Video: The barracks at Fort Bragg
posted at 6:02 pm on April 29, 2008 by Allahpundit
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What can one man with a digital camera and video editing software do in the YouTube age? Watch the clips and see. The first is Ed Frawley’s highly effective expose of the conditions in his son’s barracks, ‘Tubed a few days (or weeks?) ago and percolating ever since in the appropriate circles, and the second and third are from his interview with CNN this morning, following a contrite phone call from the Army’s vice chief of staff. I always assumed most barracks were spartan, but not to the point of posing actual health hazards. If you believe the sidebar description on the video’s YT page, Fort Bragg’s hardly an isolated case.
Inevitable exit question to our military readers: How common or uncommon is this? “Good things” are only a handicam away…
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I blame Bush personally. Why not? Several YouTube commenters do.
amerpundit on April 29, 2008 at 6:07 PM
That being said, those conditions are an absolute disgrace.
amerpundit on April 29, 2008 at 6:07 PM
To force soldiers who have returned from a 15 month tour in Afghanistan to live in barracks like these is despicable. We would not allow prisoners of war to have to endure these unsanitary and unsafe conditions. Those responsible should be driven from any further military as their actions have removed all doubt they are unfit to lead.
volsense on April 29, 2008 at 6:08 PM
The people who comment on You tube are also among the most vile and unhinged loons…people with WAY too much time on their hands.
Richard Romano on April 29, 2008 at 6:11 PM
Hey, I know, let’s put the Government in charge of our health care too!!!
Tim Zank on April 29, 2008 at 6:11 PM
I served three years at Fort Carson, Colorado and never saw anything like this in our barracks. But that was 20 years ago. Still, I can’t believe this would be tolerated. Even one inspection of these quarters by a conscientious officer or senior NCO and the sh*t would hit the fan.
packsoldier on April 29, 2008 at 6:11 PM
Perhaps Mrs. Clinton will swap one of her earmarks to fix this problem.
Regardless, this is a national disgrace. I’m mad as hell.
SouthernGent on April 29, 2008 at 6:13 PM
This barracks a disgrace. In general they are top notch.
My sons barracks at Ft Knox were the exact same ones I was in back in my day. That said they were well maintained and safe.
At Ft Carson, then the move to Ft Hood, his barracks are just like an apartment building. Individual rooms (or two to a room), shared or single bath (depending on rank).
I’ve never seen the barracks at Bragg but often as units rotate in-out of a post they are waiting on another unit to vacate billets so they can move in. From what I have seen of the billets this barracks is by far the exception and not the rule.
Limerick on April 29, 2008 at 6:13 PM
yet another ‘issue’ for the Left to blame republicans for and make it appear they really do “support the troops”
jp on April 29, 2008 at 6:14 PM
I don’t know if you can blame Bush for the actions of some incompetent fools who allowed this to happen. Now that it has come to public attention, you can blame him if those in command that allowed this to happen are not dismissed publicy for total incompetence. There is absolutely no excuse for this to happen.
volsense on April 29, 2008 at 6:15 PM
As I walked through the video, it did not seem to me to be worth listening to until the last sequence. And then I was utterly outraged!
Couldn’t the army hire Marriott to provide decent accommodations? We know how to do these things in America!
Tears.
levi from queens on April 29, 2008 at 6:18 PM
Somebody’s heads and other vital body parts need to be removed.
How can stuff like this happen? Where’s the CO?
SteveMG on April 29, 2008 at 6:20 PM
Two-words for the Feds on this:
Fix it.
JetBoy on April 29, 2008 at 6:20 PM
The army allows soldiers to rent off post. They even offer pay allowances to help them with the rent.
Limerick on April 29, 2008 at 6:21 PM
Yep… people who think the government would provide better health care than the private sector really need their heads examined. Just look at what the government has done for our schools….. tragic.
Maxx on April 29, 2008 at 6:22 PM
Fort Drum, home of the 10th Mountain, is the most moved into and out of base in the country.
Having said that, the conditions there were pristine in comparison. Not luxurious or beautiful, but functional, clean and . . . functional.
The barracks at Fort Knox and the one in Louisiana where my son went for his AIT were just as functional and clean.
What gives with Fort Bragg? Someone ought to lose a rank or two over this.
Mommynator on April 29, 2008 at 6:22 PM
Guys and gals, I spent 14 years in the Army Infantry.
Do you REALLY want me to tell you about the places I’ve slept?
Do you REALLY want to hear about how long it was from the time I deployed to Iraq until I was able to have a shower with water that fell on my head that wasn’t rain?
Yeah, those pictures suck. And the blame falls smack dab on the base in question and the unit’s rear detachment.
From my understanding the billets were to be upgraded during their deployment. They weren’t. But the rear detachment (the guys that stay home when a unit goes overseas) should have had that place STRAC as hell before they came back.
Mortis on April 29, 2008 at 6:25 PM
That is a disgrace.
I’ve spent time in a similar dorm; rusted iron railings, peeling paint chips, plumbing problems, water issues, sinks getting backed up with human filth, feces in the drinking water (after a hurricane, not a normal thing) and all sorts of other crap. I did not, however, spend 15 months (or more) fighting this country’s wars.
If HRC can get 2.3 billion for NY, why can’t the army get the several million it would take to give our soldiers clean, comfortable living when they get back from doing their duty? Absolutely disgracful. Someone better lose their job over this.
