Study: Prejudice against Mormons much more intense than against blacks, women; Update: New Globe piece on Mitt’s illegal landscapers
posted at 6:18 pm on December 4, 2007 by Allahpundit
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Pathetic. I hope he knocks it out of the park on Thursday night.
Key findings of the study include:
# Bias against Mormons is significantly more intense among the public compared to bias against women and blacks. The bias against Mormons is even more pronounced among conservative Evangelicals. Their bias against Mormons rivals their bias against atheists.
# Only about half the nation claims to even know a Mormon or to know that Romney is Mormon.
# The extent of the bias against Romney is moderated if the individual already knows that he is Mormon. That information seems to demystify the Mormon religion, making people more tolerant of the religion. Those who do not know Romney is Mormon exhibit much greater bias upon learning of his religion.
That last bullet point suggests a certain wisdom to giving the speech, but note well from elsewhere in the release: “[S]imple appeals for religious tolerance do not win over support for Romney from the respondents.” As feared.
In other news, he just launched a depth charge on a scandal that was creeping up silently behind him.
Update: Here’s that scandal in the making he just torpedoed.
Despite a Globe story in Dec. 2006 that highlighted Romney’s use of illegal immigrants to tend to his lawn, Romney continued to employ the same landscaping company – until today. The landscaping company, in turn, continued to employ illegal immigrants.
Two of the workers confirmed in separate interviews with Globe reporters last week that they were in the country without documents. One said he had paid $7,000 to a smuggler to escort him across the desert into Arizona; the other said he had come to the country with a student visa that was now expired. Both were seen on the lawn by either Globe reporters or photographers over the last two months.
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everyone is a victim… oh no! whatever will we do?
anyone here care to tell me how many lifeforms have gone extinct in the history of the world? life is not fair.
it’s rough all over, people should get over themselves and get to the business at hand. Terrorism, Oppression, Famine, Education… and of course whether or not Brittney is prego… anyone?
I finally know why people commit suicide, “they figure out that the world is full of idiots and not only do they insist on telling you about it, they insist on proving it to you.”
Kaptain Amerika on December 4, 2007 at 7:51 PM
I didn’t know that. You learn something every day. I always wondered what the difference was, but didn’t care enough to find out. Thanks!
jaime on December 4, 2007 at 7:52 PM
LOL. I don’t get it, but it sounds funny. I have a pretty good friend who’s Mormon, but he never said anything about his underwear.
jaime on December 4, 2007 at 7:56 PM
Naw.
Utah’s divorce rate and rate of family violence is above the national average.
bnelson44 on December 4, 2007 at 8:00 PM
I didn’t know that. You learn something every day. I always wondered what the difference was, but didn’t care enough to find out. Thanks!
jaime on December 4, 2007 at 7:52 PM
No one expects a Catholic to know anything about the Bible. So it did Guiliani no harm.
bnelson44 on December 4, 2007 at 8:01 PM
I’ve read over that Catholic.com link bnelson gave. Is it too much to ask that my church’s beliefs be even remotely described accurately? Or some logic used at all by the “certified as accurate” page?
Vanceone on December 4, 2007 at 8:02 PM
The Sunnis and Shiites are both Muslims and they know it. Mormons are not Christians, and the other Christian Churches know it.
The differences between what the Mormons believe and what Christianity believes is fundamental, it isn’t a minor difference. The two faiths are as different as Hinduism and Christianity.
bnelson44 on December 4, 2007 at 8:05 PM
Blech…this anti-Mormon crap is really depressing, and keeps getting moreso, honestly, I find it really embarrassing.
Bad Candy on December 4, 2007 at 8:09 PM
I don’t think we want to go into a debate of Mormonism vs Christianity here. Let’s just leave it at the fact that the more people unwrap what the LDS believe the more alien it sounds to a Christian. That is why Mitt won’t and shouldn’t go there.
bnelson44 on December 4, 2007 at 8:12 PM
Then tell Mitt not to make the speech. He is the one who is making this a political topic this week.
bnelson44 on December 4, 2007 at 8:13 PM
Then why don’t Evangelicals spend more time attacking Sunnis and spend less time attacking Mormons?
MB4 on December 4, 2007 at 8:15 PM
Honestly, I know Mormonism works for a lot of people, and that’s the reason I’m so baffled by this potent dislike of it.
