Did Hillary submarine Obama on FISA reform?
posted at 3:33 pm on July 9, 2008 by Ed Morrissey
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An interesting shift happened during the run-up to the final vote on the FISA reform bill this afternoon. Both Barack Obama and Hillary Clinton voted in favor of amendments that would have stripped telecom immunity from the House bill up for a vote today. Neither amendment came close to passage, and the Senate next moved to a cloture vote — which allowed one last opportunity for a filibuster.
Originally, both Hillary and Obama voted for cloture. However, Hillary changed her vote before the tally closed, opposing cloture and supporting a filibuster. A little later, she voted against the FISA reform — only one of 28 votes against — while Obama voted for its passage.
Has Hillary decided to woo the netroots in a bid to resurrect her presidential ambitions for 2008? Obama hasn’t technically clinched the nomination yet. The superdelegates can still change their minds before the first vote at the Denver convention. Moreover, Obama hasn’t exactly broken a leg in a rush to assist her in retiring her campaign debt, either.
Could she have calculated her actions today in order to generate a grass-roots effort to get the nomination? If so, could it work?
Update: Some commenters wonder whether this was an attempt to force her way onto the ticket as VP. In fact, I think she just made that option even less likely than before. Candidates do not choose running mates who make a point of showing them up, as Hillary just did today.
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Nothing that woman does is without calculation.
rockmom on July 9, 2008 at 3:35 PM
Hillary is the only one who can save us now!
pseudonominus on July 9, 2008 at 3:35 PM
“Can she be this machiavelian?”
That’s rhetorical, right?
MarkTheGreat on July 9, 2008 at 3:36 PM
Machiavellian, indeed. “The Princess”.
Badger in KC on July 9, 2008 at 3:37 PM
or sabatoge him and position for 2012
jp on July 9, 2008 at 3:38 PM
Could it work?
Probably not. On the other hand the nutroots are mighty upset with the messiah over his on again, off again, support for immediate withdrawl from Iraq, and that appears to be the only issue that matters to them right now.
MarkTheGreat on July 9, 2008 at 3:38 PM
She would make the old guy green with envy.
jukin on July 9, 2008 at 3:39 PM
the kooks over at Lew Rockwell and Mises are going nuts over this(FISA).
jp on July 9, 2008 at 3:39 PM
Obama’s income stream seems to be drying up. If the nutroots get any more disillusioned with him, it will dry up even further.
I wonder how it would play if Obama decided that he was going to take public financing after all?
MarkTheGreat on July 9, 2008 at 3:39 PM
Clinton probably no longer considers her nomination inevitable.
But she thinks she still has a significant chance, I’d estimate a double digit percentage, of victory in August. She always considered November a certitude if nominated.
Anil Petra on July 9, 2008 at 3:40 PM
That photo is a PhotoShop owner’s dream.
Akzed on July 9, 2008 at 3:41 PM
All roads lead to Denver. Bill Richardson just had an anxiety attack.
a capella on July 9, 2008 at 3:43 PM
“Can she (Her Satanic Majesty Hillary) be this Machiavellian?”
Something comes to mind about bears, the woods and defecation
Sekhmet on July 9, 2008 at 3:44 PM
Chaos !!!
BowHuntingTexas on July 9, 2008 at 3:44 PM
Is it a little ironic that the campaign plane used by Hillary was the one that malfunctioned for Obama in St. Louis the other day. The rear emergency slide deployed in flight which could have had serious consequences.
No comment by Vince Foster
trs on July 9, 2008 at 3:44 PM
Hillary Judas Clinton
Dr.Cwac.Cwac on July 9, 2008 at 3:45 PM
Never bet on Al Gore or Bill Richardson. They are always wrong. You can set your watch to it :)
JiangxiDad on July 9, 2008 at 3:45 PM
She’s Back! I wonder what she has been doing. Boy is she a sneaky one.
jencab on July 9, 2008 at 3:45 PM
Let’s hope so. Whatever/whoever saves this country from becoming an Obamanation is fine by me.
Go Hillary — don’t let this tool steal your nomination. Do whatever it takes!
