Rasmussen: Rudy 24, Fred 24
posted at 10:42 am on June 12, 2007 by Allahpundit
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Will our right-wing Messiah take a national lead before he even announces?
Former New York City Mayor Rudy Giuliani has to share his spot atop the field of Republican Presidential hopefuls this week. The newest face in the race, former Tennessee Senator Fred Thompson, is now tied with Giuliani. The latest Rasmussen Reports national telephone survey finds each man earning support from 24% of likely Republican Primary voters. A week ago, Giuliani had a six percentage point lead over Thompson, 23% to 17%…
Just as startling as Thompson’s rise in this week’s poll is the continuing loss of support for Arizona Senator John McCain. The man once considered the dominant front runner in the race is now supported by just 11% of likely Republican Primary voters nationwide. That’s down from 17% in May and 14% a week ago. His support is just half of what it was in January.
McCain’s also looking at another third-place fundraising finish, according to Politico, which he hopes to compensate for by “reconnecting with the base” in July.
We’ll all look forward to that.
Meanwhile, it’s interesting that Fred’s gain in the Rasmussen poll is entirely at Mitt’s and McCain’s expense. He’s been taking chunks out of Rudy’s lead in other polls, but Giuliani’s actually up a point here from the last sample, probably on the strength of his showing at the debate. It won’t last, though, which is why he took a hard, hard turn to the right today on illegal immigration, which he’s been all for in the past. It’s the only leftist position he hasn’t hugged too tightly to relinquish now, so it looks like he’s letting it go. It won’t save him, but it can’t hurt to try.
Since we’re talking polls, a word of caution about this one. Every time new numbers come out showing Congress’s ratings in the basement, right-wing bloggers crow. Let me gently suggest that the main reason they’re tanking is because Reid and Pelosi haven’t done enough to surrender in Iraq to please their anti-war base, and so they’ve deserted her the way the right has deserted McCain. If and when they get enough Republican votes to force Bush into some type of withdrawal, not only will the war effort crumble, Congress’s ratings will probably rise. Not really cause for celebration, is it?
FYI, Fred’s on Leno tonight. We’ll be recording, of course. Exit question one: Will it hurt him that he used to be a “foreign agent”? Exit question two: Why, if McCain’s so worried about losing the Hispanic vote long-term, is he insulting Latino special interest groups by bypassing their events?
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There’s not enough Chap-Stik in the world.
Kid from Brooklyn on June 12, 2007 at 10:47 AM
Geez. I’m still sore from the last time.
BacaDog on June 12, 2007 at 10:50 AM
HUH????
What world was this in? I don’t remember there ever being a time where the majority of conservatives could stomach this fool.
Gregor on June 12, 2007 at 10:51 AM
Regardless. A few days ago Reid told Congress that Democrats are more trusted than Republicans, while arguing the immigration issue. When the MSM quotes the new “All-time Low” approval rating for Bush, I doubt they’re taking into consideration that Republicans don’t approve, because he’s not doing enough in Iraq, not closing the borders, etc.. No, they go into how Americans are angry at Iraq, and think he’s, basically, a war hawk.
amerpundit on June 12, 2007 at 10:52 AM
hahaha
Spirit of 1776 on June 12, 2007 at 10:52 AM
He always managed to pull in 51% of the vote around his campaign office.
amerpundit on June 12, 2007 at 10:53 AM
It was in the out of touch elites in Washington world, which is not to be confused with the real world.
thirteen28 on June 12, 2007 at 10:53 AM
As far as the topic of this thread goes, I think the nomination fight is going to come down to Fred vs. Rudy. Fred needs to get moving because Rudy was very smart in listing his 12 commitments.
thirteen28 on June 12, 2007 at 10:55 AM
So McShame is going to turn on the war to reconnect with the presstitutes that backed his earlier runs, or is he going to call for tax hikes on “the rich”?
steveegg on June 12, 2007 at 10:57 AM
Oh, and our resident anti-Fred!dite will be along presently to spin this in 5, 4, 3….
steveegg on June 12, 2007 at 10:58 AM
I have such mixed feelings about Fred. I wish he’d just hurry up and get in. It’s rapidly changing from giddy anticipation to wondering-if-you-got-jilted first date.
Tanya on June 12, 2007 at 11:05 AM
Aww, what the? Everyone’s copying my cs countdown bit! Buncha posers, the lot of ya!
Whatever, I’m happy with Fred or Rudy. Fred’s my first choice and Rudy’s my second choice.
Bad Candy on June 12, 2007 at 11:09 AM
Fred!, stay off of the Letterman BDS hour. Leno won’t throw a pie in your face but Dave will damn sure try.