It works for you guys, its not violent or subversive, I couldn’t do it, I’m a caffeine junkie and I enjoy a good drink and cigar now and then(good thing I’m Catholic), but lots of people like it and it makes them happy, and I’m happy for them.
Bad Candy on December 4, 2007 at 8:17 PM
The Evangelicals have made it a political topic, big time, and Mitt is just going to fight back some now.
MB4 on December 4, 2007 at 8:18 PM
Who said Evangelicals attack Mormons? There are just a bunch of them that won’t vote for one. That is a real issue for Mitt, and that is why he is making the speech.
bnelson44 on December 4, 2007 at 8:19 PM
Your link very clearly states a list of “NON-CATHOLIC GROUPS” not “non-Christian”, so im not even sure what the list means. Do Catholics have an official list of which Protestant groups have tinkered to much with core doctrine and are no longer Christian? I’m not aware of it. Even if there is, it would be amzaing to me that protestants and evangelicals would go along with the Catholic Church having the authority to declare which among them were legitimate.
I’m not using it to prove anything about Mormonism itself but just to demonstrate the futility of claiming the right to discern which among all those listed are ‘valid’. If I want to learn about Mormonism I will ask a Mormon, not arrogant Evangelicals who claim to know more about Mormonism then Mormons.
Resolute on December 4, 2007 at 8:19 PM
The Osmonds. Got to be the Osmonds.
Slublog on December 4, 2007 at 8:19 PM
I just think it will backfire is all.
bnelson44 on December 4, 2007 at 8:20 PM
Bullcrap. A major cause of his sinking numbers is because evangelicals don’t want to vote for a “cultist”. He has to address it, this problem needs to be addressed now. This irrational disgust towards Mormons is unacceptable, particularly in a place of minimal relevance like a presidential campaign.
Bad Candy on December 4, 2007 at 8:21 PM
I think that Mitt has turned the “other cheek” enough.
I think that he will still remain classy though in his response.
MB4 on December 4, 2007 at 8:21 PM
Yeah, that’s what I’ve always thought. I went to Catholic school for 12 years and I don’t recall ever comparing “our” bible to anyone else’s bible. They made us study a thing called catechism in the lower grades. The meaning of certain bible passages in high school. The only comment I remember hearing about other religions was in 6th grade. “A person doesn’t have to be Catholic to go to heaven”. That’s it.
jaime on December 4, 2007 at 8:23 PM
I rest my case.
MB4 on December 4, 2007 at 8:23 PM
Look at the page again, there are 3 subgroups in the page:
Near Catholic, Christian and Non-Christian. The LDS church is under non-Christian.
The Mormons from the outside look like any other Christian sect because the honor Christ as someone special. However, when you delve into the religion they it is a theology which has very little resemblance to Christianity.
bnelson44 on December 4, 2007 at 8:26 PM
bnelson: That link to that pdf is about what I expected: A long list of long since answered attacks on the LDS church. I myself have answered many of those, and if the authors had any sense of honesty in them at all, they would acknowledge that much of that document is either inaccurate or a non-issue.
Since they don’t, I have to question their honesty. A lie in furtherance of some “higher truth” is not good.
Tell me, bnelson: if we are not Christian, then whom do we worship? We pray to our Heavenly Father in the name of Christ–to whom, exactly, am I praying? Are you going to tell me I’m worshiping the devil now? Is the devil answering my prayers? Let’s see you put your money where your mouth is–if the LDS church is not following Christ, as you contend, then who are we worshipping?
Vanceone on December 4, 2007 at 8:31 PM
Those who do not know Romney is Mormon exhibit much greater bias upon learning of his religion.
My question is where did they find anyone who is that out of touch? Were they polling in Zimbabwe rather than the USA?
Purple Avenger on December 4, 2007 at 8:36 PM
Yeah…me too. This is so depressing.
Hail Xenu!
Bad Candy on December 4, 2007 at 8:39 PM
My understanding is you worship God who was a man like you and I before he became God and who now lives on a planet with his many wives, one of whom is Mary and you worship God in the name of one of his many physically sexually begotten sons, Jesus. You believe that if you live under the guidance of the LDS Church men will become a gods themselves, live with many wives, have many children and also be worshiped.
By the way the Catholic Church has ruled that Mormon baptism is not valid, which means that Mormons are not Christians by baptism.
