Disaster: Half of British mosques are under quasi-Taliban control; Update: Taliban reportedly killed South Korean hostage for refusing to convert

posted at 11:37 am on September 7, 2007 by Allahpundit

“Quasi-Taliban” meaning they belong to the the Deobandi school of, ahem, “pure” Islam. Ponder the fact that Islamic radicalization in Britain is a trend dating back years and years, since well before 9/11, and yet despite the London bombings, despite the failed car bomb plot this summer and the airline plot last year, despite the endless warnings from MI5 of the gravity of the situation, the situation’s still deteriorating. To wit:

Riyadh ul Haq, who supports armed jihad and preaches contempt for Jews, Christians and Hindus, is in line to become the spiritual leader of the Deobandi sect in Britain. The ultra-conservative movement, which gave birth to the Taleban in Afghanistan, now runs more than 600 of Britain’s 1,350 mosques, according to a police report seen by The Times.

The Times investigation casts serious doubts on government statements that foreign preachers are to blame for spreading the creed of radical Islam in Britain’s mosques and its policy of enouraging the recruitment of more “home-grown” preachers…

Seventeen of Britain’s 26 Islamic seminaries are run by Deobandis and they produce 80 per cent of home-trained Muslim clerics. Many had their studies funded by local education authority grants. The sect, which has significant representation on the Muslim Council of Britain, is at its strongest in the towns and cities of the Midlands and northern England…

A commentator on religious radicalism in Pakistan, where Deobandis wield significant political influence, told The Times that “blind ignorance” on the part of the Government in Britain had allowed the Deobandis to become the dominant voice of Islam in Britain’s mosques.

Khaled Ahmed said: “The UK has been ruined by the puritanism of the Deobandis. You’ve allowed the takeover of the mosques. You can’t run multiculturalism like that, because that’s a way of destroying yourself. In Britain, the Deobandi message has become even more extreme than it is in Pakistan. It’s mind-boggling.”

Follow the link for a taste of the fanatical separatism that characterizes the sermons. The key is the boldface part, though: this isn’t a problem that’s being “imported,” it’s a problem that’s being exported, developed at home within the ideological infrastructure built over the course of years while the Brits looked the other way as part of a unstated bargain that allowed jihadist proselytizing so long as it was directed outward. In fact, to a certain extent, that bargain is still in effect. The Times notes that ul Haq takes care to stress that the Sunna only permits jihad overseas; that’s part of the “covenant of security” Muslims are supposed to abide by when living in non-Muslim lands. To see how tenuous it is, skip ahead to about 3:00 of the clip below (if you’re counting down) and just watch it play out.

One more note: ul Haq is the leader of the Birmingham Central Mosque, the largest in western Europe. I’ve written about Birmingham’s jihadist problem more than once, but still not as extensively as Rusty Shackleford has. This post is must reading. Take three minutes and go.

Update: Sweetness & Light catches a little Deobandi magic in action.

“Among the 19 hostages who returned on the second (of September), some were asked by the Taliban to convert and when they rejected, they were assaulted and severely beaten,” reported Park Eun-jo, pastor of the hostages’ home church, Saemmul Presbyterian Church in Bundang, just south of the South Korean capital Seoul.

“I heard from the hostages that they were threatened with death,” he added, according to Christian Today Korea. “Especially it is known that the reason Pastor Bae Hyung-kyu was murdered was because he refused the Taliban’s demand to convert.”…

Meanwhile, medical examinations showed no signs that the last 12 women were raped and none reported being sexually harassed despite reports from the first two released hostages – both women – who said they were repeatedly raped by their captors, according to an ABC News report on Saturday.

Mirajuddin Pathan, the governor of Ghazni province, had also said he received reports that “various Taliban commanders were fighting over the women hostages” and that “[t]hey were abused over and over“, according to ABC News.

Update: The Daily Mail has some of ul Haq’s greatest hits in bullet point form. Enjoy.

Update: Right on cue, the first Muslim contributor to the Guardian’s opinion website steps up to defend ul Haq and the Deobandi school. Click.

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I forget where I heard it, but it was in reference to Palestinians. They have plenty of children so that it doesn’t matter how long the battle with the jews takes. They will win someday.

