Michael Vick indicted for “dogfighting,” a.k.a., torturing and killing dogs
posted at 1:17 pm on July 18, 2007 by Allahpundit
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I glanced at Goldstein’s post about it last night and scoffed when he said Vick’s career is probably over. QBs who run a 4.3/40 aren’t lightly forfeited. But having now read the article in detail, my god.
When a Bad Newz Kennels dog was wounded in a losing fight, NFL star Michael Vick was consulted before the animal was doused with water and electrocuted. That’s just one of the gruesome details that emerged Tuesday when the Atlanta Falcons quarterback and three others were indicted by a federal grand jury…
About eight young dogs were put to death at the Surry County home after they were found not ready to fight in April 2007, the indictment said. They were killed “by hanging, drowning and/or slamming at least one dog’s body to the ground.”
“Some of the grisly details in these filings shocked even me, and I’m a person who faces this stuff every day,” Goodwin said. “I was surprised to see that they were killing dogs by hanging them, and one dog was killed by slamming it to the ground. Those are extremely violent methods of execution — they’re unnecessary and just sick.”…
Before fights, participating dogs of the same sex would be weighed and bathed, according to the filings. Opposing dogs would be washed to remove any poison or narcotic placed on the dog’s coat that could affect the other dog’s performance.
Sometimes, dogs weren’t fed to “make it more hungry for the other dog.”
Fights would end when one dog died or with the surrender of the losing dog, which was sometimes put to death by drowning, strangulation, hanging, gun shot, electrocution or some other method, according to the documents.
Vick doesn’t know anything about it, of course, except that he, um, owned the property where it all took place, had his own nickname among dogfighters, and may even have had his own Bad Newz Kennels t-shirt and headband. Sounds like a good guy. Exit question: Is Goldstein right? Is he done? Note: not whether he should be, but whether he will be.
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I didn’t even know he was black. In fact, for some reason I thought he was white, which probably has more to do with the fact that the two teams I regularly watch have white quarterbacks.
I’m not. Romans used to watch humans do this stuff to each other.
What?
Societies have always had different assigned jobs. By your insane logic, anyone who isn’t prepared to build a computer from scratch has no write to be typing on one.
Also, there is a difference between killing something and torturing something. If you cannot tell the difference, then your problems are much bigger than what’s said here on this site.
Esthier on July 18, 2007 at 2:42 PM
If he’s guilty, this guy is a pig.
What I don’t want to hear, from him or his lawyer, is that he “made a mistake”. I’m sick of that line.
A mistake is, when you’re doing addition, you forget to carry the one. It’s driving to your mother in law’s house and taking the second and not the third street on the left.
As long as the words of the English language still have meaning, this cannot be called a “mistake”. It is obviously planned, organized and carried out.
Deliberately.
In the hope and expectation of not being caught.
Blaise on July 18, 2007 at 2:45 PM
Vick’s future can probably be foretold by counting the number of Reverends coming to his defense.
rw on July 18, 2007 at 2:47 PM
Again, missing the point. Dogs kill each other in packs for reasons of survival. That’s a natural part of life. It’s not natural for an NFL player to teach dogs to fight each other for his pure enjoyment, then soak them in water and electrocute them.
Which goes to show, yet again, you’re an @ss.
amerpundit on July 18, 2007 at 2:48 PM
I think doriangray is preparing to make the case that we should restore gladiator matches among humans. The “logic”–to be very gracious–is heading that way. Dog’s kill each other, afterall, and therefore have no sense of right/wrong (I beg to differ, and I’m not simply anthropomorphing dogs), and, thus, can be pitted against one another. Since humans, also, kill one another–at least sometimes–it logically follows, then, that it is acceptable to pit humans against each other for our own pleasure… at least humans who have been convicted of a crime.
There you go, I made your retarded case for you.
(BTW, knowing the word “anthropomorphism” is less an indicator–in my mind–of intelligence than twisted, fallacious, and obscene logic).
DaveS on July 18, 2007 at 2:48 PM
I don’t think anyone really believes it’s “a black thing.” I think we’re all just mocking the person who said it.
