Gays worse than terrorists, but hey, no offense intended!
posted at 2:40 pm on March 16, 2008 by Ed Morrissey
Share on Facebook | regular view
An Oklahoma lawmaker has received an avalanche of criticism, reportedly including a few death threats, for calling homosexuality a greater threat to America than terrorism. Republican state legislator Sally Kern has apparently made the comment in more than one venue, and even now defends her statement while the condemnation rolls in from around the country. Kern has only mellowed it to insist that she meant no gay-bashing:
A YouTube audio clip of a state lawmaker’s screed against homosexuality, which she called a bigger threat than terrorism, has outraged gay activists and brought death threats rolling in.
“The homosexual agenda is destroying this nation, OK, it’s just a fact,” Rep. Sally Kern said recently to a gathering of fellow Republicans outside the Capitol.
“Studies show no society that has totally embraced homosexuality has lasted, you know, more than a few decades. So it’s the death knell in this country.
“I honestly think it’s the biggest threat that our nation has, even more so than terrorism or Islam, which I think is a big threat,” she said. …
Kern said she has no regrets for her statements and denies she was gay-bashing. Her Christian faith teachers [sic] her to be loving to individuals, but not their lifestyle, she said.
Gays are a bigger threat than Islamist terrorists? Only if one feels less than confident about their own sexuality. In the real world, gays don’t threaten anyone with their choices. Kern, however, has paranoid notions of gay infiltration of city councils in an effort to drive America to ruin. Oh, the humanity!
But don’t let anyone say that Kern engages in gay-bashing! No, no, no, she hates the sin and loves the sinners. She just doesn’t love it when they conspire to undermine city councils and conduct indoctrination of children into their networks. She doesn’t love gays who sneak gay-themed books into childrens’ libraries, which prompted legislation sponsored by Kern, and which failed to pass in the Oklahoma legislature. But don’t say she bashes gays, for Pete’s sake!
Unfortunately, many take this far too seriously. Republicans at some point have to distance themselves from those whose paranoid impulses lead them to these extremes. In practical terms, they are no better than those who blame Halliburton for conspiring to push the nation to war, or those who believe that the CIA secretly masterminded the 9/11 attacks in order to bolster their budgets.
Worst of all, it takes our eyes off of those who really do want to destroy America — like Osama bin Laden, the Iranian Guardian Council, and other real enemies of our nation.
You must be logged in to post a comment.
Blowback
Note from Hot Air management: This section is for comments from Hot Air's community of registered readers. Please don't assume that Hot Air management agrees with or otherwise endorses any particular comment just because we let it stand. A reminder: Anyone who fails to comply with our terms of use may lose their posting privilege.
Trackbacks/Pings
Trackback URL
Comments
Comment pages: « Previous 1 2 3 4 5 ... 8 Next »
Obviously Math Mage you are a believer in polygamy
Polygamy is condemned by God
More importantly mormonism which preaches polygamy is condemned by God as idolatry.
God warns that in the last days many false prophets and false christs will appear. (joseph smith and the false jesus of the mormons)
Jesus is not the brother of lucifer nor the son of a god who was a man on another planet who had god’s above him and a goddess wife.
SaintOlaf on March 16, 2008 at 5:59 PM
Actually, the ACLU is as dangerous as terrorists because they enable them through they’re stupid lawsuits against our country protecting itself.
Rose on March 16, 2008 at 6:00 PM
Sally Kern is correct! The GLBT has, for the most part, taken over everything at the DNC. That’s why Moderate Democrats like myself have been banned from there, and told there is no room any longer for people like me in THEIR party!!!
DfDeportation on March 16, 2008 at 6:00 PM
Would you have preferred that I used the word “evidence” instead of the word “proof”? I believe that video was posted on this site several months ago, but perhaps you or others on here didn’t see it. It’s personal testimony, which is a form of evidence. In any event, my argument is that being homosexual IS a choice and that God wouldn’t classify it as sin if it, in fact, wasn’t a choice like any other sin.
Livefreeordie on March 16, 2008 at 6:01 PM
She deserves the ridicule she’s receiving for her over the top comments.
Bad week for Oklahoma.
Heh.
James OK on March 16, 2008 at 6:02 PM
Is religion a choice? I’ve heard opinions both ways. The U.S. has functioned well by letting people choose their religion.
dedalus on March 16, 2008 at 6:07 PM
My point is that if a nations law institutionalizes sin(gay marriage) then that nation’s law is corrupt and that nation will surely fall soon.
I don’t know how this could be such a difficult concept for some of the RINO’s here to understand.
The problem is, RINO/moderates have adopted some of the propaganda of the liberals without thinking about it.
SaintOlaf on March 16, 2008 at 6:08 PM
SB777
That’s the agenda.
