Grand jury refuses to indict Texan for killing two burglars next door
posted at 7:38 pm on June 30, 2008 by Allahpundit
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Remember Joe Horn? He’s a free man, as of this afternoon. I didn’t follow the case last year when debate was raging, but ABC has a gripping account of the particulars. He was on the phone with 911, shotgun in hand, watching two burglars rob his neighbor’s house in broad daylight; the operator told him to stay put and that the cops were on the way, but Horn replied that he couldn’t let them get away with it and couldn’t be sure that they wouldn’t make a move on his house next. So he went outside, caught them coming out of his neighbor’s house, told them to stop, and when they didn’t he shot them both — dead, both in the back, although per the Chronicle link above one of the suspects ran towards him before veering away, which is how he ended up hit from behind.
The legal justification is supposedly the “Castle Doctrine,” a subset of Texas’s self-defense law that lets you defend yourself and your property by firing on an unlawful intruder without having to “retreat” first. Having spent the past hour poring over the statutes and giving myself a migraine, it seems to me there are two gray areas: One, whether Horn is to be thought of as defending his home, his neighbor’s home, or himself when the shootings occurred, and two, whether having the right to “stand your ground” (i.e. not retreat) entitles you to precipitate a confrontation that could have been avoided by simply not doing anything. The sections that authorize defense of property (9.42 and 9.43) do allow for deadly force — but only at nighttime in the case of burglary, presumably because it’s harder to tell what a burglar’s packing in dim light and also because a burglar who’s coming through the window at an hour when he knows people are likely to be home is likely to be a bolder, more dangerous burglar. The Horn shootings happened in broad daylight. Which means if he’s off the hook, it has to be on grounds that he was protecting himself, not his property, during the confrontation with the burglars. Per section 9.32, deadly force can be used if “immediately necessary” to save yourself from being murdered and/or robbed. That’s arguably reasonable in Horn’s case (although there’s no word of them producing a weapon), but what if he had just stayed in the house and avoided them entirely? Enter subsection (c):
A person who has a right to be present at the location where the deadly force is used, who has not provoked the person against whom the deadly force is used, and who is not engaged in criminal activity at the time the deadly force is used is not required to retreat before using deadly force as described by this section.
There’s the “stand your ground” provision. If it justifies him leaving the house to face them down, it’s not so much an exemption from the duty to retreat as an affirmative right to advance. And how was deadly force “immediately” necessary if it could have been prevented just by sitting tight? He’s got the shotgun and he’s watching them; if they try to come in his house, they’ll never know what hit them. Eh, whatever. It’s not worth parsing the statutes too finely since ultimately it’s in a (grand) jury’s hands and they’re not going to send an old man to jail for shooting two felons caught in the act, whatever the felony and time of day.
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entitles you to precipitate a confrontation that could have been avoided by simply not doing anything.
Sorry, I do not define standing your ground as precipitating anything. The thieves are “precipitating” events here. Not “doing anything” is no guarantee that nothing more will happen. You could die “not doing anything.” You could die as you turn and run away.
JellyToast on June 30, 2008 at 8:56 PM
It isn’t plausible that if two white burglars had advanced on this man after he told them to stop that he would have simply dropped his weapon.
Unless you’re arguing that the fact that the two burglars were non-white is by itself evidence of racism you’re going to have to elaborate on this point.
aengus on June 30, 2008 at 8:56 PM
Emmett Till wasn’t breaking into anyone’s house when he was kidnapped and murdered by terrorists.
baldilocks on June 30, 2008 at 8:58 PM
Some tid bits of Texas gun law that should get libs all teary eyed….
HB 1837. Local Government Code, 250.001. Shooting range protection. The definition of a range is expanded to include private clubs and associations regardless of when they opened, and nuisance complaints are restricted.
HB 1925. Penal Code 46.03. Places where weapons are prohibited includes within 1,000 feet of a place of execution.
