Unfortunately, they will also have very little body….

If you want to get in to the fight you’re trying to get in to, perhaps you should find someone who is saying the things that you’re mocking. You should seek out someone who’s “Bible thumping”, preaching, reciting verses, etc. I’m not, nor do I ever, do any of those things. Again, this is your hatred that blinds you to that, because you’re desperate to have this fight with someone… but you’ve got the wrong guy. It’s like going in to a thread about Iraq and taking people’s comments on the situation and then replying to them with attacks on the economy. You’re simply trying to argue with some imaginary Christian you’ve built up to hate, and you want me to be him.

Now, I’m sorry no one else bit your “but why do kids get cancer!?” crap that you kept shouting over and over, hoping someone would get in to it with you… but you need to just accept that none of them would, rather than repeatedly trying to put words in my mouth and then insist I explain them.

Once more, you’re insane and in desperate need of help. I just hope you’re locked up before you hurt someone.

Let me know how I’m doing.

Doing a real bang up job of looking like a fool.

Again, you’re just pathetic and desperate…

“Christian love” strikes again! Will you pray with me so that I can accept Jesus Christ into my heart? You’re such a loving person that you’ve convinced me that Christianity is true!

Is again, a desperate attempt to get me to talk to you. You must recognize this.

I don’t, because I’m not even close to being desperate. I can dust off one-one-hundredth of my brainpower and inspire you into a frothy-mouthed frenzy, as I’ve seen time and time again in this very thread.

You’re said NOTHING devastating to me at all

Then why are you so upset?

I’m simply pointing out that you’re an obnoxious tactless troll, and explain why I won’t bother to engage you.

And yet, you’re *still* engaging me. So forgive me if your explanation seems a bit disingenuous. It wouldn’t be the first time a Christian has lied like a rug.

You’ve decided, up front, to be a hateful SOB with no intention of having an intelligent conversation…

So let’s have an intelligent conversation. We’ll start by you choosing to answer the question that you have desperately tried to avoid:

If your god is omnipotent and loving, then why does he let young children die slow and painful deaths?

You’re desperate to unload your hate somewhere, and because most abandoned the thread a long time ago,

Nah, I’m still here, ready to tear your faith a fresh new anus.

you’re desperate for someone to talk to.

You seem quite a bit more desperate to talk to me. Maybe you’re just projecting.

The point is, you’re like a Truther, in that you reveal that there’s no reasoning with you, before you even got started… so why bother?

Again, great question! Perhaps you should ask yourself that? Think about it hard while you’re busily avoiding the pertinent question about your imaginary god.

Why get in to an argument with someone who’s entire existence here is to be obnoxious.

My purpose here is to weaken your faith. I understand why that may be obnoxious to you. Perhaps you understand why the gospel is obnoxious to me, considering that you stubbornly maintain its truth.

So why would I choose to engage you on “the issues”, when you don’t raise them as serious questions in a serious discussion, instead you come on here and chase people around (who aren’t talking about what you want to talk about) and keep throwing temper tantrums to get them to talk to you about children dying of cancer. It’s not a matter of opinion here, guy, you are pathetic, desperate, and childish.

That sure is a very long, repetitive, and boring way to say, “I militantly refuse to answer the question!”

Once again, you’re not saying anything that is “scoring points”.

And yet you keep pouting and spitting like a hurt child. Is your angry diatribe just a big act?

You’ve got to be a kid or otherwise just an extremely unstable person (which I think we’ve established already).

Who is “we”? Are you talking to your alternate personality?

It’s not that you’re scoring points,

Keep repeating that and you might begin to believe that it’s true.

it’s that you’re an irrational nut, so why bother getting in to it with you?

Didn’t you already ask yourself that? Twice?

One needn’t look any further than your desperate attempts to bait various people throughout the thread.

And you’ve been faithfully writhing on the hook much more passionately than any of them. I can only thank you for your service.

Honestly, I’m not sure why I’m bothering,

Because you’re hurt and upset, and you need to reclaim your honor as well as punish the guy who wounded you. I don’t expect you to admit that, though. It’s not like the proud Christian is going to cede any ground to the annoying atheist with his pesky, irritating questions.

REally, you’re not putting words in my mouth or beliefs in my head? So you haven’t been obsessively sarcastically repeating things like “your God”, asserting that I don’t believe children with cancer have a serious issue, etc. etc. Be forthright?

It is forthright. Why, in this very thread you told me I was throwing a “temper tantrum” about something. Clearly you would prefer that I focus on a much more serious issue, such as evolution, right?

I was being forthright in the discussion I was having with others… But you aren’t worthy of serious debate, when it’s all about YOUR single issue rant to bait people in to an argument.