VolMagic on April 29, 2008 at 6:26 PM
The army allows soldiers to rent off post. They even offer pay allowances to help them with the rent.
Limerick on April 29, 2008 at 6:21 PM
True. The Army has been shifting, since I was in, to more off post accomodations. They offer BAH(Basic Allowance for Housing) that amounts to $600-$900 per month, depending on rank. I lived in the Barracks at Ft Benning, Kelley Hill, and they were decent. No A/C but we had windows, and the Heater was either 180 degrees or nothing.
knat on April 29, 2008 at 6:27 PM
With the money the military gets, its ridiculous to have conditions like that.
muyoso on April 29, 2008 at 6:27 PM
Disgrace but the MSM will use this for their own ends.
RobCon on April 29, 2008 at 6:32 PM
Talked to my best bud, whose brother was in the army and stayed at Fort Bragg. I’ll relay the brother’s take on it.
First off, brother does not remember any buildings in that condition. The majority of barracks on base had rooms fairly comparable to most college dorms at state universities.
Brother never had a complaint, nor did anybody he knew. The most shocking thing is obviously the sewage backup picture, but this is common in a lot of areas. I can personally vouch for this as I remember basements flooding with sewage in Beloit, Wi, not far from where I lived, and I remember sewage backing up into water fountains at my high school. Not pleasant, but not a sign of poor maintenance.
The mold is disconcerting, absolutely. Something should be done about it, as should the pipes, which are only left in that condition as a result of incompetence.
However, the focus on the peeling paint is rather overdramatic. Brother says they had the same problem, and they simply repainted it. These are, after all, provided living quarters, not paid for. The broken toilet seat, he also remarked, was probably broken due to foolishness or horseplay, though he obviously can’t swear to that one being the result of it. When someone got drunk and broke the toilet seat, they went to the hardware store and got it, because the sergeant sure as hell wasn’t going to do it.
The topper is at the end when they mention paying a stipend to the soldiers who live there. Both the brother and I have lived in ratholes that cost a couple of hundred a month to live in, and they were worse than most of the pictures in that video. Hell, my landlord once kicked in my door while I was at work because there was an inspection and he couldn’t find the key. Great guy.
In short, these were largely overblown problems, most of which could be dealt with by soldiers either personally, or by getting on the cases of the maintenance officers. It’s not representative of Fort Bragg as a whole, and it’s more like some whiny liberal trying to whip up emotions for his own personal cause.
MadisonConservative on April 29, 2008 at 6:32 PM
I agree, that would have Never happened when I was in the Air Force. As for the deployment in Afghanistan, that did not bother me. It’s expected even with today’s technology.
AnthonyK on April 29, 2008 at 6:32 PM
I doubt it’s an issue of money or resources. More like incompetent command. Just like Walter Reed.
I’d like to think that stuff like this happened before (I’m sure it did; but how much?) but we’re just learning about it in the age of Youtube and digital cameras.
SteveMG on April 29, 2008 at 6:34 PM
And yet ironically, Bragg is NOT on the BRAC list while bases with far better conditions are. (to save $$$ of course! /roll eyes)
Remember back when the Army hospital was reported to have disgusting conditions for recovering wounded and the head Officer was sent packing?
Same rules should apply here to Bragg.
UncleOlaf on April 29, 2008 at 6:42 PM
Not much different than the ones I was in last time I was at Bragg….. About 27 years ago. Probably no maintenance was done while the guys were gone.
Every time we were deployed as an entire unit anywhere for more than a couple of months things looked like hell when we got back…. and for a couple of weeks everyone busted their hump getting things put right. I always hated the month or so after coming home, because we had to fix up our buildings as well as repair and maintain the equipment AND continue training…. Too many 20 hour days 7 day weeks. Other than getting a hot shower and a pizza, I would have rather stayed ‘in the field’.
About the time I left uniformed service they started hiring some civilians to do that kind of work, but in my day, we did it ALL ourselves.
Another problem that some posts had back then when units were deployed were people breaking in to vacant barracks and offices, using them for partying and trashing them just for fun.
They kept promising us new barracks. And time off when not deployed… Never got either. Guess things haven’t changed.
LegendHasIt on April 29, 2008 at 6:45 PM
“Despicable”, “disgraceful”, etc.
I agree. This needs to be fixed ASAP.
MikeZero on April 29, 2008 at 6:45 PM
Something smells about this, hope clarity will come soon. This just isn’t making sense.
MNDavenotPC on April 29, 2008 at 6:49 PM
Break down of the Chain of Command.
As a Senior Navy NCO? If they had tried to put my men in those barraks? Commanding Officer would have known about it immediatly, and whoever was in charge of those barracks would have been up on deriliction charges…
I NEVER would have let my men move in there in the first place… their Zeros and senior NCOs apparently don’t know how to work the system.
Romeo13 on April 29, 2008 at 6:52 PM
I was stationed at Bragg from Aug 2002 to Dec 2004 and yeah pretty much all the barracks look like that. Except for the support barracks. They are really nice.
What’s funny is that when I left my unit, A Co 2/505, we were promised that we were getting new barracks soon. I’m a detailed recruiter so I’ve been out of Bragg for a bit. I was under the impression that Bragg had stopped using those old WWII barracks.
