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Breaking: Supreme Court says Gitmo detainees must have access to US courts Update: Scalia: “The Nation will live to regret what the Court has done today.”

posted at 10:45 am on June 12, 2008 by Ed Morrissey
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In a 5-4 decision, the Supreme Court ruled today that the unlawful combatants held at Guantanamo Bay in Cuba must have access to American courts to challenge their detention. The ruling eliminates three attempts by the Bush administration and Congress to establish military tribunals that would handle the adjudication of terrorist cases without involving access to the civilian justice system:

The Supreme Court ruled Thursday that foreign terrorism suspects held at Guantanamo Bay have rights under the Constitution to challenge their detention in U.S. civilian courts.

The justices handed the Bush administration its third setback at the high court since 2004 over its treatment of prisoners who are being held indefinitely and without charges at the U.S. naval base in Cuba. The vote was 5-4, with the court’s liberal justices in the majority.

Justice Anthony Kennedy, writing for the court, said, “The laws and Constitution are designed to survive, and remain in force, in extraordinary times.” …

In dissent, Chief Justice John Roberts criticized his colleagues for striking down what he called “the most generous set of procedural protections ever afforded aliens detained by this country as enemy combatants.”

Justices Samuel Alito, Antonin Scalia and Clarence Thomas also dissented.

This will probably derail the hearings that had just begun at Gitmo for six members of the 9/11 conspiracy. By granting the unlawful combatants habeas corpus, the court has now eliminated the main reason for the military tribunal system — and for that matter, Gitmo itself. If the detainees can access American courts, they may as well be held on American soil.

The previous two rulings that struck down the tribunals forced the government to quickly pass laws that allowed for them. The Supreme Court has basically ruled that the Constitution applies worldwide rather than just to the US and its residents, which makes it pretty difficult to go back to the well a third time. Also, with very little time remaining in the Bush administration, they will not have enough time to push through a third attempt to address the Court’s concerns — and this ruling appears to be much broader than the two that preceded this one.

It seems absurd to apply criminal law to unlawful combatants captured during hostilities abroad. Will they require a Miranda reading, too? Do we have to bring the soldiers and Marines who captured them to the trial? In our 232-year history, when have we ever allowed that kind of access to enemy combatants not captured inside the US itself?

Update: Bear in mind that we do not yet have the full opinion, and it may be less egregious than what we have heard thus far. However, the quote from Kennedy certainly suggests an expansive ruling.

Squid Shark says in the comments that the work-around would be to classify them as POWs and be done with it. That presents a few problems, too. It eliminates the status of unlawful combatant, which then encourages all forces to eschew uniforms, legitimate state backing, etc etc. The unlawful-combatant designation and its circumscribed rights in Geneva intended to penalize those who hide among civilians for their attacks. Are we now to forego that?

Update II: The opinion can be read here. From a cursory reading, the Court says that Congress cannot act to suspend habeas corpus except through the Suspension Clause, which requires an explicit act noting invasion or rebellion. Would infiltration suffice, or does Congress even need that much reason to invoke the Suspension Clause?

Scalia’s dissent is especially scathing:

Today the Court warps our Constitution in a way that goes beyond the narrow issue of the reach of the Suspension Clause, invoking judicially brainstormed separation-of-powers principles to establish a manipulable “functional” test for the extraterritorial reach of habeas corpus (and, no doubt, for the extraterritorial reach of other Constitutional protections as well). It blatantly misdescribes [sic] important precedents, most conspicuously Justice Jackson’s opinion for the Court in Johnson v. Eisentrager. It breaks a chain of precedent as old as the common law that prohibits judicial inquiry into detentions of aliens abroad absent statutory authorization. And, most tragically, it sets our military commanders the impossible task of proving to a civilian court, under whatever standards this Court devises in the future, that evidence supports the confinement of each and every enemy prisoner.

The Nation will live to regret what the Court has done today. I dissent.

Update III: I’ve read through both dissents, and I have to say that I’m struck by the tone of Scalia and Roberts.  Not only do they dissent, they practically accuse the majority of deliberately misreading both law and precedent, especially regarding Eisentrager.  They point out that the dissent in that case explicitly noted that the decision gave aliens in detention by American forces outside of our own sovereign territory no habeas rights at all, and yet the majority used it to apply those rights in this case.  Roberts scornfully argues that the Court “cashiered” the military tribunal system before it had a chance to show that it addressed detainee rights properly.

I’d say that the end of this session couldn’t come quickly enough for these justices.


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So field commanders will be under no compunction to encourage the troops to take prisoners. What a shame.

GarandFan on June 12, 2008 at 12:07 PM

Good greif why are you people refighting the Romney/McCain battle ? Its over and McCain for good or bad is our nominee.

That kind of fight is why we lost today. Our own infighting gave us McCain as our nominee and gave us Obama as our opponent.

