Video: Lou Dobbs vs Rep. Luis Gutierrez on illegal immigration

posted at 11:45 am on November 29, 2007 by Bryan

CNN’s Lou Dobbs battles Rep. Luis Gutierrez (D-IL) over illegal immigration on Wednesday’s show. Gutierrez tosses up so many red herrings it’s hard to know where to start, so I’ll just quote a Dobbs question instead.

“Why is it that Democratic leadership, these Democratic presidential candidates, every one of them, pushing comprehensive immigration reform, which is amnesty, which your own Congressional Budget Office said would be a disaster, you guys continue to push for it as though the American people don’t mean a damn thing to you? What happened to the idea that the majority rules in this country?”

Gutierrez answers predictably. Evidently he hasn’t seen any polls on the subject. It does get entertaining when Dobbs begs Gutierrez to call him a racist.


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Dobbs is a a fool and may be a racist.

Big S on November 29, 2007 at 11:53 AM

MSM v. Useful idiot. Who do you root for? I get more from watching a Carolina Panthers’ home game.

.

GT on November 29, 2007 at 11:57 AM

Dobbs is a a fool and may be a racist.

Dobbs is a fool? I feel exactly the same way Dobbs does … so I assume to you I’m a fool as well. In my book, ignoring the massive problem we have here simply because one may be afraid of being called silly names is foolish.

darwin on November 29, 2007 at 12:05 PM

If he is a racist, it has nothing to do with his position on the illegal invasion.

ColdBore76 on November 29, 2007 at 12:06 PM

Rep. Luis Gutierrez like all Democrats doesn’t give a damn what the American people think.

doriangrey on November 29, 2007 at 12:07 PM

380 pages on border security? Anybody who takes 380 pages to spell out a requirement that our borders be protected cannot possibly be serious about doing anything about border security besides undermining it. Heck, God Almighty managed to ban adultery, murder, stealing, idolatry and a few other things besides in less than 1 page. Surely, we don’t need 380 pages for one simple law, do we?

morganfrost on November 29, 2007 at 12:08 PM

Big S on November 29, 2007 at 11:53 AM

You need to learn the difference between a “racist” and a “nationalist”.

Lou Dobbs is a Nationalist and so am I.

JayHaw Phrenzie on November 29, 2007 at 12:09 PM

morganfrost on November 29, 2007 at 12:08 PM

Good point

ColdBore76 on November 29, 2007 at 12:09 PM

The elitists did poll “comprehensive immigration reform” before the big amnesty push and found Americans liked it- until they found out it really meant amnesty for illegals.

Valiant on November 29, 2007 at 12:09 PM

At least this shill doesn’t get too melodramatic with the plight of the poor, poor felons. He’s careful. Maybe they’re beginning to realize the “Poor Pablo” act isn’t flying that much anymore…

Dobbs is a a fool and may be a racist.

Big S on November 29, 2007 at 11:53 AM

If that wasn’t sarcasm, it should have been.

MadisonConservative on November 29, 2007 at 12:10 PM

Big S on November 29, 2007 at 11:53 AM

You’re being sarcastic, right?

amerpundit on November 29, 2007 at 12:15 PM

I like Dobbs. He and Glen Beck are the only two good ones at CNN.

ThackerAgency on November 29, 2007 at 12:15 PM

If that wasn’t sarcasm, it should have been.

MadisonConservative on November 29, 2007 at 12:10 PM

Not a bit of sarcasm, even with the extra a. Dobbs has become a strident trade protectionist and advocate of government control over business. He’s bought into the nostalgia for years past when people would join a union and work at a factory for their whole life. The world and its economy are changing, and he wants to let the rest of it pass us by in favor of the “good old days” that weren’t objectively better than more modern times. The standard of living in the USA keeps going up, even with the influx of poor immigrants, illegal or not. The genius of our economy is its ability to adapt to changing times by promoting new industries and ways of doing business. Dobbs wants to put a halt to that, based on what seems to be his fear of “outsiders” sneaking in and taking our stuff. It’s an idiotic position, and if the policies he advocates with respect to trade are ever adopted you can say goodbye to 3% GDP growth and 4-5% unemployment.

