Video: Luntz focus group’s verdict? Monster win for … Fred!
posted at 11:07 pm on January 10, 2008 by Allahpundit
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He needed a home run. He got it. More thoughts in a minute.
Update: Here’s his much-lauded immigration answer. Wrap-up coming up in another update.
Update: So who won? Dean Barnett e-mails to say Huckabee. He’s so effortless, and his answers on Israel and Christian marriage must have scored huge with evangelicals. I think he and Thompson did the best, McCain didn’t hurt himself, and Romney and especially Rudy were borderline disastrous. Mitt was barely on the stage; as for Giuliani, says the boss, “Am I the only one not listening to Rudy anymore?” Nope. Same points, over and over and over, since day one of the campaign. Unless he somehow ends up as the lone alternative to Huckabee in Florida on the 29th, I think he’s finished.
Verdict: McCain wins, for exactly the reason I gave here. Michael Graham sees it too.
Update: Geraghty’s already mapping out a Thompson victory in South Carolina and the road after. I won’t pee in the Fredheads’ Cheerios, but suffice it to say I’m not staying up late to game out a Thompson/whoever showdown on Super Tuesday.
Update: A “major endorsement” coming for Fred tomorrow? Gov. Mark Sanford would be a huge coup.
Update: A second focus group segment airing on Fox right now has people applauding Fred but saying … it’s too late.
Update: The boss sees it, too. “He doesn’t have the intestinal fortitude to go after John McCain.”
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Please vote for the republican candidate that you like the least.
Mcguyver on January 10, 2008 at 11:09 PM
yeah…my wife was really impressed with ‘ol Fred tonight
jediwebdude on January 10, 2008 at 11:10 PM
No doubt… I probably only watched 20% (at most), but I did see Fred waste Huck, and I think that was really all he needed. It’ll be interesting to see what happens… especially if Fred! wins. What if he wins, then Mitt wins Michigan? Weird.
RightWinged on January 10, 2008 at 11:10 PM
I think we’re putting too much stock in these debates. Especially this late in the game. Romney had a great debate Sunday and McCain beat him 2 days later.
froghat on January 10, 2008 at 11:10 PM
Well this is a buzz kill. If this explains why Fred didn’t go after McCain…then I quit.
Weight of Glory on January 10, 2008 at 11:10 PM
Go Fred!
Clinton Happens on January 10, 2008 at 11:11 PM
I just hope this translates into actual Fred votes in South Carolina…
JetBoy on January 10, 2008 at 11:11 PM
I on the other hand am still undecided…none of the Republican candidates are wowing me. Fred was okay.
So Ron Paul thinks Israel is a step-child…interesting.
jediwebdude on January 10, 2008 at 11:11 PM
Fred’s counts at 8:30pm CT:
$528,614 (5,851 new friends)
At 10:00pm CT:
546,747 (6,058)
Dif: $18,133 (207)
yo on January 10, 2008 at 11:12 PM
If that is the case then Fred’s “clear conservative choice” rhetoric is just rhetoric, given his only goal is to hand the nomination to Maverick.
BKennedy on January 10, 2008 at 11:13 PM
I thought Fred and Ron Paul were the only two on the stage that seemed to speak from conviction. All the others sounded canned. Ron Paul is a crank, but he communicates. Mitt was weak tonight, unfortunately.
I hope this jump starts Fred’s campaign…
Priscilla on January 10, 2008 at 11:13 PM
Fredmentum starts tonight.
BrianBoru on January 10, 2008 at 11:13 PM
I’m inclined to think it may be true. I’d really, really hate to think ole Fred has been the stalking horse for his good Senate buddy.
a capella on January 10, 2008 at 11:14 PM
Winner: Fred
Loser: Ron Paul
Yep. Knew both, all along.
IrishEyes on January 10, 2008 at 11:14 PM
I’m holding my breath, because I know that is just one mans speculation. But when it came down to the last 8 mins of the debate and it was about immigration, I really thought he was going to hit McCain hard. But he didn’t, and once again John wasn’t challenged, not only on what the bill was about, but HOW he helped bring it about.
Weight of Glory on January 10, 2008 at 11:16 PM
That makes absolutely no sense. He’s really running to get McCain elected…Lowry goes off in the weeds every once in a while and I think he’s out there now.
AUINSC on January 10, 2008 at 11:16 PM
I have this vision of the movie “The Natural”, aging star who’s right right guy…
It’s High….It’s far…..It’s OUTTA HERE!!!!
