I was persuing Hot Air, and was reading this post, which led to this (typical) wacko thread in DUmmie Land, and decided to take a perusal of the other amusements. Been awhile since I did that. And lo and behold, here is a great topic

Poll question: Wi…

doriangrey on June 20, 2007 at 10:41 AM

A strong show of force is a deterrent to the Kim Jong Il’s of the world. That deterrent saves lives in the long run. When we handicap our military and make them tentative in killing the enemy, it puts more lives at risk, and lowers the threat value of force.

Sissification has taught us all that we should do ANYTHING to avoid harming civilians, and moral equivocation has led us to the point where we can’t tell the difference between harming people and targeting them.

The enemy hides behind civilians for two reasons – because they don’t draw the same distinctions as we do, and because it works, much of the time.

The only reason they complain about collateral damage is because our press reacts to it – they obviously don’t care much aboutr innocent victims if they strap their kids into bomb-cars to avoid searches and target schools and markets for attacks.

Properly, we don’t TARGET innocents or third-parties. We should also not allow the enemy to use innocents as shields – there is no positive consequence to that action at all.

In both cases, the civilian deaths are the result of the enemy’s actions. To blame us is simply lawyering for the enemy – because if we allow the enemy’s use of civilians as shields to succeed, we simply allow them more time to continue targeted attacks on us – and innocent civilians and third-parties.

They know what are weakness is, and they know how to exploit it. Trust me, I got out early because of insane rules of engagement, but I was basically saddled with the same ROE for 18 years, it’s nothing new.

As ass backwards as many of them are in some areas, they are remarkably clever in other areas. It’s like getting in a barfight and following the rules of Olympic Boxing – you’ll get your ass kicked every time.

Hopefully the dipsh–s are letting guys take off the gloves now.

reaganaut on June 20, 2007 at 12:07 AM

I completely agree with the above statement and assessment, especially the fact they (the Jihadis that want us dead) count on us to conduct our war against them in a PC manner, this makes us weak and makes them stronger, they know this and count on it. If we don’t hit them they live on to fight and kill us, if we do hit them and “innocent civilians” are killed in the process then they use it as propaganda and cry to the world about how we are the “true terrorists!”

For our enemy using “innocent civilians” as human shields is an effective tactic but only because we allow it to be effective by holding ourselves to some higher standard of civilized behavior when war is anything but civilized.
I’m not saying we should stoop to their level and start suicide bombing innocent men, women, and children at bus stops, not at all, that’s barbaric, however, as long as we continue to wage this war in a PC manner and allow the politicos to meddle with how the war is being prosecuted by dictating ridiculous PC rules of engagement to our military commanders it only serves to tie our own hands behind our backs and makes it easier for our enemies to defeat us.

If our military had the same rules of engagement during WWII we would all be speaking Japanese of German right now!
I have said this many times to anyone that will listen, YOU DON’T WIN WARS BY BEING PC, WAR IS NOT PC, NEVER HAS BEEN AND NEVER WILL BE!

Our politicos need to take the leash off and allow our military to do what it’s trained to do, kick our enemies ass wherever they are until they unconditionally surrender, then and only then should politics be involved. Any nation that prosecutes a war through the shackles of being PC or politics in anyway will not be victorious and Vietnam is “the proof in the pudding!” It was this type of PC mentality that allowed Bin Laden to go on living when the Clinton Administration had him dead in their sites, it’s no way to run a war let alone win it!

I hope this wasn’t a one time deal and it’s a sign that our government is FINALLY taking the gloves off of our military when it comes to fighting these fanatical butchers! Also, the bottom line is these monsters choose to base their operations among civilian populations and/or have their family with them in their training and operations camps the resulting innocent deaths is their responsibility, not ours, they’re the cowards hiding behind skirts, besides, it’s ok because it is their religious duty!

While I do feel pity for the children that are killed the bottom line is in war they cannot be considered “innocent civilians.” If we change our tactic to not hesitating to hit targets even if “innocent civilians” may be killed and stop worrying about our “image” around the world (they hate us anyway) then we no longer fight with our hands tied behind our backs and our enemies will soon learn that their tactic of conducting military operations from within civilian populations is no longer a “win-win” for them, it will put them in a state of constant fear and put them off balance wondering when the next one is coming, and that’s how it should be!

This includes Mosque’s as well, if they don’t want their Mosque turned to rubble then they better not conduct military operations from it! Seriously, could you imagine what Patton would have said if he were given these ridiculous rules of engagement…he’d probably shoot the messenger right between the eyes, then he’d blow the SH*T out of the Mosque he was being attacked from regardless of who was in it!

We need another Patton…God rest is soul, he’s rolling over in his grave right now seeing how our politicos are prosecuting this war! I say no more safe refuge for our enemy, hit them hard, hit them anywhere, anytime, and often!

16? 15? 14?… if so, while the West considers these children, they consider them Soldiers…

What do they think those children would have grown up to be? Rocket Scientists, Democratic Voters, or Muslim POS terrorists?

Its not like Islamic murderers hide behind civilians, women and children, after all.

They’d never do that, being the honorable warriors that they are.

Come to think of it, there’s nobody better to be near civilians, women and children than a radical Islamic zealot.

/snark off

Good Lt on June 19, 2007 at 11:36 PM

I recall a saying…something about Good Muslims being Dead Muslims…but I can’t remember the exact words right now….

I don’t follow links to DU or any of the other moonbat fever swamps any more, but somehow I don’t think the wailing of Generation Surrender would surprise me any.

MSNBC once again gives political and propoganda help to our enemies, with help from someone in our own government.

We will NOT be defeated by our external enemies… its our internal traitors that I truly worry about.

Do you want to become as savage as our enemy?

No I want to be 100 times more savage than our enemies, I want us to be so brutal that our enemies piss their pants at the very thought of engaging our troops, I want us to be so savage that our enemies have no will to engage us in any way shape of form. I want us to be so ruthless that our enemies would kill themselves before allowing one of their own to attack us.

We not only killed some kids, unfortunately (because scumbags hide amongst them), we’re killing the inner children of pampered leftist squishes.

Don’t they know this war would be sooo much easier for us if they would just come out of hiding and stand in an empty field where we could then target and kill subdue negotiate capitulate to them in the most politically correct manner?

So, when Palestinian mothers send their kids off to be suicide bombers, they are congratulated.

Thus, I expect Muslims to congratulate us for doing the same favor for their kids.

By their own ill-logic.

I’m not hand wringing over individual casualties – I understand the necessity in this case – I’m arguing against fighting in the same manner as the Islamists, as some here have suggested.

SouthernDem on June 20, 2007 at 9:22 AM

We aren’t suggesting that…we aren’t suggesting hijacking airplanes or strapping suicide bombs to our soldiers. We’re suggesting fighting a traditional Clausewitzian war a-la WWII, or at the very least a Warden ‘Centers of Gravity’ war. That the effects may look on the surface to be similar is irrelevant.

In quotes because it’s a terrible (if necessary) thing to contemplate. But I’ve had that link saved since he wrote it.