Is that better? :)

boomer on March 11, 2008 at 5:04 PM

Phew! Yes!!!! ;)

Interesting that the pope knows what offend god. I wonder if he asked God if he was offended when the Pope’s church covered up and continues to cover for pedophiles?

muyoso on March 11, 2008 at 8:58 PM

Actually, you’re framing the Pope on this and these weren’t his comments. Did you even read the articles on this topic or are you so excited to excoriate the Pope, and bring up the pedophile priest tragedy, that you didn’t have time to check your facts?

You people are acting like the mainstream media. Get yourselves together!

Interesting that the pope knows what offend god. I wonder if he asked God if he was offended when the Pope’s church covered up and continues to cover for pedophiles?

It’s a nonspeaking point, huh?

sheesh on March 11, 2008 at 3:26 PM

Ya, that too.

makes it a mute moot point because

Is that better? :)

If a factory emits large amounts of poisons into the air that cause undesirable health effects to people and other life downwind, or into the water which makes the water unusable downstream, those who own the factory offend not only God but their neighbors. For real pollutants, there are effective ways of running factories while minimizing the emissions to the environment to levels that can be purified naturally.

But the global-warming crowd needs to be careful not to read too much into the Pope’s remarks. It is not clear that emitting carbon dioxide, a harmless gas breathed out by every human being and animal, and required by plants to feed the world, into the air “ruins the environment”.

The Bible says that God created plants on the third day of creation, so He must have created carbon dioxide for them to survive. Why would it be a sin for man to make (by burning fuel) what God Himself made?

that in itself makes it a mute point because christians don’t live by the laws of the old testament, only the laws of the new.

boomer on March 11, 2008 at 3:00 PM

It’s a nonspeaking point, huh?

Genesis 2:15, 19-20

James OK on March 10, 2008 at 11:43 PM

Genesis 2
15 Then the LORD God took the man and put him into the garden of Eden to cultivate it and keep it.

19(T)Out of the ground the LORD God formed every beast of the field and every bird of the sky, and (U)brought them to the man to see what he would call them; and whatever the man called a living creature, that was its name.

20The man gave names to all the cattle, and to the birds of the sky, and to every beast of the field, but for [b]Adam there was not found (V)a helper suitable for him.

Well I can certainly see how one would come to the understanding that we do need to take care of what the Lord has given us. I have no problem with that. However to mandate that as a command would be a sin as it has not been madated as a command. In context that is talking about God placing Adam and Eve in the garden. Not how we should live. The last two verses? I don’t know how anyone could get the conclusion we should all be environmetalists out of that. Thats is talking about naming of the animals and the search for a helper for Adam. Besides it’s old testament and that in itself makes it a mute point because christians don’t live by the laws of the old testament, only the laws of the new.

The U.S. is NOT the bugaboo treehuggers make us out to be.
jimbo2008 on March 11, 2008 at 9:57 AM

I agree, and you’ll note I didn’t allude to such. But we’re not the bastion we should be, either.
Also, sadly, the US doesn’t represent the rest of the world’s environmental problems.
*cough*china india*cough*

Really? Reeaalllly??

If Evangelicals want to adopt the cult of global warming into their psyche, let them.

It’s good to be concerned about the environment, but who advocates polluting willy nilly? It is silly to assume people are not concerned with the environment regarding pollution. You don’t have to be a member of the likes of Greenpeace nor do you have to be a follower of the Goracle to be an environmentalist.

(End note: I am happy that so far in this thread, I don’t see the phrase “stewards of the environment” as Sen McCain uses. I hate that phrase.)

While no Christian would not, nor should not, bow to Gaia, conservation of the Natural is God’s mandate going back to Genesis.

What you will not, nor ever hear is the Pope advocating the purchase of carbon credits.

James OK on March 10, 2008 at 10:55 PM

No, taking dominion was. There must be a happy medium. If that means limiting economic growth to where lives are lost (such as banning DDT in Africa) to stop pollution then it is a sin.

Mortal sin, according to the beliefs of Roman Catholicism, is a sin that, unless confessed and absolved (or at least sacramental confession is willed if not available), condemns a person’s soul to Hell after death. But even so, you cannot go to heaven if the sin is of a serious enough magnitude.

So, the list of things you can do that will lead to an eternity burning in hell, even if you later repent, has grown.

As I’ve said before, nice moral compass, Catholics.

They should stick to poetic vagueness when interpreting vague poetry.

Leaves more latitude for realistic reassessments.

These hasty declarations of Certainty are silly.

(From some of the same people who doubt Science when it comes to evolution?)

If they would work reasonably, not hysterically, we’d all be better served by our ministers and politicos.

There’s more in heaven and Earth than in their hot philosophy.

The stance they are taking is that pollution is a damnable sin, which has no scriptural basis whatsoever. If they are acting as a church, then they should act in accordance to their foundation, which is the Bible. If they disregard the Bible, then they should not to be claiming to act on behalf of it.

Since he does not mention Global Warming, I am assuming that you are just “pro pollution”.