Big S on November 29, 2007 at 12:22 PM

Big S on November 29, 2007 at 12:22 PM

What you just described includes within it a fundamental outlook that most anti-amnesty people have. What you’re suggesting is that we endorse and continue to allow the employment of illegal aliens for the sake of staying competitive in the global market.

Call it nostalgia all you like, but it’s the law. If you’re saying we should break it in order to stay competitive, go right ahead. You’ll find few friends here.

MadisonConservative on November 29, 2007 at 12:25 PM

Big S on November 29, 2007 at 12:22 PM

Wow you were serious. I forgot Big S, were you making a pro slave trade argument or a pro illegal immigration argument?

Zetterson on November 29, 2007 at 12:34 PM

Big S on November 29, 2007 at 12:22 PM

How does any of what you said make him a racist? Creating a permanent underclass of Mexican illegal immigrants in the name of competition seems pretty racist to me. Demanding Mexico unfu*k itself and create an environment where there isn’t a need to flee north for a job would be a better solution. Damn this status quo.

ColdBore76 on November 29, 2007 at 12:35 PM

Not a bit of sarcasm, even with the extra a. Dobbs has become a strident trade protectionist and advocate of government control over business. He’s bought into the nostalgia for years past when people would join a union and work at a factory for their whole life. The world and its economy are changing, and he wants to let the rest of it pass us by in favor of the “good old days” that weren’t objectively better than more modern times. The standard of living in the USA keeps going up, even with the influx of poor immigrants, illegal or not. The genius of our economy is its ability to adapt to changing times by promoting new industries and ways of doing business. Dobbs wants to put a halt to that, based on what seems to be his fear of “outsiders” sneaking in and taking our stuff. It’s an idiotic position, and if the policies he advocates with respect to trade are ever adopted you can say goodbye to 3% GDP growth and 4-5% unemployment.

Big S on November 29, 2007 at 12:22 PM

So in other words, it’s just about the economy, right? It’s not about the rule of law, it’s not about assimilation and cultural cohesien, it’s not about securing our borders and our sovereignty, it’s not about national security. Economic matters trump all.

That you, Paul Gigot?

thirteen28 on November 29, 2007 at 12:35 PM

Call it nostalgia all you like, but it’s the law. If you’re saying we should break it in order to stay competitive, go right ahead. You’ll find few friends here.

MadisonConservative on November 29, 2007 at 12:25 PM

The stupidity of the Amnesty/Open Borders shills makes my head hurt. The problem is that they are just so stupid that there is just too many flaws to address in a short soundbite or a single op-ed piece.

I can’t believe that the Big S is arguing that we should open the borders and grant Amnesty for economic reasons. Thats amazing and unforgivable.

Zetterson on November 29, 2007 at 12:38 PM

MadisonConservative on November 29, 2007 at 12:25 PM

Maybe it’s the law, but maybe those who decide how many people to let into the country have miscalculated. The USA suffers from a major shortage of labor, so much so that we manage “full” employment even with 10 million of those jobs removed from the calculation, and companies here need to ship production overseas to where the laborers actually exist. In general, we consume more than we can make on our own, and pay for it by producing new innovations that the rest of the world wants. We won’t be able to go back to the “good old days” unless we resort to central planning of our economy. Even then, it won’t really work, since that would send the whole thing to hell. Dobbs used to understand this (or at least act like it on TV), but he’s become an advocate for central control largely due to his desire to keep foreigners off of our land and out of our businesses. He’s a nativist crank, there’s no way around it.

Big S on November 29, 2007 at 12:39 PM

Dobbs is a a fool and may be a racist.

Big S on November 29, 2007 at 11:53 AM

After several comments over the past weeks, all similarly idiotic, I suspect that the “S” stands for Sh!tferBrains. GFY.

As for the notion that Gutierrez is one of “Illinois leading congressmen”, please. This little douche has been handed a some money and power by Little Richie and the Chicabo mob to keep the Mexican population voting Dem, stupid and happy. He is widely regarded as a little clown, and you can clearly see why.

