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New VTech thread: Was Cho schizophrenic, “mean,” or both? Update: NBC receives material mailed by Cho; Update: Video added; Update: Cho called Columbine killers “martyrs” in manifesto; Update: Envelope signed “A. Ishmael”

posted at 4:40 pm on April 18, 2007 by Allahpundit
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There’s new information about him this morning but most of it is stuff we already know. The cops held a press conference to say that he stalked two women in 2005 and then got sent away to a mental hospital for a spell, which we learned last night from that bizarre CNN interview with his two former roommates. Meanwhile, the NYT has a scoop about the cops having initially misidentified the suspect in the first shooting as Emily Hilscher’s gun-aficionado boyfriend. If only the LA Times hadn’t had the same scoop hours earlier.

Here’s some genuinely new information, though, via ABC News. A forensic psychiatrist who’s been following the story says Cho’s behavior sounds familiar, and it goes way beyond depression:

What then leads you to believe Cho had schizophrenia?

How he related to his roommate was just too bizarre to be depression. The bizarre content of his plays — mashing a half-eaten “banana bar” in someone’s mouth, the hypersexual, nihilistic (death obsessed) obsessions in the absence of depressive guilt or tearfulness are another clue. The progressive decline of a period of years. Those with schizophrenia, especially in their earliest years, are not readily recognizable as such — their condition is evolving. But here was someone who, as early as 2005, was carrying himself so strangely that he was a spectacle. The depressed withdraw and disappear. Those who are so peculiar in their manner so as to be inappropriate (taking cell phone pictures of his teacher, speaking inaudibly, pulling a cap low over his eyes) exhibit signs and symptoms more indicative of schizophrenia. He was communicating in a rambling manner reflective of what we appreciate as autistic thinking — characteristic of schizophrenia. In a similar vein, Mr. Cho’s stilted communication in his homicide note (deceitful charlatans — not the language of a 23-year-old college kid) is also the manner of a schizophrenic’s communications, as is his pronounced delay in responding to questions.

Poet Nikki Giovanni, who taught Cho in one of her classes, tells the LA Times that she actually had guards stationed nearby at one point to intervene in case Psy-Cho (as See-Dub dubs him) went off. And here’s what she told CNN:

“I knew when it happened that that’s probably who it was,” Giovanni said, referring to her former pupil. “I would have been shocked if it wasn’t.”…

[In the fall of 2005,] Giovanni went to the department’s then-chairwoman, Lucinda Roy, and told her she wanted Cho out of her class, and Roy obliged.

“I was willing to resign before I was going to continue with him,” Giovanni said. “There was something mean about this boy.”

Giovanni said she’s taught her share of oddballs in the past, but there was something malicious about Cho’s behavior.

“I know we’re talking about a troubled youngster and crap like that, but troubled youngsters get drunk and jump off buildings; troubled youngsters drink and drive,” she said. “I’ve taught troubled youngsters. I’ve taught crazy people. It was the meanness that bothered me. It was a, really, mean streak.”

We all knew weird, quiet kids at college, but I certainly never knew anyone so weird that the teachers felt they needed guards around in order to teach him. British journalist Toby Harnden (who’s been reading this blog, among others, to keep tabs on the story) is promising an interview on Thursday in the Telegraph with Cho’s roommate that’ll reveal even more warning signs about his lethal strangeness. And so I repeat my question from last night: how did they let this time bomb keep ticking for so long?

The other stuff I’ve got right now is just a grab bag. The Times has posted a new graphic showing the layout of the second floor of Norris Hall; so far as I know, no one’s explained yet why he went upstairs instead of sticking to the first floor. Bob Owens discovers that ABC News is deleting comments that challenge them on their crappy reporting about large-capacity magazines. And readers are kicking up a fuss about the Australian Telegraph’s sensationalistic headline and lede about Cho’s possible obsession with Emily Hilscher. I think it’s nonsense: they’re just being tabloidy about the fatal attraction element, not blaming her for her own murder.

I’m sure there’ll be updates here throughout the day, albeit (hopefully) not as many as the last few posts have had. In the meantime, compare Iran’s reaction to the shooting to the “teacher’s lesson” on terrorism for “Bowling for Columbine.”

Update: Steyn tries to parse the rules for what constitutes “adulthood” these days: “[W]e live in a selectively infantilized culture where twentysomethings are ‘children’ if they’re serving in the Third Infantry Division in Ramadi but grown-ups making rational choices if they drop to the broadloom in President Clinton’s Oval Office.”

Update: Just breaking — NBC says it received a package from Cho which it has reason to believe was sent between the first and second shootings. Supposedly it contains photos and video, which probably means they’re images he took of the first shooting on his cell phone right after it happened. You’ll recall he was known to take cell-phone photos of his classmates during class, one of his little habits that freaked them out.

NBC says it’s already turned over the information to the police. Stand by.

Update: Multiple photos, video, and “rambling writings” were in the package.

Update: It sounds like the video, at least, wasn’t of the crime scene but of Cho listing his “grievances.” He must have mentioned the first shooting, otherwise I don’t how they could be so sure that he filmed it after that had happened: “Cho Seung-Hui sent NBC News a long and rambling communication and video about his grievances, the network said Wednesday. Network officials turned the material over to the FBI and said they would not immediately disclose its contents pending the agency’s review.” Update: They’ve updated the article to say that the timestamp is the giveaway. Hmmm.

