Audio alert: Ingraham vs. Geraldo on immigration; Update: Audio added; Update: Study concludes that conservative talk radio sunk the shamnesty bill
posted at 9:58 am on August 20, 2007 by Allahpundit
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Can’t. Wait. Will Michelle’s name come up? Probably. Will Geraldo sob uncontrollably at the plight of Elvira Arellano? Possibly. Will Laura goof on him mercilessly for his idiotic “immigrationism” defense? All we can do is hope, my friends. I’ve been waiting for this for a long time. Anything less than a full nuclear exchange will be disappointing.
We’ll have the audio afterwards. Laura’s producer told us yesterday that it was set for 10:30 but a reader who sounds like he’s listening to the show this morning e-mailed a few minutes ago to say it’s 11:30. If you want to listen live, tune in at both times to be safe. WYSL in Rochester broadcasts her show over the web; consider this an open thread for the program.
Update: The reader e-mails again to say he had it wrong. Sounds like it is indeed 10:30.
Update: I’ll have an embedded clip in a bit, but in the meantime here’s the mp3. The bad news: He didn’t give her one straight answer. The good news: She played the “immigrationism” clip!
Update: Here’s the embedded audio. And here’s the perfect news complement.
Link: sevenload.com
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What a waste of time. Total non-event.
I guess I understand why Rivera keeps using his New York/Sanctuary City/Safest large city meme in this argument, but I don’t really get it. It doesn’t mean anything, since all of our large cities declare themselves “sanctuary” cities. They’ve got a lower crime rate than D.C.; that’s great, so does Baghdad.
Jaibones on August 20, 2007 at 2:09 PM
Thanks Eric for the stats.
Want irks me is that Geraldo won’t address the real issue.
Reduce illegal immigrants and you reduce crime.
You also reduce the cost of their presence and most importantly you:
1. Show respect for the rule of law
2. Show respect for LEGAL immigrants who make our country great
Letting Geraldonistas launch us into the “who commits more crimes” debate is to allow them to avoid the central issue: legal vs illegal immigration.
You can’t just move into the house for sale at the end of your street. You have to buy it first.
Montana on August 20, 2007 at 2:10 PM
Latinos do seem to be quite aware of the demographics. Whites are aware also (hey, there’s nobody here who looks like me anymore!). They aren’t allowed to mention it.
PRCalDude on August 20, 2007 at 2:18 PM
Eric,
I think you should look at Steven Sailer’s analysis of incarceration rates by race. Hispanics are 2-3 times more likely to be incarcerated, while blacks are 6-9 times more likely. I’ll see if I can dig up a link.
PRCalDude on August 20, 2007 at 2:21 PM
Ok, after looking at the link to the report by Project for Excellence in Journalism (what a idiotic name THAT is)…
Why is it that these morons always look at Talk radio as similar to news on TV? When will they EVER get it through their thick heads that Rush/Hannity/Boortz/Ingraham are not programs in a vacuum?? WE don’t have input in TV news. TV news is about telling us what we’re supposed to think.
Rush et al are there BECAUSE of us. Without US, there’d be no talk radio. They are there as moderators for OUR talk. I love Rush - but in deference to him - he saw a niche when he began. He saw that the people had opinions and wanted to talk about them. We agree with him(them), and he (they) lead us in discussions about the political things we are talking about.
They’re (the analysts) closer to understanding this with the Blogosphere…but they just can’t seem to get their thick heads around the idea that talk radio is just like the blogosphere in the fact that they are TRULY democratic (little “d” of course).
tickleddragon on August 20, 2007 at 2:29 PM
JiangxiDad
White males have greater wealth and education not all but 4 out of 5 according to the census
hispanics legal and illegal is much lower, those in poverty are inclined to committ crimes thats a multicultural historical fact.
White males with the same education and wealth level of Blacks and Hispancis commit lots of crimes still 89% do not but 11% do same for black males 84% do not commit crimes but 16% do and with all hispanics 92% do not commit crimes
EricPWJohnson on August 20, 2007 at 2:30 PM
Why do leftists always cry foul and go into the fetal position when they are confronted about “their” behavior? He can dish it out but cannot take it. What a useless wuss.
