More BS…

Loundry on October 4, 2007 at 10:08 AM

Guess what. The day is coming when you will stand face to face before God to give account. You may think now that you will stand before Him and mouth all the same goofy stuff you have posted in this thread to His face in your own defense, but the truth is, you will fall on your face in horror and fear and be filled self loathing for the opportunities squandered when it happens unless you soon choose a different path than the one you are on. “Sorry, I never knew you” and “Depart from me, you’ve sealed your fate” is going to be a pretty awful last thing to hear from God for an eternity my friend…

Everything God does is moral

Which means that abortion is sometimes moral, because your god did it and everything your abortionist god does is moral. Thank you for confirming it, though I would have appreciated it if you didn’t wiggle like a worm on a hook. Forthrightness isn’t your strong point.

Again, pre-this age of grace, no one was saved from eternal death by any other means other than their faith in God’s promise to send the Messiah.

False. Elijah was saved by a fiery chariot. Furthermore, where does scripture justify what you claimed?

Even more, where does scripture say that the babies who were murdered by your baby-killing god had faith in the coming messiah and were saved by it? Considering they were Amalekites, it will be hard for you to support that they had faith in a Jewish messiah.

Actually, the “evidence” you seek does exist, but it’s contained at a place where unbelievers cannot find it. It exists in the hearts of believers

There is nothing in your heart except blood and tissue, unless you were using “heart” as a euphemism for your imagination. And, if that’s true, then you and I are in perfect agreement. I have no access to your wild fantasies about your selfish rewards in your mystical afterlife.

Unbelievers are spiritually dead already, so they have no access to the witness God sends to believers.

Then how did you come to believe it? You were “spiritually dead” too, once.

Again, the true response of the believer to ANYTHING that God’s word reveals is detestable to Him is hatred of said action. Those who stand against God and His word, believers will stand against, period.

You are NOT giving up on abusing gay people, I get it!

In response, I will NOT relent in attacking Jesus Christ’s character. An eye for an eye! If your god killed babies, then maybe he also had gay anal sex. Certainly gay anal sex isn’t as bad as killing a baby, right?

Again, whatever. You are attempting to rationalize sin by how it stands on a scale of your own design.

Those are awfully arrogant words from someone who WORSHIPS an ethnic cleansing baby-killer. Disgusting! How could you possibly be so proud of what you CHOOSE to do?

Again you are arguing a non sequitur. God does what He does, and what He does is totally just, regardless of how or I might like to interpret it for our own devices.

Actually, the non-sequitur is yours! Whether or not your god “does what he does” has nothing to do with your claim that your god had “no choice” but to mandate the violent murder of children and infants. If your god is omnipotent, then he wasn’t pigeon-holed into murder as you claim he was. You have no way out: your god WANTED to kill babies. I think he did it because he finds the terrified screams of babies to be as pleasing as the smell of burnt animal sacrifices.

The wages of sin IS spiritual death, period. We are all deserving of it.

I repeat: that “born bad” theology, so comforting to you, blows ponies.

Don’t confuse physical death with eternal spiritual death. God is just in that He has decreed that the wages of sin is spiritual death.

Since you’re trying to SPIN your god’s quite literal death penalty (did Herod experience a “spiritual” death in Acts 12:23?) for sin by employing the changed-rules of the gospel. Fair enough, I can play that game, too. Your god is still unjust because the sin of which you speak is Adam’s sin, and Deut 24:16 prevents children from dying for the sins of their fathers.

But, back to the Old Testament, if we’re all, in fact, sinful (Rom 3:23), then why didn’t your god kill everybody? You can’t claim that only a “spiritual death” applied because your god applied a literal death sentence to thousands of people, children and infants, over and over again.

People physically die, that’s the way the world works.

It’s also how your god works. In your world, he rips open pregnant women and you call it “justice”. You support abortion at least that much, right?

Again, you must choose.

You must choose to reject worshipping evil gods. If you have to be superstitious, can you at least choose a god that is NOT a baby-killer? You do have a choice, after all.

Did you read the commentary link I gave you. No, I thought not.

