Geraghty: If Mitt’s the nominee, lefty bigots won’t be able to stop themselves; Update: Readers sound off on why they won’t vote for a Mormon

posted at 12:24 pm on November 13, 2007 by Allahpundit

True enough but would it matter?

A while back, one of my Romney guys said that in a general election showdown between his man and Hillary Clinton, there are two “landmine” moments. One is if Romney (or any male candidate, for that matter) says or does anything that sounds the slightest bit sexist.

As we’ve seen, facing tough questioning from moderators and criticism from rivals was enough to get Team Hillary to play “they’re piling on to a woman!” card already.

The second “landmine” moment would be, he suggested, if she says or does anything that appears critical of Romney’s faith. Looking at Robert Redford’s comments about Mormons from earlier today [See here. — ed.], I wonder if Romney vs. Hillary could be a matchup that would turn out quite well for the GOP…

I suspect that if Romney were to get the nomination, we would hear a great deal from those folks about just what’s wrong with “those” Mormons, and the rhetoric would be ugly enough to match the seething disdain, and irrational bigotry lurking in the hearts of the intemperate. Somebody ought to set up a pool to guess which figure makes the first horrific statement painting all Mormons with a broad brush: Rosie O’Donnell? Bill Maher? Michael Moore? Keith Olbermann? Frank Rich?

I doubt whether Frank Rich making a crack about Mormon undergarments would be enough to move the polls (although it would be primo blog fodder), but Jim’s right that that sort of thing is bound to happen. What if it does? Well, first, if someone like Maher goes after Mormons, he’s more likely to do so in the context of denigrating Christianity as a whole, e.g. “Sure, Mormonism’s weird, but is it any weirder than the Catholic Church?” Americans are generally willing to tolerate anti-religious sentiment so long as it’s not focused on a “minority” faith. Second, reporters who want to inject this sort of thing without taking too much responsibility for it have an easy dodge available by framing it in terms of what Americans, not they themselves, allegedly believe. (“Romney leads in Iowa and New Hamphire but Americans may find his belief in some of the more eccentric aspects of LDS theology suspicious.”)

Third, there’s a huge open question about how solidly conservatives would be willing to line up behind Mitt on the religious issue if he’s attacked for it. Most will do so, partly out of decency, partly out of conservative tribalism, and partly out of sheer outrage at the left for being such filthy intolerant hypocrites, but the fact is that there are parts of the right-wing base even now who are warning him not to go around pretending like he’s “one of us.” (See this poll from September and compare Mormons’ numbers to Muslim Americans’.) The left may sense an opening there to peel some of them away; the trick would be to cast enough aspersions on Mormonism to scare off those voters without casting so many that even centrist Democrats become disgusted by the tactic. There are faiths that would disqualify a candidate who belonged to them in many voters’ eyes, Scientology being the most obvious example. The task for Hillary et al. would be to legitimize that calculus in voters’ minds and get them to thinking where Mormonism falls on the spectrum between Dianetics and the Bible. A scummy tactic but not hard to imagine.

One other point. While both sexism and anti-Mormonism may be landmines, the former is much bigger than the latter, needless to say. A crack about Hillary’s gender won’t peel off any Democrat-leaners the way an aspersion cast on Mormonism might among Republican-leaners; on the contrary, it would surely peel off a few women who’d planned on voting Republican (and potentially more than a few, depending upon how snide it was). Revisit this poll from February and compare the relevant categories: Americans overwhelmingly accept a woman candidate but they’re a bit more circumspect about Mormons, suggesting that they view anti-woman sentiment as essentially irrational but are a smidge more nuanced when it comes to LDS. That helps the left, but at 72%, thankfully not as much as it might.

Update: Martin Frost asked his readers whether they’d vote for a Mormon candidate. Most said they would — but not all. Click to see what Mitt’s up against. Objections to LDS’s alleged racism, its hierarchical nature, even the underwear. My favorite:

Jessica Elliott: “I can’t speak for all Christians or all Republicans, but I can give you an honest perspective from one average Christian mom who would never vote for a Mormon. You understand already that many people call Mormonism a cult. What you may not understand is that many of us see Mormonism as such a strange, ridiculous belief system that we have to seriously doubt the judgment of anyone who could believe it. It’s like asking us to consider voting for someone who believes they were kidnapped by aliens.”


