Indonesia to YouTube: Pull “Fitna” or you’re banned
posted at 10:12 am on April 2, 2008 by Allahpundit
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They caved when Pakistan pulled this on them. They caved when someone objected to Nick Gisburne’s exercise in Koran quotation. They caved when one of our own anti-jihadi Vents was alleged, without explanation, to contain “inappropriate content.” They’ll cave this time too, although for the moment they’re playing it cool:
The government of the world’s most populous Islamic state says YouTube has two days to take down a Dutch lawmaker’s provocative film on the Koran or it will block access to the popular video-sharing Web site…
In response to queries, a YouTube spokesperson said the site allows people “to express themselves and to communicate with a global audience.” [See the above links. -- ed.]
“The diversity of the world in which we live — spanning the vast dimensions of ethnicity, religion, nationality, language, political opinion, gender, and sexual orientation, to name a few — means that some of the beliefs and views of some individuals may offend others,” she said.
Videos that breach YouTube guidelines are removed, and some graphic material is restricted if not suitable for all audiences, the spokesperson added.
CNS says it’s a two-day ultimatum but Reuters says the ban is already in effect. Question for our techie readers, assuming this isn’t over even their heads: How hard would it be to filter individual videos like “Fitna” if you wanted to block them inside, say, a company? It would be as simple, I’m assuming, as imposing some sort of keyword block, but is there any way to limit that block to a single site or would you necessarily have to block that keyword for the entire Internet? My point is simply to discern how much of this is rank intimidation by Indonesia to get YouTube to pull the clip globally versus how much is a simple fascist inclination to “protect” its own people from the horrors of this particular video via targeted filtering software.
Elsewhere in “Fitna” news, jihadis are using it to justify violence ex post facto and women bulled into wearing burqas are burning Dutch flags. Business as usual, in other words.
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So is Fitna down yet?
I’m sure the enormous traffic from Indonesia has them quaking in their boots…
Theworldisnotenough on April 2, 2008 at 10:16 AM
Of course YouTube could just find their nads and call Indonesia’s bluff. Then the people of Indonesia could have their say. After you’ve gotten used to something that someone/some entity takes away, you’ll find a way to get it back.
perroviejo on April 2, 2008 at 10:23 AM
If I’m YouTube, my reply would be:
“Ban me.”
Big freaking deal.
Like anyone cares what these Turd World Nations think.
When are we going to have the guts to stand up and fight for our freedom around the world against any attack, even a cyber one?
Stop political correctness.
Stop being nice with terrorists and their supporters.
Cowards.
Indy Conservative on April 2, 2008 at 10:24 AM
You mean Fitna is actually on Youtube and wasn’t pulled immediately, even before the complaints came in?
Color me shocked.
amkun on April 2, 2008 at 10:26 AM
I’m serious. I’m very surprised.
amkun on April 2, 2008 at 10:27 AM
Will YouTube actually stand up for the good guy’s freedom of speech this time? Or will it bow down to pressure (again), while terror propaganda continues to be hosted on its servers?
amerpundit on April 2, 2008 at 10:27 AM
This is as futile as trying to catch a fart in a jar.
You can place blocks at ‘edge’ routers, the ISPs that provide access to the global net, that stop all traffic to certain domains (sites). They can block by Fully Qualified Domain Name, IP address, or both.
As for denying access to particular files, that’s much more difficult. I could rename the file. I could compress it to change its digital fingerprint. I could do any number of things to make the same file appear different to a filter. Truly futile.
Ultimately, if the Indonesians can’t see Fitna on YouTube, they can watch it anywhere else they please.
Fart in a jar.
But Islamic Fascists are way too backwards to understand this.
LimeyGeek on April 2, 2008 at 10:28 AM
“President Susilo Bambang Yudhoyono, who has banned Wilders from entering the country, urged Indonesians to remain calm, but also said world leaders had a moral obligation to prevent religious or cultural defamation.”