Jaibones on November 29, 2007 at 12:41 PM

Joe Klein, representing the media, has it figured out for all of us. We’re racist. The Clinton years were good economically, thus immigration wasn’t a problem. How out to lunch Klein, is, while having the perfect title, though. Ideology trumps reason, every time.

Dobbs is a a fool and may be a racist.

Big S on November 29, 2007 at 11:53 AM

Wow, he’s married to a legal Latino immigrant, go figure.

Entelechy on November 29, 2007 at 12:42 PM

Big S on November 29, 2007 at 12:39 PM

Again I’ll ask Big S, are you making a pro slavery argument or a pro illegal immigration argument?

Zetterson on November 29, 2007 at 12:42 PM

His beef is illegal immigration, that is the issue here–the problem is the blatant lawlessness on the border. What drives NORMAL law-abiding citizens crazy is the utter dismissal of this problem by politicians…who cares what he thinks about central planning…nothing he says will ever come to be–yet his willingness to attack Red China and the Illegal Immigration issue helps bring these issues to the career politicians.

ColdBore76 on November 29, 2007 at 12:44 PM

You need to learn the difference between a “racist” and a “nationalist”.

Lou Dobbs is a Nationalist and so am I.

Same here – and proud to be so!!!

Corky on November 29, 2007 at 12:44 PM

This is what’s going to happen to most politicians running in ’08, from the left, and from the right.

Entelechy on November 29, 2007 at 12:45 PM

Again I’ll ask Big S, are you making a pro slavery argument or a pro illegal immigration argument?

Zetterson on November 29, 2007 at 12:42 PM

Neither. I’m making a pro-immigration argument, with an implicit endorsement of regularization of the illegal immigrants who are already here, have jobs, and have become acclimated to American culture to some degree. If we want to keep up the health of the American economy, we’ll need to either let people in to work here, or accept that some of our precious low-wage jobs are going to be outsourced. Either/Or, buddy, take your pick.

Big S on November 29, 2007 at 12:46 PM

Surely, we don’t need 380 pages for one simple law, do we?

morganfrost on November 29, 2007 at 12:08 PM

The more someone actually does not want to do something the more pages they need to pretend that they want to do what they actually do not want to do.

Bullocracy 101.

MB4 on November 29, 2007 at 12:47 PM

I ask the American people. I hope you TIVO’d this, because I never raised the issue of race here whatsoever, and I never called… He’s the one that self-accused himself. I didn’t do it here, nor will I ever.

Yeah, we TIVO’d it Congressman. Here’s what you said…

No, no, you always talk about the Mexican border. You never speak about the Canadian border. You haven’t spoken about the Canadian border during this conversation. It’s always Mexico and drugs…

You’re the one that keeps mentioning Mexico and drugs and criminalizing the undocumented workers that come here to this country. You’re the one that does it. You admitted here on this program that 40% of the undocumented workers did not cross that border, yet you never emphasize what we need to do in order to control them.

Very cute Congressman. You think that just because you don’t use the exact word “racist” then you’re not accusing someone of being one?

greggish on November 29, 2007 at 12:49 PM

and have become acclimated to American culture to some degree

That was great. By acclimation I guess you mean raising mexican flags OVER American Flags..

ColdBore76 on November 29, 2007 at 12:49 PM

you can say goodbye to 3% GDP growth and 4-5% unemployment.

Big S on November 29, 2007 at 12:22 PM

You must not keep up with economic news much, as that is where we are headed right now!

MB4 on November 29, 2007 at 12:52 PM

.
These Shamnesty goons are like Night of the Living Dead. No matter how you forcefully you kill them, they just keep crawling out of the grave and trying to push this Zombie agenda through the machine and over the will of the people.
.
If only we could “ethically” clone Chuck Norris right now.
.

Keith_Z on November 29, 2007 at 12:53 PM

I forgot Big S, were you making a pro slave trade argument or a pro illegal immigration argument?

Zetterson on November 29, 2007 at 12:34 PM

Unless he invites illegals to his parties and introduces illegals to his sister or daughter, I would say likely the former.

MB4 on November 29, 2007 at 12:54 PM

What “race” are illegal Aliens ?