Limerick on June 12, 2007 at 11:10 AM
Where has cs been?
AP, did you ban him in the middle of the night?
BacaDog on June 12, 2007 at 11:10 AM
I have two words for you conservatives that are out to Hamstring Rudy.
“President Hillary”
:(
JayHaw Phrenzie on June 12, 2007 at 11:13 AM
Hey, I’m not out to hamstring Rudy! I think Fred has potential, and I’d like to see him campaign, if he’s not what we need or not good enough, I’ll go with Rudy. Not that difficult.
Bad Candy on June 12, 2007 at 11:17 AM
Actually, it doesn’t matter who I support for the primary, PA doesn’t vote primaries till the nominees are picked.
Bad Candy on June 12, 2007 at 11:19 AM
You weren’t here to do it, so I had to jump in just in case he showed up early.
Here you and I part company. I MIGHT take Giuliani over McCain, and I would take him over Paul and the Dhimms, but beyond that, I wouldn’t vote for him.
steveegg on June 12, 2007 at 11:21 AM
Rudy/Fred 08?
Dash on June 12, 2007 at 11:24 AM
Either way.
amerpundit on June 12, 2007 at 11:25 AM
If Rudy’s the best guy, he can show his mettle by beating Fred. If he can’t be Fred, then it’s probably because he’s not the best guy.
thirteen28 on June 12, 2007 at 11:25 AM
As long as Rudy promises not to get all Brady Bunch, NARAL on us and he sounds like he bloody well means it, I’m not worried. I think he’ll keep his word. Plus I think he reads the writing on the wall and sees people are demanding enforcement get done on immigration and nothing less will be accepted.
Bad Candy on June 12, 2007 at 11:27 AM
If people knew that Fred Thompson was a lobbyist (ahem, Access Man/Foreign Agent), they’d be a lot less hot for him. What, he couldn’t find anything better to do than stuff his own pockets (on behalf of a foreign company) during the first five years after the War on Terror started? He doesn’t sound serious to me, and you guys are all over him. It’s embarassing, and a joke.
Big S on June 12, 2007 at 11:28 AM
Dash, the egos on Fred and Rudy would NEVER let them accept a VP spot.
Bad Candy on June 12, 2007 at 11:28 AM
And Rudy’s company is any different? FAIL
Bad Candy on June 12, 2007 at 11:29 AM
Fff..Ffreddd!
/channelling Timmy’s voice
omnipotent on June 12, 2007 at 11:31 AM
And yes, I know what Rudy’s company does is different, but people who are looking for something to rail against him with will use it in the same way as people will use Fred’s lobbying, so that point is pure carp.
Bad Candy on June 12, 2007 at 11:34 AM
No, Mr. McCain… that connector is for European house current..
ricer1 on June 12, 2007 at 11:37 AM
In order for this to matter, you gotta win the primary.
JackStraw on June 12, 2007 at 11:44 AM
It ain’t cr*p. People can tell the difference (you and I are examples) between Rudy’s company (as well as the law firm he lent his name to) and PERSONALLY seeking favors from an ex-colleague on behalf of a foreign company. Now, I’m obviously not crazy about Fred, and like Rudy in this race (so I’m biased), but the whole Southern-fried white knight thing is almost as transparent as John Edwards’ nail polish to me. He quit his job in the Senate just when things were getting serious (emotional disterss), and now figures he can pretend to be a real social conservative and DC outsider to win the nomination. Somebody’s going to call him on it.
P.S. The fact that the company was seeking favors to limit it’s liability WILL NOT PLAY WELL is somebody does call him on it. Maybe the “base” will be okay with it, but hings like that will come back to haunt him later.
Big S on June 12, 2007 at 11:51 AM
I hat this hing! I can’t ype!
Big S on June 12, 2007 at 11:55 AM
You don’t like it because it’s true. Fred! really is like that. And most people prefer a Southern Fried white knight who tells it with a grain of humillity over a squaking new yawkah who jams it down your throat.
No, he did not. Fred! said that after he got re-elected he would run out his term and he would leave. He didn’t want to be a career senator. Imagine that, a senator living up to his word.
He’s not campaigning as a DC outsider though. He is using his experience in DC as part of his platform.
It’s like you Fred! haters think he’s this used-car salesman or something. It’s not true, and we here in Tennessee are telling you this after having him represent us for several years.
He does what he says, that’s the appeal pure and simple.
Tman on June 12, 2007 at 12:06 PM
I’d love Fred to come on Letterman and outwit that snobbish wise ass with some Southern style. And you know Fred can do it!
AlexB on June 12, 2007 at 12:10 PM
Is Fred “gonna pull those pistols or whistle Dixie?”