Oh really? So does that mean that world leaders should prevent Muslims (and others) from defaming America and its culture?
I’ve been watching the stats here on and off and there have been numerous visits to “Fitna” and related threads from that neck of the world.
Rather than caving, YouTube should say, “Bring it on!” That would force an internal discussion in Indonesia.
Connie on April 2, 2008 at 10:28 AM
Mine would’ve said “Bite me”, but your point remains.
amerpundit on April 2, 2008 at 10:28 AM
It is easy to block an entire site, assuming you have control over the DNS servers. That wouldn’t stop users from using other DNS servers or manually typing in IP addresses, but most Internet users aren’t that savvy. What is also possible, and perhaps preferable in this instance, is that YouTube can determine the country of origin of a request and simply put up a page saying “The government of your country has requested that you not have access to this content.” Now, whether or not the Indonesians would be happy with that is another story.
Kafir on April 2, 2008 at 10:28 AM
If they do, there are anonymous proxies and unblockers you can use that obscure your location or can provide unfiltered access without authorities knowledge. They can make you look like you are in another country even. These are supposedly commonly used in China.
ronsfi on April 2, 2008 at 10:29 AM
And even if YouTube gets blocked, Indonesians can catch it on any of the the countless other websites hosting it.
amerpundit on April 2, 2008 at 10:30 AM
Years ago, when I was a network admin, I used to employ a program called squidguard on Linux to block sites/types of files, etc. It really isn’t very difficult if you have the right tools.
jdawg on April 2, 2008 at 10:30 AM
PS. Any tech-savvy Indonesian could easily set up a SSH tunnel past the block and watch YouTube anyway. Or use something like Tor, or an equivalent. Many, many options.
LimeyGeek on April 2, 2008 at 10:31 AM
But if the film is forbidden, why would they go looking for it???….
Ok that was a wee bit snarky.
4shoes on April 2, 2008 at 10:35 AM
I’m an IT consultant, and it is my opinion that the intent of this threat is to intimidate YouTube to pull the video.
There are many ways they could attempt to block this video without banning YouTube. And, it could be argued that trying to block the video instead of an individual site would be more effective since the Fitna video is on other websites as well.
They know YouTube can give this video the most exposure, and that YouTube has caved to threats before.
ITmonkey on April 2, 2008 at 10:35 AM
Dhimmitube = POS. They allow nazis, antisemites, jihadists, black supremacists – but try to put even the mildest anti-Islam video and you are banned without warning. Sick leftist creeps.
They won’t be able to ban Fitna though, they TRIED that when it was first uploaded, but then there were 400 uplods in one hour and their mods just can’t handle it.
Best scenario would be Pakistan-style global ban. Costed them a lot of $$$ i bet.
Aristotle on April 2, 2008 at 10:36 AM
*uploads that is
Aristotle on April 2, 2008 at 10:36 AM
Probably not. Which is why they’re trying to bully YouTube. Islamists are very nervous and they want to send a message to create the fear in the corporate world that they’d better kowtow to their demands. Or else. The question is now becoming “Or else what?”
Connie on April 2, 2008 at 10:36 AM
Hopefully Youtube will, for once, show some balls and leave Fitna up.
Who cares- let the Indonesian government ban Youtube and have to answer to its AmericanIdol-loving, Brittney worshipping citizens who will freak out on them in short order.
And I hope thousands of people put Fitna up on Youtube under lots of different names. Fytna, Phytna, Ffitna, Fittna, etc etc until it’s easily accessible thousands of ways.
Dave Rywall on April 2, 2008 at 10:37 AM
Well put!
ITmonkey on April 2, 2008 at 10:40 AM
YouTube is owned by Google, no?
Google is a bunch of really bright but hopelessly liberal guys, right?
Unless this is their “liberal getting mugged” moment, which I doubt, they’ll just pull it.
Sad, really.
Mew
acat on April 2, 2008 at 10:49 AM
Censor this, or we will censor you. You don’t want censorship, do you?
