I can’t agree with the McCain apologists. “Hillbama would be worse” - “What about SCOTUS?” - “At least he’ll finish Iraq.” All that sounds to me like the battered wife who keeps returning to her abusive man. “Being alone would be worse” - “What about the kids?” - “At least he brings home a paycheck”

Blech. Remember what McCain told Cornyn? “F@#$ YOU! I KNOW MORE ABOUT THIS ISSUE THAN ANYBODY!!” If he uses that exact same quote, directed at the La Raza audience, I’ll support him. Anything short of that - forget it.

innominatus on May 5, 2008 at 7:16 PM

Any reason why I should vote for McCain or any other knucklehead running for president this year?

I still didn’t get any answer:

Why from more than 300 million, we end up with garbage?

Indy Conservative on May 5, 2008 at 7:19 PM

If the conservatives don’t want to win elections anymore the fastest way to do is alienate Hispanics.

terryannonline on May 5, 2008 at 7:23 PM

VinyFox = clever pseudomym for MB4?

innominatus on May 5, 2008 at 7:28 PM

Why from more than 300 million, we end up with garbage?

Indy Conservative on May 5, 2008 at 7:19 PM

quit whining, engineer victory and run yourself

windansea on May 5, 2008 at 7:36 PM

I can’t agree with the McCain apologists. “Hillbama would be worse” - “What about SCOTUS?” - “At least he’ll finish Iraq.” All that sounds to me like the battered wife who keeps returning to her abusive man. “Being alone would be worse” - “What about the kids?” - “At least he brings home a paycheck”

innominatus on May 5, 2008 at 7:16 PM

AWS (Abused Wife Syndrome) and ACS (Abused Conservative Syndrome) - pretty much the same pathology - same show just under a different tent.

MB4 on May 5, 2008 at 7:42 PM

Why from more than 300 million, we end up with garbage?

Indy Conservative on May 5, 2008 at 7:19 PM

God says it must be devolution. Darwin say it must be unintelligent design.

MB4 on May 5, 2008 at 7:44 PM

But if it comes at the cost of ptoentially undermining rule of law and a permanent Democrat majority, would elections matter?

I’m Hispanic and I’m a conservative. I think Hispanics and conservatives share a lot of similar values. But if conservatives don’t even want to attempt to get the Hispanic vote then let the Dems have the majority.

terryannonline on May 5, 2008 at 7:47 PM

terryannonline on May 5, 2008 at 7:47 PM

Is it conservative to go after those who think of themselves as hyphenated rather than as Americans and tailor an appeal to them? Isn’t that a liberal modus operandi?

MB4 on May 5, 2008 at 7:55 PM

I’m Hispanic and I’m a conservative. I think Hispanics and conservatives share a lot of similar values. But if conservatives don’t even want to attempt to get the Hispanic vote then let the Dems have the majority.

terryannonline on May 5, 2008 at 7:47 PM

Is it just because you’re Hispanic you think that everybody should kiss your butt? Same goes to Blacks or any other race.

When are we going to stop talking about race in this country?

Indy Conservative on May 5, 2008 at 7:57 PM

I’m Hispanic and I’m a conservative. I think Hispanics and conservatives share a lot of similar values. But if conservatives don’t even want to attempt to get the Hispanic vote then let the Dems have the majority.

terryannonline on May 5, 2008 at 7:47 PM

I agree to an extent, but Hispanics aren’t a uniform voting bloc, and not all illegals are Hispanic, either.

There is some indication that illegals, if given citizenship would break heavily for the Democrats looking for gov’t sponsored goodie bags. So again, we’re back to square one, if we are reliant on getting the Hispanic vote today, will getting Hispanic vote mean Amnesty is a given? And Amnesty is a given, does that mean we end up in the permanent minority anyway? All I care about is not ending up under the thumb of a Marxist state.

doubleplusundead on May 5, 2008 at 8:03 PM

I’m Hispanic and I’m a conservative. I think Hispanics and conservatives share a lot of similar values. But if conservatives don’t even want to attempt to get the Hispanic vote then let the Dems have the majority.

terryannonline on May 5, 2008 at 7:47 PM

If “getting the Hispanic vote” = ignoring laws, the constitution, and rewarding criminal behavior WHY WOULD CONSERVATIVES WANT IT??

If “getting the Hispanic vote” = pandering to a RACIST group that goes by the name “THE RACE” WHY WOULD CONSERVATIVES WANT IT??

Are you suggesting conservatives should pander to White Power Neo-Nazi’s in order to get the European vote??