Theworldisnotenough on March 16, 2008 at 6:09 PM
The problem with her statement was saying homosexuals were worse than terrorists. If they want to get married I don’t give a rip. Nobody can deny they push their agenda though. I know several gays and I don’t consider them friends because they are so liberal it is unbearable to listen to them. I haven’t met one of those “log cabin” Republicans yet, but I do enjoy Tammy Bruce’s site.
kongzilla on March 16, 2008 at 6:12 PM
Here’s my whole thing with homosexuality being a choice. I’m attracted to women. Some where along the way, around 12 or so, I started seeing girls differently. You get that certain funny feeling when you look at certain ones.
The next thing you know the Kathy Ireland SI swimsuit issue arrives in the mail and your life is never the same.
But, my point is, I never chose to be attracted to girls. It just happened. To this day, when I look at men, even very attractive ones, I do not get the same feeling as I get when I look at attractive women. Some people describe it as getting “butterflies” in your stomach, or one’s heart skipping a beat. But there’s definitely a PHYSICAL reaction. It’s beyond mental control.
So when I hear of people saying being gay is a choice, I can only assume that THEY are attracted to men, but CHOOSE not to act on it.
And for all the hell that gay kids get in high school, why would they choose that?
Tom_Shipley on March 16, 2008 at 6:13 PM
Over the millennia, history has not been kind to homosexuals, but they keep trying hoping to come up with a different result.
It is said by psychiatrist that people who do that are in the throes of insanity.
I can agree with the statement that “homosexuality is a greater threat to America than terrorism.”
Today, terrorists are not invading the social fabric of our society such as our legal system, political system, and school system, just to name a few.
As in every past society that was plagued by homosexuality, a day of reckoning will come and it will not be a pretty sight. Just ask IRAN.
pocomoco on March 16, 2008 at 6:14 PM
Bingo. Exactly what I’ve been saying all along.
JetBoy on March 16, 2008 at 6:21 PM
Well, it just so happens that I’m not Christian, our government isn’t Christian, and neither gives a s*** what was said in the book of Malachi. Or rather, the government cares to the extent that the Christian population forms a good portion of the electorate. In truth, I’m an atheist (little a, not big A crazy type), and I have my own eccentric view on the situation. But if you’re going to decide your public policy based on what God said in the Good Book, go right ahead. Just don’t expect me to be marching in that line with you.
But since you’re getting into the Bible quotes, where in that quote you used is there a condemnation of homosexuality? And why is God’s condemnation of Mormonism for idolatry a condemnation of polygamy? That does not compute. Provide better evidence, please.
It’s evidence of nothing except that hormones can change over time. By the way, how old was this person when he lost his homosexuality?
And once again, you’re using the “Well, God know best, and he wrote this, so it’s right!” argument. The Bible wasn’t written by God, it was written by a bunch of people who believed themselves to be divinely inspired. Even if they were, that doesn’t make every little statement in their Book correct. Pleas tell me you have a better argument somewhere up your sleeve, knocking down religiously inspired strawmen is getting rather boring.
Math_Mage on March 16, 2008 at 6:22 PM
Theworldisnotenough on March 16, 2008 at 6:09 PM
First off, the bill DOES NOT ban the use of the terms mom and dad or husband and wife. Read it for yourself and show me where it does:
http://info.sen.ca.gov/pub/07-08/bill/sen/sb_0751-0800/sb_777_bill_20070223_introduced.html
And an agenda is more than one thing. You guys keep throwing the term around but can’t define it. It’s almost as if you don’t know what you’re afraid of.
Second, an agenda
Tom_Shipley on March 16, 2008 at 6:24 PM
FTFY ;-)
SouthernGent on March 16, 2008 at 6:24 PM
I’d very grateful if one of the Christians on this thread would tell me a couple things about their beliefs vis a vis homosexuality. I’m genuinely interested:
1. What component of homosexuality do you consider wrong/a sin? Desire for others of the same sex, sexual relations with others of the same sex, or both?
2. If you consider sexual relations with others of the same sex wrong, is there a particular part of this (i.e. the spilling of semen) that you consider wrong?
3. Do you consider lesbianism as wrong/a sin? As far as I understand there are no references to it in the bible? If you do consider it wrong/a sin, what component is wrong?
Thanks to anyone who obliges – I’m quite ignorant, and want to understand better.
passingtramp on March 16, 2008 at 6:24 PM
Reminds me of…. one of the best movies … evvaaahh!
Seven Percent Solution on March 16, 2008 at 6:25 PM
Until about 100 years ago history wasn’t kind to women voting or owning property. Were they insane to keep hoping to come up with a different result?
dedalus on March 16, 2008 at 6:30 PM
OK, I’ll bite… but this really belongs on Ace’s page:
…. like the Proctologist said, “… that’s not what is made for.”
…. you said it, not me brother, (the spilling of semen…….eeewwwwwwww), but that pretty much hit the mark.