AZCoyote on July 9, 2008 at 3:46 PM
Nor from Ron Brown.
txsurveyor on July 9, 2008 at 3:47 PM
Ed, over-interpretation is on the road to paranoia. It’s no surprise that someone has already brought up Vince Foster. Is our destination Hillary’s plan to Islamize America?
thuja on July 9, 2008 at 3:48 PM
Machiavelli wrapped up with Rasputin, sprinkled with Stalin, and garnished with a sprig of Beelzebub.
RushBaby on July 9, 2008 at 3:48 PM
She was behind Brown’s demise as well? I had no idea!
pseudonominus on July 9, 2008 at 3:50 PM
Yes, Hillsry is good at submarining.
tarpon on July 9, 2008 at 3:51 PM
Noooooooooooo. Hillary will walk in at the last minute and save the day. She will win. Obama must be the candidate.
JiangxiDad on July 9, 2008 at 3:51 PM
I don’t know. This seems appropriate.
What type of spin miracle are we likely to see from Barry?
Dr.Cwac.Cwac on July 9, 2008 at 3:51 PM
CHAOS!!!
BohicaTwentyTwo on July 9, 2008 at 3:52 PM
Yes, this was a calculated move by her.
No, it won’t work to get her the nod. It will pay off for her, however.
-It can increase pressure from the nutroots to put her on the ticket.
-It can lead to more $ from disenchanted nutroots to retire her debt.
-It may help prevent Obama from winning in November, giving her a chance at 2012.
At any rate, it was worth a try at voting against a bill that was going to pass anyway.
And, on another topic, Bush is a pretty effective lame-duck President considering how “dumb” our media knows he is.
cs89 on July 9, 2008 at 3:52 PM
He has increased the lunatic fringe turnout in Denver. And he will look so moderate by comparison. The MSM will have a wide palate to edit, copy and paste from.
snaggletoothie on July 9, 2008 at 3:53 PM
Doubt it would work to change the eventual nomination. But, it’s definitely a good whack to BO’s kneecaps, as he’s been suckered into going against the nutroots while she’s gone with them. The Kos kidz are definitely going to be disappointed with BO over this vote.
thirteen28 on July 9, 2008 at 3:54 PM
An old saying for Barack: Keep your friends close……and your enemies closer.
Dr.Cwac.Cwac on July 9, 2008 at 3:54 PM
defecation??
Isn’t that what Hillary did on Obama?
MarkTheGreat on July 9, 2008 at 3:55 PM
Worth keeping an eye, perhaps?
Wildcatter1980 on July 9, 2008 at 3:55 PM
Or stir up the nutroots against BO enough that his only chance at election is that she rides in on a white horse and takes the VP slot, thus rounding up the nutball base, and saving the campaign for POTUS for the Dhimmicrats. She would be a LEGEND! And first in line if something, er, uh, “happened” to him. (still no comment from Vince Foster).
iurockhead on July 9, 2008 at 3:55 PM
New Hillary Ad: This is not the Obama I knew.
chief on July 9, 2008 at 3:56 PM
At the very least, they should have put the brand of a hot iron on Hester Prynne’s forehead. Madam Hester would have winced at that, I warrant me. But she, the naughty baggage, little will she care what they put upon the bodice of her gown! Why, look you, she may cover it with a brooch, or such like heathenish adornment, and so walk the streets as brave as ever! – The Scarlet Letter
Limerick on July 9, 2008 at 3:56 PM
Or was it an attempt to be Obama’s VP ?
William Amos on July 9, 2008 at 3:56 PM
That picture at top just screams” I know it was you Fredo, you broke my heart”
Tazz 55 on July 9, 2008 at 3:57 PM
By forcing him to take her to appease the nutroots. Am I right?
Dr.Cwac.Cwac on July 9, 2008 at 3:58 PM
Seriously, is anyone surprised by this? Captain Ed’s previous post on this asked the question if she was reading the HuffPo piece regarding the FISA vote. Could she have been (or at least had a lackey) watching the fever swamp? A serious possibility. There is a story from Wired of a new coalition of liberals and libertarians that will target Democrats (specifically) for capitulating and supporting the FISA reforms.