“Laura, why are you insulting me?” Waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa!
sinsing on August 20, 2007 at 2:30 PM
excuse the bad grammar… it was a true rant.
tickleddragon on August 20, 2007 at 2:31 PM
Eric,
I’m not sure you’re right about that.
PRCalDude on August 20, 2007 at 2:31 PM
Geraldo Al strikes again, I only wish that Laura hadn’t let him ramble and obfuscate, I really don’t care if he’s insulted, he’s insulted me a helluva lot.
I could get through my day quite a bit better if he were censored, put in time out or at least ignored.
Destructive migration deniers apparently don’t love the country they’re in.
Anything else is just an excuse.
Speakup on August 20, 2007 at 2:33 PM
What a tool.
Viper1 on August 20, 2007 at 2:35 PM
PrCalDude
The report I posted is Compiled by the Department of Justice, The Bureau of Prisons, The Bureau of Labor Statistics and the United States Census Bureau
The one there shows incarceration rates, its the gravity of the crime and the sentencing patterns
but my statistics are from only official sources 100% that report is out of date, not footnoted, interesting, but it still shows that with the demographic correction whites are still committing more crimes than Hispanics
And remember the crime rate for hispanics is artifically bumped by their exposure to illegal reentry incarceration and proecution
EricPWJohnson on August 20, 2007 at 2:44 PM
When I said that report I was refering to your link not the official report I linked
Its an interesting article, but its an opinion piece using selective stats out of context
EricPWJohnson on August 20, 2007 at 2:46 PM
I did a search on Fox News for Geraldo and MS-13. The only story that came up was a transcript of Geraldo on “The Big Story” defending illegals. Huh.
kmcguire on August 20, 2007 at 2:59 PM
Even if the demographic correction is true, and I don’t think that it is, they still do poorly in school and have more out-of-wedlock babies than whites, so their upward mobility is probably going to trend toward that of blacks over time. You’re kinda just being Linda Chavez here.
PRCalDude on August 20, 2007 at 2:59 PM
Geraldo is a complete moron, not to mention a lying scumbag.
mcgilvra on August 20, 2007 at 3:00 PM
White males corrected for hispanic demographics such as income and education - 11.1%)
That is not in the report that you linked
MarkB on August 20, 2007 at 3:02 PM
PrCalDude
Like I said its there to read but Geraldo had more substance cause he’s looking at the same reports I am when he makes these claims
All of his other points are fair game and I am expressly not expressing an opinion on them
but this myth, this claim that hispanics are our crime problem is not true, Hispanics do not commit the crimes as other like demographic groups in the US do.
Now could he communicate this without calling everyone a blankety blank - thats another story
But then again him sitting down and discussing something calmly would probably cause a nationwide panic :)
EricPWJohnson on August 20, 2007 at 3:04 PM
“It reminds me of a story my friend Anton told me”
What a valve
LtE126 on August 20, 2007 at 3:05 PM
Here is the Punk Geraldo at his slimiest
http://www.cnn.com/2003/WORLD/meast/03/31/sprj.irq.geraldo/
Booted out of Iraq for violating operational security. Troops were considering drawing straws to determine who was going to punch him out.
mcgilvra on August 20, 2007 at 3:05 PM
I don’t think stats about Hispanics in general equate to stats about illegal aliens.
mikeyboss on August 20, 2007 at 3:13 PM
You may not agree but your post got me thinking:
The US government - at every level - has not respected immigration law for the past, what? Half century? And now they are trying to make the “Right” the scapegoats for this government created and encouraged Disaster.
Only to the extent that the government enforces, amends, or repeals the rule of law is it alive. Immigration Law has been cryogenized for so long it’s gonna need some rehab time. Fresh political blood is needed.
Show respect to all who seek to live in America. Then punish and/or deport those felony criminals who are here provisionally or illegally. Decide what to do about those illegals who have been law abiding. Then do it the American Way.
3. Secure the borders.
All of them are compromised more or less at a time that America has realized a dangerous vulnerability to Islamic Fascism. There are 10s of millions of illegal immigrants already here with more to come, any one of whom could be a new cell-member. At the same time there seem to be 10s of thousands of illegal immigrants who are also serial felony criminals.