… Wrong? I’m going back for some more popcorn!
Seven Percent Solution on March 16, 2008 at 6:34 PM
From http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Timeline_of_LGBT_history
Tommygun on March 16, 2008 at 6:34 PM
In Islam, apostasy is a sin punishable by death. Are you arguing that predominantly Islamic countries that don’t institutionalize the death penalty for apostasy or death to infidels are necessarily corrupt and ready to fall?
What about Samuel’s warning about government imposing a tithe of one-tenth of all a person owns? Given that the present government takes a good deal more from many people, is this an institutionalization of sin?
Why is a person who doesn’t believe in a literal interpretation of the Bible necessarily a RINO? Your dogmatic position on social conservative values doesn’t automatically make you a conservative; similarly, my somewhat liberal position on social issues doesn’t make me a RINO. Political philosophy is slightly more complicated than that.
I echo Tom_Shipley. The bill says nothing of the sort, no matter what that alarmist article says. If you didn’t read the bill, don’t bother trying to comment on it.
As I attend a Jesuit school, I can at least answer this a little bit.
1. Being homosexual is not a sin. The sin is homosexual behavior.
2. The sin is not that a man is lying with a man or a woman with a woman, but rather that it’s sex without the holy purpose of procreating and therefore bad.
3. Yes, lesbianism is just as bad.
So says my Christian Ethics teacher. I could probably browse online and find his source material.
Agreed again. You know, you and I don’t agree on much, but I respect you. I *think* I stayed out of all the Shipley-bashing going on at CQ, and I’m glad I did (though that doesn’t mean I agree with what you said at CQ). :)
Math_Mage on March 16, 2008 at 6:38 PM
And this is relevant…how, exactly? Is this a “well, the Founders made a law that said this was bad, so it must be bad!” argument? Appealing to authority is not a valid premise for debate, no matter how much you want it to be.
Math_Mage on March 16, 2008 at 6:40 PM
Math_Mage on March 16, 2008 at 6:38 PM
Thanks! Had 8 years of Jesuit education myself. I like to think they produce pretty level-headed people.
Tom_Shipley on March 16, 2008 at 6:43 PM
You know people, speaking for myself, I find that most people would just like to go about living our lives, raising our children, having what ever sex we want in the last remaining freedoms that we have………
It’s when the Gay/Lesbian/Transexual/Crossdressing/Bi-Sexual Lobby start to try to throw their agenda down our throats, so to speak, ahem, it’s when we start getting really pissed off!
But that’s just me, nothing wrong with that, right?
Seven Percent Solution on March 16, 2008 at 6:45 PM
passingtramp on March 16, 2008 at 6:45 PM
Well, not quite, as they don’t seem to be able to teach history or science, but on the whole, yes. As an atheist, it’s…interesting…to belong to a religious school, but we get along well.
Math_Mage on March 16, 2008 at 6:45 PM
passingtramp,
1. Jesus magnified the Law very clearly to explain adultery as looking with lustand/or committing it in one’s mind…
2. This also explains this question
3. Yes lesbianism is a sin.
SaintOlaf on March 16, 2008 at 6:46 PM
Not used to the damned quotes system yet.
passingtramp on March 16, 2008 at 6:46 PM
There. Fixed it.
AZ_Redneck on March 16, 2008 at 6:47 PM
Math_Mage on March 16, 2008 at 6:40 PM
Simply reporting history.
Tommygun on March 16, 2008 at 6:47 PM
Math_Mage on March 16, 2008 at 6:45 PM
I had great history teachers at my schools. Science? Didn’t take many of those courses and wouldn’t be the best judge.
One thing I really like about the Jesuits is their emphasis on teaching other religious views.
Tom_Shipley on March 16, 2008 at 6:51 PM
My statement was that if we institute sin (Which gay marriage is) into our law…then our law is corrupt.
The law of islam is corrupt already.
SaintOlaf on March 16, 2008 at 6:51 PM
My point is that I don’t particularly want to live in a theocracy. If you believe that God says the committing of homosexual acts is a sin, then by all means, don’t commit them. Personally, I’m all for quoting the Bible when it comes to explaining your own morality. It’s when you quote it as a reason for passing a law that affects millions of people who don’t agree with you that there’s a problem. (And that’s just one of the reasons why I thank God every day for the 2nd Amendment!)
Also, don’t assume that everyone who enjoys “Hot Air” is an R, let alone a RINO. And for that matter I also wouldn’t assume that all Republicans are social conservatives.
Oh, also, Mormonism hasn’t preached polygamy in quite some time. Get your non-Biblical facts straight.
Levy on March 16, 2008 at 7:00 PM
You are in the majority on that thankfully.
Religion and wingnut banter like her’s does not belong in politics are in mainstream life in general.
Maybe we should stop mainstreaming the nutjobs, giving them a bully pulpit never helps.
