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Is he in heaven?
—Is he in hell?
That demmed, elusive Pimpernel.
Sir Percy Blakeney

Dashing, but one question on the link – Identity Class – Normal human?

Btw – The Scarlet Pimpernel, a long time favorite of mine.

Yes, I can, and I’m waiting, patiently.

I’m only a woman, but couldn’t help but add this, to preceed your part :)

How the devil do I ever prevail when I’m only a man?
But I’ll never be duped by this scurrilous phantom again
I wasn’t born to walk on water
I wasn’t born to sack and slaughter
But on my soul, I wasn’t born
To stoop, to scorn, and knuckle under
A man can learn to steal some thunder
A man can learn to work some wonder
And when the guantlet’s down,
It’s time to rise and climb the sky
And soon the moon will smoulder
And the winds will drive
Yes, a man grows older but his soul remains alive
All those tremulous stars still glitter
And I will survive!

dominigan and MB4 will help me.

dominigan on January 14, 2008 at 1:04 PM

Both of you stand close by me, because I need you – I’m in agreement with all you write on the RINO topic – just fight for a conservative now so we’re not faced with a RINO later. And don’t even consider a C/O for now. It will not destroy the republic, but it will negatively alter it forever. Plus it makes me very sick. I’ll stand by you too.

Entelechy on January 14, 2008 at 12:52 PM

I’m sorry, I just don’t see that. What makes you honestly think that a RINO wouldn’t embrace socialism? RINO stands for Republican In Name Only… in other words, a Democrat with an (R) after their name. Case in point… I sure haven’t seen any moves by our current administration to really tackle the issues of earmarks, social security and socialized healthcare (Medicare/Medicaid)…

the two of you also underestimate the “damage” a Clinton/Obama will inflict, to the point of no return.

Entelechy on January 14, 2008 at 12:52 PM

No, no, no my little one!!!

The Republic survived 4 years of Jimmy Carter and got Ronald Reagan and 8 years Bill Clinton and got, well didn’t get Ronald Reagan, but survived; it will survive 4 years of Barak Obama or even 4 years of Hillary Rodham Clinton.

However, I think MB4’s point was that the Republic will survive 4 years of a Democrat, so why compromise his principles with a vote more palatable to hypothetical moderate voters?

joewm315 on January 14, 2008 at 8:03 AM

Yes, as I said in MB4 on January 14, 2008 at 12:48 AM

Clinton/Obama neither of whom will destroy the Republic in 4 years

dominigan on January 14, 2008 at 8:25 AM

BINGO!

MB4 on January 14, 2008 at 12:31 PM

While I agree with what dominigan wrote about a RINO, and the party, and what you MB4 agreet to, the two of you also underestimate the “damage” a Clinton/Obama will inflict, to the point of no return. Socialism be embraced. This is an incurable cancer to the world. If we embrace it here, the rest of the world will have no beacon left, no one to criticize any more either…we’ll all be sheep and C/O will still be the wolves.

We should fight for a conservative and against socialism – it’s really the same fight, and the moment is here. We agree, the three of us – I just fear that you two, and others, are too easy on the “let’s give up, vote for C/O, and teach ours a lesson later”. That “later” might be nonrecoverable. The cancer might be too advanced by then. Fight hard now, as I know you are – that’s what the primaries are for.

dominigan on January 14, 2008 at 8:25 AM

BINGO!

I don’t know that any of the other Republican candidates can beat the Billary machine.

Hmmm..I think they were saying the same about Obama’s chances of beating Hillary in Iowa & NH too. That did’nt pan out for the MSMs either, did it?

If you could stay home once, why not twice?

MB4 on January 14, 2008 at 1:45 AM

I’m not the staying-home type on election day, and never have, since I’ve been able to legally vote in this country. Nor do I plan to do so this year. Right now the choices are very muddled. Somehow, I hope that sanity will prevail. However, to your math, I can’t live with myself enabling someone who’s diametrically opposed to everything I stand for/against. I believe they are opposite from most of what you believe/live too.

Bradky on January 14, 2008 at 7:09 AM

Wow, you have it sooooo totally backwards. Obama and Hillary are not going to destroy the republic, but electing a RINO could destroy the Republican party. RINOs are doing incredible harm to the integrity of our party.

When the topic of outlandish earmarks come up, who is mentioned?… a Republican with over a hundred million dollars pushed for a “bridge to nowhere” that would service 50 people.

Who continue to allow illegal immigrants to pour into the country, and refuse to execute the law? Last time I looked, we have a RINO in the Whitehouse.

When we hoped for a real conservative Supreme Court Justice nominee, who did we get at first?… a crony. We had to fight our own President tooth and nail to get a real conservative.

