Should Susan Atkins die at home or in prison?
posted at 11:50 am on July 3, 2008 by Ed Morrissey
Send to a Friend |
Share on Facebook | printer-friendly
Few if any murders carry the horrifying cachet of the Manson murders in 1969. The deaths of seven people on two nights at the end of a tumultuous decade combined all of the political and cultural baggage of the era — drugs, counterculture, celebrity, cults, and pure evil in the form of the perpetrators, especially Charles Manson himself. Combining mass murder and serial murder, the Manson Family has played on the imaginations of Americans for almost 40 years, while its members routinely apply for parole and get rejected.
Now one of them faces death, although much different in nature than the deaths she herself inflicted on her victims. Susan Atkins, probably the most committed of all the Tate/LaBianca murderers to Manson himself, has terminal brain cancer and is not expected to live out the year. She wants to be released so that she can die at home, presumably with family and friends. Matthew Schmalz asks in Newsweek whether mercy or retribution should take precedence (via Shaun Mullen):
Justice or mercy? That is the pressing question in what seems to be a coda in the story of the 1969 Manson family murders. At issue is the request by Susan Atkins, now 60, for compassionate release from prison on the grounds of terminal illness.
Apart from Charles Manson himself, Atkins was the public face of the Manson family during the Tate-LaBianca murder trial. She had bragged about mercilessly stabbing the pregnant Sharon Tate and laughed when details of the murders were presented in court. When she received a death sentence, the verdict seemed particularly appropriate. When her punishment was later changed to life imprisonment with possibility parole, it seemed to be a gross distortion of the justice process. If there was an example of unmerited mercy in the criminal justice system, surely this was it.
I have to admit to an-almost lifelong fascination with the Manson case. I grew up in Southern California and read Helter Skelter at 13, just seven years after the murders, and it was the only book that ever scared me — and I used to read everything Stephen King wrote. The bloodthirsty nature of the defendants, especially Atkins, was brought to life by Vincent Bugliosi. Now I oppose the death penalty, but these defendants certainly were the poster children for its imposition, and Atkins only slightly less than Manson himself.
It was Atkins who killed the pregnant actress Sharon Tate, telling her first that she had no mercy for Tate or her unborn child, which makes her plea for mercy now more than a little ghastly. Most people feel that she got more than her allotted measure of mercy from the Supreme Court decision that threw out their death-penalty sentences.
In view of her illness, though, the issue is worth discussing. Prisons have three purposes in modern times: rehabilitation, justice, and public safety in keeping dangerous criminals from harming any more innocents. Are any of these purposes served by keeping Atkins in prison until she draws her last breath?
To hear Schmalz tell it, Atkins has already been rehabilitated. She has served her sentence as a model prisoner since the mid-1970s, and has posed no danger to herself or others. Schmalz tends to over-credit the Christian conversion of Atkins — it’s an oft-used ruse by prisoners looking for parole — but let’s assume he’s right and she’s rehabilitated. That would also indicate that we no longer need to worry that Atkins will resume murdering people in their homes to start race wars on behalf of Manson.
That still leaves justice, however, and it’s pretty hard to argue that Atkins has paid that measure yet. Atkins was convicted of eight murders, which means she’s served just over 4.5 years for every life she took. Atkins is both a serial and mass murderer, having committed the eight murders in three separate incidents. Is 37 years really enough to provide justice for these acts?
And while I oppose the death penalty, I fully support life without parole, although Atkins is eligible for parole thanks to the way the death sentences got dismissed. Life without parole pretty clearly means that we expect the worst offenders to die in prison, not in the comfort of their homes. Atkins qualifies as the worst of offenders, and she should not see the light of a free day.
Addendum: I want to make one more point about Christian forgiveness, in line with Schmalz’ essay. We believe in redemption, of course, but redemption does not exempt people from the temporal consequences of their actions. Merely going to the confessional, for instance, does not mean a murderer should not receive their just punishment. Christians hope and pray for the redemption of all souls, including that of Atkins (and Manson, for that matter) — but that essentially remains between Atkins and God and has little to do with the question of release.