AprilOrit on March 16, 2008 at 7:04 PM
Who defines what sin is? The Bible? The Pope? The Quran? Whatever the Book of Zoroastrianism is called? The Three Stooges?
MY point was that Islamic countries are merely avoiding the institutionalization of sin according to the Quran, and this has led to numerous religious theocracies throughout the Middle-East. So how is “not institutionalizing sin” a criteria for good governance?
As I said, I’m an atheist, so I don’t “believe in” any of those things. Sin is just a social wrong to me.
Also, re: your comment at 6:46, if that’s true, your position is indefensible if it turns out that homosexuality has a genetic component.
Ok, in other words, you’re not contributing. I’ll ignore you, then.
Tom, I like that about my school as well. But since I’m primarily an applied-math kinda guy, I have more reason to focus on science than most, and it frustrates me that Chemistry and Physics are both taught by bad teachers, that it’s well-known throughout the school that this is true, and that nothing is done about it. Similar complaint about AP Calc BC, but that’s just one teacher in math, so an isolated problem.
Math_Mage on March 16, 2008 at 7:06 PM
That’s the problem with this country: an over represented minority forcing their agenda on the majority.
I’m sure we can all agree that the leftist, bolshevik, media does exactly this daily.
I remember when the the Hildebeast was asked whether this children’s book (about two gay men raising a child) was acceptable to read to 3-4 year old kids..and she said “it is a great book to read to young children”.
And remember when Hussein Obama was going around saying he wanted to teach sex ed to kindergarteners….
Public Schools are now totally unacceptable and guess what happens when you try to homeschool your children…
here in california they are trying to outlaw homeschooling and are trying to have parents charged criminally for the “truancy” of the child.
SaintOlaf on March 16, 2008 at 7:11 PM
So basically the only people that are allowed to have sex are fertile, herterosexuals, in their child bearing years and only with one and other?
SuperCool on March 16, 2008 at 7:11 PM
God does and He has “written His Law in our hearts”.
All men know what sin is..it is written in our hearts through our conscience.
SaintOlaf on March 16, 2008 at 7:15 PM
Oh, oops, sorry. I forgot to add that sex within marriage is also considered a holy expression of love.
Sex without marriage, of course, can never be an expression of love because the church didn’t say it was ok. [/snark]
Math_Mage on March 16, 2008 at 7:15 PM
Math Mage is wrong about that… sex is for both enjoyment and or procreation between a husband and his wife.
SaintOlaf on March 16, 2008 at 7:16 PM
I’m proud of you for sticking up for yourself (errr, us) in this thread.
its vintage duh on March 16, 2008 at 7:17 PM
You keep assuming that I believe this stuff. I don’t believe there is a God who wrote His sacred Law in our hearts so that we would know He’s there, the way C.S. Lewis puts it in Mere Christianity. Given that, I don’t think the teachings of any particular religion should be a dominant force in public policy. Got a problem with that?
Math_Mage on March 16, 2008 at 7:17 PM
I have to agree with this. Men and boys (especially those just going through puberty) cannot decide what arouses them. At that age, they don’t even know what those feelings mean; they just happen…
at the most inopportune times.
loganthompson on March 16, 2008 at 7:22 PM
It doesn’t matter if you believe that now or not…the point is you know when you sin and you know that it is wrong.
Yes I do think the teachings of God should be a dominant force in politics if only to prevent us from instituting sin as our law.
I do not believe that there will be a perfect government until Christ returns after the Great Tribulation.
SaintOlaf on March 16, 2008 at 7:23 PM
Abortion kills more Americans in one year than terrorism, Islamic or otherwise, has in its entire history.
But I guess saying that makes me an abortion clinic bomber.
spmat on March 16, 2008 at 7:27 PM
The constitution allows for freedom of religion and the free exercise thereof. It is the Christian’s right to choose to live according to the New Testament and if that offends than people will just have to live with that. You cannot deny Christians the right to believe in the New Testament just because you don’t. Christians should not be forced to accept behavior they find objectionable. And we can vote accordingly.
Rose on March 16, 2008 at 7:29 PM
Thanks. It’s bad enough when I hear of “gay agendas” and “gay is a choice” BS…but when the fundamentalists start the self-righteous bible thumping, I swear I just want to give up.
People are just either uninformed/misinformed or they simply just don’t know the truth about being gay. There’s an old saying that “you don’t know a man until you walk a mile in his shoes”…If they could, they’d know.
JetBoy on March 16, 2008 at 7:30 PM
There’s an old saying that “you don’t know a man until you walk a mile in his shoes”…If they could, they’d know.
JetBoy on March 16, 2008 at 7:30 PM
Every human being in history has walked in your shoes, jetboy. We all face the dilemma and the decision about whether or not to sin…all men have sinned against God in some way or another.