The real antagonist is the American government - at every level! We saw how and how much pressure from the grassroots media changed the course of legislation at the federal level this year, and how some states and localities have been making the rule of immigration law double and triply difficult to honor by alternative legislation and non-enforcement.
Randy
williars on August 20, 2007 at 3:28 PM
JiangxiDad
White males have greater wealth and education not all but 4 out of 5 according to the census
hispanics legal and illegal is much lower, those in poverty are inclined to committ crimes thats a multicultural historical fact.
White males with the same education and wealth level of Blacks and Hispancis commit lots of crimes still 89% do not but 11% do same for black males 84% do not commit crimes but 16% do and with all hispanics 92% do not commit
This is gobbledygook….not rational statistics.
Sorry this does not change the fact, hispanic males commit more crimes
MarkB on August 20, 2007 at 3:31 PM
EricPWJohnson on August 20, 2007 at 3:04 PM
I urge you to read Steve Sailers report,Mapping The Unmentionable: Race And Crime on how Hispanic Crime is underreported and manipulated. He specifically tears apart the statistics your linked from 2001.
“In crime statistics, Hispanics are often lumped in with non-Hispanic whites. This has the effect of narrowing the gap between the black and white crime rates by inflating the white rate. It also obscures the relatively high rate of Hispanic crime.”
“Nationally, Hispanics are on average 3.7 times as likely as whites to be imprisoned.”
As a retired law enforcement officer, I can tell you for instance,in Los Angeles(LAPD)they lump Hispanics arrests in with whites for reporting purposes to the DOJ. They are forbidden to report Hispanic crime and there is no check box for Hispanics on the police report forms since special order 40 was implemented.
My experience on the street was that Hispanics do commit crime far more often than whites at a level somewhat lower than blacks. Recently they have become far more violent than in the past and it is getting worse by the day in the Los Angeles area. I suspect this is because they do not fear being deported any longer.
ScottyDog on August 20, 2007 at 3:35 PM
I strongly disagree with that statement. You just described Amnesty.
Respect has nothing to do with it. Legality does.
When you say: Then do it the American Way. I would like to point that we already did. We elected officials who made laws, now we need to actually enforce them. And even if we don’t–for whatever reason–inaction is not a necessary precursor to throwing open our borders.
The established laws decide what we do with illegal immigrants. We deport them. We don’t just say “Oh well, shucks! Looks like you’re here already, ok ok, you can stay”.
I hope I did not misread your statement or misinterpret you position–many people agree with you, and that is where the divide exists.
But you are 100% correct in that an overhaul is needed, I just don’t want that include blanket amnesty. I do not want to reward law breakers.
Montana on August 20, 2007 at 3:39 PM
Laura’s show is delayed on the radio here, so I get to listen on my way home. I’ll have to tune in to listen to Geraldo’s whining. In the meantime, here’s an article Geraldo should read.
lan astaslem on August 20, 2007 at 4:01 PM
Don’t you guys ever get tired of picking on Geraldo?
SoulGlo on August 20, 2007 at 4:14 PM
Ya know, that reminds me of an “Aw, shucks!” moment I saw in Houston years ago…
People in Houston just did not want to yield entering the freeway…I guess because it was too much effort to learn to merge? I don’t know…anyhoo, Houston’s response was to take down all of the Yield signs on I-10!!!
How’s that for a brain fart???
Miss_Anthrope on August 20, 2007 at 4:19 PM
Going after hard targets will wear a person out, not easy pickings like Geraldo. It’s like going hunting in a petting zoo. No effort at all.
Laura on August 20, 2007 at 4:25 PM
Nope…easy fodder & entertaining!
Miss_Anthrope on August 20, 2007 at 4:31 PM
People in this country illegally that end up incarcerated in California alone costs the state billions annualy. People in this country illegally commit murders. People in this country illegally kill people while driving while intoxicated. The bottom line is that they shouldn’t be here to commit these crimes.