HarryStar on January 10, 2008 at 11:16 PM
I like that repeated post the least :/
Flippant describes my view of Fred tonight. Too flippant.
lorien1973 on January 10, 2008 at 11:17 PM
Fred Thompson is only running to get McCain elected! His plan first started when he wired WTC 7 with explosives…
frankj on January 10, 2008 at 11:18 PM
That was beautiful. If you agree, donate here
John_Locke on January 10, 2008 at 11:18 PM
As far as the buzz kill goes, we don’t even know who said that. Remember psy ops and wrecking momentum is part of the political game.
INC on January 10, 2008 at 11:18 PM
I hold that to be just as much of a possibility, and that would be the preferable scenario.
Weight of Glory on January 10, 2008 at 11:19 PM
Fred gives facts, programs, and he is “not exciting”.
Fred “comes out of the shadows” and he is “going negative”.
Some people are never satisfied.
I guess the focus groupies who thought he finally was giving facts have not been listening all along.
IrishEyes on January 10, 2008 at 11:19 PM
Fred is in it to win it…just more blather to keep Fred from getting the nomination.
ihasurnominashun on January 10, 2008 at 11:19 PM
shhh … dude .. zip it.
yo on January 10, 2008 at 11:19 PM
AP, please tell me you got hard drive on Huckabee’s meltdown in the spin room.
steveegg on January 10, 2008 at 11:19 PM
Does it even matter? Romney was the big winner the night before the NH primary and it didn’t make a dent.
I hope that it does make an impact. Mitt may be my #1 candidate, but Fred is not far behind him.
krabbas on January 10, 2008 at 11:20 PM
And no longer will I be ridiculed as a slacker, or lacking fire in this very belly of mine, while carrying around my uber-spiffy, acrylic, Fred ‘08 coffee mug.
…It’s the height of political rebellion/fashion in New York these days, and you too can get one for your own not-lacking-fire-in-belly self:
Fred’s Uber-Spiffy piece ‘o java utility device.
MAN did we need this. Oy.
ChipDWood on January 10, 2008 at 11:20 PM
Go Fred.
Griz on January 10, 2008 at 11:20 PM
That “buzz kill” is pure speculation by some dude with too much time on his hands!
SouthernGent on January 10, 2008 at 11:21 PM
It seemed as if Fred got a lot more airtime at tonights debate, compared to the previous. That’s probably why he did so much better also. The previous debates he was treated as a 2nd or 3rd tiered candidate. He needs more encores in future debates.
roninacreage on January 10, 2008 at 11:21 PM
The fracturing of the party continues. While I think Fred did win this debate, what would his winning South Carolina mean?
I guess we will pick our nominee on February 5th.
joncoltonis on January 10, 2008 at 11:24 PM
Why do you guys think these debates are important? Most people have tuned out these debates now because there’s no damn many. Fred did well, but it’s just too late. As the previous poster said, Romney did well Sunday and lost two days later in NH. Fred is going nowhere, sorry to say.
froghat on January 10, 2008 at 11:24 PM
Luntz’s group (some of them) said too late. That’s crazy. If good is good, then wtf? But still, it is what it is.
Spirit of 1776 on January 10, 2008 at 11:26 PM
Fred brought it tonight. A comeback is building. I’m headed to South Carolina to help the cause. Fred Heads everywhere should do the same, or go online to donate for Phone for Fred. Despite what Allah & the MSM would love to believe, Fred is still in this, but he needs our help.
The Republican party needs our help. Our country needs our help. Rally behind the only TRUE conservative….FRED!!
bigred on January 10, 2008 at 11:27 PM
I think its safe to say that Huckabee won’t win MN if he’s the candidate though. Making a talking point out of people dying. Not very nice.
lorien1973 on January 10, 2008 at 11:27 PM
I’m okay with all of them staying in and picking our candidate at the convention. For once, we Texans would get to choose from among ALL the candidates and not just the leftovers after a bunch of small liberal states have killed off most of the best ones. That would be a novel experience for me.
aero on January 10, 2008 at 11:27 PM
That ditz in the front row……….
WTF???
Talon on January 10, 2008 at 11:28 PM
Or christian; for that matter.
lorien1973 on January 10, 2008 at 11:28 PM
Memo to my home state voters: Iowa and NH are but 2 states…dont guy the media hype!
SouthernGent on January 10, 2008 at 11:28 PM
I’m glad they went back to expand on these criticisms on Fred. Now he can address them face on. Which if he does, maybe he can win some of those over.