NRA4Freedom on October 3, 2007 at 6:10 PM

Why don’t you just make the argument yourself and stop relying on hack apologists to conduct your spiritual warfare for you? Put on the full armor of your god, NRA4ForcedAbortion.

None I’d wager…

Is violent, forced abortion sometimes moral? (Yes/No)

Non sequitur. Everything God does is moral, whether man likes it or not. People in past ages who lived under various covenants suffered the consequences of their actions, whether you like it or not.

Because they were murdered by your god’s psychotic followers, as BABIES, long before Jesus was ever born and long before the new covenant was instituted!

Again, pre-this age of grace, no one was saved from eternal death by any other means other than their faith in God’s promise to send the Messiah.

I’d rather just call you a worshipper of an evil, baby-killing god, which is the truth. You can dispute the “evil” part (by claiming that killing babies, violently, is good), but not the baby-killing part.

Whatever

That is wild speculation considering that there is no evidence at all of anyone enjoying any “glorious eternity” after death. Furthermore, it’s a recipe for abuse since, after all, what does it matter whom we torture or kill since their treasure is in heaven, anyway?

Actually, the “evidence” you seek does exist, but it’s contained at a place where unbelievers cannot find it. It exists in the hearts of believers and is born witness to by the Holy Spirit to the believer. Unbelievers are spiritually dead already, so they have no access to the witness God sends to believers.

In other words, “No, I’m going to continue to abuse gay people”.

Again, the true response of the believer to ANYTHING that God’s word reveals is detestable to Him is hatred of said action. Those who stand against God and His word, believers will stand against, period.

Have it your way, pervert. Gay anal sex is orders of magnitude less perverted and disgusting than your evil god is is because gay anal sex never killed thousands upon thousands of babies. If you started worshipping sodomy as opposed to your baby-killing, ethnic cleansing, abortionist god then that would be a moral step up for you.

Again, whatever. You are attempting to rationalize sin by how it stands on a scale of your own design. There may well be other people out there who believe that homosexual sex is far worse than anything else in the world. What then would make what they believe of less value than what you claim here. No, God dictates what is acceptable and what is not, and we are free to like it or not, but it will be applied to us at judgement either way.

That is so immensely stupid. How can an allegedly omnipotent god have “no choice” in anything at all? He can do ANYTHING! He has choices that you can’t even imagine! You are claiming that he was FORCED to kill those babies and children. Bullshit! He could have turned all those babies and children into potatoes, or he could have made everyone start having sex, or he could have drawn a square circle and called it “Wednesday”. He’s omnipotent!

Again you are arguing a non sequitur. God does what He does, and what He does is totally just, regardless of how or I might like to interpret it for our own devices. The wages of sin IS spiritual death, period. We are all deserving of it.

That makes absolutely no sense! How can you write such idiotic things to me? Let me try to spell it out for you:

1. If your god is just, then everyone should immediately die.

2. If your god is merciful, then everyone should be saved.

Don’t confuse physical death with eternal spiritual death. God is just in that He has decreed that the wages of sin is spiritual death. Everyone who has ever lived on this earth is born spiritually dead. Only those who are redeemed and become alive in Christ make it out the other end better off than they started. There is a saying about how this physical life is as close to Hell as a believer will ever get, but it is also as close to Heaven as someone who rejects Christ in their heart will ever get also. So I guess it should surprise no one that they who reject Gods free gift of Grace should try to grab all the gusto they can in this life, before its too late for them. As for physical death, God has decreed that it is for everyone to physically die, and then judgement.

As it is, your god willy-nilly kills who he wants and saves who he wants. When he slaughters millions of screaming, helpless infants, then you call it “just”. When he allows murderers and rapists (think Couey) to murder and rape, then you call it “mercy”. You can’t have it both ways!

People physically die, that’s the way the world works. Every single breath you take really is a gift to you from God, for at any moment He sees fit, your time and chance to come to Him on His terms and accept His grace for YOUR eternity is over. You really don’t comprehend how conceited what you are saying truly is in the sight of God, but someday you will see it and some day your knee will bow before him. It can either bow willingly and thankfully in this life, or by force in the next. Again, you must choose.

He had them killed! How could he “save them from themselves” if they were killed as helpless infants, or, better yet, as fetuses?