Limerick on June 30, 2008 at 9:00 PM
I am deployed with the reserves now and I am away but this is my neighborhood.I do not know him but I live 2 blocks from his home.QuanellX(Houstons latest” all blacks are beat down by the man” activist) has stated he will stage a protest if Horn is not charged.He led a protest after the shootings and was met by a couple of hundred Horn backers,most of them on bikes and with American flags.Video is on youtube.Horn has unequaled support from the entire state.If Q10 follows thru I believe the backers will show up in force again.The 2 losers were robbing mostly Vietnamese business owners ,casing them at work and hitting the homes.They picked the wrong hood and got the snitz.Local good guy vs 2 illegal crooks = Justice Texas style.BTW Q10 collects rewards from Crime Stoppers by getting people that are wanted for crimes to turn themselves in, with him as the go between
michael griggs on June 30, 2008 at 9:00 PM
I am deployed with the reserves now and I am away but this is my neighborhood.I do not know him but I live 2 blocks from his home.QuanellX(Houstons latest” all blacks are beat down by the man” activist) has stated he will stage a protest if Horn is not charged.He led a protest after the shootings and was met by a couple of hundred Horn backers,most of them on bikes and with American flags.Video is on youtube.Horn has unequaled support from the entire state.If Q10 follows thru I believe the backers will show up in force again.The 2 losers were robbing mostly Vietnamese business owners ,casing them at work and hitting the homes.They picked the wrong hood and got the snitz.Local good guy vs 2 illegal crooks = Justice Texas style.BTW Q10 collects rewards from Crime Stoppers by getting people that are wanted for crimes to turn themselves in, with him as the go between
michael griggs on June 30, 2008 at 9:00 PM
crr6,
I’m willing to bet that most HA commenters were elated as soon as they read the follwoing headline:
Grand jury refuses to indict Texan for killing two burglars next door
Is it more likely that most HA commenters were tepid until furthering examining the article and upon realising the two men were non-white becoming belatedly enthusiastic? I don’t think that is likely.
aengus on June 30, 2008 at 9:01 PM
Even if you hurl..
aengus on June 30,2008 at 8:36PM.
aengus: LOL,me thinks from the HRC,they would just line
me up and I would be shotinzee!haha.—:) :) :)
Hey,these trolls are pure sh!t disturbers,later
in the cafe’ drinking their latte’ coffee whatevers,
peeing their pants how they put one over on a
Republican websites!
And,this is a seminar caller,posting on threads
co-ordinated effort,the Libs will do anyway*,anyhow,
by any means neccessary to win!
Listening to Rush,these clowns actually go to
meetings for talking points!
* (canopfor regrets using the word anyway,which is
a term used on “Sands of Passion” muslim soap
opera,any likeness is pure coincidental,or
koinky dinky!)haha. :).
canopfor on June 30, 2008 at 9:02 PM
It’s not a parallel at all.
baldilocks on June 30, 2008 at 9:04 PM
sorry,double post,my bad
michael griggs on June 30, 2008 at 9:06 PM
Using crr6’s own logic..
JFK was assassinated in Dallas and 45 years later I found crabgrass in my lawn. Crabgrass..grassy knoll..Something to think about!
GoodBoy on June 30, 2008 at 9:08 PM
Just how stupid are you? Honest and serious question.
The “flag this” comment was pointing out that they were illegal aliens, not their race. Two white people could have a kid in Mexico, name him Jose, and if he invaded our country & was killed committing a crime I would make the same points as I do in this case.
It is not an issue of race, it is an issue of crime. They committed on invading this country, and were killed committing another.
If you had an IQ over 40 and could pull your head out of your “everything in the world is about race” butt you would be able to see that very obvious fact.
Voidseeker on June 30, 2008 at 9:09 PM
There is the concept in common law of “hue and cry” where it is the responsibility of a citizen when a crime has been witnessed to assist in the delivery of the criminal to the authorities. A person failing to assist would be guilty of being an accessory to the crime itself. That concept is one that goes back centuries and is part of the cement that holds communities together.
It is my personal opinion that the neighbor had an obligation to see that the criminals were delivered to justice. He apparently attempted to simply stop them. When one of them made a move toward him, it became a matter of self defense. I believe a reasonable person could assume that the criminal coming at them would have the intention to harm them.
If the neighbor had simply walked over and shot the men, it would have been murder. That he attempted to detain them for delivery to the police is probably a citizens arrest. What would an armed police officer have done if he had commanded the individual to stop and the person charged toward the officer? You don’t know if the person has a knife in their pocket and police aren’t paid to take physical abuse. Neither is a citizen acting in the interest of the community.