PatrickS on August 20, 2007 at 4:39 PM
Heard the whole thing. Laura, I love ya, but you got Geraldo’d. He did nothing different than he does on every other show he’s allowed on. What is the point anymore? He fillibusters and obfuscates. What more are we learning? Uncle! We get his act already. Enough with this guy. If he’s going to be allowed to spew his nonsense (and again, I don’t know why anyone is finding this amusing anymore…), it should go like this: ask question, sit through fillibuster; acknowlege fillibuster and ask question again; sit through fillibuster; inform him that if he will not answer direct questions the “interview” is over and MEAN it. If he gets thrown off enough shows eventually he will realize that the rules have changed. To what end, I don’t know…
JWS on August 20, 2007 at 4:49 PM
I don’t think repeating your statement constitutes proof. Why don’t we go do a demographic analysis of the LA county jail right now and see what we come up with?
You’re trying to argue with what we see with our own lying eyes every day. Whites don’t join gangs in droves like Hispanics do. The whites that actually are in gangs do so in prison for mutual protection. This demographic correction for socio-economic status you speak of, even if true, doesn’t bode well for the country as they have a high drop-out rate and high illegitimacy rates. Actually, their drop out rate is slightly higher than that of blacks. So if drop-out rates and illegitimacy rates are any indicator of upward mobility and future socio-economic status (and they are), then it still means that Hispanics are going to commit more crimes than whites.
I realize it’s comforting to believe better about them, as they are going to be a majority in 20 years, but it’s better to see them clearly and plan accordingly.
PRCalDude on August 20, 2007 at 4:54 PM
Will someone answer a simple question…as our borders continue to be a sive…we continue to listen to morons like this? NOTHING is being done about our problem and you are being distracted by MSM including Laura Ingrham, a FOX stooge, who wants you to swallow the Bush program! NOTHING is being changed! NOTHING!
sabbott on August 20, 2007 at 5:52 PM
You all sit at your mommy’s computers and have fun taking shots at each other…what the hell good are you! NOTHING is changing! The fence is NOT being built! Your representatives DON’T CARE! You rubes will go to the polls in the next election and elect the same morons that you always have and we will have more of the same and we will have more prattling on with FOX News and O’Reilly and Hannnity and Colmes…blah…blah..blah…you make NO Diffenrence!!! Nothing IS CHANGING!!!
sabbott on August 20, 2007 at 5:56 PM
Many of us do not trust in Amnesty(sic.). Rather, many of us agree because we trust in American Justice, ONCE the borders are secured by the demonstrated will of the People’s representatives.
Randy
williars on August 20, 2007 at 6:02 PM
I’m afraid our only recourse is to do what our founding fathers did. You’re right, our representatives don’t care. Perhaps certain states could start a secession movement for lack of government action regarding this issue. Short of violence, there’s nothing we can do.
PRCalDude on August 20, 2007 at 6:05 PM
Someone please pass a hanky to Geraldo
Wade on August 20, 2007 at 7:02 PM
Laura is the greatest. A few years ago she got banned from Imus in the Morning..
Wade on August 20, 2007 at 7:10 PM
What a lot of people are ignoring here are the stats of illegal immigrants in our prison population. Doesn’t matter what race they are, what matters is they are a large and growing percentage of our prison population. GR can make all the noise he wants about Hispanics being law-abiding (I know plenty who are), but that fails to tell the true story of how our prisons are being filled to above capacity here in California. If you could take all the illegals out of the CA prisons we would have plenty of room for the citizens who deserve to be there.
The race issue is a red herring. Focus on how many of the prisoners in our justice system are here illegally. That will give you a much truer picture of the problem.
Snidely Whiplash on August 20, 2007 at 7:40 PM
Frankily, I wouldn’t change my position if no illegal immigrant ever committed crime. Even if they were all solid citizens who went to church on Sunday, delivered blankets to the homeless, and mentored underprivileged children, they are still breaking the law just by being here. We’re blessed in America to have rule of law, and that means law is enforced regardless whether those breaking it are noble or horrible.
radjah shelduck on August 20, 2007 at 7:44 PM
Geraldo Rivera doesn’t get it. Who cares if he has travelled the world. What’s not to get? If the illegal weren’t here, there would be no crime period. It has nothing to do whether or not New York is a safer city because of their sanctuary policy.
Mark
http://mark24609.blogspot.com/
“Everybody in politics lies, but [the Clintons] do it with such ease, it’s troubling.”
David Geffen - Former Clinton supporter and Hollywood mogul
mark24609 on August 20, 2007 at 8:34 PM
Remember, illegals are better than you. MS-13 crime . . that’s a native problem.