Reread it and stop to consider it. It really would be ironic for you to spend eternity in Hell because you were just SO angry at God for allowing the death of someone who is there at His side for eternity.

Why in the world did you put children in scare quotes? Are you implying that they are somehow not children? Do you need to read your Bible again?

Did you read the commentary link I gave you. No, I thought not.

Wrong. Senseless killing of your own kind is NOT the way of nature at all.

Syndic Nuruodo on October 3, 2007 at 4:01 PM

It’s the way of *some* nature.

Prides of lions typically have one male over many females. A new male may attempt to take over the pride by fighting with the current reigning male. If the new male wins, then he will kill each and every one of the cubs that were sired by the previous male. It’s brutal. And, from my own philosophical perspective, it’s senseless. I am an adoptive parent, after all. But the actions of instinct-driven animals are no basis for human beings who have reason and choice at their disposal.

Thank you for your reply. It is actually quite thoughtful and I appreciate it.

Unfortunately, you’re wrong. If you abandon the idea that mankind is special, no one has any right to life, liberty, or property unless the government grants them such.

Should the government decide that Jews, gays, the elderly, and/or the disabled are not worthy of life, then there is absolutely no reason for them to live.

In nature, the strong dominate and kill the weak. This is the way of nature, therefore it is natural and it is right.

Prove me wrong.

You’ve raised several interesting points here, and it’s hard to respond to you because I agree in some places and disagree in others.

1. I do think humanity is special because of our cognitive ability. The question “What is human?” is a complex philosophical question that is far beyond the scope of any discussion in this thread.

2. I do not agree that a government’s abrogation of an individual’s right to life, liberty, or property makes such an action just. Instead, that is the action of an unjust government. I do not see a great division between ethics and politics; rather, I think politics is merely an extension of ethics as it applies to matters of the force wielded by government.

3. That which is natural is unrelated to that which is moral. The behavior of instinct-driven animals is not a model for rational human beings with the power of choice.

4. “Might makes right”. Yes, or no, depending on how you look at it.

So I’m not sure how to respond to your challenge of “prove me wrong”.

It is contested whether or not homosexuality is dangerous to life.

You yourself commented on AIDS and its effects on the gay population. Add bisexuality and “bug-chasing” to the mix, spice it up with virus mutation and you’ve got a potential pandemic on your hands.

I will heartily agree that “gay culture” is harmful to life, because “gay culture” is merely a far-too-polite term for rank hedonism. “Gay culture” is about living in the ghetto, consuming drugs, pursuing sex, obsessing over youth and appearance, and, in general, living hard and dying young. It’s a pursuit of pleasure and a disregard for individual flourishing, as all hedonism is. And I also think that it is a cause of AIDS.

Note that I wrote “A cause” of AIDS, because I think AIDS is multi-factorial, and I do not think it’s caused by a unique retrovirus called “HIV”. That discussion is also far, far beyond the scope of anything in this thread, but do not presume to challenge me on it unless you know enough about immunology such that you can explain the polyclonal properties of antigens to me.

I didn’t say it was A-OK. I implied it was sometimes necessary to prevent a greater tragedy. War is never good. That doesn’t mean there’s no such thing as a just war.

I agree with everything you wrote there, but it does not apply to an omnipotent god. Nothing is “necessary” to your god. He is omnipotent and can do anything. He is also defined as holy and sinless, and that means that his choice to murder children and infants was good and holy. Frankly, I think it’s far more disgusting than gay anal sex could ever be in any circumstance, including prison rape.

If you would rather that all babies live, then you believe in the Judeo-Christian God moreso than the people who were annihilated by the Israelites, for they sacrificed their children on fiery altars on a regular basis.

In your morality, there’s nothing inherently wrong with murdering babies — it’s only wrong when your god didn’t tell you to do it. So I don’t understand your attempt to generate moral outrage over the baby-murdering antics of the enemies of the Israelites. After all, your god did it, too. I abhor all of it while you must excuse some of it.

This is exactly the same thing we see the Muslims doing to their children and the entire world right now.