You must be logged in to post a comment.
Blowback
Note from Hot Air management: This section is for comments from Hot Air's community of registered readers. Please don't assume that Hot Air management agrees with or otherwise endorses any particular comment just because we let it stand. A reminder: Anyone who fails to comply with our terms of use may lose their posting privilege.
Trackbacks/Pings
Trackback URL
Comments
Comment pages: [1] 2 3 4 »
I agree Ed. She showed no mercy to her victims.
JeffreyLloyd on July 3, 2008 at 11:53 AM
Nope
Squid Shark on July 3, 2008 at 11:54 AM
Let her die in prison. That IS her home.
Tim Zank on July 3, 2008 at 11:54 AM
Sure, send her to Disney World, too. Let’s all send her $50! Poor thing, poor blood-drenched, mocking butcher of a pregnant woman.
Akzed on July 3, 2008 at 11:55 AM
Death in prison lever pulled
ej_pez on July 3, 2008 at 11:56 AM
I vote for a prison death.
Mojave Mark on July 3, 2008 at 11:56 AM
Prison.
robblefarian on July 3, 2008 at 11:57 AM
prison
james23 on July 3, 2008 at 11:58 AM
This one is easy, PRISON.
Harpoon on July 3, 2008 at 11:58 AM
Gee let’s see - I know - let’s ask Sharon Tate and her baby !
jake-the-goose on July 3, 2008 at 11:59 AM
Prison and the potters field.
Rodney Graves on July 3, 2008 at 11:59 AM
Atkins gets mercy IN PRISON.
All of her temporal requirements are met IN PRISON.
She must complete her sentence IN PRISON.
Next thing the ubertards will cry is that dying in prison is cruel and unusual punishment; then going to prison is cruel and unusual punishment considering all of the criminals whom the government FAILS to convict get to run free.
maverick muse on July 3, 2008 at 11:59 AM
No Mercy!! Prison
ChrisIansNana on July 3, 2008 at 11:59 AM
Let’s leave it up to her victim(s). What say you?
rightside on July 3, 2008 at 11:59 AM
Prison.
Mr. Bingley on July 3, 2008 at 12:00 PM
Unless one is a hand-wringing, hairshirt liberal, I fail to see why this would even be a question worth asking.
Like Sharon Tate did? I’m all for it. Except, of course, that Sharon Tate got to be with her family and friends in Heaven. Susan Atkins, on the other hand, will get to be with them in a quite different place.
But if she’s in a hurry to go, by all means. I’d be happy to help.
Misha I on July 3, 2008 at 12:00 PM
I’m always slightly amused at convicted felons who have a religious conversion, claim to be a new person, and all want to get out (or not go in the first place) for some reason - they want to do the Lord’s work, they’re not the person that committed the crime, etc.
The clergy in my family (two Lutherans, one Baptist), would all say that there is plenty of Lord’s work to be done in prison - as an example, a tutor, a mentor or lay preacher. There are plenty of Christians (although never enough) outside of prison. You’re needed inside.
A religious conversion is not a pardon - in this world, at least.
Wethal on July 3, 2008 at 12:01 PM
Prison.
cvsusn on July 3, 2008 at 12:01 PM
Life in prison means all the way to the end. Once the sentence is complete she can do whatever in hell she wants.
Limerick on July 3, 2008 at 12:02 PM
Wow, this is a no-brainer.
Hunt035 on July 3, 2008 at 12:02 PM
Make an example. It’s a deterrent to other criminals. No mercy to her victims only reinforces me view. Prison.
Meric1837 on July 3, 2008 at 12:02 PM
No, leave her where she is. If her family and friends want come to the prison, let them. But don’t let her out.
Ellen on July 3, 2008 at 12:02 PM
prison
Richard Romano on July 3, 2008 at 12:02 PM
Um, I’m thinking “no” to the whole dying peacefully at home thing.
flipflop on July 3, 2008 at 12:04 PM
Prison. No objections in this case to using tax payer money to fulfill the “life imprisonment” sentence.