Esthier on July 18, 2007 at 2:48 PM
JackStraw on July 18, 2007 at 2:41 PM
The Japanese and Chinese were fighting dogs before the Roman empire even existed.
doriangrey on July 18, 2007 at 2:49 PM
So Dorian since I need a ‘moral high ground’ to say this is wrong and I can’t possibly have that because I eat meat, which is killing, does that mean I also can’t oppose abortion? Because killing is killing amirite?
Darksbane on July 18, 2007 at 2:50 PM
Wow, this thread filled up fast, then I realized there was a complete moron trying to defend torturing and killing animals for fun and money. And yes, I am a hunter, and most normal hunters (those who don’t go on to become serial killers) can understand the basic difference.
That only scratches the surface.
By the way, Vick has been done for a few years now.
reaganaut on July 18, 2007 at 2:54 PM
I wouldn’t go there… doriangrey opened this whole ridiculous exchange with a red-herring about abortion:
To respond honestly to your post would require the complete rejection of the gross illogic upon which the whole tirade was founded.
DaveS on July 18, 2007 at 2:54 PM
Dorian I’m going to give you some sage advice that I heard from the great Brian Fantana.
Take it easy, Champ. Why don’t you sit this next one out, stop talking for a while.
JackStraw on July 18, 2007 at 2:57 PM
Not long ago, the Chinese drowned baby girls. Should we go back to that as well? Just because it was done in the past, doesn’t make it acceptable today.
amerpundit on July 18, 2007 at 2:59 PM
Yes, I know. I simply felt the need to give my thoughts on the subject, since I do know a little bit about “black culture.” :-)
My parents rescued a female English Staffordshire Bull Terrier–which are related to the American version aka the Pit Bull. She had been used as a breeder for some other dog-fighter whose business had been scuttled by the law. She’s a sweet, smart and obedient dog who loves humans (other dogs are another story) and she follows me around the house whenever I visit my parents. So when I read about torturers of dogs, I think of her and get really pissed.
baldilocks on July 18, 2007 at 3:00 PM
My hometown of Newport News Va (AKA Bad Newz) has certainly become famous for its hoodlum athletes.
mbarn on July 18, 2007 at 3:02 PM
Oh, and as to the exit question, I can’t say I know enough about football to say whether or not he’s done. I just can’t imagine how they could let him stay.
If he gets jail time, I’d say he’s definitely done, but if he gets off with little more than a slap on the wrist, then I’m sure the NFL will follow the lead of our justice system.
Esthier on July 18, 2007 at 3:02 PM
doriangrey,
Wow, that’s some interesting philosophy going on there. This isn’t so much about the morality/immorality of dog fighting, but what goes on when a dog loses or is too injured to continue.
Instead of humane euthanizing horses with broken legs, we should beat them to death with sticks. That’s the natural extension of the argument.
Krydor on July 18, 2007 at 3:03 PM
MLB, NFL, NHL, NBA…….shamesty for bad boys.
Limerick on July 18, 2007 at 3:04 PM
I know the feeling. It may be anthropomorphism, but pets do something for humans that other animals simply cannot.
I’m allergic to cats and nearly hated them before finding mine, but when I first got her, she was almost dead. Nursing a sick kitten back to health cured me completely. She may as well be my own kid.
Esthier on July 18, 2007 at 3:04 PM
Atheletes, the most spoiled group in America.
And Christians were fed to the lions, and jews were put into gas chambers, and blacks were slaves as were jews (for several hundred years more), and and…you get the idea. Sit in the corner for a time out.
right2bright on July 18, 2007 at 3:05 PM
I think his future is going to be determined by the fans. He has already started to alienate some people. If he plays this year and he gets some major ragging because of this, he could snap.
It still amazes me that people in his position manage to throw their careers away. I guess there is no accounting for stupid.
Harpoon on July 18, 2007 at 3:07 PM
I joked with my mom that she likes “Jazzie” better than she likes us (her kids and my dad). She didn’t laugh too hard. ;-)
baldilocks on July 18, 2007 at 3:08 PM
Michael Vick will be the next Raiders quarterback, and the Black Hole will cheer him on.
Kalifornia Kafir on July 18, 2007 at 3:10 PM
The situation isn’t funny but this song is.
