Sy Hersh: U.S. army in Iraq is the most “violent and murderous” in American history

posted at 6:51 pm on November 1, 2006 by Allahpundit

Waffles hands him the baton and off he goes. Winter Soldier ’06:

Hersh described video footage depicting U.S. atrocities in Iraq, which he had viewed, but not yet published a story about.

He described one video in which American soldiers massacre a group of people playing soccer.
“Three U.S. armed vehicles, eight soldiers in each, are driving through a village, passing candy out to kids,” he began. “Suddenly the first vehicle explodes, and there are soldiers screaming. Sixteen soldiers come out of the other vehicles, and they do what they’re told to do, which is look for running people.”

“Never mind that the bomb was detonated by remote control,” Hersh continued. “[The soldiers] open up fire; [the] cameras show it was a soccer game.”

“About ten minutes later, [the soldiers] begin dragging bodies together, and they drop weapons there. It was reported as 20 or 30 insurgents killed that day,” he said.

If Americans knew the full extent of U.S. criminal conduct, they would receive returning Iraqi veterans as they did Vietnam veterans, Hersh said.

“In Vietnam, our soldiers came back and they were reviled as baby killers, in shame and humiliation,” he said. “It isn’t happening now, but I will tell you – there has never been an [American] army as violent and murderous as our army has been in Iraq.”

He goes on to speculate that invading Iraq was one of the 12 steps in Bush’s AA program.

Sy Hersh, leftist hero.

So notorious is he for making sensational accusations during his speaking engagements that New York magazine devoted an entire feature to the subject last year. Title: “Sy Hersh Says It’s Okay to Lie (Just Not in Print).” It’s like buying a Happy Meal to get the toy — you buy a ticket to a Sy Hersh lecture, you’re pretty much guaranteed a bombshell about war crimes in Iraq. Because even if it’s not true, it’s True.

On the podium, Sy is willing to tell a story that’s not quite right, in order to convey a Larger Truth. “Sometimes I change events, dates, and places in a certain way to protect people,” Hersh told me. “I can’t fudge what I write. But I can certainly fudge what I say.”

He told the Chris Suellentrop, the author of the New York piece, the same story about the soccer game — except this time, it was a hypothetical. Then there’s this:

Last July, not too long after the Abu Ghraib story broke, Hersh spoke to the annual membership conference of the American Civil Liberties Union. He stood before the crowd and in mid-speech appeared to talk to himself. “Debating about it,” he muttered, then paused. “Um.” Clucked his tongue. “Some of the worst things that happened that you don’t know about. Okay? Videos,” he said. “And basically what happened is that those women who were arrested with young boys, children, in cases that have been recorded, the boys were sodomized, with the cameras rolling, and the worst above all of them is the soundtrack of the boys shrieking. That your government has. They’re in total terror it’s going to come out.”

What Hersh said wasn’t entirely correct. His book Chain of Command would deliver the authoritative Seymour M. version: “An attorney involved in the case told me in July 2004 that one of the witness statements he had read described the rape of a boy by a foreign contract employee who served as an interpreter at Abu Ghraib,” Hersh wrote. “In the statement, which had not been made public, the lawyer told me, a prisoner stated that he was a witness to the rape, and that a woman was taking pictures.”

Horrifying stuff. But key details were different from the impression Hersh gave to the ACLU crowd. And the Sy version raced halfway across the Internet before Seymour M. could get his boots on.

I’ll go out on a limb and predict that the video of the alleged soccer-game massacre will never surface. And also that Hersh won’t suffer one scintilla of backlash from his fanboys for engaging in this slander.

Exit question for our military readers: which type of anti-war protester do you prefer, the “babykiller”-shouting Vietnam version or the “hope you lose but come home safe” handshake-and-a-smile Iraq model? With the latter you save on dry cleaning. But with the former, at least you know where you stand.


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But we support the troops.

They’re heroes, really. Anyone who thinks we’d speak badly of them must be crazy!

If Kerry did resign, Massachusetts would replace him with Sy Hersh.