And I’m sorry, but that is just flat out insulting to Hispanics.

The solution has always been: SHUT the borders down for illegals, OPEN the channels for legals.

Setup a guest SS network that is T00 000 0000 and change all current SSN to: C000 00 0000. When someone switches from a guest/immigrant to a naturalized citizen their SSN switches from T00 000 0000 to N00 000 0000.

* Open up the country to non-criminals that want to come here. Have them go through the embassies, with the FBI there.
* They give fingerprints, eye-scans, and a blood test. Come back in a month or two and get your passport & new Temp SSN.
* You have 3 years to become a citizen or gtfo. Commit a felony: no chance to become citizen, server jail time, then deported. Stay past your time = felony.
* Kids born to ILLEGALS are NOT citizens, their parents are not “subject to the Constitution” BUT kids born to legals are citizens (even more pressing reason to become citizen in those 3 years).

Voidseeker on May 5, 2008 at 8:06 PM

I agree to an extent, but Hispanics aren’t a uniform voting bloc

Then how do you know that “pandering” to Hispanics means amnesty?

So again, we’re back to square one, if we are reliant on getting the Hispanic vote today, will getting Hispanic vote mean Amnesty is a given?

You just said that Hispanics aren’t a uniform voting bloc, then doesn’t that mean the answer to this question doesn’t necessarily mean a “yes.”

terryannonline on May 5, 2008 at 8:09 PM

I don’t give a damn about 200-300-400 comments.

You claim to be Hispanic and you expect people to court your vote.

To be clear I think candidates should try to court EVERYONE’S VOTE!

terryannonline on May 5, 2008 at 8:12 PM

Looks like the only people who can’t “stop talking about race” are the 200 plus comments mad because how dare a presidential candidate appear before a La Raza Convention!

terryannonline on May 5, 2008 at 8:04 PM

Yeah, it would be no news if McCain was to got to a KKK meeting as long as they changed their name from KKK to “The Race” right? Or went to talk to a Nazi group that called themselves “Das Geschlecht”?

Please.

Voidseeker on May 5, 2008 at 8:12 PM

Looks like the only people who can’t “stop talking about race” are the 200 plus comments mad because how dare a presidential candidate appear before a La Raza Convention!
terryannonline on May 5, 2008 at 8:04 PM

So… You wouldn’t be a little bit upset if he appeared before a KKK or a Stormfront convention and told them he supports support their goals?

LegendHasIt on May 5, 2008 at 8:13 PM

I don’t give a damn about 200-300-400 comments.

You claim to be Hispanic and you expect people to court your vote.

To be clear I think candidates should try to court EVERYONE’S VOTE!

terryannonline on May 5, 2008 at 8:12 PM

To be clear, NOT BASED ON RACE.

Indy Conservative on May 5, 2008 at 8:15 PM

To be clear, NOT BASED ON RACE.

Wasn’t here that I continue to hear people say Hispanic is NOT A RACE, which I agree.

terryannonline on May 5, 2008 at 8:21 PM

Then how do you know that “pandering” to Hispanics means amnesty?

I don’t know, but McCain does…or he thinks he does.

You just said that Hispanics aren’t a uniform voting bloc, then doesn’t that mean the answer to this question doesn’t necessarily mean a “yes.”

terryannonline on May 5, 2008 at 8:09 PM

Yes, but there’s numerical potential and political reality, as some have said, there are some hispanic voters who are supportive of Amnesty, and anti-amnesty conservatives are pushing them away.

I guess what I want to know is this, if X hispanic voters oppose amnesty, but we need X+Y, with Y being pro-amnesty hispanic voters to win, does that mean we’re screwed? La Raza is virulently open border, McCain is doing damage to himself to go there.

doubleplusundead on May 5, 2008 at 8:21 PM

Do an archive search of what their website looked like three years ago, before it was ‘cleansed’.

Search for some of the speeches given by their leaders and members over the last 20 years.

Please post your PayPal address… I’ll send you some cash… Maybe you can buy a clue.

LegendHasIt on May 5, 2008 at 8:23 PM

Search for some of the speeches given by their leaders and members over the last 20 years.