Brat on June 12, 2007 at 12:20 PM
I’m not a Fred hater. I tend not to get emotionally involved with candidates. I just want the person with the best chance of winning to be the nominee. If Fred is all that, how about he actually, you know, starts running and let the rest of us judge him on his performance not just take your word.
Fred’s determination to sit out the first few rounds of debates may be a great political strategy as he never has to answer hard questions and just let his supporters frame him, but for those of us who actually want to see candidates respond under pressure are getting a little tired of the act.
Oh, and don’t get too wrapped up in the good ol’ boy thing. It’s not nearly as endearing as you seem to think it is.
JackStraw on June 12, 2007 at 12:21 PM
This sounds pretty bad for freddie boy. He might have to start donning a worn out straw hat and trade his ceegar in for a wheat stalk. As Knute was lethally adorable, fred? has created a lethally folksy image for himself. Knute was following a natural path where as fred? is a complete fake.
csdeven on June 12, 2007 at 12:21 PM
You’re new to this whole “election” thing, aren’t you?
Rudy sees Fred! catching up fast from the right, so now he’s tacking right on immigration despite his support for amnesty and his history of supporting and re-instating an anti-enforcement “sanctuary city” policy in NYC.
If he wins the nomination, he’ll shift back to his old RINO self, guaranteed. Happens every damn election; pander to the base for the primaries, then reverse course and move to the theoretical “center” for the general election.
Me? Not ready to be fooled again by another RINO who’s flirting with conservatism just long enough to get lucky.
Hollowpoint on June 12, 2007 at 12:27 PM
I understand that perspective, and I don’t disagree. I just can’t blame the guy for wanting to wait until he’s ready to do this though. It’s not like he’s applying for a job at McDonalds, this is a major commitment. At the same time, it’s June 2007, the election is not tomorrow.
Tman on June 12, 2007 at 12:28 PM
That made me laugh out loud.
Yakko77 on June 12, 2007 at 12:29 PM
Not a surprise seeing Fred! catching up to Guiliani. In fact when ‘I’m with Fred’ website was announced the traffic hits surpassed all of the top 3 Republican candidates websites. He kinda, sorta blew them out of the waters those first few days.
Kokonut on June 12, 2007 at 12:32 PM
Get ready? Was he unaware that there is a Presidential election every 4 years? Come on, he’s been getting ready for this since he left the senate, perhaps before.
Look, I think he’s a smart, capable guy. Is he the best candidate? Who knows, it’s up to him to demonstrate this. He’s in danger of becomming the Howard Dean of this cycle. Remember how inevitable he was until he wasn’t anymore?
JackStraw on June 12, 2007 at 12:37 PM
You make a good point. The propaganda media loves to say the Bush is unpopular but they don’t ever say WHY he’s unpopular. He’s unpopular because he won’t secure the border 6 years after 9/11 and he won’t enforce current immigration law. If he did those things he would be extremely popular. The democrats are unpopular because they’re traitors and vote whores but that’s a whole different story.
Mojave Mark on June 12, 2007 at 12:38 PM
The logic of this argument still escapes me. The timing of the political debates and announcements by candidates at such an early stage is unprecedented in presidential politics. I see a lot of folks are upset that a candidate would take the traditional path of announcing less than a year out(could that be conservative?) instead of leaping in with the masses and causing confusion and candidate apathy before we even get to the serious campaigning of the late summer and early fall.
In Mr. Thompson’s defense, he had contractual arrangements that he had to take care of before he could announce, which, if I’m not mistaken, is an honorable thing to do. In the meantime, he has run a Net-centric campaign on a broad range of issues that the other candidates are not touching. For example, his article on Zimbabwe , which talks about not only their economic collapse but the failure of the UN to be effective on anything but food aid.
Fred is getting his message out, and he’s doing it in a sustainable and savvy manner.
As to being a lobbyist, the last time I checked, that’s a legal occupation. And I find nothing wrong with someone who can make money doing what he’s been trained to do — be a lawyer and zealously represent his client. Isn’t that what we call an entrepreneur, the backbone of our economy?
These arguments are a house of cards that fall to logic. Patience, friends. We’ll have a real campaign to talk about very soon after he announces. In the meantime, I’m enjoying Fred’s take on a variety of issues that I haven’t seen addressed by any other candidate.
Tennman on June 12, 2007 at 12:41 PM
Now, you say that and the facts say this…..
In 2002, after waffling for almost a year, freddie boy surprised his supporters by announcing he would not run a mere 20 some days before the deadline. That doesn’t sound to me like he was committed to not run again. Sounds to me like he learned a new lesson in fakery in 2002 and now he’s using it again.
csdeven on June 12, 2007 at 12:42 PM
Tennman, well said. csdeven, did Fred steal your girlfriend or kill your best dog? What is your deal pal?