In my old room the AC didn’t work (which wasn’t that big a deal) but the nasty thing was all of the mold in the ceiling. I went to PLDC (Primary Leadership Development Course) and got a weekend where we were allowed to go back to real life. There was mold on the walls after only two weeks! Yeah those barracks are atrocious.
JasonG on April 29, 2008 at 6:52 PM
Oh, Forgot to add:
I’ll bet a hundred bucks that conditions are quite livable now in that barrack; Maybe not elegant, but clean and functioning.
If not, everyone from the Battalion CO to the Platoon Sergeant needs to be ‘busted’ by AT LEAST one rank, and the Squad Leaders all get Article 15s.
LegendHasIt on April 29, 2008 at 6:54 PM
I’m going to tell you people the same thing that I would tell my soldiers.
It is the Army, not the boy scouts.
The Army has the most personnel, the most aircraft, the most sea-faring vessels, more spec-ops, more tactical communications, etc, etc. Yet, it has the smallest budget. When it comes down to it, I’d much rather have the money spent on equipment that will keep me alive as opposed to a slightly nicer standard of living.
I lived in crappy barracks before I went to Iraq. I lived in crappy barracks when I lived in South Korea. But I never got butthurt over it and cried.
It is what it is.
Blarg the Destroyer on April 29, 2008 at 7:03 PM
Some of the conditions were not satisfactory to the point of being deplorable (mold and sewer problems), however…
The father is also trying to make a mountain out of a molehill.
When I was living in base housing the AF base had a “store” where I could go and pick up things for the home for free.
I don’t remember if paint was available but I am almost positive toilet seats were. (All other parts of a toilet were).
When “someone” (who will remain nameless) flushed a toy car down the toilet, that I was unable to unblock. A call was made and an AF plumber came out and removed/reinstalled the toilet minus the toy the next day.
Disclaimer: AF housing is not Army housing. The joke is that the AF builds the base/golf course first, and goes back to congress when they need more money for the runway.
F15Mech on April 29, 2008 at 7:03 PM
Probably the best a Russian soldier could hope for. That being said, we should have different standards here.
Indeed, why not hire if not Marriott then at least Motel 6 to plan and build acceptable housing for the military?
freevillage on April 29, 2008 at 7:10 PM
I haven’t watched all the video yet, but I’m wondering about the comments near the front end- complaints about not taking a shower for 8 weeks and not calling home for a month. Personally, that doesn’t sound so horrible. If you’re fighting an enemy in the mountains, there probably aren’t going to be showers. That doesn’t seem too insane, but I’ve not been in the military, so I’m just wondering?
That and the 7 mins a month use of the satellite phone- is that really crazy itself? Isn’t it insanely expensive to use satellites in general? I work in television, and it costs around $900 an hour to use one of the television satellites we downlink from. I’d imagine sat phones are pretty expensive to utilize themselves (surely much cheaper but expensive nonetheless).
Haven’t even gotten to the part with any pics of the barracks, but I just wondered about these two items upfront…no idea if these are common situations or what (??)
TheBlueSite on April 29, 2008 at 7:13 PM
His rants like calling home and use of a sat phone are easy to dismiss.
The only thing I would give him credit for is the mold/sewer problems.
F15Mech on April 29, 2008 at 7:26 PM
True, but they’re very selective with it and it can be very rare for junior single guys because, by contract, they have to keep a certain amount of occupancy in the barracks. Only when that number is exceeded can the excess get off base. Senior ranking enlisted members will always be off base before Sgt’s and below.
A related side story: Here in Pensacola, there’s been a bit of a turn-around, since one of the ‘money-saving’ BRAC aspects has been to take base housing (along with Bachelor Officer/Enlisted Quarters) and turn it over to civilian firms to manage. What they get paid is what the service would pay you if you lived in town ~ BAH (formerly BAQ) ~ Basic Allowance for Housing. (It’s a different amount on every station, being the end result of a formula that takes into account the prevailing rental market rates, utilities, etc. As you can imagine, in California, it’s a small, necessary fortune. In Camp LeJeune, NC, not so much.) So the contracts signed by these firms and the DOD stipulate a certain amount of housing will be occupied, with the BAH for those service members payable to the firms.
Beginning the LAST week of March, someone on base here did the math and went “Holy CRAP! We don’t have enough folks in base housing!” Instead of filling the slots with the plethora of students checking in in a constant stream, some genius pulled in ALL the flight students already stationed and settled in here ~ married and single. They were told as of APR 1 (a week’s notice, mind you) their BAH was revoked and they needed to be in base housing, so report to THAT office and sign the ‘lease’, ASAP. (The Navy would also NOT be paying their relocation moving expenses.)
You can imagine the chaos it caused. Our young neighbor moved in about 6 months ago, had gotten a dog and was thankful he was done moving for a while, since it had been 4 moves in 8 months. He had to break his lease and move on base, along with all his classmates. The rental market here is tough enough as it is without the Navy pulling the rug out from under these kids and their landlords (Many of whom are deployed…with the Navy, like our neighbor. Hard to find tenants from mainland Japan, less mind a war zone.)