Nice argument there by Indonesia.
Ferris on April 2, 2008 at 10:53 AM
If Youtube does pull it, there will be about a thousand uploads in an hour of Fitna.
We are ready for it this time.
opusrex on April 2, 2008 at 10:53 AM
Barack Hussein Obama, Jr. spent four very formative years (ages six to ten) living in the capitol of the world’s most populous Islamic state. He attended an Islamic school there. His step-father was Muslim. His birth father was Muslim. His paternal grandparents were Muslim. Barack “describes his mother, raised by non-religious parents, as detached from religion“.
Barack’s “My Spiritual Journey“, which appeared in Time Magazine Monday, Oct. 16, 2006, mentions the name of “Jesus” exactly zero (0) times. In that same article, Obama said.
Rev. “God Damn America” Wright was the source of Obama’s “newfound understandings”. The same man who would likely be Obama’s choice to administer the Oath of Office to him, if Obama were to be elected.
And yet Barack Hussein Obama, Jr. is acting like he is a Christian, in order to fool Christian voters. Under pressure, he has claimed that he is a Christian and “prays every night to Jesus”. All he has to do to convince Bible-believing Christians that he is, in fact, a Christian, is to confess with his mouth, “Jesus is Lord”.
Three. Simple. Words.
But he can’t and won’t do it.
Why?
Because:
Red Pill on April 2, 2008 at 10:54 AM
Welcome to the world, Indonesia…..of free speech.
BacaDog on April 2, 2008 at 11:05 AM
Hah! Just in here reading this thread:
Domain Name telkom.net.id ? (Indonesia)
IP Address 222.124.219.# (PT. Telekomunikasi Indonesia)
ISP PT. Telekomunikasi Indonesia
Location
Continent : Asia
Country : Indonesia (Facts)
State/Region : Jawa Barat
City : Jakarta
Connie on April 2, 2008 at 11:06 AM
Red Pill how’s that glue you’re sniffing? Perhaps it’s preventing you from remaining on topic.
OMG Obama’s middle name is HUSSEIN? He lived in Indonesia? That is breaking news. He must be a terrist.
And no, Obama would not employ Wright to perform the swearing in ceremony. Duh.
And everyone who embraces Christianity is welcome with open arms but not Obama? Shame on you. You’re a horrible Christian.
Dave Rywall on April 2, 2008 at 11:08 AM
Even if You-tube blocked it, it can be downloaded as a torrent. There are ways around practically everything.
jdawg on April 2, 2008 at 11:12 AM
Does Indonesia have only one (state run) ISP? Telekomunikasi Indonesia?
LimeyGeek on April 2, 2008 at 11:14 AM
I don’t know. I have a file from HA’s sitemeter that I’m keeping. I’ll have to read back through to see.
Connie on April 2, 2008 at 11:18 AM
Scratch that. I should google before I post ;)
Background, for what it’s worth.
LimeyGeek on April 2, 2008 at 11:19 AM
Welcome to the YouTube “Say Anything You Like About Indonesia Week”. Feel free to insult, slander or blaspheme the third-world hell-hole to your Infidel heart’s content!!
Never piss off someone with global media coverage, ya schmucks.
mojo on April 2, 2008 at 11:27 AM
Well, Islamic law always seems to hold the high ground.
Rogue Traveler on April 2, 2008 at 11:30 AM
It would all depend on the different filtering program you are using and you would use multiple key words to block it that way like “Fitna + YouTube”.
An easier way is if you know exactly what the specific URL is to block, which each video has on YouTube and all the need to do is block that.
An example is all they would want to do is block http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=37w-aXGk8M0 and any other URL pointing to the video.
JeffinSac on April 2, 2008 at 11:45 AM
So I can go to Youtube, look at spider bites, suckerpunches, girlfights, racist comedians, puke contests, suicide bombers, dead things but if someone wants to speak the truth about a certain religion of hate, they get banned because one of the countries in which this religion resides is threatening them?