Such a coalition would be a boon to Hillary and a bane to Obama if it has enough steam. Granted, that grass-roots pressure will be directed in two ways:
A) It will put more money in her coffers for a general election run, and
B) They will begin doing what Hillary has been doing which is lobbying the SuperDs to abandon Obama at the convention.
Recall, if you will, the infamous screed from the MoveOn.numbnuts crowd in 2005:
“We bought it, we own it, and we’re taking it back.”
LOL. The fever swamp isn’t to be trifled with, and they could very well become the backbone of a resurgent Hillary campaign.
Thomas
MrAndMrsSmith on July 9, 2008 at 4:01 PM
Payback for him hiring Patti Solis Doyle as the chief of staff for his VP choice? Which sent a message that she wouldn’t be the VP nominee?
Basically he was telling her to p*** off. So she returned the gesture.
Wethal on July 9, 2008 at 4:02 PM
So, she’s back to his left? Can we drop the “strange new respect” now?
joewm315 on July 9, 2008 at 4:02 PM
Obama needs the clintons now. He needs to get over the hard feelings that occurred during the primaries.
Hillary had no reason to vote against this bill other than the get the left behind her VP Bid.
William Amos on July 9, 2008 at 4:03 PM
Watch for her next move.
That will be a tell.
fogw on July 9, 2008 at 4:03 PM
Worse. She’s Clintonian.
amerpundit on July 9, 2008 at 4:05 PM
Dropped and stomped on.
RushBaby on July 9, 2008 at 4:05 PM
She just did it to prove a point – that she’s not a flip flopper and Obama is. I think is was a “ha ha f*** you” moment. She played it well.
pullingmyhairout on July 9, 2008 at 4:06 PM
Nacho Lebra
2006
1GooDDaDDy on July 9, 2008 at 4:07 PM
This whole episode, for all the sound and fury, is an utter defeat for the netroots. Here’s more, “The Left’s FISA Orwellianism”:
http://americanpowerblog.blogspot.com/2008/07/lefts-fisa-orwellianism.html
Donald Douglas on July 9, 2008 at 4:08 PM
Obama supporters resist paying Clinton campaign debt (7/9/08)
Wethal on July 9, 2008 at 4:08 PM
I don’t know what’s she got up her pantsuit sleeve, but I do know it’s been a blast to watch.
Bob's Kid on July 9, 2008 at 4:10 PM
obama did vote for FISA but he is against it, so really you can not hold him accountable for voting for it. oh and W is the devil.
custer on July 9, 2008 at 4:11 PM
Hillary and Nader? Naw, but the thought of a third party is still there.
Hillary will not go away until the final vote at the convention.
right2bright on July 9, 2008 at 4:12 PM
Breaking: Hannity reports that during a conference, Jesse Jackson was speaking. Not knowing that the mic was open, Jesse Jackson made disparaging remarks about Obama. “I want to rip his nuts off.”
Dr.Cwac.Cwac on July 9, 2008 at 4:13 PM
What if she did it to try and make Obama more appealing to the center-right?
It would look like Clinton is now to the left, and Obama is to the right of Clinton, is it a ploy to make him more appealing to the not so up to date voters?
WoosterOh on July 9, 2008 at 4:14 PM
Face it, Hillary has something that Barama does not have; balls.
carbon_footprint on July 9, 2008 at 4:15 PM
Ever so cool.
Can it be true?
1GooDDaDDy on July 9, 2008 at 4:15 PM
Can Obama take this as a back stab ? Hillary didnt directly attack Obama she simply took a stand on a controversial bill.
Im not saying Obama wont take this as a slight but the nutroots have to be placated and that is who hillary played up to with this vote. I dont think she aimed this as much at hurting Obama as improving her stand with the left.
Obama will be under a lot of pressure now from the left and he has to address it some how.