In typical military fashion, a just arrived flight student has moved into the hastily vacated home next door, clueless to how lucky he is.
tree hugging sister on April 29, 2008 at 7:30 PM
I personally never saw a barracks anywhere that looked ‘that’ bad, but the Army has lots of old buildings and yes, paint peels eventually. New barracks and housing is being built on nearly any and all bases and it actually quite nice for the most part. But, we are in a war and funds get distributed as needs dictate these days. All that said, my husband would have had his men pitch their tents before he would have ever let them occupy that building. Hell, he had a fit if anyone touched ‘his walls’….a hold over from DI days I think. But as a Top and CSM, some NCO would be standing parade rest with a mighty tight asshole should he have been presented with that mess. Yea, blame the post commander, but there is a battalion CSM and commander who has a whole lot of ’splaing to do here! Let alone the rear detachment NCO’s….but they’d be out of a job by now!
dustoffmom on April 29, 2008 at 7:30 PM
Oh, I forgot to add that when my parents came and saw me after I got back (from Afghanistan or Iraq, I can’t remember which) my dad took a look around the barracks and remarked that they were the worst barracks he’s ever seen.
The man joined in 1975 as an Infantryman.
JasonG on April 29, 2008 at 7:32 PM
And probably what will happen is these soldiers will have a massive GI party (military speak for a wasted weekend cleaning up the barracks) one weekend. Trust me; the SNCOs and officers don’t live in this filth so they will only care when the congressmen start calling.
Correct in theory, but dependent on rank and location. On many posts, the post commander must approve BAH for single soldiers. What’s more, the approval is based on how full the barracks are. So if the barracks have empty rooms, you’re not getting BAH to move off post.
Really not a big deal and most probably the dad’s soldier-son didn’t complain about it. Most of us don’t complain about that when deployed. (Besides, that’s what baby wipes are for!) That’s what makes it interesting and fun. It’s our loved ones who don’t understand why we’re not emailing and calling.
As for me, I’ve only lived in the barracks for 5 of my 22 years (not counting deployments), and I’ve had some disgusting things (like signing waivers about asbestos and lead paint on the walls…but you have to sign those to live in base housing with your family, too, some places), but nothing to write home about. I’m more concerned with planes almost as old as the barracks in this little film…
mjtyson on April 29, 2008 at 7:41 PM
The soldier in charge of maintenance should be disciplined. Then this other soldier should not be taking digital photos and whining to his dad, rather he should organize a work detail and clean up the barracks / pig sty.
tommylotto on April 29, 2008 at 7:45 PM
I just spoke with the PA officer at Ft. Bragg. He was completely nondefensive and admitted the conditions shown on the video are disgusting. He sent me a link to the Fayetteville Observer’s website: http://www.fayobserver.com/special/videos/2008/04/0425fortbraggresponds.html“>
Sorry if the link doesn’t work. I am nontechy. Anyway he did say the unit in question returned 3 weeks early and with only 72 hours notice. The main issues have been cleared and they are scheduled to move into completely new barracks in summer ‘09. He said it is still an old building and pretty much always in need of something. But he was very pleasant considering he has probably been fielding all kinds of calls all day and since the story broke locally.
texasgirl on April 29, 2008 at 7:53 PM
Update current Bragg Story 03/21/08 MILCON: Fort Bragg Building for 43,000 Soldiers There is video in the link but I can’t get it to work.
AnthonyK on April 29, 2008 at 7:53 PM
Blarg, we grok you 100% on the Spartan ethic you propound here. It is to your credit as a citizen-warrior, and we thank you for your service standing guard over this fat dumb happy(schizo?)country of ours.
But its not really OK. Our uniformed personnel deserve the best treatment we can give them, and our tax dollars need to be spent in ways that reflect our appreciation of the armed services. If any barracks anywhere is a rathole, then thats a bad thing, and it needs to be fixed pronto by responsible people. and if some brass hatted shavetail somewhere doesnt want to do whats necessary to keep the barracks clean and rat-free, that dude should be cashiered out of service.
Mike D. on April 29, 2008 at 7:55 PM
Back when I joined the AF in 1998, I was sent to Keesler AFB, (Gulfport, MS) for Tech School, and the building I lived in was dated to around the Korean War… Of course, they were (at that time) just opening the first of their new dorms, and have since replaced all of them. I remember our bathroom flooded once similar to the pic shown. The walls were cinderblock, and we were missing our fair share of ceiling tiles, but believe it when I said we worked overtime to make sure we passed weekly room and bay inspections. We even won Squadron of the Month based on our inspection the last week I was there.
When I first arrived at Osan AB, Korea, in Feb 2001, I was put into a billeting building apart of a group affectionately referred to as “the crack houses” because they were reminiscent of a crack house… That and the fact that every wall and ceiling surface had cracks in them… Luckily I only had to spend 1 week in those before a dorm room became available. But those are also all gone now.
Those dorms pictured above appear to be suffering not only from age, but also neglect. That much mold, peeled paint, and the uncapped drain lines indicate to me that the folks in charge of maintaining the building need a serious kick in the pants. Even if the buildings are scheduled for replacement, as long as people are living in them, it is their job to keep them livable…
Tremor on April 29, 2008 at 8:05 PM
All the while the Army grunts do without:
Hillary’s multi-million $ request for her pork,
certainly not for our boys or security.
Chertoff spends multi-millions
on a virtual fence that doesn’t measure up,
wasting tax dollars on nothingness,
certainly not for our boys or security.
Where is the Army Corps of Engineers?
Still stuck where the sun don’t shine in New Orleans?