We created the mess we are in and the constant bickering only keeps us from focusing on making things better and wastes time.

William Amos on June 12, 2008 at 12:07 PM

A commenter on this web site is clearly unaware that McCain supports this decision. Perhaps Obama will come out and ask McCain if these are the sorts of judges that McCain is going to appoint to the court.

flenser on June 12, 2008 at 12:00 PM

McCain has “stated” (and I use that term loosely) that he is for originalist judges. This is just an absurd ruling that a child can recognize.

I’m hoping that McCain will come out against it but time will tell. I still “hope” though

HarryStar on June 12, 2008 at 12:08 PM

flenser on June 12, 2008 at 12:04 PM

McCain admitted he was wrong on the shamnesty bill. Did Romney ever admit he was wrong, or was he just hoping people forgot? Hey it works for Obama I guess.

McCain is and was wrong on a lot. But he is still better by light years then Obama. And he is the nominee.

Neither McCain or Romney were great. Maybe Romney was better. But he isn’t running for president. Even Hillary fought harder for it. But I digress.

It’s Obama vs McCain. Your choice.

tottoritodd on June 12, 2008 at 12:09 PM

I have a question does this ruling now mean that the thousands detained in Iraq and Afganistan currently have the right to appeal their deteniton in US courts ?

William Amos on June 12, 2008 at 12:10 PM

So when they start filing law suits against the USA, who is going to be paying for those damages?

PappaMac on June 12, 2008 at 12:10 PM

GarandFan on June 12, 2008 at 12:07 PM

On the contrary. They are now under the pressure of assembling a legal case against each and every person they fight on the battlefied.

This decision changes the entire concept of how we can and cannot fight a war. In level of importance I’d put this about three miles higher then Roe v Wade.

Limerick on June 12, 2008 at 12:10 PM

Yes, WofGlory, McCain does want Gitmo closed down for the reasons cited by SCOTUS. And no, he is unwilling to hear opposing arguments. That’s his nature.

A willful lie by you, I fear, he does want GTMO closed but not for the reasons cited by SCOTUS and he has made very clear his belief that they should not have acces to the U.S. system.

Squid Shark on June 12, 2008 at 12:10 PM

I have never seen such abject ignorance of the Constitution and the electorial process. Hey all you MDS people. We don’t have a “none of the above” option. It is either McCain or Obama.

Sweet Jesus, talk about abject ignorance of the electoral process!

No, you pathetic fool, we do not have a “none of the above” option. But we are perfectly free to vote for whomever we wish. It is NOT either McMoron or Obama.

the only country with a “none of the above” option was the Soviet Union. If the “none of the aboves” got the majority, then the communists put up another slate.

Sounds like we could learn a thing or two from them.

Why are you trying so incessantly hard to get other people to doubt their vote or not exercise it,

Of course, if only we’d shut up then you lemmings could continue happly on your pre-programmed course. John McCain’s far left political views are not the problem, the problem is the people who point them out.

flenser on June 12, 2008 at 12:12 PM

Don’t know if anyone has posted this yet, but it’s decisions like this that will make me vote for McCain this year. Obama will appoint more liberal justices who want to take my rights and fredoms away while giving them to unlawful enemy combatants. Given that the Senate will likely have a Democrat majority, they won’t have any trouble getting their lifetime appointments.

This has to be a joke.

RobTN on June 12, 2008 at 12:12 PM

yet another reason why allowing Obama to win over McCain is literally insane.

jp on June 12, 2008 at 12:13 PM

Whiny thumbsucking defeatists or clever Mobies? Hmmmm

:-)

OH, and you want McCain to have to nominate conservative justices? Get out and work your asses off to support conservative Senate candidates like Pearce in NM and Schaffer in CO.

And you better make sure you support Cornyn in TX as thanks for his efforts, because squishy headed pollsters and MSM types think he’s in trouble this year.

Quit dogging McCain, use him to defeat Obama, and tie his hands by electing conservative Senators.

VS

All is lost! Sit home and surrender in ‘08!

funky chicken on June 12, 2008 at 12:13 PM

Take no prisoners. Kill them on the battlefield and it’ll all be taken care of.

Spanglemaker on June 12, 2008 at 12:13 PM

We lost America.
Indy Conservative on June 12, 2008 at 11:56 AM

Yep.
MadisonConservative on June 12, 2008 at 12:02 PM

You guys sound less like “conservatives” and more like liberals posing as conservatives. Why is that?

wise_man on June 12, 2008 at 12:03 PM

For how many years Roe V Wade is been on the Books?

By the same token, today’s decision will remain on the Books for many many years to come.

We lost our sovereignty.

Once sovereignty is lost, once patriotism is lost, there is nothing left of a nation to be called “nation.”

What makes a nation?

1 – Patriotism.

2 – Independence.

