You will get what the Republican party has given you! As for us conservatives, we shall sit this one out and wait for an election where we aren’t spit upon by both parties. Good luck!

sabbott on June 28, 2008 at 10:53 AM

thats for sure!! its like choosing between the devil and the deep blue sea….

this is a choice???

thebriand on June 28, 2008 at 12:34 AM

Do you really think Obama will be as effective in the GWOT as McCain?

No, I don’t. But I don’t think he’ll do anything catastrophic. Out of his own self-interest.

Do you really think the SCOTUS is conservative?

No, I don’t. It’s as conservative as it’s been in forever. And considering that Ginsburg and Stevens are the most likely candidates for retirement, it’s hard to imagine the appointment of more liberal justices. And it’s also hard to imagine it getting more conservative. A Democrat Senate is not going to allow McCain or anybody else to replace either of those loony leftists with a conservative.

Do you really think McCain will raise taxes in the way a socialist Democrat would?

Absolutely. As I said, McCain and Bambi agree on the two costliest policies we’re facing: amnesty and global warmism. Any other tax increases will pale in comparison to the ones required for those two things. And besides, if it means Bambi and the Dems get discredited and booted out of DC instead of McCain and the Republicans, I’m willing to pay that price.

So, McCain would be a bit better in the short run, but the punishment the Republicans would take far outweighs any difference between a Bambi and a McCain administration.

God bless this country. As soon as we start demonstrating principles over political expediancy we’ll start turning this country around. Like an alcoholic, we first must hit rock bottom. (obviously we’re about there) Then the healing will begin hopefully with ballots but quite possibly with more brutal force. Whatever….. we’ll muddle through and my bet is that we’ll come up on top.

Didn’t Jefferson say ” The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time, with the blood of patriots and tyrants.” Well lately there seems to be a stench of Tyrants in the air. At very least the stench of elected officials who represent campaign contributers far more than the people who elected them. The ballot is a powerful tool only among honorable men. Other tools are for tyrants.

http://www.tshaonline.org/handbook/online/articles/OO/pqo1.html

MB4 on June 28, 2008 at 12:33 AM

You seem to be my only adversary with the view that my arguments for McCain today will be negated by Obama’s bus tomorrow.

The vodka tonight is grand.

Limerick on June 28, 2008 at 12:39 AM

You and I both know that Obama will likely win and MicroBrew is better. That reminds me.

thebriand on June 28, 2008 at 12:50 AM

Cheers, indeed.

The vodka tonight is grand.

Limerick on June 28, 2008 at 12:39 AM

I could go for some Goose right now. As it is, I’ll settle for the couple of Bud’s I’ve been holding onto since last weekend. Cheers.

The one analogy of McCain calling a soldier and telling them they are deporting their mother, is cute, but case by case we can remedy those. That one case out of 20 million we can handle.

right2bright on June 27, 2008 at 5:31 PM

I wounder how Juan, if he becomes el Presidente, which no longer seems very likely, would like to call an American Soldier or Marine serving in Iraq or Afghanistan and tell him that his mother was killed by a drunk driving illegal alien or that his wife or girl friend was raped, and maybe murdered, by an illegal alien.

MB4 on June 28, 2008 at 12:33 AM

You seem to be my only adversary with the view that my arguments for McCain today will be negated by Obama’s bus tomorrow.

The vodka tonight is grand.

misterpeasea on June 28, 2008 at 12:07 AM

Do you really think Obama will be as effective in the GWOT as McCain? I do not.
Do you really think the SCOTUS is conservative? I don’t. They just gave terrorists access to our court system. With one more liberal on that court, the 2nd Amendment would have been thrown out the window.
Do you really think McCain will raise taxes in the way a socialist Democrat would? I do not.
As far as who takes the blame for the bad stuff, I’d rather worry about limiting the bad stuff.
I think McCain is completely wrong on immigration. He’s completely wrong on global warming. He was wrong on many thing over the years. You’ll have no argument from me on that.
I still say he is far better than the alternative.
My choice is to “hold my nose” and vote for him. Your choice I take it, is to sit it out. I can definitely understand that point of view, I just disagree with it.

And so we have two candidates, since you are not supporting McCain, then I am assuming you have embraced Obama.
Well, aren’t you the discerning one…

right2bright on June 27, 2008 at 4:44 PM

Never assume as it may make an ass out of you.

For others, there are my reasons for voting for McCain that go beyond immigration and Iraq. I believe that answers the charge that McCain supporters can’t justify their vote for McCain based on the ‘facts’.

here are Obama’s own words on defense…[comments in brackets my own]

Barak Obama Feb 29 2008

Second, I will cut tens of billions of dollars in wasteful spending.

I will cut investments in unproven missile defense systems.
[No missle defense]

I will not weaponize space.[strip Space Command]

I will slow our development of future combat systems.
[speaks for itself-let everyone else catch up so they don't feel theatened]

And I will institute an independent “Defense Priorities Board” to ensure that the Quadrennial Defense Review is not used to justify unnecessary spending.[Civilians decide what weapon systems the military REALLY needs]

Third, I will set a goal of a world without nuclear weapons. To seek that goal, I will not develop new nuclear weapons; I will seek a global ban on the production of fissile material; and I will negotiate with Russia to take our ICBMs off hair-trigger alert, and to achieve deep cuts in our nuclear arsenals.[no fissle material???? How does America, without nuclear weapons, keep dictators from reaching across borders?]