NeverSubmit on June 12, 2007 at 12:44 PM
Fred’s got a brilliant strategy going. He is speaking directly to the Republican primaries voters via his podcasts and the radio and he is getting paid for it versus having to pay, perhaps, millions. As we can see this strategy has him firmly near the top of the polls. When he announces he will lose these venues so just be patient.
Bill C on June 12, 2007 at 12:51 PM
Leno?!!
Come on FRED! I want to see a real interview to see if there is a pot of gold underneath that legend of yours!
Fred! has all the stuff for Prez! (at least that is what everyone is telling me) but he seems to be hesitant about being interviewed by REAL hardball figures, and I don’t mean Chris Matthews.
If Fred! ever officially declares, then he needs to get an interviewed on Bill Oreilly and perhaps by Alan Colmes. If he is able to hold is own (as well as dish out some fire) against the interviewers, the GOP won’t need a primary as FRED!’s numbers would encompass 90% plus.
Note: Fred!, Fred!, is he the man? If he can’t do it, then Mitt! surely can!
Darnell Clayton on June 12, 2007 at 12:55 PM
No kidding. It’s almost Pavlovian. I never know what a Fred Thread will be about until I read it, but I always know csdeven will spend eight hours each day trying to kill it.
wccawa on June 12, 2007 at 12:58 PM
Base to McCain “Are we about to be unscr*wed? Naahhh”.
csdeven, dead daughter, personal tragedy and reflection – google it.
Entelechy on June 12, 2007 at 1:00 PM
There is an undercurrent of bigotry against people from the South in people who live in big northern metropolitan areas. Being from Chicago, I know all about this. You want to feign stupidity you affect a southern accent.
I know everyone has a favorite candidate but can we stick to the issues. Ok, personality and communication skills do matter and some will base there vote on whether they like the sound of someones voice. Still, that is no reason to fall into stereotype and prejudice against a non-PC culture.
Bill C on June 12, 2007 at 1:03 PM
What’s my deal? I’m a conservative. I don’t give my support to a non-candidate who is presenting himself as an equal with actual candidates who have braved debates, tough questions, and hostile interviewers. fred? is like a AA ball player bragging that he has more home runs than a major leaguer. The guy has not been challenged and as a real conservative I demand action, not rhetoric. It is an insult to courageous candidates for freddie boy to get his head all puffed up over these specious poll numbers. My conservative values dictate that I not accept polls results that included a coward who has refused to announce. And before anyone parrots the “he was under contract bla bla bla”, those obligations did not prevent him from making a firm commitment. He is still waffling on weather he will even announce.
That just speaks to his honor. He still has a 20 year record of twisting public officials arms for the benefit of special interest groups.
Then we have his pro-choice stance and his flip-flop on that. Which lies do we believe?
Speaking of lies….he, against the advice of his manager, went out and bought a pickup truck that his staff would drive a few blocks away from his rallies. fred? would take his limo to the truck and drive the truck to the rally. He would then drive away from the rally, park the truck a few blocks away, and his staff would drive it home.
THAT is not a conservative value. A conservative doesn’t have to fake out his own supporters by creating an image of what he is not.
My problem is that fred? talks a good game, but he ain’t walking the walk. And until he does grow some stones and opens himself up to the scrutiny that REAL candidates do, he will receive no respect and every bit of criticism that I can muster.
csdeven on June 12, 2007 at 1:06 PM
It’s pretty simple logic. The race is on despite the fact that it gets earlier every cycle. If Fred wants my consideration, then get in the race. He knows exactly what he is doing, as you said he has been running a stealth campaign, free from scrutiny and tough questions and is playing this game as long as he can.
Had Rudy taken this tack, he would probably still have 60% of the vote. But he got in, openned himself up to the process and lost some support. When Fred eventually does, he will also lose some support as his abortion “nuanced” position is examined, his leadership on McCain/Feingold, hell he will even have to answer why he was John McCains co-chair last election and now is running against him.
If Fred is all that his supporters say he is, he should welcome the comparison to his competitors not avoid it.
JackStraw on June 12, 2007 at 1:24 PM
cd,
Fred! commited to two terms as a senator when he initially ran for office. He in fact ran on that promise, that he would only serve for two terms and then he was done. After 9/11, he did waver a bit because he felt that he could do more to help by staying in office, but he decided to keep his word and he left after the term ended.
Again, what a concept- a politician who does what he says.
And your bit about the pick up truck is silly. I have seen Fred driving the pick up truck in Nashville, and not to any rally.