SouthernDem on July 18, 2007 at 3:10 PM
Now that’s a name I haven’t heard in a while. I can still remember when he was taunting Katerina Witt in his newspaper column in 1984. I just came to the conclusion that he hated everyone and everything.
Harpoon on July 18, 2007 at 3:17 PM
Be careful and don’t come between them.
Esthier on July 18, 2007 at 3:18 PM
JackStraw on July 18, 2007 at 2:57 PM
Hmmm, sounds like good advice, think I’ll take it.
doriangrey on July 18, 2007 at 3:18 PM
Can someone here explain to me how Micheal Vick’s indictment for illegal dog fighting (yes, we are a notion of laws) has morphed to “kill it then grill it”? Or, if you don’t kill it, you don’t eat?
It’s a sad day for dog lovers.
swami on July 18, 2007 at 3:19 PM
Michael Vick will be the next Raiders quarterback, and the Black Hole will cheer him on.
Kalifornia Kafir
The Raiders generally take talented players with bad attitudes from crappy franchises. Vick is a bad player.
Krydor on July 18, 2007 at 3:20 PM
That dog fight could have been any two liberal women in the public eye.
Cindy and Pelosi?
Edwards (John or Liz) and Hillary?
right2bright on July 18, 2007 at 3:22 PM
I thought the Raiders were a crappy franchise.
EnochCain on July 18, 2007 at 3:23 PM
(?)
I don’t think that there’s a chance of that.
baldilocks on July 18, 2007 at 3:24 PM
I just mean don’t make her choose.
Esthier on July 18, 2007 at 3:25 PM
I have to question the hometraining and general mental stability of both the Vick brothers, Michael and Marcus. Marcus pretty much threw away his career via his antics and arrests. Now what is Michael’s excuse? His millions isn’t enough so he has to resort to dog fighting? Geez
Lennie on July 18, 2007 at 3:26 PM
I thought the Raiders were a crappy franchise.
EnochCain
We are rebuilding from the N**v T****r years. San Diego is so incredibly screwed, it isn’t even funny.
Krydor on July 18, 2007 at 3:29 PM
I, too, was very disappointed and saddened when I heard the news about quarterback Michael Vick.
For all of you fellow NFL fans who are sick and tired of being disappointed in off-the-field player mis-conduct, I know one quarterback who makes us fans really proud.
ColtsFan on July 18, 2007 at 3:30 PM
The Raiders are a crap franchise. Just look at their fan base. I see plenty of Raiders stickers on the freeway that say, “F_ck the rest.” Claaaaasssssy.
PRCalDude on July 18, 2007 at 3:31 PM
About professional athletes: I used to be a big football and basketball fan–especially in the eighties, the era of the Showtime Lakers. Oh, there were always a couple of knuckleheads in either sport, but they were few and far between and owners weren’t shy about putting them in check.
Around the mid-nineties, the knuckleheads began to increasingly become tolerated by said owners (Exhibit A: Kobe Bryant–and that’s not wrt to the rape charge, but to his subsequent behavior).
Even though the thugs and spoiled brats still mostly the exception than the rule, I have long ceased to tune in. Vick’s alleged actions are only another drop in the bucket.
Is his career finished? If, and only if, Vick is convicted and sentenced to do time and if the Falcons and the NFL begin to feel the pressure on the bottom line. I’m reasonable sure that the former will happen; not so sure about the latter.
baldilocks on July 18, 2007 at 3:37 PM
Well trained hunting dogs DO NOT turn on each other. Even if they did, they wear kevlar vests and collars. If a hunting dog turns on another during a hunt, it’s usually retired. And I don’t mean electrocuted or beaten to death.
Vick should get 26 years in prison, a good portion of those years for further sullying the good name of a GOOD, AMERICAN breed of dog. Dogs that were once used in army flyers because of their strong, brave, and loyal nature. What an effing dick, Micheal Vick is now officially Michael Dick in my book.
NTWR on July 18, 2007 at 3:39 PM
Amen. Kobe’s antics soured me on the Lakers, especially with what he did to the Big Man.
PRCalDude on July 18, 2007 at 3:40 PM
No joke, threw him under the bus.
Spirit of 1776 on July 18, 2007 at 3:45 PM
Blaise, you’re right. Either that, or we’ll hear his mama say “he just fell in with the wrong crowd.”