This COULD be a set-up by supervising personnel
not processing the paperwork for upkeep and repair
not making the calls to follow up
but withholding to make the grunts’ lives miserable
and score some political points
to settle their own gripe or grudge
the details of which we’ll probably never know.
maverick muse on April 29, 2008 at 8:06 PM
In the early ’80’s, I stayed in “splinter village” (old WWII barracks that were supposed to be destroyed in the ’50’s)at Ft. Riley and it was open bay billets, no A/C, doors open 24/7 to keep it reasonably cool, iron bunk beds (we slept on the floor), toilets without doors on the stalls, and we sucked it up. In fact, we even Brassoed the plumbing pipes. I am willing to bet that the building maintenance has been contracted out and was not the responsibility of a troop unit. Any Commander or 1SGT would never have allowed this to happen. The military teaches that the welfare of the troops comes first. The lowest rank is taken care of before the higher ranks (a hard and fast rule when I was a Tank Company Commander).
DAT60A3 on April 29, 2008 at 8:07 PM
Maybe, the should move to gitmo.
This sort of thing has always happened…it sucks, but won’t ever change
tomas on April 29, 2008 at 8:08 PM
Seriously, is this a DNC ad?
In my ten years in the military, I can never recall ever seeing barracks looking that bad, even transient personnel barracks. Even as a HM serving with the Marines when we stilled had Quonset Huts serving as living quarters, they were old, but nothing, and I mean nothing like that.
Watching the film, I am reminded not of barracks being utilized by our personnel, but of barracks getting ready to be torn down, hence the lack of maintenance and upkeep.
When I was in, we had ‘Field Day’ every Thursday evening, which meant a top to bottom total cleaning, for inspections on Friday morning by senior NCOs and Officers, for it is one thing the military will ever teach you, is cleaning, even if it doesn’t need cleaning!, so I cannot comprehend any Officer or NCO allowing this to happen.
One thing that stuck with me, was his claim of lead based paint…ummm…how did he know it was lead based? (Frame 6:26) Also, did you notice at frame 3:59, the picture of a soldier holding his head in his arms? And maybe I am nitpicking, but it seems like every time the narrator attempts to say ’soldier’ he almost says ’shoulder’, but quickly corrects himself.
I smell ‘Bravo Sierra’ on this one.
Gothguy on April 29, 2008 at 8:09 PM
I gotta take issue with this comment:
You must have been very unlucky in the people you have served with.
In my 10 years (6 1/2 uniformed, the rest as a ‘civilian contractor’ to DOD) I met ONE First Sergeant and maybe a dozen SFC’s that might have allowed that kind of situation to last more than a couple of days. Out of thousands.
And the worst ‘combat arms’ SM or CSM that ever lived wouldn’t allow conditions like that to last even if the troops themselves were happy as pigs in a sty about it.
Even most of the junior and field grade officers I knew wouldn’t allow it to be more than a very short, temporary situation. Old barracks, yeah… You can’t do much about that even if you are a base CG. But filth and flooded bathrooms? No way.
LegendHasIt on April 29, 2008 at 8:12 PM
Having provided some equipment to the Army and seen what the brass expected these fine people to use makes this video just another disappointment.
Details omitted, but this is consistent with so much I have seen I am surprised sometimes these fine people will fight for us. It is not the brass, methinks, in many cases.
And Congress is so damn useless I believe their performance rating is overstated at least 2x. They are a big part of problems like this. The little games of San Fran Nan and Dingy Harry are part and parcel with the lack of funds to fix this kind of stuff. It would do those two some good to spend a month in barracks as the chambermaids. They would do lousy job of it but their attitude toward the troops might change a little.
Harry Schell on April 29, 2008 at 8:38 PM
That’s why I joined the Air Force instead of the Army. Those guys do the heavy lifting and get treated like sh!t. I’ve been TDY to some Navy bases that had really crappy facilities for their troops too. The AF seems to take better care of their people from what I’ve seen over the last twenty six years of service.
Big John on April 29, 2008 at 8:39 PM
And if this is how government cares for the thin line between the country and oblivion, what do you think your healthcare will be like?
Harry Schell on April 29, 2008 at 8:40 PM
You seem to have seen the same things that I did ages ago, I guess some things never change, except from what I saw the Navy had it pretty good. You were smart to join the Air Force.
MB4 on April 29, 2008 at 8:47 PM
LegendHasIt,
Yes, I’m a bit bitter. I’m bitter from all the inspections I’ve been through where I got failed because I had a piece of trash in my trash can (trash cans are not supposed to have trash in them), a fan plugged in (it could start all by itself and burn the barracks down), or some ice in my crappy little dorm fridge’s “freezer”!
I had a problem with all these E-9s (they weren’t CSMs or CMSgts) inspecting my rooms and NOT writing up the things that needed fixing, like broken doors, rugs stained as if a cat had visited, window screens missing (and thus gigs for dust) and three shower heads for 57 rooms (about half of which had two people in them…do the math).