Brat on July 3, 2008 at 12:04 PM
She should never get out.
Defense Guy on July 3, 2008 at 12:04 PM
Keeping her in prison isn’t justice, but it’s the closest we’ll get in this day and age.
VolMagic on July 3, 2008 at 12:06 PM
Prison.
BobK on July 3, 2008 at 12:06 PM
The mercy she wants should come from God.
She should stay in prison.
sheesh on July 3, 2008 at 12:06 PM
Did she allow her victims to die at peace amongst family and friends?
She should have gotten the death penalty.
MarkTheGreat on July 3, 2008 at 12:08 PM
She wants to be released….TOO BAD..die, and rot in hell….
twiggman on July 3, 2008 at 12:08 PM
Leviticus Chapter 24:17: “Anyone who takes another person’s life must be put to death.”
Leviticus Chapter 24:19-22: “Anyone who injures another person must be dealt with according to the injury inflicted—20 a fracture for a fracture, an eye for an eye, a tooth for a tooth. Whatever anyone does to injure another person must be paid back in kind. Whoever kills an animal must pay for it in full, but whoever kills another person must be put to death. This same standard applies both to native-born Israelites and to the foreigners living among you. I am the Lord your God.”
It takes the balls of someone like her - a mass murderer - to ask for compassionate release. Did she show that same compassion to her victims?
KrisinNE on July 3, 2008 at 12:09 PM
If Atkins truly is rehabilitated, she should be humbled by the magnitude of her crimes and believe it proper that she remain in prison. And if she isn’t rehabilitied, she should be made to stay in prison, anyway. Either way, she should be in prison.
Blacklake on July 3, 2008 at 12:10 PM
F her. Let her die in prison, with no mercy and no dignity.
thirteen28 on July 3, 2008 at 12:10 PM
Um… the second one?
Spanglemaker on July 3, 2008 at 12:11 PM
Well here is one, many Christians dodge. You can only forgive the one that sins against you. They have to ask you for forgiveness, and then you have the option forgiving them, this was not an oversight by God. So how do you ask for forgiveness from someone you killed? You can’t therefore a sin that cannot be forgiven.
She cannot be forgiven on earth, her punishment should have been death…so be it, she dies in prison.
right2bright on July 3, 2008 at 12:11 PM
You know, I like to be merciful and understanding of people so I’m slightly conflicted about this. It’s the nurse in me, I suppose. She’s going to die a pretty horrific death and it would be nice for her to do it surrounded by her family. However, she never gave that choice to anyone she killed. It’s not my place to judge her, but at the same time, that’s a pretty lame reason not to have an opinion.
So of course, my more “justice” side almost always wins out and I’m gonna say “Prison.” She did the crime, she should do the time, all the way to the end. Her family can be with her at the end, she just won’t be “free.” But it’s something akin to Paul Bernardo being let out of prison to die at home (if you don’t know who that is, ask your Canadian friends).
mjk on July 3, 2008 at 12:12 PM
I recall an interview with Texas death row inmate Karla Faye Tucker, who, along with an accomplice, killed two people with an ice pick. She was scheduled to be executed when Bush was governor. She asked for a commutation, because of her religious conversion, and years as a model prisoner, but didn’t get one.
She said was going to her death relying on God’s mercy, but acknowledging that her sentence under man’s law was just.
Wethal on July 3, 2008 at 12:13 PM
Prison. Let her reap her just rewards in the afterlife. If she’s truly changed, so be it. If not, good luck with that.
High Desert Wanderer on July 3, 2008 at 12:13 PM
Prison.
Rogue Traveler on July 3, 2008 at 12:14 PM
JUSTICE
WoosterOh on July 3, 2008 at 12:14 PM
When Christ said “Judge not, lest ye be judged”, (Can’t help it, grew up on King Jimmy) he was talking about judging the quality of other people’s souls. So be carefull there about assuming she’s going to hell.
If her conversion is real, she will be in heaven to greet the rest of us. And whether it’s real or not, is not for us to judge.
