes I am. I wish the AF had a deeper tradition. There are probably a lot of AF people who feel he same way I do.
But you just want to bash the AF for some perception that we either don’t work or aren’t as committed to our own as other services. You can speak to personal examples all day, so can I. But I’m not stupid enough to denigrate an entire service for the inequiteis of a few – like you.
I have never met a member from a sister service or my own that I would not lay down my life for. I don’t give a shit what service tab they have over their left chest pocket.
At least I understand some things transcend a service patch.
catmman on July 19, 2008 at 10:47 AM
As long as the sister services poke fun at my choice of service I will make sure to poke fun at their lack of intelligence.
After my ASVAB score came in the Navy wanted me for nuke engineering. I personally did not want a head start on something that sunk, nor did I want to hot-bunk like my Uncle did.
F15Mech on July 20, 2008 at 8:09 PM
BDU-33 on July 22, 2008 at 12:40 AM
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