You’re just justifying your sin by saying it’s not a choice.
God says very clearly “homosexuals will not inherit the kingdom of God”.
SaintOlaf on March 16, 2008 at 7:36 PM
Ah, so now we come to the “Natural Law” aspect of religious belief. Not yet knowing what my sexual preference is, I can’t speak for the gay community, but I imagine that many of its members would disagree vociferously with the idea that they think they’re sinning while having sex with men. Just because the idea offends you doesn’t mean it’s a sin. Of course, your counterargument will be that they’ve disconnected with their consciences and can no longer feel the Natural Law, to which I ask what the gay crime rate is in comparison with the heterosexual crime rate, because obviously if they can’t feel the Natural Law they have no compunction about committing other sins.
It is the Christian’s right to choose to live according to the New Testament. Is it the Christian’s right to force other people to live according to the New Testament? Christians would be perfectly free to only recognize heterosexual marriage in their private lives even if other private institutions started marrying gay couples with permission from the government. Unless the gays in your community want the CHURCH to marry them, I don’t see what your complaint is.
Math_Mage on March 16, 2008 at 7:42 PM
?
passingtramp on March 16, 2008 at 7:46 PM
Homosexuality isn’t the problem. It’s an overt emphasis on bodily pleasure that’s the problem. Sure, Rome’s gay orgies preceded the ultimate fall at the hands of barbarians, but it wasn’t because men were poking men. It was because the Roman society had lost focus on global issues and instead focused on material issues. (It didn’t help that the currency was completely devalued and the Roman legions were not getting adequate pay.) Other societies that focused on material pleasures lost the work ethic that got them to their luxury-ridden state.
Nethicus on March 16, 2008 at 7:46 PM
My complaint is that Christians are being forced to accept behavior that they do not agree with and if they don’t they are accused of being bigots. We are forced to send our children to schools where this agenda is being taught to them even if we object and again are called bigots. If we don’t like it we are forced to pay for private schools. Schools should not be used for indoctrination and social engineering. Do what you want in the privacy of your own lives but leave our children out of it. I have never said anything about marriage. It really isn’t an issue for me. In that case you are talking about adults. I think gay marriage is meaningless but whatever.
Rose on March 16, 2008 at 7:48 PM
You simply cannot justify the position that you KNOW that being homosexual is a choice. Committing homosexual ACTS is a choice. Simply batting for the other team isn’t necessarily such.
Meaning I’m too busy with homework and whatnot to be worried about who I want to be with when I grow up. In short, I’m a nerd. And proud of it. Plus I’m not given to introspection, so haven’t tried to analyze my sexual leanings.
Math_Mage on March 16, 2008 at 7:48 PM
Ah. I can sympathize with that position. At the same time, I’m not sure exactly what indoctrination and social engineering is being done, exactly. Could you elaborate, please?
Math_Mage on March 16, 2008 at 7:51 PM
Fair enough! You write much more eloquently than I would expect of someone still doing homework.
passingtramp on March 16, 2008 at 7:53 PM
Math Mage,
Yes lust clouds one’s judgement when it comes to listening to God’s Law. this is an obvious and easily proven fact.
Though that won’t necessarily make them commit murder(although many serial killers are gay white men)…but it certainly does make them commit two other sins…lying and idolatry.
Homosexuals, in this society, are notorious and tested liars, due to the fact that they are consistently denying and lying about the fact that they have sex with members of the same sex.
They are also idolaters. When you commit the sin of idolatry what you are doing is making a false god in your mind that does not believe that homosexuality is a sin…even though God clearly says that it is.
So it is multiple sins adultery,lying and idolatry.
SaintOlaf on March 16, 2008 at 7:58 PM
Well, I try to be a good Catholic…good to my family, friends…and for the last time I DID NOT CHOOSE TO BE GAY, nor do I excuse sin. I’m sure you’ll agree that God created all mankind in His image. And all through time, there’s been homosexuals…and lots of ‘em.
But when all is said and done, I’ll let God judge me when my time comes to go. And God alone. “Judge not…lest ye be judged”.
JetBoy on March 16, 2008 at 7:58 PM
What is happening in California is a good example, since I live here. I don’t think that children need to be exposed to same sex relationships at any point in their education. Only academics should be taught. The whole idea of tolerance is something that has been manufactured by activists. Talk to people who attended elementary school 20 or 30 years ago and ask them if this was an issue. Even at the high school level it is a problem that has been created in the last decade or so. When I attended a secular high school in LA county in the 70’s not one person committed suicide in a school of 1200. So much for the high suicide rate of gay teens. Also, we did not have groups of gay teens fearing for their lives. Sexual identity wasn’t discussed because it wasn’t an issue. If any kids suffered it was in silence and if this was such a bad thing than why are things so much harder for them now when the issue is over discussed? Activists have created the problem.