So yes, I’m bitter. Since going to the dark side (becoming an O, and that’s not a zero!) whenever the commander has directed a barracks inspection, I have stuck with health issues that were within the resident’s power to correct. Thankfully, the few I’ve done had been in barracks that are pretty new and had no health issues like asbestos or paint or carpets.
mjtyson on April 29, 2008 at 8:48 PM
Most of you are severly uniformed about this. The reality is, this is what happens when the barracks are contracted out to civillians. We no longer have control over the barracks like we (SNCO’s and NCO’s) once did. Like everything else on base, supply, the chow hall, the barracks fall under the perview of civillians who could give a damn. We put in requests for repair and eventually they get around to it. Another problem is when a barracks is slated for renovation, they are less likely to spend the money to fix things that are wrong. The problem with this is that when the barracks arent being renovated till FY 09 or FY 10 they will obviously fall into a poor state of repair. I will be damned if the military leadership is going to be blamed. On the base I am stationed, by order, we are only allowed to inspect bi-weekly vice the weekly Friday morning field day inspections I got when I was a young Marine.
You see, crap like this is the 2nd and 3rd order effects of providing our troops with a better quality of living if you can believe it. My troops barracks are pathetic, and there isn’t a damn thing I can do about it, because I’m outranked by a fat lazy GS who could give a damn.
gator70 on April 29, 2008 at 8:49 PM
Aren’t they still the ones who are suppose to be in charge or has that changed too?
MB4 on April 29, 2008 at 9:00 PM
As embarrassing as it is, I’m glad it’s out there and I don’t care if the MSM publicizes it.
Those soldiers don’t get Basic Housing Allowance and are forced to live in the barracks because they are single. Instead of getting paid the same amount married soldiers get a couple of single guys could easily afford to rent an apartment or house to live in. But single soldiers by and large don’t get that allowance until they make Staff Sergeant.
Hog Wild on April 29, 2008 at 9:00 PM
Does that fat lazy GS also outrank your base commander?
MB4 on April 29, 2008 at 9:02 PM
I was in Old Division at Bragg in ‘05 and again in ‘06. It was this bad or probably worse, but don’t want to play the “it sucked worse for us game.” We didn’t let families in for this very reason. It was a disgrace, but all we wanted was to get the DD214’s and move on.
Check the Guard and Reserve catonment area at Bragg, way worse than the 82nd areas.
E5infantry on April 29, 2008 at 9:09 PM
My brother was statioed at Fort Bragg, and I’ve been there. That did not look like the Fort Bragg that I remember by any stretch of the imagination.
Vntnrse on April 29, 2008 at 9:18 PM
It all depends on where you are. Most the barracks are pristine, but the ones slated to be torn down are just allowed to fall apart as they build the new barracks. (In front of the DFAC in old division)
E5infantry on April 29, 2008 at 9:20 PM
I spent years at Bragg. These barracks are located at the top of Smoke Bomb Hill. Thousands of troops and their commanders run by these barracks every morning at 6:00 a.m. during their Post required five mile P.T. run.
The video showed new barracks that are being built. I’m assuming that Bragg had more troops in country than they anticipated and had to stick them somewhere.
It doesn’t sound like these troops have been in country that long and the Army was probably taking steps to make these barracks livable.
I can assure you that the problem is NOT either lack of concern on the part of the senior NCO’s and Commanders of these troops (even the most sadistic leaders would have reported these conditions if for no other reason than the battalion monthly payday barracks inspection would have ruined their careers for letting the barrack be in this condition) or not wanting to spend money (Bragg is huge and there are plenty of civilian contractors who make a fortune fixing and maintaining the housing and grounds- when I lived in Post housing and had a problem with my air-conditioner a private contractor came out and fixed it immediately).
I do know this: The father (and probably his son) are now the most hated by all troops who live on Post. There will be endless inspections as a result of this and any poor S.O.B. living on Post will now spend countless hours fixing all the gigs found in the numerous pre-inspections that will surly come prior to the main inspections.
The father has good intentions but he has no idea the absolute heck he’s brought down on all the poor barracks dwellers- the Army, like large corporations, always overreacts to situations like this.
frank on April 29, 2008 at 9:28 PM
You completely missed his point.
As he notes - explicitly - in the video, he is not offering “complaints” as you put it about the hardships in Afghanistan. Instead, he is - again, as he specifically noted - pointing out the sacrifices these men made in combat … and suggesting that after dealing with those hardships, they deserve better when the return home.
Which they do.
Professor Blather on April 29, 2008 at 9:30 PM
Rugs and carpets? If you had rugs and carpets in the barracks,the whole military has indeed gone to hell.
Other than my few rare ventures into the land of the “Perfumed Princes”, I rarely saw carpets in any military building. Even linoleum was a “treat”
Knew an infantry battalion commander at Ft. Stewart that bought his own rug for his office. Everyone thought he was an effete snob for it.
In my latter days, the very best of us lived in a ‘Stockade’. And didn’t complain about stained carpets.
Course I’m an old guy. We ate 25 year old C-rations, slept on cots when we could get ‘em AND WE LIKED IT that way.. ;-)
/grandpa simpson
LegendHasIt on April 29, 2008 at 9:30 PM
So, maybe somebody should do a “follow the money” on the funds which are allotted for these repairs.
surrounded on April 29, 2008 at 9:31 PM
Excellent post. And he’s right.
I had my first drill weekend with the National Guard last weekend. The barracks were pretty bad, the chow was close to inedible. (Of course, being a former Marine, it all seemed fine to me …)
One of the officer candidate’s, a staff sergeant, actually complained. She approached the NCOIC of the training unit, in front of all of us, and pointed out that the food wasn’t even fully cooked and was a safety hazard.