And I suppose you think that the dominion over the earth given to us by G-d does not come with any responsibility for stewardship…

Squid Shark on March 10, 2008 at 10:46 PM

LOL. This Squid guy is going to be fun.

Yes, Squid, I think we should pollute everything, kill everything that moves, and drink lot’s of beer while we watch Nascar. Try not to flinch.

and when we destroy God’s creation, it’s similar to ripping pages from the Bible.”

DESTROY=RIPPING?????? How absurd!!! Algore = FOOL

How terribly sad that, these days, any mention of environmentalism automatically equals global warming hysteria.

Thanks Al, for diverting attention from proven problems like air and water pollution.

SouthernDem on March 11, 2008 at 8:49 AM

The EPA’s last report in 2007 said that, overall, air and water in the U.S. was cleaner than it has ever been since testing started back in 1972. Sure there are places like L.A., etc. that need more work, but most of the world’s pollution problems are caused by other countries, especially developing countries like China, Russia, etc.
The U.S. is NOT the bugaboo treehuggers make us out to be.

I’m all for environmental conservation – I don’t like living in a dirty house, why would I want to live on a dirty planet? But I’ve noticed that because I’m a nontheist, I must be a gaia-worshipper because I recycle, use reusuable grocery bags, and consume (some) organic products. If only I worshiped your God, then I’d be a rightious conservative.

Whatever. Environmental stewardship is important and irrelevant to personal religious beliefs. ‘Climate change’ and ‘global warming/cooling’ are nothing but hysterical hoopla designed by a few to profit from the ignorance of many. I give credit to the Pope for trying, but the other guy quoted (Southern Baptist, right?) loses points for adding fuel to the fire. As much as I hate the Catholic Church, I can put this aside to look at the bigger picture. Something about seeing the forest in spite of all the trees.

One last off-topic note: I miss the old pope. JP2 was a relation of my Polish side of the family, and he was something of a hero in my household growing up. I don’t like this new guy too much – something just doesn’t seem right about him (besides the whole he’s Catholic thing).

I think you might be projecting your paranoia about the Global Wwarming “conspiracy” onto this…

Just my opinion…

Squid Shark on March 11, 2008 at 6:28 AM

Well, there’s nothing else that can be said to you if you have already swallowed the bait.

We can resume the discussion when Al Gore’s vision comes true…don’t hold your breath.

Thanks Al, for diverting attention from proven problems like air and water pollution.

Faith1 on March 11, 2008 at 7:52 AM

Amen!

One big slam about the Catholic Church being socialist? Ummm, have you ever read anything about the church and their history over the last 2000 years? Of course they are socialist–most churches re to come extent–the whole “sacrifice of the individuals for the betterment of the whole”. I don’t buy into it either but waving the “socialist” flag at a church is like trying to make a point by saying water is wet.

This particular Pope has slammed the enviro-weenies and global warming alarmists so I don’t read this as a sudden reversal. “Don’t trash the environment” isn’t quite the same as Gore’s “Give me ultimate power over your lives so I can tell you how to live or you’ll all die.”

Many of you complain of lefties suffering BDS….I think many of you suffer from Catholic Derangement Syndrome. It’s telling to see the complete flip-flop in praise/condemnation from some posters–previously cheering when this same Pope told people to quit jumping on the Global Warming bandwagon. How quickly they forget.

My affiliation? I’m agnostic. I don’t particularly care for any human run church group. As I said, I have no love for th Catholic Church but I don’t mindlessly hate it like some here appear to do.

How dare they speak out against pollution…
scandalous!

Squid Shark on March 10, 2008 at 10:52 PM

That’s not the point! Western civilization is hanging by a thread, with only a few Republicans in the US willing to fight for it, and even fewer allies abroad. And the Pope could be one of our strongest allies, if he’d wake up.

We’re not talking about pollution, btw. We’re railing against the global warming hysteria. And in either case, the Pope should have more important things to worry about. He’s beginning to sound like the leader of one of those socialist western european countries that truly don’t have anything better to do, having given up their own security responsibilities decades ago.

Traffic is really getting bad. Hope the Pope issues a severe warning against it.

Don’t tell the Pope that the sun’s activity is in a slow period and chilling temps are on the way. If he heard that, he’d have to rewrite the “sins” and the world might think the Catholic Church is really just a political/business oriented enterprise.

Whoops. Was that my outside voice?

Aplogies to any devout Catholics who faithfully observe the lessons of the Bible and steadfastly ignore the political postering of their Church!

Montana on March 10, 2008 at 10:36 PM

Ever since that last little problem with the sun because of Copernicus, the church has stayed out of all issues involving the sun. Don’t say they’re not learning.

Genesis 8:21b-22

“Then the LORD said in His heart, “I will never again curse the ground for man’s sake, although the imagination of man’s heart is evil from his youth; nor will I again destroy every living thing as I have done.

While the earth remains,
Seedtime and harvest,
Cold and heat,
Winter and summer,
And day and night,
Shall not cease.” NKJV

Global warming is a religious Marxist movement and while it”s sad that people in high places should know better, there is an eternity of difference in believing IN GOD and believing GOD.