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csdeven on November 14, 2007 at 8:07 AM

And good morning to you.
To answer your first question on who says you are LDS? Simple answer…you, you stated it in one of your posts. As I said, good for you embrace it. I do not know why so many run from their faith.
To say every religion is a cult, that is the new line of your church. A talking point that begin a few years ago. They decided that they would call everyone a cult, that way they could not be separated. A smart political move.
Thanks for the invitation to your church, I have been to many services. Just never to a temple service. Christ wouldn’t be able to go either. He never tithed.

but the Christian cult answer is yes.

csdeven on October 31, 2007 at 1:52 AM

As to your statement about the rest being untrue or as you so eloquently put it

The rest of your rant is outright lies.

read the above quote from you where you called it “the Christian cult”. Darn internet, you can actually go back a couple of hours and find what was actually said.
I guess with that exposed, I don’t need to respond to the rest of your rant…seeing that was the only thing I really discussed.
Thanks for calling me a liar, when you were (once again) the one that was incorrect. But I like your tenacity, your a persistent little puppy, truth won’t stop you.

right2bright on November 14, 2007 at 9:04 AM

right2bright on November 14, 2007 at 9:04 AM

Don’t try to excuse your bigotry. You are completely clueless on the LDS faith and you ought to just stop pretending you aren’t.

csdeven on November 14, 2007 at 9:40 AM

Simple answer…you, you stated it in one of your posts.

Produce it.

csdeven on November 14, 2007 at 9:46 AM

Mormons care? We already knew that and it still makes no difference.

jeanie on November 14, 2007 at 9:47 AM

csdeven on November 14, 2007 at 9:46 AM

How about this. We each send in a $1,000 check to AP made out to whatever charity we want, if I don’t have the quote from you, then AP sends my check to the charity. If I do have that quote, then AP sends your check.
Deal?
That way when I come up with the quote (in about 10 seconds now, actually about two keystrokes to insert) then you won’t say…oh no big deal, and go on your merry way.
A charity somewhere is a winner. On second thought, maybe you never posted it…and your charity wins. Well it’s too late, I made the offer..I think you got me. Go for it.

right2bright on November 14, 2007 at 10:01 AM

csdeven on November 14, 2007 at 9:40 AM

Funny, I thought sure I caught you in a mis truth again. Here read this again.

right2bright on November 14, 2007 at 9:04 AM

See where you did call Christians a cult? and see where you said that I was not telling the truth?
A simple apology would be nice. When you call someone a liar, and you are wrong, seems like you would be a little more humble? But you are a tough cookie, a real tiger, even called me a bigot…like I stated in a post, you won’t let the facts or truth get in the way of your thinking.
Unless you take me up on your offer of a charity check…this conversation is finished with you. If you can’t own up to your obvious, quoted, false accusations, there is no hope for honesty.
I can see why you hate Fred, and love Mitt. You embrace what you are.

right2bright on November 14, 2007 at 10:11 AM

Nice try, you lace your posts with personal attacks, and then call me the one that smears. *uck’in liar. Look at your smears. You were name calling me right out of the gate you stupid swine…you must live and drink in your own urine. I don’t have to sit here and have heaps of name calling foisted on me by some candidate groupie, because I don’t like his policies, and then be told not to retort. You stupid fool, read your posts, and then tell me how many personal insults you hurled at me, before I decided that I have had enough of your stupid ignorant, dirty mouthed insults…you are the type that makes personal attacks, because you don’t have the huevos to say it to anyones face. You are like the momma’s boy you support. Feel safe, and hurl your insults…I assure you, face to face and you would swallow your insults. Harrass someone else you little groupie, leave the thinking to the big boys that don’t start off each post with some stupid, smart-*ss insult. Wise up groupie.
Now back to the real problem, you are a nothing…
As I said, you think punishing Bechtel by giving them and additional–additional almost $300,000,0000 is punishing them, then please, God, have Mitt punish me.

right2bright on November 13, 2007 at 10:01 PM

LOL. The real r2b has finally surfaced. Maybe you should call an exorcist! If you can’t handle being called “not2brite” then I suspect that you really should look to the Dems to find your ideal candidate.

I have never used any other term to describe you, and you are lying when you claim that I hurl foul-mouthed insults at you. Indeed, I challenge you to go into the vault and prove your allegations which I have conveniently highlighted for you in bold type.

YOU clearly implied that I was callous about the death of another human being and falsely claimed that I was defending Bechtel. Frankly I can’t think of a viler thing to do than imply that someone does not care about another person’s life.

While you may not use nicknames you may want to try out for a different part because the role of the Saint just isn’t you.

As for your claims that Bechtel was overpaid, you link won’t open so I cannot respond to those allegations.