No. It’s all about your religion being false and the fact that when you die you will rot in the ground and you won’t go to heaven. The Bible is wrong, and that is that.

You NEED to make Christianity look bad. Again, not desperate, right!?

Of course not. Making Christianity look bad is nothing more than a prerequisite to weakening your faith.

Anyway lunatic, I’ve wasted enough time on you.

It sure took you a lot of wasting time to realize that. Isn’t the definition of insanity “doing the same thing over and over again while expecting different results”? Your most recent installment of “Christian debate” was even more repetitive than your other ones. Maybe you should be more judicious with the “lunatic” label.

I’ll just say this one more time, in hopes that you’ll recognize it at some point. You are truly a VERY unstable person. You are a deranged lunatic.

Did Jonah *really* live in the belly of a fish/whale for three days and survive the experience? (Yes/No)

I am totally serious about this. This isn’t you “scoring points”, it’s me honestly telling you that you’re clearly on the edge, and I wouldn’t be surprised to see you go on a shooting spree, because you’re clearly that insane of a person.

RightWinged on November 6, 2007 at 9:37 AM

That would make it very easy for you to hate– er, I mean, “love” me. In other words, you *want* me to go on a shooting spree. That’s why you’ve mentioned it twice now. It also dove-tails into that fake “Christian love” that I’m so bored with by now: you release a string of insults and then follow it up with, “I’m really concerned about you” to try and make you feel clean after releasing a torrent of Christ-sanctioned abuse. You’re not the first and you won’t be the last Christian to do that to me. Frankly, it would look insane to me if it weren’t so common.

But I’m not here to convince you that you’re crazy. I’m here to move your faith from “on fire” to “lukewarm”. Are you still chomping at the bit to be a “fisher of men”? Or are you feeling a little bit less secure about your testimony? Let me know how I’m doing.

1. I’m not “desperate”. Instead, I rather enjoy our conversation.

2. I don’t need your attention. What I need is to make Christianity look bad. You are merely a means to this end.

3. I’m not “putting words in your mouth and beliefs in your head”. Honestly, that’s quite impossible to do. Instead, you can be forthright about your beliefs, but so far you seem rather reticent to do that.

4. I’m just doing this to “piss you off”. I have far more noble goals than that.

And, again, it looks like I’m scoring points big time. I must be writing things that are devastating to your faith and you have absolutely no way of defending yourself.

Loundry on November 6, 2007 at 9:15 AM

Again, you’re just pathetic and desperate… You know that this:

And, again, it looks like I’m scoring points big time. I must be writing things that are devastating to your faith and you have absolutely no way of defending yourself.

Is again, a desperate attempt to get me to talk to you. You must recognize this.

You’re said NOTHING devastating to me at all, I’m simply pointing out that you’re an obnoxious tactless troll, and explain why I won’t bother to engage you. You’ve decided, up front, to be a hateful SOB with no intention of having an intelligent conversation… You’re desperate to unload your hate somewhere, and because most abandoned the thread a long time ago, you attempted to pretend to reply to a comment I made, when in reality your “reply” was anything but… it was simply Christian bashing as bait for an argument, again because you’re desperate for someone to talk to. The point is, you’re like a Truther, in that you reveal that there’s no reasoning with you, before you even got started… so why bother? Why get in to an argument with someone who’s entire existence here is to be obnoxious. So why would I choose to engage you on “the issues”, when you don’t raise them as serious questions in a serious discussion, instead you come on here and chase people around (who aren’t talking about what you want to talk about) and keep throwing temper tantrums to get them to talk to you about children dying of cancer. It’s not a matter of opinion here, guy, you are pathetic, desperate, and childish.

Once again, you’re not saying anything that is “scoring points”. I can’t believe you don’t recognize how childish you are by saying things like that either. You’ve got to be a kid or otherwise just an extremely unstable person (which I think we’ve established already). It’s not that you’re scoring points, it’s that you’re an irrational nut, so why bother getting in to it with you? One needn’t look any further than your desperate attempts to bait various people throughout the thread.

Honestly, I’m not sure why I’m bothering, but I feel the need to show you how truly insane you are:

3. I’m not “putting words in your mouth and beliefs in your head”. Honestly, that’s quite impossible to do. Instead, you can be forthright about your beliefs, but so far you seem rather reticent to do that.

REally, you’re not putting words in my mouth or beliefs in my head? So you haven’t been obsessively sarcastically repeating things like “your God”, asserting that I don’t believe children with cancer have a serious issue, etc. etc. Be forthright? I was being forthright in the discussion I was having with others… But you aren’t worthy of serious debate, when it’s all about YOUR single issue rant to bait people in to an argument.