MarkTheGreat on July 3, 2008 at 12:14 PM
Only problem with keeping her in prison I can see is that I assume the state will possibly be required to pay for any medical intervention necessary, which could be very expensive. Is there a legal way the state can impose some kind on DNR rules on her and withhold any medical intervention?
While I hold no mercy for her, she should die humanely and free of pain, as any animal should die. Load her up with morphine, sure, but no costly medical care.
redshirt on July 3, 2008 at 12:15 PM
She gave the death penalty to Sharon Tate and her unborn child. It’s unfortunate that America was denied the opportunity to give her the penalty she so eagerly delivered to them. Finally, she now has been given a slow-motion death sentence, which is even better. Let her die in prison, slowly and painfully.
This is always my argument in favor of the death penalty for murderers. They gave the death penalty to their victims, who were innocent, with no trial. Why should we deny it to them, who are found guilty by a jury of their peers?
rockmom on July 3, 2008 at 12:16 PM
She should be burned at the stake
LODGE4 on July 3, 2008 at 12:16 PM
Baby Tate was safe within the womb until she stabbed him/her to death, let her rot in that cell.
Pam on July 3, 2008 at 12:17 PM
You’re right, if ever there was someone who should spend their last day detained within the imposing walls of prison, it’s Atkins.
If she is truly repentant and rehabilitated, let God be the judge. His divine providence provides for those who seek mercy.
For her acts on earth, the state has condemned her to a deserved fate.
Greg the Californian on July 3, 2008 at 12:17 PM
If she is truly converted then she knows she has a lot to answer for. If it is a ruse then she is a public safety risk because she just may want to do “one more for the big guy down below” in order to assure her place in the hierarchy. I say let her stay in prison because life means just that, life until you die in prison. Then again I would be more than willing to let her out on one condition. If all the officials that approve of letting her out are willing to serve out her sentence if she does something evil after release. My guess is no and therefore they also think she is a risk.
jmarcure on July 3, 2008 at 12:18 PM
She should die in prison. Preferably laying on the floor while people walk past spitting on her.
Spartacus on July 3, 2008 at 12:18 PM
St. Dysmus is the name given to the repentant thief on the cross next to Christ. He acknowledged that he deserved to die (theft being a capital crime), but repented with his last breath. Repentance didn’t get him down off the cross, but did get him into Paradise.
Wethal on July 3, 2008 at 12:18 PM
Prison.
Aggie85 on July 3, 2008 at 12:18 PM
In prison. Next.
BowHuntingTexas on July 3, 2008 at 12:19 PM
Prison!
L
letget on July 3, 2008 at 12:19 PM
She should die in prison or at home suspended by her neck.
argos on July 3, 2008 at 12:20 PM
“For He shall have judgment without mercy, that hath showed no mercy; and mercy rejoiceth against judgment.”
The General Epistle of James 2:13, King James Bible
She showed no mercy, therefore she deserves none.
Virus-X on July 3, 2008 at 12:20 PM
What’s with the class of 69 lady killers all coming down with brain cancer now? If they do let her out, I hope she and Ted don’t have some evil bucket list.
Buddahpundit on July 3, 2008 at 12:21 PM
Death in prison. Any mercy is in god’s hands at this point.
trigon on July 3, 2008 at 12:21 PM
Prison in solitary
Wade on July 3, 2008 at 12:21 PM
Alone and in prison.
rplat on July 3, 2008 at 12:22 PM
And if my last post wasn’t clear enough:
PRISON.
Virus-X on July 3, 2008 at 12:22 PM
Showing mercy by allowing her not to complete her punishment would set a bad precedent. Aren’t punishments and the completion of said punishments a key part of the justice system? I don’t see how an illness, terminal or otherwise, changes that.
kgs_mvs on July 3, 2008 at 12:22 PM
Yeah, that works too. Home or prison yard.
argos on July 3, 2008 at 12:23 PM
It means not to judge unfairly because you will be judged by your own standards:
7:1 Judge not, that ye be not judged.
7:2 For with what judgment ye judge, ye shall be judged: and with what measure ye mete, it shall be measured to you again.