If you are going to label a whole organization as racist then please why don’t you provide me proof.

terryannonline on May 5, 2008 at 8:27 PM

From their Web site:

1. The Translation of Our Name: National Council of La Raza

Many people incorrectly translate our name, “La Raza,” as “the race.” While it is true that one meaning of “raza” in Spanish is indeed “race,” in Spanish, as in English and any other language, words can and do have multiple meanings. As noted in several online dictionaries, “La Raza” means “the people” or “the community.” Translating our name as “the race” is not only inaccurate, it is factually incorrect. “Hispanic” is an ethnicity, not a race. As anyone who has ever met a Dominican American, Mexican American, or Spanish American can attest, Hispanics can be and are members of any and all races.

The term “La Raza” has its origins in early 20th century Latin American literature and translates into English most closely as “the people,” or, according to some scholars, “the Hispanic people of the New World.” The term was coined by Mexican scholar José Vasconcelos to reflect the fact that the people of Latin America are a mixture of many of the world’s races, cultures, and religions. Mistranslating “La Raza” to mean “the race” implies that it is a term meant to exclude others.

terryannonline on May 5, 2008 at 8:30 PM

Um, I’m looking at the their Web site right now. I see absolutely nothing that is even remotely equivalent to the KKK!

terryannonline on May 5, 2008 at 8:19 PM

Search the KKK site now, I am willing to bet you would just see a lot of “white empowerment” talk.

As LegendHasIt said above, the La Raza site has been cleansed after the truth about that group came to light. But even then they are still 100% behind ignore the laws of the USA, solely for the benefit of ‘their race’. And instead of calling for ‘their race’ to obey the laws until they are changed, they demand the laws be changed to fit the actions of criminals in ‘their race’.

Voidseeker on May 5, 2008 at 8:33 PM

If the conservatives don’t want to win elections anymore the fastest way to do is alienate Hispanics.

terryannonline on May 5, 2008 at 7:23 PM

Sorry, but saying that is like saying someone speaking at an ayrian nation rally is doing so as to not alienate whites.

- The Cat

MirCat on May 5, 2008 at 8:43 PM

“La Raza” (The Race) is a broad term which refers to those whose ancestry is indigenous to the area of Mexico (or “Aztlan”). MEChA members refer to themselves as “La Raza” or “Raza,” but the term itself is used to indicate camaraderie among those in different organizations with the same objectives. There are a number of organizations who consider themselves to be La Raza.”

The whole political movement is based on “the Race”…….

Seven Percent Solution on May 5, 2008 at 8:47 PM

He’s making it very easy for me to validate my decision not to vote for him. RINO.

KSgop on May 5, 2008 at 9:04 PM

La Raza has gone out of its way in recent years to tone down their militant Reconquista rhetoric.

Isn’t that a good thing? Isn’t that what we want?

terryannonline on May 5, 2008 at 9:06 PM

Isn’t that a good thing? Isn’t that what we want?

terryannonline on May 5, 2008 at 9:06 PM

They are toning down their rhetoric, but the goal and hatred for the United States remains the same.

Funny, I didn’t see this or this on the news…… I wonder why?

Notice the tactic change from a year ago? Notice not so many Mexican flags, and “Get off OUR continent signs?

This march had all the trappings of a May Day parade in Moscow…

Seven Percent Solution on May 5, 2008 at 9:22 PM

If it is out of political expedience or just honestly wanting to move from a less radical position, both lead in the right direction (no pun intended).

terryannonline on May 5, 2008 at 9:22 PM

Trojan Horse. Not in the right direction.

VolMagic on May 5, 2008 at 9:27 PM

I would often see La Rza at my school holding rallies and “talks.” They are virulently anti-American and racist to the core. It is absolutely correct to compare them to the KKK, New Black Panthers or other such groups. They are scum and defending them based upon what their own website says is quite foolish. Don’t believe their propaganda.

Grayson on May 5, 2008 at 9:38 PM

If it is out of political expedience or just honestly wanting to move from a less radical position, both lead in the right direction (no pun intended).

terryannonline on May 5, 2008 at 9:22 PM

What? You cannot be serious. Just because you KNOW you’re being lied to doesn’t mean that the liar is moving in the right direction!

By definition, political expedience means something that is SAID but not actually BELIEVED. That means there is no ACTUAL “move in the right direction” - it’s a fraud. Therefore it is a useless gesture except for those naive enough to believe that it is actually “a move in the right direction”.

Redhead Infidel on May 5, 2008 at 10:37 PM

Terryann, we’re talking about La Raza. They don’t vote in legislature - they just buy those who do.

Redhead Infidel on May 5, 2008 at 11:15 PM

Wait, am I now reading Republicans defending La Raza on this site? Holy Jesus what has become of this place?

I had a bad feeling this place was filled with first and second time voters.