More insanity:

1. I’m not “desperate”. Instead, I rather enjoy our conversation.

So you’re not desperate, but:

2. I don’t need your attention. What I need is to make Christianity look bad. You are merely a means to this end.

You NEED to make Christianity look bad. Again, not desperate, right!?

Anyway lunatic, I’ve wasted enough time on you.

I’ll just say this one more time, in hopes that you’ll recognize it at some point. You are truly a VERY unstable person. You are a deranged lunatic. I am totally serious about this. This isn’t you “scoring points”, it’s me honestly telling you that you’re clearly on the edge, and I wouldn’t be surprised to see you go on a shooting spree, because you’re clearly that insane of a person.

people who complain about their lot in life are crybaby whiners

Complain away crybaby. Blame whoever or whatever you want. Fine with me.

include parents whose children have died of cancer

When one comes to me and says “the death of my child is God’s fault” or “proves there is no God” I’ll have something to say but frankly it’s none of your business.

you should call those parents crybabies

Frak off, don’t tell me what to do.

Quick question, do you recognize that you’re a troll and nothing more?

I must be scoring points with you because you’re trying hard to diminish me. It also looks like you’re going back on your “I’m not engaging you” promise. I must be far to attractive a target for your “Christian love” and you simply can’t resist.

Do you admit that your initial “reply” to me, was anything but, because it had absolutely nothing to do with anything I was saying?

That’s because what I’m talking about (the fact that your “omnipotent” and “loving” god gleefully lets young children die slowly and painfully) is far more damaging to your religion than any boring conversation about evolution. I don’t even thing evolution is scientific, so we’d end up agreeing about far too many things anyway. What’s the fun in that?

Do you admit that you’re desperate to unleash your hatred for Christianity on someone, so you’re trying everything you can to bait me in to something, by putting words in my mouth and beliefs in my head (unrelated to ANYTHING I was talking about), simply so you can piss me off in hopes it will be enough that I’ll talk to you for a minute because you need the company. Will you admit all of that?

RightWinged on November 5, 2007 at 6:18 PM

No, you’ve read me totally wrong.

1. I’m not “desperate”. Instead, I rather enjoy our conversation.

2. I don’t need your attention. What I need is to make Christianity look bad. You are merely a means to this end.

3. I’m not “putting words in your mouth and beliefs in your head”. Honestly, that’s quite impossible to do. Instead, you can be forthright about your beliefs, but so far you seem rather reticent to do that.

4. I’m just doing this to “piss you off”. I have far more noble goals than that.

And, again, it looks like I’m scoring points big time. I must be writing things that are devastating to your faith and you have absolutely no way of defending yourself.

I don’t speak for God and you don’t speak for grieving parents so cut the crap.

boris on November 5, 2007 at 6:29 PM

You speak for yourself, and you seem to think that people who complain about their lot in life are crybaby whiners. I don’t see why that doesn’t include parents whose children have died of cancer, so if you really stand by what you said then you should call those parents crybabies.

Or maybe you’re having second thoughts about your “crybaby” accusation?

You still have the “too marvelous to happen by chance” argument. Even if science had a new lifeless earthlike planet and a few billion years to run the experiment you could still claim the creator slipped in some magical divinity to skew the odds.

If there is a creator my claim is that magical divinity to skew the odds happened when the universe was initially “designed” and has been coasting on natural physics ever since.

boris on November 5, 2007 at 9:19 PM

Lol, intelligent design (by scientists) = evidence for evolution, in the mind of evolutionists. Classic.

Scientists at the J. Craig Venter Institute in Rockville, Md., hope to take a giant stride in synthetic biology by creating a piece of DNA 580,076 units in length from simple chemicals, chiefly the material that constitutes DNA’s four-letter chemical alphabet. This molecule would be an exact copy of the genome of a small bacterium. Dr. Venter says he then plans to insert it into a bacterial cell. If this man-made genome can take over the cell’s functions, Dr. Venter should be able to claim he has made the first synthetic cell.

True it is an exact copy of living DNA, but it has no living parents. Life from non-life.

The enzymes, cell wall, and other necessary components for a functioning cell are much simpler problems and are not considered the essence of life necessary for reproduction. If it works it’s game over for the supernatural necessity debate.

Me swapping parts out of your water-powered-fusion engine is not at all saying I can build one.

A protein which replicates under certain conditions is fine and dandy but it isn’t life. Or do you think crystals are alive?

I don’t think you really understand the underpinnings of what you are saying:

Since we can mutate a plant to produce different colored leaves, thats the hard part. The easy part is making a seed…

But that is the question on the table.

OK, if that is the question on the table then I’ll have to go with “I don’t know”. Further, I’m not sure what tools I’d use to get the answer. “Free will or determinism” is another one I’ve given up on. “Coke or Pepsi” I’m working on. You appear to have put some thought into the origin of life question and that’s both interesting and admirable.