3 – Borders.

4 – Culture.

5 – Language.

We lost almost all of the five.

And we are on our way to lose everything.

Yes, we lost America.

America is slipping away from us.

In November, vote for yourselves, my fellow Conservatives.

That’s your only chance to be honest and to actually DO something about taking America back.

Indy Conservative on June 12, 2008 at 12:14 PM

Can you show me where he has supported this position(granting enemy combatants American rights)?
Show me and I will eat my crow, no problem
tottoritodd on June 12, 2008 at 12:03 PM

There is a this link posted earlier, purporting to be where McCain supported this:

This is a McCain decision. Do not think for a minute he will nominate judges to the court that disagree with him on issues of such importance. He is weak on national security.
He will never nominate a conservative judge.
Valiant on June 12, 2008 at 11:07 AM

Problem is, it’s a lie. Its not a “McCain decision,” its an Mark R. Levin opinion. In that link, Levin says: “McCain undoubtedly supports the 5-4 decision,” and again, that is clearly Levin’s opinion.

McCain has stated that he would close gitmo and move them all to a military facility in Levanworth. Too many people here lie about McCain, and that just undercuts their own position. There are a lot of things to be critical of McCain, and this liberal tactic of lying about your political opponent is really getting tired. We are better than this. Conservatives don’t do this, but (as I have observed) liberals find this to be their tactic of choice.

Makes you wonder.

wise_man on June 12, 2008 at 12:14 PM

Just read the dang thing… its ugly.

It can now be argued that ANY military installation owned by the US, is now not only bound by the UCMJ, but also by all rights protecting the US Court.

IT specificly talked about the lack of evidence, Lack of counsel, hearsay evidence, and non ability to confront accusers, to say the MSRTs were not good enough… ie… they want full Civil rights for these prisoners, or they must be released.

So, with those two things, every Perp brought onto any US military base, will now have to be granted full US Civil Rights, including the ability to lawyer up, just in CASE they are determined to be an enemy combatant, because they WILL eventualy get a Habeus Corpus hearing in US Court.

Romeo13 on June 12, 2008 at 12:14 PM

By what authority does SCOTUS dictate war-fighting to the Executive?

JohnTant on June 12, 2008 at 11:58 AM

Our culture provides the court with expansive authority. The court does as it wishes because the other branches don’t resist.

One day, we might get a president who says to the court, “You know what? You’re over the line. I’m not obeying this decision, and if I hear any more from you, I’m going to direct the Armed Forces to secure your building.”

paul006 on June 12, 2008 at 12:14 PM

But we are perfectly free to vote for whomever we wish.
flenser on June 12, 2008 at 12:12 PM

Thanks for backing up my decision. McCain 08!

Limerick on June 12, 2008 at 12:15 PM

This is bad for the country. Period.

HotJavaJack on June 12, 2008 at 12:15 PM

Scalia’s dissent is especially scathing:

I totally agree. We are now going to have to let every illegal alien the right to an American Court if they are here.

America is not the United nations… we shouldn’t pander.

upinak on June 12, 2008 at 12:15 PM

he does want GTMO closed but not for the reasons cited by SCOTUS

Then what, pray tell, is his reason?

and he has made very clear his belief that they should not have acces to the U.S. system.

I won’t say that this is a wilful lie, because I know from experience that you usually don’t know what you are talking about.

flenser on June 12, 2008 at 12:15 PM

Ed –
You were just quoted by Rush and HotAir was mentioned by name. You’re famous!!

pullingmyhairout on June 12, 2008 at 12:15 PM

Quit dogging McCain, use him to defeat Obama, and tie his hands by electing conservative Senators.

VS

All is lost! Sit home and surrender in ‘08!

funky chicken on June 12, 2008 at 12:13 PM

Again, makes you wonder.

wise_man on June 12, 2008 at 12:15 PM

Limbaugh just referenced this thread and Ed Morrissey!

geckomon on June 12, 2008 at 12:15 PM

Ed Rush just quoted you on his show about this. We are so SOL in American.
L

letget on June 12, 2008 at 12:15 PM

basically, suicidal Jihadist will now use American Useful idiots and make a complete mockery of our judicial system.

the left see’s 9/11 as a crime, not an act of war. They are philosophically and intellectually suicidal and pro-death, just another manifestation from our liberal over-lords.

jp on June 12, 2008 at 12:15 PM

Don’t know if anyone has posted this yet, but it’s decisions like this that will make me vote for McCain this year. Obama will appoint more liberal justices who want to take my rights and fredoms away while giving them to unlawful enemy combatants. Given that the Senate will likely have a Democrat majority, they won’t have any trouble getting their lifetime appointments.

This has to be a joke.

RobTN on June 12, 2008 at 12:12 PM

How many conservative justices will McCain be able to get past a Democrat congress and senate? NONE, ZIP, ZERO, NADA.

