Gallup world poll: What makes a Muslim radical?
posted at 2:32 pm on November 20, 2006 by Allahpundit
Answer: the same things that make a Muslim moderate. Plus a little extra income and education.
How sound is the methodology here, though?
Respondents who said 9/11 was unjustified (1 or 2 on a 5-point scale, where 1 is totally unjustified and 5 is completely justified) are classified as moderates. Respondents who said 9/11 was justified (4 or 5 on the same scale) are classified as radicals.
Blowback
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The right has been saying this for years.
urbancenturion on November 20, 2006 at 2:37 PM
Most of us on this board knew this already – now, the rest of the world will get it because, well because it’s a Gallup World Poll.
Entelechy on November 20, 2006 at 2:38 PM
Now that’s a title, possibly worthless, but a title.
Why not ask them Where they went to school, What the teachers or professors taught them, Do they know anyone who died, Do they know anyone that’s been martyred, and What do they think of martyrdom and the promises that come with it?
I’m quite positive the ‘Hotair panel’ and HA commenters could do much better in the questions chosen to determine “What makes a radical muslim.”
shooter on November 20, 2006 at 2:45 PM
What if there truly is no difference? What if what we need to do is to continue to pay the price of suffering a slow trickle of casualties (that we have now) to slowly weed out enough “bad guys” to clean up the messes that have been left to fester for years because the “west” has refused to face the eventual, inevitable threat.
Or worse, what if the solution is to counteract the demographic explosion with a level of violence and (dare I say it) genocide?
Will I be banned for just asking these questions? Probably. I must say that I disagree with those who say there is no military solution. I think there is only a military solution.
The only other option is for the “moderate” Muslims to do the weeding out themselves (and I mean violently). Unless and until that happens, it is incumbent on the west to defend itself. If we are too cowardly to face facts (like all of Europe) then we probably don’t deserve to live. BTW, I have my guns and ammo at home, and I won’t be letting my CHL lapse again.
urbancenturion on November 20, 2006 at 2:47 PM
Well, Ward Churchill and Cindy Sheehan are radical Muslims now, if that helps.
As for the meta-question, it’s the jihad!
Pablo on November 20, 2006 at 2:48 PM
Ah. There are no moderates.
Just Rich, Explosive Muslims and Poor Economist Muslims.
The truth is prevealed!
RiverCocytus on November 20, 2006 at 2:52 PM
I am with you urbancenturion. I am afraid the answer to what makes a Muslim radical, is actually reading the Koran. So in that light, all that is needed is time.
Rustyw on November 20, 2006 at 2:59 PM
Book recommendation very relevant to this topic:
Guests of the Ayatollah
A spellbinding book about the 1979 Embassy takeover and hostage crisis in Iran…”America’s first confrontation with Islamo-fascism”. It’s available as book/CD at Amazon or download to your ipod at audible.com. The author reads it himself and it is just fantastic!
RushBaby on November 20, 2006 at 3:07 PM
I’m with both of you. Imagine if the bible said you must convert or kill muslims before you can get to heaven. Imagine that this has been preached by hundreds of thousands for over a fifteen ceturies. TWO Billion Christians trying to get to heaven?
Radical muslims? It is so ingrained, it could be evolutionary.
shooter on November 20, 2006 at 3:09 PM
Sorry shooter, but the Bible does essentially say that. Armageddon is basically a genocide commited by God and His army. Of course, we won’t be engaging in that war until He Himself appears in order to lead us in battle. But if one is a believer, the Bible certainly prophetically describes that eventual war.
urbancenturion on November 20, 2006 at 3:17 PM
The problem with Radical Muslims, Leftists, Hippies, etc. is that they don’t have enough crushing debt.
The same crushing debt that makes us go to work every damn day leaving little time to protest, hang out, throw rocks at tanks, and generally have a good ol’e time!
Dread Pirate Roberts VI on November 20, 2006 at 3:17 PM
This belief, and the fact that they keep women, those who brung them, in a lower class and treat them, in many cases, worse than a variety of animals, keeps me from accepting that the religion is moderate altogether.