Yes, he owns a red pick up truck. Yes, he does drive it. Yes, he also owns other vehicles, he drives them too. So what?
You sound as if he stole your baby or something, give it a rest buddy. He is the real deal.
Tman on June 12, 2007 at 1:35 PM
It’s mid-June. Somehow I suspect he’ll manage to work that into his schedule over the next 7 months.
The same could be said of the other candidates in a different respect- why haven’t they submitted a couple dozen articles published on the web for all to see talking about their political philosophy as Fred has done? Are they that afraid of leaving a paper trail?
Instead we get the likes of Rudy’s “12 commandments” in which he promises in typical campaign fashion to wave his magic wand and make all our dreams come true.
Hollowpoint on June 12, 2007 at 1:38 PM
csdeven on June 12, 2007 at 1:06 PM
What you are doing is not criticism it’s called libel. You keep concocting analogies regarding him that are intellectually dishonest disingenuous and intentional distortions of the truth. You have had every single one of these disingenuous assertions refuted by multiple individuals on multiple occasions with the appropriate documentation to prove that you intentionally mischaracterized misquoted and distorted the facts. And when confronted with the facts you simply ignore them and continue to rant and rave tossing out the same refuted canards.
doriangrey on June 12, 2007 at 1:44 PM
I figure it this way: A man runs on the strength of his own character and accomplishments. It’s up to the rest of us to judge his veracity. One cannot attest to his own.
The only evasive answer I’ve heard Fred give is on the date of his decision and announcement. That tells me that he’ll answer whatever questions are raised about his character and his truthfulness. If he doesn’t, then we’ll have an answer of a different sort. But I’m not going to jump the gun yet. I’m willing to wait and let the candidacy settle in.
As to the argument that he should dive into the middle of the muddled lemmings so he can share their fate, that’s really not a good strategy, my friend. We live in a culture these days of instant gratification. There’s a fine line between eager anticipation and unreal expectation.
I’ll savor the appetizers for now in eager anticipation of the entrée.
/Pun intended.
Tennman on June 12, 2007 at 1:52 PM
And when he does I will begin to consider him as a serious candidate. Until then, you’re right, he and his team put out a lot of position papers. Much like every other candidate does on their websites. It’s nice that NRO has seen fit to partner with Fred but I don’t give him any bonus points for that. The positions are there for all candidates.
I just want to see him answer live, not to Sean Hannity, but in a debate format. I learn a lot about potential candidates in this type of pressure setting and look forward to seeing how Fred handles himself.
How exactly is that a controversial position?
JackStraw on June 12, 2007 at 1:53 PM
Joseph Farah in “My Choice for President“
Gregor on June 12, 2007 at 1:57 PM
Again by Joseph Farah in the same article
Gregor on June 12, 2007 at 1:58 PM
Indeed. And I just wonder if a guy nobody would have heard of had it not been for his acting career is being hyped just a tad too much. He has gotten the same messiah treatment from the right as Obama has from the left. Danger Will Robinson.
But as you said, I’m willing to reserve judgement until he actually enters the race and the microscope gets turned on.
JackStraw on June 12, 2007 at 2:04 PM
Will he at least show us the common courtesy of a reach-around this time?
Misha I on June 12, 2007 at 2:04 PM
Does anyone else here think a Fred/Rudy ticket would be winnable? I think it would kick a$$!
stonemeister on June 12, 2007 at 2:06 PM
I hope no one believes that hogwash. How many of those polled were true left wing moonbats? Even if Pelosi/Reid are able to bring the war to an end Congress’ approval rating will sink even lower, probably into the lower 20’s or below. Remember folks there are a whole lot more people that would rather see “victory” than surrender.
Capitalist Infidel on June 12, 2007 at 2:10 PM
A Fred/Rudy ticket is just idiotic. Giuliani is losing ground because conservatives are realizing that he’s actually a liberal. And for you Rudy supporters, please spare me. Talking tough about terrorism doesn’t make you a conservative.
Why the hell would Fred run on traditional conservative values and then poison his campaign by naming a closet liberal as his running mate? It’s amazing how many readers are willing to vote for a liberal, simply because they think they can win.
Gregor on June 12, 2007 at 2:12 PM
JackStraw on June 12, 2007 at 2:04 PM
Nobody would have heard of? Counsel for the minority during watergate? Two term Senator? I think you are grasping at straws there Jack……..
doriangrey on June 12, 2007 at 2:14 PM
I know of only one Messiah. And he’s not a politician.
I agree with you 100 percent. We can inflate our expectations to the point we are bitterly disappointed when we don’t get what we think we deserve.
Fact of the matter is, Fred’s a man – an honorable man, mind you — but just a man. We need to sift through the information we have now and continually reassess.