William Amos on July 9, 2008 at 4:15 PM
See my comment above: Barama has none.
carbon_footprint on July 9, 2008 at 4:16 PM
/gets out the popcorn…
There are MANY Democrats who are very angry over how the primaries turned out…
Basicly, according to the math I heard, only about 2% of democrats, the ones who went to some very tainted caucases, got Barry the Nom… that he was GIVEN delegates who never voted for him tells the Base that the fix was in… and they are pretty angry over it…
There is even talk of NOT having a televised roll call vote at the convention, which would REALLY play into the weirdness… and the conspiricy theories.
Remember, the left is chock full of conspiricy types… and there is some pretty good evidence to back the fact that Barry was selected, not elected.
I think this convention is going to be really interesting.
Romeo13 on July 9, 2008 at 4:17 PM
Nothing more entertaining…and it ain’t even close to being over.
God, I love this election…every emotion, every snaky move, every trick in the book, no wonder “good” guys can’t win.
right2bright on July 9, 2008 at 4:17 PM
Sounds more like something Hillary would say.
Wethal on July 9, 2008 at 4:18 PM
I don’t think she’s holding out hope for the nomination… this year. Scorched Earth, baby. Can’t you just feel the reconciliation?
Hollowpoint on July 9, 2008 at 4:21 PM
Its like watching Kevin Spacey’s limp go away for the first time.
BohicaTwentyTwo on July 9, 2008 at 4:21 PM
Hannity is going to talk about it on H&C tonight.
Dr.Cwac.Cwac on July 9, 2008 at 4:21 PM
she won’t do that, there will be no other gods but HER
right4life on July 9, 2008 at 4:23 PM
Thanks for the tip, I’ll be sure to tune in later tonight.
1GooDDaDDy on July 9, 2008 at 4:24 PM
She won’t even go away then – if she does not come out on top she will start planning Obama’s political demise and her 2012 run.
Hillary has been very quiet lately and I doubt it is by accident. Since the end of the primaries there has been more and more talk that Obama is a suit, a plant, that some one else is controlling him. That makes no sense to the party, to have their two strongest candidates destroy eachother rather then work together (Clinton/Obama – in that order in 2008) to secure the presidency for the next 16 years. That tells me who ever is pulling Barry’s strings wants the Clintons gone. Hillary is no dummy I am sure that if I have figured this out, she has as well and has been quietly finding out who is really behind the Obama campaign.
Govgirl on July 9, 2008 at 4:28 PM
Look for Jesse HiJackson to issue a quick apology before tonight.
Dr.Cwac.Cwac on July 9, 2008 at 4:29 PM
This procedure needs to be done with great care, so as not to damage Chrissy Matthews nose during said removal.
fogw on July 9, 2008 at 4:33 PM
I thought being on the left means never having to say you’re sorry. ;0
1GooDDaDDy on July 9, 2008 at 4:34 PM
Can she be this machiavelian?
Hmmm. Is a frog’s butt watertight?
innominatus on July 9, 2008 at 4:34 PM
I thought that was a “leg” issue?
1GooDDaDDy on July 9, 2008 at 4:36 PM
No. It means saying sorry that someone else is offended.
Dr.Cwac.Cwac on July 9, 2008 at 4:36 PM
Check out Drudge now.
Dr.Cwac.Cwac on July 9, 2008 at 4:37 PM
Once I thought somebody like Soros. Now I suppose it’s somebody like Limbaugh.
JiangxiDad on July 9, 2008 at 4:38 PM
Highly doubt it’s an accident.
JiangxiDad on July 9, 2008 at 4:39 PM
I’m constantly being offended by everything that the nutroots of the left have been doing to our side (country) for over 40 years.
Where, oh where, is my apology?
1GooDDaDDy on July 9, 2008 at 4:41 PM
Limbaugh? Pulling the strings to the Obama balloon? Only if it is the let the air out.
Govgirl on July 9, 2008 at 4:42 PM
CNN….
Jackson apologizes to Obama.
Dr.Cwac.Cwac on July 9, 2008 at 4:43 PM
It’s all Fox News fault. Watch him use that spin.
Dr.Cwac.Cwac on July 9, 2008 at 4:44 PM
Damn…now THAT was fast!
Gog, I love the information flow on the net. Nothing can get past the us any longer.
That is unless the “Fairness doctrine” makes it.
