Video: “Dude” incident in Baltimore
posted at 6:20 pm on February 12, 2008 by Bryan
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A Baltimore city policeman is under investigation after this video surfaced. It captures an incident that took place at Baltimore’s Inner Harbor last summer. The Inner Harbor is where Baltimore meets the upper Chesapeake pretty much head on, and it’s both the city’s main tourist attraction and one of its heavier crime areas. Visible police patrols have cut down on the latter. The kids in the video were evidently skateboarding in an area where that’s prohibited, when the officer pulled up and told them to stop.
It appears that the officer told everyone to stop skateboarding and was in the process of leaving. However, one kid had his IPOD playing in his ears and probably didn’t hear him. After the kid is told again to stop skateboarding, he talks to the officer disrespectfully. The officer goes to confiscate his skateboard but the kid doesn’t comply, which leads to the officer forcefully collecting it from him. The kid obviously didn’t show any respect to the officer and deserved to get pushed around, while the officer obviously has some attitude (and probably authority complex) problems he needs to work out.
WBAL has a story about the suspension here.
Sterling Clifford, a spokesman for the Baltimore Police Department and the mayor’s office, says the incident involving Officer Salvatore Rivieri, a 17-year-old [sic] veteran, is the subject of an internal affairs investigation.
The video, apparently shot last summer, shows Rivieri putting the youth, 14-year-old Eric Bush, into a headlock and pushing him to the ground.
Rivieri told The Sun on Sunday that he did not know that the incident had been recorded or posted on the Internet. He acknowledged having encounters with skateboarders at the Inner Harbor, where skateboarding is banned, last summer, and told a reporter that he would watch the video on YouTube.
What do you think?
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Parent’s fault. If that kid had been taught to respect the cops, he probably would have had less reason to fly off the handle.
Warner Todd Huston on February 12, 2008 at 7:39 PM
Um, if you’re right and that was supposed to teach him about reality, then I’m afraid he might be convinced now that his “mental diet of MTV and tunes” is packed full of of nutritious reality.
NorthernCross on February 12, 2008 at 7:40 PM
lol.
Maybe it is urban myth. But who hasn’t heard that?
TheSitRep on February 12, 2008 at 7:40 PM
Because a garbage man isn’t going to put his life on the line to save yours or your wife’s or your child’s on a daily basis. A garbage man isn’t going to catch the people who just robbed your hose. He isn’t going to track down the person who raped your daughter and he’s certainly not going to make you any smarter.
TheBigOldDog on February 12, 2008 at 7:42 PM
Northern,
The officer, despite any objections to his behavior, was acting in an official manner. The kid refused to comply to an officer acting in an official manner. The officer instructed the kid to not call him “dude”. The kid refused to comply. This is the same idea of why you only call a judge “your honor” or some other respectful, official title. If you called a judge “dude” after several orders to the contrary while you were in court, you would be charged with contempt of court. You may certainly object and say that you have some right to call the judge whatever you want, but you’re still going to get fined and sit in a jail cell.
Weebork on February 12, 2008 at 7:45 PM
The majority of comments in this forum is that our First Amendment Hero was within his rights to ignore the policeman and just walk away. A First Amendment Hero that walks away from a facist pig won’t and shouldn’t get a ticket. Of course, the facist pig could’ve used his Big Brother powers to issue a ticket by mail.
Speaking of lectures watch closely: Our First Amendment Hero heroically spat to the pig “I don’t have a dad.”
Oh, the t-shirts that will be made of that First Amendment Heroic phrase shall be epic!
ScottMcC on February 12, 2008 at 7:45 PM
Well, maybe because garbage men are not usually at risk of getting gunned down while picking up your trash?
EnochCain on February 12, 2008 at 7:45 PM
DUDE
http://cosmos.bcst.yahoo.com/up/player/popup/?cl=6413542
maynila on February 12, 2008 at 7:45 PM
Respect ? After watching one deputy throw a quadraplegic out of his wheel chair and this tool disrespecting himself while raging away, I have to ask why do they deserve respect? Do you think this is the first time either of them acted with disrespect towards ciizens ? I doubt it, they have probably pulled this shit before.
deadbackpacker on February 12, 2008 at 7:46 PM
So its ok to disrespect all police officers because of what some do?
EnochCain on February 12, 2008 at 7:47 PM
Mean while someone is being raped with a chainsaw right around the corner.
manfriend on February 12, 2008 at 7:49 PM
Dude seems to forget who works for who.