I think Fred Thompson is a man for the times. But that’s my opinion, and I hope I’m right. But we’ll see, won’t we?
Tennman on June 12, 2007 at 2:21 PM
Yes, he has great name recognition amongst political junkies. The other 95% of the population knows Fred from Law and Order, not Watergate or his 8 years in the Senate.
Quick, who was the minority counsel for the Clinton Impeachment hearings? No googling.
JackStraw on June 12, 2007 at 2:23 PM
Why would a traditionalist conservative president want a quasi-conservative VP? For other viewpoints that don’t go too far to the left — nobody can honestly say that Rudy is a left wing extremist, just somewhat liberal on some domestic issues. Rudy could provide the “devil’s advocate” input to Fred! so that Fred! can make more well-constructed, and “sellable”, conservative decisions.
Maybe.
I still believe a Fred!/Condi ticket would be ideal, though.
stonemeister on June 12, 2007 at 2:38 PM
It’s not a controversial position, and I’d like to see him debate as well. The point is that this election cycle started very, VERY early. Historically, an early July announcement isn’t a terribly late entry into the race, but with this year’s cycle beginning in freakin’ January it just seems so.
Does anyone really think that the two debates held some 8 months before Super Tuesday are going to have a significant impact on the primary election? Did Fred (or the voting public) really lose out in his not participating in that nine man circular masturabtory exercise?
Hollowpoint on June 12, 2007 at 2:38 PM
JackStraw on June 12, 2007 at 2:23 PM
Did he ask what the President knew and when he knew it?
doriangrey on June 12, 2007 at 2:39 PM
To be fair, that was Howard Baker who said that. Fred Thompson came up with the question, but he isn’t credited with the actual utterance.
Tennman on June 12, 2007 at 2:46 PM
I voted for Rudy Guiliani for Mayor of NYC. No regrets whatsoever. He did a great job of cleaning up the city.
However, I could NEVER vote for him for POTUS. It amazes me that so many people cannot see that he is practically President Bush’s twin! Call it RINO or “compassionate conservativism”–vote for Rudy and you will get another George W. at best. Bush is at least socially conservative, whereas Rudy is openly:
Pro-abortion
Pro-gay marriage
Pro-gun control
Pro-amnesty (until a week ago!)
Yeah, he promises he’ll appoint conservative judges, but he may never get that opportunity, and if he does he may nominate a “conservative” like Harriet Miers.
I realize how critical it is to nominate someone (like Rudy) who will be tough on the WOT, but how tough is he really going to be? New York was a sanctuary city under his watch and until a week ago, Rudy had no problem with that. Half of my family is in, or retired from, the NYPD and not a single one of them has ever written someone up for being in the country illegally. Think he’ll secure our borders any better than Bush?
Bush started out tough on the WOT and look where we are now. Until this recent surge, our guys in Iraq were fighting with one hand tied behind their back. And now he’s talking to terrorists and making contingency plans to abandon the Iraqi people because a bunch of lily-livered liberals are whining.
Rudy is a sheep (lib) in wolf’s (con) clothing.
IrishEi on June 12, 2007 at 2:47 PM
Exactly. And more, only political geeks like us know this. Now if you asked people who said this
Greer told me. Summer of his third year, he and his squad went down in a chopper accident in the Med. Bad – pilot, crew killed. That kid spent ten months in traction, another year learning to walk again. Did his fourth year from the hospital. Now it’s up to you, Charlie, but you might consider cuttin’ the kid a little slack.
I bet you’d get a better response.
JackStraw on June 12, 2007 at 2:51 PM
Really? Are you refering to Rudy Giuliani or Rudy Ruettiger?
There’s absolutely nothing “somewhat” liberal about Giuliani. I’d go as far as to say that half the Democratic side of the isle is further right than he.
Are you suggesting that he’s conservative becuase he says really mean things about the terrorists? That’s about all he’s got, but doesn’t Bush do the same thing? Doesn’t Hillary do the same thing? Didn’t John Kerry do the same thing?
