If y’all would just buy a Prius or ride a bike, we wouldn’t need the oil over there anyhow. s/off :)

Now there you go confusing all the defeatist with facts and reality and all that. Don’t you know it doesn’t matter we can just come home put up some walls bury our heads/asses in the sand and wish away all the bad people in the world.

I, for one, am not advocating isolationism. I even think removing Saddam was the right thing to do, especially if we thought at the time that he was building WMD stockpiles. What I do have a problem with, however, is replacing this anti-American tyrant with an even bigger one — an Islamic state.

So I am not against interventionism per say, but I am against long, drawn-out, costly, ineffective Islamic democracy building projects.

Allowing Iraq to be taken over by groups inimical to American interests…

You mean like the Islamic government that we’ve setup there?

Ironic? you have just stated that no matter what victories we have on the battlefield, what improvements we have in the political arena within Iraq, what PR advances we make, what friendships we make, we can not ever “win” in Iraq. I’m sure there were plenty of people that thought that about Nazi germany, about imperial Japan, about communism soviet union. Because you see there is still in emperor in Japan, still some Nazi beliefs in Germany, still some Communists in russia. So of course we didn’t “win” any of those victories either.

I find it amazing that, after all this time, you people still don’t get it.

Your WWII Germany/Japan comparison is invalid. After the war, both Japan and Germany were able to be reformed and rebuilt into modern, democratic societies because the underlying political philosophy which caused the war in the first place had been defeated. Shintoism in Japan was severely discredited; Nazism, as a highly influential worldview, had been destroyed. This is not the case in the Middle East today, where Islam is not only the prevailing religious/political worldview of the people, but it is also the law of the land. And since there is no way of Democratizing (i.e. liberating) Islam, there is no way we can possibly “win.” Democracy and Islam are completely incompatible.

Of course, none of this is going to sink in until you come to the realization that Islam itself is the enemy. But of course, for that to happen, you’d have to stop drinking the kool-aid.

Oh, and BTW, when America began, it was a free country that just happened to practice slavery. Time will fix their problems, just as it has ours.

Kafir on April 28, 2008 at 9:07 PM

Such a statement is extremely offensive, and it has no place on a so-called conservative website. Are you really comparing early America, founded on Christian principles by Christian Protestants, to the backwards culture and people of Islam?

How dare you.

(I get all crazy verklempt whenever I think about this, and it’s graphic evidence of exactly why snipes like 2Brave2Bscared make are completely ridiculous and resolutely retarded tripe)

Wait…I’m confused. Are these “Muslims” practicing Islam in these churches, or Christianity? And you do realize that Christian persecution within Iraq is much worse now than it ever was under Saddam? Where’s the outrage over this?

Yes, and more soldiers died on D-Day than in any other battle during WWII. However, D-Day was the battle that was the beginning of the end for the Third Reich.

And you think that the “Nation Building” in Iraq is going to result in the end of Islam? Islam is enshrined in the Iraqi constitution, for heavens sake!

So, had you been alive on June 7th, 1944, what would you have been doing? My guess is whining that our soldiers are dying in huge numbers and Hitler is still in Berlin so we should bring ‘em home.

Actually my dad and 8 uncles were “there”, actually most of my uncles were on the Japanese front, so peddle your guessing elsewhere.

After all, the Germans are irreconcilable. They have always been and will always be war mongering Jew-haters that will never seat a peaceful democratic government.

But that is not true you see and we took Nazism away from them anyway. We did not let them enshrine it in their new constitution and I rather doubt that many even wanted it at that point.

Kafir on April 28, 2008 at 11:09 PM

All your points are profoundly uncoordinated.

Huh…

MB4 on April 28, 2008 at 10:34 PM

Yes, and more soldiers died on D-Day than in any other battle during WWII. However, D-Day was the battle that was the beginning of the end for the Third Reich. So, had you been alive on June 7th, 1944, what would you have been doing? My guess is whining that our soldiers are dying in huge numbers and Hitler is still in Berlin so we should bring ‘em home. After all, the Germans are irreconcilable. They have always been and will always be war mongering Jew-haters that will never seat a peaceful democratic government.

History amply shows that.