Update: I won’t repeat my ticking-time-bomb question yet again, but … okay, I will repeat it. If they knew in 2005 that he was “mentally ill” and an “imminent danger to himself,” why did the magistrate refer him for outpatient treatment?

Update: More: “The package, timestamped in the two-hour window between Monday’s shootings, was sent to NBC News head Steve Capus. It contained digital photos of the gunman holding weapons and a manifesto that ‘rants against rich people and warns that he wants to get even,’ The Associated Press quoted an unidentified New York law enforcement official familiar with the case as saying.”

Update: NBC says it’s going to air portions of the video tonight. Wow.

Update: Still more. Why would Cho have sent the video to the president of the NBC News instead of Brian Williams or whoever? “The package, timestamped in the two-hour window between Monday’s shootings, was sent to NBC News head Steve Capus. In an interview with MSNBC.com, Capus said Cho talks to the camera in the videos. In one instance, he makes a vague reference to the massacre, Capus said, and said, ‘This didn’t have to happen.’ ‘The statement is hard to follow, kind of rambling. He speaks about hatred,’ Capus said, adding that it was ‘distrubring, very angry, profanity laced.’”

Update: The post office must have been his last stop before Norris Hall: “The package bore a U.S. Postal Service stamp recording that it had been received at a Virginia post office at 9:01 a.m. ET Monday, about an hour and 45 minutes after Cho shot two people in the West Ambler Johnston residence hall on the Virginia Tech campus and shortly before Cho entered Norris Hall, where he killed 30 more people.” There are 23 Quicktime files in the package, according to NBC.

Update: Go see the photo on MSNBC’s front page. The survivors said he was wearing a tan shirt during the attack, almost like a boy scout’s uniform.

Update: I admit I’m keen to see what Cho had to say for himself, but Mona Charen makes a good point. Does NBC realize what it’s doing here by extending Ismail Ax’s 15 minutes of fame?

And speaking of which, I don’t see any writing in red ink on his inner arm in that NBC photo.

cho3.jpg

Update: Yet another update from NBC. Lest there was any doubt left, this was highly premeditated. And as I speculated the other day, the ammo appears to have been unusually lethal:

The production of the videos indicated that Cho had worked on the package for some time, because he not only “took the time to record the videos, but he also broke them down into snippets” that were embedded paragraph by paragraph into the main document, Capus said…

Other photographs show Cho holding a knife, and some show hollow-point bullets lined up on a table, Capus said.

Update: Spruiell thinks this is a bad call by NBC too. I think it’s a close call, but I’m not sure I agree.

Update: The NBC Nightly News is airing now. Brian Williams just said the return address on the envelope was signed “Ismail” — or “Ishmael,” as Williams pronounced it. Pete Williams says there’s evidence that he was preparing this at least six days before the shooting.

Update: Here’s the segment from the Nightly News. Question: Where were these videos shot? I assumed it was in his dorm room, but that white brick background looks more like a hallway.

Update: They aired a little more video at the end of the show. More of the same: Cho ranting about trust funds, hedonism, Jesus Christ — and then, in the written document he gave them, a reference to “martyrs like Eric and Dylan.”

Update: Catherine Herridge is on Fox News right now telling Shep Smith that a VTech spokesman said this afternoon they had no idea Cho was taken a mental hospital or investigated for stalking in 2005.

Update: All right, two screencaps. First is the envelope slip, showing pretty clearly he signed it “A. Ishmael.” Presumably that means what was written on his arm was “Ishmael Ax,” not “Ismail Ax,” which makes the already dubious jihad theory that much more dubious.

ax003.jpg

Recall that reader Ray F. theorized a few days ago that “Ismail/Ishmael Ax” was a reference to James Fenimore Cooper’s story “The Prairie,” the lead character of which was “Ishmael Bush” — spelled the same way Cho spells it here. So let’s not rule that theory out just yet.

Now the second photo. Is this him wielding his “ax”? It’s a strange way to hold a hammer.

ax.jpg

Update: NBC’s got a slideshow with new photos in the sidebar here. You can see clearly in their copy of the envelope slip that it’s “Ishmael.” Note the array of hollow-tipped bullets in photo 7.

Update: Williams and Williams say there’s no way to tell (yet) when the videos were recorded, but note that at one point he says, “You had a hundred billion chances and ways to have avoided today.”

Update: Newsweek’s got a great, terrifying article up about Colin Goddard, a senior who was in French class in Norris Hall when Cho shot his way through the locked door and began walking up and down the aisles, pumping bullets into students. Goddard was hit in the leg but played dead until Cho left. Then:

Suddenly, the classroom door burst open again. The killer was back. “He came back in and started going around the room again, shooting people.” Up one aisle and down another, Cho moved through the room, repeating the path he had taken the first time. When the killer reached Goddard, he felt two more bullets punch into his body, one in the shoulder, and one in his buttocks. “My chest and torso were kind of underneath a desk, that’s why I think I got shot in my extremities,” he told NEWSWEEK.

It sounds like Cho committed suicide in that very room just a few moments later, moments before the cops burst in.

Update: I know people are going to start sending me this link soon, so let me flag it now and warn you: the Northeast Intelligence Network is a notoriously alarmist site. Before you go jumping at shadows about jihad and 9/11, wait for a credible media source to report it.