A cops place in America is not to be lording his authority over those weaker than him. See crime, write it up, arrest when necessary.
This guy thinks he’s a demigod, when he’s just a pudgy mortal with a bad, bad attitude.
Too bad the kid wasn’t packing a taser.
Pablo on February 12, 2008 at 7:49 PM
It isn’t so much that you are giving respect to the actual person wearing the badge, although that is preferable, your respect goes towards the institution that make up the police. Much in the same way you address the POTUS. I dislike Bill Clinton, but I still referred to him as president or Mr Clinton when he was in office because I respected the job he held, not him. It’s the ideal. I thought this was obvious?
Weebork on February 12, 2008 at 7:51 PM
Bad analogy. There are certain procedures and rules of etiquette that are imposed upon us during a formal hearing, and so you can’t just say anything at all while court’s in session. Unless I’m mistaken, Baltimore cops don’t have the authority to call a formal hearing on a street, or anywhere for that matter. That means the kid can call the cop Mr. Raffles, King of the Potato Elves, and the cop can’t do anything about it.
NorthernCross on February 12, 2008 at 7:51 PM
Respect is earned and by their behavior they deserve none. Just because you wear a badge doesn’t mean you are always entitled to respect. Courtesy,yes, but not respect. Would you respect any other adult who acted like that towards a 14 year old ?
deadbackpacker on February 12, 2008 at 7:52 PM
I can’t believe that cop thinks that kind of behavior toward children acceptable. I’d like to see that cop act that way toward some real criminals.
KCtheKat on February 12, 2008 at 7:54 PM
I am not talking about the cop in this instance but more about people saying “I hate cops” and calling them pigs which I thought was something only the left did…oh and lets not forget my favorite the references to Nazis.
EnochCain on February 12, 2008 at 7:54 PM
Yes – toward a sullen, smartmouthing, 14 year old like that kid, absolutely.
RushBaby on February 12, 2008 at 7:55 PM
Hwy, when did Eric Cartman join the Baltimore PD?
Pablo on February 12, 2008 at 7:56 PM
Yo KC, it’s me! Laviciousness! How long you been hangin’ here??
NorthernCross on February 12, 2008 at 7:58 PM
Yeah, when he called him a lardass c0cks*cker, that was way out of line.
Pablo on February 12, 2008 at 7:59 PM
Neither one of you actually answered the question only spit out some drivel about risk. Garbage men make pick ups in very dangerous neighborhoods. I also notice that neither one of you mentioned linemen, who keep your lights on in the worst of weather. Police officers make a choice just like everyone else. They do it for reasons known only to themselves but they make that choice. In the list of most dangerous jobs police work doesn’t even make the top ten. How about substituting fisherman or lumberjack for garbage man. They’re the top two in almost every list. Do we owe a commercial fisherman an extra measure of respect for his chosen profession entered willingly by choice? After all he could die delivering your flounder.
Nice to hear from you BOD. Thanks for the snarky personal attack. That the best you can do?
Oldnuke on February 12, 2008 at 8:00 PM
The officer says ‘Do you talk to your father like this?’
I DON’T HAVE A FATHER, the kid says.
The officer says ‘SHUT YOUR MOUTH I AM TALKING’
Yeah, doin a great job there DUDE! Good way to have sympathy when you are exposed as a jerk. I wonder how the officer’s father is doing.
The officer should have walked away after he told the kid to stop riding the skateboard and he said ‘OK’. He’ll go down as another reason that this kid hates cops.
ThackerAgency on February 12, 2008 at 8:03 PM
In major cities Police refer to themselves as Trash man or Garbage men.
I had a buddy that became a Cop. He was the nicest guy you could ever meet, but after having to work 2 years in the Galveston County jail before becoming a deputy he became the worst prick you’d ever want to meet.
What those guys have to see day in and day out can really jade a man.
I have extreme respect for them when they are Pros and have helped them out in some situations.
But that Jabroni has some personal issues.
TheSitRep on February 12, 2008 at 8:03 PM
Northern,
You’re right in the technical sense.
Weebork on February 12, 2008 at 8:03 PM
On the contrary it is you who are sadly and profoundly mistaken. If a cop orders you to do something you DO NOT have the option to ignore or disregard what he says, even if you believe that he is acting in excess of his authority. US law states very clearly that every citizen is legally required to fully cooperate with all law enforcement officer at all times.
Your recourse should you believe that an officer of the law has illegally exceeded his authority is with the court system, it is not under any circumstances with you ignoring or disobeying a law enforcement member.