Pablo on November 1, 2006 at 6:54 PM

I love this guy, he’s kind of like Everything That’s Right With America – he’s completely subversive, openly aids our enemies, and makes a damn good living doing it.

Sing with me: My country tis of thee…

Enrique on November 1, 2006 at 6:55 PM

This is the kind of thing that is going to make Kerrygate a gift that keeps on giving.

Thanks Sy ;)

thirteen28 on November 1, 2006 at 7:00 PM

There is one always consistent fact about liberals: to be liberal, you must not know history.

And since I’m a history buff of sorts – I literally laughed out loud at the idea that our current military is the most “violent and murderous” in our history.

Not. Even. Close. It would take amazing effort to have that poor of a knowledge of our history – even our recent history.

As for the incident in question … what the @^$!^!#$ do you think is going to happen if you attack an armored column?

And does it matter at all whether the people in the area might have been fully aware of the ambush about to take place?

Jesus wept. Liberals have absolutely no grasp on reality.

Professor Blather on November 1, 2006 at 7:01 PM

Our Soldiers did WHAT to little boys?

It sounds like Sy is just expressing his own erotic wet dream that he WISHES would happen to him.

Tony737 on November 1, 2006 at 7:01 PM

Screw that subversive moron, Hersh. Sorry for being crude but sometimes you need the effect.

rplat on November 1, 2006 at 7:01 PM

I’m sure its just satire or something when its proven to be BS

Defector01 on November 1, 2006 at 7:03 PM

Vietnam war retreads are such boring people. both in the media and in the Democrat party. America deserves better. But we support the troops took a big hit this week when another Vietnam retread put a face and words to how you people really feel.

Hindsight does not substitute for intelligence and second guessing is not a strategy.

tarpon on November 1, 2006 at 7:04 PM

Well, at least he didn’t call the troops stupid. Just war criminals. Asshole. If this footage actually existed, does anyone, even the people wearing a Kool-Aid I.V., think that it wouldn’t be running on TV 24/7? Especially with the midterms just around the corner? Lying shitbag.

ReubenJCogburn on November 1, 2006 at 7:04 PM

Exit question for our military readers: which type of anti-war protester do you prefer, the “babykiller”-shouting Vietnam version or the “hope you lose but come home safe” handshake-and-a-smile Iraq model?

To be honest, I think the liberal ‘only poor people join the Army’ meme is the most disgusting. At least with the spitters you can chase them for a bit. Good times had by all.

JasonG on November 1, 2006 at 7:05 PM

Sixteen soldiers come out of the other vehicles, and they do what they’re told to do, which is look for running people.”

Because of course, they’re retards, just like Kerry said.

Sometimes I change events, dates, and places in a certain way to protect people

Well, it’s also because I make shit up.

He stood before the crowd and in mid-speech appeared to talk to himself. “Debating about it,” he muttered, then paused.

See what I mean? I mean, this is kinda tough to make shit up when you’re put on the spopt like this…..

If Americans knew the full extent of U.S. criminal conduct, they would receive returning Iraqi veterans as they did Vietnam veterans, Hersh said.

Well, of course, American soldiers are, like, total ‘tards, so they wouldn’t like, kick your ass our detach your head from your torso or anything if you spit on them, right?

Actually, being the ladies and gentlemen that they are, they probably wouldn’t. But I’m no gentleman, and I’m more than happy to hang out at airports if Sy “fucknozzle” Hersh is there to greet the troops.

HerrMorgenholz on November 1, 2006 at 7:07 PM

Sy Hersh is an antiAmerican pseudo intellectual whose ego is out of control. I hate to waste keystokes talking about him. I feel like Imus on Kerry, “Stop it, just stop it. Go home, get on the bike, windsurfing, anything, I’m begging you, just stop.”

d1carter on November 1, 2006 at 7:08 PM

Taking the heat off John… nice try

Viper1 on November 1, 2006 at 7:10 PM

Hersch must have a really, really good security system at home…

Jaibones on November 1, 2006 at 7:10 PM

“Exit question for our military readers:”

I prefer the anti-war protestor type that actually is crazy enough to put his or her hands on me so I can in turn return the favor 100 fold. These people are sick, sick, sick and no amount of mental health care or drugs can cure them.

darwin on November 1, 2006 at 7:15 PM

our founding fathers gave us the second admendment for a reason, i think that reason is getting closer.

