Gitmo interrogator speaks
posted at 3:55 pm on February 17, 2008 by Bryan
MSNBC reports but leaves out important context.
Interrogators received intelligence from detainees that helped U.S. troops in Afghanistan attack Taliban fighters last summer — and they did it through casual questioning and not torture, the military’s chief interrogator here said.
In a rare interview with The Associated Press, veteran interrogator Paul Rester complained that his profession has gotten a bad reputation because of accounts of waterboarding and other rough interrogation tactics used by the CIA at “black sites.”
Lawyers for Guantanamo detainees, however, allege their clients have been subjected to temperature extremes, sleep deprivation and threats at this U.S. military base in southeast Cuba.
It’s at this point that the MSNBC report ought to sidebar into who these lawyers are and who is paying for them (hint: they’re far far left ACLU and National Lawyers Guild types funded in part by Wahhabi money). MSNBC would also do well to report that some Gitmo lawyers have engaged in extracurricular activities on behalf of their clients. MSNBC would earn a big gold star if it also noted that al Qaeda trains its terrorists to make up allegations of mistreatment and torture if they’re captured so that the press and the left will run with those allegations and crack war morale. MSNBC also leaves out the fact that for all the “mistreatment,” our troops on Gitmo guard duty have been subjected to a whole range of attacks from the detainees, to whom our military gives Korans, prayer rugs, an arrow pointing the way to Mecca and meals that are better than those our own troops are eating in the fields of combat. For some reason, though MSNBC leaves all of that context out. I’ll add the sidebar that their layers of editors and fact checkers never add, since it’s important to evaluating what the terrorists and their lawyers say.
Wearing a blue-striped business shirt without a tie and looking more like a harried executive than a top interrogator, Rester groused that his line of work is “a business that is fundamentally thankless.”
Evil is banal, get it?
He sat hunched over a table in a snack room inside the building where the top commanders keep their offices. In an attempt to keep personnel from blabbing about intelligence-gathering, a poster showed a picture of a hooded gunman and the words: “Keep talking. We’re listening” — today’s version of the World War II-era admonishment that “Loose lips sink ships.”
“Everybody in the world believes that they know how we do what we do, and I have to endure it every time I turn around and somebody is making reference to waterboarding,” Rester said. He insisted that Guantanamo interrogators have had many successes using rapport-building and said that technique was the norm here.
The story goes on to note a couple of rapport-building successes before hearing from a Gitmo lawyer and ending with three-year-old FBI allegations that a couple of inmates were being mistreated. Those inmates are unnamed in the story, and the circumstances of their treatment aren’t detailed, so the story leaves with the impression that interrogator Paul Rester isn’t entirely coming clean about what goes on at Gitmo.
Neither are the Gitmo lawyers. Neither is the press. If I have to pick between Gitmo lawyers who parrot the lines their terrorist clients are trained to make up, the press that knowingly leaves out loads of important context, or an interrogator who is frustrated by the actions of the first two groups and how his work is made more difficult by them, I’ll pick the interrogator. At least his intentions are obvious and up front: He’s trying to stop terrorists by questioning captured terrorists.









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I am really conflicted about making comments on this subject.
Interrogation is more psychological than it is physical. Thus commenting on the psychological aspects reveals ‘sources and methods’. In other words, talking about this publicly, gives insight into how we do interrogation to our enemies.
If opposition forces believe that we torture, and abuse captives, it works to our advantage. If the prisoner is expecting to be brutally treated, and we don’t do it, there is a time when a sympathetic approach breaks down the resistance to interrogation.
Unfortunately, to foster the idea among our enemies that being captured results in unpleasantness, we also have to permit that idea to be the dominant perception among the general public, to our detriment.
rockhauler on February 17, 2008 at 4:13 PM
Still, beyond belief.
labrat on February 17, 2008 at 4:14 PM
What’s with the facts? Obviously, the MSNBC workers are professional journalists and you’re just a lousy blogger. At least that’s what I learned from Andrew Keen, and since he wrote a physical book he must be right.
Sarcasm aside, it would be interesting to hear the MSNBC journalists justify their choices about the relevant facts. Sadly, my friend who worked for the NYT had a tragic accident and may not come out of it alive, or I’d be confrontational with him about these ideas. I wish I knew another MSM higher-up.
thuja on February 17, 2008 at 4:21 PM
You forgot to add that these Lawyers are big Barack Obama backers Bryan.
William Amos on February 17, 2008 at 4:23 PM
Dang! I sure did. And they sure are.
Bryan on February 17, 2008 at 4:24 PM
The sarcasm dripping from that line is thick. I believe the interrogator even if MSNBC doesn’t.