Got it.
Geronimo on April 2, 2008 at 11:53 AM
Yeah. Here’s another just in:
Domain Name tm.net.my ? (Malaysia)
IP Address 60.50.12.# (Telekom Malaysia Berhad)
ISP Telekom Malaysia Berhad
Location
Continent : Asia
Country : Malaysia (Facts)
State/Region : Kedah
City : Sungai Petani
Connie on April 2, 2008 at 12:35 PM
It’s actually amusing. Since I posted the above to you, there have been 2 more Fitna hits from Malaysia and one from Egypt. Looks like the citizens are voting for the right to see it, imo.
Connie on April 2, 2008 at 12:43 PM
It would be fascinating to see YouTube actually attempt to throw its own weight around. What better test ground than a market which cannot possibly have any significant revenue contribution?
Ban ‘em, SBY, and see what the rakyat have to say about it. It’s more likely to be distributed by pirated CD copies in Indonesia anyway.
How many churches were diresolusi and closed in Indonesia last year? And SBY has the gall to lecture on “a moral obligation to prevent religious or cultural defamation”. Unbelievable.
TexasDan on April 2, 2008 at 2:06 PM
I have lived in Indonesia. I was treated very well while I was there. However, that was back when I considered myself an agnostic and I didn’t talk about Christianity at all. If I were there today and spoke publicly in the same way as I do here on HotAir, how do you think I would be treated?
Red Pill on April 2, 2008 at 2:29 PM
How do you do that?
Red Pill on April 2, 2008 at 2:31 PM
While LimeyGeek is right, technically and philosophically, they’re not aiming to stop this physically. To them a victory would mean for YouTube to say that they stopped it. Just like LL was, but then fortunately reversed decision.
It’s no different than the games Microsoft plays with China.
It’s the war of ideas, for ‘hearts and minds’, they’re aiming to, and easier for them, to win.
Entelechy on April 2, 2008 at 2:50 PM
Let Indonesia ban them. It’s called cutting your nose off to spite your face, and only hurts Indonesia (former colony, by the way, of the Netherlands).
Tzetzes on April 2, 2008 at 2:57 PM
Easy to do, if you control the network connections and can force them to go through your proxy server. But only if you block all SSL web servers, because there are some SSL web servers that exist only to encrypt and proxy the web page in order to bypass all filters.
I think the only practical approach is to try to control DNS so the youtube URL doesn’t resolve to the actual IP address. But all it really takes to bypass that is to put the IP address for Youtube in your hosts file or change your DNS name servers to use those outside of Indonesia.
The problem with Indonesia changing their DNS servers is that those changes might propagate to other DNS servers and cause severe problems for Youtube around the world. Indonesia wouldn’t be bothered by that, but everyone else would be.
Of course, all it takes is for someone to download the video and start emailing it.
Censorship in the Internet age is nearly impossible.
tom on April 2, 2008 at 4:17 PM
Since we’re on the subject of removal of offensive items from the web. I did a quick search on google for “Why is fitna offensive?”. One of the top five links was for a Yahoo Answers search, but when I went to check it out, the question had been deleted. I wonder if someone asked them to remove it. Could it be that even questions about why fitna is offensive are offensive to some Muslims? Anyway, Yahoo must have forgotten about Google “cached” link, which is still active. There was an interesting slip (that some would certainly call Freudian) by one of the posters:
kgs_mvs on April 2, 2008 at 4:26 PM
Well spotted!
Tzetzes on April 2, 2008 at 4:49 PM
I propose we set up out own video sharing site called “MooTube: Youtube with all the bullcrap filtered out”
Capitana on April 2, 2008 at 5:38 PM
Hopefully indonesia WILL ban youtube access to it’s citizens….half of all the al qaeda and barack hussein obama videos on youtube will disappear overnight.
I can only stand seeing so many al qaeda and/or Hussein Obama videos on youtube.
SaintOlaf on April 2, 2008 at 8:53 PM
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