Worrisome Giuliani poll data of the day!
posted at 4:21 pm on February 15, 2007 by Allahpundit
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Fox News just dropped a bag full of goodies. 41% of Dems want the Gorebot to enter stage left? More Democrats are following the Libby trial closely than “American Idol”?
Here’s the money, though.
The obvious, crucially important, yet inexplicably missing follow-up question: how many people in the red box in the first question are also in the red box(es) in the second?
Exit question: given that the same poll has Rudy with a 25-point lead over McCain head to head, how much do the social issues even matter?
Bonus exit question: how depressingly myopic is this? C’mon, guys. They’re tough, but we’ve seen tougher.
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But by “more frightening”, doesn’t that mean which is more likely to suddenly blow you up at any second, rather than conspicuously conquer a few faraway countries first?
Alex K on February 15, 2007 at 4:25 PM
The scariest part of your ‘bonus exit question’ is that 8% either didn’t know or answered NEITHER when asked who was worse, terrorists or Nazis.
dalewalt on February 15, 2007 at 4:27 PM
Who Cares?
Where is the Salt Lake Jihad Story????
Lone jihadists are becoming common, we cant ignore these, the MSM already does.
shooter on February 15, 2007 at 4:27 PM
I’d be willing to bet that they overlap to within just a few percentage points. Just makes sense.
I’m more interested in how many are Republicans that actually vote in primaries or straw polls.
mesablue on February 15, 2007 at 4:31 PM
Terrorists are not nearly as well organized or efficient as the Nazis. Just an observation. That’s all.
CyberCipher on February 15, 2007 at 4:33 PM
I can’t believe that anyone would be surprised, since most people that vote are not going to care one way or the other until a few months before the election. They are busy living their lives and trying to enjoy doing it. I know lots of people who couldn’t even tell you the name of ANY serious potential 08 candidate for certain, they simply are not interested enough this soon to even worry about it. So unless they are polling the far left or far right, they are just pissing into the wind.
NRA4Freedom on February 15, 2007 at 4:33 PM
Doesn’t it make more sense that they don’t overlap? People who care a lot about these issues will pay more attention to them and will seek out information on Rudy’s actual position.
Allahpundit on February 15, 2007 at 4:34 PM
Good point Shooter, I guess the American public doesn’t NEED to know anything unless it is BIG, and then the MSM will try to blame it on Bush.
NRA4Freedom on February 15, 2007 at 4:35 PM
How do you know he was engaging in jihad? Got a link? If so, send it to me.
Allahpundit on February 15, 2007 at 4:36 PM
Another interesting, but unanswered, question is how many people know about Guiliani’s position vis-a-vis gun control, and for how many of them it’s a potential deal-breaker.
Centerfire on February 15, 2007 at 4:37 PM
Abortion rates have been falling since Reagan and we still have Roe v. Wade as the “law of the land.” The abortion battle is being won on moral conviction. Giuliani’s stances on gun control and the environment worry me much more than his love of the liberal sacrament of abortion.
Valiant on February 15, 2007 at 4:38 PM
Could you imagine fighting Nazis under today’s conditions? Patton would never have gotten another command after the slapping incident. Though it would have been fun to watch the moonbats play dress up and slap each other at every protest.
rw on February 15, 2007 at 4:45 PM
On the Salt Lake City jihadist:
Valiant on February 15, 2007 at 4:47 PM
Not in a broad poll this early on. There are 36% who don’t know and 21% who think he is pro-life. That leaves a lot of room to get at least close to the numbers in the second question.
If only Republican primary voters are polled there will be a lot less overlap.
McCain is going to poll a lot better in that group.
mesablue on February 15, 2007 at 4:50 PM
Asking people who they fear more — current-day terrorists or dead Nazis — is kind of retarded.
SWLiP on February 15, 2007 at 4:51 PM
There’s no question that jihadists are much “tougher” than Nazi’s. I can’t think of anyone “tougher” although I’d say “scarier” than someone who wants to die.
Capitalist Infidel on February 15, 2007 at 4:55 PM
Tougher yes, but with a crazier ideology…I don’t think so.
These guys want to kill us because their theology tells them to do so. That is scary!
brtex on February 15, 2007 at 4:55 PM
Maybe some people don’t like having to choose between the two labels pro-choice and pro-life? What do you call someone who wants to ban late term abortions… are they to be lumped in with those who want to legalize abortion on demand for any reason whatsoever right up until the moment of birth? (I’m not trying to characterize Rudy’s position here… just saying that I’ve been polled myself before, and I tend to get pissed off at these kind of stupid false choices.)