Some of you guys clearly live in a bizarro fantasy land and have never actually had any contentious interactions with the law enforcement community. I wish that I could say that I live in that same ignorant make believe world, but I don’t. I have been arrested at least 20 times and gone to jail at least five times, and been convicted of a felony.
Furthermore all of my siblings 1 sister and three brothers have had even more of the above mentioned interactions with the law enforcement community, including the two of my brother who have done multiple prison terms. HebrewToYou without intentionally being disrespectful, you honestly don’t know what the f%^k you are blathering on about. You are totally 100% clueless. In fact you are stunningly to the point of frighteningly clueless.
doriangrey on February 12, 2008 at 8:05 PM
says “Guys, go skateboard somewhere else, or I’ll confiscate thos boards next time I see you”. Then he should continue patrolling. Headlocking the kid, who was about 200 lbs. lighter than this pig was unnecessary.
Andy in Agoura Hills on February 12, 2008 at 6:59 PM
So thinking conservatives have less respect for the law than a thoughtless 14-year old kid?
aengus on February 12, 2008 at 8:06 PM
I enjoy seeing pants-hanging-down, lazy, unrespectul to ALL adults teenagers pee themselves……..
I’m sure the parents will want to sue over poor little johnny…..
The sad thing is, if the cops don’t CONSTANTLY get those skateboarding weasels to stop, someone gets hurt and then the city gets sued…..
awesum on February 12, 2008 at 8:06 PM
This is Baltimore’s finest? What are we coming to?!
This man should never be allowed to wear a badge ever again! He has some real issues and is ready to vent on anyone that he perceives has dissed him in the smallest way!
Screaming and attempting to humiliate some little kid for calling him dude is so far over the line! It’s a wonder he didn’t taze the kid and call in the SWAT team!
This so called cop, obviously didn’t feel he had any control and needed to yell and abuse to make up his lack of self confidence! He could be a real danger both to the public and to other police! He only knows how to escalate situations, not de-escalate!
JellyToast on February 12, 2008 at 8:07 PM
BINGO!
I’m not saying the cop was right, but ya know, he’s probably just sick and tired of dealing with punks.
reine.de.tout on February 12, 2008 at 8:07 PM
I’m really sick of hearing the word disrespect used as a verb. Yes, yes, I know, it goes way back (though I don’t think this is a continuation of earlier use). And yes, language changes and all of that. But still, it’s so abused and thrown around, as though we were 16th-century Italians, ready to start a fight with anybody who “disses” us.
(I also have “issues” with the word issues.)
Tzetzes on February 12, 2008 at 8:07 PM
Memo to my son:
If and when you ever find yourself in the company of a police officer, the correct response is “Yes, sir.”
CurtZHP on February 12, 2008 at 8:09 PM
A better cop would have diffused the situation before it got out of hand.
However, that stupid meter maid vehicle and that getup made the officer look more like a dork than a cop, hence the disrespectful comments from the apple of our youth.
Once those punks provoked the cop, it was all over. Cool heads prevail.
southsideironworks on February 12, 2008 at 8:09 PM
A long time, I just don’t post as much as I used to. Too many people posting now a days.
KCtheKat on February 12, 2008 at 8:10 PM
Kid = Kid.
Cop = Unprofessional.
Tzetzes on February 12, 2008 at 8:10 PM
NorthernCross on February 12, 2008 at 8:11 PM
Um, let’s try this again…
So let me get this straight. A cop busts down the dooor to my sister’s apartment and orders her to undress so that he can diddle her, and she has to do obey his orders, with her only recourse being that she can take him to court after the fact?
I’m sorry, but it just seems beyond reason that US law can be so inequitable.
NorthernCross on February 12, 2008 at 8:11 PM
NorthernCross on February 12, 2008 at 8:12 PM
You wanna cite that law, dorian? Just the very clear part will suffice.
Pablo on February 12, 2008 at 8:12 PM
To answer your question, there are only two reasons to respect a member of the law enforcement community. The first reason is that the law enforcement individual is a symbolic representation of the community as a whole, and very specifically the judicial system of the community. Without out the assurance of equal justice for all every community becomes subject to its most violent and barbaric members.
The only other reason to respect a law enforcement officer is predicated solely on the professionalism and behavior of the individual them self.