This is just racebating politics

William Amos on November 29, 2007 at 12:55 PM

we’ll need to either let people in to work here, or accept that some of our precious low-wage jobs are going to be outsourced. Either/Or, buddy, take your pick.

Big S on November 29, 2007 at 12:46 PM

I don’t entirely buy your supposition, but assuming that it’s accurate, then we can get more immigrants, but they need to be here LEGALLY and go through the normal immigration process.

You need to learn the difference between a “racist” and a “nationalist”.

Lou Dobbs is a Nationalist and so am I.

JayHaw Phrenzie on November 29, 2007 at 12:09 PM

I’m right there with you.

Nineball on November 29, 2007 at 12:56 PM

The USA suffers from a major shortage of labor

Big S on November 29, 2007 at 12:39 PM

Bravo Sierra.

MB4 on November 29, 2007 at 12:58 PM

A lot of what Big S says about Dobbs is correct, but I don’t see anything inherently raaaaaaacist about it. Protectionist, yes, but racist? Come on, his wife is a Mexican-American. Guess he is just trying to water down those Mexican genes, huh?

RW Wacko on November 29, 2007 at 12:58 PM

ColdBore76 on November 29, 2007 at 12:49 PM

How many such incidents have you seen? Go ahead, demagogue the bad judgement and/or ill intent of a few immigrants (whose status is unknown, incidentally) to smear the millions who are just here for jobs. A year or so a go, when there were all of those immigrant demonstrations that got everybody so mad, the vast majority of illegals were probably busy working so they could pay their rent or buy their kids the latest video game or cool shoes…just like the rest of us. If you’re worried about our “culture,” let them come out of the shadows and work wherever they can find a job; pushing them underground actually provides an incentive for them to live in insular, unassimilated communities rather than assimilating into mainstram American culture. If your solution is to stop people from coming in, and chase the ones who are already here out, be prepared to chase their jobs and productivity out with them.

Big S on November 29, 2007 at 12:58 PM

Neither. I’m making a pro-immigration argument

Big S on November 29, 2007 at 12:46 PM

Bravo Sierra.

You are making a serf master pro plantation owner argument.

MB4 on November 29, 2007 at 1:02 PM

A lot of what Big S says about Dobbs is correct, but I don’t see anything inherently raaaaaaacist about it. Protectionist, yes, but racist? Come on, his wife is a Mexican-American. Guess he is just trying to water down those Mexican genes, huh?

RW Wacko on November 29, 2007 at 12:58 PM

I didn’t know that about his wife, so I guess that means I’m wrong on that. However, considering the inconsistencies in his rhetoric with respect to economics (especially coming from somebody who should know better), it’s hard to rationalize any other way than some fear that outsiders are just trying sneak in and take what’s “rightfully ours”. It’s good to be patriotic, but Dobbs shows all of the bad tendencies of economic populism that tend to put countries on troublesome protectionist paths.

Big S on November 29, 2007 at 1:07 PM

A year or so a go, when there were all of those immigrant (You forgot the word illegal. Why is that I wonder?) demonstrations that got everybody so mad, the vast majority of illegals were probably busy working so they could pay their rent or buy their kids the latest video game or cool shoes…just like the rest of us.(No not just like “the rest of us” as they are in the U.S. ILLEGALLY, unlike “the rest of us”)

Big S on November 29, 2007 at 12:58 PM

MB4 on November 29, 2007 at 1:07 PM

Big S,

the flag thing was a microcosmic example of unwillingness to assimilate. You are telling me that of the 22 million illegal immigrant here a large majority of them are assimilating? Culturally, morally, linguistically and ethically? The border crossing illegals are here because they espouse and understand the inherent exceptional civil magic that is America…that’s what you are saying…NO it isn’t you are saying that they have assimilated economically by coming in, knowing there role and working our dirty jobs, let’s peddle more soft bigotry of low expectation, don’t demand them to learn the language, keep them on the low rung right? Let me ask you this, how pro-illegal immigration would you be if they came across in the numbers they are now-but with proficient english speaking skills and gunning not for lawn and construction jobs but for YOURS!

ColdBore76 on November 29, 2007 at 1:09 PM

If you’re worried about our “culture,” let them come out of the shadows

Big S on November 29, 2007 at 12:58 PM

ROFLMAO!!!