Spirit of 1776 on January 10, 2008 at 11:29 PM
Mine too, although she resonated with the Huckster on his Israel diatribe - felt he was launched on weakly by Carlson & slapped him back. Can’t disagree, but I fell Fred was the big winner.
peski on January 10, 2008 at 11:29 PM
Talon, would you like it if I called your wife a ditz? How bout dem apples?
froghat on January 10, 2008 at 11:29 PM
Let me repeat:
Fred would clearly be the best President.
If everyone will just vote based on the above criteria (if not my judgment), Fred has a very good chance to pull it off.
peski on January 10, 2008 at 11:22 PM
peski on January 10, 2008 at 11:30 PM
Ugh, that one lady in the front row who claimed Fred hasn’t been consistent doesn’t know what she’s talking about. If she’s going to say that, tell us why and show us where he hasn’t been consistent. They shouldn’t let these people make empty claims without backing them up.
paultevis on January 10, 2008 at 11:31 PM
Excellent performance from Thompson! So cathartic to see him shoving Huckabee around.
Beatnik Joe on January 10, 2008 at 11:31 PM
McCain/Giuliani 2008.
awake on January 10, 2008 at 11:31 PM
AP, is there some reason that you have to use the most vulgar language to discuss anything dealing with Fred? Stop already. Most of us treat your opinions with respect. Please reciprocate and stop with the yellow jadedism. ;-)
Tennman on January 10, 2008 at 11:31 PM
More from The Corner (Peter is in Fred’s Corner):
INC on January 10, 2008 at 11:32 PM
Wow. “Fred was a little flippant. I want a serious candidate.”
Fred. Cannot. Win.
joewm315 on January 10, 2008 at 11:32 PM
I have to tell you, Fred has become the “Ralph Nader” of the ‘08 republican primaries..
He’s is spoiling and thinning the pub vote and could throw the nom to McSchamnesty.
Mcguyver on January 10, 2008 at 11:33 PM
Suxs that this is even believable. Which it is :(
Spirit of 1776 on January 10, 2008 at 11:33 PM
He went after Mccain and huck on immigration. what the hell are you talking about. He named both by name. He linked Mccain to shamnesty, Huck to instate tution, he also got a jab in to Rudy for sancatury cities. It was a subtle dig to remind SC who started shamnesty. Are city slickers too dumb to a get southern dig?
unseen on January 10, 2008 at 11:33 PM
South Carolina voter here. I am a strong supporter for Senator Thompson! I watched the debate and thought Fred won hands down. I especially liked his Huckabee smackdown. I think McCain has a lot of support in my area of South Carolina, but thats not saying much they keep voting Spratt in the house. Would like to note that the only signs I have seen along the roadside in my town and the surrounding ones is Ron Paul. Except of course the Fred signs at my house and my dad’s.
SCGOPgirl on January 10, 2008 at 11:33 PM
What fracturing? It’s called debate. If there any “fracturing” it’s from the DemoGogue in Chief, Huckupchuck.
peski on January 10, 2008 at 11:34 PM
Fred did “bring it” tonight. But why didn’t he “bring it” every night? If he did this from day one, he’d be in much better shape. Fred is still several laps behind in this race and needs the others to crash or have some serious pit row trouble.
roninacreage on January 10, 2008 at 11:34 PM
Its not too late!
doubleplusundead on January 10, 2008 at 11:36 PM
People, lets be real. Fred will be gone in a few weeks. One debate isn’t gonna change the fact that he has run a horrible campaign.
froghat on January 10, 2008 at 11:36 PM
“I think its safe to say that Huckabee won’t win MN if he’s the candidate though. Making a talking point out of people dying. Not very nice.”
Plus the convention is in Minnesota and Huck goes out of his way to piss them off, this guy’s to stupid to be President.
lowandslow on January 10, 2008 at 11:37 PM
Does he? Was he in Knute Rockne too? And I bet his favorite candy is jellybeans!
I’m personally offended by anyone trying to pass him off for Reagan. He isn’t Reagan. He never will be. Just because one is an actor and a conservative does not mean he is the new Ronald Reagan.
Were that true, we could run Kelsey Grammer for President.
Hey, now that you mention it…
emailnuevo on January 10, 2008 at 11:37 PM
What is entertaining is Fred’s frequent slams on the media trusting the polls. Even tonight he got in a zinger.
jediwebdude on January 10, 2008 at 11:38 PM
froghat on January 10, 2008 at 11:36 PM
There is a long road to go and anyone that thinks they know what is going to happen go ask Barrack what that’s like.
unseen on January 10, 2008 at 11:38 PM
Well you see, that would have been caving into soundbite culture. Fred is the clear conservative choice. He doesn’t need to do tricks for the media, all Fred needs to be is Fred!