Buy Danish on November 14, 2007 at 10:19 AM

right2bright on November 14, 2007 at 10:01 AM

Stop playing your games and produce it or admit you’re a liar.

csdeven on November 14, 2007 at 10:22 AM

csdeven on November 14, 2007 at 10:22 AM

Funny, I caught you in the lie and you are now demanding me to produce.
Put up or shut up. Make it easy, you write a $500 and I will write a $1,000 check. Two to one odds, can’t beat that.

right2bright on November 14, 2007 at 10:25 AM

Hmmm, getting a little hot in here.

doufree on November 14, 2007 at 10:43 AM

Buy Danish on November 14, 2007 at 10:19 AM

At least you now get it…Maybe now you will use a little respect and stop the name calling. Always easy to do that behind a computer in the safety of your home.

Look at the audits for the big dig. Huge amount of data, but if you type in “Bechtel, big dig” you will get everything you need. It was from an auditors report. I have some meetings if you wait till this evening, I can get you some links.

Certainly did not mean to imply that you were callous, only cavalier about Bechtels role and there lack of responsiblity along with Romenys role of protecting them. No personal insult there meant.
I certainly meant to throw it back in your face with the other insults, it gets a little tiring when a post starts with an insult, glad you didn’t like it. You certainly enjoyed it when you were giving it. A little cold water always wakes people up. Funny how people will insult, and then pretend they didn’t…It was also a fair warning to others to post comments, not personal insults. Another guy keeps throwing out the bigot word, I think his brain is stuck on that word. He will learn his lesson (he already is running from his lies).

right2bright on November 14, 2007 at 10:43 AM

right2bright on November 14, 2007 at 10:25 AM

What’s easier is you producing the post.

csdeven on November 14, 2007 at 10:46 AM

right2bright on November 14, 2007 at 10:43

Not so fast, r2b. What I “get” is that you don’t being called “not2brite”. I am waiting for you to back up your false charges that I am a “liar”, “foul-mouthed”, and so forth.

As for Bechtel and Romney, you continue to try to blame him for actions which preceded his administration by decades, and you fail to give him credit for his repeated efforts to fire incompetent people well before anyone had died.

As for accusations that you are a “bigot”, what do you expect when you make a big deal out of what kind of undergarments someone wears? What’s your motive here, r2b? Do tell, and be sure to let us know how one’s choice of undergarments reveals something about one’s fitness for office.

Buy Danish on November 14, 2007 at 11:03 AM

Woops, I didn’t mean to put that whole thing in quotes! Just this -

right2bright on November 14, 2007 at 10:43

Buy Danish on November 14, 2007 at 11:09 AM

In my old, shucked-off protestant theology, I believed that I was saved by faith, but also that “faith without works is dead”. Hence, I was saved by faith+works, but no, I certainly wasn’t saved by works, because there was nothing I could do that could bridge the gap between me and Jesus because Jesus did it all and all my actions were for naught. Yeah, I know, it’s nonsensical.

Loundry on November 13, 2007 at 4:57 PM

This is nonsensical because it misrepresents the doctrine.

When we say that “faith without works is dead”, we can also say it as “works without faith is dead”. We have to put the saying in context. If one believes they have faith, but their works are not good, then they need to rethink their beliefs. If their works are good, but they reject faith, it doesn’t matter in terms of salvation.

The part you gloss over is with regard to original sin. Humans can not achieve their own salvation. But this is not an excuse to disbelieve in God because God doesn’t submit to human dictations to do things the way we want Him to.

Christ has already done what needs to be done for us. It is when we reject Christ’s gift of Faith and refuse repentance that we doom ourselves to full judgment for our sins.

Lawrence on November 14, 2007 at 11:44 AM

Hmmm, getting a little hot in here.

doufree on November 14, 2007 at 10:43 AM

Some like it hot and some sweat
When the heat is on
Some feel the heat and decide that
They can´t go on
Some like it hot, but you can´t tell how hot
Til you try
Some like it hot, so let´s turn up the heat
Til we fry

Some like it hot

- Power Station

MB4 on November 14, 2007 at 11:58 AM

Buy Danish on November 14, 2007 at 11:03 AM

Okay, I will try one more time. I don’t know why, you still will pretend not to get it. Pretend because no one is that dense.