You sure you really want to go there?
bnelson44 on December 4, 2007 at 8:46 PM
Yeah, I know. But that is basically what all these evangelicals have to decide: If the Mormon church isn’t Christian (as they contend) then what are we? I was baptized in the name of the Father, the Son and the Holy Ghost. I pray to the Father in Christ’s name. I try to follow Christ’s commandments. I do my best to repent and take advantage of Christ’s atonement, so I can live with Him in the next life. We use the Bible. We teach that Christ suffered for our sins and died, was buried and rose the third day as the firstfruits. We teach that Christ is divine, and always has been.
Now, if that isn’t Christianity, as so many on this board claim, then what is it? Am I worshiping the devil? Because that sounds a ton like being a Christian to me, and I regard myself as one. And just what authority does some evangelical have to officially declare that I’m not a follower of Christ?
This whole argument is absurd. We are not Nicean Christians, yes, but we are Christians. And none of this has any bearing on whether someone LDS would make a good president.
Vanceone on December 4, 2007 at 8:52 PM
You also deny the Trinity which is a fundamental tennat of Christianity.
Well, Mitt is bringing it up on Thursday which I think is a fundamental mistake.
bnelson44 on December 4, 2007 at 8:56 PM
Bnelson: so I’m not a Christian, eh? When I say that Christ is my Savior, I’m wrong? His Grace is not enough for my sins, is that your contention? I’m just exploring the ramifications of your beliefs here.
See, as I understand it, Evangelicals state that all you have to do to be saved is confess that Christ is your personal Savior. But it appears that that is not enough, you must accept the doctrines of the Nicean council to be saved now. Because I accept Christ as my personal savior, and yet I’m not allowed to be a Christian.
So if one must accept the doctrines of the Council of Nicea to be saved, then what OTHER doctines of various councils are necessary? And how do Evangelicals know that they aren’t afoul of those (apparently necessary for salvation) church councils?
Vanceone on December 4, 2007 at 8:57 PM
One man’s hokum … is another man’s FAITH. It’s not facts – it’s supernatural beliefs, guys (and girls). Why waste time arguing over comparitive un-provable supernatural beliefs??
I wonder if those who have ‘hokum’ concerns had similar concerns when (if) you voted in 1960, when JFK believed, as his church taught, in weekly and routine transmutation. He seemed to survive his ‘hokum’ OK. Didn’t seem to affect the way he lowered taxes.
How about we examine relevant credentials – like why Romney took over a year, and only then with prodding from reporters, to solve his own illegal immigration problem.
30 days with no reminders – fine. 12 months of inattention, not good.
fred5678 on December 4, 2007 at 8:57 PM
You need to understand that Christians don’t consider your faith a Christian faith. There are simply too many fundamental differences between your faith and Christianity. This is not the place to argue that point. It is what it is. If Mitt turns this race into a debate on whether Mormonism is Christian, he will lose the race. I think he knows that. At least I hope he does.
bnelson44 on December 4, 2007 at 9:00 PM
IMHO, Kennedy had a different issue. The Catholics were not in an organized “mission” lasting many generations, trying to evangelize all the protestants in the US. Kennedy’s issue was that people were afraid that the Pope would have influence on governmental affairs. I don’t think many are worried that the Profit of the Mormon Church will have influence over Mitt’s running the Oval Office.
bnelson44 on December 4, 2007 at 9:05 PM
Temple garments.
Valiant on December 4, 2007 at 9:11 PM
If you look into your own heart, and you find nothing wrong there, what is there to worry about? What is there to fear?
- Confucius
MB4 on December 4, 2007 at 9:11 PM
I understand you guys attempt to claim that Christ is not sufficient for us, yes. I’m just pointing out to you that we most assuredly define ourselves as Christians. Yet you try to deny us the benefits of Christ’s atonement. Don’t try to sugarcoat it, man.
And it’s not Mitt who’s dragging his faith into this race–it is you evangelicals who are preaching that while a Hindu or a Jew is fine, a Mormon is unqualified to be in office, because it might promote the LDS church. I.e. Mitt’s faith makes him unelectable because it might help to “legitimize” the LDS church, which for whatever reason scares the living daylights out of the Evangelical community.