We, as a free country, are so finished.

stenwin77 on June 12, 2008 at 12:16 PM

McCain has stated that he would close gitmo and move them all to a military facility in Levanworth. Too many people here lie about McCain, and that just undercuts their own position. There are a lot of things to be critical of McCain, and this liberal tactic of lying about your political opponent is really getting tired. We are better than this. Conservatives don’t do this, but (as I have observed) liberals find this to be their tactic of choice.

Makes you wonder.

wise_man on June 12, 2008 at 12:14 PM

Wise man if you come to Japan, look me up, the sakes on me.

tottoritodd on June 12, 2008 at 12:16 PM

I wonder if this ruling now gives Terrorists the constitutional right to wear suicide vests into court ? If so I want to argue that any judge who wants to give terrorists rights ALSO has to give them the right to do that.

Lets see what Judges have the balls to make that ruling.

William Amos on June 12, 2008 at 12:16 PM

he does want GTMO closed but not for the reasons cited by SCOTUS

Then what, pray tell, is his reason?

flenser on June 12, 2008 at 12:15 PM

Watch the youtube clip, and then you won’t be so ignorant of the facts.

wise_man on June 12, 2008 at 12:17 PM

This decision changes the entire concept of how we can and cannot fight a war. In level of importance I’d put this about three miles higher then Roe v Wade.

Limerick on June 12, 2008 at 12:10 PM

Agreed!

jerrytbg on June 12, 2008 at 12:17 PM

Memo to US soldiers:

Do not take prisoners.

signed,
5 Justices of the US Supreme Court

PS, If you must take prisoners, make sure they all have “heart conditions”

rbj on June 12, 2008 at 12:18 PM

We need to give Americans a thourough and politically incorrect history lesson.

Lets start with the Alien and Seditions Act by John Adams and the founders of his day!

jp on June 12, 2008 at 12:18 PM

tottoritodd on June 12, 2008 at 11:58 AM

You have got to be kidding me with that garbage. You hand pick a few lines from his original run for office in MA against Ted Kennedy and expect that to pass as his position on that issue. You are either being intellectually dishonest on purpose or you are just simply that misguided. How about some stuff he’s said within, oh lets say, this decade? Hmm?

Where do you live tottoritodd? I live in Cambridge MA and I experienced his time as Gov her first hand. I know where he stands because I watched his time here very closely and know many fine people who worked with Gov Romney. For you to ignore all of what he did while here and brush it aside and replace it with a single statement from back before he ever served one minute as gov is horrifically careless, at best.

In addition to that you take a single line Romney said about Gay people deserving equal rights. So, according to you, it is unconservative to believe equal rights is a worthy goal? Would it be more conservative for one to believe that some should have more rights than others? Mitt led the fight against gay marriage in MA. He preferred and pushed for civil unions because -the horror- it allowed gay people to be granted the same rights under the law yet recognized that the definition of marriage was not to be changed.

The one and only issue McCain was to the right of Romney on was healthcare. Thats it. That is the only issue. Weigh that against the mountain of liberal positions Hombre McCain has held firm to and its utterly hilarious to conclude that Romney is more liberal then McCain. Its just laugh out loud ridiculous.

Zetterson on June 12, 2008 at 12:19 PM

By what authority does SCOTUS dictate war-fighting to the Executive?

JohnTant

This will probably be murky, due to the fact this is NOT a declared war, thereby making it constitutionaly vague. If Congress actually declared the war, then the Executive should have (relatively) unfettered authority. In this case, not so clear.

Of course, there really is no one to declare war against, in this case, so that even adds to the confusion.

JamesLee on June 12, 2008 at 12:20 PM

Go ahead and stay home, and give Obama the job. Live with it.

LtE126 on June 12, 2008 at 12:20 PM

McCain voted for Roberts and Alito. Obama voted against Roberts and Alito.

But they are exactly the same!

Aye = Nay!

funky chicken on June 12, 2008 at 12:20 PM

How many conservative justices will McCain be able to get past a Democrat congress and senate? NONE, ZIP, ZERO, NADA.

We, as a free country, are so finished.

stenwin77 on June 12, 2008 at 12:16 PM

It may well be time for the American Julius Caesar as sad as that is to say.

Thomas Sowell has even wrote he feared it would come to this out of necessity to defend our selves and what Liberty we do have simply because so many americans are Willfully Blind.

jp on June 12, 2008 at 12:20 PM

Limbaugh just referenced this thread and Ed Morrissey!
geckomon on June 12, 2008 at 12:15 PM

I just tuned into Rush just now. I heard him claim that McCain is with the democrats on this, and then he went to a commerical break.

Rush. Please don’t lie. I know you don’t like McCain, but for pity’s sake, don’t do this. McCain wants to close gitmo and send them to ft leavenworth, not set them free. Not give them all US citizen status.