ClassicCon on May 5, 2008 at 11:33 PM

Wait, am I now reading Republicans defending La Raza on this site? Holy Jesus what has become of this place?

Well, my apologies for not automatically jumping on the band wagon and bashing an organization.

terryannonline on May 5, 2008 at 11:51 PM

Well, my apologies for not automatically jumping on the band wagon and bashing an organization.

terryannonline on May 5, 2008 at 11:51 PM

I understand completely. I felt the same way when I supported the KKK. I thought they were just into pride and dressing up fancy and making nice warm fires and such till they found out my mother’s father’s mother was black and they tried to hang me high. I barley got away with Blondie’s help.

Tuco on May 6, 2008 at 12:03 AM

Why from more than 300 million, we end up with garbage?

Indy Conservative on May 5, 2008 at 7:19 PM

Because you’re not running.

Entelechy on May 6, 2008 at 12:14 AM

Mostly I like that you know who you are, and you stand by it! Also, that you say something, meaningful or not, in short sentences. It’s a real talent. I envy you. No, I don’t. I just like you. I’m glad you’re here, and no need to change.

Entelechy on May 6, 2008 at 12:03 AM

I like him too but also for another important reason. Although he isn’t nearly as old as I of course, he must be getting up there in years, which I like as with age comes wisdom. As he only has just the one goat to milk, and as I perceive that he could afford more than just the one goat, I am able to deduce his advancing age as a younger man would surely be able to milk more than just the one goat.

Holmes on May 6, 2008 at 12:18 AM

Not if I’m ruling this country.

Indy Conservative on May 5, 2008 at 8:10 PM

Easy, there, Indy Conservative Attila :)

Holmes, I thought that you’re not only old, but that you’d died already.

Entelechy on May 6, 2008 at 12:24 AM

terryannonline on May 6, 2008 at 12:15 AM

Here you go:

http://www.zimbio.com/pilot?ZURL=%2FIllegal%2Bimmigration%2Farticles%2F363%2FNational%2BCouncil%2BLa%2BRaza%2BJanet%2BMurguia%2BWannabe&URL=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.humanevents.com%2Farticle.php%3Fid%3D13863

From the link:

MEChA isn’t at all shy about their goals, or their views of other races. Their founding principles are contained in these words in “El Plan Espiritual de Aztlan” (The Spiritual Plan for Aztlan):

“In the spirit of a new people that is conscious not only of its proud historical heritage but also of the brutal gringo invasion of our territories, we, the Chicano inhabitants and civilizers of the northern land of Aztlan from whence came our forefathers, reclaiming the land of their birth and consecrating the determination of our people of the sun, declare that the call of our blood is our power, our responsibility, and our inevitable destiny. … Aztlan belongs to those who plant the seeds, water the fields, and gather the crops and not to the foreign Europeans. … We are a bronze people with a bronze culture. Before the world, before all of North America, before all our brothers in the bronze continent, we are a nation, we are a union of free pueblos, we are Aztlan. For La Raza todo. Fuera de La Raza nada.”

That closing two-sentence motto is chilling to everyone who values equal rights for all. It says: “For The Race everything. Outside The Race, nothing.“

That last bit remind you of anyone? Il Duce, perhaps?

Yeah, they are “just an organization”

VolMagic on May 6, 2008 at 12:31 AM

VolMagic on May 6, 2008 at 12:31 AM

Well I found this on NCRL’s Web site:

NCLR has never supported, and does not support, separatist organizations. Some critics have accused MEChA (Movimiento Estudiantil Chicano de Aztlán or Chicano Student Movement of Aztlán) of being a separatist organization and denounced NCLR for being a “major funder” of the organization. The reality is that in 2003, NCLR provided one chapter of the organization (Georgetown University) with a $2,500 subgrant to support a conference of Latino students – mainly from the Southwest and West Coast – who were attending East Coast colleges but who could not afford to travel home for Thanksgiving. These Latino student groups hold mini-conferences with workshops and speakers, bringing together students who are often the first high school graduates and college attendees in their families.

According to its mission statement, MEChA is a student organization whose primary objectives are educational – to help Latino students finish high school and go to college, and to support them while at institutions of higher education. NCLR freely acknowledges that some of the organization’s founding documents, e.g., Plan Espiritual de Aztlán, contain inappropriate rhetoric, and NCLR also acknowledges that rhetoric from some MEChA members has been extremist and inflammatory. In a June 2006 Los Angeles Times op-ed, journalist Gustavo Arellano noted that all of the MEChA members of his class graduated from college and have gone on to successful careers, a rarity at a time when only 12% of Latinos have a college degree. And to the group’s founding documents, Arellano also pointed out that “few members take these dated relics of the 1960s seriously, if they even bothered to read them.”