If Leiberman was running, would he have to do a speech on Judaism? Not at all. No one’s claiming Rudy’s Catholicism matters. But you Evangelicals cannot stand the thought that someone who’s LDS might legitimize my faith. What better definition of religious prejudice can you find? A priori, the LDS church getting what might be construed as “good press” is something the evangelical community is afraid of. So you guys demonize my faith. Literally, too, in many instances. That’s why I was asking what you think I am, if not a Christian. When it comes right down to it, you Evangelical types (to whom this matters, and apparently it’s a lot of you), view the LDS church as worse than, say, Judaism or Hinduism, I think.
Why not admit it?
Vanceone on December 4, 2007 at 9:13 PM
That’s about it. An election is not a time to try to convert anyone from their faith to your faith. You have to deal with the electorate where they are at. The question of the thread was why do evangelicals say they don’t want to vote for a Mormon. Well you seem to understand it. It isn’t Mitt’s fault. I mentioned that a few times. The evangelicals don’t want to make Mormonism legitimate and certainly don’t want people to think it is just another Christian sect. Your previous argument doesn’t make them feel any more at home with Mitt. I hope he doesn’t try that as well.
bnelson44 on December 4, 2007 at 9:19 PM
IMHO, the Catholics were an organized (by several major nations) mission to convert all the heathens in the Americas over many centuries. Sometimes brutally.
All major belief systems, holding that their one true way, out of thousands, is the only way to ’salvation’, try to spread the word to save their neighbors. Some knock on my door, some threaten to behead me. In a President, I am looking for a stalwart defender against the latter, no matter what his belief system is.
fred5678 on December 4, 2007 at 9:24 PM
Still, what Kennedy faced was a fear of the Pope not a fear of legitimacy or evangelizing.
bnelson44 on December 4, 2007 at 9:28 PM
my input in yesterday’s thread:
Many of us are clear on our distaste with the manner in which Huckabee seems to want to impose his ideas on us, wrapped in the sugarcoating of his personal Christian faith. I’m a Christian, and he bothers me.
To a Christian, it would be (even) worse if a were to do the same. Hence, I am guided to a large extent by a given candidates avowed belief system.
TexasDan on December 4, 2007 at 9:29 PM
Who has said this?
nailinmyeye on December 4, 2007 at 9:29 PM
so now I know that text in carrots doesn’t show up.
..it would be even worse if -insert non-Christian religious affiliation here– were to do the same.
TexasDan on December 4, 2007 at 9:30 PM
Well, Mitt won’t say it but I will: How is that attitude not an example of religious bigotry? There’s nothing that Evangelicals propose that would result in practical harm to the US (like voting for some members of Islamic sects), so it’s just sheer theological prejudice.
Let me link you to a story: This is what, sadly, Evangelicals come across as to many of us. An evangelical preacher calls Mormon women whores.
I’ve run into it in my own town. Evangelical preachers who try to disrupt our meetings, and tell me I’m going to hell. You’ll excuse me if I really have little patience for some holier than thou claims that I’m not a Christian while these guys are.
Vanceone on December 4, 2007 at 9:32 PM
You exercise the same theological prejudice when you choose to attend your church and not mine.
TexasDan on December 4, 2007 at 9:34 PM
Nailinmyeye: It’s all over this thread and others recently. Just look at what TexasDan says: Mormons are devil worshippers. I don’t think he would say a Jew worshipped a devil, or the Hindus. And bnelson approved of my statement that Evangelicals approve more of Jews and Hindus than they do LDS people.
Do you really think I’m wrong on that one? How many protesters do you see the local Evangelical community run at a Hindu place of worship, versus some at LDS events?
Vanceone on December 4, 2007 at 9:36 PM
Well, I don’t claim to be an expert, but calling people you want to vote for you or for your candidate a bigot aitn’t going to get you vary far.
bnelson44 on December 4, 2007 at 9:38 PM
I read the article at your link.
Yes Vance, there are @$$holes who call themselves Christian. It saddens us too. Mormon women are not whores. And those aren’t “Evangelical preachers” either and you know it.
TexasDan on December 4, 2007 at 9:38 PM
You are being disingenuous, and you are overstating your point.
I asked who said that a Mormon was non-electable whereas a Hindu or a Jew was. You don’t answer. No one has said that, on this thread at least. And my guess would be that the majority of evangelicals would not hold that attitude. In fact, I as an Evangelical, said above that Mitt would be my man if he got the nomination.
