Audio: Kristol rips NYT, Senate “jackasses” on Iraq; Update: McCain, Voinovich in backroom “brawl” over Iraq

posted at 8:26 pm on July 10, 2007 by Allahpundit

I like his plan for McCain and his point about letting Petraeus, whose appointment Congress ratified, being given a fair chance to implement his strategy is naturally well taken. But does anyone think things are going to be so vastly improved ten weeks from now that it might change the naysayers’ minds about whether to begin a drawdown soon or not? The improvement would have to be so dramatic and impressive to the public that it would actually be in Harry Reid’s interest — which begins, of course, with those precious Senate seats he’s been dreaming of — to switch his vote?

Anyone see that happening? Under any circumstances?

Update: What happens when the most notorious temper in the Senate clashes with one of his dimmer colleagues in the amnesty wing? Magic, baby:

Fresh off a trip to Iraq, a visibly tired McCain lit into the “liberal left” for advocating retreat in Iraq and then went behind closed doors to brawl with a fellow GOP senator over the war.

In what one senator called “the most serious fight that I have seen in my time in the Senate,” McCain clashed with Sen. George Voinovich (R-Ohio) over the Arizona senator’s assertion that the most dangerous threat facing U.S. troops in Iraq was Al Qaeda members.

Voinovich, who recently urged President Bush to change his war policy now, shot back that Al Qaeda “wouldn’t be in Iraq” if American forces weren’t there, according to people who witnessed the exchange.

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Voinovichh is right. AQ wouldn’t be in Iraq if the US troops weren’t there. They be here. I’d rather fight AQ in Iraq with the best soldiers in the world than here.

Mig on July 11, 2007 at 11:13 AM

Right on Allah.

Any opportunity the Iraqis had of leaving behind autocratic rule based on religious hatred was lost once Saddam was hanged, if not sooner. Hatred of that monster probably was the only thing a significant majority of Iraqis agreed upon (and some still supported him unfortunately).

At that moment a truly representative government more along US federal lines rather than a parliamentary system might have worked.

But the fact is no amount of US blood is going to solve their problems right now. They need to slaughter each other until they finally get sick of it. Unfortunately, I think that is going to take a long time. Oil exports from Iraq are going to continue to suffer.

I supported the war. I thought the Iraqis would jump at an opportunity to leave armed civil strife behind. I’m still glad we invaded, and killed off Saddam’s cadre. But we should have just shot him while he was in his hole in the ground and then left town.

If we had, Republicans still would control the Senate. That price was too high, because it will cost this nation so much more over the next couple of election cycles.

As an afterthought, the Kurds would do well to make-nice with the Turks, before they find themselves wiped out on two fronts.

doufree on July 11, 2007 at 11:28 AM

What are you going to do? Eat your spinach Obliterate your HA account?

Fragility on July 10, 2007 at 11:48 PM

Ciao Fragil one – though, as usual, I always miss losing another troll because it’s way more fun with you around.

baldilocks, Limerick, csdeven, Jen the Neocon, MB4 and all others here and everywhere who have served, do serve or are families of those who serve this country – THANK YOU!

Thank you for supporting our freedom and right to also be stupid, aside from being free.

MB4 you became most infuriating when you started to drop titles. Your display of ‘superior’ knowledge and moral authority on things war, just because you were somebody, was all lost when you missed the point of the most powerful premise of the volunteer force.

Btw – many on this board, including some lefties, are credentialed, educated and/or experienced and hardly ever have all that running in front of them. Nor do they diminish others who don’t or call them idiots or other terms only elitists would.

Sincerely though, I appreciate your service the same as all others’. You are all superior to the rest of us.

Entelechy on July 11, 2007 at 1:38 PM

Actually I was an E1, E2, E5, O1, O2 and O3

achieved in three and a half years of service, says MP4. At present, time-in-grade requirements for promotion to O-2 and O-3 are both two years. Leaving out the rather minuscule time-in-grade requirements for the junior enlisted grades in which MP4 says that he served, that’s four years already. Perhaps, however, MP4 served when the time-in-grade requirements were different. It’s possible.

baldilocks on July 11, 2007 at 2:17 PM

A**holes like MB4 are all over the net and they all say the same thing “i was in the military, i voted for Bush, if you don’t serve you’re a chickenhawk etc.” and they’re all full of sh*t. They usually get the idea from this site, but everything they say is a lie and they’re not worth the time it takes to discredit them.

forged rite on July 11, 2007 at 5:08 PM

Here’s the “tactics, techniques and procedures” page from that site. Like i said, they’re just a bunch of liberal a**holes and like all a**holes, they’re full of sh*t.

forged rite on July 11, 2007 at 5:13 PM

MB4 is a hill at Sill?
I spent 4 years at Ft.Sill, Basic,AIT,then stationed there.
About 2 years with Staff&Fac, the rest with 2/2 214thBrigade. Used to work at Poolaw Hall, right behind I-See-O bldg. I been all over that base(except for the impact areas)never heard of MB4. Why not go with Mount Scott, thats the highest point around there. Medicine Bluffs were cool, or hell why not somethin about Geronimo, he’s buried there. Why some obscure map point, why some obscure hill? What happened to you on that hill MB4?

Kristol sounded off well. Somebody attacks my home, I’m going to try to get the fight away from my family first. Give me a second or two, so I can gear up for combat, then I’m headed for the enemies front yard. I’m pretty sure Sun Tzu mentioned, if possible you pick the battlefield, the book might have been written a while back but his concepts are absolutely logical. And what better place to set up a terrorist killing zone than Iraq? Saddam had been begging for a final a**whippin ever since his psycho chronies signed the cease fire and promptly forgot Uncle Sams military muscle. God only knows how many acts of war that saddist saddam commited against US, trying to assasinate ANY ex POTUS is reason enough. Even without the WMD argument there’s plenty case enough. The dems call Iraq a terrorist magnet… d*mn right, go there and fight somebody ready for your evil twisted a*s, that’s the alternative to them attacking our families in highrise office buildings.
I’m still for the war.
I’m still for the troops.
I just wish I could tell my brothers in arms “we got your back at home”, but its tough when Dems declare it’s open season on anyone who supports victory, and the Pres. declares it’s open borders to anyone who supports the law.

christophercube on July 12, 2007 at 1:43 AM