I’m from Atlanta and have been thoroughly embarrassed by Vick for a long time. He’s a nobody, no-talent thug.
MsUnderestimated on July 18, 2007 at 3:45 PM
The account of my mom’s reaction was a joke as well.
The reason why I added the question mark in response to your admonition is because I would never dream of asking my mother to choose between me and a pet, nor would anyone in my family. We all love the dog, but even if we didn’t, presenting such an odd dilemma would never occur to any of us, Mom included.
baldilocks on July 18, 2007 at 3:49 PM
I see. It’s just so easy for things to be misunderstood online. It’s caused me many mishaps and even a few unnecessary arguments.
Esthier on July 18, 2007 at 3:52 PM
Agreed. I’m sure that I’m not the only one who thought Kobe should have been traded, rather than Shaq. However, I suspect that, back then, no other owner was willing to shoulder the PR disaster of accepting Kobe onto their team, not to mention his salary.
baldilocks on July 18, 2007 at 3:53 PM
Possibly not Zett. The crime happened in southern VA,
lots of good Christian folk, who frown on torture, may get
the jury box.
bernzright777 on July 18, 2007 at 3:53 PM
Me too. :-D
baldilocks on July 18, 2007 at 3:54 PM
Well, I hope you are right.
Zetterson on July 18, 2007 at 3:55 PM
And good point with the VA fact. I didn’t realize that. I assumed ATL erroneously.
Zetterson on July 18, 2007 at 3:57 PM
What you seem to be missing here is that not all animals are held in equal regard. Americans are indifferent to cows. We like dogs. All animals are not the same.
Similarly, all killing isn’t the same. Americans don’t mind soldiers killing to advance or protect strategic interests during times of war. We do mind serial criminals killing to obtain personal sexual gratification from pre-teen girls. A dead human isn’t just another dead human; the reasons behind their deaths matter to us.
Similarly, killing animals to obtain sustenance and killing animals to revel in their suffering are not the same thing. I think you’ll find the people here, like myself, who want to see Vick in prison don’t feel similarly about Chinese or other SE asians who actually eat dogs. The latter is unappealing and perhaps even objectionable, but the former is stark barbarism.
These are almost subtle distinctions, though, and as I recall from a previous discussion you’re one who can’t even distinguish between the Law of Contradiction and the Fallacy of the False Dilemma (which have far less in common with another than even a dog and a cow). So, in the likely event all of this is lost on you, maybe it’ll prove of value to somebody else who happens to be browsing past.
Blacklake on July 18, 2007 at 4:00 PM
I’m surprised that noone has linked the fact that abusing animals is one of the first signs of a person with serious psychological issues. It’s a sign of the person being predisposed to sexual/physical abuse of children, women and violent crime attacks such as armed robbery.
As for anyone trying to rationalize this as some sort of “cultural” issue, how does someone being black have anything to do with some sort of cultural tie-in to dog fighting in Africa? That’s just insane, and is hypocritically saying that we should expect people to have certain tendancies based on their race, but then on the other hand condemn people for saying that there are problem with certain groups because of their race….. You can’t have it both ways, and is an insult to a HUGE number of black people in America who vehemently condemn this hyper abuse of innocent animals.
KMC1 on July 18, 2007 at 4:07 PM
Raise your hand if you’re surprised that this ignorant thug was involved with this. Just one reason I cancelled my NFL season TV package. They have ruined another thing that at one time was beyond fabulous. Throat slashing, chest thumping, etc. Just another symptom of the bigger disease…
JWS on July 18, 2007 at 4:08 PM
I did mention it earlier.
baldilocks on July 18, 2007 at 4:14 PM
I predict he will skate on this. It’s a thug league now. Ray Lewis obstructed an investigation of a double (if memory serves) murder and became the leagues sweetheart. The Bengals head coach presides over a get-arrested machine and he’s a hero. Good grief…
JWS on July 18, 2007 at 4:14 PM
This’ll probably get bumped but here goes…
What’s the use of bein’ one if you can’t act like one.
LtE126 on July 18, 2007 at 4:23 PM
I’ve no doubt the Falcons will try to keep him. But this might not work if A) he’s in federal prison, or B) details of what he did gets to enough Falcon fans that they collectively demand his head. In the minds of many dog owners (a group which I believe coincides significantly with NFL fans), this is a rather emotionally charged set of allegations, to put it mildly.