As I stated. I chose just a couple of instances that the left liberals would attack, or try to divide. I just chose two because I did not want to throw to many variables. But apparently even two was very confusing for you. The two I chose was, Mormon’s undergarments and then their Masonic imagery, and would that protect people from evil. And the second was, Mormon’s believe that Jesus was a polygamist, that he was married to three wives. At least one prophet believed and stated that, and Mormon’s prophets, by definition are infallible.
So, trying to keep the argument simple with two examples, led you to believe I was fixated. A shame you can’t understand (notice on my posts at the beginning I noted that). Those were the two that I chose to illustrate the ease in which the liberals can divide. And it was shown how quickly the Mormon’s began accusing (and you never got around to the polygamy stuff), playing the victim, calling people bigots, and generally calling people names.
This post (look all the way at the top) was how the liberals will use his religion to divide and embarrass Mitt and his followers. And it was easier than I ever thought.
That is one of the reason I think Mitt will fail, not because he is Mormon, but because the liberals will have such an easy time of undermining and dividing. They understand the victim card, bigot card, better than anyone else…and now I know you are adept at using it also.

When challenged you resort to calling names…that won’t cut it in the race. You have no idea how I feel about Mormon’s and their religion. Playing devils advocate has it’s downside, one of them being skewered for saying what other will say.
I haven’t called you guys names, I have challenged your religion, and when you can’t answer you attack. The people won’t see it as bigotry, it will be subtle but ruthless. Read where I said he should go for the VP, until people can absorb his beliefs. If I was so bigoted, I would not want him in any position. Get it?
I use the one or two examples to stay focused. But I did not expect you guys to fold so quickly…have a little faith.

right2bright on November 13, 2007 at 1:55 PM

Here is just one (of several times) trying to explain to you guys of what was asked at the top. What will liberals do with the Mormon tag. And you answered it. Like I said, have a little faith.

right2bright on November 14, 2007 at 5:12 PM

i’m voting for Romney.

madmonkphotog on November 14, 2007 at 8:00 PM

right2bright on November 14, 2007 at 5:12 PM

Can the group gather from your refusal to produce the post you claim exists that it does not exist, or that you haven’t looked yet?

csdeven on November 14, 2007 at 8:07 PM

Jessica Elliott: “I can’t speak for all Christians or all Republicans, but I can give you an honest perspective from one average Christian mom who would never vote for a Mormon. You understand already that many people call Mormonism a cult. What you may not understand is that many of us see Mormonism as such a strange, ridiculous belief system that we have to seriously doubt the judgment of anyone who could believe it.

Stunning… This person thinks, upon reckoning, God will ignore their not voting for someone they think is cultish, irrespective that that person agrees at over 90% with their positions, and a reward them for allowing someone who disagrees with them 90% of the time on core positions to take the position of most powerful person on earth.

Let me break this down for you:

Mormon…
or
Leftist…

It surprises me that this is a difficult choice for the religious.

bains on November 14, 2007 at 11:29 PM

Let me break this down for you: Mormon… or Leftist… It surprises me that this is a difficult choice for the religious. bains on November 14, 2007 at 11:29 PM

Mormon or Moron.

If Romney gets the nomination it will split the evangelicals for sure. As a Christian I’d vote for him out of pragmatism but many of my brothers and sisters in Christ would not.

Mojave Mark on November 14, 2007 at 11:54 PM

But Mark, that’s my point.
Why would your fellow Christians sit out an election knowing that by doing so will result in a president (Hillary Clinton) that opposes your fundemental beliefs just to spite a candidate (Mitt Romney) who agrees with you positions overwhelmingly, just because you think his faith quirky.

bains on November 15, 2007 at 12:09 AM

csdeven on November 14, 2007 at 8:07 PM

I told you how I will reveal. It won’t cost you anything if you believe in yourself.
Either way a charity gets some money.
You responded to a question in the affirmative that you were, if you aren’t, say so. If you are, what’s the point?
Think it over, write the check or drop it.

right2bright on November 15, 2007 at 12:36 AM

csdeven on November 14, 2007 at 8:07 PM

Wait, sorry, on my post of 5:12 I wasn’t writing to you. What are you talking about?
Do you mean my post of 10:19 to buydanish, I gave him the same search parameters that I used. If he has trouble he will ask again. Don’t you worry about buydanish, he can take care of himself.
Or do you mean the one where you accused me of lies, and then when I pointed out you where the one who actually made the Christian cult statement, you hid in the corner and were not man enough to apologize? I think that is about 3 times I have caught you like that.
buydanish has moved on, I suggest you do the same, you already have enough egg on your face.
This one, remember:

csdeven on November 14, 2007 at 9:40 AM
Funny, I thought sure I caught you in a mis truth again. Here read this again.

right2bright on November 14, 2007 at 9:04 AM

See where you did call Christians a cult? and see where you said that I was not telling the truth?
A simple apology would be nice. When you call someone a liar, and you are wrong, seems like you would be a little more humble? But you are a tough cookie, a real tiger, even called me a bigot…like I stated in a post, you won’t let the facts or truth get in the way of your thinking.
Unless you take me up on your offer of a charity check…this conversation is finished with you. If you can’t own up to your obvious, quoted, false accusations, there is no hope for honesty.
I can see why you hate Fred, and love Mitt. You embrace what you are.

right2bright on November 14, 2007 at 10:11 AM

Man, you just don’t let up, even when you are nailed with facts. Now move along so you won’t keep calling people names.

right2bright on November 15, 2007 at 12:50 AM

but many of my brothers and sisters in Christ would not.