TheBigOldDog on July 3, 2008 at 12:23 PM
Good post Ed.
Exit question: Can we really redeam ourselves? Or do we need a redeemer?
“For a brief moment I forsook you, But with great compassion I will gather you. In an outburst of anger I hid My face from you for a moment, But with everlasting lovingkindness I will have compassion on you,” Says the LORD your Redeemer. “For this is like the days of Noah to Me, When I swore that the waters of Noah would not flood the earth again; So I have sworn that I will not be angry with you nor will I rebuke you.” - Isaiah 54:7-9
shick on July 3, 2008 at 12:24 PM
Solitary confinement.
No aspirin.
profitsbeard on July 3, 2008 at 12:24 PM
The Christian thing … in, cough, this, cough, secular, cough, nation, cough, … to do is to let her family and friends perform their vigil in a private prison cell.
Next subject and question. please.
Dusty on July 3, 2008 at 12:25 PM
She’s been supposedly showing her fellow prisoners how a Christian lives. Show them how one dies, Susan.
Wethal on July 3, 2008 at 12:26 PM
God’s mercy is a miracle and beyond our comprehension. But it is for the next life. This one she needs to finish in that cell.
Jaibones on July 3, 2008 at 12:29 PM
If she really had a conversion, it doesn’t matter where she dies. Sin has consequences in this life. God killed people on seemingly lower (to us)infractions and he has given that authority to civil government.
I have no symphaty for this argument.
maynila on July 3, 2008 at 12:29 PM
Since justice has not been served by her execution, the next closest thing is that she rot in a cell until she dies. The only mercy she deserves is the peace of death.
peski on July 3, 2008 at 12:29 PM
I thought the original death sentence wasn’t harsh enough.
PattyAnn on July 3, 2008 at 12:29 PM
I agree but does she? She may want out just to pop off a few innocents because she thinks she is going to hell and want s to make sure the big guy likes her. You know, better safe then sorry. I would never presume to judge someone is worthy of hell because I simply don’t know. On the other hand the secular crime and punishment system should be run as if there were no god, heaven or hell so she should remain in prison has dictated by her sentence.
jmarcure on July 3, 2008 at 12:29 PM
She should die in prison. No mercy, good riddens, next……Manson
txstar on July 3, 2008 at 12:30 PM
Although she may now be rehabilitated and she may now be a born again Christian, the facts relating to the heinousness, callousness and sheer brutality of the Sharon Tate murders cannot just be cast aside for the sake of Susan Atkins. If Susan is the believer she now claims she is, she should have no fears as to where she is going when she leaves this earth. As to where she leaves this earth from, based on what she did and on that basis alone, she should pay the ultimate penalty and die in prison. For the sake of Sharon Tate, Jay Sebring, and the rest of the victims of the madness of Charles Manson and his followers, justice must be allowed to prevail. Leaving her to die in prison will assure that it will.
pilamaye on July 3, 2008 at 12:30 PM
She wanted to cut Tate’s baby out of her womb and keep it as a souvenir; it was only her slightly more human accomplices who convinced her otherwise.
Maybe Roman Polanksi should be allowed to cut the tumor out of her head.
darclon on July 3, 2008 at 12:31 PM
Ditto. There’s nothing wrong with judging. A rational person cannot not judge. Even to say, “You shouldn’t judge other people” is to make a judgment about judging. Every law on the books is a judgment about right and wrong. The jury’s verdict was a judgment with which no one appears to disagree.
Christ’s point was: just don’t be a hypocrite and judge others by a different standard than you judge yourself.
Wethal on July 3, 2008 at 12:31 PM
Yes.
baldilocks on July 3, 2008 at 12:31 PM
Prison.
Sharon Tate and the other never had a say in where they spent their last day thanks to this animal.
Atkins can be right with God. That’s not up to man. She may be forgiven by some, but her punishment is life without parole and that’s exactly where she needs to be.
Oink on July 3, 2008 at 12:32 PM
Do any of us deserve mercy? We all have disobeyed.