Then you cite a news story that talks about some extreme, marginal, “street preachers” doing something that the vast majority of evangelicals would find, and denounce as, reprehensible. Why do you try to make that paradigmatic of all evangelicals? Come on man. That would be like me saying that you all have multiple wives. It just isn’t fair.
I actually don’t think that Hot Air is the proper forum for a discussion on the differences between traditional Christianity and Mormonism. But if you are going to have the conversation, stop playing the victim, and at least do it fairly.
nailinmyeye on December 4, 2007 at 9:42 PM
No one said Mormons are devil worshipers. The worse anyone on this thread said, and I said it, was that Mormons were not Christian and some evangelicals think it is a cult. It is the prevailing view of all Churches I know of outside the LDS Church that Mormons are not Christians.
Not sure about hindus and jews, the study in the original post talked about women and blacks.
bnelson44 on December 4, 2007 at 9:43 PM
Evangelicals “hate” Catholics too. Wonder why all the heat on Mitt and not Rudy.
James on December 4, 2007 at 9:43 PM
Thanks.
jaime on December 4, 2007 at 9:44 PM
Vanceone,
I think you keep answering your own question. You keep referring to your church as “LDS”.
Explain what LDS actually means.
Jaynie59 on December 4, 2007 at 9:44 PM
That is simply untrue.
nailinmyeye on December 4, 2007 at 9:46 PM
You were agitating for us to state it clearly.
You can’t have it both ways: you want to push for the bottom line of Christian doctrine regarding Mormonism, yet you’re upset when I say it.
I said you were decieved, not devil worshippers. I have said before in my interactions with you: that doesn’t mean I don’t want to be your friend. You’re not my enemy. I have many dear Muslim friends. They’re not my enemy.
TexasDan on December 4, 2007 at 9:47 PM
Christians don’t hate Mormons. They just don’t want one in the White House.
PoliticallyIncorrectSandy on December 4, 2007 at 9:48 PM
TexasDan: They claim to be. They sound just like right2bright does when he debates against me. I’ve gone into so-called Christian bookstores, and read the stuff they have on that evil cult Mormonism. That style of stuff seems to be quite prevalent in the Evangelical Anti-Mormon community. I’ve personally been told I’m going to hell, so this fits in with many evangelical beliefs that I’m aware of.
Of course, there are lots of Protestant Christians who are great people–I’m friends with lots of good people. But this anti-mormonism, and the kind of stuff at the link I gave, is more prevalent than you think. I’ve watched my church have to fight city councils, etc. just to build a chapel in the town where I lived. And the leading drivers of opposition tended to be Protestant ministers.
That’s what this whole thing is about–there are a LOT of people who, for whatever reason, cannot stand the LDS church–and they are determined to resist it fiercely. It’s been that way all throughout our history, and it continues.
I wish you Evangelicals would realize that you should follow Gamamiels advice. If we are not of God, then we shall wither on the vine.
Bnelson: *shrug* Perhaps. But I don’t think Evangelicals as a whole are bigots. Most are good people. But there are a fair number who are prejudiced unfairly against the LDS church, and I doubt Mitt or any other Mormon would ever win them over anyway.
I’d like to note, however, that calling LDS people non-Christians, cultists, etc. doesn’t exactly inspire me to think highly of so-called Christians. You guys are way too quick to condemn me to hell.
Vanceone on December 4, 2007 at 9:50 PM
Has anyone, anyone here “condemned you to hell”?
If so, quote them. If not, stop playing the victim – what you are saying is simply dishonest.
nailinmyeye on December 4, 2007 at 9:52 PM
Jaynie59: LDS stands for “Latter-Day Saints”. My church is not the “Mormon church,” it is actually “The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints,” or LDS for short. Mormon is a widely accepted nickname, but it is not our name. I hope that helps! We try to use the LDS name more than Mormon, if at all possible.
Vanceone on December 4, 2007 at 9:53 PM
Well according to my fine evangelical roommates in the past I worship Mary and pray to graven images…
James on December 4, 2007 at 9:54 PM
nailinmyeye–no, no one here at hotair has, that I can recall. I do know when I was on my mission I was told that a few times, however. And, of course, the street preachers who invaded my town recently and held up signs saying I was going to hell certainly did too.
Vanceone on December 4, 2007 at 9:54 PM
Well – you might. But I still love you.
I’m joking. This thread seriously needs some lightening.
nailinmyeye on December 4, 2007 at 9:57 PM
Again, calling people names is not going to endear anyone to your cause.