- The Cat
MirCat on August 20, 2007 at 9:00 PM
I’m just going to say this once. I ate at my hole in the wall Thai joint that I haven’t been to in about a year because I got tired of getting stomach you know what presumably from the bean sprouts in the Pad Thai. But I digress. What I witnessed today was me and the two nice mayan ladies in front of me with their two fine young male boys, hair cropped short, another in the oven and one in the stroller dealie on the floor. And I thought to myself, self, if the Democrats do win this thing, and they certainly appear poised to do just that, I will be none to pleased when my two strapping teen boys get the draft call and all the the fine illegal boys get to bang. That my friend is when the shit is going to hit the fan.
We should naturalize these people and close that border tight between now and election time because make no mistake, for all their political posturing, the dims fully understand the third world threat coalescing around our island nation. And they will institute a draft. a fair one.. everyone needs to get in the pool first. Methinks Michelle and the merry kneejerks need to think this thing through. That is all. And it’s all good. Right now.
pc on August 20, 2007 at 9:12 PM
And they are not all growing up to be bangers. These young men will do just fine with a rifle in the hands fighting Islamofacists. I tell ya the folks that are already here will come in handy in the not to distant if my political antennae are tuned correctly. And you won’t really have to enforce a border because it’s going to be a lot less attractive to drop one on the ground here when there’s a strong possibility of conscripted service.
pc on August 20, 2007 at 9:15 PM
Hey, look, I don’t agree with Geraldo often, but I give him at least this: He’s a decent and intellectually honest liberal. And those kind are hard to find nowadays.
Maybe that’s why I was especially disappointed to see him sink to the “radical” name-calling against MM.
petefrt on August 20, 2007 at 9:16 PM
Am I scared of my sons being conscripted? Hell yes but that’s the salt of the earth that’ll get people reproducing properly again so it’s needed. And my old man made a career out of dodging VD and bullets so it can’t be all bad. He’s 82, banging a 64 year old, heheheheehe. Walks 18 at 3 times a week. That is all from the peanut gallery tonight.
pc on August 20, 2007 at 9:21 PM
That’s a bang trifecta! sorry. and it’s he walks 18 at least three times a week. Boy did I go off or what@!
pc on August 20, 2007 at 9:23 PM
But she ate him for breakfast. Good show, Laura!
petefrt on August 20, 2007 at 10:11 PM
Our local sheriff has tried to address the problem of illegals. He has billboards, internet site, appeared on at least Fox and local radio stating that this will not be tolerated in this county. He publicly stated that he will place any employer of illegals on billboards. Then a group of MS13 members went to construction sites and attacked employees and the sites. The federal government has given him a very hard time and tried to tie his hands over this.
tanmany2k on August 20, 2007 at 10:13 PM
that was interesting. Conscripted service you say. Will recalculate with the new data.
btw…
antennae
conscripted
coalescing
Methinks
digress
int. jux. with the good ole boy style
JiangxiDad on August 20, 2007 at 10:23 PM
PatrickS
I agree with you, my point was Geraldo had evidence in the report, how he chooses to disseminate that information is unfortunate as much as those who spread the dissinformation
I’m against illegal immigration, I’m for english as the only language
But I’m not blind to the fact that developed countries attract immigrants legal and illegal
EricPWJohnson on August 20, 2007 at 11:49 PM
1. As has been pointed out, statistics by race are useless in this discussion as it is not race but of immigration status which is germane.
2. Any population study which uses corrections for wealth and education is also useless. It is a magic fairy “what if” proposition. The fact is that the populations under statistical review have the educational levels and wealth that they have. They have the birth rate that they have. What would happen to that statistical model should someone wave a magic wand and give a group better educations and more money is not a factor. They are what they are until something changes. And the new illegals next year, 5 years from now or 10 years from now will NEVER have a better education or more wealth. The new illegals will ALWAYS be at a low level of both. Those who enter legally are, of course, a different kettle of fish as they will trend towards higher levels of education and wealth. Isn’t that more germane to the issue?
cat on August 21, 2007 at 1:42 AM
From Politico:
“But no one could match the attention devoted to the issue by CNN’s Dobbs, a relentless advocate of tougher immigration enforcement and a staunch opponent of the immigration bill.