Aside from these reasons there is absolutly no reason to accord them any more respect than one would any other individual in society.
doriangrey on February 12, 2008 at 8:15 PM
I’ve run into lots of cops like these (worked with them and know them personally) and a lot get the Wyatt Earp complex. Our local sheriff welcomes reports from the public about incidents like this and is quick to squelch them! He is soft spoken and gets the respect of the whole county without being a asshole! Write a ticket, issue a written warning, let the courts and loss of cash be the lesson. That 14 year old isn’t listening to you anymore than your dog that you kick does at home. BTW, a lot of cops are wife beaters, one across the street sent his wife through the front door, but that doesn’t mean they all are. It’s actions like these that sully the entire force!
flytier on February 12, 2008 at 8:19 PM
Cops pissed because they make him ride around in a clown car.
Cop was over the top. Kid was a snot but the cop should have been more professional.
ronsfi on February 12, 2008 at 8:19 PM
No, he’s an employee of the community.
And no, he’s a witness in front of the judicial system. He does not represent the judicial system. And supposing he did, did he arrest and charge the kid? No. so what was he doing?
He is NOT the law. He is hired to enforce the law. This guy went way, way beyond that.
Pablo on February 12, 2008 at 8:21 PM
The disrespectful punk got what he deserved. This modern attitude that does not hold these young men responsible
for their actions is destroying our culture. Pitiful, spoiled, disrespectful children. The cop was in the right.
frizzbee on February 12, 2008 at 8:21 PM
I support cops and have one in my family but jeez. Listen dude, if I had to dress like a yellowjacket and drive around in a ride the other cops laugh at, maybe I’d be a dick too but I doubt it.
The dudes were just skating and the cop went ballistic for no reason. Give him a desk job and force him out at twenty so he can get a job more akin to his abilities…like pro wrestler.
sswenviron on February 12, 2008 at 8:22 PM
What a childish and immature response.
While the actual status differ slightly from jurisdiction to jurisdiction they remain amazingly consistent nationwide. So I’ll give you this link instead.
doriangrey on February 12, 2008 at 8:25 PM
Kid = Kid.
Cop = Unprofessional.
I totally agree.People are always complaining that kids sit around all day and play video games and watch tv.These guys are out skateboarding and get the felon treatment.Maybe the policeman could have pointed them to a spot that does allow skating instead of blowing a gasket.One other thing…punks are the kids selling dope,tagging,shopliftting,murdering,stealing,assaulting…..none of which I saw here.Way to big an over reaction
stonecutter on February 12, 2008 at 8:25 PM
Cops have a very serious duty to perform. The are always better served when they behave professionally and with in the limits of the law.
This Cop was hopped up on the ether of power that he derives from his position.
The cop should have been respectful to those young citizens just as he should be to a 90 year old. If the kids had refuse to comply with the law then he should have issued a citation or taken the kid into custody and booked him for an offense.
NO WHERE in his training or in a police manual does it say you should act like an asshole. But alas this was his one chance in life to be a badass. ( against a defenseless 95# child) I bet you a dollar that if that had been a 260# Hells Angel the cop would have shown more respect.
But, I bet you wont take that bet.
TheSitRep on February 12, 2008 at 8:25 PM
That cop is a total jerk. I would skateboard with friends at inner harbor every summer back in the day. We never had any problems with the cops there. When I was younger all a cop would have to do is come by and tell me and my friends to move on and we would go. This cop looks like he was trying to pick a fight with these kids.
matthewbit07 on February 12, 2008 at 8:28 PM
Yep, the kid was disrespectful, but the cop flew off the handle way too quickly.
Despite what some of you may think, one way not to get a 14 year old to respect you is to scream at the top of you lungs at them, then put them in a headlock.
These kids will view cops in negative light the rest of their live because of this officer.
SouthernDem on February 12, 2008 at 8:30 PM
Yup. If he had bothered to confront them at all.
Pablo on February 12, 2008 at 8:30 PM
US law states very clearly that every citizen is legally required to fully cooperate with all law enforcement officer at all times.
doriangrey on February 12
So, your saying if a a cop stops you and tells you to pull down your pants and stick your finger up where the sun don’t shine, I am legally required to obey? If a cop stops me and orders me to slap the nearest female, steal her purse and put it in his patrol car, I must obey??
Because we have lost our moral fabric and have little understanding of true individual liberty and rights,, I imagine a great many people would think they would have no choice.
Just like the Nazi guards in the death camps, or those people in Germany that informed on their neighbors for hiding Jews. They had to obey, right?
I am not saying I may not suffer for refusing to obey an illegal order or for refusing to obey someone abusing their authority,, but it will always be right to disobey and illegal order.
I believe in the Bible and I believe in God. I believe in all that this nation stands for. And I believe with all that is within me, that, though these kids were disrespectful, this officer was acting outside of his authority and abusing his position.