Rose on March 16, 2008 at 8:01 PM
Excuse me, but did the security cameras somehow fail to catch the buttless chaps Mohammed Atta was wearing on 9-11? Are drag queens somehow hiding bombs under their beehive wigs, and we’ve failed to see this? Should we withdraw from Iraq now and send the soldiers to invade South Beach and Castro (the SF district, not the jerk in Cuba)? Geez, what a moron.
Sekhmet on March 16, 2008 at 8:03 PM
What are you doing online if ur under 13? Do your parents know what ur doing? get the hell outta here.
Hey AP. You take minors here??
JiangxiDad on March 16, 2008 at 8:03 PM
Your homo attraction came on just as strong and just as much out of the blue as someone’s hetero attractions. But, that doesn’t mean you were born that way. What happened to you, how you were raised, by whom, how you internalized masculinity, and many other factors discussed by Freud and particularly Jung, could be the reason why you continue with same-sex attraction long after the brief passing phase it occupies for many other young kids. For your own benefit, you may wish to consider other alternatives than having just been born that way.
JiangxiDad on March 16, 2008 at 8:08 PM
For the record, according to the Center for Disease Control/Massachusetts Department of Education Youth Risk Behavior Survey (1999), 33% of gay youth will attempt suicide. Gay teen suicide attempts are four times that of heterosexual teens.
JetBoy on March 16, 2008 at 8:08 PM
St. Olaf,
You believe being gay is a sin. Sin is giving into temptation. Do something we may want to do, but should not. We may want to murder the guy who slept with our wife, but we know it’s wrong, so attempt not to.
Are you saying that gay men are attracted to other men, but should ignore that temptation? And if so, why did God choose to tempt these men with this urge and allow others not to be tempted?
Are you saying that MANY men are attracted to men and that gay men are the ones who give into the temptation?
Or are you saying that gay men are not really attracted to men but sleep with each other because of rebellion or some other non-sexual reason?
Tom_Shipley on March 16, 2008 at 8:09 PM
And for what decade are your statistics? Exactly at what point did suicide among gay teens become a problem? Before or after the activists began pushing their agenda? I say the problem follows the activists, not the other way around.
Rose on March 16, 2008 at 8:11 PM
His points are cogent and on-topic.
Not all comments can be as informative as:
dedalus on March 16, 2008 at 8:11 PM
LOL. STFU 2 U 2
JiangxiDad on March 16, 2008 at 8:15 PM
As I posted, the survey was done in 1999…If you’d like something more recent than that, I’ll oblige…but the numbers are the same.
And you know, you’re right about one thing, in a way…the suicide problem DOES follow the activists. Only those activists are the fundamentalist, or misinformed but loud anti-gay people who tell kids that being gay is wrong, and a choice, and that they’ll never get into heaven.
JetBoy on March 16, 2008 at 8:16 PM
Hey all, not to change the subject but the John Adams movie started at 8PM on HBO in case anyone is interested.
AprilOrit on March 16, 2008 at 8:16 PM
[Ca. governor vetoes gay marriage law passed by legislature.]
Ouch, you got me. Oh, wait, no you didn’t. That’s all part of the legislative process. If California’s legislature passes gay marriage laws, the governor can veto them or not. If he does veto them, and the legislature overrides the veto, I’m fine with California having gay marriage laws. If he doesn’t veto them, I’m fine with California having gay marriage laws.
What I’m not fine with is claiming it’s a constitutional right and finding said right in a 200+ year old document. That’s not part of the legislative process.
Oh, and I think I did a pretty good job of defining the gay agenda: advocating rights, or laws, for gays AS GAYS.
Being homosexual is not a constitutional right. Homosexual marriage is not a constitutional right. Sodomy, homosexual or not, is not a constitutional right, no matter which penumbra of which emanation the Supreme Court points to.
Same with the right to privacy. It’s not there. Doesn’t mean I don’t like privacy. It just means it’s not in the Constitution. Same with the “right” to abortion; it’s not there. You want to make any of those things a right? Pass an amendment.
You want that right to be taken away any time a majority of the Supreme Court disagrees with it? Claim it’s in a penumbra of an emanation of the Bill of Rights, hidden so well that only when you Don The Robe Of A Supreme Court Justice can you see it.
So, again I say: allow gay marriage, outlaw gay marriage, whatever. Just do it the right way.
misterpeasea on March 16, 2008 at 8:21 PM
I think that’s going to turn out to be a low estimate…
Hog Wild on March 16, 2008 at 8:22 PM
“Kern said she has no regrets for her statements and denies she was gay-bashing. Her Christian faith teachers [sic] her to be loving to individuals, but not their lifestyle, she said”
Unfortunately, this is taught in many churches including the Southern Baptist ones my extended family attends in Arkansas. They contend that they must love the individual but confront and eradicate the lifestyle. Kern’s views are widely shared in my hometown of Hot Springs and other areas of the south I have lived. I personally find them repugnant but would caution blue state Conservatives like Captain Ed that trying to purge the party of people with this view of homosexuality would cause the South to turn purple, if not blue as they make up a huge conservative block of the Republican party. Candidly, these are many of the same people that are having trouble with a “conservative” like John McCain.