Please don’t do this Rush. Don’t lie.

wise_man on June 12, 2008 at 12:21 PM

This is why the CIA has secret prisons. I say when we capture a terrorist, we interrogate them in said secret prison, and release them back into the field with a tracking device subcutaneously implanted. Whenever they get back to their buddies, send them a hellfire greeting from a Predator. Or just kill them.

Like Al Gore said, “Of course it’s illegal – that’s why it’s a covert op.”

apollyonbob on June 12, 2008 at 12:21 PM

By the way, its time for Bush to go the Andrew Jackson route:

The SCOTUS can have their Opinions, but I’d like to know how they are going to enforce them without an Army, like the Executive has.

jp on June 12, 2008 at 12:22 PM

How many conservative justices will McCain be able to get past a Democrat congress and senate? NONE, ZIP, ZERO, NADA.

We, as a free country, are so finished.

stenwin77 on June 12, 2008 at 12:16 PM

Don’t give up. We hae survived a civil war, two world wars, Jimmy “the peanut farmer” Carter, and if you want to dust off a history book a facist president named Wilson.

We only lose if we give up

tottoritodd on June 12, 2008 at 12:22 PM

Nice!

Case A, our enemy fight us on battlefield in uniform, we abide by the Geneva Convention. And since WWII, how many times the other guys actually followed the GC for our prisoners?

Case B, our enemy fight us in civilian clothes, we are required to treat them as lawful US citizens (by today’s ruling). Did I get this right?

Sir Napsalot on June 12, 2008 at 12:22 PM

What the stupid supreme court has done is it set the worst of the worst free.

The ACLU and others have said that any detainee “Tortured” can not get a fair trial and must be set free.

We have to now release all of the people at gitmo because the left will now argue that their entire detention was incorrect and “Illegal”

William Amos on June 12, 2008 at 12:22 PM

jp on June 12, 2008 at 12:20 PM

Ceasar or Sulla?.. (no offense sulla)… dangerous statement there either way.

Limerick on June 12, 2008 at 12:22 PM

McCain wants to close gitmo and send them to ft leavenworth, not set them free

I think if they were moved to US Soil as “enemy combatants” they’d be granted Habeaus Corpes rights and granted full US Constitutional rights.

jp on June 12, 2008 at 12:23 PM

But if we just vote for McCain, the country will get more conservative RIGHT?…right?

oh f’ it.

ClassicCon on June 12, 2008 at 12:24 PM

Thanks for backing up my decision. McCain 08!

Limerick

I’m curious; Is there ANYTHING which McCain could do which would cause his backers to lose faith in him? What if he embraced communism? Islam? Joined the America Nazi Party?

The reason I ask is that I get the distinct impression that if a troop of girl scouts were found buried in McCain’s back yard, you’d just shrug and say “Well, it’s him or Obama, and he’s better than Obama”.

I mean, you people like to cite the GWOT as being a strong point of McCain’s. Faced with the fact that it’s not — you just don’t care.

flenser on June 12, 2008 at 12:24 PM

I think if they were moved to US Soil as “enemy combatants” they’d be granted Habeaus Corpes rights and granted full US Constitutional rights.

jp on June 12, 2008 at 12:23 PM

They just got that anyway.

apollyonbob on June 12, 2008 at 12:24 PM

The decision ultimately means,

Release the Dogs of War

Kini on June 12, 2008 at 12:24 PM

Ceasar or Sulla?.. (no offense sulla)… dangerous statement there either way.

Limerick on June 12, 2008 at 12:22 PM

no less dangerous than the SCOTUS decision today. What do you do though, wait for a US City to get nuked first though?

scary times all the way around.

jp on June 12, 2008 at 12:25 PM

flenser on June 12, 2008 at 12:24 PM

I don’t know. Betting on daydreams is always a bad idea.

Limerick on June 12, 2008 at 12:25 PM

Would it make a difference if we had declared war?

stenwin77 on June 12, 2008 at 12:26 PM

I live about two miles from the Jihadi, Samir Khan, who made national news last week for his AQ website. I thought about sending him a Club Gitmo T-shirt as a house warming gift but I guess thats out now.

jp on June 12, 2008 at 12:27 PM

I fear how they are going to rule on our precious 2nd Amendment.

Conservatives need to break off (physically) and start a new country. This one is done.

stenwin77 on June 12, 2008 at 12:27 PM

I mean, you people like to cite the GWOT as being a strong point of McCain’s. Faced with the fact that it’s not — you just don’t care.

Wait ’til he comments on the decision.

JiangxiDad on June 12, 2008 at 12:27 PM

Memo to US soldiers:

Do not take prisoners.

signed,
5 Justices of the US Supreme Court

PS, If you must take prisoners, make sure they all have “heart conditions”

rbj on June 12, 2008 at 12:18 PM

Yeah, so we can then put you on trial for MURDER, like the Haditha Marines.