His answer? Just like Gator said: the food and accommodations (and even base security!) are provided by independent civilian contractors, and there’s nothing he can do …
Professor Blather on April 29, 2008 at 9:33 PM
What’s the big deal - week long Sergeant Major’s working party and it’s fixed.
JohnW on April 29, 2008 at 9:34 PM
Disgraceful,and with the greatest respect and only kidding
but the the Latrine flood,couldn’t the Navy of cleaned it up!
canopfor on April 29, 2008 at 9:34 PM
Excellent post.And he’s right.
Professor Blather on April 29,2008 at 9:33PM.
Professor Blather:Nice to hear your posts again,
where you’ve been?
canopfor on April 29, 2008 at 9:37 PM
Said it better than I did.
It’s not like a dirty hotel room, they are no other places to stay. Next stop, combat stealth shelter on the PT field. You don’t complain, because the antidote is worse than the disease. Embrace the suck.
E5infantry on April 29, 2008 at 9:38 PM
Nothing at all wrong with the Air Force. On one small NAVSECGRU base in the UK on which I spent most of my enlistment, the barracks (it was a former Royal Air Force base) were pretty outstanding. Old but decent carpet! Paint on the walls! Refrigerators in their rooms!
The single Marines thought they’d died and gone to Heaven.
The few zoomies from the small Air Force detachment on base stayed in the same barracks … the ones we thought were frickin’ awesome … but THEY got a sub-standard housing allowance for living in such squalid conditions.
No joke.
I spent 4 months in San Angelo, TX (now famous for its interesting religious folks) at Goodfellow AFB. We were put up in rooms that you’d pay decent money to stay at in a Marriott or Radison. Seriously. Wall to wall carpet, televisions and fridges and microwaves, and - wait for it! -
MAID SERVICE.
That’s right. Maid service.
The Air Force has it made.
But some of us actually wanted to be in the military.
Professor Blather on April 29, 2008 at 9:39 PM
I’m around. Just been busy. I lurk now and then.
Plus I’m all Obama’d out.
Professor Blather on April 29, 2008 at 9:40 PM
I lived in those barracks for 2 1/2 years, and that was 6 years ago now. I don’t WANT to know what kind of stuff was growing in my ceiling then, let alone now.
The ventilation was horrible. The only way you could get clean-smelling air is to open the windows, which isn’t all that practical in the winter or dead of summer. There were NO air filters in the heating/cooling units in each room, and this was also true of other Army barracks I’ve stayed in.
My impression from my time of service is that the Army doesn’t really care about barracks maintenance or repairs as much as it cares about appearances. In this case, with no soldiers to clean, paint, and cover stuff up, the barracks’ appearance became even more run-down during the course of the deployment.
Livefreeordie on April 29, 2008 at 9:54 PM
OK vets time to speak up.
If you want to believe this is true (LMAO) where would the sargent in charge be right now for allowing this? What will the soldiers face at general inspection for allowing this? Now, excluding some type of emerengcy, how many of you buy this cockeyed story?
This is NOT how the military works, one spec of dust, one wrinkle in a bed, one water spot in a sink, will get you written up or repramanded lol.
allrsn on April 29, 2008 at 9:58 PM
It’s funny you mention the sub-standard housing allowance. When I was in Airborne school at Ft. Benning, there were one or two Air Force guys in my class. Each received unfit quarters pay for staying in Army barracks.
Livefreeordie on April 29, 2008 at 9:58 PM
I was pretty much done with the video once the commentator, (the soldier’s grandfather, I believe), stated he took those pictures himself the day after his grandson returned from Afghanistan. Give it a month…geez, then go in and take pictures. There’s a not a First Sergeant alive that would tolerate a barracks in that condition. They’d been empty for some period of time, so yes, they’ll need quite a bit of work.
Unsurprised, and underwhelmed. No story there, sorry.
DngrMse on April 29, 2008 at 9:59 PM
When my husband was stationed at Ft. Campbell,KY (101st Airborne-Screaming Eagles)the barracks were deplorable. The single guys lived in the old condemned AirForce barracks. They didn’t look any different than the ones on that video. You didn’t complain to anyone, because there wasn’t anyone that gave a rats behind. They dealt with it and moved on. Or got married so that they could get BAQ (BAH) and move out. Between the barracks and the chow hall I never understood how any of them survived. Although, I’ve also tried to stomach an MRE and that alone is reason enough to thank everyone past and present for their brave service.
These guys deserve a lot better than they are getting, but can withstand a heck of a lot worse without complaint. Sadly, as much as this father was trying to do a good thing for his son and others his son is going to pay an awful price for what his father has brought to light. The powers that be don’t like to be made out to look like the fools they are!!
mauioriginal on April 29, 2008 at 10:07 PM
allrsn on April 29, 2008 at 10:07 PM
Opps I hit strike instead of enquote, sorry.
allrsn on April 29, 2008 at 10:08 PM
Yeah, tell that to the 240 lb E-5 I saw the other day with a giant jelly donut stain on the front of his ACUs…
I was too dumbstruck to ding him on it…
greenonions on April 29, 2008 at 10:16 PM
True I and others have also stained our uniforms (I worked with oil), but it had better be fixed fast.