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AP, Bryan, or Ian, I posted a thread that is hung up in moderation due to multiple links (I’m assuming), that links to the myspace pages of victims that I was able to find. Obviously your call if you don’t want to push that through, but IMO the links are important for folks to check out. Brings the issue home.

RightWinged on April 18, 2007 at 6:12 PM

CORRECTION: AP, Bryan, or Ian, I posted a thread comment

RightWinged on April 18, 2007 at 6:13 PM

Great NBC just posted a new pciture of this nut posing with his guns. Apparently from the pics he sent them

http://msnbcmedia4.msn.com/j/msnbc/Components/Photos/070418/070418_vatech_shooterSTILL.hmedium.jpg

William Amos on April 18, 2007 at 6:14 PM

Among the materials are 23 QuickTime video files showing Cho talking directly to the camera, Capus said. He does not name anyone specifically, but he talks at length about religion and his hatred of the wealthy.

William Amos on April 18, 2007 at 6:15 PM

Isn’t hatred of religion and the wealthy exactly what most professors teach in university nowadays?

Cato on April 18, 2007 at 6:23 PM

OK – about the picture and the associated MSNBC article… So, who shot the photos and vids? Of course, you would assume that he used something as a “tripod” and did it himself (and it’s not like he had any friends to help out), but MSNBC doesn’t mention this – like did they find evidence that suggested he did it himself (I assume poor and tilted framing would give that away)? We might want to know that.
Regardless, he was definitely a busy little maniac for the 2-hr “gap.”

MikeHu on April 18, 2007 at 6:34 PM

videos on NBC news (TV) right now

sunny on April 18, 2007 at 6:34 PM

Hey.. can you stop using that image of him… just my opinion but it makes me feel like we are glorifying his actions to kill. I think he realized that would be plastered everywhere and it really makes him look good.

I’d rather see that crappy photo of him.

Shack on April 18, 2007 at 6:35 PM

Shack – I was just thinking the same thing. Stop showing the damn photos. Once is questionable enough, but multiple times is just overdoing it.

Slublog on April 18, 2007 at 6:37 PM

Allah-

You should quickly don some flame-proof underwear about the “hollowpoints are unusually lethal” comment. Most police dept’s (except, I think the NYPD) use them because they stop fights fast. They’re pretty much a standard defensive loading because they don’t overpenetrate.

One more thing that photo makes clear–there’s no extended magazine sticking out the handle of that Glock.

see-dubya on April 18, 2007 at 6:37 PM

I’m speaking of NBC News coverage, BTW.

Slublog on April 18, 2007 at 6:38 PM

Update: The NBC Nightly News is airing now. Brian Williams just said the return address on the envelope was signed “Ismail” — or “Ishmael,” as Williams pronounced it. Pete Williams says there’s evidence that he was preparing this at least six days before the shooting.

This is interesting, and something to keep in mind.

But let me preemptively tell Januarius to cool your jets. You’ve been wildly speculating worse than Shep and Geraldo, and last I saw you were linking people to some Debbie Schlussel post in which she attempts to tell us that this Flickr photo that was removed was of Cho, called Ismail in Indonesia. TURNS OUT TO BE BUNK! Schlussel better issue a serious apology.

RightWinged on April 18, 2007 at 6:42 PM

Some comments he made

You had a hundred billion chances and ways to have avoided today,” Cho says on one of the videos. “But you decided to spill my blood. You forced me into a corner and gave me only one option. The decision was yours. Now you have blood on your hands that will never wash off.”

William Amos on April 18, 2007 at 6:43 PM

I’m sorry….heeheehee…reaaaally…but the incongruity of seeing the psycho with the guns JUST ABOVE the hearty pink “ROMANCE QUIZ” on the ad block is HILL-arious.

Guess I’m just a little thin…

seejanemom on April 18, 2007 at 6:43 PM

Ok, the guy mailed off some promo material for himself. The worse thing anyone, the FBI now, can do is to realease and publish anything in that package…quotes, images, anything. It’s what a killer would have wanted. Let’s deny him that.

Kudos to NBC for having the moral standard to immediately turn this package over to authorities.

It just seems that these school shootings are done with the intention of creating a huge media blitz. Perhaps if the blitz stops…

JetBoy on April 18, 2007 at 6:47 PM

Authorities had enough time after the first shooting to determine a suspect, find that suspect on the highway, and start to interview him on the side of the road, but not enough time for VTech administration to send an email warning to students. In the age of instant communication, how could this happen? A killer was on the loose. Obviously he wasn’t scared of getting caught if he had time to go to the post office and mail the package. This is such a tragedy on many fronts!

icelandicfarmer on April 18, 2007 at 6:48 PM

Hey Allah…not to be nit-picky but…with respect to:

the ammo appears to have been unusually lethal:

JHPs (Jacketed Hollow Points) are available in most calibers almost anywhere. They make nasty wounds and make any caliber more effective at closer ranges. However, they aren’t really “unusually” lethal. Black Talons on the other hand or cop-killers are unusually lethal.

BirdEye on April 18, 2007 at 6:49 PM

Ok, the guy mailed off some promo material for himself. The worse thing anyone, the FBI now, can do is to realease and publish anything in that package…quotes, images, anything. It’s what a killer would have wanted. Let’s deny him that.

