Obama: Your kids should learn Spanish
posted at 7:46 am on July 9, 2008 by Ed Morrissey
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Barack Obama addressed the issue of official languages yesterday by endorsing one: Spanish. Instead of worrying about immigrants learning English, he told an audience, America should be teaching its children Spanish. Every child should be bilingual, Obama said, but listen to the language he chooses later:
It’s embarrassing when Europeans come over here, they all speak English, they speak French, they speak German. And then we go over to Europe and all we can say is merci beaucoup,
Well, which is it — should we teach them Spanish or French? Maybe we should teach them Chinese, or perhaps Arabic. Immigrants come from around the world to live in America. Perhaps Obama doesn’t realize this, but they don’t all speak Spanish. If our children have to learn foreign languages so that immigrants feel at home here, then we’d better plan on keeping them in school for about 30 years.
Also, Obama’s argument here makes no sense. He’s complaining that Americans don’t speak the native language when we visit Europe, but that we don’t speak the immigrant language when people move to the United States. With that argument, shouldn’t we expect Europeans to speak English when we travel there?
I agree that everyone should learn a foreign language. I spoke French for a while, and I know a little Spanish from growing up in Southern California, and I studied Irish for several years. The study of foreign language not only broadens one’s cultural perspective, but it also helps in understanding one’s native tongue. However, to argue that Americans should learn Spanish as a higher priority than insisting that immigrants learn English is nonsense, and Obama’s argument for it is a giant non-sequitur. It carries a strong whiff of America-bashing, too.
Update: Andrew Leonard has the usual counterargument at Salon:
There’s nothing particularly exceptional about Obama’s position, unless you are an English-only partisan cowering in fear of your cultural identity being swamped by funny-looking people from strange lands. Or one of the similarly insecure patriots who believe any criticism of the U.S. is a sign of “blame-America-first” treachery. And I suppose the whole comment about “going to Europe” opens Obama up to more charges of elitism, and disconnection from the lives of those who, right now, can’t afford to even think about going to Europe.
But to most people who actually grasp the fact that we live in a complex, interconnected global economy, being able to speak more than one language just makes a lot of sense. Maybe those of us who do feel threatened by Spanish-language signs in government offices would sleep a little easier if we understood what they they were saying.
No one argues that a second language doesn’t help, but like Obama, Leonard seems to have divided the world into English and Spanish. Government offices produce literature and signs in a multitude of languages; are we to learn all of them instead of having immigrants learn English? Putting the onus of assimilation on the host is not just impractical, it’s downright rude.
If I emigrated to a country where English was not the language, I would not demand that the government produce signs and panphlets in English; I’d learn the language. My children would learn it as well if I expected them to succeed in their new land.
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It would be very nice if our education system actually taught our children other languages, much in the same way foreign countries in Europe especially teach English in their systems. Of course in the world of be “be very afraid” GOP politics … learning another language is like surrendering. There is a reason McCain leads Obama in people with a HS education or less in this country.
Monkei on July 9, 2008 at 12:36 PM
at 12:09 PM
It didn’t begin with your target. It certainly won’t end with Berry. Kindly drop the harrassment, por favor.
maverick muse on July 9, 2008 at 12:38 PM
And Obama’s any different?
I don’t like McCain, but how you can criticize him on something Obama agrees with him on and would probably go even further on?
Esthier on July 9, 2008 at 12:38 PM
Nice tolerance lib.
carbon_footprint on July 9, 2008 at 12:39 PM
Naaa I already have a reputation on here as being a meanie. Or unedumacated. But then again, I am not worried about it!
upinak on July 9, 2008 at 12:39 PM
Don’t forget, WE (as in those who believe in freedom) are the RACISTS!
upinak on July 9, 2008 at 12:40 PM
True dat Upinak.
carbon_footprint on July 9, 2008 at 12:41 PM
Did you read anything anyone as written anywhere in this post?
Esthier on July 9, 2008 at 12:41 PM
WORD!
Hooked on Da Phoniz werkd 4 me!
upinak on July 9, 2008 at 12:41 PM
I didn’t take your comment as a challenge, just a cue to clarify my earlier comment. No harm, no foul.
RushBaby on July 9, 2008 at 12:42 PM
Another Liberal twig eating tree humping neo-democrat bumper car thread disruptor.