1776…REMEMBER WHY

rocked on November 1, 2006 at 7:19 PM

John Kerry: “I was in Cambodia, delivering weapons to the Khmer Rouge. I can prove it. I have the hat.”

Sy Hersh: “US war criminals masquerading as soldiers are massacring and sodomizing Iraqis left and right. I can prove it. I have the video tape.”

Uh huh.

Spurius Ligustinus on November 1, 2006 at 7:27 PM

I noticed he said this at McGill, why doesn’t he do us a favor and just stay in Canada.

lowandslow on November 1, 2006 at 7:28 PM

Seditionist Sy’s attempt to deflect attention from Kerry will only result in more independents voting against Democrats.

WWIII on November 1, 2006 at 7:28 PM

Sodomy in the military? I thought people like him want that?

Make up your minds, please!

SouthernGent on November 1, 2006 at 7:36 PM

His assertion makes his point of view very clear. To state the modern military is the most “violent and murderous” in history is a statement revealing his belief the military has always been this way. Clearly, an anti-war, anti-military opinion. Syclops should not be allowed to speak in public any more.

thedecider on November 1, 2006 at 7:37 PM

Dementia is a terrible affliction.

Somewhere, a glue factory awaits this assclown.

JammieWearingFool on November 1, 2006 at 7:38 PM

C’mon people. Just let it go already. It’s only words, after all. Forgive & forget.

/HEAVY sarcasm

Ugly on November 1, 2006 at 7:40 PM

I’m not knocking your for posting this AP, but I don’t know if I would unless it starts to get play outside of lefty circles. I just don’t want to bring any attention to this piece of shit. I remember the unsubstantiated ‘sodomizing kids’ crap…

I notice in the hypothetical version of his soccer story, he says that the bad guys ran in to the soccer game. Well, depending on the circumstances, it’s always possible that people got caught in the crossfire.. but considering everything this guy says is bullshit, that’s irrelevant right now.

No, what’s more important is that he ends the hypothetical like this:

And maybe somebody there tells me about what happened.”

Who? Who told you about it? Jesse MacBeth? Or that other liar who talked about killing the little girl and stacking bodies in trailers, etc. (anyone remember that story, and have a link for anyone who might not know what I’m talking about?). What about the “little girl” who wrote letters to that college paper, about her dad in Iraq. All of these were lies, and I’m sure there are plenty more who are telling journalists what they want to hear, even if it’s complete lies.

RightWinged on November 1, 2006 at 7:46 PM

The incredible thing is in less than a week there’s a good chance we’re going to turn a portion of the control of this country over to a group of people who deep down feel the same way Hersh dose..scary isn’t it?

mlong on November 1, 2006 at 7:54 PM

I love you guys! rofl…
Now we hear from Kerry’s little pal in the 5th column Fourth Estate, Sy “My Lai Pulitzer” Hersh–why do we have to share a country, or even a world, with these numbnuts?!?
“Guess what? Our soldiers are not only stoooooopid, but they’re violent killers, too! Stupid AND violent. It’s like we have an Army of Mongos or Incredible Hulks, except they’re not green!”

And yet our soldiers were the same humitarian, humane rescuers who went into New Orleans to save and supply the victims of Katrina and to restore order there (as well as rescue and supply the Asian victims of the 2005 tsunami and they rescued the refugees from the Hezbo Lebanon war just this summer!)
Liberalism is a mental disease that must be eradicated!
I hate these people!!

Jen the Neocon on November 1, 2006 at 8:03 PM

knock knock neo the matrix has you ! I been lookin for this guy. Mr. parallel universe dude! Injecting venom in our proud culture for so many years. Hey have you heard they found a set of ancient scrolls. Yeah seems there was a misprint on the ten commandments. There was actually twelve of them. uh uh lets see eleven thalt shall stand up and fight when attacked. and twelve greedy,lying story tellers will relive your own stories in hell!

sonnyspats1 on November 1, 2006 at 8:16 PM

Waffles hands him the baton and off he goes. Winter Soldier ‘06:

LMAO…

The Ugly American on November 1, 2006 at 8:30 PM

Liberalism is a mental disease that must be eradicated!