Kudos to NBC for having the moral standard to immediately turn this package over to authorities.

It just seems that these school shootings are done with the intention of creating a huge media blitz. Perhaps if the blitz stops…

JetBoy on April 18, 2007 at 6:47 PM

I don’t know, I think everyone’s politics gets in the way of their professionalism these days and I don’t trust that we’ll learn all the real truths we’re entitled to if the “authorities” get hold of it. Don’t get me wrong, I’m very pro law enforcement and my grandfather spent his career as an FBI agent, but things like the lack of captured documents being released in Iraq leave me lacking in trust for those in charge of this sort of stuff.

RightWinged on April 18, 2007 at 6:50 PM

see-dubya on April 18, 2007 at 6:37 PM

9mm is ineffective without hollow-points. It’s got no stopping power. The killer obviously knew that.

PRCalDude on April 18, 2007 at 6:51 PM

Horrible call by [MS]NBC in airing this video and posting the sicko’s “promo pic” at the top of their website. In their rush to air their exclusive scoop on this whackjob, in the name of ratings, they will have planted the seed of media glorifcation in the heads of other sick kids out there who may be contemplating something like this.

Were the victims’ families consulted prior to airing the pictures and video? What about law enforcement? What about University officials?

This sickens me the more I think about it. Our news media is out of control.

Dave Shay on April 18, 2007 at 6:52 PM

The scumbag calls the Columbine killers ‘heroes’.

mesablue on April 18, 2007 at 6:58 PM

Brian Williams just said, We don’t want to create any more heros or martyrs with this, but more video will air tomorrow morning on Today.

Wow.

icelandicfarmer on April 18, 2007 at 6:59 PM

Wow…Ok, I take back my “kudos” for NBC…I saw some commenters say they were showing video…and I turn to channel 4, and lo! There it is…

I guess they didn’t turn everything over to the FBI…Brian Williams just said they don’t want to martyr the guy…but there’ll be more! video tomorrow…

And Rightwiged …I see what you’re saying about authorities…but I fail to see where anything this killer has to say would help the general public in any way. As for (ot a little) the Iraq documents…What ever DID happen to all of those??

JetBoy on April 18, 2007 at 7:00 PM

WM Amos at 6:15, quoting (I think) MSNBC:

Among the materials are 23 QuickTime video files showing Cho talking directly to the camera, Capus said. He does not name anyone specifically, but he talks at length about religion and his hatred of the wealthy.

Voiceover on the NBC video posted above:

He rails against hedonism and Christianity.

And then Psy-Cho mutters about how Jesus is crucifying him.

I would say that is a very significant omission in the way MSNBC chose to cover this story.

see-dubya on April 18, 2007 at 7:05 PM

But but Radical Christianity blah blah blah.

- The Cat

P.S. Remeber the modivation behind columbine?

MirCat on April 18, 2007 at 7:06 PM

Sorry folks. We live in a free and transparent society. If they had held this back it would have spurred endless conspiracy theories. Better it all comes out and people see it for themselves.

TheBigOldDog on April 18, 2007 at 7:06 PM

And Rightwiged …I see what you’re saying about authorities…but I fail to see where anything this killer has to say would help the general public in any way. As for (ot a little) the Iraq documents…What ever DID happen to all of those??

JetBoy on April 18, 2007 at 7:00 PM

That’s because we don’t know what’s contained. And as cautious as I’ve been (which is more than I can say for a few others around here) on the “Muslim” connection, I fear if there is anything to this, the authorities will bury it. Similarly, everyone buries the “natural selection” t-shirt at Columbine, as well as the history of genocide perpetrated and justified by evolutionary principles. This kid we know railed against religion. A lot of people like to bash religion for causing wars and millions of deaths, when in fact it’s the opposite side more often responsible. Christianity gets bashed all the time, yet in all likelyhood at this point this kid hated religion.

And that’s just little guessing… Again, my problem is we don’t know what could be contained in this package full of videos and photos, etc. I just don’t trust we’ll get all the informatoin we’re entitled to.

RightWinged on April 18, 2007 at 7:07 PM

He seems to be a paranoid schizophrenic,…most are only dangerous to themselves but some to others. He obviously was the rare type that is dangerous to others…his ramblings are crazy talk. Not worth even deciphering as they come from a disturbed mind . It would be interesting to see if he heard voices , as that is a primary symptom of schizophrenia.Wonder if the hospital stay detected his schizophrenia……ACLU lets them be crazy if they so desire…so not much one can do unless they have done violence beforehand…..

Mellen on April 18, 2007 at 7:08 PM

I assumed it was in his dorm room, but that white brick background looks more like a hallway.

I was watching Fox News earlier today, and they showed the inside of a dorm room at the building this nutjob lived in, and it had that white brick background.

D_bot on April 18, 2007 at 7:08 PM

Where were these videos shot? I assumed it was in his dorm room, but that white brick background looks more like a hallway.

Looks like my old dorm room. White block walls. However, since I was semi-normal, I had posters, photos and other normal things a kid would have on a wall.

sunny on April 18, 2007 at 7:08 PM

I don’t mean this to sound like I’m taking this lightly, but…. does anyone else think that he sounds like Napoleon Dynamite when he’s talking?