If you ignore it, it may go away!
upinak on July 9, 2008 at 12:43 PM
You do not understand europe and its education pressures (vis a vis languages) at all.
Outside of the narcissistic pantomime-world of contemporary liberalism, people generally learn languages in proportion with their perceived barriers to communication. Europe has far more barriers than America - hence less pressure here to spend valuable educational resources on learning multiple languages.
Why do you think undeveloped countries place so much prime emphasis on learning english?
LimeyGeek on July 9, 2008 at 12:43 PM
Just wanted to make sure. Glad we’re both fine.
Esthier on July 9, 2008 at 12:44 PM
I should have. My mistake.
Esthier on July 9, 2008 at 12:45 PM
I wish I could learn German so I could understand my damned Volkswagen…
mimi1220 on July 9, 2008 at 12:45 PM
Always.
RushBaby on July 9, 2008 at 12:45 PM
You are trying to teach it to dance aren’t you?!
Limey, come over here so we may talk and shoot some targets with our Bows. BTW I just bought a Diamond, Edge. I am such a begginer!
upinak on July 9, 2008 at 12:48 PM
Kini on July 9, 2008 at 12:15 PM
The phonics utilize the vowels, not too heavy on consonants–in a rhapsodic nature. Native American languages seem to use vowels similarly but perhaps with a different rhythm. I’ve only heard stuff in the movies, so this is merely a first impression/ no idea what’s being said.
maverick muse on July 9, 2008 at 12:48 PM
If I’m ever in your neck of the woods, I’d be proud to go shootin’ with ya…..my wife might humiliate us both with her skills, though ;)
LimeyGeek on July 9, 2008 at 12:50 PM
You caught it! Obama doing Jim Crow, “VIVA LA UNCLE TOM” to anyone who opposes the Obamaton.
How ’bout that. We’re trained to not see and hear what is before us. Good catch!
maverick muse on July 9, 2008 at 12:53 PM
Plus, what language should we begin teaching from pre-K on?
They learn our language, because it’s the best return on investment. There is no perfect language for Americans to learn as children.
Spanish can be helpful, but it’s far from perfect. And if you don’t use it regularly, then you’ll lose it.
Esthier on July 9, 2008 at 12:53 PM
RIGHT ON! Women rock, I could introduce her to a lady up here who has actually killed a polar bear with a bow. She is freaking cool! I wanna be her when I grow up.
upinak on July 9, 2008 at 12:54 PM
Latin is a form of Spanish.
I don’t see why teaching Latin would not go well.
upinak on July 9, 2008 at 12:55 PM
My children have all been REQUIRED to learn Spanish. While I am not happy with the state of all the illegals, I am a realist and recognize my children will be better off for having learned Spanish. My 15 year old daughter protests the mandate, but I am confident she will not regret the decision.
I learned French when I was younger, I always believed it was important to know the language of ones enemy. I wish I would have learned Spanish instead.
JHL on July 9, 2008 at 12:55 PM
Mallard T. Drake on July 9, 2008 at 12:27 PM
Touché!
point well reasoned
still, at least to study Latin for a year before graduation highschool would benefit everyone, cost effective to budget
maverick muse on July 9, 2008 at 12:58 PM
Me too ;)
LimeyGeek on July 9, 2008 at 12:58 PM
So does that mean you are going to go out and get Rosetta Stone software and learn a type of Arabic?
upinak on July 9, 2008 at 12:58 PM
BHO has definitely lost whatever common sense he ever had.
libhater on July 9, 2008 at 1:03 PM
Upinak,
No need to learn Arabic. I figure that with Iran, they will all be blown back to Babel and wont have any language that will be necessary to learn. I jest~
Bottom line, Knowing Spanish in the South Western US has advantages in business. It may disgust some of you, but you cannot deny it.
JHL on July 9, 2008 at 1:03 PM
I agree that there is no ‘perfect’ language, as there is no perfect one-size-fits-all education that prepares everyone for everything they could possibly face in the future.
I would argue that from a contemporary American perspective, the most valuable two languages to learn would be latin and spanish (If I had to cut it down to one, I’d opt for latin - learning spanish later would be a snap).
Spanish for obvious reasons, and latin because of the foundation it lays for future voluntary language learning - the world is being shrunk by faster and cheaper travel and communications (notably the net), so picking up a smattering of various languages can be useful ‘lubricant’.