SouthernGent on February 17, 2008 at 4:27 PM
Why do we Americans continue to hold a 9mm to our own head? Do we have a death wish complex?
misterspork on February 17, 2008 at 4:31 PM
I’m still not clear how they distinguish a genuine Taleban or al-Qa’ida combatant from some hapless fool who was too near the battle or was fingered by some enemy who wants his land. These aren’t guys in uniform to be treated like POW’s, nor are they criminals to be given a court trial. They’re somewhere in a gray area that still requires some kind of process to determine the facts of their identity and deeds.
NNtrancer on February 17, 2008 at 4:31 PM
I thikn the same thing occured during WWII. many wanted the SS/gestapo instead of just the Whermacht foot soldiers.
What I recall is that they used other prisoners to point them out as well as captured records and ideological fevor. The true blue Jihaidst would have trouble hiding his Religeous fevor.
William Amos on February 17, 2008 at 4:36 PM
First, the media runs the lies about “torture” to get the government to reveal more about our techniques, in order to clue in our enemies.
Second, the enemy knows we don’t do things like that, so the rest of the comment is meaningless. Please think.
Tommygun on February 17, 2008 at 4:53 PM
Not all of us, no, but many on the Left hate America enough to shoot a 9mm into its head. Some of them aren’t smart enough to realize that they’ll take the hit, too, and the rest are just nihilists.
Kensington on February 17, 2008 at 4:53 PM
Tommygun
Excuse me?? I can only conclude that reading comprehension is not your strong suit.
Think it through, yourself, dude.
rockhauler on February 17, 2008 at 5:10 PM
“Unfortunately, to foster the idea among our enemies that being captured results in unpleasantness, ”
Yea right. All those stories about Gitmo showing the prayer rugs, food, et al do exactly that. Dod doing a black arts scheme with the MSM? Dod doesn’t have to because the leftists MSM are already on the other side.
mred on February 17, 2008 at 5:53 PM
Because liberalism is a form of mental illness.
doriangrey on February 17, 2008 at 6:44 PM
Thank you veteran interrogator Paul Rester. God Bless you and the job you are doing to protect us.
P.S.- Don’t worry about the water boarding. Do what you got to do. I support you.
HotAirExpert on February 17, 2008 at 7:40 PM
I read nonsense like this and can’t help but feel we are well on our way to our own “fall of the Roman empire.” We are knee deep in self-hating, America-hating, treason-committing vampires protected by the cloak of “law.”
Had you been able to promise the American people on September 12, 2001 that this government would keep us from being hit again for the next 7 years and counting, Congress would have moved immediately to make George W Bush the fifth face on Mt. Rushmore.
Instead, we sit here now watching as these vile lawyers and traitors continue to write the handbook on how to bring the greatest nation on earth to its knees.
I used to think that it would take another major attach on US soil to wake us (again!), but now I fear that even that won’t do it.
What will it take for Americans to stand up and say enough is enough?
Sugar Land on February 17, 2008 at 8:10 PM
‘Death without Dignity’ legal in Orygun…headed your way.
oldernslower on February 17, 2008 at 10:00 PM
I DON’T CARE HOW YOU GET THEM TO TALK, JUST GET THEM TO TALK. THESE INTERRORGATORS SAVE LIVES AND SHOULD ALL BE GIVEN MEDALS!
Bubba Redneck on February 17, 2008 at 11:36 PM
Shoot ‘em in the field after quick tribunals, after squeezing the big dogs for info.
This kidgloves nonsense only weakens our side against a brutal and merciless foe who mocks our “Geneva Conventions” pudeurs by slicing off someone’s head or setting fire to live captives, and recording the crime on video for release online to frighten and demoralize their sworn enemy. Us.
Terrorists, spies and saboteurs, who operate out of uniform and under no code of war, are only required to be given a cloth blindfold, not our Constitution for their toilet paper.
Saves money on free Koran handouts, too.
profitsbeard on February 18, 2008 at 12:29 AM
“Lawyers for Guantanamo detainees, however, allege their clients have been subjected to temperature extremes, sleep deprivation and threats …”
Big deal, our guys go through more than that in Boot Camp.
Tony737 on February 18, 2008 at 1:13 AM
One problem is the image that most people have about what intelligence information is, and how interrogation works.
Intelligence information is whatever information that can be combined with other information to tell you the enemies plans, intent, or just lead you somewhere that you didn’t know existed. It isn’t always Jack Baur shooting someone in the kneecap or telling the prisoner “Ve haff vays uff making you talk!” and asking for the secret plans to the doomsday device.
Interrogation is a conversation. It is a lot like people pay big bucks to psychologists for. It is a piece here and a piece there. It can involve threats, it can also involve simple gestures that form a relationship between the interrogator and the subject.
There is no roadmap for interrogation. Your more experienced interrogators use various methods depending on how the session is going. It may be necessary for the subject to really believe that he is going to be hurt or die. Or maybe not.