Mojave Mark on November 14, 2007 at 11:54 PM

That’s OK. Mitt doesn’t need nor does he want the bigot vote.

csdeven on November 15, 2007 at 4:14 AM

right2bright on November 15, 2007 at 12:50 AM

r2, earlier in the thread you predicted that Mitt supporters would resort to writing you off as for your religious bigotry against Mormons, and then proceeded to engage in a series of comments consisting almost exclusively of religios bigotry against Mormons.

Just wanted to get back to you on that and mention how lame that was.

Jaibones on November 15, 2007 at 8:14 AM

Jaibones on November 15, 2007 at 8:14 AM

Here Jailbones, let me inform you also. This is getting ridiculous.

right2bright on November 14, 2007 at 5:12 PM

Read that post, and maybe, just maybe you will understand. Look again at the top of this page. You will see what this thread is about. Look at the context of this thread.
Look at my other posts. I think Mitt would make a good VP, I just don’t think he is ready for President. He has not resolved, to my liking, his flip-flopping. Now if I was so anti-Mormon, why would I want him in the #2 position in the greatest nation on earth?
Do you know what the word devils advocate means? I jerked their chains, and it was easy to dislodge them from their holier than thou attitude. And just to piss you off, you obviously, fell into the trap also.
Just wanted to mention how lame it was that you did not understand this thread.
Get it now, we don’t allow real liberals on this site, so I took that role. And you guys folded like a cheap suit.
It ends up that I have more faith in Mitt, then his ardent supporters. He would never resort to the kind of spurious retorts as some of his Mormon brothers and sisters.
That should be the end of this…you should all be educated by now. It only took three times.

right2bright on November 15, 2007 at 8:45 AM

I jerked their chains, and it was easy to dislodge them from their holier than thou attitude.
right2bright on November 15, 2007 at 8:45 AM

Here is where you started the bigotry. And what do you expect when you call all Mormons liars…..

You are absolutely right, if anyone is schooled on dodging questions about religion and their faith it is Mormons. They don’t spend hours everyday before school studying and years on missions to answer straight questions, they are pros…which makes them good politicians.
He won’t be cornered, but it will be exposed.
Chip, chip, chip, chip, away at the fence sitters.
right2bright on November 13, 2007 at 1:13 PM

Then you try to get back to your so called “plan” to get the LDS members here to have a visceral reaction to your “examples”.

and 60 minutes says: So you believe that an undergarment made of cotton will protect you from evil…you really think that? And you are counting on that to help lead the country? The greatest nation on earth is depending on what undergarment you are wearing? And Mitt says blah blah blah…
and in closing 60 minutes will state something like this: Maybe we wasted our money on all of the Kevlar for our soldiers, maybe we just needed to send them some pajamas…this is Morey Schaffer for 60 minutes.

Morey would NEVER ask that question and you know it. This is an excuse for you to bleat your bigotry and try to hide behind the excuse that you are just given an “example”. You blew it because your 1:13 post exposed you as a “Christian” bigot.

Here are more examples…..

Let’s not get into the Masonic emblems on the underwear. Do you know how irrational people are about Masonic emblems? Goodbye Catholic vote.

The Masonic compass is stitched over the left breast of the Mormon temple garment. In esoteric Masonry I was taught that the compass represents the sacred Goddess. This is because the compass is used to describe a circle in geometry, and the circle is the consummate symbol of the Goddess in Wicca. Hence all coven ritual is conducted in a circle. …the ‘point’ of the sacred coven circle actually is the womb of the high priestess who represents the Goddess. The circle then is a symbol of the Queen of heaven; and the compass is her chief tool.

This is the garbage (but sincere to some) he (Mitt) and his followers are up against.
We haven’t even touched the Jesus is married and polygamist beliefs, and you are already in hot water on hot air.

right2bright on November 13, 2007 at 1:43 PM

This is more of your bigotry, disguised as “examples” of what questions the media will ask.

If followers cannot defend simple statements that I have brought forth, then how is Mitt going to be selected. I have stated several times, it is unfair, but fair game. This if for keeps.
I could bring up dozens of examples, but concentrating on a couple keeps the discussion focused.

right2bright on November 13, 2007 at 1:48 PM

Mitt wont have to answer these questions and you know it. This is more bigotry on your part.