Islam sucks worse than Christianity, agreed. That doesn’t mean I’m going to put up with Christian bullying. All I want is Christians to stop abusing gays, and I don’t think that’s too much to ask.

When push comes to shove, you won’t have the stomach to support what needs to be done to protect yourself from such a fate. That’s fine, as long as you understand from your protection comes and stop trying to eliminate it.

I beg to differ. If you and I recognize the threat that Islam poses to both of us, then we can join hands and be allies. If we are both willing to put down our animus toward each other, then I’ll take a mujahid’s bullet for your child when push comes to shove. But it takes two. Whether a Christian can stomach having a gay atheist as an ally against Islam is the salient question.

If I had to guess, it was like being raised Catholic, having either no father or a no-good one, and probably throw some abuse by the clergy on top for good measure.

Interesting. Do you really believe that my homosexuality was caused by abuse and/or bad parenting? Do you think that most homosexuality was caused by abuse and/or bad parenting? I’m not completely surprised that people feel this way — I’ve just never talked to someone who actually held on to this belief.

Myself (grew up Protestant), my partner (grew up Catholic), and our best friend (grew up Jehovah’s Witness), all three of us gay, all recently shared our experiences with each other growing up gay among religious people. Are you curious what those experiences might have been like, or do you chalk it all up to “abuse” and bad parenting and leave it at that?

Syndic Nuruodo on October 3, 2007 at 2:22 PM

How old are you, 5?

Logic works both ways here, isn’t it ? ;)

Syndic Nuruodo on October 3, 2007 at 2:22 PM

Actually, stupid, RESPONDING to an attack is quite different than issuing an attack via the use of lies. But then, as you said “logic works both ways here, isn’t it?”

If you abandon the idea that mankind is special, no one has any right to life, liberty, or property unless the government grants them such.

Do you mean that only your fear of “god” and the government
prevents you from robbing and murdering other people ?
What a nice morality you have then.

In nature, the strong dominate and kill the weak. This is the way of nature, therefore it is natural and it is right.

Wrong. Senseless killing of your own kind is NOT the way of nature at all.

Because it deprives them of life, and all individuals have the right to life, liberty, and property.

Loundry on October 3, 2007 at 10:35 AM

Loundry, thanks for answering my question.

Unfortunately, you’re wrong. If you abandon the idea that mankind is special, no one has any right to life, liberty, or property unless the government grants them such.

Should the government decide that Jews, gays, the elderly, and/or the disabled are not worthy of life, then there is absolutely no reason for them to live.

In nature, the strong dominate and kill the weak. This is the way of nature, therefore it is natural and it is right.

Prove me wrong.

Unlike gay sex which is *always* wrong, correct? You can come up with an uncompromising moral stand against consensual gay sex (which deprives no one of life, liberty, or property).

It is contested whether or not homosexuality is dangerous to life.

You yourself commented on AIDS and its effects on the gay population. Add bisexuality and “bug-chasing” to the mix, spice it up with virus mutation and you’ve got a potential pandemic on your hands.

But you have to waffle on the issue of baby murder. Murdering babies is sometimes A-OK to you, and that’s the burden of being a Christian: You have to make excuses for your baby-killing god’s horrible behavior and deal with the moral consequences of choosing a god that lusts for the blood of children and infants as your moral compass.

I didn’t say it was A-OK. I implied it was sometimes necessary to prevent a greater tragedy. War is never good. That doesn’t mean there’s no such thing as a just war.

If you would rather that all babies live, then you believe in the Judeo-Christian God moreso than the people who were annihilated by the Israelites, for they sacrificed their children on fiery altars on a regular basis. They did not love their own children and would have slowly but surely annihilated the Israelites. This is exactly the same thing we see the Muslims doing to their children and the entire world right now.

When push comes to shove, you won’t have the stomach to support what needs to be done to protect yourself from such a fate. That’s fine, as long as you understand from your protection comes and stop trying to eliminate it.

When have you walked in my shoes? Tell me: what is like to be me?

If I had to guess, it was like being raised Catholic, having either no father or a no-good one, and probably throw some abuse by the clergy on top for good measure.

From what I understand there is a disease called AIDS that is caused by GAY ANAL SEX.