Jen the Neocon on November 1, 2006 at 8:03 PM

A fish story:

I’ll give you the perfect example of what happens when liberals brainwash the sheeple with their stories, lies, and fabrications. It’s a fish story, but it’s true. A number of years ago, I went to a Chinese restaurant with another person. I won’t mention her name because I don’t want to embarrass her.

This particular restaurant had a fish tank filled with live fish, where the customer picked out the fish she wanted to eat. The waiter would come out with a net. He’d stick it in and pull out the fish you wanted, cook it, and then you’d eat. Most people paid not attention to it.

I was sitting with my back to the tank. I don’t remember what I ordered, but it wasn’t fish. The person I was with didn’t order fish, either. Throughout our meal, she kept looking over my shoulder at the fish tank. All of a sudden, she broke out in tears that wouldn’t stop. I handed her a napkin and asked what was wrong. You know, I’m thinking maybe she ordered something a little too spicy.

She managed to say, “No. The fish… they’re going to die. They’re all gonna die!” She just wouldn’t stop, she wouldn’t let it go. I figured some liberal save-the-whale nutcase probably traumatized her back in kindergarten with the story of Free Willy, and now she was having a panic attack. Or at least an attack of conscience that something must be done.

You know what I had to do? I had to buy all the fish in the tank. I put them in buckets and took them down to San Francisco Bay to “release” them in the water. It’s a true story. You don’t have to believe it. I did it.

Now, a sane person would know that was a foolish thing for me to do. In fact, in a sane society, I’d be in a straightjacket for what I did. Why? Not all the fish were from San Francisco Bay, and I’m sure predators ate them shortly thereafter. But to a brainwashed liberal, we had to save the fish. (Of course, you never see that kind of emotional concern from liberals when it comes to saving unborn children who are “all going to die.”)

If liberalism prevails in this culture, a mosquito will become a protected species under hate-crime legislation. Sadly, evidence that the mental disease of liberalism is spreading is everywhere.

~ from ‘Liberalism is a Mental Disorder’ by Michael Savage

Ugly on November 1, 2006 at 8:46 PM

the responsibility for the invasion of Iraq lies with eight or nine members of the administration who have a “neo-conservative agenda”…

…it’s the height of irony to see an assimilated Jew wrining his hands and mouthing the standard Leftist Evil Root Cause Of All History: “It’s the Jewwwwwwwwwwwwwws!”

“You have a collapsed Congress, you have a collapsed press. The military is going to do what the President wants,” Hersh said. “How fragile is democracy in America, if a president can come in with an agenda controlled by a few cultists?”

…fragile democracy…this is the *THIRD* election since 9/11, the one coming up the second since Baghdad’s fallen, none of them walk-aways, all pretty hard fought…yeah…this “evil” man is just running roughshod over democracy.

How about FDR and his New Deal “cultists”? How about JFK and his “brain trust” cultists? How about Clinton and his perjury-and-fellatio-enabler “cultists”?

The problem with being a premier investigative journalist is that it’s other investigative journalists who bestow the crown…and who can trust them?

Puritan1648 on November 1, 2006 at 8:47 PM

“In Vietnam, our soldiers came back and they were reviled as baby killers, in shame and humiliation,” he said. “It isn’t happening now…”

…pining for the “good old days” there, Sy?

You did your part to fuel the fire back in them good old days…get your wrinkly old behind in gear, and there’re enough nutroots Kos-istas who’ll jump aboard your rickety old train. Get a move on, Methuselah!

Puritan1648 on November 1, 2006 at 8:49 PM

D’oh!!

That was taken from ‘The Savage Nation’, not ‘Liberalism is a Mental Disorder’.

Sometimes I hate my brain.