If a RINO becomes the Republican nominee, expect conservative voters to stay home. And since they are a larger and more consistent base than the moderates, expect to lose in November… just like last election period.

So if you want to defeat the Dems in November, you better hope a conservative gets nominated. Not a threat… just a fact.

Conservatives have a longer plan in mind. If a RINO is nominated, many hope that the Dems win. That way, we have a chance to clean house in the Republican party and focus on the next election period. If a RINO wins, we effectively have a Democrat that we have to fight from within. I’m in it for the long haul as a conservative first, and a Republican second.

To paraphrase Scripture for this election period… “What profits you to gain a few moderates, but lose your soul (the conservative base)?”

if you don’t agree with me on all counts you are not a republican – heck you are just a RINO/CINO whom I can’t respect or support.” is driving away moderates in droves

I think we will have to modify our stances on some issues soon.
For example, civil unions/marriage for gays. I don’t feel the federal government has any business defining marriage for all people, and I think a lot of more federalist candidates feel the same way, but try to avoid saying so outright. We’ll have to address things like that, I agree.

However, I think MB4′s point was that the Republic will survive 4 years of a Democrat, so why compromise his principles with a vote more palatable to hypothetical moderate voters?

Bradky on January 14, 2008 at 7:09 AM

Actually it’s all about the electoral college. Bill Clinton did not receive anything close to a majority (vote split by Perot), and Bush did not receive a popular vote majority first time around.

Anyhoo, re Hillary/Obama – destroying our economy, expanding entitlements, and not effectively pursuing the W.O.T. could do lasting, irreparable damage to this nation.

“While still married to Carol, McCain began an adulterous relationship with Cindy. He married Cindy in May 1980 – just a month after dumping his crippled wife and securing a divorce.”

Abortion:

John McCain Supports Embryonic Stem Cell Research (Audio)
McCain Softens Abortion Stand (The Washington Post)

“But certainly in the short term, or even the long term, I would not support repeal of Roe v. Wade, which would then force X number of women in America to [undergo] illegal and dangerous operations.“ – John McCain

Fiscal Record:

McCain Boasts That He Voted Against The Bush Tax Cuts (Video)
McCain Would Vote Against Tax Cuts Again (The Club for Growth)

- McCain sponsored and voted for an enormous 282% tax increase on cigarettes in 1998
- McCain was one of only two Republican senators to oppose the 2001 tax cuts
- McCain was one of only three Republican senators to oppose the 2003 reductions
- McCain supported an amendment sponsored by Senator Russ Feingold (D-WI) against full repeal of the Death Tax
- McCain voted against repealing the Death Tax in 2002

Foreign Policy:

McCain to Close Gitmo: “The first day I am President” (Video)

Global Warming:

McCain and Lieberman Push for New Anti-Global Warming Legislation (The National Center for Public Policy Research)
Senators McCain and Lieberman Propose Energy Tax (The National Center for Public Policy Research)

Illegal Immigration:

John McCain gets a ‘D’ on his Immigration Voting Report Card (Americans for Better Immigration)
John McCain Praises Pro-illegal Protests (NewsMax)

Veterans:

McCain Can’t Buy His Way Out of Votes Against Funding for Veterans

- McCain Voted Against $19 Billion for Military Hospitals
- McCain Voted Against Amendment to Provide $2.8 Billion For Veterans’ Medical Care
- McCain Voted Against 2005 Amendment to Provide Guaranteed Funding Stream for Veterans’ Health Care
- McCain Voted Against Establishing $1 Billion Trust Fund to Provide Improvements to Military and Veterans’ Health Facilities
- McCain Voted Against Adding $1.5 billion to Veterans’ Medical Services in FY 2007 by Closing Corporate Tax Loopholes
- McCain Voted Against Mandatory Funding of $6.9 Billion in FY 2007 and $104 Billion Over Five Years for Veterans’ Health Care

I’m struggling to believe some of the imbeciles who say they will vote for any whackjob just because he has an R after his name rather than Clinton/Obama neither of whom will destroy the Republic in 4 years and may help to pave the way for a real Republican.MB4 on January 14, 2008 at 12:48 AM

You are being overly dramatic. Obama and Hillary are not going to destroy the republic. They may pass tax increases and some social policies you don’t like but first they must be elected by a majority, which is what our democracy is all about.
Secondly, this idea of a “real republican” is what is going to make the party lose for years to come. The base has come to a juncture in which the idea is that “I am a conservative , if you don’t agree with me on all counts you are not a republican – heck you are just a RINO/CINO whom I can’t respect or support.” is driving away moderates in droves.

Have fun with that strategy.

Conservatives have become the new RINOs.

Where so we go?