Gregor on June 12, 2007 at 2:54 PM
This issue here is that freddie boys polling number are tainted by all the facts that have been exposed just in this thread alone. The groupies are reacting to some role he played in some TV show and then make justifications for his questionable history and zero qualifications to be the most powerful executive on the face of the earth. Sorry, buy bluejeans and hay stalks don’t manage wars and lead people to greatness. fred? believes his own BS. He probably believes he is the real person in the roles he plays and is projecting that in the way he approaches his non-candidacy for president. He probably believes that his polling numbers are solid too and it’s clear they are not based on any vetting of his actual record or experience as a public servant.
csdeven on June 12, 2007 at 3:14 PM
FRED THOMPSON IS THE MAN!
msipes on June 12, 2007 at 3:20 PM
Fred has some baggage but a lot less than any of the other candidates with a chance. His legal experience is first rate, his senate experience is reasonable, he has made a lot of sensible statements lately and he has good recognition from his TV roles. He seems by far the least flawed candidate on either side of the isle and will probably be the next POTUS.
duff65 on June 12, 2007 at 3:28 PM
Gregor, I’m just saying Rudy’s conservative on crime, law enformcement, and international issues, and some more. He’s moderately liberal on abortion and some social issues. As a veep, those liberal positions could provide valuable input to a Fred! prez — not meaning that Fred! would abide by the liberal input, but that Fred! can make the right call, but deliver the message in such a way as to keep the left satisfied or subdued.
Anyway, Fred/Rudy isn’t my first choice (not even close), just a discussion point.
stonemeister on June 12, 2007 at 3:28 PM
See, this is exactly why I want him to get in. I love his speeches and podcasts, and I want to know if the “aw shucks” is real. I have a soft spot for cowboys, but I’d prefer to know if I’m getting John Wayne or Billy Crystal. The longer he waits to stand up and prove it, the faster he’s losing me.
Tanya on June 12, 2007 at 3:32 PM
Funny. I remember the exact same comments when Reagan was running.
Gregor on June 12, 2007 at 3:42 PM
Is he really conservative on international issues? He’s an open borders guy. He’s a NAFTA guy. Are you assuming he’s conservative just because he talks tough against terrorists? What has Rudy actually DONE that shows he’s conservative on international issues? I don’t think there’s a single thing.
You can’t be serious. He’s as liberal as they come on almost every social issue. Does he earn the “moderate tag” just because he says that he doesn’t really like having to vote the way he does? I really don’t understand that one. He’s no less left on social issues than Hillary.
Gregor on June 12, 2007 at 3:47 PM
Ok, I’m tired of praising Fred… time for some unwarranted criticism (I wanna see if cs is really having fun doing this). And I’m not feeling like re-hashing old arguments. So I’ll make up a new one.
Fred really isn’t running. What he’s doing is worrying USA, FX, A&E, etc. who would be unable to run Law & Order re-runs for the next 18 months. “Follow the money”… how much could Fred get from “interested parties” at these stations to have him … not run?
Consider the possibility that his nomination deal is worth a significant (7-8 digits) amount to several networks; and his candidacy may simply be a legal, soft-shoe form of extortion…
Sure, I made up the entire thing there, but it’s at least plausible… I’ve probably worried someone over the fact that it’s impossible to disprove a negative… so hey, I could be right.
Doubtful, almost certainly not the case, but plausible that Fred could receive a nice payoff in order to allow L&O re-runs.
gekkobear on June 12, 2007 at 3:49 PM
Some yes. But fred? is completely unqualified to be POTUS. He was also an arm twisting lobbyist. And Reagan actually owned regular mans clothing before he ran. A Reagan never believed he was the characters he played. freddie boy acts like he is the characters he has played.
csdeven on June 12, 2007 at 4:00 PM
You forgot his other qualifications. Lobbyist. For 20 years he twisted the arms of elected officials for the benefit of special interest groups.
csdeven on June 12, 2007 at 4:05 PM
Oh lordy yes!! Lets run with that one.
hahaha
csdeven on June 12, 2007 at 4:07 PM
cs,
You do realize that his first acting role was to play himself, right?
Probably not. Here’s The IMDB for “Marie”, his first acting role.
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0089555/
Read what character Fred! is listed under.
Tman on June 12, 2007 at 4:11 PM
Cheney in the Thompson camp. csdeven, you’re getting close to your storage limit on HA.
Entelechy on June 12, 2007 at 4:30 PM
It surprised me that you made such an obvious error. ;-)
Tennman on June 12, 2007 at 4:36 PM
Tman
Thats what cracked me up reading csdeven’s comment. He did play himself in his first role so he obviously does believe he is the person he played. I always get a good giggle out of his comments, people who have such an irrational hatred toward another is quite entertaining.
Capitalist Infidel on June 12, 2007 at 4:39 PM
cs,
blah, blah, blah
We’ve heard it all before many times from you. We all know you don’t like that he’s not a real candidate or has announced yet! We know! We know! Give it a rest okay!
Do we have to hear it constantly and non-stop? We know your point of view on this, you’re just making everyone sick and tired of hearing your non-stop rants. Please stop/wait till he announces, then actually criticize him on his positions!
SSG Fuzzy on June 12, 2007 at 4:49 PM
Sorry to dissapoint – must shape up :)
Entelechy on June 12, 2007 at 4:55 PM
You’re conservative? So which “conservative” candidate do you support, and are you currently a volunteer or worker on their campaign?