HELLO!

Open you eyes.

They are not in the shadows.

They are all over the place in broad daylight.

Do you work for Tyson Foods?

MB4 on November 29, 2007 at 1:10 PM

we’ll need to either let people in to work here, or accept that some of our precious low-wage jobs are going to be outsourced. Either/Or, buddy, take your pick.

Nonsense. “Precious low wage jobs” often become higher paying jobs once illegals are removed from the equation.

I agree with you about this being an Either/Or proposition though. Either we as a nation will have enforceable borders and sensible immigration laws Or we will cease to be a nation.

Take your pick.

Mike Honcho on November 29, 2007 at 1:10 PM

Hypocrite

ColdBore76 on November 29, 2007 at 1:10 PM

To the extent that there is any “labor shortage”, illegals are the major cause of it.

There is to a degree a “teacher shortage”. Why is that?
It is because there are so many illegals in our schools.

There is to a degree a “doctor and nurse shortage”. Why is that?
It is because there are so many illegals in our hospitals.

There is to a degree a “law personnel shortage”. Why is that?
It is because there are so many illegals committing crimes.

There is to a degree a “auto repair shortage”. Why is that?
It is because there are so many illegals crashing cars.

MB4 on November 29, 2007 at 1:17 PM

Let me ask you this, how pro-illegal immigration would you be if they came across in the numbers they are now-but with proficient english speaking skills and gunning not for lawn and construction jobs but for YOURS!

ColdBore76 on November 29, 2007 at 1:09 PM

That’s just silly. What I’m saying is that our country has a labor shortage, and that we need to address it by wither bringing people in or shipping the work elsewhere. We already have a lot of people here who have come to be laborers, and who would likely assimilate into American culture if they were able to attain legal status. There are thee options for dealing with them. One is to deport them, and watch many of their jobs go with them. Another is to keep with the status quo and ignore them, providing a disincentive to participation in mainstream American society. The third is to provide some kind of path to citizenship (those words!) or green cards, in hopes of keeping their productivity here, while providing an incentive for them to become more like us and adopt the culture and language of the country. I choose the third, knowing fully well that they will compete against some Americans for jobs at some times in some places. However, with an integrative program for immigrants, I assume they’ll work their way up the economic ladder like most perople in this country do, and that their kids will compete with my own someday for high paying jobs. I have no problem with that at all.

Big S on November 29, 2007 at 1:20 PM

Big S on November 29, 2007 at 12:58 PM

Think you are getting a skewed viewpoint from conservatives here. Think the majority of conservatives would take a good fence/biometrics and tough enforcement UP FRONT in exchange for path to legalization down the road (back of the line, learn English, fines, etc), or status quo. Is a very small minority who wants to send people back to their native countries.

Their is a tendency of people on both sides to think of illegals as a big group of people, either hardworking family-people who do the jobs we won’t do, or blood-sucking leaches stealing American jobs and benefits and criminals. It’s really a combination of the two. Wish we could keep the best and throw back the worst. Go to the Tenderloin in San Francisco and all the crack dealers are Mexicans. All you hear people asking on the streets are “where are the Mexicans?” so people can get their score of cheap Mexican crack and meth. We could do without those immigrants, too.

It’s not so cut-and-dry either way.

RW Wacko on November 29, 2007 at 1:23 PM

That’s just silly. What I’m saying is that our country has a labor shortage

Big S on November 29, 2007 at 1:20 PM

And if we did not have so many illegals we would not have this labor shortage of yours.

What you really mean is that you have a serf labor, labor shortage.

MB4 on November 29, 2007 at 1:24 PM

They’re holding the American people’s security hostage. They won’t secure our borders unless it comes along with amnesty. Everytime in the past that they’ve handed out amnesty they promised to secure the borders too, and they never did. What makes anyone think this time will be any different? No amnesty or any type or immigration reform until the borders are secure and the current laws are enforced! Then we can talk about ‘paths to citizenship’

Keli on November 29, 2007 at 1:25 PM

Nonsense. “Precious low wage jobs” often become higher paying jobs once illegals are removed from the equation.