If I were on that jury, I wouldn’t have voted to convict indict either.
crosspatch on June 30, 2008 at 9:10 PM
To answer an earlier question about ACLU and lawsuits…here is the clincher…
source
Limerick on June 30, 2008 at 9:10 PM
I found some to. Scary stuff that crabgrass. : )
Texyank on June 30, 2008 at 9:11 PM
Listen to the whole tape and say Joe Horn was “threatened” with a straight face. He was perfectly in control of the situation the entire time.
crr6 on June 30, 2008 at 9:14 PM
We’re you in his front yard with him, or do you have a witness that says he wasn’t threatened?
Limerick on June 30, 2008 at 9:15 PM
You wrote 74 words just to smear the hundreds of registered users of HotAir.com racists? I could’ve done that in two words!
Those verbose “HotAir.com would have voted to acquit the murderers of Emmett Till 50 years ago” bumper stickers are going to cost you a fortune in printing.
ScottMcC on June 30, 2008 at 9:16 PM
I completely missed this:
In your weird world, would it have been ok if Horn was a minority “numerically and culturally” and the two criminals were part of the majority “numerically and culturally”? I have a hunch that it would.
See, in a rational common sense world that most of us live it IT DOES NOT MATTER. This is an issue of crime and punishment.
In your world people are different if they belong to one group or another, and get different weight in your thought processes because of it. You need to seek help. You are obsessed with race/grouping and it is crowding out logic.
Voidseeker on June 30, 2008 at 9:19 PM
Two guys were burglarizing the house next door, you drooling cretin, and you don’t perceive that as a “threat”?
Lee on June 30, 2008 at 9:19 PM
I wonder if crime in the neighbor hood has gone up or down since the shooting………….. Hmmmmmmm.
My guess would be down.
Excellent post Michael, and Thank You for your service!
Seven Percent Solution on June 30, 2008 at 9:20 PM
I don’t know about “most” HA commenters. But misterpeasea sure seemed markedly more enthusiastic.
Oh come now. Don’t be willfully ignorant. If the issue was solely the fact that they were illegal aliens, why bother tacking on
crr6 on June 30, 2008 at 9:20 PM
For those that haven’t read the article, here is the BEST part:
I didn’t even KNOW this! From what I remember of the story I thought it was just two local thugs. How interesting to find out that these are illegally imported scum.
Doing the job American law enforcement wont do.
JOE HORN FOR PRESIDENT.
wearyman on June 30, 2008 at 9:22 PM
Had I’ve been in that Jury I would have voted for indictment
Ropera on June 30, 2008 at 9:22 PM
LOL
Answers my question about how stupid you are. Have you listened to it? I have. More than once, back when this first came up.
The Criminals were caught in the middle of a crime, refused to stop/halt, and got what they deserved.
You are right that he was in control the whole time. But in your crooked thinking you believe he killed the two of them because they were not white and he was white. You honestly think that he would have NOT shot two white crooks in the same situation.
Wow. Again, seek help. You need it.
Voidseeker on June 30, 2008 at 9:22 PM
crr6’s first comment is a perfect illustration of liberal thought. He just blurts out what he imagines about how other people would vote as jurors. This fits my experience perfectly.
My liberal friends are confident that Ahmadinejad doesn’t really mean it when he says he’ll wipe Israel off the planet. They insist that I don’t think and/or feel the way I do about dozens of things. They constantly substitute their point of view for what someone else is saying even if the someone else is talking about himself. It can be as extreme as I say that I’m happy about something and they argue that I’m really not.
I can’t explain it exactly but it’s like they trust their imagination more that their eyes and ears.
Pythagoras on June 30, 2008 at 9:23 PM
Shooting two men in the back makes you a hero in Texas, weary?
Sounds about right…
alphie on June 30, 2008 at 9:24 PM
I like your tenacity! First attempt to paint pro-Horn opinion as racism backfires horribly, but you just keep on rolling, completely unfazed.
joewm315 on June 30, 2008 at 9:25 PM
Bravo Zulu Mr. Horn! Thank you for removing two criminals from the gene pool and thank you again for saving the taxpayers a ton of money.
Mooseman on June 30, 2008 at 9:26 PM
Hard to wrap your liberal brain around isn’t it. Intruder on property can be shot COMING & GOING. That’s the law. I can feel the outrage from here.
Limerick on June 30, 2008 at 9:27 PM
God Bless Texas! (And jury nullification.)