The Opinionator on March 16, 2008 at 8:27 PM
Tom,
Bingo. It is the latter. It is simply a perversion..the devil works in many ways and clouding your judgment and knowledge of God’s internal Law with lust is one of them.
Let’s not get ahead of ourselves here, remember the sin you are breaking is adultery…and idolotry by creating a false god that believes homosexuality and adultery are ok.
For example even a hetero man with a longtime girlfriend of 5 years…every time he has sex with her or lusts after her in his mind..he is sinning against God.
All men have sinned against God.
All sinners will burn for eternity in the lake of fire.
Jesus said “I am the Way, the Truth and the Life”! “No man comes to the Father except through me”.
By repenting(turning from sin) and asking Jesus Christ to come into your life and to live in you…he will accept the punishment for your sins and will provide your unattainable righteousness before the Father, on the day of judgment.
This is the Gospel.
SaintOlaf on March 16, 2008 at 8:27 PM
I said that gay teen suicide was not an issue until gay activists made it one. It wasn’t until schools started promoting the gay agenda that teens began to see themselves as victims. Find a statistic showing a high suicide rate among gay teens before they started their indoctrination programs in the public schools.
Rose on March 16, 2008 at 8:29 PM
Maybe this will help:
http://www.article8.org/docs/gay_strategies/after_the_ball.htm
macblanegirl on March 16, 2008 at 8:29 PM
I’m not American, so I’m interested to know what exactly constitutes these programs you speak of?
passingtramp on March 16, 2008 at 8:30 PM
Yeah, because 13-year-olds are totally incapable of the eloquence and hard-hitting rhetorical style you employ. But if you really need to know, you’re under by 3, and my parents do know that I comment on blogs in addition to having one of my own. More to the point, there’s nothing wrong with 12-year-olds being on the Internet. I dare say some of them probably know how to use the Internet better than you or I, since they’ve never really lived in an age without Myspace or Google or similar tools for communication.
Let’s see, lying and idolatry. I’ll indulge in a little hyperbole here – if a slaver met a member of the Underground Railroad in the 1800s and asked if he had any slaves hidden in the house, would it be a sin to lie if there were? Now, I’m not saying that people who bully homosexuals are morally equivalent to slavers, just pointing out that lying isn’t absolutely immoral.
As for idolatry, what if the person isn’t religious? Then he isn’t constructing any God in his mind at all.
In other words, homosexuality is a mental disorder caused by improper nurturing of one’s sexual self as a child?
Rosie, your point is interesting, but what reason is there for discussion of the topic of homosexuality to make homosexuality-related issues worse? I would understand it if you said that activists made a mountain out of a molehill, but you’re saying the activists somehow turned a molehill into a mountain with all their hot air.
Math_Mage on March 16, 2008 at 8:32 PM
passingtramp, sorry but I doubt your sincerity. I apologize if I am wrong.
Rose on March 16, 2008 at 8:33 PM
! I’m quite sincere.
passingtramp on March 16, 2008 at 8:35 PM
Ha ha, thank you. I do read, consider and enjoy your comments.
dedalus on March 16, 2008 at 8:39 PM
Meth, that is exactly what I am saying. The activists went into the public schools demanding that students be taught that they have the right to explore their sexual identities. Kids who were unsure were told to experiment to see. Instead of leaving the issue alone they fanned the fires. Kids who never would have even entertained the idea were suddenly questioning if maybe they were different. The schools were told that they had to allow these kids to express themselves. The issue did not belong in the schools. They created the mess.
Rose on March 16, 2008 at 8:39 PM
For every 1 self-righteous religious person I’ve seen yelling at me from the top of their lungs that homosexuality is immoral, I’ve seen 100 liberals and gay activists yelling at me telling me if I don’t embrace and applaud homosexuality I’ll be arrested for a hate-crime.
p0s3r on March 16, 2008 at 8:39 PM
I’ll assume you are 18+,in spite of your silly comment about not having yet examined your sexual preferences. That’s like Obama not having noticed his pastor’s racism.
In regard to the quote, almost correct. There is no sexual self, so to speak, in a child. It’s more about the development of the masculine and feminine identity (not gender)of the individual. If that’s not essentially established by puberty, the “missing” identity gets sexualized. In the more typical course of events, the opposite nature (either anima or animus)becomes the object of sexual desire.
At least this is how I understand Jung’s take on it.
Did you know guys marry their anima (internal idealized female natures). That’s why they divorce at 50. LOL.