Ugly on November 1, 2006 at 8:51 PM

Ah, yes, the “Glory days” never seem to ever really come back for good ol’ Seymour, do they?

And to think that he is considered to be among the “best of the best” Pulitzer Prize winners in America –

Couldn’t he just go somewhere where he and his “talents” would be truly and fully appreciated?

Like either Venezuela? or perhaps as the new UN
minister of propaganda, I mean, media representative?

Pleeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeese?

Emmett J. on November 1, 2006 at 9:20 PM

As one of the spat upon…………..that’s why God gave me two hands….I can punch with both of them.

Limerick on November 1, 2006 at 9:21 PM

And to think that he is considered to be among the “best of the best” Pulitzer Prize winners in America

…who awards the Pulitzer? I rest my case….

Puritan1648 on November 1, 2006 at 9:33 PM

I thought Sy Hersh was dead! Ooops.

His secret clip has probably been posted on YouTube – 6 months ago.

hotdax on November 1, 2006 at 10:25 PM

(“In Washington, you can’t expect any rationality. I don’t know if he’s in Iraq because God told him to, because his father didn’t do it, or because it’s the next step in his 12-step Alcoholics Anonymous program,” he said.)

Waffles hands him the baton and off he goes. Winter Soldier ‘06:

Ain’t that the truth.

Texyank on November 1, 2006 at 11:36 PM

(“In Washington, you can’t expect any rationality. I don’t know if he’s in Iraq because God told him to, because his father didn’t do it, or because it’s the next step in his 12-step Alcoholics Anonymous program,” he said.)

Waffles hands him the baton and off he goes. Winter Soldier ‘06:

Ain’t that the damn truth. . .

Texyank on November 1, 2006 at 11:38 PM

And for the unvarnished, anti-waffle truth, go to the nice folks at . They have a great site with fantastic links.

Emmett J. on November 1, 2006 at 11:57 PM

As one of the spat upon…………..that’s why God gave me two hands….I can punch with both of them.

Limerick on November 1, 2006 at 9:21 PM

Then punch. Twice. With each.

=’)

And thanks.

Ugly on November 1, 2006 at 11:58 PM

still getting used to the links, meant to be a link to

wintersoldier.com

Emmett J. on November 1, 2006 at 11:59 PM

Emmett J.

The first link worked. Thank you.

Ugly on November 2, 2006 at 12:03 AM

Book this man. Get this man on the news, CNN, MSNBC, Olbermein show, get this man out in public. Book him with Kerry, Pelosi, Reid.
I love this guy!!

right2bright on November 2, 2006 at 12:32 AM

The first link worked. Thank you.

Ugly on November 2, 2006 at 12:03 AM

You’re very welcome.

Emmett J. on November 2, 2006 at 12:41 AM

Sy who?
He’s dead to me. He’s getting no cyber-ink from me. Guess he’s looking for another big Prize for My Lie (Lai) storytelling.

Can’t say much more about him here, ’cause I can’t use the words I’d use elsewhere. ;-)

Here’s everything you might want to read about the Swifties’ vs. Oompa Loompa sKerry, all listed nicely for ya.

bamapachyderm on November 2, 2006 at 1:06 AM

Eeeek! A stray apostrophe! (Swifties’? Argh.)

bamapachyderm on November 2, 2006 at 1:06 AM

And how many were killed in South Vietnam after we left?

htom on November 2, 2006 at 1:20 AM

And how many were killed in South Vietnam after we left?

htom on November 2, 2006 at 1:20 AM

Too many – but of course Seymour wouldn’t write about that, now would he?

Emmett J. on November 2, 2006 at 1:26 AM

Shouldn’t we have exceptions in the law that allows for members of the military to pound on these type of guys?

RightWinged on November 2, 2006 at 2:53 AM

Fuck that traitorous piece of shit all day.

Lazarus on November 2, 2006 at 2:56 AM

This same kind of soldier once also killed hundreds of thousands of Nazis (some of whom were probably helplessly asleep in their fortified positions when the bombs hit), too. The murderous s.o.b.’s!

And they also broke down the gates of death camps, probably without permission. The baby-killing maniacs!

