- The Cat

Bush found Jesus to help him from being a raging alcoholic until he was 40 years OLD! BTW Bush had a DUI, nice. DUI kills 100,000’s of people world wide (17-27k in USA) and Bush was doing that. NICE and he is president.

If you want Abortions Illegal, make DUI’s a felony with hard time for first offence, HECK lets out law alcohol all together; While at it lets make porn, gambling, smoking, pre-marital sex and adultery illegal. The latter punishable by stoning to death aka, Taliban style. YOU ALL ARE IDIOTS. Go start your own Totalitarian theocracy country. This is america and you don’t get to tell people what to do in the privacy of their home or what to do with their body, sorry.

WOMAN are in charge of BIRTH. They call the shots. They can tell a man they want to keep the baby, abort the baby and they have nothing to say about it, at least outside of marriage.

BIRTH CONTROL – The stupid church does not want to talk about it or teach it or make it available even though there is NOTHING in the bible. (Challenge me, I DARE YOU, I am very up on scriptures). I don’t know why we don’t have condom commercials on prime time and condoms at the schools nurses office and handed out on the street corner in poor neighbourhoods. Less pregnancies = less abortions. NO KIDDING, Duuh YOU THINK?

I THINK Fred is right on. BUT YOU extreme radical mindless idiots are so dogmatic and militant you are beyond hope. IF YOU DON’T LIKE ABORTIONS DO THE FOLLOWING: Pray, Work with your church to prevent pregnancy, Work with civic organizations involving again education and adoption, Adapt some CRACK BABIES, and SHUT UP!

BTW I am a christian and I HATE Abortion but I put it in God’s hand. I suspect most of you have this mindless manufactured rage because you are told to because its a conservative thing, and you worship your party. You don’t care about children. PUT GOD AND COUNTRY FIRST.

I looked at the clip several times. It seems to me that Fred isn’t so much flip-flopping as he is evolving. And that evolution is firmly on track if his record is any indication, not to mention his appearance earlier this year on Meet The Press.

Fred’s emphasis on the 14th Amendment and the sovereign power of the states has lasted to the present day. As to the courts, leaving the matter to the states would be an improvement over what he referred to on MTP as “legislating from the bench.” (Now THAT’S the clip we should be looking at.) One thing he appeared to have given up, though, is any sense that hearts and minds will be easily swayed by how terrible abortion is. Especially when there’s a profit in it for somebody — usually a man, and sometimes with taxpayer funding. But getting the Federal government, and the courts, out of the equation, is a step in the right direction.

The other Republican candidates are either extreme long-shots, or big-government conservatives, or both. The latter betrays the ideals that made Reagan a great president, and can make the GOP great again.

To that end, I’d say Fred looks pretty good at this point.

But the point is, if you call it murder, then the logical conclusion is to punish it as murder. There is hesitancy to go down this road and I think it’s worth it to ask why that is.

Perhaps it’s because our target is not the same. For me, the target should be a life given a chance to live. The target in the above scenario is proscribing punishment. The two can be mutually exclusive.

Punishment is only a logical argument for a worst-case scenario. There are other scenarios that should be given a chance first. Roe v. Wade didn’t go far enough. It granted women absolute control over their bodies, but it said nothing at all about the rights of the unborn.

The old saying, “Your right to swing your arms ends at the tip of my nose” is the concept that should be given voice here. Women should have the right to choose. The unborn have no voice to make the choice. Who stands in for the unborn?

It’s not an either/or proposition as far as I know. It’s a difficult issue that other writers better than I have yet to come to grips with. The abortion/right-to-life question will still be raging for decades.

Having said that, my personal choice would be: I want the madness to stop. I want the babies to be born and to be cared for. I want them to go to loving homes and become Republicans. :)

JaHerer22 on April 25, 2007 at 9:21 AM

So we “help” her kill her baby? This was the whole argument in the beginning, you know? The Roe case was based on a lie of rape. Read Norma McCorvey’s book about how she was used as Jane Roe. Read ex abortionist Bernard Nathanson’s book. He was one of the one’s who spearheaded NARAL as he explains how they made numbers up in how illegal abortion affected women. Lies. Lies. Lies. They told us it was for “hard cases” but it became a billion dollar industry largely unregulated.