JiangxiDad on March 16, 2008 at 8:43 PM
@ JiangxiDad on March 16, 2008 at 8:08 PM
So you are saying that homosexuality is a product of the environment? So I guess Ted Haggard liked to do meth with a male prostitute because he was surrounded by religion. The constant preaching against homosexuality caused his homo behavior. You ever notice how those who preach most FERVENTLY against something like homosexuality usually end up getting caught taking part in said behavior?
muyoso on March 16, 2008 at 8:45 PM
@ p0s3r on March 16, 2008 at 8:39 PM
You are ridiculous.
muyoso on March 16, 2008 at 8:46 PM
I’m pretty sure that’s taught in most Christian churches. Are you saying they are radicals because they think homosexuality is a sin? If you think that’s wild, Pastor Wright’s comments must have really blown your socks off!
kongzilla on March 16, 2008 at 8:47 PM
I made no connection btwn homosexual attraction and religion. Nor did I condemn anyone. As usual,you are a silly cow. Go back to ur Nazi-lovin Paul nuts.
JiangxiDad on March 16, 2008 at 8:50 PM
I have seen portions of the bible posted here being used to claim homosexuality is not approved, yet all of them seem to be taking a BIG stretch to make that connection.
http://www.religioustolerance.org/hom_bmar.htm
Try that on for size.
muyoso on March 16, 2008 at 8:50 PM
Uhm. Exaggerate much?
But then, maybe you have a point. Liberals are always preaching FERVENTLY against fascism, and yet they are most assuredly taking part in said behavior.
Interesting.
misterpeasea on March 16, 2008 at 8:50 PM
@ JiangxiDad on March 16, 2008 at 8:50 PM
No, you said SPECIFICALLY that someone cannot just be a homosexual from birth, but rather is formed by their parents into one. You said that. Then I extrapolated that to the Ted Haggard situation. I love how anytime I take the the logic behind one of your comments, and apply it to something else to show you the ridiculousness of your comment, you ALWAYS fall back to stupid name calling.
muyoso on March 16, 2008 at 8:52 PM
Wow. One obscure state legislator makes some goofy comments. Big deal.
I’m a devout, Bible-believing, Evangelical Christian. Yes, the homosexuality is certainly as bad for our culture as adultery, fornication, abortion, etc. But it doesn’t have the capacity to kill thousands–or millions–in one day, as Islamofascist terrorism does.
jgapinoy on March 16, 2008 at 8:52 PM
@ misterpeasea on March 16, 2008 at 8:50 PM
Explain why divorce rates are MUCH higher among christians than atheists. Actually, the MORE fervently anti-divorce the christian denomination is, the higher percentages of divorce there are.
muyoso on March 16, 2008 at 8:53 PM
No, Ed, it’s not because she’s not confident in her own sexuality. That’s silly. You know she means that sin brings God’s judgement.
jgapinoy on March 16, 2008 at 8:54 PM
Then you’ll have to walk me thru your argument you silly cow.
What does Ted Haggard have to do with whether or not homosexual attraction is determined before birth?
JiangxiDad on March 16, 2008 at 8:55 PM
muyoso
That’s pathetically silly. Everyone knows that most Americans call themselves Christians, but most Americans don’t follow Christ.
In a real statistic, couples who live together before marriage are much more likely to divorce than those who don’t. That separates the sheep from the goats.
jgapinoy on March 16, 2008 at 8:57 PM
I’m not sure but I would assume in religious communities that marriage is sacred tradition and not with the irreligious so they don’t get married in high rates. So of course divorce is going to be higher with people who get married.
terryannonline on March 16, 2008 at 8:58 PM
@ Kongzilla,
I am not saying that they are radicals. My intent in posting was to offer the good Captain Ed and those that live in other parts of the country a perspective they may not seeon regular basis. All of my family and friends in AR, OK and TX would agree with the love the sinner, hate the sin perspective Kern speaks of and many of them, though certainly not all, agree that homosexuality is undercutting us from within. Me, I am the libertarian leaning one in the family. As long as you leave me alone, I could care less who you sleep with. Although, I do have a bit of discomfort about gay adoption.
As to Pastor Wright, his comments offended me deeply. I grew up in a career military family and we are very patriotic. Wright is an ungratefull asshat.
The Opinionator on March 16, 2008 at 9:00 PM
Homosexuality is a deviancy caused by
–a bad relationship with a parent
–being molested
–pornography, or
–being enticed by a wicked culture to explore sexual curiosity
jgapinoy on March 16, 2008 at 9:00 PM
If you’ll tell me how that’s relevant to gays, gay rights, the gay agenda, the threat of the gay agenda as compared to terrorism, the legitimate legislative process, or anything else being discussed here.
misterpeasea on March 16, 2008 at 9:02 PM
Comment pages: « Previous 1 2 3 4 5 ... 8 Next »