Remember, I didn’t say LDS was a cult. But I did say it was not a Christian religion recognized by other Christian Churches. You get too emotional about it. If what I can say can condemn you so hell, your faith is too fragile. I state facts that you need to recognize without getting all upset about it. LDS theology and doctrine is simply too far separated from Christianity for Christian churches to accept LDS ad Christian. You have your faith, embrace it, but also embrace the truth of what is around you. And the truth of this campaign season.
bnelson44 on December 4, 2007 at 9:58 PM
I’m so much more concerned that he still uses illegals to tend his lawn than what church he goes to.
Buzzy on December 4, 2007 at 10:05 PM
Gammaliel may have been a nice guy, but I’ll stick with Jesus, who warned that the tares could not be pulled from the field without destroying the wheat, and would therefore be left to grow until the final judgement.
TexasDan on December 4, 2007 at 10:06 PM
I think he was using a contractor.
bnelson44 on December 4, 2007 at 10:09 PM
My faith isn’t fragile at all. I really could care less about other’s view of my relationship with God–that is my problem, and mine alone.
I’m just trying to correct this persistent error that I’m not a Christian. How would you like it if everyone claimed you were not a follower of Jesus Christ? And they said that regardless of what your yourself believe, you cannot be a follower because they don’t recognize it?
I’ve said numerous times that the LDS church is not “traditional Christianity.” There’s no question there. But when people say that I’m not Christian at all, well, that’s something different.
Yes, I’m fully aware that other Christian churches claim we aren’t Christian. That doesn’t mean that we aren’t, however.
It is a shame that it is Evangelicals who are trying to run Mitt out based on his religion. Don’t they realize that next, it will be THEM run out because they have the audacity to believe in Christ at all? That is what will happen next. “How can anyone believe those silly Mormon fables–that shows they have no intelligence!” What’s the difference between that and “How can anyone follow those fantasies of someone rising from the dead and a perfect human? They clearly don’t have any intelligence!” That very argument is quite popular now at the DailyKos, for whatever that is worth.
Vanceone on December 4, 2007 at 10:11 PM
By the way, from the study in the original article, I think we find what Mitt will do on Thursday:
Participants react favorably to messages that dispel the negative stereotypes about Mormons. Examples would be “about a hundred years ago the Mormon Church banned polygamy,” or “the Church of Jesus Chris of Latter-day Saints stresses traditional family values.” However, simple appeals for religious tolerance do not win over support for Romney from the respondents.
bnelson44 on December 4, 2007 at 10:15 PM
Yuck!, Don’t go all “independent” on us now….
paulsur on December 4, 2007 at 10:23 PM
You know, I’m not a Mitt fan, but this criticism of the illegal landscapers is completely unfair. I agree that when he hires a company, and they use illegals, how is that Romney’s fault? OK…he fired the landscapers…let’s move on.
asc85 on December 4, 2007 at 10:24 PM
What is this?
The my mythology is better than yours game?
For christ’s sake how can some one that believes in a god talking thru a burning bush, creationism, Immaculate conception, etc. castigate another primitive for believing in Mormonism.
It’s too much.
TheSitRep on December 4, 2007 at 10:24 PM
Hell, they don’t even protest me that much!
Laying prostate before them don’t work too well either.
MB4 on December 4, 2007 at 10:30 PM
If you it gets their vote it does.
Got to remember, the goal here is an election, not conversion.
bnelson44 on December 4, 2007 at 10:32 PM
Would it do any good?
bnelson44 on December 4, 2007 at 10:33 PM
Do you question their morality, or suitableness for public office? Do you feel you can trust them to make moral decisions as evangelicals would?
paulsur on December 4, 2007 at 10:37 PM
MB4 on December 4, 2007 at 10:41 PM
Nuke this thread from orbit, its the only way to be sure.
Bad Candy on December 4, 2007 at 10:42 PM
Assumes facts not in evidence.
MB4 on December 4, 2007 at 10:43 PM
Mitt is running for President, not some kind of LDS Pope.
MB4 on December 4, 2007 at 10:45 PM
Hasn’t so far.
MB4 on December 4, 2007 at 10:49 PM
This is all so is very strange.
Evangelicals attacking and belittling Mormons and atheists defending them.
Is this part of God’s mysterious plan?
Maybe it’s true what some say – God is a comedian playing to an audience too afraid to laugh.