ThackerAgency on October 3, 2007 at 1:29 PM

I have to comment on this again because it is really revealing about the Christian attitude toward gays. ThackerAgency can’t even get the mainstream AIDS dogma correct, which states that AIDS is the name of the syndrome which is caused by a breakdown of the immune system due to “HIV infection”. The mainstream AIDS dogma states that anyone can get “HIV”, gay or straight, through both anal and vaginal sex as well as through sharing needles and blood transfusions.

To ThackerAgency, that dogma is disregarded.

To him, AIDS is caused by gay anal sex. Period.

I think this is a mainstream view of many Christians: the dirty sex of gays causes them to get sick and die, and gays deserve to die painful and humiliating deaths. And, afterwards, gays will be tortured for all eternity.

I call this “Christian love”.

Pathetic how they can’t simply not believe without needing to attack Christianity…

JWS on October 2, 2007 at 9:22 PM

Pathetic, how they can’t simply believe without needing to attack nonbelievers.

Logic works both ways here, isn’t it ? ;)

Matthew 7
7:1 Judge not, that ye be not judged
7:2 For with what judgment ye judge, ye shall be judged: and with what measure ye mete, it shall be measured to you again.
7:3 And why beholdest thou the mote that is in thy brother’s eye, but considerest not the beam that is in thine own eye?
7:4 Or how wilt thou say to thy brother, Let me pull out the mote out of thine eye; and, behold, a beam is in thine own eye?
7:5 Thou hypocrite, first cast out the beam out of thine own eye; and then shalt thou see clearly to cast out the mote out of thy brother’s eye.

Do you really have a monopoly on morality?
And where’s your “love and compassion”, you atheismophobes? lol

Oh, I get it now, Loundry CLAIMS TO BE gay.

It depends on whom you as. There are plenty of leftist gays who deny that I’m “truly gay” because I don’t like drag queens or the “gay pride” parade.

Look dude, don’t try to get everyone to be OK with what you do. If you picked your nose, people would say it was gross, but you could do it anyway. Your problem would be with people calling it gross. It would be gross.

Christian abuse of gays goes quite a bit farther than merely calling it gross. Do some straights have “gross” sex? Do you treat them exactly the same way that you do gays? (Do I have to ask such blatantly obvious questions? Yes, I do.)

Do what you want, but you are accepted by Christianity.

I could walk into any Southern Baptist church and proclaim to the congregation that I am gay, and they would love me immediately and unconditionally. In fact, they would exalt me and wish they could be like me.

You are a sinner just like everyone else. Christianity begins there.

And that’s why Christianity sucks. The “born bad” theology blows pony.

If you don’t believe you sin, you don’t need Jesus. But homosexuality is a sin. Your ‘hurt feelings’ won’t change that.

ThackerAgency on October 3, 2007 at 1:33 PM

Notice the Christian bully excuses his vicious abuse by mocking his victim’s pain. How do you think it would feel to be on the receiving end, you pervert? I suppose if you can fathom loving a baby-killer and using him as your moral compass then you can excuse all kinds of horrible abuses.

From what I understand there is a disease called AIDS that is caused by GAY ANAL SEX. And I do believe it has killed. . . shall we say . . . ‘thousands?’

ThackerAgency on October 3, 2007 at 1:29 PM

This is a wonderful example of “Christian love”:

“Gays deserve to die from AIDS.”

Indeed, “all” you are doing is calling a sin a sin (and wishing death by AIDS upon gays as divine retribution for their sin). You gay-bashing Christians are so full of crap. What a sucky, deceitful religion you follow to go along with your sucky, abortionist god.

Furthermore, are you claiming that gay anal sex killed babies? Which one killed more babies: your evil god, or gay anal sex? It’s a competition! I think your god is presently in the lead and will stay there way forever, particularly since your god is omnipotent and could save all babies if he wanted to.

No, those were examples of God’s super love as requested by you from Exodus. God wiped out people on purpose by hardening the heart of the ruler of Egypt. After every plague, it was all “you, get lost! Oh, I’ve changed my mind for no apparent reason!”