Calling out the “bigotry” card is what I said would happen. I am a Mormon victim won’t cut it (Hillary tried on the gender).

When challenged you resort to calling names…that won’t cut it in the race. You have no idea how I feel about Mormon’s and their religion. Playing devils advocate has it’s downside, one of them being skewered for saying what other will say.
I haven’t called you guys names,
right2bright on November 13, 2007 at 1:55 PM

Yeah, ya did call them names. You escalated this because you wanted people to get irritated to the point where they would attack you. Well, BIGOT, they obliged you because YOU STARTED IT.

This is the post where you said that all Mormons were purposely deceitful. LIARS.

You are absolutely right, if anyone is schooled on dodging questions about religion and their faith it is Mormons. They don’t spend hours everyday before school studying and years on missions to answer straight questions, they are pros…which makes them good politicians.
He won’t be cornered, but it will be exposed.
Chip, chip, chip, chip, away at the fence sitters.
right2bright on November 13, 2007 at 1:13 PM

So spare us the BS. You know as well as I that you are only trying to do what I did to you the first time you tried to take me on. The difference is that I NEVER called you a name. I ridiculed groupies and you came out of the closet exposing yourself as a Fred groupie.

Next time you want to try and play with the big dogs, remember this phrase:

“When you throw a rock at a pack of dogs, the one that yelps is the one you hit”

Here is the thing you don’t get. Mormons are the most attacked faith in America today. Bigots like you have thousands of websites devoted entirely to defaming and casting aspersions on people of the LDS faith. Every person of the LDS faith (with the exception of a few) have heard the line you have been using here for many, many, years. You bigots are like parrots. You sit in your “Christian” pews on Sunday and listen to your paid pastor rail against a religion that is no threat to you whatsoever. But he creates a bad guy for you to be afraid of. He does this to keep you dependent on him to keep you protected against the evils of the world. They do the same thing with Harry Potter. They rail against the books as a serious threat to your children. Why does he create these imaginary monsters? To keep you funneling the tithes into his pockets. It’s that simple. The Christianity he claims to teach is a very simple faith and without a clear and present danger to his flock, there isn’t much need for him and many folks would stay home and give their tithings to someone else.

This is the constant with people like you. You study the LDS faith in order to demean and destroy the faith that others have in something that you don’t agree with. You will pay a huge penalty some day because you are spreading lies and half truths in order to destroy that faith.

Here is what you cannot do that the LDS can do. Preach your faith without tearing down others. The LDS NEVER speak poorly of another faith in their churches or while on missions. It is a basic principle of their faith. Yet, people flock to the teachings. You cannot do that. The proof is in your behavior here and in your daily life. I know this to be true because the amount of typical BS lies you spew about the LDS faith isn’t something you learn overnight. You are steeped in this culture of hate. I think your problem is that you are bored and you have a confrontational snarky personality. You understand your faith, but your bored because there is nothing new to learn. You see the LDS teaching that mans learning isn’t limited to the basic salvation that you learned. You see them explain many of the passages in the bible that you cannot explain and that scares you. So, you attack it in order to convince yourself that you are on the right track and because you love confrontation.

I challenge you to put that life away and preach the message of Christ. The message of love. The message of salvation through accepting the Lord Jesus Christ as your savior. Let his light change you from a snarky person to a kind and understanding person. I do care about you and I believe you have a good heart and want to do the right thing.

Peace and cheers.

csdeven on November 15, 2007 at 12:17 PM

Well, that was all screwed up.

I jerked their chains, and it was easy to dislodge them from their holier than thou attitude.
right2bright on November 15, 2007 at 8:45 AM

Here is where you started the bigotry. And what do you expect when you call all Mormons liars…..

You are absolutely right, if anyone is schooled on dodging questions about religion and their faith it is Mormons. They don’t spend hours everyday before school studying and years on missions to answer straight questions, they are pros…which makes them good politicians.
He won’t be cornered, but it will be exposed.
Chip, chip, chip, chip, away at the fence sitters.
right2bright on November 13, 2007 at 1:13 PM

Then you try to get back to your so called “plan” to get the LDS members here to have a visceral reaction to your “examples”.

and 60 minutes says: So you believe that an undergarment made of cotton will protect you from evil…you really think that? And you are counting on that to help lead the country? The greatest nation on earth is depending on what undergarment you are wearing? And Mitt says blah blah blah…
and in closing 60 minutes will state something like this: Maybe we wasted our money on all of the Kevlar for our soldiers, maybe we just needed to send them some pajamas…this is Morey Schaffer for 60 minutes.