The truth? Millions of women suffer from their abortion. The heart of your child starts beating before an abortion can be performed. And then there is the horror of abortion on a child that no one seems to want to face. (last link very graphic)

My point is that we can argue the semantics all day long, but the lies of Roe still infect our society and divide us as no other issue does. No reasonable person can say that abortion is a good thing. There are better options. And if we, as a society, don’t find them then we should all be ashamed of ourselves.

I strongly urge JaHerer22 to read the Bernard Nathanson link. It’s a brief but fascinating and eye opening look into the beginning of abortion that anyone interested in this issue should read.

the point is… this is going to happen, just like drugs… regardless of it’s legal or not. to legalize is to control and moderate…

We rarely execute murderers of adults and children today, yet you bring out execution as the logical result of criminalized abortion?

Well if it’s pre-mediated murder, certainly the death penalty would be in play.

But the point is, if you call it murder, then the logical conclusion is to punish it as murder. There is hesitancy to go down this road and I think it’s worth it to ask why that is.

Ahh, looks like bigbeas has this thought covered as well.

Anyway, my main point is that if this is all that can be found to damage Fred!, it’s smooth sailing to 1600 Pennsylvania Av.

But do I equate it to murder? I don’t think so. As someone alluded above, it that’s the case, the penalty for the woman and the doc should be execution.

We rarely execute murderers of adults and children today, yet you bring out execution as the logical result of criminalized abortion?

Fred’s stance in this video is that women, once given all information, will choose life–that the argument of abortion will become essentially moot. Of course, the pro-abortionists don’t wish to have that discussion, so rather than talking about where human life becomes worthy enough for protection by our laws, or the possible negative/dangerous effects of abortion, we get arguments ad absurdum like “the penalty for the woman and the doc should be execution” and statements about women mass-mutilating themselves with clothes-hangers.

Well done, libs. Way to keep the women uninformed.

So instead of having her abortion performed by a licensed medical professional, a desperate woman will now be able to buy abortion drugs from drug dealer on the corner; or, if she’s really lucky, she might even be able to get a vet- school-drop-out to perform a coat hanger abortion in a abandoned factory. It’s really a win-win for everyone.

JaHerer22 on April 25, 2007 at 9:21 AM

That’s drug dealer logic…

We understand what brings a woman to this point. Just as someone might understand what would bring someone to sucide. It’s desperate and terrible, but not criminal.

The Abortionist knows full well what he does. He knows it clearly.

Rightwingsparkle on April 24, 2007 at 10:41 PM

Really? Seems to me that if you are calling it murder, this makes the woman the person who is hiring the hit man.

I struggle with abortion. I think it’s wrong, in the it’s a sin sense. But do I equate it to murder? I don’t think so. As someone alluded above, it that’s the case, the penalty for the woman and the doc should be execution.

So instead of having her abortion performed by a licensed medical professional, a desperate woman will now be able to buy abortion drugs from drug dealer on the corner; or, if she’s really lucky, she might even be able to get a vet- school-drop-out to perform a coat hanger abortion in a abandoned factory. It’s really a win-win for everyone.

JaHerer22 on April 25, 2007 at 9:21 AM

Not my problem. I didn’t knock her up. I can’t kill people for money, why can they? Equal rights for all I guess.

Just to be clear. Pro-lifers want abortionist to be criminalized, not the women.

We understand what brings a woman to this point. Just as someone might understand what would bring someone to sucide. It’s desperate and terrible, but not criminal.

The Abortionist knows full well what he does. He knows it clearly.

Rightwingsparkle on April 24, 2007 at 10:41 PM

So instead of having her abortion performed by a licensed medical professional, a desperate woman will now be able to buy abortion drugs from drug dealer on the corner; or, if she’s really lucky, she might even be able to get a vet- school-drop-out to perform a coat hanger abortion in a abandoned factory. It’s really a win-win for everyone.

That said, with the criminalization of abortion there should come the criminalization of deadbeat fathers.

I thought there were already deadbeat dad laws, some of which get them thrown into jail for non-payment of child support?

Where is their choice (hint: same time most women’s choice is… before sex)?

Go FRED!!