Blacklake on July 18, 2007 at 4:25 PM
It’s “HotLanta”. Nobody will say shit. He probably has lots of clients there.
LtE126 on July 18, 2007 at 4:29 PM
Lots of cultures practice dogfighting. And if the charges were just illegal dogfighting I think Vick might have a chance of not going being publicly destroyed.
However, traditional dogfighting, as practiced in parts of Asia for example, does NOT involve the torture, mutilation and killing of dogs. Real dogfighters, traditional dogfighters, have great respect for their dogs AS FIGHTERS. They train and feed their dogs to be in top physical condition and the NEVER fight to the death. The owners value their dogs too much, both in a monetary sense and as competitor companions, to kill them. The recent book A Fighters Heart explains dogfighting in its cultural context.
But Vick was not merely involved in illegal dogfighting and gambling. He was involved in extreme animal cruelty. Not only is this illegal but it is reprehensible and sadistic. He’s a morally empty shell in the shape of a man. I think it is the tales of the mutilation, electrocution, torture and hanging of dogs that will send the public into fits. How many sports fans are going sit on their sofas with their family pets at their feet and watch Vick play? How many boys are going to look up to a football player who is seen as a cold-blooded dog killer?
This is NOT hunting. This is NOT killing livestock. Hanging for God’s sake! Smashing dogs into the ground?! This is simply monstrous. People who torture animals in this fashion should not be free to roam decent society. Good bye and good ridance.
Thomas the Wraith on July 18, 2007 at 4:32 PM
Whether he’s done in the NFL is probably entirely dependent on whether he’s convicted. If he gets 6 years in the slam, he’s finished. If he’s acquitted, he’ll be playing. The only doubt about that is whether there’s a franchise willing to have him lead their team.
There will be as long as he doesn’t suck.
Pablo on July 18, 2007 at 4:36 PM
I wonder how long the Nike d*uchebag out in Oregon will keep him on payroll?
DCJeff on July 18, 2007 at 4:36 PM
“Protean”?
Jim Treacher on July 18, 2007 at 4:39 PM
The closer this moves towards a grimly-detailed trial, the greater is the need for the Falcons organization to suspend Vick indefinitely.
Coz I am emotional and a dog lover, if I was the owner of the Falcons, I suspend Vick right now, today. this minute.
If, however unlikely, Vick turns out to be an innocent pawn, then you can apologize to him and bring him back if you want. But right now this minute, the PR issue for the Falcons and for the entire NFL is 100x bigger and more potentially devastating to the Falcons franchise and the league than PacMan Jones’s doofus gangbanger behavior.
When and if Vick goes on road games this year, thats all people will talk about and he’ll be booed as no player in the history of organized sports has ever been booed before, except for maybe Steve Bartman.
Michael Vick is a growing cancer on the NFL, the greatest sports league ever invented. Somebody, somewhere, had better excise the tumor before it kills the league.
Since technically he’s not guilty until proven guilty, it should be up to the Falcons to suspend him. The NFL cant really do much yet, and by the time the league is in any position to do anything, the problem will have spiralled out of control.
that’s my 2 cents. take it for what its worth.
We now return you to Gunsmoke.
Mike D. on July 18, 2007 at 4:44 PM
As a compliment to Peyton, he reminds me of the QB’s of the 50-60’s. Class, honor, commitment to community, etc.
csdeven on July 18, 2007 at 4:48 PM
Can’t wait for Clinton Portis to comment…that should be good…(smirk)
areseaoh on July 18, 2007 at 4:48 PM
doriangrey’s argument is the dumbest argument of all. It’s the “if you don’t do it, then you can’t judge” argument. If I don’t kill my own food, thus I don’t have the moral standing to argue against dog-fighting…or whatever. OK, since I’m not a woman, I can’t ague against abortion…
…and since I’m not a cop, I can’t judge criminal behavior.
…or since I’m not a soldier, I can’t judge the war.
…or since I’m not a broker, I can’t possibly know anything about stocks.
But of course–since there are farmers that choose to make a living by providing meat to the public, then obviously we’re all just a bunch of hypocrite jackasses. Whatever.