Hersh has drowned in his own bile.

We see only the bobbling corpse and hear the escaping gases of putrification.

profitsbeard on November 2, 2006 at 3:05 AM

Hersh, the guy who claimed that the US was planning to use nuclear weapons on Iran.

Interestingly enough, Hersh also wrote that the Niger forgeries were carried out by CIA agents opposed to the Iraq war.

Let’s just say Hersh loves stirring shit up.

Seixon on November 2, 2006 at 3:48 AM

You have to wonder about a guy who rushes so blindly to embrace the side of people who want to kill him. It’s a strange form of self-hatred where he’s so disgusted with himself, that he believes any culture that would allow him to earn a living must be destroyed.

It’s pathetic.

And what’s more pathetic are the people who believe him.

MoxArgon on November 2, 2006 at 6:30 AM

A question for Sy (hershey highway for brains),
Were our troops not violent under Dem presidents?
Oh, I fogot. Under Dem presidents our military was “sennnsitive, caarrring, lovvving, forrrrgivvving”.
Memo to Sy; war is violent.
If we could only train the libs to hate our enemies as much as they hate America….
mountainmanbob

mountainmanbob on November 2, 2006 at 7:54 AM

Typical “d”emocrat. To play on an old phrase…A sheep in wolf’s clothing.

oldelpasoan

oldelpasoan on November 2, 2006 at 9:04 AM

I hope he’s lying -because if not, he really is the lowest of the low-life on the planet!

If he has evidence anyone (including someone in the military) committed crimes like that, he should be showing it from every venue he can. His first priority though, seems to be personal profit and glory. I don’t know words strong enough to describe the contempt I feel for anyone who would do that. Then there’s also the fact that sitting on things like that casts uncertainty over the entire military.

So in my opinion, either he’s lying or he’s witholding evidence for personal profit -with a side-order of trying to influence the election.

taznar on November 2, 2006 at 10:28 AM

What a tool. He longs for another My Lai. Funny how “progressive” thinkers want to live in the past. Maybe they’re not as “progressive” as advertised. Kerry said the Republicans want to turn the clock back to 1958? Why do the Democrats want to turn it back to 1968?

Were our troops not violent under Dem presidents?
Oh, I fogot. Under Dem presidents our military was “sennnsitive, caarrring, lovvving, forrrrgivvving”.

I vaguely remember all those “progressive” MSM and celeb types telling us how important it was to bomb the snot out of Serbia a few years ago. Slick Willie’s adventure in tail-wagging.

irishsquid on November 2, 2006 at 12:36 PM

“In Vietnam, our soldiers came back and they were reviled as baby killers, in shame and humiliation,” he said. “It isn’t happening now, but I will tell you – there has never been an [American] army as violent and murderous as our army has been in Iraq.”

A liberal bastard hating the troops? Tell me something new.

JackM on November 2, 2006 at 2:02 PM

“About ten minutes later, [the soldiers] begin dragging bodies together, and they drop weapons there. It was reported as 20 or 30 insurgents killed that day,” he said.

If Americans knew the full extent of U.S. criminal conduct, they would receive returning Iraqi veterans as they did Vietnam veterans, Hersh said.

I think Kerry and Sy need to make an extended trip to Iraq to investigate these charges. Hopefully they won’t get fragged while they are there….

E L Frederick on November 2, 2006 at 2:38 PM

I much prefer to be a baby-killer. (BTW, they taste just like chicken)

I keep encountering the smarmy “I support the (evil, murderous, lying, war-crime committing) troops” types, and they waste far too much of my day. The “baby-killers” are over and done with in milliseconds, and I’m free to ignore them.

RustMouse on November 3, 2006 at 9:17 AM

Interesting, the knee jerk reaction that what Hersh is saying can’t be true. It seems to me given what our troops are trained to do, versus what the reality on the ground in Iraq is, the issue is not whether there have been crimes, but why they are not more common. These guys are being shot at by not just civilians, but by members of the Iraqi police and army. What do you expect?

honora on November 3, 2006 at 12:36 PM