Perhaps with paradise waiting, time is not an issue. Nothing needs to happen now, it just needs to happen eventually. No rush, just victory.

sunny on September 7, 2007 at 11:45 AM

sunny on September 7, 2007 at 11:45 AM

Steyn’s point.

JiangxiDad on September 7, 2007 at 11:48 AM

sunny on September 7, 2007 at 11:45 AM

like it or not; that is a real problem on this planet. The advanced cultures (american, europe, russians, etc) are not reproducing. The unadvanced cultures (africa, middle east) are reproducing at an alarming rate. Human race is going to hit an extended period of cultural/technological de-evolution or it’ll blow itself up first. Not sure which is more likely right now.

lorien1973 on September 7, 2007 at 11:50 AM

Bye Bye Britain. It was nice knowing you.

SoulGlo on September 7, 2007 at 11:53 AM

Steyn’s point.

JiangxiDad on September 7, 2007 at 11:48 AM

Thanks. Couldn’t recall.

ot:I guess the bin laden tape is out…per fox news

sunny on September 7, 2007 at 11:56 AM

Why do you all keep harping on this? Can’t you see that they are just trying to live life according to their faith? Why don’t we start focusing on the real problem all of us are facing – GLOBAL WARMING!!

SARCASM

Rick on September 7, 2007 at 12:00 PM

There will be civil war in Britain before long.

shaken on September 7, 2007 at 12:01 PM

No wonder 80+% of Brits think the country is in moral collapse. This was an astounding report that will undoubtedly be ignored by the Powers That Be in the UK. I read the British press on a regular basis and the situation over there is mind-boggling. I don’t know how the Brits can stand it. No wonder 200,000+ native Brits left last year. Except perhaps for a few choice dungheaps on the Continent – Sweden and Belgium come to mind – there aren’t any Western nations that are more infiltrated by radical Islamists. But just when you think it can’t get any worse stuff like this rolls out. Stunning.

For years I thought that the Brits would finally wake up and smell the jihad but now I have my doubts. The official dhimmitude may be too pronounced (in both Labour and the Conservatives) and the people too narcotized and passive. A slow motion tragedy.

Thomas the Wraith on September 7, 2007 at 12:02 PM

shaken on September 7, 2007 at 12:01 PM

have a link?

JiangxiDad on September 7, 2007 at 12:03 PM

I had heard that the Deobandis were peaceful and moderate compared to Wahhabists. I wasn’t aware of the Taliban connection.

see-dubya on September 7, 2007 at 12:03 PM

British libs are the forefathers of our lunatic fringe. We need to get control of our own freaks; Britain is dead.

Jaibones on September 7, 2007 at 12:07 PM

Bye Bye Britain. It was nice knowing you.

SoulGlo on September 7, 2007 at 11:53 AM

If they’re gone, we’re about 10-20 short years behind them.

PRCalDude on September 7, 2007 at 12:09 PM

Ah ha. The Taliban are technically Hanafi but rooted in Deobandism:

Traditionally, Sunni Islam of the Hanafi school of jurisprudence was the dominant religion of Afganistan. The Taliban also adhered to the Hanafi school of Sunni Islam, making it the dominant religion in the country for most of 2001. For the last 200 years, Sunnis often have looked to the example of the Deoband madrassah (religious school) near Delhi, India. Most of the Taliban leadership attended Deobandi-influenced seminaries in Pakistan.

see-dubya on September 7, 2007 at 12:14 PM

If they’re gone, we’re about 10-20 short years behind them.

PRCalDude on September 7, 2007 at 12:09 PM

Don’t think so. We are finding out before it’s too late. Britain didn’t. And they did an amazing job running the world, even sacrificing themselves for the world’s benefit during WWII.
Maybe defeating the Islamists will prove to be our ultimate undoing, by sapping our wealth and resources and national will, but that won’t happen until sometime after they’re defeated.

JiangxiDad on September 7, 2007 at 12:14 PM

I had heard that the Deobandis were peaceful and moderate compared to Wahhabists.

A pack of rabid and starving wolves is peaceful and moderate compared to Wahhabists.