There are numerous studies concerning the intelligence of dogs. Dogs save lives. Period. Dogs have adapted faster than any animal on Earth–including HUMANS. Their ability to survive is second only to us.
My wife has a service dog. He has the ability to know if her blood sugar gets too low and thus could go into a diabetic coma. He is invaluable–certainly worth more than your sorry life.
robblefarian on July 18, 2007 at 4:58 PM
You folks seem like good guys. And I understand your cynicism regarding this.
However, having said that, I’m going to repeat myself.
He Gone. Wanna bet?
there it is on July 18, 2007 at 5:00 PM
Can we make this a group hug?
RushBaby on July 18, 2007 at 5:07 PM
If guilty, just cover him in Snausages and throw him in a kennel full of abused pitbulls.
He’ll get the point.
profitsbeard on July 18, 2007 at 5:08 PM
Yes, I’m a Harley riding Pit Bull owner (great dogs. No, I don’t believe in fighting them). This SOB needs to be fed to cats, cuz a good ol’ pit would never attack its owner (traditionally, man fighters were destroyed and not fought). Not only that, but scumbags like these give dog-men and pit bull owners a bad name. Read Richard F. Stratton’s excellent work on the subject.
Re his future – he needs to be out.
TinMan13 on July 18, 2007 at 5:26 PM
Anybody that thinks torturing dumb animals makes you a man is a f*cking p*ssy.
There’s a big difference between killing on the battlefield or for food and institutionalized torture.
ReubenJCogburn on July 18, 2007 at 5:26 PM
Vick can run like the wind and has a cannon arm. But he knows nothing about running an offense and playing the position of quarterback at the NFL level. My friend in Georgia said, “Vick has ruined the Falcons.”
But hey, dog fighting is just part of hip hop culture. To criticize it is just plain racist.
Metro on July 18, 2007 at 5:33 PM
ReubenCogburn, absolutely correct. In fact, this is the difference between Michael Vick and a real man:
http://wbztv.com/topstories/local_story_144094607.html
Zetterson on July 18, 2007 at 5:35 PM
If he does go to jail, make sure there are only wingless flies allowed in his cell.
Wouldn’t want to tempt him too much.
profitsbeard on July 18, 2007 at 5:36 PM
I saw that a couple of weeks ago, I believe on one of the headlines here. Men like SPC Rollins are worth a hundred Michael Vicks. And somehow I doubt a guy who adopted an Iraqi dog would be impressed by “men” who think abusing pets makes you a hard-ass.
ReubenJCogburn on July 18, 2007 at 5:49 PM
A guy in Mass got six years for beating a dog to death, another guy got 6 month probation for repeatedly raping a child over a two year perod. …things that make you go hmmmmm.
Alden Pyle on July 18, 2007 at 5:59 PM
Who the hell is Michael Vick and why is he more talked about than anything that actually matters (WoT, economic boom in progress, lack of cooler temps thanks to the Live Earth concert)?
Neo on July 18, 2007 at 6:12 PM
Yeah and I remember a story about a high rise window washer who got in some pretty serious legal trouble for having swatted a pigeon that flew at his head while he was dangling hundreds of feet in the air.
Zetterson on July 18, 2007 at 6:20 PM
Bravo! Someone finally said it! We’ve been hearing since 2001 that the guy was the second comnig of who? Elway? He was the new prototype quarterback, only Fran Tarkington was a runner before Vick was born.
Not to worry, the worst headcoach in the NFL (Herman Edwards) and the worst GM (Carl Peterson) will pick him up in a heartbeat.
srhoades on July 18, 2007 at 6:40 PM
This is the kicker….there was sadism involved. They did this had been done to teach the other living dogs a lesson? Or just to be sadistic? Not just illegal dogfighting. Vick is done.
Suz on July 18, 2007 at 6:54 PM
Sick stuff.
congsan on July 18, 2007 at 6:55 PM
*correction
“They did this to teach….”
Sorry for the lousy typing.