MB4 on December 4, 2007 at 10:53 PM
Religious tolerance is something I get, down to my bones. Religion in politics is something I fear, down to my bones.
Timing’s the issue, if one is to be true to oneself. This election, we are presented with the question, will we apply the microscope to all religions equally? The answer, for me, is: How does the religion figure into the candidate’s politics/policy positions.
Mitt’s Mormonism doesn’t even register on my radar.
RushBaby on December 4, 2007 at 10:55 PM
Your catching on.
bnelson44 on December 4, 2007 at 10:56 PM
If I understand the evangelicals that isn’t the fear. The fear is free LDS church publicity.
bnelson44 on December 4, 2007 at 11:02 PM
That may be because you didn’t get the extra cost Evangelical chip when you bought your radar machine.
MB4 on December 4, 2007 at 11:04 PM
Then why aren’t they protesting Brittney? She gets free publicity all the time.
MB4 on December 4, 2007 at 11:06 PM
Who said they aren’t?
bnelson44 on December 4, 2007 at 11:07 PM
That may be because, as a true conservative, frugality is part of my nature. Chip away!
RushBaby on December 4, 2007 at 11:09 PM
I think they are much too busy protesting Mormons to have much time left over to protest her.
Besides most of the TV Evangelical preachers are probably trying to figure out a way to s##ew her.
MB4 on December 4, 2007 at 11:13 PM
Black atheist women?
Jaibones on December 4, 2007 at 11:15 PM
They aren’t protesting Mormons, they are rooting for Huck :)
bnelson44 on December 4, 2007 at 11:15 PM
Given all that has been going on, clearly a distinction without much of a difference.
MB4 on December 4, 2007 at 11:24 PM
MB4 on December 4, 2007 at 11:24 PM
LOL!
bnelson44 on December 4, 2007 at 11:26 PM
Gots to go for now.
All us evangelical atheists are going out to spay paint some church tonight.
I don’t want to be late.
MB4 on December 4, 2007 at 11:27 PM
night
bnelson44 on December 4, 2007 at 11:31 PM
Religion was featured on Metalocalypse tonight. Coincidence?
Nonfactor on December 5, 2007 at 12:23 AM
I think Romney should’ve told the folks at NPR to shove it (for lack of better words).
Why is it that so many people (in media) want religion out of politics and then insist on asking these questions? It seems so-called ‘separation of church and state’ doesn’t exist when trying to make a Christian look foolish in politics.
Can you imagine if George W. Bush told Americans that he asks himself ‘What would Jesus do?’ before many decisions he made? You know; if he just came out and said it. It would hit the fan. But regarding the death penalty; that question is apparently okay. It’s actually enlightening.
People on the street of NY say they wouldn’t vote for someone that didn’t believe in evolution. That’s who firing these questions at Republican candidates.
I think all candidates should stick to discussing the issues. Let them stand on that and only that.
df4jc on December 5, 2007 at 12:55 AM
Evangelicals fear and despise Mormons because of the competition; and because you don’t find too many Ted Haggards, Jimmy Swaggarts, or Jim Bakkers leading Mormon congregations. If Huckabee by some fluke becomes the Republican nominee, I guarantee you Utah, the reddest of all states, will go Democratic next year for the first time since 1964. And it won’t be the only state. As George Will recently pointed out, this kind of religious exclusivity crap applied to politics will turn off millions of voters and Republicans will pay a heavy price.
WasatchMan on December 5, 2007 at 2:50 AM
Read my comments on this thread. I’ve never questioned Romney’s morality, or fitness for public office.
What is weird to me is that from the comments on this thread from MB4, Vanceone and others, you would think that evangelicals are out there protesting in mass, on television infomercials half hour after half hour, and preaching from the pulpit (and street corner), that Mormons are bad and Mitt Romney is worse. I just don’t see it.
nailinmyeye on December 5, 2007 at 4:03 AM
Vote for me in 2008! I mow my own lawn!
As president, I very likely will upgrade my push mower to a riding mower.
Though I imagine I won’t have much say about Secret Service agents flanking my riding mower with their riding mowers as I lap the White House.
saint kansas on December 5, 2007 at 4:55 AM
If it is a John Deere, you have my vote. And, think about John Deere subsidies for all Americans, and that will seal it.
nailinmyeye on December 5, 2007 at 6:03 AM
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