It is an unfortunate sign, though, of the times, that not a single adult walking by had the courage to suffer for those children. How many adults had felt as some of us do here now, but were too afraid to intervene. Too afraid to ask questions. Too afraid to see the obvious.
The police dept. noticed, I am sure. “Good little sheep! Just keep moving and don’t look at this child getting a headlock.”
The children noticed and will remember. By the time that generation becomes our age, they may well have perfected the “turning the blind eye” to all the future abuses that have yet to come. They will have learned well from our example.
JellyToast on February 12, 2008 at 8:31 PM
The punk in this situation is wearing a badge.
Pablo on February 12, 2008 at 8:31 PM
Have you ever actually been arrested Pablo? No I didn’t think so, in short, you don’t have the slightest idea what you are ranting about. Believe me when I tell you I really do wish the world was like the fantasy you live it, the truth is it isn’t. I have a cop following me around right now, because I bought my Corvette from a suspected drug dealer. I have spoken to lawyer and judges about this, and the cop is fully within his rights so long as his contact with me is within certain legal guideline. The son of a bitch pulls me over if I so much as fail to signal a lane change. So don’t even pretend you know what the limitations of a police officer are when talking to me.
doriangrey on February 12, 2008 at 8:32 PM
Believe it or not….Police Officers read these comments and post on HotAir. The Officer did not handle himself very well. Does he deserve to be called a “fat pig”, pig, nazi??? NO!!! I would direct everyone to a link that everyone should read. It is a page at Officer.com that details all the Police Officers that have died recently. http://www.officer.com/article/index.jsp?siteSection=2
mpax on February 12, 2008 at 8:33 PM
What a question. I can’t tell you why you must respect a police officer anymore than I can tell you why you mustn’t sell drugs or murder people. (Without not delving into religious arguments which I’m not going to do in this post).
To a Conservative its self-evident that respect for the rule of law is fundamental to a moral and just society.
Liberal thinking does not take this into account but says oh he’s only 14 and the Officer is older, fatter and a loudmouth therefore we must side with the weaker party, the victim (poor fella), out of sentiment.
Did the Officer exceed his legal authority? No. Was he an asshole? Yes. One of my best friends was beaten up by sadistic policemen. Does this invalidate the rule of law? No. Stick to principles.
aengus on February 12, 2008 at 8:34 PM
JellyToast Pablo, You guys are dangerously clueless, have fun in your fantasy world.
doriangrey on February 12, 2008 at 8:34 PM
I call you out for making an overbroad statement of the law, and your only answer is that I’m being “childish and immature”? I’ll let your ad hominem dodge speak for itself.
And nowhere in that passage you cited is there any legal support this statement of yours:
And that’s me being generous, since your cite of yours isn’t exactly legal authority.
NorthernCross on February 12, 2008 at 8:35 PM
No, they are there for law enforcement, not administer justice. Please correct me if I’m wrong.
SouthernDem on February 12, 2008 at 8:36 PM
*to* administer justice.
SouthernDem on February 12, 2008 at 8:38 PM
Lets have this discussion again after you have been arrested 4 or 5 times and are no longer living in a make believe world ok.
doriangrey on February 12, 2008 at 8:39 PM
Yes, you absolutely do. He can certainly arrest you for disregarding his order, but if he orders you to break the law or give up a right you cannot waive you should certainly ignore it.
This isn’t a police state. Cops are not all powerful. You do not have to bow down to them. This cop especially. Shame on you for trying to convince people that cops hold all the cards. Let them arrest you for disregarding an illegal order. You can sue the pants off their dept. later.
HebrewToYou on February 12, 2008 at 8:40 PM
You were asked to cite the legal document saying that “you DO NOT have the option to ignore or disregard what” an officer says. Why have you not done so?
HebrewToYou on February 12, 2008 at 8:41 PM
Is it me or did the clip stop right when he was about to threaten the kid? I didn’t think most of it was too bad, but if he threatened him physically he ought to be fired. I tend to side with the cops, who unfortunately have to step into the gap of teaching kids manners and respect because their parents are losers. Cops are doing the best they can. He didn’t hit the kid. He just gave him a verbal slap down, and it was meant to be harsh to try to intimidate the kid and hopefully send him down a better path next time. I have no doubt he’ll be a little more respectful of the next cop he encounters. In that, mission accomplished. But I wish I could see the next 5 seconds of what happened.
pecan pie on February 12, 2008 at 8:41 PM
I said nothing about rule of law nor did I say why must I respect a police officer. What I said was
Key words “More” or “Less”. Meaning why should a policeman by virtue of wearing a uniform and a badge be accorded a larger measure of respect than any other worker performing his job. I don’t buy the danger argument any more than the one about hunting down my daughter’s rapist. Policemen are public servants performing the job they chose, nothing more nothing less. Respect is earned by action not by what you wear.