Rick on September 7, 2007 at 12:15 PM

I think the UK (and other parts of the world where Radical Islam has been allowed to flourish and grow domestically let alone from foreign sources) is going to have some bloody times ahead. I don’t see how such radical teachings aren’t going to have a very negative and deadly effect if left unchecked and unchallenged.

Yakko77 on September 7, 2007 at 12:20 PM

Don’t think so. We are finding out before it’s too late. Britain didn’t. And they did an amazing job running the world, even sacrificing themselves for the world’s benefit during WWII.
Maybe defeating the Islamists will prove to be our ultimate undoing, by sapping our wealth and resources and national will, but that won’t happen until sometime after they’re defeated.

Optimism.

Christoph on September 7, 2007 at 12:27 PM

Brave Christians.

Christoph on September 7, 2007 at 12:44 PM

Anyone want to know what’s being preached in these Mosques should watch this show from the UK called Dispatches

The episode is Undercover Mosque

http://www.youtube.com/view_play_list?p=EA0270E133DC8334

VinceP1974 on September 7, 2007 at 12:59 PM

Half of British mosques are under quasi-Taliban control

Only half?

ScottMcC on September 7, 2007 at 1:01 PM

Is anyone doing this math on mosques in the US?

TexasDan on September 7, 2007 at 1:06 PM

This should provide Melanie Phillips considerable material to write about! I did just try to get to her website, however, and it won’t come up…

mimi1220 on September 7, 2007 at 1:09 PM

Update: Right on cue, the first Muslim contributor to the Guardian’s opinion website steps up to defend ul Haq and the Deobandi school. Click.

I translated some of that from serpent-tongue.

PRCalDude on September 7, 2007 at 1:14 PM

Texas Dan: DANG! http://WWW.islamicfinder.org is a heckuva resource.

mimi1220 on September 7, 2007 at 1:14 PM

Poor olde England. It’s really screwed itself up. I wonder if they can ever dig themselves out. We can’t allow that to happen here, government policy not withstanding.

jeanie on September 7, 2007 at 1:23 PM

10:45 PDT – Hey the Times has taken this story off their web main “front page” (still most commented on story). I don’t see an obvious link, other than under “most read” tab (but probably under UK news tab).
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/?2528205

MikeHu on September 7, 2007 at 1:49 PM

FoxNews is saying all the Al Qaeda websites are down also.

pedestrian on September 7, 2007 at 1:58 PM

Somewhat related — Does anyone know what is going on with the new Muslim school in NY?

lan astaslem on September 7, 2007 at 2:20 PM

There will be civil war in Britain before long.
shaken on September 7, 2007 at 12:01 PM
have a link?
JiangxiDad on September 7, 2007 at 12:03 PM

Seemed an opinion as much as statement of fact. But this seems a good time to mention another book which didn’t get as much play as America Alone and Londonistan, Tony Blankley’s excellent The West’s Last Chance, which covers similar ground and, if memory serves, posits civil war as one of the possible upcoming scenarios in Britain.

eeyore on September 7, 2007 at 2:39 PM

I keep running into Brits that claim ignorance to American ways since the are Brits abroad. Most have been here for decades. This country is going to home an exodus of nutty Subjects while their England turns into one big Gaza.

Hening on September 7, 2007 at 4:16 PM

While we ponder the spectacle of radicals taking over the English mosques, may I point out that the Saudi Wahhabis have radicalized 80% of the mosques in America. They control who becomes Muslim chaplains in the prisons and military, too.

Tantor on September 7, 2007 at 4:26 PM

The Brits should take a page out of their own history and outlaw Islam. Bulldoze the mosques and start hanging the Imams if they don’t convert to Anglicism.

georgej on September 7, 2007 at 6:52 PM

Tantor on September 7, 2007 at 4:26 PM

A good point. Though I do not believe that the majority of Muslims in America are Jihaidist. I believe that the majority of Muslims in America have rejected Jihad and want to live in peace in America.

But for those who are: Start with deporting the wahhabi Imams. Then as promotion of terrorism and Jihad is inconsistent with freedom of religion in the United States, any mosque that promotes Jihad gets bulldozed and their assets seized. Any Jihadists who object get a multi-year vaction in Cuba.

Boys and girls, the Constitution is NOT a suicide pact!

georgej on September 7, 2007 at 6:59 PM