It’s as stupid for people to try to dictate what methods can be used under what circumstances as it is for me to suddenly dictate plays during the Super Bowl.
I recall when I went through Basic Training back in 1967. It was very much like “Full Metal Jacket” in many ways. We had been told numerous times about what the Drill Sergeants could and couldn’t do to us. That went right out the window as soon as we got off the bus at the Company.
WE knew what the Drill Sergeants could and couldn’t do. But we weren’t sure that THEY knew. There was an element of doubt that allowed them to manipulate us. In SERE training that the SF, pilots and others go through, they KNOW that the opforce people are only role playing, but there is always an element of doubt there. The possibility that they might have gotten too wrapped up the role playing to realize what they’re doing.
That doubt should always be there in an interrogation too. The prisoner might KNOW what restrictions are on the interrogator, but he should always be wondering if maybe, just maybe, the interrogator is out of control and he might be hurt or killed. Most likely there will be another interrogator playing that role. “Good cop. Bad cop” It works.
But some people are trying to remove that doubt. If a prisoner knows that interrogators have been punished for using certain techniques, the element of doubt is gone. The element of fear is gone. They know that all the hard talk is just “woof tickets” and they can relax and play their own games.
Just in passing. “Waterboarding” is a technique that was developed fairly recently to replace a technique that has been around for eons. The old method involved holding a prisoner’s head underwater until he felt like he was drowning, then pull him out and ask questions. I’m sure you’ve seen it used in countless movies. But it was dangerous. Because if you misjudged things you ended up drowning the prisoner. That wasted a source and in the American military, at least, resulted in a lot of paperwork.
The “waterboarding” technique was developed as a safe way of inducing the panic from drowning without killing or damaging the prisoner.
So what happens? Someone complains about the safe method. I have no doubt that the jihadists do not bother to waterboard using the safe method.
They are barbarians.
schmuck281 on February 18, 2008 at 3:37 AM
You nailed it. This is one of the best summaries of interrogation I’ve seen.
My husband was the psychologist for the SERE school and underwent waterboarding. The experience was as you say–he experienced panic, he knew they would not drown him deliberately but thought he was experiencing a training accident, and he emphatically says he was not harmed. And not one of these people now protesting waterboarding has ever protested that he went through it–apparently, it is only reprehensible to use it on the enemy in order to save American lives.
If waterboarding is so awful, perhaps we should interrogate prisoners while doing bikini waxes. Millions of women worldwide regularly and voluntarily have them. “It’s not torture, it’s grooming.”
DrMagnolias on February 18, 2008 at 4:41 AM
Brya, Bryan, Bryan. Have you forgotten that Bush is evil and that all his foot soldiers are only out there to instrument evil upon all Muslims? Come on!
Seixon on February 18, 2008 at 5:41 AM
Schmuck281 gets best comment award.
If “casual conversation” works in getting intelligence, then I’m all for it. It also seems reasonable that it’s not going to work 100% of the time. When it doesn’t, I don’t see how it’s reasonable to intentionally handicap our interrogators. In a time of war, I don’t think anything should be off the table in this regard.
JohnTant on February 18, 2008 at 8:16 AM
Casual converstaion is all the CIA will have left if the recent legislation is signed by Bush.
No phsycological coertion is allowed. They have less interrogation power than the US police.
davod on February 18, 2008 at 10:06 AM
Scalia hits it on the head;
(from an msnbc link)
He’s a little more agreeable to multiple interrogation methods as well, at war time and especially in the ‘ticking bomb’ scenario.
We need more like him.
shooter on February 18, 2008 at 3:30 PM
ROFL
oldleprechaun on February 18, 2008 at 6:27 PM
The thought just occurred to me- since those on the left seem to think “water-boarding” is bad, why don’t we take a page from the Religion of Peace and start teaching five-year-olds how to behead people? We’re barbarians and they’re civilized, right?
oldleprechaun on February 18, 2008 at 6:32 PM
That phrase “the banality of evil” has always bothered me. Evil is not banal. It is potentially seductive, exciting and even exhilarating. Hannah Ardent finds one dull, meticulous Nazi bureaucrat and concludes, to the subsequent agreement of all Western intelligentsia forever more, that evil is a banal thing. When Eichmann was shuffling his papers his fellow Nazis were dressing in fetishistic black leather uniforms, holding neo-pagan blood festivals with fully or half-naked Aryan “goddesses” parading through the streets of Berlin and conquering nations with a satisfactory zeal.
Evil has a kind of magnificent glamour attached to it in many cases. The Hapsburgs dined on gourmet baby seal hearts whilst their slave populations starved. Too many examples to mention. I think the whole “banality of evil” explanation is a crock. I haven’t been able to figure out why Western intellectuals have swallowed it as Gospel truth but there has to be a reason.
aengus on February 18, 2008 at 8:18 PM