He didn’t let the people into the promised land because they did not obey. His main commandment – that you still don’t get – is to OBEY the Creator! Why? Because He knows His Creation better than YOU. He LOVES His Creation more than you do too.

No, he waited until Moses was dead to let them in, as shown in the next book. It was specifically a slight against Moses.

Obey, indeed. Seeing as how I’ve not been told by God to do anything, what am I supposed to obey?

I bet Noah thought this God was pretty MERCIFUL for telling him that he was going to KILL ALL THOSE OTHER BABIES.

Wouldn’t it have been more merciful for your god to have just saved everybody as opposed to slaughtering the world’s babies wholesale? Your god is “merciful”, after all.

I’m glad you know the story though. Consider yourself fortunate. In Saudi Arabia they aren’t given the opportunity to hear the story of the ALL POWERFUL – yet LOVING and MERCIFUL God.

Merciful enough to kill babies and children? Yes, it’s fake “Christian mercy” to go along with fake “Christian love”.

Believe what you want. But using what you personally believe about homosexuality and using that to explain your hostility toward Christianity is disingenuous.

I will be hostile toward YOU until your abuse of gays stops. An eye for an eye! It’s pretty easy to be critical of you considering that you WORSHIP an evil, baby-murdering god. Disgusting!

Christians aren’t hostile toward homosexuals, homosexuals are hostile toward Christians because Christians call a sin a sin.

This is the “Big Lie” of Christianity. “All Christians are doing is calling a sin a sin.”

I challenge you to come out as gay and live that way for a year, telling all your friends and family that you are now gay. Tell me what your life will be like after that. Will it be in any way more difficult than living your life as a straight man?

At least we recognize that there are homosexuals here. Maybe we could let Rosie enjoy the fruits of Iran where there are no homosexuals. She could be the first and lead the homosexual revolution to those friends of hers.

ThackerAgency on October 3, 2007 at 1:26 PM

I repeat:

I don’t have to forgive, but I am willing to be polite if the Christians cease with all of the “pervert” and “abomination” excrement, only because I think Leftism and Islam are worse than Christianity.

Look dude, don’t try to get everyone to be OK with what you do. If you picked your nose, people would say it was gross, but you could do it anyway. Your problem would be with people calling it gross. It would be gross.

Do what you want, but you are accepted by Christianity. You are a sinner just like everyone else. Christianity begins there. If you don’t believe you sin, you don’t need Jesus. But homosexuality is a sin. Your ‘hurt feelings’ won’t change that.

gay anal sex never killed thousands upon thousands of babies.

ummm. . . do you also believe that smoking doesn’t cause cancer?

From what I understand there is a disease called AIDS that is caused by GAY ANAL SEX. And I do believe it has killed. . . shall we say . . . ‘thousands?’

How do you know that what God offers you can’t turn your “crappy as possible life” into something else entirely?

NRA4Freedom on October 3, 2007 at 1:00 PM

Because I am an EX-Christian. I know what it’s like to live your lifestyle and your crappy religion, and now I think it sucks.

When have you walked in my shoes? Tell me: what is like to be me?

Or, do you so enjoy your “crappy as possible” life

Do you understand that it is abuse of Christians which is the worst aspect of being gay? Do you understand that it is you and your perverted co-religionists who have fought hard to make my life difficult?

All I want is for the abuse to stop, and I don’t think that’s too much to ask.

And Do you REALLY think that your “crappy as possible” life is somehow going to magically change by convincing an “on the highway to hell” society to accept homosexual sex as “normal”?

If by doing so then they stop calling me “pervert” and “abomination” and trying to legislate against me, then, yes, that would make my life better. How do you think it feels to have the majority of Christians in the world think you’re despicable and a threat to children? Tell me, how bad does it feel to be on the receiving end of your abuse as opposed to the giving end of it?

Do you understand that people, particularly young people, see that in you and say, “Wow, Christianity sucks!”?

That is what this discussion is about.

Man, this present life is far more fleeting than that…it isn’t about now, it’s about forever after that. I truly hope you find your way.

In other words, “We Christians can abuse gays all we want in this life because their treasure is in heaven!”

Sick, sick, sick!