Morey would NEVER ask that question and you know it. This is an excuse for you to bleat your bigotry and try to hide behind the excuse that you are just given an “example”. You blew it because your 1:13 post exposed you as a “Christian” bigot.

Here are more examples…..

Let’s not get into the Masonic emblems on the underwear. Do you know how irrational people are about Masonic emblems? Goodbye Catholic vote.

The Masonic compass is stitched over the left breast of the Mormon temple garment. In esoteric Masonry I was taught that the compass represents the sacred Goddess. This is because the compass is used to describe a circle in geometry, and the circle is the consummate symbol of the Goddess in Wicca. Hence all coven ritual is conducted in a circle. …the ‘point’ of the sacred coven circle actually is the womb of the high priestess who represents the Goddess. The circle then is a symbol of the Queen of heaven; and the compass is her chief tool.

This is the garbage (but sincere to some) he (Mitt) and his followers are up against.
We haven’t even touched the Jesus is married and polygamist beliefs, and you are already in hot water on hot air.

right2bright on November 13, 2007 at 1:43 PM

This is more of your bigotry, disguised as “examples” of what questions the media will ask.

If followers cannot defend simple statements that I have brought forth, then how is Mitt going to be selected. I have stated several times, it is unfair, but fair game. This if for keeps.
I could bring up dozens of examples, but concentrating on a couple keeps the discussion focused.

right2bright on November 13, 2007 at 1:48 PM

Mitt wont have to answer these questions and you know it. This is more bigotry on your part.

Calling out the “bigotry” card is what I said would happen. I am a Mormon victim won’t cut it (Hillary tried on the gender).

When challenged you resort to calling names…that won’t cut it in the race. You have no idea how I feel about Mormon’s and their religion. Playing devils advocate has it’s downside, one of them being skewered for saying what other will say.
I haven’t called you guys names,
right2bright on November 13, 2007 at 1:55 PM

Yeah, ya did call them names. You escalated this because you wanted people to get irritated to the point where they would attack you. Well, BIGOT, they obliged you because YOU STARTED IT.

This is the post where you said that all Mormons were purposely deceitful. LIARS.

You are absolutely right, if anyone is schooled on dodging questions about religion and their faith it is Mormons. They don’t spend hours everyday before school studying and years on missions to answer straight questions, they are pros…which makes them good politicians.
He won’t be cornered, but it will be exposed.
Chip, chip, chip, chip, away at the fence sitters.
right2bright on November 13, 2007 at 1:13 PM

So spare us the BS. You know as well as I that you are only trying to do what I did to you the first time you tried to take me on. The difference is that I NEVER called you a name. I ridiculed groupies and you came out of the closet exposing yourself as a Fred groupie.

Next time you want to try and play with the big dogs, remember this phrase:

“When you throw a rock at a pack of dogs, the one that yelps is the one you hit”

Here is the thing you don’t get. Mormons are the most attacked faith in America today. Bigots like you have thousands of websites devoted entirely to defaming and casting aspersions on people of the LDS faith. Every person of the LDS faith (with the exception of a few) have heard the line you have been using here for many, many, years. You bigots are like parrots. You sit in your “Christian” pews on Sunday and listen to your paid pastor rail against a religion that is no threat to you whatsoever. But he creates a bad guy for you to be afraid of. He does this to keep you dependent on him to keep you protected against the evils of the world. They do the same thing with Harry Potter. They rail against the books as a serious threat to your children. Why does he create these imaginary monsters? To keep you funneling the tithes into his pockets. It’s that simple. The Christianity he claims to teach is a very simple faith and without a clear and present danger to his flock, there isn’t much need for him and many folks would stay home and give their tithings to someone else.

This is the constant with people like you. You study the LDS faith in order to demean and destroy the faith that others have in something that you don’t agree with. You will pay a huge penalty some day because you are spreading lies and half truths in order to destroy that faith.

Here is what you cannot do that the LDS can do. Preach your faith without tearing down others. The LDS NEVER speak poorly of another faith in their churches or while on missions. It is a basic principle of their faith. Yet, people flock to the teachings. You cannot do that. The proof is in your behavior here and in your daily life. I know this to be true because the amount of typical BS lies you spew about the LDS faith isn’t something you learn overnight. You are steeped in this culture of hate. I think your problem is that you are bored and you have a confrontational snarky personality. You understand your faith, but your bored because there is nothing new to learn. You see the LDS teaching that mans learning isn’t limited to the basic salvation that you learned. You see them explain many of the passages in the bible that you cannot explain and that scares you. So, you attack it in order to convince yourself that you are on the right track and because you love confrontation.