NCLR has publicly and repeatedly disavowed this rhetoric as we have others that we believe are inappropriate, as we did when we criticized a pro-separatist Latino website for its racist and anti-Semitic views. We will continue, however, to support programs and activities that help more Hispanics enter and finish college.

terryannonline on May 6, 2008 at 12:42 AM

terryannonline on May 6, 2008 at 12:42 AM

Fine…

This is from the KKK page:

Welcome to the Ku Klux Klan!

Bringing a Message of Hope and Deliverance to White Christian America! A Message of Love NOT Hate!

Of course they won’t say what they are on their own webpage. But you asked for links that showed La Raza’s dark side, and I supplied them.

VolMagic on May 6, 2008 at 12:47 AM

Holmes, I thought that you’re not only old, but that you’d died already.

Entelechy on May 6, 2008 at 12:24 AM

I am trying to make a come back.

Holmes on May 6, 2008 at 12:53 AM

When speaking of the border and immigration, you attract more flies with honey than with vinegar.

Sekhmet on May 6, 2008 at 1:52 AM

Then I deduce that we need to use more vinegar and less honey.

Holmes on May 6, 2008 at 2:44 AM

veiled implications that every Mestizo-looking fellow pulled over

Sekhmet on May 6, 2008 at 1:52 AM

You can take your not so veiled name calling routine and go bugger off.

Sandor on May 6, 2008 at 3:09 AM

I’m Hispanic and I’m a conservative. I think Hispanics and conservatives share a lot of similar values. But if conservatives don’t even want to attempt to get the Hispanic vote then let the Dems have the majority.

terryannonline on May 5, 2008 at 7:47 PM

I’m white and I’m a conservative. I think that whites and conservatives share a lot of similar values. But if conservatives don’t even want to attempt to get the white vote then let the Dems have the majority.

Just in case you want to see how stupid it sounds for a politician to pander to any group…why can’t you just be an American Terry (provided of course you are one)?

orlandocajun on May 6, 2008 at 6:52 AM

There is one obvious solution to the problem of illegal immigration:

The armed conquest of Mexico and the establishment of a benevolent dictatorship (headed by a Governor).

The Governor will require that all former Mexicans must learn the conqueror’s language.

In return for which the conqueror will turn a third-world economy into a first-world one.

Bonus for the conqueror: he will have all Mexico’s oil.

What’s the alternative? Hordes of illiterate Mexican peasants continue to flood over the border (some 3,000 a day at present!), reproduce faster than the still-dominant English speakers, overwhelm the economy, and turn the USA into a third-world country, consisting mainly of crime-ridden inner-city ghettos.

What are we waiting for?

MrLynn on May 6, 2008 at 7:34 AM

If they are saying something and their actions match it, then does it matter what they truly BELIEVE?

terryannonline on May 5, 2008 at 11:23 PM

But their actions do NOT match the bland marketspeak on their website. How do you not get this yet?? They are pro-amnesty, they are open borders, they are pro-Aztlan. They advocate violence against Americans to achieve their end goals.

Having slept on it now, I can see that we’re not going to get past your willful ignorance. You have CHOSEN to believe La Raza’s propaganda, and haven’t bothered to look at what is right in front of your lyin’ eyes - all the links and quotes people have provided you. And that’s only scratching the surface! You keep moving the goalposts and demanding more. Why should anyone bother? You’ve chosen your side.

The founders of La Raza are simply Jeremiah Wright in another form with a different flavor of hate and bitterness. That’s who you are defending, Terryann, and it is indefensible.

Redhead Infidel on May 6, 2008 at 8:18 AM

They, as a group, are NEVER going to vote conservative - we won’t GIVE them enough.

That’s a sweeping statement.

terryannonline on May 6, 2008 at 8:36 AM

In his own words.

JetBoy on May 5, 2008 at 5:16 PM

Oh Please! You think cranky old bastard even knows what is on his website let alone authoring it? At least be honest and quote McCain’s propoganda as his position not “his words.”

That being said, McCain can claim he is a pro-life anti-amnesty Ronald Reagan conservative all he wants. That doesn’t make it true and it isn’t despite the number of times the lie is told.

highhopes on May 6, 2008 at 9:01 AM