Gregor on June 12, 2007 at 5:18 PM
Any political party is a fragile coalition of differing views on hot button issues and deep political convictions. I have to smile at CSDs grabbing up Fred’s past lobbyist role and inserting the term “arm twisting” before it because I use the term “gun grabber” with Rudy to describe his weakness on the 2nd amendment. CSD has his opinion just as I have mine, and everyone else has theirs. If Fred or Rudy or Mitt can’t stand up to the critical examination of their views and past here on HA or in the much bigger scope of national public opinion then they certainly don’t deserve to be POTUS and we all need to know about it. Rant on CSD and know we’ll do the same.
Buzzy on June 12, 2007 at 5:31 PM
I’ll just buy storage offsets by complimenting AP’s artwork. :-)
fred? being linked to a Cheney is about as bad as being in the same line of work as a guy named Abramoff. Ouchy?
A lot of people are mesmerized by actors and believe they are what they act. I do not and therefore I am not impressed one iota by freds? acting, whether it be on TV or the campaign trail.
Fortunately for you, you actually have to read a comment, so it is within your power to completely ignore me.
Ain’t it cool!?
csdeven on June 12, 2007 at 5:36 PM
Unlike the fred? groupies, I haven’t decided yet. 2nd, unlike the fred? groupies, I prefer my candidate to be an actual candidate and not a non-candidate. And unlike the fred? groupies, I expect the candidate I support to have the stones to debate others, answer tough questions from jerks, and accept interviews in hostile environments. Also, unlike the fred? groupies, I don’t appreciate my candidate putting on a silly facade in a lame attempt to fool me into believing he is something he is not.
But in the final analysis, I expect my candidate to have some experiences that translate to the job I would elect him to. fred? is completely vacuous in those experiences. If he were not, I would donate to his campaign (on the condition that he was actually announced as a candidate). I will support fred? (rather than stay home) if the polls indicate that he can beat the dems front runner. Unlike some people, I believe ANY republican is better than ANY dem ANY minute of ANY day of ANY week of ANY year.
Thanks for asking the question instead knee jerking into crazy accusations.
Peace and cheers!
csdeven on June 12, 2007 at 5:52 PM
Did you read the link? No, you did not read the link.
Here’s what it says.
I think it’s nice that you will vote for any Repub over a dem regardless. I will probably do the same unless the repubs nominate someone worse than McCain. But you seem to have an unhealthy passion for Fred!-hating that makes you ignore things that are plain as day to the rest of us. Your obssession with bad mouthing him appears boderline psychotic, and you completely ignore points raised that refute your arguments. Just now you said that Fred! “acts like he is the characters he has played”, and when I showed you that he was in fact chosen to play HIMSELF for his first movie, you just ignore that too.
This is a sign of someone who is intellectually dishonest, and you are going to look foolish if you end up having to vote for the guy.
Do really want to continue this tirade and then end up with a mouthful of crow when it comes time for election day?
I know I wouldn’t.
Tman on June 12, 2007 at 6:28 PM
Pot, meet kettle.
wccawa on June 12, 2007 at 6:29 PM
A true conservative, in his/her right mind, would not vote for Giuliani or McCain. It’s like saying … I’m going to go ahead and kill myself, because I’m going to die eventually anyway.
As for myself, I would prefer to see Tancredo as President, but I too am a realist. But that doesn’t mean that I’m going to go out and vote for a person I know to be against everything I stand for simply because I know he can win.
I have doubts about Thompson as to whether or not he’s who he says he is, but I have absolutely zero doubt about Giuliani. There’s no mystery there. He’s a card carrying open borders, one world government, baby killing, gun grabbing liberal. I’ll vote for the guy who gives me a little hope over that any day.
Gregor on June 12, 2007 at 6:33 PM
Really late comment, csdeven, so I hope you get this.
I have read enough of your comments on many topics here at HA that I can vouch for your conservative creds. You have been accused of being a troll, and you are not. I for one appreciate the tenacity of your skepticism and I am taking note of your concerns about Fred. And I am equally taking note of the warnings posted by others with regard to the other candidates – for instance, IrishEi on June 12, 2007 at 2:47 PM. I have such gratitude for blogs; one of their many blessings is that information/experiences/opinions about people, conditions, and events in other locales – that we would never have been aware of – can be communicated and discussed immediately.
I would love for Mitt, Rudy, and Fred (once he announces his candidacy) to sit down for some podcasts where they just have a conversation. Forget the quiz show/inquisition format, and just let the topics develop naturally.
RushBaby on June 12, 2007 at 6:38 PM
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