Oldnuke on February 12, 2008 at 8:43 PM
The Police Officer has no class. The teenager has never learned to respect authority. In the confrontation, the Police Officer did not teach the teenager to respect the law. Nothing was learned here. The Police Officer was in control of the situation and blew it. The teenager goes away with a new hatred.
Bootleghooch on February 12, 2008 at 8:44 PM
“What now? Let me tell you what now. I’ma call a coupla hard, pipe-hittin’ n#@@%^s, who’ll go to work on the homes here with a pair of pliers and a blow torch. You hear me talkin’, hillbilly boy? I ain’t through with you by a damn sight. I’ma get medieval on your ass.”
Pulp Fiction, 1994, Character – Marsellus
BowHuntingTexas on February 12, 2008 at 8:45 PM
Make believe world, you say? This coming from some dude who thinks I’ve got to do anything a government official tells me to do? Part of me wonders if you’re just clowning around here. Come on now, cops have the authority to enforce the law, but surely you can’t believe that we’ve got to follow any order that they give us.
NorthernCross on February 12, 2008 at 8:46 PM
You were talking about the law, dorian. Let me refresh your memory:
This is not the law, and is therefore not an answer to my question about the legal requirement you referenced. It’s advice, at best. I defy you to cite any law, anywhere that says what you tell us is a legal requirement.
And I’ve both been in handcuffs and put them on others. Please continue.
Pablo on February 12, 2008 at 8:47 PM
Wow. You’re right doriangrey, it’s probably safe to say that none of us can match you in the law-breaking department. If that’s “clueless” then clueless I shall remain, and happily so.
Buy Danish on February 12, 2008 at 8:48 PM
.
Here are the top 10 most dangerous jobs in the US
No. 1:
Fishers and Related Workers
Deaths per 100,000 workers: 142
No. 2:
Pilots and Flight Engineers
Deaths per 100,000 workers: 88
No. 3:
Loggers
Deaths per 100,000 workers: 82
No. 4:
Iron and Steel Workers
Deaths per 100,000 workers: 61
No. 5:
Refuse and Recyclable Material Collectors
Deaths per 100,000 workers: 42
No. 6:
Farmers and Ranchers
Deaths per 100,000 workers: 38
No. 7:
Electrical Power Line Workers (Installers and Repairers)
Deaths per 100,000 workers: 35
No. 8:
Roofers
Deaths per 100,000 workers: 34
No. 9:
Drivers (truckers and salespeople)
Deaths per 100,000 workers: 27
No. 10:
Agricultural Workers
Deaths per 100,000 workers: 22
TheSitRep on February 12, 2008 at 8:51 PM
in an extreme way, this incident reminds me of the rodney king affair…few realize that there were two other black men in king’s car; they were ordered by the police to remain in the car, which they did and witnessed the entire scene…i’ve always wondered why these “racist” cops didn’t take the opportunity to beat a couple more black men…maybe because the men complied with the cops’ direct order
this “child” might have followed the example set by his friends…also, like the king affair, the video shows us only a portion of the incident…maybe this cop was patient; he clearly had addressed the kid multiple times before the tape starts rolling
if i were that kid, my dad (or mom) would have had me polishing that cop’s little golf buggy every week for a year…oh, and my skateboard and ipod would have been donated to charity
somebody claimed cops become cops for reasons known only to them…how about dedication and a sense of responsibility to their community…or a respect for law and order…or a desire to protect and serve…
erclimb on February 12, 2008 at 8:51 PM
pecan pie,
He put him in a headlock and threw him on the ground. The path he put that kid on is one in which he thinks cops are pigs. And in the case of that cop, he’s right.
The
pigcop could have handled it 100 times better and I know 100 cops who would have done just that.Pablo on February 12, 2008 at 8:51 PM
This guy doesn’t need to be a cop. And it’s also a disturbing example of a tendency, illustrated time and time again, right here, of cops hyper-escalating situations for no other reason than apparent “control” issues. Being professional and firm is quite different from acting as if you’ve just blown a gasket a la Lee Ermy in Full Metal Jacket.