And I have a question about Tech and rich kids – I don’t think of VT as having particularly rich kids, I tend to think more of UVA when I think of random rich VA kids and Tech being more average income kids (or more of a spread) Are there a ton of rich kids at VT?

dead-duck on April 18, 2007 at 7:09 PM

Cato: my post was quickly overtaken by the announcement that he was committed. As for rambling: “let’s lock up all the psychos” is nice and short. An actually considered point takes more than a few words.

I do apologise for only labelling a response to your point. Most of my comments were directed to people far upthread saying how this guy must have been an idiot and that anyone that seeks treatment needs to lose their ability to defend themselves or get an education. We’re very much in agreement on most things, and the derogatory comments were meant for other people.

As to reading McBeef… I’ll think about it. Lots to do, and slacking here is enough right now. Plus, not sure that I can face reading that so close to this event. I don’t watch jihadi beheadings either and a student play written by a sociopathic killer isn’t high on my list of fun things to do. Much rather do constructive things to help VT and work with people in or of college age. So many of my friends are in engineering grad school, this hit really close.

libertarianuberalles on April 18, 2007 at 7:09 PM

Authorities had enough time after the first shooting to determine a suspect, find that suspect on the highway, and start to interview him on the side of the road, but not enough time for VTech administration to send an email warning to students. In the age of instant communication, how could this happen? A killer was on the loose. Obviously he wasn’t scared of getting caught if he had time to go to the post office and mail the package. This is such a tragedy on many fronts!

But, the fact that they had a suspect and were talking to him obviated the need to warn the students in the minds of the VT administration. If they thought everything was well in hand, why would they warn that a killer was in their midst? It wasn’t a matter of them not having enough time. They simply didn’t see a need for it. The situation was under control.

It was a ridiculously ironic and bitter circumstance that the first victim’s boyfriend was a gun fanatic. He was an absolutely obvious suspect. The administration was lulled into tragic complacency.

Unless there is some evidence that the administration knew otherwise, I’m betting when all is said and done that this is how it is going to be played.

nukemhill on April 18, 2007 at 7:11 PM

I don’t mean this to sound like I’m taking this lightly, but…. does anyone else think that he sounds like Napoleon Dynamite when he’s talking?

dead-duck on April 18, 2007 at 7:09 PM

Dude, you’re exactly right. Sounds like he’s using a fake voice.

RightWinged on April 18, 2007 at 7:12 PM

Sorry folks. We live in a free and transparent society. If they had held this back it would have spurred endless conspiracy theories. Better it all comes out and people see it for themselves.

TheBigOldDog on April 18, 2007 at 7:06 PM

One thing it’s evidence for. No 2nd shooter. Proof that he was the same as the morning.

Personally I think they should release a copy unedited copy. So people can see exactly what this guy is about, and to help keep an eye on those that think the same way. And TBOD, you are right about quelling all the conspiracy theories.

- The Cat

MirCat on April 18, 2007 at 7:13 PM

Again, my problem is we don’t know what could be contained in this package full of videos and photos, etc. I just don’t trust we’ll get all the informatoin we’re entitled to.

RightWinged on April 18, 2007 at 7:07 PM

I’m not sure that we are necessarily “entitled” to all information that comes out on this. Kind of like the photos from crime scenes — paid for by tax dollars but public release is not automatic.

This is one of the downsides of the 24 hour news cycle — it tends to encourage everyone to “take ownership” of a story or tragedy before all facts are out and give people a chance to take a breath and examine the facts at leisure.

Bradky on April 18, 2007 at 7:14 PM

Blacklake…so a schizphrenic is responsible for their actions????? How would you cope with a scrambled brain??? It is a SEVERE brain disease…..he may have heard voices that caused him to act…. Schizophrenia is when the body of someone you know is taken over by something outside of their control…I’ve often though Regan in the Excorist is a good example of how bizarre the illness can affect someone.

Mellen on April 18, 2007 at 7:14 PM

Ismail AX?

In one of the other posts, someone speculated that AX could stand for Alpha Chi. I am wondering if the X could stand for Chi as in Christ, and AX might stand for anti-Christ?

huckleberry on April 18, 2007 at 7:16 PM

@ Rightwinged

I don’t think the news media vultures will let the authorities off easy on this. Any of this killer’s diatribe, so far what I’ve heard, has any value to the general public. Our desire to know doesn’t trump our need to know. Unless there’s something in there that states, say, that he has a friend on another campus who will do the same in a week. Then there’s a public need to know.

He has already spoken of the Columbine killers as “heroes”…The less publicity these campus killers get, the less chance of it happening again. I think “becoming famous” for their deeds is a main influence in them carrying it out.

In the shadows in life, in the spotlight in death.

JetBoy on April 18, 2007 at 7:18 PM

I don’t mean this to sound like I’m taking this lightly, but…. does anyone else think that he sounds like Napoleon Dynamite when he’s talking?

dead-duck on April 18, 2007 at 7:09 PM

That’s who he was reminding me of!

Blacklake…so a schizphrenic is responsible for their actions????? How would you cope with a scrambled brain??? It is a SEVERE brain disease…..he may have heard voices that caused him to act…. Schizophrenia is when the body of someone you know is taken over by something outside of their control…I’ve often though Regan in the Excorist is a good example of how bizarre the illness can affect someone.