I had a short term contract job there for 6 weeks, I loved Texas and Texans. Everywhere should have such common sense. I’d love to live there, and given more than passing thought to relocating, except the heat would kill me.
anne on June 30, 2008 at 9:29 PM
I don’t think you read or understood my comment properly. Did misterpeasea initially express disinterest and then go on to express interest upon learning the burglars were non-white? No he didn’t. So unless you are a mind reader (for all I know you could be a Lightworker) you’re talking out of your…..mouth.
aengus on June 30, 2008 at 9:30 PM
Twisted, stupid, AND dishonest.
Nothing was tacked on you racist. And you are a racist in the truest meaning of the world as everything you look at is seen through a filter of race.
Quote the full sentence: “Horn fatally shot the burglars, two illegal immigrants from Colombia named Diego Ortiz and Miguel de Jesus.”
Should the commenter have not bothered to copy paste the SINGLE SENTENCE in some silly attempt to keep racists like yourself from reading only the names at the end and having your racist knee-jerk response to it?
I like how your warped mind is unable to grasp the “two illegal immigrants” part of the sentence and you just jump right to race.
What if the line had read “Horn fatally shot the burglars, two illegal immigrants from Russia named Ivan and Boris.”?
We HotAir readers would have the same reaction, YOU on the other hand would not care at all as the two crooks were white.
Like I said, you’re a racist. Not the readers of HotAir.
Stop projecting and get help.
Voidseeker on June 30, 2008 at 9:31 PM
So you agree he was in control the entire time…but he was also threatened? Talk about crooked thinking.
And please stop acting as if I believe race was the only factor in the killings. There were many factors. I just think one of them was race.
crr6 on June 30, 2008 at 9:32 PM
Neighborhood A: Sheeple huddled in their homes defenseless, feeling secure that the government will provide all the security they need, except that the law enforcement only shows up AFTER the crime has been committed.
Neighborhood B: Free Americans enjoying their Second Amendment Right to defend themselves, and taking personal responsibility for the safety and protection of their families and neighborhood.
………………… I choose “B“.
Seven Percent Solution on June 30, 2008 at 9:35 PM
He was in control and when threatened he was not willing to cede control of the situation to criminal, potential murderers.
aengus on June 30, 2008 at 9:35 PM
Boy the stupid & dishonest just is coming out of the woodwork here.
Just “two men” huh? That is all they were? Are you unable to come up with any other descriptors for them? Really? Nothing else that could possibly give the readers of your comment context huh?
So Texas would treat someone that shot “two men” in the back as a hero, and their criminal system is so broken that a jury could not see that as something they needed to prosecute?
Leaving out facts does not help your point. Changing context of events and ignoring the actions of the criminals makes the comment inane.
Voidseeker on June 30, 2008 at 9:36 PM
A person can be in control and be threatened as well. I know this for a fact, having had a person try to break in my house two weeks ago. I had my cell phone in the left hand, “My Little Friend” in the right. That’s control. But I wouldn’t expect you to know about any type of control, especially self-control.
Good thing my front door is very secure–good thing for the burglar, that is.
Oh yeah sure. Because white people just love burglars–as long as they’re white too. /s
baldilocks on June 30, 2008 at 9:42 PM
The Houston Comical’s editorial cartoonist take on it.
I love the comments. Especially SHunter76.
I’m still trying to figure out why one commenter called Joe Horn supporters “thug-huggers”. I thought that was the liberal stance.
atxcowgirl on June 30, 2008 at 9:43 PM
As you are rather lacking in intelligence I will help you out here:
“Main Entry: con·trol
Function:
verb
Inflected Form(s):
con·trolled; con·trol·ling
Etymology:
Middle English countrollen, from Anglo-French contrerouler, from contreroule copy of an account, audit, from Medieval Latin contrarotulus, from Latin contra- + Medieval Latin rotulus roll — more at roll
Date:
15th century
transitive verb
1 aarchaic : to check, test, or verify by evidence or experiments b: to incorporate suitable controls in
2 a: to exercise restraining or directing influence over : regulate b: to have power over : rule c: to reduce the incidence or severity of especially to innocuous levels intransitive verb: to incorporate controls in an experiment or study —used with for”
Yes, he was in CONTROL of the situation, but the CRIMINALS chose to try and take control of him. They lost. That is why they are dead, and Horn is alive.