I challenge you to put that life away and preach the message of Christ. The message of love. The message of salvation through accepting the Lord Jesus Christ as your savior. Let his light change you from a snarky person to a kind and understanding person. I do care about you and I believe you have a good heart and want to do the right thing.

Peace and cheers.

csdeven on November 15, 2007 at 12:22 PM

csdeven on November 15, 2007 at 12:17 PM

I didn’t read your post but the first sentence or two, I am sure you called me a bigot several times.

You are a person who was caught in a lie, when confronted, retorts by calling me a bigot.
How about responding to my post where I caught you lying?

Nevermind, you won’t admit it, even with the facts posted so plainly.
Here read this again:

right2bright on November 14, 2007 at 10:11 AM

and then read this again:

right2bright on November 15, 2007 at 8:45 AM

Now you should understand…but you won’t. You love the word bigot, if only you knew what it meant. Wait, didn’t you call it a “Christian cult”, whooooooo’s the bigot (by your definition)? Move on, this thread was a devils advocate thread, read (I have said this so many times) the headlines…as I had stated almost from the gitgo, and stated many times. Like I said, Mitt would be great as VP, where we would find out what he really believes…do you think I would want a Mormon as VP if I hated them so much? Read, learn, listen, please.
With your rants, maybe what I was stating as a joust, is accurate after all…maybe Mormons are nuts. Nawwww, I won’t judge them by one crazy weirdo.
You should embrace and live your faith…it is important.

right2bright on November 15, 2007 at 12:36 PM

By that “logic,” I would never be able to vote for a Protestant.

rightwingprof on November 15, 2007 at 1:20 PM

right2bright on November 15, 2007 at 12:36 PM

You aren’t fooling anyone. You read the entire thing and choked on every point because I nailed your sorry butt.

Second, you never have a problem finding all kinds of comments to prove your points, but when you claim I said I was LDS, for some reason, you cannot produce the comment. You want to make this easy, just produce the post without all the BS about donations etc to charity.

You, are a straight up bigot. I seen that the very first time I seen you make any mention of the LDS faith.

csdeven on November 15, 2007 at 3:11 PM

When Kennedy ran the meme was: “He’ll take his orders straight from the Pope”.

He didn’t.

So Mitt will take his from… The Mormon Tabernacle Choir?

heldmyw on November 15, 2007 at 3:18 PM

And I highly, highly doubt you are bound for outer darkness, Loudry. I’m no judge, but I’m fairly certain on that one. In fact, I doubt it is possible for you to go there.

Vanceone on November 13, 2007 at 5:04 PM

+100

It’s official: Mormons are better humans than Baptists are.

Romney > Huckabee

Loundry hearts Vanceone in a very non-gay way.

Loundry on November 15, 2007 at 3:30 PM

Ho hum. I haven’t checked this thread since yesterday, but I see that right2bright has not been able to provide any evidence that I am a “liar”, “dirty-mouthed”, and so forth.

I suppose I shouldn’t hold my breath.

Buy Danish on November 15, 2007 at 5:30 PM

Buy Danish on November 15, 2007 at 5:30 PM

Check my post at 12:22. I nailed her a$$ to the wall!

csdeven on November 15, 2007 at 6:02 PM

Buy Danish on November 15, 2007 at 5:30 PM

Calling someone not bright is what? A compliment? That is a filthy comment, btw, able to post while behind a computer safe at home, makes you what some would call a “girlie-man.
You insult, but when some defends themselves you cry like a baby.
You made a personal insult, and I slapped back, when you would not apologize. Now you whine, sorry live in the muck you created.
csdeven was shown to be a liar, and made personal attacks, but he also is not man enough to apologize. So I have the same disdain for him. You represent your faith well…congratulations.

right2bright on November 15, 2007 at 12:50 AM

right2bright on November 15, 2007 at 7:13 PM

right2bright on November 15, 2007 at 7:13 PM

Surely you jest. How about if I just said that your 7:13 comment is perfectly idiotic? Would that be less “filthy” in your estimation?

Sheesh.

And since you’ve now made a brand new claim that ‘when someone defends themselves (sic) I cry like a baby’, I trust you will substantiate that with specific quotes to back up your hilarious allegation.

Methinks you may be projecting just a bit, but I digress.

P.S. I am a member of the female sex so you may want to come up with a more fitting retort than calling me a “girlie-man”. Give it your best shot!

Buy Danish on November 15, 2007 at 7:30 PM

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