LimeyGeek on July 9, 2008 at 1:03 PM
It would, but it just wouldn’t help if you’re traveling to another country.
It would probably be very helpful as a building block for teaching new languages though. I know when I first started learning Spanish I wasn’t even prepared for the way words were structured.
Esthier on July 9, 2008 at 1:03 PM
If I didn’t know better, and I’m begining to wonder, I would swear that both Oscar and Myers are runing for el Presidente of Mexicrap.
MB4 on July 9, 2008 at 1:03 PM
upinak, it’s just the gutteral consonants and the very sharp “t” usage that lent Deutsch it’s low class image through the 19th Century in Europe. Actually, Spanish “*ss-hole” has that gutteral spit opportunity to enunciate con fuoco. Equal opportunity to share in anger.
maverick muse on July 9, 2008 at 1:04 PM
Here it is in Russian: zamul’chi (sp)
From what I’ve heard, Obama’s only other language is the one native to Indonesia; the one he learned as a child. No word on whether he has learned one voluntarily.
baldilocks on July 9, 2008 at 1:07 PM
Presuming these arrogant toads, the author and by extension Obama, were referring to my grandparents who could not wait to learn english because they were PROUD to become integrated into American life?
And our alternative is Juan McVain reminding everyone (revisionist history) that “Spanish was spoken in Arizona before English.”
Yeah, McVain is different then the Dems how, again?
Branch Rickey on July 9, 2008 at 1:08 PM
Actually you are incorrect. Spain, Italy, Morocco, Portugal, France (in some dialects) and parts of Algeria speak fluent Spanish with a dialect (Even the Greek men and women understand Spanish). All of them are very Latin-esqe! And since most our Southern Friends (aka below our border) speak a lower form of Spanish (compared to Spain) it is not hard to understand them if you learn Latin.
upinak on July 9, 2008 at 1:09 PM
I’m all for my children learning Spanish, or French or Latin…whatever they CHOOSE to learn. I object to my children potentially being FORCED to learn Spanish because our borders are being overrun by illegal aliens.
Pulchritudinous Patriot on July 9, 2008 at 1:11 PM
Mav oh I know. Germany was a eye opening experience for me, but I did notice how simular our words were compared to German. American English is more grutteral then people realize.
But hey, I have been told I sound like I am from Minnesota/Wisconson… you know my Alaskan Accent ;-)
upinak on July 9, 2008 at 1:11 PM
I object to the existence of the entire gubmint monkey-grinder edumacation system.
LimeyGeek on July 9, 2008 at 1:13 PM
So you’re saying that someone who is fluent in Latin will be able to converse with people who speak Spanish?
Esthier on July 9, 2008 at 1:14 PM
Not fluently, but they can get the grasp.
I was at one time fluent in Latin. Not anymore of course, but I could understand Spanish usually with no problems unless they have some sort of accent, usually due to their dialect and country.
Reading it is a totally different thing though.
upinak on July 9, 2008 at 1:17 PM
I wish I knew Spanish, then when we outsourced our maintenance work to India I could have spoken with… wait, that was Hindi? Damn, bad example.
But when I called tech support in Korea I could have… oh, not Spanish either? Ok, try again.
Well when I was reading some of the translations of early Math/Physics texts and wanted to read the originals… German? Ok fine.
But in the Global Marketplace the second up-and-coming behind English is… wait, Chinese?
Ok, so why do I “need” Spanish exactly? If I took my old roommate’s job managing a restaurant in a large city, yes Spanish would be a boon. In my industry, I’ve never even wanted it.
But Monkei would (I guess) prefer our school system to teach English, Spanish, Chinese, Korean, Russian, German, French, Portuguese, Polish, Japanese, Dutch, and French.
Given the educational system we have, this should only require 60 or 70 years of high school. Our kids will be perfectly ready to be productive members of the global economy as soon as they graduate at the age of 85 or so.
Or maybe we could try to apply some focus to education to get them to be self-sufficient productive members of society before they retire. The economy will struggle a bit with no workers and no production. Yes, it may be a utopia otherwise, but that’s a big “otherwise”.
gekkobear on July 9, 2008 at 1:18 PM
I’d agree that for today’s youth, begin with the Classic LATIN, begin with the root for requirement to graduate and prerequisite before taking Spanish.