Or at least, that’s what the Fredheads were saying yesterday.
BKennedy on January 10, 2008 at 11:38 PM
I think he’s won the past two debates, not just tonight. So, doesn’t that rather mean he’s on a roll?
Darksean on January 10, 2008 at 11:39 PM
Too late? This is the fourth state out of fifty! Some of us still have a couple of months to think about this. WTF?!
aero on January 10, 2008 at 11:39 PM
Fred.Never.Loses.
TexasDan on January 10, 2008 at 11:39 PM
But is his competition in SC really John McCain or Huckabee? If it is Huckabee, there is no reason to go after McCain and get McCain all riled up just yet.
bnelson44 on January 10, 2008 at 11:39 PM
Thank you. Don’t listen to the trolls. Debate, discourse and disagreement, yes. But Fred has has shot and would be the best President based on the choice we have today. So if you believe that, vote for him. If you don’t, vote for who you think is the best man.
Screw all the playmakers.
peski on January 10, 2008 at 11:39 PM
“Yet”? The election’s in nine days. This was his last chance on a huge stage to hit him.
Allahpundit on January 10, 2008 at 11:40 PM
Yes, he drove around in a bus in Iowa for a monty to push McCain to forth place to help McCain in NH and then he’s riding around in a bus in SC for a couple weeks to to beat McCain in SC. He steals McCain’s thunder during the debate and makes him look like the poser he is just to help him to get elected. Yeah, that makes sense.
michele on January 10, 2008 at 11:40 PM
Woohoo, go Fred! I knew his time to shine in the debates was coming. :D
Afterimage on January 10, 2008 at 11:41 PM
C’mon, AP, tell me Fred wouldn’t be the best President. Tell me who would. C’mon, come clean.
peski on January 10, 2008 at 11:42 PM
Back, back, back, back, back Fred goes yard…
d1carter on January 10, 2008 at 11:42 PM
here is my choice:
1. thompson
2. rudy
3. romney
4. mccain
5. Ronpaul (ewww)
6. dennis kusinich
7. huckabee
GO FRED (please)
custer on January 10, 2008 at 11:42 PM
You people are ridiculous. He takes out Huck and we’ll get McCain? Screw you. He didn’t win in 2000, he ain’t gonna win now. All the “true” conservatives were talking Mitt this, Mitt that with his coffers and Fred struggling with the cash flow. Now APs all about one little debate and McCain is gonna win? Real Conservatives are gonna vote for the leader of the Gang of 13 and promoter of Shamnesty if Mitt has to exit due to his lackluster performance? No matter what you ARE ALWAYS pissing in the Fredheads cereal. And you love every minute of it too…
Sultry Beauty on January 10, 2008 at 11:42 PM
Michelle Malkin is what’s wrong with the Republican talking heads. They think they have everything figured out and tell people who is right and who is wrong. Hey Michelle, if immigration was such a big deal, why was it listed as #4 in NH and why are McCain and Huck polling well in California and other border states? Pundits can kiss my butt!
froghat on January 10, 2008 at 11:43 PM
Allah its dangerous though, McCain has a lot of military supporters down in SC. Fred had to be careful, going full bore after may have backfired.
broker1 on January 10, 2008 at 11:43 PM
SC is in 9 days. But Huckabee is his competition in SC, not McCain. McCain is only showing well now because he is the default candidate. You can beat a default canditate on positive points, you don’t have to go negative on him. If Thompson beats McCain in SC, then he can aim for Feb 5th and there will be time to attack McCain then.
If Fred doesn’t win SC, it doesn’t matter anyway.
bnelson44 on January 10, 2008 at 11:43 PM
I don’t think it’s fortitude, he just doesn’t have the desire. That’s the problem. Always too cozy with Mac - personally and personally.
Spirit of 1776 on January 10, 2008 at 11:43 PM
er, personally and politically:)
Spirit of 1776 on January 10, 2008 at 11:44 PM
Oh, I’m a die-hard Fredhead. I just found it hilarious that he would be criticized as too flighty…. after being the too-boring, issues oriented geezer to all the amateur kingmakers in the MSM.
joewm315 on January 10, 2008 at 11:44 PM
That is what I’m holding on to. I’m thinking that, in order to strike a balance between being aggressive and coming across as the bitter old man, he has to pick his battles judiciously. Since McCain lost the SC vote in 2000, primarily due to the evangelical base, Fred must see Huck as his primary target. Thus by going soft on McCain, he is not over aggressive, while still hitting the guy who has been polling at the top nearly everywhere else. All this assumes much…but if it weren’t for assumptions there wouldn’t be blogs!