Mike Honcho on November 29, 2007 at 1:10 PM

That’s true in service industries (hotels, restaurants, etc.) where the labor is position specific. However, your assertion only applies in the short term. A food or clothing company that that fires illegal immigrant workers may temporarily staff its production plants with higher-wage Americans, but will immediately start looking for ways to outsource as much of that labor as possible in order to keep costs down. There is a ceiling in wages for many such jobs, defined by the cost in shipping the goods from China to here.

Big S on November 29, 2007 at 1:26 PM

Think you are getting a skewed viewpoint from conservatives here.

No, not “skewed” at all.

It’s not so cut-and-dry either way.

RW Wacko on November 29, 2007 at 1:23 PM

Yes it is.

MB4 on November 29, 2007 at 1:27 PM

Demanding Mexico unfu*k itself and create an environment where there isn’t a need to flee north for a job would be a better solution. Damn this status quo.

Mexico is also much stricter when it comes to foreigners than we are. A non-Mexican in Mexico is forbidden by law to take part in Mexican politics, including demostrations, and may be removed from Mexico for any reason without any judicial process. Even if a non-Mexican is able to legally become a Mexican citizen (which happens far less frequently than non-Americans become U.S. citizens), he/she is still excluded from many government jobs, due to being born outside of Mexico. Some jobs, such as the Mexican presidency, require at least one parent of the office-holder to be born in Mexico.

The ironic thing about all this illegal immigration from Mexico is that Ross Perot’s “giant sucking sound” has come into being, but in the opposite direction. Because U.S. jobs pay better (even with undercut wages paid under the table) than Mexican jobs, the Mexican workers are being “sucked” (so to speak) into the U.S., rather than U.S. jobs being “sucked” down into Mexico.

As for those who complain, “what about the Canadian border?”, what percentage of illegal aliens have entered from Canada?

Bigfoot on November 29, 2007 at 1:28 PM

That’s true in service industries (hotels, restaurants, etc.) where the labor is position specific. However, your assertion only applies in the short term. A food or clothing company that that fires illegal immigrant workers may temporarily staff its production plants with higher-wage Americans, but will immediately start looking for ways to outsource as much of that labor as possible in order to keep costs down. There is a ceiling in wages for many such jobs, defined by the cost in shipping the goods from China to here.

Big S on November 29, 2007 at 1:26 PM

Even accepting the narrow, economic-only focus of your argument, when it comes down to either letting illegal do the work in this country or outsourcing it to China, I’ll go for outsourcing – precisely because there are many other non-economic aspects to this debate that you and others who want cheap, docile labor seem to overlook.

thirteen28 on November 29, 2007 at 1:29 PM

There is a ceiling in wages for many such jobs, defined by the cost in shipping the goods from China to here.

Big S on November 29, 2007 at 1:26 PM

Only so long as our government has pro serf master plantation owners, anti-American, no reciprocity trade policies with China.

MB4 on November 29, 2007 at 1:31 PM

It’s not so cut-and-dry either way.

RW Wacko on November 29, 2007 at 1:23 PM

I agree with that. However, my initial point was that somebody like Dobbs who demagogues the influx of immigrants (illegal or not) and is dead set against amnesty as well as the outsourcing of jobs to other countries, does not understand the fundamentals of labor prices.

Big S on November 29, 2007 at 1:32 PM

Big S,

Lou is, and has been for several decades, married to a Latino woman. What’s your social circle look like? I bet it’s white as typing paper.

Where’s your predominately white neighborhood that doesn’t directly see the effects of the policies you promote?

What’s your full time job and would you be ok with 1-million workers of that same profession coming over here legally or illegally?

Why is China’s economy chugging along at 9% while ours is lagging at 3%? Answer: they practice the same policies that Lou Dobbs suggests. Sorry it’s offensive to you, but nationalism helps to preserve, well, nations – ie, the place you call home – and causes trade surpluses. Blind free-trade produces deficits like we have now.

Starting off a comment as you did, using the words you did, takes away your credibility. I hope you understand this.

Buck

bucktowndusty on November 29, 2007 at 1:33 PM

You aren’t a hypocrite Big S, apologies. I was out of line.