The cop’s probable rationalization for this display of over the top unprofessional conduct is probably that the boy ‘disrespected’ him. Pot, meet kettle, as in this case the cop’s rapid departure from civil discourse (for nothing more than a personal affront) is equally if not more demonstrative of the demise of routine civility in public discourse. And in the case of the police officer, he is certainly old enough, and most likely has received training (being, as this is set, in the Democratic People’s Republic of Maryland) on interacting with the public.
The point, which I’ve made before, and will likely make again, unfortunately, is that the job of law enforcement is a tough enough one as it is – and buffoonish, boorish, strong arm tactics where they are not actually needed only serve the role of unforced error. Did the officer’s behaviour do anything to increase the respect any of the kids that witnessed hold for law enforcement? Or is it more likely that they now, consciously or unconsciously now view the police as borderline psychopaths carrying lethal weapons, and the desired respect is in fact simply fear?
And fear of law enforcement, by people that have no valid reason for this, other than the proximity of law enforcement, is not all that comforting a circumstance, now is it?
Wind Rider on February 12, 2008 at 8:51 PM
Sure, whatever Pablo…….
doriangrey on February 12, 2008 at 8:52 PM
Bingo. Oldnuke nails it.
You’re going to waiting a long time, Pablo, because doriangrey is talking nonsense. There is no such law. You can be arrested for disobeying an order issued by an officer of the law, most certainly, but that could easily be turned into a wrongful arrest if that order was illegally issued.
It’s a similar concept to the signing of a ticket when pulled over for a traffic violation. You’re not admitting your guilt; you’re just letting the system run its course. If you refuse to sign the ticket you can and likely will be arrested. But that still doesn’t mean you’re guilty of a crime.
HebrewToYou on February 12, 2008 at 8:53 PM
I have been arrested. Exactly five times, in fact. Each time for blocking the entrance to an abortion clinic and refusing to move when a police officer said move. Each time I refused, very respectfully (I totally respect police and the law, but asking me to move so a child could be killed was an objectively immoral order), and was, in turn, very respectfully treated by the officer as he took me to jail.
All due respect to you, doriangrey, it seems odd that I should have to establish my credibility to talk about this issue by having been arrested, but you asked, so there you go.
Now here’s what I want to say.
This officer of the law ought to go to jail for assaulting and verbally threatening a child, without sufficient cause, and who posed absolutely no threat to himself.
inviolet on February 12, 2008 at 8:53 PM
And I know 10 times that who would not have.
doriangrey on February 12, 2008 at 8:53 PM
That cop is a petty tyrant who should be fired. Those using the coercive power of state should be held to a higher standard than those who lack that authority.
phronesis on February 12, 2008 at 8:54 PM
Answer my questions, dorian. ‘Yeah, whatever” doesn’t do that. You made the statements, now back them up or concede that they’re inaccurate.
Pablo on February 12, 2008 at 8:55 PM
So you are the reason there are so many frickin’ libs. Just let then cull themselves to non-existance.
/s
TheSitRep on February 12, 2008 at 8:55 PM
You know 1000 punks with badges? That’s really sad.
Pablo on February 12, 2008 at 8:56 PM
Put the crack pipe down and back slowly away from it. Seriously. and where exactly will it be turned into a wrongful arrest> Thats right, in a court of law in front of a judge, but in the mean time your stupid as goes to jail. Furthermore, while signing a ticket is not an admission of guilt, try not showing up and see what happens, again your stupid ass ends up, where? thats right in jail.
doriangrey on February 12, 2008 at 8:57 PM
Sad or not it is what it is.
doriangrey on February 12, 2008 at 8:58 PM
I don’t disagree that this cop is probably a jerk and was probably out of line. But as I said, I tend to side with the cops (not blindly and endlessly) rather than a punk kid giving him attitude and not complying with an order. If the kid hadn’t resisted, the cop would not have had to be as forceful.
Again, I agree he could’ve handled it better. No winners. The cop needs to do better, but shouldn’t be fired based on what I saw. If we keep hounding cops like this, no good people will ever signup to defend my family for fear of lawsuits.
My caveat stands though: it sounded like he was about to threaten the kid with the camers at the end. “Is that camera on? If I find myself on ”
That doesn’t play well to me.
pecan pie on February 12, 2008 at 8:59 PM
We can expect a lot more of this in the near future. Hate crimes will be expanded to Behavior Crimes and Thought Crimes. And the Nanny State growing out of the next presidency, regardless of who’s elected, will come up with a lot of Behavior and Thought Crimes.