You cannot control the actions of people, you can control situations. You are welcome for the lesson.
Voidseeker on June 30, 2008 at 9:45 PM
Latest estimate of gun ownership (by number of Texas households) is 41%. No exact figures on total number of guns are available as Texas DOES NOT REQUIRE registration, licensing, or permits(except concealed carry).
FY07 we had 90,800 concealed carry holders. One of them I sleep next to each night. She makes a mean margarita too.
Non-residents can apply for a concealed carry permit also.
Apply, pass the background check, show a photo ID, take the class and you are good to go.
A loaded weapon is permitted in a car. You have the same right to protect it as your property as you do your own home. You do not have to climb out the passenger door as the car jacket enters on the drivers side. Bummer, huh?
Limerick on June 30, 2008 at 9:48 PM
I see. I would say that while misterpeas originally may have expressed interest, he later showed greater interest upon learning of the illegal immigrant/racial dynamic. Which is pretty much the same thing. I actually am going out for the night, but kudos for attempting a relatively ad hominem-free, reasoned discussion.
It’s tough to respond to such a rambling, emotional, irrational post. But I will say that simply talking about and noticing race does not make you a racist. I guess I should depart for the night with some sort of melodramatic, imperative sentence. So uhhh
You are the true racist Voidseeker, and you should seek professional help for your racism!
crr6 on June 30, 2008 at 9:50 PM
If the situation were reversed and Horn had been unarmed and the thiefs had the guns and killed Horn, these liberals would be demanding that the two get off because they felt threatened and acted in self defense.
Rose on June 30, 2008 at 9:50 PM
My understanding is that you are allowed to shoot burglars in Canada. However, under no circumstances are you permitted to say anything to them which might be construed as hateful or derogatory.
flenser on June 30, 2008 at 9:52 PM
“You do not have to climb out the passenger door as the car jacket enters on the drivers side. Bummer, huh?”
Every criminal killed is a potential Democrat vote lost. Democrats are now after the prisoner vote so it stands to reason they don’t want anything happening to those poor Democrats behind bars. These guys dying probably cost some local politician two votes.
crosspatch on June 30, 2008 at 9:52 PM
absolutely true!! crooks of a feather, flock together…they’re hoping to get in on one of dingy harry’s dirty land deals..
right4life on June 30, 2008 at 9:55 PM
The illegal immigrant dynamic (which involves flouting the law) is not the same as the hypothetical racial dynamic (being non-white is not a crime).
Damning with faint praise.
I succeeded, not attempted, in engaging you in a 100% ad hominem-free, reasoned discussion.
Enjoy your night.
aengus on June 30, 2008 at 9:55 PM
He said nothing about a “racial” dynamic. You are the one working hard to inject that into the discussion.
Of course you have that extra organ which all liberals are born with, which allows you to read other peoples minds and their motivations.
By a quirk of fate, I have it too. So tell me …. why do you hate white people?
flenser on June 30, 2008 at 9:56 PM
The video made it seem that they were on Horn’s property, or at least right in between.
He has the right to stand anywhere in his own yard whenever he wants, especially if something is going down next door. No law forces any man to stay in his house and not walk his own da*n property.
The problem is that he said “they’re getting away” and then he shoots them in the back. I don’t think even the police can shoot someone running away.
BUT I can see where he could have feared that after ID’ing them, that they would go to their car and come back for him. In that case it is a preemptive strike in defense of possible retaliation/execution. BUT why not just aim for their legs?
I personally think that thieves should be shot after not heeding a warning, whether in the back or not. BUT I don’t think the law is written to back this.
nottakingsides on June 30, 2008 at 9:58 PM
If my post doesn’t make much sense, what I am saying is that the liberals always defend the criminal no matter what the situation. And, I was one of those who thought the two crooks getting their due was a positive thing even before I knew they were illegal.
Rose on June 30, 2008 at 9:58 PM
Every cop is a criminal, and all the sinners, saints.
flenser on June 30, 2008 at 10:00 PM
Since when did dying prevent Democrats from voting?