ColdBore76 on November 29, 2007 at 1:33 PM

thirteen28 on November 29, 2007 at 1:29 PM

That’s a perfectly logical position to hold, even though I disagree. However, Lou Dobbs, the subject of this thread, rails against both of them.

Big S on November 29, 2007 at 1:34 PM

Big S on November 29, 2007 at 12:39 PM

So all you care about is how it effects the economy? you don’t have any problem with the fact that 6 years after 9/11 our border is still wide open? So i guess innocent American lives lost are worth it in you book, just so long as we stay competitive.

Would you agree to having legal work visas, along with a secure border and illegal immigration halted? Or do they have to be illegal and undocumented to keep us competitive?

Keli on November 29, 2007 at 1:35 PM

But I am speaking about the present, I like the post I saw earlier…absolutely seal the border kick out the bad ones and keep the good ones (no matter what country they are from). If the parents are bad, kick the whole family out, if the kids are minors and bad, kick the whole family out…

ColdBore76 on November 29, 2007 at 1:35 PM

good point Keli

ColdBore76 on November 29, 2007 at 1:35 PM

what poll is this shamnesty tool looking at ????
the only path way to citizenship starts at the back of the line in their own country .

Mojack420 on November 29, 2007 at 1:36 PM

Big S,

You are more wrong than a American Flag made in China…just sayin’.

ColdBore76 on November 29, 2007 at 1:37 PM

Logic 101:

Seal the borders and THEN deal with the illegals here already.

It just can’t be any other way.

awake on November 29, 2007 at 1:39 PM

A blowhard vs. a lefty pol. Hooray
Then again, the congressman complains he only talks about the Sourthen border yet claims he does not suggest race as a factor. Look uo the word sophisty Congressman.

RobCon on November 29, 2007 at 1:40 PM

bucktowndusty on November 29, 2007 at 1:33 PM

Actually, I live in New York City, live in a majority Black/Hispanic neighborhood, and work in a science laboratory with a lot of Asians, both born here in the USA and abroad. In fact, I’m the only white person, other than the supervisor, in my research division. There’s a lot of competition in my field from those who would like to come to the USA and take jobs like mine, so I feel the pressure. However, I recognize that it is good to keep this specific industry in the country, and have felt that my colleagues are eager to assimilate into American culture once they get here.

Big S on November 29, 2007 at 1:41 PM

Would you agree to having legal work visas, along with a secure border and illegal immigration halted? Or do they have to be illegal and undocumented to keep us competitive?

Keli on November 29, 2007 at 1:35 PM

Earlier in this thread, I said I prefer allowing in in a legal manner however many immigrants we need in order to meet our economic demands, and that I would be comfortable with changes in laws and some form of amnesty in order to do it. After all, the illegals who have made it here have shown themselves to be sufficiently resourceful to compete in our economy already. Whoever comes up with the quotas for work visa issuances, has vastly miscalculated the labor requirements of the US economy, and that needs to be fixed. In the long run, improved control, including border security and employer verification will be needed.

Big S on November 29, 2007 at 1:51 PM

I agree with that. However, my initial point was that somebody like Dobbs who demagogues the influx of immigrants (illegal or not)

Big S on November 29, 2007 at 1:32 PM

Sounds to me like you are the one doing the demagogueing.

MB4 on November 29, 2007 at 1:52 PM

Big S,

“So I feel the pressure”

Exactly, and Lou is trying to alleviate some of that pressure.

I live in Maryland and I can tell you that imported lower-income diversity isn’t as pleasant as your experience might be. Recently a radio station in the DC area went Spanish programming and the Latino’s at work said, “Ha, we’re taking over.” You can’t get a job in my hometown unless you speak Spanish. The federal government has “preferred monority hiring. Imagine that Big S, you are an UNPREFERRED white guy now thanks to the massive influx.

In fact, I’m the only white person, other than the supervisor, in my research division.

You are lucky. Try quiting then applying for your job back. There is a bias against “white” science people. Asians are stereotyped smarter and cheaper to hire. Supervisors might not get past your name on the resume once they realize that it sounds white.

I recognize that it is good to keep this specific industry in the country

Lou Dobbs could not have said this any better.