According to PEJ’s analysis, Dobbs devoted a full 27 percent of the airtime on his nightly show to immigration during the second quarter of 2007, with much of that coverage highly critical of the measure. On June 29, the day after the bill went down to defeat, Dobbs celebrated by reading the congratulatory e-mails he got from viewers.”
======================================================
I think it’s premature to say that CNN had a the most say or influence on getting that Shamnesty bill shelved.
With 34 million listeners (Rush, Hannity, and Savage) are not the total conservative talk shows when you have Michael Reagan, Mike McConnell, Laura Ingraham, etc talking about immigration to listeners.
What the number of CNN viewers compared to the number of radio listeners?
Would you even agree, Allah, that CNN had more pull that all conservative talk radios combined that have discussed the Shamnest bill relentlessly?
Kokonut on August 21, 2007 at 10:26 AM
I’m not AT ALL sure that poverty causes crime. It could as easily be true that crime causes poverty — that the impulsiveness, impatience and lack of foresight that makes a criminal also makes a really bad employee.
This is a very difficult country to be poor in. I don’t mean it’s very difficult if you’re poor, I mean that it’s pathetically easy to crawl out of poverty into at least the lower tiers of the middle, provided you have some basic life skills.
S. Weasel on August 21, 2007 at 12:48 PM
Geraldo who? Lopez? Smith? Jackson?
Rivera?!?! WAHAHAHAHAHA
peacenprosperity on August 21, 2007 at 1:55 PM
Geraldo Rivera is a Hispanic ethnic-supremacist.
S on August 21, 2007 at 2:08 PM
Geraldo has latinitis. He is too snow blind to see the threat. Lyndon Johnson was right about latin administators.
saiga on August 21, 2007 at 3:49 PM
I have heard some really stupid things in my lifetime, and Iwould have to put the asertion that “illegal immigration is good for America” at the top of that list. It takes a real fool to make lemonade out of those lemons.
saiga on August 21, 2007 at 3:53 PM
Rivera was pathetic in this interview. I do not believe that a Geraldo Rivera, in his prime, would ever have allowed an interview subject to get away with the kind of garbage he was shovelling. He never answered one question. He regarded this as just an opportunity to spout off, non-stop, until those few occasions in which Ms. Ingraham was fianlly able to get a word in edgeways. When she asked a direct question, he turned it into a personal slur.
Laura Ingraham made him look like dog food.
Blaise on August 21, 2007 at 5:59 PM
Michelle Malkin and Laura Ingraham
vs
Geraldo Rivera and Kirsten Powers
Now that‘d be a tag team match to see.
least1 on August 22, 2007 at 2:14 AM
I am more than impressed that Laura didn’t go ‘Cramer’ on Geraldo, he deserved it…but she would have been dismissed.
Did anyone hear Presidente Calderon pull the cat out of the bag during his speech at the North American Security and Prosperity summit in Quebec on Mon. and Tues?
If you didn’t, please listen to it and then tell me that the globalist businessmen’s agenda to homogenize Canada, The US and Mexico into the North American Union isn’t behind the sanctuary cities and the ‘don’t ask, don’t tell’ policy of law ‘enforcement’.
I understand that the citizens of all 3 countries protested the NAU agenda, but this news story must get out! I’m surprised that Hotair hasn’t run anything on this topic–that i have seen.
All other topics take at least a step back…our sovereignty hangs in the balance.
Christine on August 22, 2007 at 1:14 PM
I am so tired of Geraldo’s mantra that illegals don’t commit crimes at as high a rate as the rest of us.
Laura brought up some good points - sanctuary city, Los Angeles - but every interviewer neglects to bring up that the ‘crime’ is selective. They don’t count illegal entry, use of stolen SS #’s, false identities, etc, as crimes, do they? Because every illegal who works in the US has had to use an illegal means to get the job.
I also know Geraldo’s statistics are wrong because MADD thought the acceptance of drinking and driving in Mexico was serious enough, and the bleedover into the US was significant enough, to write an article about it:
http://www.madd.org/aboutus/0,1056,2552,00.html
linlithgow on August 22, 2007 at 4:36 PM
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