Entelechy on November 20, 2006 at 3:19 PM
Now Shooter,
That is New Testament revelations stuff isn’t it? The whole thing doesn’t occur until the Muslims, i.e. The false prophet Mohamed, (if you believe that converting or killing everyone who doesn’t agree with you is the work of a false prophet), take over the world. Even then a thousand years go by.
So revolutions are the apocalyptic text of Paul right?
Rustyw on November 20, 2006 at 3:26 PM
err i mean urbancenturion
Rustyw on November 20, 2006 at 3:26 PM
The most surprising thing about this article is that the authors neglected to report what % were “moderates” and what % were radicals. Why?
RedWinged Blackbird on November 20, 2006 at 3:28 PM
You’re in the Canadian Hockey League? Cool!
db on November 20, 2006 at 3:36 PM
I don’t know when it happens, but the war takes place and it amounts to a genocide, which by human standards is too awful to contemplate.
hehe, no… Concealed Handgun License. Significantly more dangerous than a body check.
urbancenturion on November 20, 2006 at 3:49 PM
…I don’t know if “counteract(ing) the demographic explosion with a level of violence and…genocied” is necessary.
Violence to the level where the weenies who’re now pushing people out the door wearing dynamites belts are p*ssing in their britches at the prospect of the US response would be sufficient.
Whey they’re not risking only their own lives, but also the lives of their relatives, their neighborhoods, and their “civilization” (such as it is), they *MIGHT* think better of this whole “shahid” thing.
If not, seeking them out and hastening their ambitions on will become an inevitable necessity.
Puritan1648 on November 20, 2006 at 3:54 PM
And they both prefer dead Jews to live ones.
Attila (Pillage Idiot) on November 20, 2006 at 3:54 PM
I know… I was just funnin with yaI mean, darn, I was hoping you could get me tickets :^)
db on November 20, 2006 at 3:56 PM
Its all in the interpretation. Some people can read the Koran and come up with a religon of peace. Some people can listen to Ozzy and think they are supposed to blow their brains out.
BohicaTwentyTwo on November 20, 2006 at 4:03 PM
Isn’t John Esposito the “expert” Robert Spencer is always calling out as an apologist?
BTW: Spencer may be on O’Reilly tonight.
forest on November 20, 2006 at 4:03 PM
how did they divide the ‘moderates’ from the ‘radicals’?
And as I recall Jesus basically said simply believing (and accepting him as you savior) is the way to heaven.
No mention of killing non-christians, hating or humiliating them. Conversion is mentioned – but by being a ‘witness’ and not by the sword (convert or die!). Love your enemy as opposed to Kill the Infidels…..
CrazyFool on November 20, 2006 at 4:09 PM
…more to the point, somebody do one of these self-serving, foregone-conclusion polls to find out what would *UNMAKE* a radical Muslim.
We would probably find out that what would satisfy and “un-radicalize” these jokers is the same thing that would placate the internationalist Left:
* Give them *ALL* that they demand,
* Give it to them *NOW*,
* Anticipate what they’ll want tomorrow and give *THAT* up,
* Annihilate Israel and every man, woman, child, pet, plant and microbe therein,
* Repeat as necessary,
* Convert *EVERYONE* to Islam…*THEIR* flavor of Islam….
…and then, you have the problem of which flavor of Islam, which imam, which Middle Eastern cultural grandee, and which political microfaction one aligns to determines the direction of the *NEXT* trumped-up, overly-dramatic, bloody and seemingly endless round of butchery comes *NEXT* out the Middle East, the insane asylum of Planet Earth…which is saying something.
Who cares *HOW* they radicalized. The point is to get them to see their self-interest in accepting civilization and stopping…or in finding and fixing ‘em in other, more Old-Testament-y sorts of ways.
Puritan1648 on November 20, 2006 at 4:13 PM
urbancenturion:
Sorry shooter, but the Bible does essentially say that. Armageddon is basically a genocide commited by God and His army. Of course, we won’t be engaging in that war until He Himself appears in order to lead us in battle. But if one is a believer, the Bible certainly prophetically describes that eventual war.
urbancenturion on November 20, 2006 at 3:17 PM
The New Testament Book, Revelations, is about a confrontation with the “Antichrist-may or may not be Muslim- and the forces of evil”. Don’t see anything intepretive as genocide there. The Apocalypse (world ending) by definition is not genocide as everyone dies.
enigma00825 on November 20, 2006 at 4:20 PM
enigma00825,
Yes but who is the false prophet? Could it be the one who put forth a religion that contains bastardized versions of two previous religions, the same religion that contains nothing new other than codes for killing, controlling and treating others? Some say Islam is a curse upon humanity. Some say that religion in general is a curse upon humanity. However, one could not fault a Christian for believing that the false prophet is indeed the sacred prophet of Islam.