SteveMG on April 28, 2008 at 9:36 PM

Now there you go confusing all the defeatist with facts and reality and all that. Don’t you know it doesn’t matter we can just come home put up some walls bury our heads/asses in the sand and wish away all the bad people in the world. I’m sure are active engagement in the world the last 70 years had nothing to do with the realitive peace we have seen. Imagine that no civilization ending wars, no nuclear winter, no armies marching across europe in 70 years but you know what it had nothing to do with the USA engaging in geopolitical movements, nothing to do with the USA putting out brishfire wars in far off places, nothing to do with the usa fighting the cold war. It just happened, in fact I bet we postponed the peace by trying to project our strength around the world. Well if not for the evil USA the soviet union would have melted their tanks decades ago. the middle east would have galdly given its oil to the entire world at cost, Islam would have made peace with christians and jews and we could have all been sitting around the campfire swaping stories.

Yada, yada, yada. Maybe if you type in all caps from now on, you can drown out the good news coming from Iraq.

Kafir on April 28, 2008 at 9:49 PM

I just checked the most important news coming out of Iraq and it is that more American troops have been killed in Iraq this month than during any month since last September. That is bad news.

Yeah, yeah, MB4 and if it was 1943, you’d be talking about what a waste it is to keep troops in Europe.

I wasn’t even born then. Besides your claim as to what I would be talking about then is without any visible means of support, profoundly illogical and in fact hysterical.

Yada, yada, yada. Maybe if you type in all caps from now on, you can drown out the good news coming from Iraq.

Kafir on April 28, 2008 at 9:49 PM

Yada, yada, yada. Maybe if you type in all caps from now on, you can drown out the bad news coming from Iraq.

Methinks… too much Kentucky elevation …?
….or is it Tennessee windage…?

J_Gocht on April 28, 2008 at 9:52 PM

My keyboard is too indefilade.

Allowing Iraq to be taken over by groups inimical to American interests – especially in a vital part of the world – is only inviting greater costs down the line.

SteveMG on April 28, 2008 at 9:36 PM

Do you really think that al-Maliki is “imical“ friendly to our interests down the line?

Do you really think that a constitution that has Islamic law enshrined in it is “imical“ friendly to our interests down the line?

MB4 on April 28, 2008 at 9:41 PM

“DOVORK keyboard right?
It’s been around forever…!

Methinks… too much Kentucky elevation …?
….or is it Tennessee windage…?

MB4 on April 28, 2008 at 9:18 PM

Yeah, yeah, MB4 and if it was 1943, you’d be talking about what a waste it is to keep troops in Europe. Yada, yada, yada. Maybe if you type in all caps from now on, you can drown out the good news coming from Iraq.

Damn MB4 it’s “David”
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_Hackworth

J_Gocht on April 28, 2008 at 9:37 PM

I know, but the S is right next to the D on my olde keyboard!.

“- Col Davis Hackworth U.S. Army (retired)
MB4 on April 28, 2008 at 9:22 PM”

Damn MB4 it’s “David”
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_Hackworth

Olde soldiers luv’d this “soldiers, soldier”…
Sound off!
Col. David Hackworth…!

Olde soldiers “dead”!
Sound off…!
Hell of a leader…!

Which is more dangerous right now, MSM? -the Middle East or the Windy City? Waiting…

whitetop on April 28, 2008 at 9:24 PM

Your wait is over…. and it doesn’t take any MSM to answer either.

Baghdad is much more dangerous than Chicago, especially if you are a Christian. Which one would you rather live in? Which one would you rather have your son or daughter living in?

Allowing Iraq to be taken over by groups inimical to American interests – especially in a vital part of the world – is only inviting greater costs down the line.

One can’t wish the world away; as hard as some try.

History amply shows that.

The fighting in Afghanistan won’t be in the cities. It will be in small villages and outdoor areas. You also have to deal with the millions of unmarked Soviet’s land mines that have already killed countless Afghanistan’s civilians.

If those who forget the past are condemned to repeat it, then H.R. McMaster has done the Pentagon and the nation a favor. He has good advise for readers, especially high ranking military ones. Like all good history books, it unlocks the past and guides an understanding of the present.
- Ernest Blazar

Red hot. Brilliantly shows how the American people were conned.
- Col Davis Hackworth U.S. Army (retired)

MB4 on April 28, 2008 at 8:50 PM

Seconded!

Limerick on April 28, 2008 at 8:51 PM

And thirded!

It’s stunning. Go get Dereliction of Duty, a blistering and scholarly expose.
- Rush Limbaugh