I opted for German, myself. I waited until after German and French to take Latin because somehow I had been given the backward fear that Latin was difficult. I stayed with German because of my major interest. But like my siblings, my children chose Spanish; and my son says that it is actually a most perfunctory language (routine predictability in structure) compared to Italian for example.
maverick muse on July 9, 2008 at 1:19 PM
Darn it all, there we had a good reason to be mad at the Democrats and show how out of the mainstream Obama is and McCain goes and screws it up by being no different.
Snake307 on July 9, 2008 at 1:21 PM
carbon_footprint on July 9, 2008 at 12:39 PM
“And, tomorrow is another day!”
If the likes of Scarlett O’Hara could figure that out, those who won’t let go of an ol’ grudge need time out.
maverick muse on July 9, 2008 at 1:22 PM
The military taught me German and Russian while I was in my twenties. At DLI, it’s either sink or swim.
(Re)learning English grammar facilitated the usage of both.
baldilocks on July 9, 2008 at 1:24 PM
Ok so explain to me how I understood this women in a German Perfume store perfectly while I was drunk off my but asking for a certain expensive prefume?
I am still amazed I knew exactly what she was saying.
upinak on July 9, 2008 at 1:26 PM
Baldi, is it true that German and Russian, even though miles apart are very simular to learn?
upinak on July 9, 2008 at 1:29 PM
I would say no.
baldilocks on July 9, 2008 at 1:32 PM
Great point!
becki51758 on July 9, 2008 at 1:35 PM
Alcohol helps language comprehension. Really, it does. :-)
baldilocks on July 9, 2008 at 1:37 PM
Ah. I’ve never tried that.
Esthier on July 9, 2008 at 1:40 PM
Guess so! Damn Milka Coffee with Baily’s! I miss German alcohol, good stuff and NO hangovers!
upinak on July 9, 2008 at 1:42 PM
upinak on July 9, 2008 at 1:11 PM
Funny, I never noticed my friends from Alaska or Idaho having an accent. My native Arizonan accent was more influenced via Western States than Southern. Austin natives participating in the cosmopolitan university society don’t speak with a “Texan” accent, either. And in Texas, there are multiple Texan accents, anyway. I do enjoy hearing a genteel Southern drawl that actually has more akin with the King’s English than Yankee chewing does. No offense, folks, just an opinion. And I said “akin” not “match”. You don’t hear Margaret Thatcher, Tony Blair or the Queen or Prince of England snipping through sentences the way folks from NE zip through the language. It’s the warm attention given vowels that I like, and the time during delivery to think not only of the message intended from the speaker but of my reaction before responding.
maverick muse on July 9, 2008 at 1:43 PM
Allah did a thread on Sarah Palin, and mentioned she had a accent much like Minnesotians. I sound very much like Sarah, and thought it funny. NO, I am NOT Sarah.
But I agree on the Soft Southern… :)
upinak on July 9, 2008 at 1:46 PM
1:21
problem verbatim?
An realist would point out that ANY legislation is going to be a can of worms, that compromise is the necessity of passing a bill.
As a citizen, I would be ever so grateful to simply have the current laws enforced, no reform, no more legislation. Just secure the damn border and enforce the rule of law, and NO NEW TAXES. Starting my Christmas wish list early.
maverick muse on July 9, 2008 at 1:51 PM
B Husein should say what he really means - he’s embarassed that English is the dominant language, today. This is just one more piece of the Trinity/Wright attitude. I don’t know how many more ways BHO can express his hate for America. I guess we’ll find out.
Personally, I would very much prefer it if B Husein would carry out the rest of his campaign in Spanish only.
progressoverpeace on July 9, 2008 at 1:51 PM
upinak on July 9, 2008 at 1:46 PM
I was there.
maverick muse on July 9, 2008 at 1:52 PM
LOL! She was speaking to you in English and you thought you understood her German. Thanks for the riddle. I’m still laughing.
maverick muse on July 9, 2008 at 1:55 PM
I agree for practical reasons, choose what is practical.
maverick muse on July 9, 2008 at 1:57 PM
NO, she was speaking in German! I was over near Heidelburg.. I have witnesses. An ex was there and can confirm it. He was amazed!
upinak on July 9, 2008 at 1:58 PM
OK, so if she was speaking in German and you were drunk, the topic was self explanatory? Eye contact works, as does body language. And yes, German/English are closely related. (But I like my first answer better.)
maverick muse on July 9, 2008 at 2:01 PM
So basically, Americans should learn French and German because French and Germans learn English? Hey Obama, there’s a reason why the French and the Germans learn English. A reason that isn’t generally necessary for Americans. Figure it out.
