“Well, they’ve done their homework on us.”

You are right, Bryan. But, who wouldn’t do so when in an argument, whether or not they were honest in their intentions..

Personally, I’d like to know what effort the government has already made in addressing the environmental review process that is required by law. I’m not an expert in the federal process but am familiar with it as practiced in local and state settings. It’s a process. It has categories for types of development. It has check off’s. It has initial reviews, middle reviews, and final reviews. Paperwork is generated. I am not sure but have little doubt that it has a waiver paths in cases of overriding federal concerns; not the government has to do waivers if mitigations can be implemented without much of a problem. Reagnaut [reaganaut on July 31, 2007 at 10:19 AM] had no problem noting what needs to be done.

Congress has already passed legislation to build a fence. DfDeportation [DfDeportation on July 31, 2007 at 10:52 AM] says four have been. So, what environmental paperwork have our diligent government directors already completed in this regard?

Look, I am for good, no, great border security. I am for a real, physical strong fence. I am absolutely disgusted with those who have ignored the issue of illegal immigration until it became a crisis for the SECOND time. I am mad as hell at those who are still effin’ around on their job of implementing border security like first-day-at-work teenage store clerks playing with the iPhones (that their parents bought just to annoy AP) in the back room thinking they have a four hour break. (Sorry for insulting teenage store clerks.)

One wins an argument by being prepared, dotting the i’s and crossing the t’s. If those in Washington responsible for being prepared haven’t done their thinking and processed the paperwork, I want to know why they haven’t.

I hope they haven’t turned a blind eye to another law, an environmental law, like they been doing for years with the immigration laws and border security laws. If they haven’t acted in the professional, diligent and competent manner in something as simple doing an EIS, they shouldn’t be in the jobs they are holding and we should get rid of them.

Mexico’s latest complaint about the border fence is that defense will be environmentally damaging. Just more excuses. Story from USA Today…

Isn’t fencing a hate crime?

You know, we kill coyotes in Texas. They kill livestock and carry rabies…

pullingmyhairout on July 31, 2007 at 10:15 AM

That’s right and if a fence will cut down on the number of those varmints as well as the other kind, all well and good. Just another arugument for the fence.

Just how many bills…..
DfDeportation on July 31, 2007 at 10:52 AM

Plenty, in the freezer. Earmarked for other things of course.

I think a madatory 10 years without parole for knowingly hiring or selling to an illegal will stop it once and for all

EricPWJohnson on July 31, 2007 at 10:00 AM

Leaving behind the fence question for a bit…you are exactly correct here. Financial penalties won’t cut it…they’ll just respond by hiring more illegals so they can afford to pay the fines. If you frog-march a few CEOs/HR flunkies into prison, it will stop.

I’m not advocating landmines. It’s a horrible thing. But what if we had the Guard down there pretending to mine it? Set off a random explosion now and again to make the illusion complete?

Nah. This is all tongue-in-cheek. But don’t believe for a second that fences and/or walls don’t work. Ask anyone from Berlin. Ask anyone in prison. Ask the friggin’ Chinese. You can still see their wall from space.

Walls and such aren’t perfect. But they sure slow ‘em down.

Perhaps whimpering about it not being a 100% solition isn’t productive. Things are bad enough with the status quo that I’d settle for an 80% solution. Combine that with pressure on employers? We might get somewhere in that case.

and Bushy just cut the Nat. Guard on the border in half…

I have heard of NO big ICE raids since the immigration bill debacle.

What we need is enforcement here folks…

Militarize the border…. Mexico be damed…

I was up in the Northeast a while back and all the road construction crews were lily white.

Oh yes, our corrupt politicians and union thugs are still in a loving relationship. Those highway jobs pay big money and of course take forever to complete. DOn’t get me started on bridge repair….

In MA, crews are still forced to hire police, instead of flagmen as well. It’s not uncommon to see 4 or 5 state police cars lined up in a 2 mile span, even more at night.

Put the fence up in the high traffic areas and use it to funnel the illegal wave into smaller areas where we have assets on the ground. There are also areas that are so inhospitable for humans, we don’t need a fence. The coyotes (both kinds) will find their way to the openings.

I’d be against lawsuits against companies, though. That just makes the trial lawyers richer and is ripe for abuse. I just have no faith that our federal government can solve problems. State and local authorities need to have more control. It also boggles my mind how much power the Judicial branch is wielding these days. Each time I hear someone whine, “that’s unconstitutional” my blood pressure goes up 5 points. The Federal government is just getting too big, and the larger it gets, the less effective it becomes.

EricPWJohnson on July 31, 2007 at 10:00 AM

Eric, you are right about a few things – Americans want cheap stuff and it costs us BIG TIME. But as for the jobs American’s “won’t do,” I was up in the Northeast a while back and all the road construction crews were lily white. Down her in Tejas, they are all hispanic – most likely a legal crew boss hiring day laborers who are illegal. That was just an observation. I think if a job pays enough, there are plenty of Americans willing to step up and take them.

A moat around England is not keeping out the illegals and the drugs

The Large Sea is not keeping the Africans out of Italy

Just thinking about our huge wall – I think a madatory 10 years without parole for knowingly hiring or selling to an illegal will stop it once and for all

Of course then there’s the national ID card thing again

Americans want

Jobs, but mostly inside

Security, for free

Cheap Goods

All the oil they can swallow

And most of our oil and cheap goods come from countries with the largest illegal immigrant populations

Mexico
China
Venesuela

Flame on

Mexico is right about this issue. The fence is a ridiculous idea and should be rejected on environmental grounds. I have a much better idea of how we can stop the illegal flood and enforce our laws seriously against people who hire illegals. We’ll do it the American way: we permit every unemployed person and low-income person within a fifty mile radius to sue for lost wages a businessman who hires an illegal and hopefully bankrupt the businessman.

I will admit that there remains a security issue of muslims sneaking into the United States across both the Canadian and Mexican borders. So unless, we are willing to build a Canadian fence also and I’m certainly not willing, building the fence with Mexico isn’t going to help the security situation.

thuja on July 31, 2007 at 8:27 AM

The part you are missing is the large numbers of illegals that do not need to be hired by a large company but exist in a parralel society. The resources need to enforce the plan you have with any effectivenesss means person of ehtnicities other than Hispanic (mostly) would be suing hundreds of Mom and Pop stores, not the best idea.

Increased enforcement and a few hundred miles of fence and we as a nation may have enough trust in our government that 200 miles of fence is enough. That will only happen if Mexico and the illegal alien lobby shut the he@@ up. The more they protest the more we want the fence. Illegals lost amnesty the first day they marched and had the gaul to wave a Mexican flag and demand their “rights.” Sow the wind…

I’m quite serious. I object to the fence, because it is premised on avoiding the issue of who is responsible for the illegal invasion: the businessmen who break our laws and deliberately hire illegals.

thuja on July 31, 2007 at 8:43 AM

Or the country that purposely exports its citizens to prop up their economy? They of course have no culpability…

Shameless. Do they have no shame? None at all? How obviously deceptive. They might as well say “May we please keep exporting our citizens, please?” I thinks they would get more traction that way.

Pro-enforcement types need to post videos of the trash dumps illegals leave behind, lets do an enviromental study on illegals. Use night vision to film them then look at the mess they leave behind during the day. You know Discovery Channel style. That would be humiliating, and the exact opposite of their desired effect. That’ll shut down the enviro-angle real quick. Minute Men get on it.