Texas Rainmaker on June 30, 2008 at 10:02 PM
Hahahaha.
aengus on June 30, 2008 at 10:03 PM
They certainly can and do.
aengus on June 30, 2008 at 10:04 PM
Rose,
I understood your point. That’s why I questioned a Chronicle commenter calling Horn supporters “thug-huggers”
atxcowgirl on June 30, 2008 at 10:05 PM
Here is SB378 *(Castle Law)…
http://www.capitol.state.tx.us/tlodocs/80R/billtext/html/SB00378I.htm
Read down about protection from lawsuits and the amendment that allows anyone sued, that was found to be within the law, to counter-sue the SOB that dragged him into court.
Limerick on June 30, 2008 at 10:05 PM
Nice attempted dodge. I am sure that everyone else that read my comment found it neither rambling or irrational, yet you did. Why would that be?
Sadly your “melodramatic, imperative sentence” is neither, but it is ironic that you imply mine was yet proceed to avoid/evade it.
You are projecting, you are a racist. I am not saying that as an insult, just fact. The sooner you accept that you cannot view the world outside of the prism of racism the sooner the problem can be resolved.
The judgment’s placed on your IQ were insults though, and justly deserved.
Voidseeker on June 30, 2008 at 10:09 PM
Illegal aliens doing the work most Americans won’t do…. and dieing because of it.
Maybe they feel safer robbing people in this country than their own. GOD in heaven I hope not, else there’s libel to be a great influx of these people wanting these jobs most Americans won’t do.
dhunter on June 30, 2008 at 10:12 PM
Texas girl, I would guess that the Chronicle commenter considers Horn the thug in this situation.
Rose on June 30, 2008 at 10:12 PM
And for crr6 and alphie, with all these RIGHT WING FACIST STATE GUN LAWS in Texas please point out the news articles of LEGAL gunowners pulling OK Corrals on each other. Not the stories like Horn’s, where a citizen acted according to his rights, but citizens just shooting it out because they wanted something to do.
Limerick on June 30, 2008 at 10:13 PM
Excuse me, I mean cowgirl.
Whoever wrote this law covered all bases. They made sure that the victim did not suffer for his or her actions. Bravo.
Rose on June 30, 2008 at 10:14 PM
If crr6 and alphie had been around in the late 19th-century and managed to impose their views on everyone it would be known as the Not-OK Corral.
aengus on June 30, 2008 at 10:16 PM
Do those who have angst about the grand jury’s decision applaud the neighbors of Kitty Genovese?
hadsil on June 30, 2008 at 10:16 PM
Yup, you did. I did not. But then again I believe trying to be reasonable with an idiot is insane. Crr6’s first comment cemented that he/she was such. The slander and disgusting comment by crr6 implying everyone here is a racist, and comparing a young black murder victim to two criminals was just beyond unacceptable.
Projection is one of my biggest pet peevs, Racist Projection being at the top of the list.
Voidseeker on June 30, 2008 at 10:19 PM
Spewed beer on my monitor and keyboard is NOT funny!
Rigga-fratta-ragga-rigga
Limerick on June 30, 2008 at 10:19 PM
I’d have the same reaction if they were names Steve and Mike.
FloatingRock on June 30, 2008 at 10:26 PM
.
So, you’re moving to Texas! Welcome, we enjoy neighbors who think like you do.
Think_b4_speaking on June 30, 2008 at 10:28 PM
He was only in control so long as he prevented them from wrestling away his shotgun and killing him with it. When he told them to “stop”, they should have stopped.
We’re not acting; we simply read your first post.
FloatingRock on June 30, 2008 at 10:30 PM
Exactly. They could be unnamed and we would all feel the exact same way. They could be any skin color and we would all feel the exact same way.
Well, all of us here except crr6. To him/her the skin color involved matters. And he/she cannot see how racist that makes him/her.
Voidseeker on June 30, 2008 at 10:31 PM
I’m glad there’s at least one state in the Union that isn’t going to punish the good guys.
I’m amazed. First, a victory for the right to defend myself with a gun. And then, a victory for the idea that people who stop criminals from hurting anyone else ought not to be punished for doing so.
Never been there, but in light of this I will have to agree, that the grass is greener in Texas.
(Oh, and I just want to point this out: Jackson and Sharpton will care a lot more about this, than the thugs who just happen to be African in Zimbabwe who decided to dismember and burn a woman alive. And torture many other human beings. Not a word from them on that. They’re not Caucasian.)
Hawkins1701 on June 30, 2008 at 10:32 PM
I just got two words.
.
.