Of course you’re point is that the ensuing battle against the Beast is not genocide, but if you consider it genocide against the flesh, well then shooter has a point. Christ return dose supposedly mark the end of the flesh material world along with the beginning of the Kingdome of heaven.
I think it says that anyway.
Rustyw on November 20, 2006 at 4:38 PM
I agree their definition of what constitutes a radical is deeply flawed.
I think an apt comparison that might make sense to Americans is Eric Rudolph. What is the difference between Rudolph, a convicted abortion clinic bomber and murderer, and others who are against abortion, especially those with “Run, Rudolph, Run” bumperstickers? You see, they both have the same basic philosophy, but only Eric Rudolph actually carried out violence, not the thousands, perhaps millions who sympathized with his cause and perhaps felt his acts were justified.
It seems to me the same thing is true of Muslims. A consistent thread in the Muslim world is that Muslims do not hate Americans, they hate American policy. The difference, therefore, between moderates and radicals is how to achieve that change. If they take the route Eric Rudolph took – violent action, then they’re radicals. If they take a peaceful approach, then they’re moderates.
Similarly, there’s an interested thread over at Micheal Totten’s website that references relevant articles and blogs on the state of Arab liberalism and democracy movements.
NPP on November 20, 2006 at 4:49 PM
Great point NPP. Well stated.
Rustyw on November 20, 2006 at 5:15 PM
I see the whole moderate/radical argument a little differently, I think its the age old ploy of the few trying to seizing power over the many; just like communism.
Zorro on November 20, 2006 at 6:16 PM
The point is that they have already stated that, unlike we who worship life, they worship death. They have been sending their children to blow themselves up, as well as Israelis on a regular basis. They don’t care about their own lives, the lives of their relatives, or their neighborhoods. And they think that their civilization, such as it is, will outlive that of the west because they have the will to die and kill while we do not. I truly don’t think we can intimidate them into backing down.
At what point do we acknowledge the inevitable necessity, though? Do we do it early when we can still handle the problem (though not painlessly); or do we wait until it is patently obvious that there is an inevitable necessity because we have several American cities that vaporize in a glowing mushroom cloud. By then it is too late. If they control all the oil in the Middle East (which has been their goal since the Shah fell, which is why we supported Saddam in the first place), then they can afford an arsenal big enough to eradicate the world.
The reason I wondered aloud whether genocide is the only solution is because they have the confidence that they do precisely because there are so many of them worldwide. 1.2 Billion. With a B. 10% radicalized. At least. Do western cultures have the stomach to kill a hundred million people? Plus those who will be radicalized by that act? Not even close.
At this point, I feel there is no hope. Christ’s second coming will be required to eradicate the scourge Islam. Make no mistake, it will be a genocide, but that doesn’t mean that every human will die. It just means that a very large number will. Then Christ will establish His kingdom (as was stated above). He will still rule over people on the Earth. That’s why He’s the King. The Christians wil help Him rule. That’s why He’s the King of kings. Rev 2:10 talks abuot God giving His overcomers a crown; and in 3:21 He says He will share His throne.
Puritan1648, I’m starting to favor those Old-Testament-y ways, myself.
urbancenturion on November 20, 2006 at 6:39 PM
Unfortunately where there’s smoke there’s fire.
Jihadis don’t exist without “Moderates” or more telling still, Jihadis don’t function without Moderates.
The Moderates believe and support the philosophy and the Jihadis act on that philosophy. They share responsibility.
And there’s a lot of smoke coming from Islam.
Speakup on November 20, 2006 at 7:09 PM
Not yet, but we will. It will most likely take more attacks on us, but eventually we’ll fight back – hard.
And while Islam has 1.2 Billion, keep in mind, our Hindu friends may get pretty ticked off soon as well. These continued bomb attacks are getting very, very old.