Read Romans chapter 11
shick on July 3, 2008 at 12:32 PM
Better:
Yes.
baldilocks on July 3, 2008 at 12:32 PM
Prison.
If you let her out her home will become a pilgrimage destination for every Recreate 68, aging hippie looking to relieve the good ol days along with the new generation of leftinstras. There is no since in letting the loony left make a martyr out of her anymore then they are going to.
At the end, when her condition warrants it move her to a hospital to allow family to be with her, but she is owed no more compassion then she showed Tate.
Just A Grunt on July 3, 2008 at 12:33 PM
If justice is served only by completing the sentence, shouldn’t executive pardons allowing release or negating a death penalty be abolished? Seems it should be either one or the other for the sake of consistency. Mercy shouldn’t be an issue, right?
a capella on July 3, 2008 at 12:33 PM
She should die in prison. If she truly has repented the Lord will be her hiding place.
shick on July 3, 2008 at 12:33 PM
I haven’t read the story. Is she a Christian?
Also, don’t confuse earthly justice with Heavenly justice/redemption.
baldilocks on July 3, 2008 at 12:34 PM
“It was Atkins who killed the pregnant actress Sharon Tate, telling her first that she had no mercy for Tate or her unborn child, which makes her plea for mercy now more than a little ghastly.”
In a conversation with a jailhouse informant, Atkins claimed to having stabbed Tate to death. She did not admit to killing Tate in her subsequent interview with Vincent Bugliosi or in her grand jury testimony.
Later, both Adkins and her co-conspirator Charles Watkins claimed that Watkins had stabbed Tate to death.
Not that I have any particular sympathy for Adkins. If the survivors of her victims would agree to let her out to die at home, I wouldn’t object. Otherwise, it boils down to the old line from the Baretta theme song.
NCC on July 3, 2008 at 12:36 PM
Exactly.
baldilocks on July 3, 2008 at 12:37 PM
I haven’t read it either. Only the Lord knows the condifition of her heart.
I’m not confusing them. see my last post.
I wasn’t suggesting she receive mercy from eartly justice.
shick on July 3, 2008 at 12:37 PM
C’mon guys, think of the carbon output.
On topic- prison. There can be no other choice.
BillH on July 3, 2008 at 12:37 PM
Prison.
Urban Infidel on July 3, 2008 at 12:37 PM
She has friends?
awake on July 3, 2008 at 12:38 PM
So you oppose God’s law when dealing with certain crimes?
maynila on July 3, 2008 at 12:39 PM
Rot in prison. I hope the cancer takes its time.
Tom Blogical on July 3, 2008 at 12:39 PM
Let her die in prison, then have her cremated and the ashes flushed down the nearest toilet. She can seek mercy in the next world.
Special Forces Grunt on July 3, 2008 at 12:39 PM
Is it possible to fire up old sparky before this fall?
Dingbat63 on July 3, 2008 at 12:40 PM
My point was meant to be sent to readers who think God grades on a curve. He doesn’t.
We all deserve his just wrath.
shick on July 3, 2008 at 12:40 PM
Funny, I had heard long ago a phrase : “God gives mercy, we arrange the meeting and /or dispense justice”… when I was in service… never thought to apply it to this topic. Justice demands that she stay.
MNDavenotPC on July 3, 2008 at 12:41 PM
Prison, preferably cleaning toilets until she breathes her last breath.
Buy Danish on July 3, 2008 at 12:41 PM
Maybe we should ask Obama to ask his good friend what she thinks…Oh wait, we already know, here it is…
*
Sharon Tate and her child could not be reached for comment…
right2bright on July 3, 2008 at 12:42 PM
Prison. I do, however, hope that she is sincere in her conversion and repentance. God wants no one to suffer hell, although there are those that will. I believe that Jesus told us to pray for our enemies anyway.
Pulchritudinous Patriot on July 3, 2008 at 12:42 PM
Should Atkins die in prison, it still won’t equal justice. But it’s the best we’re going to get.
Cicero43 on July 3, 2008 at 12:42 PM
Comment pages: [1] 2 3 4 »