Mellen on April 18, 2007 at 7:14 PM

Thing is, this country has gotten so PC you can’t do anything with people like this. This guy was a danger to himself and others, yet no one acted, but everyone knew they should have, yet no one could/would.

And lets not sidestep the fact that demon possession is a very real thing, and this could have very well have been it. Listen to what the guy says. It is only incoherent until you add that to the equation.

- The Cat

MirCat on April 18, 2007 at 7:19 PM

Somebody just watching Fox check me here. Did I hear this right? The Judge made counseling “voluntary” rather than “Mandatory.” Had he made it mandatory, it would have showed up on the background check. The counselor found him to be an “Imminent danger.” I guess since it was voluntary he was able to just walk away. all according to Cathrine Haridge (sp) Fox.

Mellen, according to Charles Krauthammer (a psychiatrist) he isn’t a schizophrenic – schizophrenics are disorganized. This guy was just the opposite.

TheBigOldDog on April 18, 2007 at 7:23 PM

Do the photos show if Mr. Ishmael shaved his facial hair just prior to his attack?

huckleberry on April 18, 2007 at 7:26 PM

Sorry folks. We live in a free and transparent society. If they had held this back it would have spurred endless conspiracy theories. Better it all comes out and people see it for themselves.

TheBigOldDog on April 18, 2007 at 7:06 PM

I’m sorry. I’m with the crowd that doesn’t want to glorify this POS. Now we’ll wait another 5 years or so for a new waste of protoplasm to commemorate this one’s blaze of glory, and the press will be all over that too.

Just curious, anyone who supports NBC’s decision to air this: Did you equally support CNN’s decision to air those sniper videos from Iraq a few months ago? If not, what is the difference between the two situations?

SailorDave on April 18, 2007 at 7:26 PM

Demon-possessed?

PRCalDude on April 18, 2007 at 7:26 PM

Notice in the screencap that the SOB wrote the zipcode wrong twice and had to cross it out.

No big significance there, just oddly human. Like Hitler farting.

see-dubya on April 18, 2007 at 7:28 PM

AP, the second photo in the slide show on MSNBC’s website shows a close up, clearer picture of the envelope. It’s also NOT addressed to Steve Capus, but just to NBC.

Enoxo on April 18, 2007 at 7:28 PM

Thank you again, you sick &*@#, for saving the taxpayers of The Commonwealth the trouble of executing you.

And thank you NBC, for making him into the warm-up act for the NEXT MASS MURDERING “AMERICAN IDOL” you so carelessly create.

Yeah. THANKS a LOT.

seejanemom on April 18, 2007 at 7:29 PM

Anyone have the video of the pregnant pause / stunned silence from last night’s Hannity & Colmes?
Mark Fuhrman told Colmes (roughly), “This is not a law-enforcement problem. Out of thousands of students she’s taught this teacher has singled out this one troubled guy. Cops would love to be able to deep-six guys like this but their hands are tied by society. This is the out-patient policy which society has decided upon – and we all get to live with the result.”

Something like that. Then Geraldo disagreed. And patted himself on the back for his Willowbrook piece w/o actually saying Willowbrook.

Anyway, the stunned silence was golden before Geraldo filled the the airwaves with (of course) self-promotion.

Stephen M on April 18, 2007 at 7:30 PM

The Cat–right you are..and don’t blame PC -blame the ACLU. They say you have the right to be crazy if you so desire…..(and how can you trust a crazy person to make that decision?)why do you think mentally ill homeless people are allowed to stay sleeping on the streets??
….YOU cannot force them to seek shelter or the ACLU will fight you…makes a lot of sense doesn’t it????

Mellen on April 18, 2007 at 7:30 PM

Great, I turn on the news, and fir up the internet and I see this scumbag’s picture splashed everywhere, with the images he wanted everyone to see! WTF! A psycho killer immortalized just how he wanted to be, acting as his own press secretary from the grave.

How many other sick, twisted, lonely, starved for attention f***s are suddenly inspired to become as (in)famous as this vermin?

reaganaut on April 18, 2007 at 7:30 PM

I’m sorry. I’m with the crowd that doesn’t want to glorify this POS. Now we’ll wait another 5 years or so for a new waste of protoplasm to commemorate this one’s blaze of glory, and the press will be all over that too.

Yet you’re reading and posting about it. People want to know. When they don’t get information and answers, they make them up. Better it all comes out, people learn from it and move on.

TheBigOldDog on April 18, 2007 at 7:30 PM

Life imitates art.

spmat on April 18, 2007 at 7:31 PM

BigDog: that’s what I took away from it.

RW and MirCat: Glad it’s not just me. I was half expecting him to start complaining about how chicks only dig guys with skills.

I think he looks like he’s acting on the videos, with the different tones/facial expressions. Either that or he’s actually that moody.

As for the whole issue of giving him the attention… I don’t know. It’s tough for me to draw the line between what is necessary to know and what is just morbid curiosity.

I do agree, though, with the person above who suggested sticking with the planer (somewhat more dorky) pic of him rather than giving his “action hero” self portrait top billing.

dead-duck on April 18, 2007 at 7:32 PM

I saw a portion of the video, I don’t care to see it all. But from what I saw, it sounds like he’s trying to act.

It makes me wonder if he created a “play” based on a student going on a mass killing spree, and he decided he’d bring it to life and act it out.