I exist and I will die. My children exist and will die. Somewhere in the 80 or so years one gets, I hope to behave morally, teach my children the same, and create a few things that live beyond me.

If there is an afterlife, I’ll be ecstatic. I’ll tell the Creator I did my best with the information I had. Not sure how that is going to fly.

Great discourse always gets swamped with a torrent of hosing. The angry puppet always lays out High School 101 proof that God is a fake or kids wouldn’t die.

The inverse of that argument is interesting: if God is real we would all be perfect, never feel pain and God would grant our every wish. In fact God would work for us. Pretty cool. That is why I know there is no God because he doesn’t do what I think he should. If you disagree I will beat you with this mallet until your head pops off

OK.

Meanwhile for atheists who know they are right: how do you prove an axiom?

The difficulty of arguing against Christian beliefs is there are so many ‘Christian beliefs’. A belief is something built upon faith. It is an axiom.

Now agnostics I respect. They admit they cannot prove the axiom. I admit to the agnostic that I cannot prove it either. I am hard wired to believe in my God. I admit my stand is based entirely upon Faith. This is my axiom. I Believe. Of this I am very very happy and it gives me much optimism.

To Punch I suggest you ask God to give you what you deserve and wait for the results

jumping to the question of whether evolution ultimately sits atop a universe behaving by chance or design

But that is the question on the table.

That adaptation exists via natural selection or selective breeding is not in question. Maybe that’s why you want to discuss that issue instead.

I do hope you choose to say that to …

I don’t speak for God and you don’t speak for grieving parents so cut the crap.

the Halo characters are good for profits–maybe the world wars and genocides of the 20th century in our world helped our creator’s stock price

Interesting times are a blessing and a curse.

That kind of argument always sounds like crybaby logic. God went and made me now He is supposed to take care of me me me! Wah Wah Wah life sucks and it’s all His fault!

boris on November 5, 2007 at 1:10 PM

I do hope you choose to say that to the grieving parents of a child who has died slowly and painfully of cancer. The funeral is an opportune moment for that truth that you seem eager to dish out, so I exhort you to push yourself in the weeping parents’ faces and tell them what crybabies they are. That would be “Christian love” in action!

Don’t worry about any reprisal. You’ll be in the clear because, as we all can see, you have chosen to incorrectly capitalize the pronoun “him” as proof of your awesome faith.

How’s your faith doing?

Are you feeling a little … lukewarm?

Loundry on November 5, 2007 at 6:14 PM

Quick question, do you recognize that you’re a troll and nothing more? Do you admit that your initial “reply” to me, was anything but, because it had absolutely nothing to do with anything I was saying? Do you admit that you’re desperate to unleash your hatred for Christianity on someone, so you’re trying everything you can to bait me in to something, by putting words in my mouth and beliefs in my head (unrelated to ANYTHING I was talking about), simply so you can piss me off in hopes it will be enough that I’ll talk to you for a minute because you need the company. Will you admit all of that?

Apparently the Microsoft creators of Halo disprove your conumdrum.

Doctrine in some of the Christian churches teaches that God is all-loving, all-knowing, and all-powerful. Within the scale of human experience it is incomprehensible to let a child suffer that way. You have to push God’s work off into the afterlife where he’ll settle accounts.

Microsoft may appear all-powerful but I’ve never heard them described as all-loving. The characters in Halo exist because the marketing department demanded it and the investors need to show a return. The deaths of the Halo characters are good for profits–maybe the world wars and genocides of the 20th century in our world helped our creator’s stock price.

Troll on trolla.

RightWinged on November 5, 2007 at 4:11 PM

How’s your faith doing?

Are you feeling a little … lukewarm?

Have been mostly BS and word games.

Actually, they haven’t. If you want to support your argument from assertion go ahead.

It isn’t essential for evolution to answer the origin of life to be valuable scientific theory. You’ve ducked that by jumping to the question of whether evolution ultimately sits atop a universe behaving by chance or design.

That’s why supporting a good religion makes more sense than none. As long as there is a critical mass of good believers civil society is possible. Otherwise nature abhors a vacuum and the role will be filled by ecofanatics, poor religion, or utopian politics.

This is similar to something I posted this morning. I’m skeptical of SETI, ID, and strong atheism, but do think that we can say that God exists in the same way that Santa exists, and fills an important role.

We might also be able to find God hiding in the cosmos with more powerful computers and telescopes, but I’m not relying on science to reverse engineer the universe and find Q.E.D. the existence of God.

why an allegedly omnipotent and loving god fails to end something like childhood cancer is a very serious inquiry

Apparently the Microsoft creators of Halo disprove your conumdrum.