English is the only truly global language, a language that most nations around the world have silently agreed can be a common language used to communicate across the world. That isn’t the case for Spanish, French, or German.
Sure, Spanish would help some Americans who work with people from South America, but learning Spanish won’t help Americans at all when they travel to Europe. It’s astounding that Obama, a supposedly intelligent man, doesn’t see this.
Try speaking Spanish on a trip to Denmark, Obama, see how smart you feel then.
Seixon on July 9, 2008 at 2:05 PM
The Messiah speaks. The real question is how does it benefit Michelle O’s kids. Really, let’s see if those self-rightous hypocrites will force their spawn to learn the language of the poor, illiterate illegals.
Judgement you can laugh at.
Zorg on July 9, 2008 at 2:07 PM
BHo makes mcCain look strong on immigration. I really didn’t think that was possible but it was.
unseen on July 9, 2008 at 2:07 PM
No, he doesn’t.
Darksean on July 9, 2008 at 2:08 PM
No, he doesn’t.
Darksean on July 9, 2008 at 2:08 PM
Let’s see an open border person that wants the entire country to learn the langauge of our invaders, have no border secuirty, give everyone amensty. against someone that wants to “secure” the border, have our language as the offical language and give guest worker priviliges and some type of amensty.
while neither is “strong” on immigration one IS stronger than the other.
Of the two which is stronger on immigration?
unseen on July 9, 2008 at 2:14 PM
Your highlighted McCain excerpt:
“without excusing the fact they came here illegally or granting them privileges before those who have been waiting their turn outside the country.”
I’ll start mine now, too, with the wish that McCain would quit saying things that are patently false.
McCain has no intention of denying the illegals the privilege of staying here until the all those now in line have entered the country, unless he intends to add a provision to the Shamnesty legislation that all lines are null and void — if I remember correctly, Linda Chavez said the line in Mexico was 40 years long.
Dusty on July 9, 2008 at 2:16 PM
I wish that McShame and his supporters would stop talking about ‘immigration’ when they are refering to the issue of illegal aliens.
progressoverpeace on July 9, 2008 at 2:22 PM
Gee, I have never seen that before…gosh,not2bright, here are a couple others that trolls with no arguments use.
right2bdumb
neverright2bright
right2bwrong
there are others but not2bright is the most popular among posters with no substance. Of course flenser thinks he had it first, but it was honora, a banned poster (2006) that first used it. She was about as smart as you…
Here you can call me, stupid, racist (a flenser favorite), dumb, ignorant, branch ritchey (plus she caught me ending a sentence in a preposition) has some good ones, so does fossten. Funny, they are all McCain bashers (and joined in the past couple of weeks)…imagine that.
Let me know if you need any more derogatory names, with your argument you seem to need them.
right2bright on July 9, 2008 at 2:25 PM
There are some classics on this thread…this is one.
right2bright on July 9, 2008 at 2:26 PM
What????
You mean there are many Spanish words that are Latin derivative. As are English, French, Italian, etc.
right2bright on July 9, 2008 at 2:32 PM
It is the afternoon, has Obama changed his mind on this yet?
right2bright on July 9, 2008 at 2:33 PM
smiles brightly!
DING DING DING DING! But Latin and Spanish are very close to each other.
upinak on July 9, 2008 at 2:34 PM
I don’t like McCain, but how you can criticize him on something Obama agrees with him on and would probably go even further on?
Esthier on July 9, 2008 at 12:38 PM
Because Obama is not running as the CONSERVATIVE candidate. Obama doesn’t court the other side of the aisle shopping for a better deal either. McSHAME is a traitor to the GOP and true conservatives.
DanKenton on July 9, 2008 at 2:43 PM
Ah kno! We’s so dum! Kant u halp us mistr smrt liburul?!?
.
.
.
Wut wur we talkin bout?
SouthernDem on July 9, 2008 at 2:44 PM
So, you’re saying you have an entourage of critics? Imagine my surprise…
DanKenton on July 9, 2008 at 2:47 PM
me thinks that you need to switch over to the side of light. me thinks you go to no where and bounds of rage. yes?!?
upinak on July 9, 2008 at 2:49 PM
It’s embarrassing when Europeans come over here, they all speak English, they speak French, they speak German. And then we go over to Europe and all we can say is merci beaucoup,
whats embarrassing is this amateur is one step from the Presidency.