It was also cool when he screwed Moses over. “See that? That’s the Promised Land. You’ve been a jerk, M, so no country for you!”

Krydor on October 3, 2007 at 12:24 PM

Funny how all those things you mentioned before (assuming you were referring to them as ‘proof’ that He’s bad) were done to PROTECT the people who BELIEVED in ONE God. Notice also in those stories. . . did PEOPLE do the killing? or did God fight his own battles for himself ‘thank you very much’? – highlights a major difference in Christianity and other religions (Islam).

He didn’t let the people into the promised land because they did not obey. His main commandment – that you still don’t get – is to OBEY the Creator! Why? Because He knows His Creation better than YOU. He LOVES His Creation more than you do too.

Your god did not wipe everything out with the flood because Noah, Noah’s family, and two of every creature that walks the earth (yeah, right) were NOT wiped out.

I bet Noah thought this God was pretty MERCIFUL for telling him that he was going to KILL ALL THOSE OTHER BABIES. I’m glad you know the story though. Consider yourself fortunate. In Saudi Arabia they aren’t given the opportunity to hear the story of the ALL POWERFUL – yet LOVING and MERCIFUL God.

Believe what you want. But using what you personally believe about homosexuality and using that to explain your hostility toward Christianity is disingenuous. Christians aren’t hostile toward homosexuals, homosexuals are hostile toward Christians because Christians call a sin a sin.

At least we recognize that there are homosexuals here. Maybe we could let Rosie enjoy the fruits of Iran where there are no homosexuals. She could be the first and lead the homosexual revolution to those friends of hers.

Again, you can “think” anything you like, but that doesn’t make it truth.

That cuts both ways, Christian.

In other words, if you are going to play the game, you had better–

Stop trying to change the subject. Please verify:

Is violent, forced abortion sometimes moral? (Yes/No)

More or less

No, less! You claimed that everyone is going to suffer the same fate when, in fact, NOT everyone is going to be violently aborted by your god’s psychotic followers. You and I are living proof of that.

How do you know that they didn’t?

Because they were murdered by your god’s psychotic followers, as BABIES, long before Jesus was ever born and long before the new covenant was instituted!

Let’s suppose a different analogy.

I’d rather just call you a worshipper of an evil, baby-killing god, which is the truth. You can dispute the “evil” part (by claiming that killing babies, violently, is good), but not the baby-killing part.

Does suffering the consequences of those actions here take away from the glorious eternity that awaits him after physical death?

That is wild speculation considering that there is no evidence at all of anyone enjoying any “glorious eternity” after death. Furthermore, it’s a recipe for abuse since, after all, what does it matter whom we torture or kill since their treasure is in heaven, anyway?

The true response of the believer to ANYTHING that God’s word reveals is detestable to Him is hatred of said action.

In other words, “No, I’m going to continue to abuse gay people”.

Have it your way, pervert. Gay anal sex is orders of magnitude less perverted and disgusting than your evil god is is because gay anal sex never killed thousands upon thousands of babies. If you started worshipping sodomy as opposed to your baby-killing, ethnic cleansing, abortionist god then that would be a moral step up for you.

Again, a just and righteous God has no choice but to carry out that justice.

That is so immensely stupid. How can an allegedly omnipotent god have “no choice” in anything at all? He can do ANYTHING! He has choices that you can’t even imagine! You are claiming that he was FORCED to kill those babies and children. Bullshit! He could have turned all those babies and children into potatoes, or he could have made everyone start having sex, or he could have drawn a square circle and called it “Wednesday”. He’s omnipotent!

The only choice you are left with is that your god WANTED to kill babies and children. He did it more than once. And he also aborted some kids, too, by ripping their mothers open.

Why didn’t you suffer the same fate? Wouldn’t that be “just”?

No, it’s your fault that you choose to not look deep enough into it to understand the ramifications and results of man’s own actions in the past as it pertains to their dealings with a just and righteous God.

That makes absolutely no sense! How can you write such idiotic things to me? Let me try to spell it out for you:

1. If your god is just, then everyone should immediately die.

2. If your god is merciful, then everyone should be saved.

As it is, your god willy-nilly kills who he wants and saves who he wants. When he slaughters millions of screaming, helpless infants, then you call it “just”. When he allows murderers and rapists (think Couey) to murder and rape, then you call it “mercy”. You can’t have it both ways!