BowHuntingTexas on February 12, 2008 at 8:59 PM
I’m sorry, pecan pie. What order was resisted?
Pablo on February 12, 2008 at 9:00 PM
Do me a favor and tell them all to find a job they’re better suited to.
Pablo on February 12, 2008 at 9:00 PM
Classy.
Exactly. Because police officers, unlike this one, have no authority to judge you. They aren’t paid to lecture; they aren’t paid to harass; they aren’t paid to assault; they aren’t paid to batter. They are paid to enforce the law, to protect and serve. This officer did nothing of the sort.
You’re making my point for me. A cop has no authority to issue an illegal order and you have no obligation to adhere to it. You may be temporarily inconvenienced, but as long as YOU follow the law you will be treated fairly.
Bench warrants have nothing to do with this discussion, by the way.
HebrewToYou on February 12, 2008 at 9:01 PM
I agree with you as it happens. My difference with you on this issue is more philosophical than legal. All citizens have the same legal rights obviously. The approach to a (defenseless) child, a Hell’s Angel and an OAP would differ as needs be.
A Hell’s Angel would be approached with extreme caution as he might present a violent threat. Fair enough?
An old man or a child would be approached with less caution. That’s a legalistic definition and is useful but only so far.
In the crux of the situation a fully grown man in practice approaches the child in a disciplinarian fashion if they do not comply with the law.
In practice an OAP is approached with dignity and respect (unless they constitute a real danger) or if senile with due caution and sympathy.
These three scenarios are different but why is this? The law says that these three people – the Hell’s Angel, the child and the OAP – have the same legal rights yet they receive different treatment. The reason is an understanding of human nature and recognition of common sense.
One of the cores aims of liberalism is to promote equality to the extent that it does not recognise any differences between age, gender, race etc. No one in past centuries would have felt the need to legislate in defense of basic common, decent moral assumptions. Indeed the British were so confident of their Constitution that they felt it sufficient to leave it unwritten.
aengus on February 12, 2008 at 9:01 PM
All I see are examples of childish behavior.
The kid acted like a snot and the cop acted like a bully.
Deety on February 12, 2008 at 9:02 PM
OK, you’re just giving a lot of nonresponses at this point. I think it’s safe to say that your theories about what a cop can or can’t do just don’t have the support of legal authority.
NorthernCross on February 12, 2008 at 9:02 PM
I think we should start to worry that there will be fewer and fewer people who will choose a career in law enforcement, when every interaction with the public can be turned into a documentary. But then, I don’t know how long this kid was in the hospital.
Jim Treacher on February 12, 2008 at 9:03 PM
You seem to be suggesting that because the cops have the ability to harass and wrongfully arrest people by virtue of their position that they also have the right to do so. That is absolutely false and if we were to assent to the premise that might makes right we might as well abandon the legal system entirely. I’d argue that it is precisely because the police can abuse their position that they must be held to a higher standard.
phronesis on February 12, 2008 at 9:04 PM
And yet you can charge right in on a 14 year old like he’s your bitch…because you know you’re not in any danger.
Thing is, you’d like to see some sort of crime in action before you do that. Because barring that, you have no business doing it.
Pablo on February 12, 2008 at 9:06 PM
Great post.
HebrewToYou on February 12, 2008 at 9:06 PM
And yet you can charge right in on a 14 year old like he’s your b*tch…because you know you’re not in any danger.
Thing is, you’d like to see some sort of crime in action before you do that. Because barring that, you have no business doing it.
Pablo on February 12, 2008 at 9:07 PM
And in trying to do the impossible Utopian thing they have accomplished the exact opposite of what they intended.
Buy Danish on February 12, 2008 at 9:07 PM
Thing is one of them is a child. And the other should know better.
Pablo on February 12, 2008 at 9:08 PM
Sigh. What is totally obvious to any sentient being is this:
I imagine the reason this was not encoded within the original statement is that no one foresaw a situation where someone would so fail to comprehend or willfully misinterpret the law.
aengus on February 12, 2008 at 9:10 PM
I had two jackass cops arrest me for PI in Corpus Christi, TX I went to them to ask where I could get a taxi cab they said ( very snarkedly) ” right over there. But when I went to get the Taxi which looked more like a Tijuana Taxi some people got in it. So, I went back to the cops and asked if there was a cab stand around, that’s when they said “Oh we’ll give you a ride turn a round” They hauled me to the Nueces county jail where I spent 15 HRS.
Bastages!
TheSitRep on February 12, 2008 at 9:11 PM
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