Suz on July 18, 2007 at 6:55 PM
If this brutal, sadistic, depraved behavior doesn’t end this guy’s career, I don’t know what would. But then again, people still chase after O.J. for his autograph.
nyrofan on July 18, 2007 at 6:56 PM
The ultra-lib comments coming from ESPN should be no surprise, and I’m not talking about the Rush thing. Anyone remember where Olby got his start?
srhoades on July 18, 2007 at 7:01 PM
Michael Vick is the biggest jerk we have here in Atlanta. Okay, the second biggest jerk after Ted Turner…
radjah shelduck on July 18, 2007 at 7:05 PM
At least the gladiators understood what they were doing, and were willing to lay down their lives for the chance of freedom. This would make them closer to soldiers in a war, not dogs fighting for the entertainment of a sick and twisted individual.
Maybe you’re just the one that doesn’t have the morals.
I don’t think that even people who use that argument say that he who is not a soldier has no right to judge the war.
Ryan Gandy on July 18, 2007 at 7:07 PM
Killed, cleaned and cooked my own dinner many-a-time (both hunting and fishing) and can say with absolute moral certainty that what Vick did was abhorrent. Anyone trying to make a moral equivalent to the two has rocks in his head.
srhoades on July 18, 2007 at 7:11 PM
I don’t know what to say after all these comments. I killed in a war. I hunt. I don’t know if Vick is guilty , but I know this……. I would still put him in a pit with the dogs he trained… let’s see how tough he is.I’ve seen comments about killing animals and such and so be it. I buy my meat at a grocery store now. To anyone who thinks I’m less a man because I can use a weapon effectively but still care for animals… you haven’t been in combat and you aren’t a true hunter.
MNDavenotPC on July 18, 2007 at 8:03 PM
You’re right. The walking anus who killed the dog should’ve gotten 10 years. The rapist should’ve gotten 30 to life.
Blacklake on July 18, 2007 at 8:49 PM
I’m a big animal lover and the reality is that blacks, chinese, hispanics, arabs, you name it, do not value animals as western culture does. In their culture, there is no empathy. No conscience. Individuals are individuals, but if you take a race as a whole, that is the unfortunate reality.
jihadwatcher on July 18, 2007 at 9:41 PM
I certainly would hope he’s done.That is Sick and totally Disgusting!
wubu on July 18, 2007 at 10:04 PM
He hasn’t been convicted of anything. He’s been indicted on (basically) the say-so of unnamed sources who very likely were looking for a deal to stay out of prison. We’ll see how it pans out.
It’s entirely possible he let one of his buddies use his house because it was private and big enough to hold the fights, but didn’t know the extent of the brutality of the “sport”. A crime of stupidity.
As long as he doesn’t serve any jail time – which he won’t – his career is fine. His next contract won’t be as lucrative, that’s about it.
RightOFLeft on July 19, 2007 at 1:40 AM
I’ve had enough of these guys and the NFL that protects and promotes them! From Vick to Daunte (Love Boat) to TO they have turned the league into something that I no longer care to watch. I use to be a fan but no more. Same thing happened to me with the NBA before it was taken over by gangsters. I will now watch college football and follow my Iowa Hawkeyes and you guys can have the NFL. I’m done with these fools!
sabbott on July 19, 2007 at 3:16 AM
It has been a really bad year for Va Tech alums.
I hope he does time, but he probably won’t. He’ll skate just like Jeffrey I-purchased-a-sex-slave Epstein.
J-
John on July 19, 2007 at 3:37 AM
Vick is no better than Jeffey Dahmer. Same mindset.
BTW. PRCalDude, punt my Yorkie, and you die. She is my heart, and you don’t have one. And if you think that was a joke you made, it’s not funny.
Ignorant Mensan on July 19, 2007 at 10:20 AM
do you have any % of blacks, chinese, hispanics, arabs…? All? Some? None of western culture is included? How many of these people do you know personally? or are you just guessing.
flipflopper on July 19, 2007 at 10:39 AM
oh I forgot, what about Koreans, Indian? Russians…Are they included?
flipflopper on July 19, 2007 at 10:40 AM
I would have assumed that you were referring to Africans, when you mention blacks, except that Vick isn’t African; he’s an American, and, therefore a member and product of Western culture.
Most black Americans I know love their pets just as dearly as other Americans do. Then there are the fallen humans–the sadists–of all races. Never forget that.
baldilocks on July 19, 2007 at 3:14 PM
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