Watcher on February 15, 2007 at 4:55 PM
Right now, this is still just a popularity/nameID contest. Believe me, the social issues will matter. It may not have as much weight as in the past, but when it comes down to a nominee, it will definitely be a factor.
CP on February 15, 2007 at 5:01 PM
So, by a 62%-17% margin, Republicans say terrorists are scarier than Nazis.
Explanation? Republicans watch too many “Hogan’s Heroes” reruns.
Ali-Bubba on February 15, 2007 at 5:09 PM
AP asks: “How do you know he was engaging in jihad?”
I guess the answer depends on if he was shouting “Allah ahkbar!” as he was killing the innocent or not.
georgej on February 15, 2007 at 5:14 PM
The 6% who can’t decide between Nazis or terrorists must be a) Olbermann viewers, b)extreme BDS sufferers or c) both.
JammieWearingFool on February 15, 2007 at 5:17 PM
Item/question 39 is really, really stupid. It’s like comparing super-evil to super-super-evil.
The world is complacent and hasn’t been tested/hurt enough by the jihadis yet.
They were (somewhat) united in fighting the Nazis and s/b again in fighting all forms of tyranny.
The bleeding leftie- and world-idealism means nothing, until they come to this conclusion. Might never be and therefore world-peace/harmony will remain what it is, a utopia.
Entelechy on February 15, 2007 at 5:21 PM
My gut feeling is that any republican/conservative who is “a lot less likely” to vote for a candidate who is pro-choice is probably going to feel the same about the pro-gay marriage. They are both conservative social issues.
I can’t think of, nor can I really envisage some conservative/republican going “Pro choice? Never!!! A life begins at conception!!! Abortion is just a fancy way of killing babies!!! . . . But gay marriage? Yep. I’m all for it.”
No, I just have a hard time envisioning that.
EFG on February 15, 2007 at 5:23 PM
I just hope Rudy enjoys watching gun owners vote for someone else.
Because that is exactly what is going to happen. No more nose holding for the sake of the party.
quax1 on February 15, 2007 at 5:27 PM
Rebuttal question: how many pro-lifers were in this poll?
steveegg on February 15, 2007 at 5:34 PM
Actually, georgej (at 5:14), when he shot the first 2, he said “Die motherf…….” But unfortuneately, what I saw in the first hours of coverage was that they “wouldn’t answer the door at his house”, but what I looked for and didn’t see was the phrase “authorities executed a search warrant…”
eeyore on February 15, 2007 at 5:36 PM
And this is why Gingrich is smart to be sitting out and not wasting money during this time. He’ll swoop in when people are paying attention and will look like a real conservative in shining armor compared to the rest of the field, whose images will be riddled with holes from 2 years of scrutiny.
NTWR on February 15, 2007 at 5:43 PM
I went to the link you provided. What I found most disturbing in the article was not FBI spokesman who is just doing the responsible thing in trying to keep from what may very well be just a simple case of a psychotic mass shooting. I found most disturbing what I saw as a potential case of failure to assimilate.
This actually bothered me. He came here from a war-torn Bosnia about 15 years ago with his family. And yet, after 15 years of living here, the surviving family appears not to have sufficient ties to their new home to want to bury their son here.
It isn’t proof of anything, including proof that they aren’t assimilated. But it did ping my antenae as being unusual.
So let me ask the commenters. Are there any of you who would think that this is a normal thing to do? Do any of you plan to be buried in a different country, or plan on burying relative in the same way?
I know Italian-Americans often times have strong ties to Italy. But I’ve never heard of any of them being shipped back to the peninsula for burial.
Ditto Irish-Americans.
Ditto German-Americans.
Ditto Japanese-Americans.
The only one I can think of is a Filipino-American who was shipped back to the Philippines after being killed in Iraq. But he was different, because his entire family was still living back in the Philippines.
So again, maybe I’m off-base on this one. But it sounded to me like this was evidence of a family or community that was not integrateing or assimilating to the American melting pot.
But I’d rather I was wrong.
EFG on February 15, 2007 at 5:43 PM
I think people are more afraid of the terrorists because of the randomness of their attacks. It’s not like a war where the fighting seems to be confined to battlefields. People knew who the enemy was and could confront them. Now, you just don’t know who may be a live bomb.
Rose on February 15, 2007 at 5:45 PM
All that matters is the right supreme court nominees. Many more conservatives are upset with Roe and the courts than committed to rigid positions on life/choice. Most conservatives would be contented if the issue were debated, wrestled with and decided by democratic process. Guiliani is clearly in this camp. Game, set, match.