DAMN
STRAIGHT
:+:
Texas Gal on June 30, 2008 at 10:35 PM
Thank you Rose,
I hadn’t thought of it that way. My mind is still wrapped around the 2 thugs that broke into the house, and of course the liberals would be hugging those 2 thugs.
atxcowgirl on June 30, 2008 at 10:40 PM
Warning to all you in the other 49…..
I love Texas. Really, really love it. But I gotta tell ya now. We don’t have any Grand Canyons or Yosemites here. In fact we have fewer non-fenced Federal acres then most would suspect. Most of us don’t stay for the scenery. Don’t get me wrong, she is pretty, but it helps if you have a few beers in you before you make your move.
Limerick on June 30, 2008 at 10:41 PM
Two goblins met a surly Texan while they were breaking the law.
Justice prevails.
I’d be willing to bet there won’t be too many more of this type of crime in Mr. horn’s neighborhood.
Two goblins dead = win
Old man tired of crime fighting back = win
Justice prevails = win
A Grand Jury with some sense = win
catmman on June 30, 2008 at 10:41 PM
Hawkins1701 on June 30, 2008 at 10:43 PM
Good for Joe Horn. I shall raise a pint to you this weekend my fellow American.
Geronimo on June 30, 2008 at 10:44 PM
And what’s with this whole “he shot ‘em in the back” crap?
The libs who are the first to point this out and use it as some kind of justification for calling Mr. Horn “bloodthirsty” or whatever are the same libs who trumpet the fact that “freedom fighters” use IED’s and blow up American soldiers from a safe, comfortable distance.
Hey libs, for you to actually have credibility when you claim your righteous indignation, you have to have some credibility (and a bit of righteousness) to begin with.
catmman on June 30, 2008 at 10:45 PM
but if your if you have a few beers in you
before you make your move.
Limerick on June 30,2008 at 10:41PM.
Limerick:If were ever on the battlefield,your the
designated driver,winchester in one hand,
wheel in the other! haha————:):):).
canopfor on June 30, 2008 at 10:49 PM
Limerick on June 30, 2008 at 10:55 PM
Nah…..I’m more akin to Blazing Saddles then Stagecoach.
Limerick on June 30, 2008 at 10:57 PM
Yep, that’s what he was saying.
I swear Houston is turning into another liberal bastion just like Austin. That’s why I moved to the burbs after 50 years in Houston.
Unfortunately, this isn’t over and Mr. Horn is going to need all the support he can get.
Texas Gal on June 30, 2008 at 11:05 PM
I’m game. No net wiz though so I’ll have to wait for someone to post the fund address. Being Texas I’m sure that will suddenly appear if the honorable Mr Horn gets in a pickle.
Limerick on June 30, 2008 at 11:07 PM
I hear ya Michael. Quanill X is a pimp on his own people for his own ego and financial gain. Just like last weekend and that father who grabbed his kids on Father’s Day. Not only murdered them but burned their little bodies to hide his crime. Now Q10 (I like that shorthand) is seen as the hero that led the cops to the little graves. And the murder father is trying to claim some drug dealer did the deed.
When Q10 gets in between the criminal and the cops it only gives them 3rd party cover. He has no shame.
BTW.. thank you for your service Michael.. stay safe.
Texas Gal on June 30, 2008 at 11:12 PM
Since I’m local, I’ll stay on top of this but already they are saying that a civil court actions is likely against Mr. Horn by the “survivors”.
Texas Gal on June 30, 2008 at 11:15 PM
Wasn’t Mr. Horn the only surviror?
atxcowgirl on June 30, 2008 at 11:16 PM
Not in itself. But if the men are doing you or your neighbors harm, it does make you something of a warrior, one of the handful of men willing to do unpleasant things to make the world better for them having been done. And that’s good enough for me. I’ll take a watchdog as my neighbor over a sheep any day.
Blacklake on June 30, 2008 at 11:19 PM
I live on a cul-de-sac, or as we say in Texas a dead end street. Of the ten homes there are five occupied 24/7. All by old farts with nothing better to do then put beer bottles out for the garden gnomes and look out the window when some fool thinks it’s a through-street. Love it! We haven’t shot each other…….yet.
Limerick on June 30, 2008 at 11:25 PM
Oh if you just could have seen the live in girlfriend of one of the varmits on TV .. she had $ signs all over her.