If you think of what Obama can do to us, beyond immigration, judges, and taxes, the night becomes darker then McCain would ever make it.

We are not at war, you moron.

flenser on June 27, 2008 at 11:48 PM

Huh? You just keep topping your own stupidity. It’s really quite amazing.
Nonsensical statement, followed by insult. Repeat.

Is the right thing to take the nomination a way from the man who fairly won it?

Not saying take the nomination away from him, though the primary machinations make me unhappy.

If in four years, a more conservative third party becomes viable, I’ll likely vote for their nominee.
This notion that losing this year will be good for the party is simple-minded and dangerous.

I think going along with the liberal drift of the party, and affirming that the liberal drift of the party is OK by electing the liberal candidate, is simple-minded and dangerous. Their behavior will not change if they are rewarded for it.

We are at war. I shudder to think of the advances AQ will make under an Obama presidency. It pains me to think which rights will disappear, or magically appear, if even one more liberal is put on the Supreme Court. My wallet hurts when I hear Obama propose more and more government programs. I am scared to death of ObamaCare.

War: out of self-interest, Bambi and the Dems won’t do anything stupid. They wanted defeat with a Republican President to take the blame, they don’t want defeat with a Democrat President to take the blame.

SCt: is as conservative as it’s been in forever. We have survived a liberal Supreme Court since FDR’s court-packing threat. And, no one has yet explained to me how President McCain is going to first, nominate a conservative judge, and second, get that judge past the Senate. Especially if it’s one of the leftists who is being replaced.

And I hate to break it to you, but McCain is going to be all over your wallet too. McCain and Bambi agree on the two stupidest and most costly policies: amnesty and global warming. And domestically, anything one Congress can do, the next can undo.

Who do you want discredited and blamed for the stupid and costly crap that is coming? Bambi and the Dems, or McCain and the Republicans? It looks like a no-brainer to me that it’s much better to have Bambi and the Dems discredit liberalism than to have McCain and the Republicans discredit conservatism.

It is if you care about winning the election and the future of the country. Otherwise, not so much.

flenser on June 27, 2008 at 11:50 PM

First you want to take voting rights away from people who disagree with you, now you are for throwing out the process altogether, AFTER it’s been settled.
To say that is a way to win the election is beyond absurd.

flenser on June 27, 2008 at 11:46 PM

Hard to make the case that multi-party systems don’t end up with the one thing you are against the most, compromise. Look at any parliamentary system on the planet. All are led by coalitions. I don’t dispute that the right is moving left. Then again I’ve no doubt that Andrew Jackson would consider Nixon and moonbat.

There are a lot of security and defense reasons that I have chosen McCain that are outside the immigration and Iraq issue…missle defense, moderization of Navy carrier and submarine fleets, nuclear weapon upgrading, sustaining Space Command and it’s future offensive and defensive capabilities, NOT slowing our defense research…all of which Obama has publically stated (Feb 29) to be against.
This isn’t a one, or two, issue election.

flenser on June 27, 2008 at 11:37 PM

Now I am sure of it. You have absolutely no shame. I disagree with McCain on many issues, but he is certainly not slime. Your debate tactic is to call names and make things up.
If we, and when I say we, I mean conservatives, not you, couldn’t win the primary, it is preposterous to think we can win the national election via a third party. Your ranting can’t change that. Maybe in four years a party can be built. Maybe.
I’m still waiting to hear who you think is a viable candidate. I suspect you have no answer. None that wouldn’t make you look even more foolish, anyway. So, your answer must be to let Obama win. Again I say, this whole argument smells like Operation Chaos in reverse. Espescially given that your debate style is exactly what you find on any lefty blog. The ravings of a deluded tool.

Is the right thing to take the nomination a way from the man who fairly won it?

It is if you care about winning the election and the future of the country. Otherwise, not so much.

This notion that losing this year will be good for the party is simple-minded and dangerous. We are at war.

We are not at war, you moron.

What about you, Senator McCain? What exactly do you stand for?

Amnesty. First, last and always. Everything else is a side issue for McCain.

LegendHasIt on June 27, 2008 at 8:00 PM

You, and many other here, act as if the party just declared McCain the nominee. WE HAD PRIMARIES! McCain won, fair and square. He is the nominee.
You say we should have the guts to demand the RNC do the right thing. Is the right thing to take the nomination a way from the man who fairly won it? All this jibber jabber would have meant something during the primaries. Right now it just seems like Operation Chaos in reverse. You are spoiling for a fight at the convention? That is the surest way to get Obama elected, and I am becoming more and more convinced that some of you want just that.

If in four years, a more conservative third party becomes viable, I’ll likely vote for their nominee. I won’t be holding my breath waiting.
This notion that losing this year will be good for the party is simple-minded and dangerous. We are at war. I shudder to think of the advances AQ will make under an Obama presidency. It pains me to think which rights will disappear, or magically appear, if even one more liberal is put on the Supreme Court. My wallet hurts when I hear Obama propose more and more government programs. I am scared to death of ObamaCare.
If you want to sit out, do it up. I think it’s a terrible idea.