allrsn on April 29, 2008 at 10:19 PM
Exactly. Every blackberry assigned to Fort Bragg is buzzing like mad right now.
and it will be only a matter of time before people start bitching about the Army spending too much time worrying about the paint on the walls than fighting the war…
greenonions on April 29, 2008 at 10:20 PM
Fine, but do you honestly think NCOs are running around bouncing quarters off soldiers’ beds following a deployment? Let alone giving them Article 15s for it?
greenonions on April 29, 2008 at 10:22 PM
The worst I ever saw was a chow hall with a very bad main sewer drain, (if you want to talk about stain on clothes you should have seen these plumbers) the building was being replaced so instead of spending 100,000 permently reparing it they spent 5000 fixing it weekly.
allrsn on April 29, 2008 at 10:23 PM
NOT in a war zone NO. Now you getting silly.
allrsn on April 29, 2008 at 10:24 PM
I grew up an Army brat and lived on Army bases most of my childhood, including at Fort Bragg. I was also in the Air Force for four years, and back then (the ’60s) no barracks would get to that point. We who lived in them were charged with keeping them ship shape. That included painting, scraping, cleaning, waxing, etc. We also kept the latrines spotless, though we didn’t do actual plumbing. The military service that I know, as a dependent and as an airman, would never have allowed any building to get to that point without some action. My first sergeant would have moved heaven and hell to get this fixed.
rivlax on April 29, 2008 at 10:26 PM
Exactly my point, and experience.
allrsn on April 29, 2008 at 10:28 PM
He didn’t speak to his son for 8 weeks,not even a phone
call because his son decided to give his 7 minutes of phone time to the married guys. How difficult would it have been for junior to say, ‘Hey…you can have my seven minutes, but how about having your spouse calling this 10 digit # and let my family know I’m OK’. Seems pretty simple.
Firmworm on April 29, 2008 at 10:38 PM
In the the Marine Corps, at Camp Lejeune, housing wasn’t paradise, but it wasn’t supposed to be. There are always problems with old buildings, but things were kept clean and there was always a senior NCO who could get things fixed.
Growing up as an Army brat, however, some of our lodging was less desireable. That was in the eighties, though. I’ll just say that I’m not terribly shocked to see this story coming out of Fort Bragg.
joewm315 on April 29, 2008 at 10:40 PM
That is appalling. I can’t believe these poor guys are forced to live in these conditions.
4shoes on April 29, 2008 at 10:42 PM
In defense of the Army, stairwells are considered a “common area” which barracks dwellers are expected to keep clean. They don’t have maids there, gents.
joewm315 on April 29, 2008 at 10:42 PM
True although much of the housing has been replaced on many bases, only 20 years ago most housing was build preWWII. It was hastaly built and a little lacking. IT WAS however clean and well maintained, if not heads and asses would fly!
allrsn on April 29, 2008 at 10:44 PM
This has nothing to do with Bush. He isn’t the inspector. The DOD is a HUGE buerocracy. Notice it took an army dad to complain and not a paratrooper.
We do deserve to be housed better at the lower enlisted level, but the truth is it is changing. Sweeping renovations are talking place all over the Army. At Ft. Bragg our housing was okay, but did have leaks from bathroom overflows, which are extremely common. When you have family after family living in these units, the tenents dont’ take care of the quarters because they aren’t theirs and they know they’ll be in and out in a couple years at best.
We call the lower enlisted housing in the Army “the ghetto”. Everyone refers to them that way. BUT they are all being torn down and rebuilt.
The problem with the barracks is that this is where the lower enlisted single soldiers must live. They cannot live off post until they reach a certain rank. They don’t usually live there long because they deploy and promote.
I see the Army taking care of this Army wide, but it isn’t suprising that this substandard housing still exists.
Amy Proctor on April 29, 2008 at 10:51 PM
I lived in Corregidor Courts from 1962-64 when it was officers’ quarters and our three-bedroom apartment was quite comfortable and spacious. Just FYI, it was the same floor plan as Capt. Jeffrey MacDonald’s, which was just up the street on Castle Drive.
I also lived on post at Kelley Barracks near Stuttgart, Germany, in another spacious 3-bedroom apartment. Even at Fort Gordon in Georgia in the early ’50s, our quarters were clean and comfortable, if not stylish.
As with the troops, we had very strict maintenance rules, including lawn mowing, etc. It sounds like things have changed a bit in 40 years. I guess you can’t make anyone do anything anymore.
rivlax on April 29, 2008 at 10:52 PM
Hey, y’all! I’m here at Bragg - wife of, rather than soldier. and there are tons of new barracks being erected but it does take time to get them built; the soldiers are being shuffled around as old barracks are being torn down.
Blight on April 29, 2008 at 11:09 PM
Amen to that! He now has that dreaded ‘Congressional Flag” on his records. Excuse me for saying so, but ‘civilians’ do not realize they problems they bring upon their service members when they haughtily fire off letters and videos to Washington or the press. You are ever after branded as a handle with kid gloves soldier and while they may talk sweet to your face…..they are gunning for you in the end. Sortta like Vegas….what happens in the Army stays in the Army mentality, particularly with the oldtimers. And they are most likely your commander and senior NCO’s. It’s always a no win situation for the soldier. If his son is any kind of soldier he is sorely regretting this!
dustoffmom on April 29, 2008 at 11:11 PM
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