Again, you don’t know that He didn’t.

He had them killed! How could he “save them from themselves” if they were killed as helpless infants, or, better yet, as fetuses?

I honestly think you are holding on to “I’m right, and that’s that” out of pure stubbornness because your arguments are no longer making sense.

All of those “children”

Why in the world did you put children in scare quotes? Are you implying that they are somehow not children? Do you need to read your Bible again? Here it is:

“Now go, attack the Amalekites and totally destroy everything that belongs to them. Do not spare them; put to death men and women, children and infants, cattle and sheep, camels and donkeys.” 1 Sam 15:13

(Bonus question: what sin did the sheep, camels, and donkeys commit that warranted their deaths?)

that you are misconstruing the verse as referring to may be enjoying their eternity with Him

“I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me.” John 14:6, words of Christ

Where did the Amelekite children accept Christ? Kind of hard to do that since Jesus hadn’t been born yet and the new covenant hadn’t been instituted yet! Or maybe they were sucked up to heaven in a fiery Chariot like Elijah was? Where does scripture say that?

even now, while you are mistakenly using their physical death to help pave your own personal road to Hell for your eternity…

NRA4Freedom on October 3, 2007 at 12:21 PM

Even now, you are trying to change the subject of baby killing as a holy act (it was, according to your perverted morality) into something about salvation and my own moral failings. Get this straight: it is disgusting that you worship a baby-killing, abortionist god. I could perform fellatio non-stop for the rest of my life, and that would be infinitely less disgusting than looking at a baby-killer and deciding that you want him as your moral compass.

But don’t mistakenly fool yourself into thinking that defining people by who they choose to have sex with is anything akin to the “civil rights” deserving of people whose skin color unfortunately happens to define them in our culture.

For most of our country’s history we had laws that differentiated people based on skin color. We had a civil war that, in part, was fought to preserve enslaving people based on skin color.

There is something inherent in some people that make them strongly atracted to the opposite sex. I am and I’d find it astonishingly difficult if society told me that the right thing to do was to have a marital relationship with another man.

There is something inherent in some people that make them strongly attracted to the same sex. Some say it is genetic and some say it is formed in the early years. If it is either of those two cases I’d find that discriminating against gays marrying is analogous to anti-miscegenation laws which weren’t struck down nationwide until 1967.

…have a crappy-as-possible life until your well-deserved death from AIDS, then you just might begin to understand the depth of my bitterness…

How do you know that what God offers you can’t turn your “crappy as possible life” into something else entirely? Or, do you so enjoy your “crappy as possible” life, that you choose to run away from God for that reason?

And Do you REALLY think that your “crappy as possible” life is somehow going to magically change by convincing an “on the highway to hell” society to accept homosexual sex as “normal”? Man, this present life is far more fleeting than that…it isn’t about now, it’s about forever after that. I truly hope you find your way.

If your religious beliefs teach you that homosexuality is wrong, then you should be free to live your life in a way that avoids eternal damnation. Christ described the kindness of a Samaritan and further instructed his followers to love their enemies. If someone intrinsically feels that the only natural way for them to express love for another human being is with someone of the same sex, I think it is fundamental to our notions of American liberty and Christian love that we allow them to do so in a way that fully recognizes them. dedalus on October 3, 2007 at 12:33 PM

And that’s perfectly fine, and if and when you are able to convince enough of America that despite what the God of the Bible says to the contrary and that “gay is good”, then maybe it will become the law of the land. But don’t mistakenly fool yourself into thinking that defining people by who they choose to have sex with is anything akin to the “civil rights” deserving of people whose skin color unfortunately happens to define them in our culture. To the mind that thinks to itself, “do what thou wilt”, the perversion that is homosexual sex will seem a fairly small thing, compared to the mind that believes what the God of the Bible says is truly going on in this present world, which is perhaps all too soon to be history anyway. The truth is clear to anyone who reads the news, man IS ‘waxing worse and worse” in this age, the push to homosexualize the world is just a small portion of it.