Enoxo on April 18, 2007 at 7:32 PM

There should be a warning before these pics are shown – it’s not unlikely that a parent or loved one of any of the innocent victims is a HA viewer.
Can you imagine the hell they must be going thru already?

And I certainly did not need to see that evilness.

What purpose does it serve the public to see and hear this?
How do the images and audio elevate anyone?

This is all bad….

Tru2my2 on April 18, 2007 at 7:32 PM

The only people who should be viewing this killer’s promo material are the authorities, and…if they so desire…the victim’s families. This isn’t “need to know” stuff for the general public. It only serves to “up” the news ratings in their sensation du jour…

JetBoy on April 18, 2007 at 7:35 PM

The Cat–right you are..and don’t blame PC -blame the ACLU. They say you have the right to be crazy if you so desire…..(and how can you trust a crazy person to make that decision?)why do you think mentally ill homeless people are allowed to stay sleeping on the streets??

For those interested in this subject, I highly recommend the book “Madness in the Streets.” It’s a pretty scathing indictment of the anti-psychiatry “mainstreaming” movement.

Slublog on April 18, 2007 at 7:35 PM

How about we NOT show the photos of him as a self-styled Rambo, and instead show the MORGUE SHOT OF HIS FACE BLOWN OFF?

Votes?

seejanemom on April 18, 2007 at 7:37 PM

wow, lots of posts came up while I was writing my last one, I need to be quicker. I was referring to BigDog’s post about the judge’s comments on the psych stuff.

dead-duck on April 18, 2007 at 7:38 PM

Slublog Karuathammer said, “years ago he would more likely be in a State Mental Hospital than a State University.”

TheBigOldDog on April 18, 2007 at 7:38 PM

I listened to some of the audio of these tapes on the Michael Savage radio show coming home from baseball just now. His voice is so utterly creepy that it gave me goosebumps.

He was clearly deranged. Unlike Savage I don’t see a conspiracy here, just a mentally ill young man.

Has anyone talked about or written about how he learned to shoot these guns so well? I mean he had just purchased them a month ago? What about target practice nearby???

Rightwingsparkle on April 18, 2007 at 7:39 PM

If it is schizophrenia it likely came on in late adolesence…late teens…and even a crisis or stress in his life..a break-up or ….perhaps going away to school probbly exacerbated the illness…..Unfortunately the ignorance about mental illness is still rampant. I doubt his parents understood what was happening to him…he probably turned against them, the paranoia often causes these people to turn against those closest to them….I wonder if he was medicated on clozapine or some other schizophrenic drug,Haldol is an old drug that can make people go nits, and most drs don’t use it anymore…but sme still do,… problem with drugs is that the side effects cause people to stop the drugs and they can then go off the rails big time…We will see as more comes out…..Even if the parents knew he was ill , getting help today is still very hard and unfortunately doctors can disagree about the danger these people can pose ….as I said most do NOT.

Mellen on April 18, 2007 at 7:39 PM

TheBigOldDog on April 18, 2007 at 7:38 PM

Yeah…Thomas Szasz didn’t do the mentally ill any favors.

Slublog on April 18, 2007 at 7:39 PM

Note the array of hollow-tipped bullets in photo 7.

Really strange that he would arrange the ammo in neat rows for a photo. JHP’s are nothing special. Anyone who keeps a handgun for home/self defense would probably have nothing less.

RedWinged Blackbird on April 18, 2007 at 7:41 PM

In some of the pics he has a fresh haircut. Others his hair is longer.

faraway on April 18, 2007 at 7:41 PM

Votes?

seejanemom on April 18, 2007 at 7:37 PM

1

PRCalDude on April 18, 2007 at 7:43 PM

Don’t see anything unusual about the bullets, AlP. It’s been years since I’ve picked up a 9-mm, but they look like regular 9-mm JHP rounds you might find in any cop’s service pistol. They’re deadly, certainly, but I wouldn’t say “unusually” so.

I’ll defer to Confederate Yankee to tell us if those look like Black Talons or something unusual.

see-dubya on April 18, 2007 at 7:44 PM

faraway–also he has a white t-shirt in some and a black shirt in others.

see-dubya on April 18, 2007 at 7:44 PM

My thought on the bullet pic — is it possible that this isn’t a pic he took but rather one he found somewhere that just happened to show the type of bullets he wanted to use?

dead-duck on April 18, 2007 at 7:44 PM

My theory on why he filed away the serial numbers on the guns… He did not want the guns to be traced back if they were discovered PRIOR to the attacks.

faraway on April 18, 2007 at 7:45 PM

Slublog,,…..The biggest problem with metal health treatment is that since deinstitutionalization they closed the hospitals and put people on the outside to live more normal lives. This is the hitch they forgot about, they may be fine on their meds in the hospital, but once let out they stop taking the meds,( and put their families thru hell!) They cannot be monitored and they end up dead from suicide or homeless or they kill family or they live quiet lives of desperation that truly is a hell on earth…..I would have to say mental health treatments today are worse than it was 40 years ago when my sister became ill. They had hospitals and the ACLU did not interfere as much as they do today. Although it was still frustrating to get help.Every once in a while one of thse people does something and people make noises about doing something, then it gets forgotten…Remember the schizophrenic who pushed that woman in New York in front of a train???? Nothing is done….will anything be done now? probably not-instead they’ll talk about gun laws etc , when treating mental illness is what needs to be carefully studied.The guy who shot Reagan was also schizophrenic…Hinckley….and I do not believe it can be cured….they must always take medciation.