Anil Petra on February 15, 2007 at 6:11 PM
If Guilliani is the nominee I’ll vote for him. But I’d rather have someone who truly believes in conservative principles. And right now aside from the also-rans there doesn’t seem to be anyone clearly articulating conservative principles.
We need a Newt, Snow or Santorum.
We need someone capable of making the right decision for the country and to hell with Political Correctness. No more Powell Doctrine.
Iblis on February 15, 2007 at 6:26 PM
Here’s ABC News shooter!
A = He a Muslin
B = He “wanted to kill a lot of people”
C = There are five dead innocents!
Need any more clarification from ABC?
Dread Pirate Roberts VI on February 15, 2007 at 6:27 PM
D = I can’t spell Muslin
Dread Pirate Roberts VI on February 15, 2007 at 6:27 PM
What scares me more?
Jihadis setting off a nuke in my home city or the Nazis invading Poland?
Yes, I agree. I really should be more concerned about Poland.
Sheesh…
Misha I on February 15, 2007 at 6:38 PM
All this talk of 2008 is getting OLD really fast!
IT’S THE 2ND MONTH OF 2007 FOR GOD’S SAKE. STOP THE MADNESS! WE HAVE WORK TO DO TO STOP PELOSI, REID, AND COMPANY RIGHT NOW!
SouthernGent on February 15, 2007 at 7:04 PM
How about this one:
http://michellemalkin.com/archives/006868.htm
It’s not definite, but highly suspect.
Lawrence on February 15, 2007 at 7:10 PM
Was it the community in general or the family that isn’t assimilating. It’s really hard to argue that in any large American city there isn’t some type of effort by the community to assimilate people.
Lawrence on February 15, 2007 at 7:12 PM
I have a hard time following AP, so maybe he’s saying this. But isn’t the real question (ie, the missing question) in that poll “given the choice between a pro-abortion Democrat and a pro-abortion Republican, which would you support, Dem, Rep, or Neither”?
Jaibones on February 15, 2007 at 7:33 PM
It looks like this election is basically going to come down to moderate conservative vs hard lefty. we’re going to have to choose between Hilary and rudy or mccain. It sucks, but in the end given those options I’d vote for rudy.
At least we know exactly where Rudy stands. McCain is a traitor to his own party.
One Angry Christian on February 15, 2007 at 8:32 PM
Only possible explanation for today’s lack of fear of Nazis …
… “Springtime For Hitler”
Lisa Condo on February 15, 2007 at 8:42 PM
To call McCain a traitor is unfair.
Allah asked: how much do the social issues even matter?
They matter a GREAT DEAL. Listen. I grew up in the Bible belt. Most Church going folk I know don’t care about politics. When it comes to actually voting they look up and ask simply, “Is he pro-life?” It’s a DEAL BREAKER. If he isn’t, he doesn’t get their vote.
It doesn’t matter how you or I feel. You can get mad at this “one issue” voting all you wish, but it doesn’t change the fact that that is a deal breaker for most religious conservatives.
So please don’t ask me to forgive Rudy for his pro-choice and pro-gay positions and then not expect me to ask you to forgive McCain for McCain/Feingold.
Rightwingsparkle on February 15, 2007 at 8:43 PM
Also, what this proves to me is what I knew all along…Most Republicans are not aware of Rudy’s positions on social issues. Which does account for his popularity. Once they are known, those poll numbers will drop.
Also, the primary voters pay much closer attention naturally, which is why I think Rudy can NOT make it throught the primaries.
Rightwingsparkle on February 15, 2007 at 8:46 PM
Which is more frightening, a dead rat on the sidewalk across the street, or a live rabid rat in your house?
Bad Penny on February 15, 2007 at 8:47 PM
Did he, as a serviceman, lay down an oath to the Constitution?
Did he, as a Senator, take the initiative in creating a bill that, in effect, outlaws freedom of political speech?
That’s treason, and the correct term for somebody who commits treason is, you guessed it:
Traitor.
Misha I on February 15, 2007 at 8:55 PM
Misha,
There is alot more to it than that. The way you describe it is spin. Do you honestly think that he went into it thinking,”Yeah, I will outlaw some aspects of freedom of speech. Yeah, that’s the ticket.” How absurd! He went into honestly trying to stop money from completely corrupting the system! Hate him for it all you want, but that was what he wanted to do! Saying he is a traitor is irresponsible. It makes my blood boil to read such name calling for a man who suffered horribly for 5 1/2 year for his country (especially when he didn’t have to!)
And I swear, if it’s the last thing I do, I’ll find a way to get McCain to explain it.