1GooDDaDDy on July 9, 2008 at 4:46 PM
Had my tongue firmly planted in cheek. But, given Obama’s flame out, his position as the worst possible candidate the left could have chosen after Kucinich and Lurch, and the way it has seemingly done in the Clintons, wouldn’t it be the perfect plot for el Rushbo to hatch–or at least a good idea for a novel!
JiangxiDad on July 9, 2008 at 4:47 PM
This just keeps getting better, I was beginning to think that the Dem convention might not be all that entertaining, but between Hillary, the anti-war nuts, and now the Rev. Jackson himself all in the anti-Obama mix, it could be a hoot. Oh, and don’t forget that if Obama does not get the nomination, Re-Create ‘68 is ready and waiting to riot, just like they did in Chicago.
Govgirl on July 9, 2008 at 4:49 PM
I tried to post the link to CNN, but when I hit submit, the post was not going up.
Dr.Cwac.Cwac on July 9, 2008 at 4:51 PM
Oops, I’m sorry I missed that one.
Govgirl on July 9, 2008 at 4:51 PM
Denver! Denver! Denver!
“Moreover, Obama hasn’t exactly broken a leg in a rush to assist her in retiring her campaign debt, either.”
Neither have the Clinton’s stubbed their toes in loudly pulling for Barry.
They’re not going to do anything until that debt is marked PAID. And that includes their outstanding 12 million.
GarandFan on July 9, 2008 at 4:54 PM
This is what did it.
So asking black males to take responsibility for their actions (a conservative philosophy……centrist move for Barry?) will get you on the Rev. HiJackson’s sh!t list. In Jesse’s world, all African-Americans are victims. None are allowed to be successful and responsible on their own. Gubmint needs to lift them up because they cannot do it on their own. Remember, America has a systemic racism problem .
I predicted after Barack secured the nomination that the race hustlers would not allow him to become president. President Obama = Jesse, Louis, Al out of jobs
Dr.Cwac.Cwac on July 9, 2008 at 4:55 PM
I’m old enough to remember first hand the Dem convention of ‘68. I was serving in Nam as a Marine at the time but even then I thought it was the dems eating ther own young.
We can only pray they do the some thing 40 years later.
1GooDDaDDy on July 9, 2008 at 4:56 PM
My oh my, I’m with you Doc. I saw this coming from the race baiters too.
1GooDDaDDy on July 9, 2008 at 4:59 PM
Zisss izzzzzz verrrrrrrrrrrry innnnnnnnnnterezzzting.
(adjusts monocle)
omnipotent on July 9, 2008 at 5:02 PM
Heh, Hillary “submarined” Obama while her husband Slick Willy is at (wait for it…wait for it) the submarine races!
I couldn’t resist…
Liberty or Death on July 9, 2008 at 5:10 PM
The 1968 convention is the stuff of history books for me, and I teach teenagers about it for a living. But, I also teach them that while those idiots were protesting fine patriots like yourself were sacrificing for their country, thank you for your service.
Govgirl on July 9, 2008 at 5:12 PM
“A babies gotta do, what a babies gotta do”
Tommy Pickles
2001
Thanks.
1GooDDaDDy on July 9, 2008 at 5:15 PM
Does Hilary have a chance at the nominatrion?
wouldn’t it be interesting if suddenly the whole Chicago Annenberg Challenge and william ayers made an appearance in the MSM?
just saying….
galtg on July 9, 2008 at 5:20 PM
Obama moved the acceptance speech to the stadium becuase —Hillary had already booked the convention center.
jerseyman on July 9, 2008 at 5:20 PM
This isn’t blue on blue. It’s slime on slime. It’s all a game to these clowns. America is the least of their concerns.
oakpack on July 9, 2008 at 5:38 PM
the Fat Lady ain’t sung yet, so the show’s not over….
The Clintons are the essential, ultimate Fanatics: they NEVER give up, and that crazy b____ believes she can still gain the nomination
Janos Hunyadi on July 9, 2008 at 5:39 PM
Too funny for words.
Jaibones on July 9, 2008 at 6:48 PM
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