bcf6a4abf7d8c78328b9…

It is a serious question and one I am admittedly bothered by.  Let me explain, but first I want to make it clear that I abhor Phelps and his protests at Soldiers funerals, and his entire anti gay campaign.

To be double clear, Phelps and his ch…

http://www.cjonline.com/stories/110207/loc_214323778.shtml

For Topekans, perhaps the most indelible symbol of the anti-homosexual pickets who attend Westboro Baptist Church is the church itself. And that is exactly what Albert Snyder wants to seize.

On Wednesday, a federal court jury in Baltimore awarded Snyder $10.9 million in damages, saying the church and three of its leaders were liable for invasion of privacy and intentional infliction of emotional distress as the result of the funeral picketing.

Write the editors of the York PA newspapers.

And go to:

http://www.matthewsnyder.org

I really do not believe his cult will continue for very long without him

I can only hope you are right. They are despicable excuses for homo sapiens.

Ochlan on November 1, 2007 at 12:46 PM

Then why go to such lengths to defend them? I know I’m getting into this a bit late, I did read all the comments, I still don’t get why the Phelps clan shouldn’t be held responsible for their disgusting actions. Like Lawrence said above, ( thank you for that bit of info.)these people are professional scam artists. Yea, yea, freedom of speech, constitutional rights… bla bla bla. I can only say, Ochlan and others like you, I hope you never know what it’s like to be in the position that the parents, relatives and friends of that dead soldier were in. They have rights too, the right to grieve their loss without callous, money-grubbing lunatics screaming at the funeral should be top of list.

It is only when I state – as fact – demonstrably untrue claims (about you specifically) do I step into the realms of slander or libel. You still have to demonstrate injury, of course, under tort law.

Ochlan on November 1, 2007 at 2:48 PM

Spoken like a true lawyer.

{sigh}

Please tell me that no one here believes these inbred mongoloids have any part of $2.9 million? They drive to these funerals in a 1974 Ford Fairlane station wagon…

Just because Fred is cheap, doesn’t mean he doesn’t have money.

The moment they attach specific individuals to their rhetoric they have crossed the line into slander or libel

Whoa there. Spoken or written, I am free to express my opinion of you specifically…of your actions, choices etc. This is how I interpret the Phelps actions…hence my defense of them. The “free speech” angle comes as a consequence of setting such precedent.

It is only when I state – as fact – demonstrably untrue claims (about you specifically) do I step into the realms of slander or libel. You still have to demonstrate injury, of course, under tort law.

Not that I’d say anything bad about you dorian…other than “get a haircut” ;-)

The fact that it has taken so long for someone to actually get upset enough to commit acts of violence against them is a testament to the forebearance and peaceful intentions of mainstream America. We’ve come an awful long way in our search for tolerance, ain’t we?

Subsunk on November 1, 2007 at 2:07 PM

Indeed. Fred is like the crazy uncle that is more a danger to himself than anyone else. He’s been around a long time and is an old, rich, pimple-on-the-butt excentric. And has never presented a physical danger to anyone except maybe those who follow him.

But this in no way excuse him and his cult following from personal attacks against our deceased veterans. Let it be clearly understood, he is not just attacking individuals, he is attacking everything that these individuals stand for… which is all the rest of us.

AprilOrit on November 1, 2007 at 1:12 PM

True. It will have to be one of the sons, though, or a close male associate. But a lot depends on who ends up in control of his money. Fred’s power comes as much from his money as from charisma. The general impression is that his money will be split among several and his cause will splinter. Or it will go to one person who will probably squander or pilfer it. And once the money is gone, the cult will start to die off.

Subsunk on November 1, 2007 at 2:07 PM

Exactly…

It may yet turn out to be a Pandoras Box…

Ochlan on November 1, 2007 at 11:48 AM

I doubt it, this issue is more of a personal slander/libel action and not one of repression of freedom of speech.

You have no idea how unclean I feel defending the Phelps clan.

Ochlan on November 1, 2007 at 12:01 PM

Trust me, yes I do…

Someone threw a bottle at their van window.

Unlike the Phelps clan, the bottle-thrower has actually committed a crime.

Ochlan on November 1, 2007 at 12:02 PM

As bad as the Phelps clan is, and they are pretty sickening, physical violence against them simply is not a justifiable response to their actions. As long as their rhetorical statements remain devoid of any specific individual they remain squarely in the domain of freedom of speech. The moment they attach specific individuals to their rhetoric they have crossed the line into slander or libel.