Romeo13 on June 12, 2008 at 12:28 PM

McCain wants to close gitmo and send them to ft leavenworth

On what grounds? McCain is on record as wanting to try them or set them free.

flenser on June 12, 2008 at 12:28 PM

I used to listen to Rush. Alot. Not too much anymore. He makes me sick. He can help keep a Republican in office. He won’t. He’s not a team player anymore. My kids are gonna get Obama because of sore losers like him and crybabies like 95% of posters here.

Thanks

5-4. and it will never change. BTW… the future unborn thanks you too.

LtE126 on June 12, 2008 at 12:28 PM

I just tuned into Rush just now. I heard him claim that McCain is with the democrats on this, and then he went to a commerical break.

Rush. Please don’t lie. I know you don’t like McCain, but for pity’s sake, don’t do this. McCain wants to close gitmo and send them to ft leavenworth, not set them free. Not give them all US citizen status.

Please don’t do this Rush. Don’t lie.

wise_man on June 12, 2008 at 12:21 PM

Open your eyes. Rush is right. Just because a candidate has an R in front of their name does not mean you have to defend him. McCain sucks. Admit it.

Zetterson on June 12, 2008 at 12:28 PM

It eliminates the status of unlawful combatant, which then encourages all forces to eschew uniforms, legitimate state backing, etc etc.

As other commenters have noted, it also encourages U.S. forces not to take prisoners, but to kill anyone that attacks them.

That can’t all bad, can it?

Enrique on June 12, 2008 at 12:29 PM

I’m curious; Is there ANYTHING which McCain could do which would cause his backers to lose faith in him? What if he embraced communism? Islam? Joined the America Nazi Party?

The reason I ask is that I get the distinct impression that if a troop of girl scouts were found buried in McCain’s back yard, you’d just shrug and say “Well, it’s him or Obama, and he’s better than Obama”.

I mean, you people like to cite the GWOT as being a strong point of McCain’s. Faced with the fact that it’s not — you just don’t care.

flenser on June 12, 2008 at 12:24 PM

Well said.

I’m voting for Baldwin (Constitution Party). I’ll have NO part of turning the country over to Mexico.

stenwin77 on June 12, 2008 at 12:29 PM

I’m curious; Is there ANYTHING which McCain could do which would cause his backers to lose faith in him?
flenser on June 12, 2008 at 12:24 PM

I’ve spent years on partisan blogs and the same people said the same types of things about people who didn’t accept the liberal lies about Bush.

Makes you wonder.

wise_man on June 12, 2008 at 12:29 PM

Would it make a difference if we had declared war?

stenwin77 on June 12, 2008 at 12:26 PM

many constitutional scholars would say that we did declare war with the War Resolution and Regime Change resolutions, constitution doesn’t have contextual requirements.

either way, in the 70’s COngress passed the “War Powers Resolution Act”, SCOTUS would need to declare it Unconstitutional first I think…

jp on June 12, 2008 at 12:29 PM

Awesome, yet another defeat for our side! I feel so empowered sitting here banging on my keyboard. Time for something to snap.

ClassicCon on June 12, 2008 at 12:30 PM

But, but George Soros and the MSM tell me that the GOP can’t win Senate seats this election cycle!

Sit home and surrender in ‘08!

Get up and fight, you pussies!

funky chicken on June 12, 2008 at 12:30 PM

Yeah, so we can then put you on trial for MURDER, like the Haditha Marines.

Romeo13 on June 12, 2008 at 12:28 PM

Again, that’s why it’s a covert op :P

apollyonbob on June 12, 2008 at 12:31 PM

Zetterson on June 12, 2008 at 12:19 PM

You said name one issue. You agree that there was one. My point wasn’t to bash Romney. I like Romney. I lived in Ohio and Romney was one of my top choices, but by that time my vote was moot. My point is that we could be fighting about any one of the candidates. None were that great.

I really believe that Obama is scary. His followers believe he is our savoir. Literally.

I now live in Japan. The people here are nervous about Obama because of his trade policies. He is just an all around disaster. I hate Hillary, but if it was between her and Obama, no question I would vote for her. At least Bill produced the ‘94 revolution. It’s not that McCain is that great, it’s that Obama is that bad.

tottoritodd on June 12, 2008 at 12:31 PM

LtE126 on June 12, 2008 at 12:28 PM

Ditto.

It all boils down to the No-Macs are only interested in defeat and betting on the enemy to make a mistake so they can climb back into the drivers seat.

I’ll take my chances with McCain and work towards something better in the future instead of relying on my enemy to work for me.

Limerick on June 12, 2008 at 12:31 PM

Wait ’til he comments on the decision.