Weight of Glory on January 10, 2008 at 11:45 PM
Had to step out for an errand to keep the wife
happy,so Freds the man,excellent,I like the more
aggressive,a little louder Fred.
canopfor on January 10, 2008 at 11:45 PM
That’s a comment when one is searching for a handy criticism and there really is not one.
MoCoM on January 10, 2008 at 11:45 PM
New Hampshire? Are you serious? Some of us live with the problem of illegal immigration. New Hampshire is a long ways away from the action on that issue, of course they don’t care.
But I generally agree about pundits. They gameplan too much instead of supporting the guy they agree with the most.
joewm315 on January 10, 2008 at 11:46 PM
Allah:
Have you been watching KP on Fox’s Post Debate? Whadayathink?
d1carter on January 10, 2008 at 11:46 PM
I don’t include MM in the list ;)
/pander
joewm315 on January 10, 2008 at 11:46 PM
Fred doesn’t do too well with women voters because he doesn’t emote very much. That is a weakness, especially going up against someone like Hillary. I’m afraid he would be a week general election candidate because of that. He would do better against Obama.
bnelson44 on January 10, 2008 at 11:47 PM
If this debate is followed with an NRA endorcement tomorrow (to connect threads here) Fred’s really in the running to take SC.
P. James Moriarty on January 10, 2008 at 11:47 PM
Dude, an NRA endorsement would kick eight kinds of ass.
doubleplusundead on January 10, 2008 at 11:48 PM
I was quoting the lady in the video. I am a Fredhead.
Wow, after taking verbal beatings for my Fredlove for weeks I’m now having to defend my ‘Head bona fides. Perhaps the tide is turning?
Get on quick, bandwagon jumpers.
joewm315 on January 10, 2008 at 11:48 PM
This focus group keeps saying “waa, it’s too late” for Fred. Uh, not if you vote for him. That’s kinda the point!
someguy on January 10, 2008 at 11:48 PM
As shallow as this sounds, I think his wife softens that image quite a bit.
Weight of Glory on January 10, 2008 at 11:49 PM
Fred’s IT folk need to figure out that whole “capacity planning” thing.
Now he’s throwing runtime errors.
Interesting error to throw.
yo on January 10, 2008 at 11:50 PM
Allahpundit on January 10, 2008 at 11:40 PM
Chalk it up to your city slicker mindset. Fred did hit McCain in a sountern way in a southern state, SC is not NYC. We do things differently down here. Try to think outside your own little world. The SC voters in the after debate poll “got it”. You don’t seem to grasp southern nuance.
unseen on January 10, 2008 at 11:50 PM
Fredheads Unite!
Well, maybe not, sounds kinda commie. But seriously, we all get there different ways (I dare you to start an atheist bashing post) but Fred is the guy. If we don’t nominate him we’re picking the second best, or worse. Not a disaster, but not the best man for the job.
And AP, I still love and admire you, but if you can’t tell me why Fred is not the best choice for Prez, then give it a rest (dreaming).
peski on January 10, 2008 at 11:50 PM
So, the isue is low on liberal NH’s list, and the free-ride candidates are doing well in CALIFORNIA and the border states, where large numbers of illegal immigrants live (and can thus influence opinion)?
That’s your argument?
Let’s break it down: liberal states are naturally socially permissive and don’t give a d— about the federal government. Remember, “live free or die” is about anti-government, though in practice it’s more like “…just live.”
California, that bastion of conservative thought, of course has its liberal Republicans (remember Linda Chavez calling the anti-shamnesty guys “racist” and people who “just don’t like hispanics”?). The border states also have huge influxes of Hispanic immigrants that skew the system. Not to mention, Huckabee manages to fool whatever Christians are around in those states into thinking he’s the savior of the party - because he’s devious, cunning, and has to be stopped, by Mitt or Fred or even McCain.
Securing the border falls under “national security.” If the GOP doesn’t stand for that, seeing how it’s being sorta lenient about small government and anti-abortion, then our party’s over. Send in the clowns (don’t bother, they’re here).
To Michelle Malkin: Forgive him.
emailnuevo on January 10, 2008 at 11:51 PM
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