Rightwingsparkle on February 15, 2007 at 9:04 PM
Those sort of litmus tests are exactly where we get Big Government Republicanism from… is being 100% pro-life and 100% anti-gay all it takes for someone to be able to call themselves a Conservative anymore?
Watcher on February 15, 2007 at 9:24 PM
His intentions don’t matter, assuming that you’re right about them, which isn’t at all certain. Unless you are McCain, of course.
The road to Hell is paved with good intentions, and there is nothing negotiable about the Bill of Rights. Nothing. The oath isn’t negotiable either, no matter how pure of heart you think that you are, and I’m more than willing to entertain the notion that HE felt that he was just that.
Listen, I can make a pretty damn convincing case in favor of not letting poor people vote, for the good of the economy and survival of the country. It’s really quite simple. Not because I wish to disenfranchise the poor, but because I realize the inevitability of us going bankrupt if people can vote themselves largesses out of the treasury.
So are you saying it would be OK for me to suggest (which I never would) abolishing, at least partially, the right to vote because of my “good intentions” and “deep concern for the budget?”
I don’t for a second think that you are. You’d call me on it and point out, as well you should, the outrageousness of such a suggestion.
Benedict Arnold did a great deal for his country before he decided to turn on it too.
Nothing can take the heroics and honor he earned in Viet Nam away from him, but it doesn’t buy him a free pass either.
I’ll be looking forward to that, because I too would love to hear that explanation.
Misha I on February 15, 2007 at 9:26 PM
And Sparkle, I want to add this and it’s very important: Please don’t think I find any satisfaction in pointing this out, because I do believe that he deserves much better.
As a matter of fact, it is a huge disappointment to me and I wish that it wasn’t so, more than you know.
But reality can be massively disappointing and unpleasant like that at times, which is something that I truly hate.
Misha I on February 15, 2007 at 9:45 PM
What I am saying is that I don’t McCain’s sacrifice and service to his country should be ignored and his obvious ability to lead should be scoffed at just because of this!!
Is any politician’s record perfect?? Has any public servant ever done everything we wanted or how we wanted?
I could name things that Reagan did wrong, but does that negate every good and powerful thing he DID do? Of course not.
These are scary times. It is VITAL that we elect men who can lead us through a world changing violently. We need someone who understands war, who understands sacrifice, who understands why we fight. We are not in a time where we can dismiss a great leader for a past mistake.
His service FAR outweighs his mistakes.
For God’s sake, if we don’t step up to this, we will end up with a Pres. Hillary, who will be a social and economic disaster, not to mention how our safety will be compromised.
This is a time for heros,Misha….and McCain, you must admit, is a hero.
We need a hero.
Rightwingsparkle on February 15, 2007 at 9:49 PM
I couldn’t resist.
;-)
Rightwingsparkle on February 15, 2007 at 9:58 PM
He most certainly was, and nothing would please me more than to see him realize his mistakes, work to undo them and become one again.
I’d hate for him to go down in history as what he has become.
(And I am SO going to get you for that video. My ears, my EEEEEARSSS! ;-) )
Misha I on February 15, 2007 at 10:19 PM
Well, yeah. But that’s not the point. Is there enough of an effort? Is there enough assimilation going on? Why is this mans body being shipped back to Bosnia?
I have no idea if he was a jihadi, or a trench coat mafia copycat.
Either way, that burial thing stood out to me.
EFG on February 15, 2007 at 10:28 PM
Recruit Newt!
RobertCSampson on February 15, 2007 at 10:47 PM
No, it doesn’t. I admire McCain as a man, but cannot abide him as a politician.
Slublog on February 15, 2007 at 11:26 PM
Worrisome? Not for us Romney fans. Dum, Dumb, Dumb, Dumb.
To answer your last question, the Nazis didn’t get nukes. There are intentions and capabilities. The former is why we should be scared.
Bill C on February 16, 2007 at 12:06 AM
This is really an interesting time for the Republican party. They have an opportunity to define who they are and what they stand for.
Are they for free and open political speech (McCain-Feingold, the Fairness Doctrine)?
Are they for border enforcement or open borders?
Small government libertarians or big government compassionate conservatives?
Are they the party of Life, Liberty and the Pursuit of Happiness or are they socialist-lite?
There are some very good candidates in the mix now and more may run. Early polls are nothing but exercises in name recognition and gathering data from folks who don’t vote in primaries (which have notoriously low turnouts).
cmay on February 16, 2007 at 8:08 AM
From what I hear, McCain is a liar (don’t remember what he did, exactly). Personally, I’d rather vote pro choice than pro choice pretending to be pro life. A lot of my American pro life friends feel the same way.
Darth Executor on February 16, 2007 at 9:22 AM