Considering what I’ve mentioned here, do you still stand my your first post?

Buck

bucktowndusty on November 29, 2007 at 1:54 PM

I’ve said all I can possibly say on this issue, and will need to be off to work here in a bit, so goodbye for now everybody

Big S on November 29, 2007 at 1:54 PM

I don’t think Dobbs has ever taken issue with legal immigrants.

ColdBore76 on November 29, 2007 at 1:54 PM

Big S,

Have you ever visited http://www.vdare.com ? Extensive coverage of the immigration there.

Buck

bucktowndusty on November 29, 2007 at 2:24 PM

Thats what happens when you allow a foreign culture to grow in your country. We must deport the criminal illegals, which are all illegals.

saiga on November 29, 2007 at 2:46 PM

Logic 101:

Seal the borders and THEN deal with the illegals here already.

It just can’t be any other way.

awake on November 29, 2007 at 1:39 PM

Correctamundo.

saiga on November 29, 2007 at 2:48 PM

I’ve said all I can possibly say on this issue, and will need to be off to work here in a bit, so goodbye for now everybody

Big S on November 29, 2007 at 1:54 PM

Appreciated your logical arguments. Agree with some of what you said, esp regarding criticism of Dobbs’ protectionsist policies and general misunderstanding of the workings of the global economy. Get tired of the one-trick brown-skinned people and Muslims are evil get rid of them/bomb them arguments found here. You know who you are.

RW Wacko on November 29, 2007 at 3:37 PM

The standard of living in the USA keeps going up, even with the influx of poor immigrants, illegal or not.

Yeah, more people have iPods, X boxes, airconditioners and Abercrombie & Finch sweatshirts but it takes Mom & Dad working fulltime to buy it all, leaving the kids at home to be raised by MTV.
Unbridled business, now there is a mechanism to get us to Utopia. I get a kick out of “unfettered markets” and all that provides us. Living with AOLTimeWarnerStarbucks, Inc. has made things so much better. Five hundred stations but nothing worth watching,great! I like to amuse myself by thinking of all those Chinese (or any other country for that matter) apparatchiks chortling internally while some silly American twit prattles on about Free Trade & Open Markets. What stories they must tell amongst themselves!
Bill Gates, Jack Welsh, Michael Eisner et al must be great champions of free and open competition, right?
Never mind that we have an underclass of young blacks & hispanics that busy themselves with all kinds of “mischief” because there aren’t any jobs for them. We’ll have “full employment” when all those kids are fully employed Or don’t they count in your calculations, BigS?
The real reason illegal immigration is countenanced (by both parties) is to keep wages down. A carpenter or a plumber’s wage is relative & proportional to
the illegal washing the dishes in the restaurant. Bill Gates would rather hire H-1B programmers than keep the 49 year old American computer programmer who earns way too much. He’d much rather outsource everything but the fact is that he’s paranoid when it comes to his code.
Got a laugh out of reading a story about big entertainment/movie companies beginning to outsource some aspects of their legal work to Indian companies set up by one of our Bright Young Things. Man, you know things are challenging when they’re going after the lawyers!
I’m not a communist and I’m not against business, I’m just against a rigged game and impatient with pie-eyed absolutists.
Do you know what you get when you let MTV mind your kids?

thegreatbeast on November 29, 2007 at 6:26 PM

Well said, thegreatbeast!

The standard of living in the USA keeps going up, even with the influx of poor immigrants, illegal or not.

The standard of living might be going up, for many, but the quality of life isn’t. And the future sure doesn’t look so bright, if significant measures are not taken, and the brakes aren’t put on the socialist crowds, waiting impatiently to alter your competitive freedom.

Entelechy on November 29, 2007 at 8:57 PM

I like Dobbs. He and Glen Beck are the only two good ones at CNN.

ThackerAgency on November 29, 2007 at 12:15 PM

But but but, Glen Beck supports police.

Annnyway, what’s with all this going to the back of the line stuff. If they are already here and not going anywhere . . they’re cutting in line, eating the food, but not yet paying the lunch lady.

- The Cat

MirCat on November 30, 2007 at 1:17 AM