1. I agree with Enrique — what exactly did the suit allege? That some retarded, poor, radical homophobic people from Kansas went to his funeral and said mean things about the U.S.?

2. Please tell me that no one here believes these inbred mongoloids have any part of $2.9 million? They drive to these funerals in a 1974 Ford Fairlane station wagon…

Jaibones on October 31, 2007 at 5:52 PM

Haven’t read all the comments here and someone may have mentioned this, but Fred and family don’t protest here because they think America is gay and is being punished by God. That is just what they say to enrage folks. They’re real intention is to inflame passions so much that someone throws a rock at them or burns the old Fairlane so they can sue in court and get lots of money to live well for the rest of their lives. It is an act! A trap to get money from the US government for the enraged actions of some Marine buddy kicking their worthless asses. Our Men have been informed and comport themselves accordingly.

The fact that it has taken so long for someone to actually get upset enough to commit acts of violence against them is a testament to the forebearance and peaceful intentions of mainstream America. We’ve come an awful long way in our search for tolerance, ain’t we?

Now Phelps’ own tactics are being used against them. How is that bad for the average American? That average Joe can sue a miscreant like Phelps and be chastised for endangering our collective freedom of speech is ridiculous. Where is the Snyder’s right for redress? Where is their right to speak in all this? They chose to file suit. They won. It was deserved and I hope will hold up on appeal. Their rights of free speech were honored.

End of story.

Subsunk

I really do not believe his cult will continue for very long without him

Well his kids, like Shirley and some of the sons are pretty much out there on the forefront, I hope you are right also but I think they will continue if they can.

I really do not believe his cult will continue for very long without him

I can only hope you are right. They are despicable excuses for homo sapiens.

In that case, what exactly stops me from following you around with a loudspeaker calling you any and every name I can think of 24/7?

gekkobear on November 1, 2007 at 12:36 PM

Depends first on whether you come withing my self defense ‘bubble’ of influence. Depends secone on how long it takes me to get a restraining order.

It may yet turn out to be a Pandoras Box…

Ochlan on November 1, 2007 at 11:48 AM

Only as long as we continue to pass off this kind of harrassment as free speech.

I understand what you’re saying, Ochlan, but you do not understand the full measure of what you defend.

Thing about all the other fire and brimestone churches you mention, they don’t preach their message every Suday by standing across the street corner harrying other the members of other churches.

They used to stand on the street corner direcly in the path of parishioners getting verbal in their face. But the community had enough and Topeka has forced them to move a cross the street and to tone down the personal verbal assaults. And low and behold, it hasn’t impacted anyone’s free speech rights.

Except for their Lawyer backgrounds and deep pockets the Phelps cult is real close to getting run out of town and real close to losing their tax exempt status as a church. Fred is getting old and Topekans are pretty much just waiting for him to die. I may be wrong, but I really do not believe his cult will continue for very long without him.

Lawrence on November 1, 2007 at 11:33 AM

Bingo.

The soldier wasn’t a “public figure”, the funeral wasn’t a “public event”; but Phelps was there, with an uninvited crowd and a loudspeaker calling the dead soldier a homosexual. At a minimum that’s slander, and invasion of privacy.

You do have the right to protest the military. Can I recommend protesting at the capital, or outside a military installation; or one of a hundred public events?

However if instead you believe that harassment of an individual who isn’t part of the “public figures” group is acceptable, I’m confused.

In that case, what exactly stops me from following you around with a loudspeaker calling you any and every name I can think of 24/7? I don’t know of anyone who I’d be willing to spend a few vacation days stalking, slandering and harassing endlessly; but I also thought it would be illegal somehow…

Someone threw a bottle at their van window.

Unlike the Phelps clan, the bottle-thrower has actually committed a crime.

What sickens me most is seeing the kids holding the God Hates Fags signs…it’s like seeing innocent kids being taught white supremacy stuff.

You have no idea how unclean I feel defending the Phelps clan.

Westboro Baptist Church gets their ass kicked at a military funeral in Maryland.

Someone threw a bottle at their van window.

Angry Left Wing Mob runs the Phelps Family out of Frederick Md

There are plenty of hellfire & brimstone churches out there, all very vocal about condemning people to hell for their sinful ways…when will people start to challenge them in court, alleging ‘distress’ and seeking a payout?

It may yet turn out to be a Pandoras Box…