I can predict pretty much what he’ll say. He will basically agree with it. After all, he has called for exactly this in the past. But knowing how unpopular it is, he’ll try to find some detail to criticize, to try to not totally alienate Republicans.

Of course I may be giving him too much credit. He may not even do the second part.

flenser on June 12, 2008 at 12:32 PM

I used to listen to Rush. Alot. Not too much anymore. He makes me sick. He can help keep a Republican in office. He won’t. He’s not a team player anymore. My kids are gonna get Obama because of sore losers like him and crybabies like 95% of posters here.

Thanks

5-4. and it will never change. BTW… the future unborn thanks you too.

LtE126 on June 12, 2008 at 12:28 PM

Yep. Except those “future unborn” won’t ever get born to thank anybody…..of course that’s what you meant

funky chicken on June 12, 2008 at 12:32 PM

many constitutional scholars would say that we did declare war with the War Resolution and Regime Change resolutions, constitution doesn’t have contextual requirements.

either way, in the 70’s COngress passed the “War Powers Resolution Act”, SCOTUS would need to declare it Unconstitutional first I think…

jp on June 12, 2008 at 12:29 PM

Thanks.

Some have said all along the Bush should have declared war from day one. Would have resolved a lot of issues. But, whom would he have said we were at war with? Terrorists aren’t a country.

Things are going to get much, much worse before they ever improve, if ever.

stenwin77 on June 12, 2008 at 12:32 PM

If our soldiers can fight for our liberties overseas I surely can fight for our liberties here. This is a setback but gives the right ammo to paint the left as the terrorist loving group they are.

William Amos on June 12, 2008 at 12:33 PM

I have not read all of the posts here nor do I have read the opinion itself so I don’t know if anyone else has giving any thought to the following. But I wonder at what point do a SCOTUS justice’s actions rise to the level of impeachment? Because despite the modern day myth that the SCOTUS has the final and absolute say on all things constitutional there must be a logical point in which a SCOTUS justice’s actions are so clearly unconstitutional to the other branches views that action must be taken. How many unconstitutional rulings does it take for a justice to be called out?

NotCoach on June 12, 2008 at 12:33 PM

Solution - Fry them on the battlefield. Save on fuel hauling them to Gitmo, protect the nation and save on halal meals and embossed korans all at the same time.

Can Scalia and Ruthie still be palsy walsy after this?

Western_Civ on June 12, 2008 at 12:33 PM

And talkers like Rush, Tammy and Laura Ingraham call Obama an egomaniac.

Sick.

BTW…right there with you Funky…all sore loser pussies.

LtE126 on June 12, 2008 at 12:34 PM

Maybe I’m not getting this. Will this ruling effect all the prisoners we’re taking in Iraq and Afghanistan? Surely this isn’t the case.

kongzilla on June 12, 2008 at 12:34 PM

I mean, you people like to cite the GWOT as being a strong point of McCain’s. Faced with the fact that it’s not — you just don’t care.

flenser on June 12, 2008 at 12:24 PM

What exactly has shown the GWOT is not McCain’s strong point? This decision has little to do with McCain. He didn’t elect these judges to the court and actually McCain pushed and voted for the MCA 2006 act that this decision rebutted. McCain has been for closing Gitmo and trying these guy’s at bases in America not civilian courts.

Now I ask you, how will your man Obama be better than McCain in the GWOT?

Complete7 on June 12, 2008 at 12:35 PM

Well, John Marshall has made his decision, now let him enforce it. ~Andrew Jackson

jp on June 12, 2008 at 12:35 PM

My kids are gonna get Obama because of sore losers like him and crybabies like 95% of posters here.

LtE126 on June 12, 2008 at 12:28 PM

It’s disgusting. But it’s not 95%. It’s just a few that make enough noise to give you that impression.

wise_man on June 12, 2008 at 12:35 PM

I have not read all of the posts here nor do I have read the opinion itself so I don’t know if anyone else has giving any thought to the following. But I wonder at what point do a SCOTUS justice’s actions rise to the level of impeachment?

Unfortunately Supreme Court Justices are impeached by CONGRESS. Which means its more likely that Pelosi and company would impeach the 4 dissenters rather than the 5 in the majority.

William Amos on June 12, 2008 at 12:35 PM

Maybe I’m not getting this. Will this ruling effect all the prisoners we’re taking in Iraq and Afghanistan? Surely this isn’t the case.

kongzilla on June 12, 2008 at 12:34 PM

I think the ruling applies to GITMO but eventually, I guess it will apply to all. And don’t call me Shirley !?? (A line from Airplane that I loved.)

stenwin77 on June 12, 2008 at 12:36 PM

so when does the march on washington begin?
-
what is the road from here?
-
a call to all soldiers
“give no quarter, take no prisoners”

Kaptain Amerika on June 12, 2008 at 12:37 PM

They’re doing a good job, wise_man…relentless.