If the West starts to seriously fall, at some point it may be China to the rescue. It’s one thing to enjoy watching us struggle and falter against the Islamic plague but China won’t want to see the establishment of the Caliphate turning it’s eye towards China next. At some point China may have to come in carrying a very big stick, just for it’s own self protection.
The other path may be that the liberals suddenly realise that their freedoms are being threatened. I was talking with this young lesbian lady who works at a store I frequent. We talk frequently. She knows I’m pretty liberal socially but in terms of this particular war, I’m VERY right wing. I pointed out how I didn’t understand gays who hate President Bush since he’s fighting a war for them. Islam wants her and her girlfriend dead, and they do execute them regularly. She seemed to understand and agree. There was a glimmer of light, which is probably why I like her in the first place.
I’d personally like to see our politicians actively state that they want the United States to be an Islamic country. Come out in favour of establishing Sharia law, advocate the public execution of gays, forced marriages, sharia rape laws, the whole nine yards all in the glorious name of Islam. Liberal heads would explode.
Canadian Infidel on November 20, 2006 at 8:15 PM
What makes a muslim radical? ISLAM!
There IS no “moderate” or “radical” muslim…
There are two types of muslims:
First, you have the ones that fly airplanes into buildings. They are the *fundamenalists* who believe the koran is the word of allah and that all infidels must convert or die. The fundies can be subdivided into two more groups: Those who do the actual killing of infidels and those who support those who do the killing.
For the second type of muslim, you have the ones that do NOT fly airplanes into buildings. They are the *apostates*. They also can be subdivided into two more groups: Those who help the infidel by fighting against the fundie muslims and those who do not take either side.
Apostates are worse than infidels in the eyes of the fundies because they (the apostates) oughta know better than the stupid, dirty infidels.
Fundies and apostates, NOT radicals and moderates.
Tony737 on November 20, 2006 at 8:44 PM
What makes a Muslim radical?
How about a coward Mullah, $25,000, 72 virgins, and a promise of eternal martyrdom.
Sounds like a good deal to me.
Send in the next martyr to be, please.
pocomoco on November 20, 2006 at 8:47 PM
That’s probably what they all say. Might’ve had second thoughts, had they bothered to read the fine print: “…the promise of 72 virgins”
SpartRan on November 21, 2006 at 8:48 AM
It’ll take more than a Gallup poll to put an end to decades of Marxist assumptions.
Kralizec on November 21, 2006 at 9:51 AM
The thing that makes a Muslim radical is BEING A TRUE MUSLIM! What part of this is difficult for you to grasp? Islam is NOT Chrisitanity, there has been no “new covenant” or testament whereby Mohammed says, “All that other kill the infidel stuff? Didn’t mean it. My bad.” The extremists have the backing of the CLERICS right? I mean it’s these IMAMS and MULLAH”S that really run the show right? They’re the ones who have declared that it is “HALAL” to kill infidels right? Well that means that Allah enacts NO PUNISHMENT ON A MUSLIM FOR KILLING INFIDELS! And this is according to the RELIGIOUS LEADERS! Because you can find some EXILED progressive to denounce the Jihad from his place of hiding, means nothing! What are the IMAMS, the INTERPRETERS of the KORAN saying in the Arabic World and on the Arab street? NEWSFLASH: They’re calling for JIHAD and calling the suicide bombers “MARTYRS”. See, the “good” Muslims that you seem to long for, are few and far between.
What is a religion if it is NOT constituted by the Clerics and the worshippers? DUH. The right wing religious nutbags hiding out in the woods of Montana are REPUDIATED BY the religious RIGHT in this country! Falwell and Robertson, while I certainly have differences with them doctrinally, do not give marching orders to the Klan, or have anything to do with those who MISUSE their faith. The relationship between the IMAMS, CLERICS, SCHOLARS and TERRORISTS is a paternal relationship with the aformentioned giving marching orders, blessings, financial help and most importantly, ABSOLUTIONS from sin to the latter.
Terrorism would end tomorrow is the Imams and Clerics deemed it to be sin, but it is officially condoned and called, “Halel”.
Soothsayer on November 21, 2006 at 3:54 PM