Mellen on April 18, 2007 at 7:48 PM

Votes?

seejanemom on April 18, 2007 at 7:37 PM

2

Dave Shay on April 18, 2007 at 7:48 PM

I admit I’m keen to see what Cho had to say for himself

What for? It would just be more deranged loser bull$hit. The only shame is that this piece of crap wasn’t aborted. The guy was a walking argument for Roe v. Wade.

packsoldier on April 18, 2007 at 7:49 PM

He rants against Christianity and sends his letter to Olbermann’s network where he know’s it will be appreciated.

His audience might be puny but they are easy influenced and that makes Olbermann extremely dangerous.

Perchant on April 18, 2007 at 7:49 PM

I think this needs to be out there and discussed. This atrocity has happened. Now steps need to be taken to prevent the next one from happening.
Like:

1. Something akin to Air Martials, be it Trained RAs Profs or anyone that could be an opposing force(legal concieled carry ok?). A lot of office buildings and bisnesses have the no gun sign. . I’m glad I work in a mall that doesn’t have that. The gaurds may not have guns, but atleast they have tazers.

2. Identifing people that are a threat and getting them help (not a witch hunt, but I mean a guy like this THAT EVERY ONE KNEW IT COULD HAPPEN) I mean when you are affaid to show up to class and have to have gaurds at the door . . . 3.

3. Trunk Monkeys

- The Cat

P.S. As for the last one, I can’t be serious too much, it’s bad for the blood pressure.

MirCat on April 18, 2007 at 7:51 PM

You cannot study the rantings of a mad man….waste of time and effort…..

Mellen on April 18, 2007 at 7:52 PM

NBC News Pres was asked by Chrissy who the return addressee was and he only says it was “another name”. Seems like it would be at least interesting to note that it was the same name that was written on his arm.

faraway on April 18, 2007 at 7:52 PM

and I do not believe it can be cured….they must always take medciation.

Completely agree.

Slublog on April 18, 2007 at 7:52 PM

My theory on why he filed away the serial numbers on the guns… He did not want the guns to be traced back if they were discovered PRIOR to the attacks.

faraway on April 18, 2007 at 7:45 PM

This is what I call a good theory

- The Cat

MirCat on April 18, 2007 at 7:53 PM

He rants against Christianity and sends his letter to Olbermann’s network where he know’s it will be appreciated.

His audience might be puny but they are easy influenced and that makes Olbermann extremely dangerous.

Perchant on April 18, 2007 at 7:49 PM

Yes! It’s all Olbermann’s fault! I bet he had prior knowledge, too, but he let it happen because he thought he was going to get a big scoop, but then that stupid brian williams went and said they had to put it on the nightly news blah blah blah… he thought he was going to have this story our by Monday night, but the dumb kid had to go get the address wrong on the envelope.

But it’s ok, he steered attention away from himself early on by blaming Bush and Republicans, and giving MSNBC the idea for that gun control program. All to take the attention off of himself.

Make no mistake, it’s not if Olby knew, it’s when

dead-duck on April 18, 2007 at 7:55 PM

>does anyone else think that he sounds like Napoleon Dynamite when he’s talking?

That’s the first thing I thought. I kept waiting for him to say “Luckyyyy!”

Doghouse on April 18, 2007 at 7:58 PM

Demon-possessed?

PRCalDude on April 18, 2007 at 7:26 PM

I almost said that. I pity the psychologist handling this case.

Ouabam on April 18, 2007 at 7:59 PM

Hey Slublog,
I spent twenty years trying to convince my mother that you cannot reason with a schizophrenic……How long do you think it will take to convince this forum????
LOL….(Have at it folks…you are in for it!!!)

Mellen on April 18, 2007 at 7:59 PM

I find it hard to believe that the Napoleon voice he uses in the videos is his “real” voice. He clearly seems to be acting.

Anyone else notice the odd line where he talks about his “children”?

RightWinged on April 18, 2007 at 8:01 PM

I’ll say here what I said at Ace’s. It seems that he believed he was Ishmael or was speaking for him. Thus speaking out against Christianity and speaking of his “children” and “brothers and sisters.”

Rightwingsparkle on April 18, 2007 at 8:02 PM

Something akin to Air Martials, be it Trained RAs Profs or anyone that could be an opposing force(legal concieled carry ok?). A lot of office buildings and bisnesses have the no gun sign. . I’m glad I work in a mall that doesn’t have that. The gaurds may not have guns, but atleast they have tazers.

Woah. One in a million students are actually killed on campus, yes, it’s still more than it should be, but to make a bunch of new laws because of this is an overreaction. More kids are killed bike riding on their way to school because they aren’t wearing helmets.

Identifing people that are a threat and getting them help (not a witch hunt, but I mean a guy like this THAT EVERY ONE KNEW IT COULD HAPPEN) I mean when you are affaid to show up to class and have to have gaurds at the door

Two words: Forced lobotomies.

they must always take medciation.

Forced health care. Great idea…

Nonfactor on April 18, 2007 at 8:02 PM

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