Texas Gal on June 30, 2008 at 11:25 PM
Joe Horn. We affectionately call folks like him “Castle Doctrine Bad Asses”.
There was another one that’s not been widely reported that took place in the Dallas / Ft. Worth Metroplex a few months back. The guy shot and killed 2 burglars over a 2 week period when they, on separate occasions, tried stealing his stuff out of his storage shed in the middle of the night.
This was after the Castle Doctrine was passed last September.
Hey, bad guys. You want to rob from, murder and / or rape a Texan? You might want to take a close look at what rights innocent civilians have to protect themselves.
Hint, hint. It centers a lot around (hand) guns.
BowHuntingTexas on June 30, 2008 at 11:27 PM
I don’t think remaining silent would help. The CHRC would consider the shooting itself an act of hate. Hate against burglars.
Talon on June 30, 2008 at 11:27 PM
Limerick on June 30, 2008 at 10:41 PM
There is always Palo Duro Canyon near Amarillo
PrettyD_Vicious on June 30, 2008 at 11:28 PM
Hey! That resembles me!!
But I ain’t got no garden gnomes.. :)
Seriously, I’ve ran off my share of “lost on the dead end street” so you-don’t-live-here-you-need-to-git-cause-I’ve-got-your-description-and-license-plate.
Texas Gal on June 30, 2008 at 11:30 PM
Purdy too! I love the Big Bend area or just the expanse of the sky out in West Texas. But you have to admit that most of the other 49rs expect Texas to look like some John Ford western.
Limerick on June 30, 2008 at 11:35 PM
LOL…..I feel pretty blessed. I don’t socialize with all my neighbors, but when we end up with someone elses mail we don’t give it back to the postman. The walk does us good. The new fella (some IBM halfwit) has finally gotten used to finding a ziplock bag of japapeno’s hanging from his doorknob too. ;)
Limerick on June 30, 2008 at 11:41 PM
I guess if they were trying to break into Horns house and got the same treatment, the critics would be OK with that. I believe the law in Texas that applies in this case case specifically gives you the right to protect your neighbors property as you would your own in his absence. Sounds like a good policy to me.
Lunkinator on June 30, 2008 at 11:54 PM
If Horn had been in this state (NC), he’d have been SOL. You can protect yourself (or others) with deadly force if you feel in immediate danger (or that others are), but you can’t protect property. You can shoot someone trying to break into your house, but once they’re in, you have to wait to see if they come after you or others before shooting. Weird, huh.
Folks are trying to get that changed.
eeyore on June 30, 2008 at 11:56 PM
haha.. I do the same.. walkin the mail to the right box.. but I hadn’t thought about the baggie of japapenos..!
I’ll throw in the Hill Country, especially around Marble Falls in the spring.
Yep, an oil well in every yard and a horse tied up at every abode, tumbleweeds in the wind and jackrabbits on the run. Texas has an amazing landscape and if you’ve never driven from the east to the west, you just can’t appreciate the diversity.
A little funny. I have a friend who is Eastern European and of course their view of Texas is from movies. She was astonished as to how green this area is. I told her when we can, I’ll take her to West Texas so she can see the Texas of her imagination.
Texas Gal on June 30, 2008 at 11:57 PM
Good.
Two very dead Illegal Immigrant crooks who will never prey on anyone again in the USA (or anywhere else on Earth), and a neighborhood hero is back home where he belongs.
Most excellent news.
SilverStar830 on July 1, 2008 at 12:01 AM
The reason he was justified is because a felony was being committed, and the neighbor knew it. Deadly force is justified in this instance because the neighbor most likely had permission to act in the neighbors absence, especially if he was house-sitting and its been documented he has permission to enter the property.
Fortunately, we are In TX not charged based on what we ” didn’t ” do like in CA or NY. Saying someone should simply do-nothing is unreasonable and them going to jail because they “could ” have simply let the felony occur is not the American way, at least in TX.
Don’t steal.
tx2654 on July 1, 2008 at 12:19 AM
Enchanted Rock.
If you haven’t been, go. Go now. I’m not one for magical but you can’t climb up there and come come back down without wondering if it was the guns or the magic that kept that Ranger Captain Hayes alive. (Besides Fredericksburg has a great micro-brewery!)
Limerick on July 1, 2008 at 12:21 AM
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