I have to slap myself sometimes.
P.S. dont worry, this idiotic position is bound to change soon.
Sonosam on July 9, 2008 at 2:49 PM
Obama’s arrogance and condescension are truly boundless.
phronesis on July 9, 2008 at 2:59 PM
upinak on July 9, 2008 at 2:49 PM
Me thinks you need to purchase Hooked On Phonics post haste.
DanKenton on July 9, 2008 at 3:03 PM
Methinks you need to cease being a pillock.
LimeyGeek on July 9, 2008 at 3:07 PM
Please everyone………..ILLEGAL ALIENS
VikingGoneWild on July 9, 2008 at 3:07 PM
I am going to grab some popcorn. This could get drama-obama-tised!
upinak on July 9, 2008 at 3:07 PM
Dan is the perfect chia pet. I just wonder if the seeds are going to grow or mold, like they typically do!
upinak on July 9, 2008 at 3:08 PM
There is a reason McCain leads Obama in people with a HS education or less in this country.
Monkei on July 9, 2008 at 12:36 PM
they’ve had less indoctrination?
unseen on July 9, 2008 at 3:09 PM
Look at the name, stop and think. It is like arguing with mold on a rock.
upinak on July 9, 2008 at 3:11 PM
I wasn’t aware that McCain was. If anything, many have seen his nomination as proof that conservativism is dead.
That’s not entirely true. Haven’t you noticed all his latest flips? He may not be trying to appeal to conservatives (though I can’t say what else his faith-based comment was otherwise), but he’s certainly trying to look centrist.
Really, they both have that in common. They both openly court the Left while trying to appear to be moderates.
Every time Obama gives me a reason to vote against him, McCain opens his mouth and does the same thing.
Seems a little extreme. He’s not much of a conservative, but then he never really was. It’s not as though he suddenly changed after being elected.
I don’t know. I’m having a really hard time caring. What’s the best we can do? Vote Obama? That will possibly be worse and certainly won’t be any better.
Most conservatives seem to be hoping McCain will listen to us once he gets elected, but I just don’t buy that. Which only leaves sitting home or voting third party.
Esthier on July 9, 2008 at 3:13 PM
upinak on July 9, 2008 at 3:08 PM
Pretty lame Upinass.
DanKenton on July 9, 2008 at 3:13 PM
Lame or not I didn’t call you a name other then your were a plant, which is actually a gag at best. Void of feelings, or life. Pond Scum is a better term for something such as yourself.
Go take your lips and plant them on Obama’s butt… and I hope you get banned.
upinak on July 9, 2008 at 3:17 PM
Illegal immigrant is the same.
The only complaint should be if people drop the illegal.
Esthier on July 9, 2008 at 3:28 PM
I would have no problem with this, if the Democrats were working as hard as possible to promote free trade in the Americas, fighting to widen NAFTA, promote CAFTA, seek out new agreements with Chile and Argentina. So that the purpose of learning Spanish was to promote international trade and investment, more effective outsourcing, help us better design products for Latin American markets.
But that’s not what this is about. Democrats want to compel your children to learn Spanish to talk to illegal immigrants and their offspring here in America.
Anil Petra on July 9, 2008 at 3:30 PM
No, illegal aliens are not ‘immigrants’ of any sort. If anything, you can call them what we all used to, ‘migrants’, but not ‘immigrants’.
progressoverpeace on July 9, 2008 at 3:31 PM
upinak on July 9, 2008 at 3:17 PM
You stay classy, Upinass
DanKenton on July 9, 2008 at 3:32 PM
If I didn’t know any better, I think you have a serious beta crush on me. Darn the shame I don’t go for second rate. Sucks to be you.
upinak on July 9, 2008 at 3:38 PM
How are they not immigrants? They have immigrated from one country into another.
That says nothing of how they immigrated, only that they did.
The illegal part explains the how.
Esthier on July 9, 2008 at 3:42 PM
upinak on July 9, 2008 at 3:38 PM*snork!* Everyone here knows your little stalker is waaaaaay outclassed.
RushBaby on July 9, 2008 at 3:44 PM
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