LtE126 on June 12, 2008 at 12:37 PM

I’ll take my chances with McCain and work towards something better in the future instead of relying on my enemy to work for me.

McCain is the enemy. At least, his stands on the major issues of the day are identical to those of the Democrats. You’re willing to make the enemy the leader of the Republican Party and expect him to work for you. How stupid is that?

I’ll take my chances with McCain and work towards something better in the future

How are you going to work towards something better in the future if you’re willing to vote for something worse here and now? You can’t get right by moving left.

flenser on June 12, 2008 at 12:37 PM

Some have said all along the Bush should have declared war from day one. Would have resolved a lot of issues. But, whom would he have said we were at war with? Terrorists aren’t a country.

Things are going to get much, much worse before they ever improve, if ever.

stenwin77 on June 12, 2008 at 12:32 PM

Declare War against what though? Islam? Al-Qaeda? the ideology in general? there is no precedent to follow and a Govt. declaring war on a religion isn’t politically possible.

In the past it was simple, because it was nations doing this….now we live in a whole new ballgame of warfare.

jp on June 12, 2008 at 12:37 PM

McCain voted for Roberts and Alito. Obama voted against Roberts and Alito.

But they are exactly the same!

Aye = Nay!

Quit dogging McCain, use him to defeat Obama, and tie his hands by electing conservative Senators.

VS

All is lost! Sit home and surrender in ‘08!

hello? Limbaugh fans? Stenwin?

funky chicken on June 12, 2008 at 12:38 PM

But I wonder at what point do a SCOTUS justice’s actions rise to the level of impeachment?

NotCoach on June 12, 2008 at 12:33 PM

I beleive that’s essentially a political issue, not a factual or technical one. In theory, I believe it’s quite easy.

JiangxiDad on June 12, 2008 at 12:39 PM

McCain is the enemy.
flenser on June 12, 2008 at 12:37 PM

No, you are the enemy.

wise_man on June 12, 2008 at 12:39 PM

Unfortunately Supreme Court Justices are impeached by CONGRESS. Which means its more likely that Pelosi and company would impeach the 4 dissenters rather than the 5 in the majority.

William Amos on June 12, 2008 at 12:35 PM

I understand this sentiment but at the same time bemoan the fact that every politician, regardless of their political bent, meekly accepts each and every SC ruling as law. The President has the constitutional obligation to simply ignore this ruling in order to send a clear message that the SC is only one branch, not the ruler of all three.

NotCoach on June 12, 2008 at 12:39 PM

The Court wants Bush to take an Andrew Jackson stance so the liberal Congress can impeach him or charge our President with War Crimes.

One of the first items on Obama’s agenda is to prosecute Americans for War Crimes.

faraway on June 12, 2008 at 12:40 PM

My kids are gonna get Obama because of sore losers like him and crybabies like 95% of posters here.

And what exactly is the functional difference between McCain and Obama? Every day we see another story illustrating how McCain is in sync with the left wing of the Democratic Party. How long can you people disbelieve the evidence of your own eyes?

flenser on June 12, 2008 at 12:40 PM

Do they all have to be released now because they have been denied a “speedy trial” and did not get read their rights when they were captured in Afghanistan and Iraq shooting at our troops? This is insane.

Dollayo on June 12, 2008 at 12:40 PM

I am so sad. This assinine supreme court decision has just jeopardized our future safety. What is even more sad, is even IF McCain manages to win this election (he sure isn’t in a hurry to take advantage of Obama’s weaknesses), is that he is facing a HUGE Democratic swing in the Senate next year and won’t be able to nominate judges that do any better than these 5 idiots who have obviously lost their mind. Sigh.

karenhasfreedom on June 12, 2008 at 12:41 PM

One of the first items on Obama’s agenda is to prosecute Americans for War Crimes.

faraway on June 12, 2008 at 12:40 PM

If they tried this, civil war. and I’d imagine Bush could get the military on his side.

jp on June 12, 2008 at 12:41 PM

I blame Reagan for being so craptastic at judge picking.

malan89 on June 12, 2008 at 12:41 PM

The President has the constitutional obligation to simply ignore this ruling in order to send a clear message that the SC is only one branch, not the ruler of all three.

NotCoach on June 12, 2008 at 12:39 PM

Yes, obligation and right. However he would have to take on both the Court and Congress at this moment. That would lead to an impeachment trial.

JiangxiDad on June 12, 2008 at 12:42 PM

Must be lots of way right nuts around here, or Dem trolls. I vote Rep and always will…I’m not and never will be a way right nut, just a Republican.

LtE126 on June 12, 2008 at 12:42 PM

How stupid is that?
flenser on June 12, 2008 at 12:37 PM

Stupid enough it appears.

Have fun forting up. It is the tried and true tactic for losing a war.

Limerick on June 12, 2008 at 12:42 PM

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