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	<title>Comments on: North Korea: Getting nowhere</title>
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		<title>By: Tom Blumer</title>
		<link>http://hotair.com/archives/2006/07/12/north-korea-getting-nowhere/comment-page-1/#comment-28140</link>
		<dc:creator>Tom Blumer</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 14 Jul 2006 00:00:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://hotair.com/archives/the-blog/2006/07/12/north-korea-getting-nowhere/#comment-28140</guid>
		<description>It may be that the NoKos are simply holding out on keeping the trains they have &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.strategypage.com/qnd/korea/articles/20060705.aspx&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;stolen from the Chinese&lt;/a&gt; recently (noted by me at &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.bizzyblog.com/?p=2517&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;the third item here&lt;/a&gt;:

&lt;blockquote&gt;….. food and fuel supplies sent to North Korea have been halted, not to force North Korea to stop missile tests or participate in peace talks, but to return the Chinese trains the aid was carried in on. In the last few weeks, the North Koreans have just kept the trains, sending the Chinese crews back across the border. North Korea just ignores Chinese demands that the trains be returned, and insists that the trains are part of the aid program. It’s no secret that North Korean railroad stock is falling apart, after decades of poor maintenance and not much new equipment. &lt;/blockquote&gt;
I would think Chinese leaders are intensely ticked about this.

Tom
BizzyBlog.com</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It may be that the NoKos are simply holding out on keeping the trains they have <a href="http://www.strategypage.com/qnd/korea/articles/20060705.aspx" rel="nofollow">stolen from the Chinese</a> recently (noted by me at <a href="http://www.bizzyblog.com/?p=2517" rel="nofollow">the third item here</a>:</p>
<blockquote><p>….. food and fuel supplies sent to North Korea have been halted, not to force North Korea to stop missile tests or participate in peace talks, but to return the Chinese trains the aid was carried in on. In the last few weeks, the North Koreans have just kept the trains, sending the Chinese crews back across the border. North Korea just ignores Chinese demands that the trains be returned, and insists that the trains are part of the aid program. It’s no secret that North Korean railroad stock is falling apart, after decades of poor maintenance and not much new equipment. </p></blockquote>
<p>I would think Chinese leaders are intensely ticked about this.</p>
<p>Tom<br />
BizzyBlog.com</p>
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		<title>By: gary</title>
		<link>http://hotair.com/archives/2006/07/12/north-korea-getting-nowhere/comment-page-1/#comment-28099</link>
		<dc:creator>gary</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 13 Jul 2006 21:31:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://hotair.com/archives/the-blog/2006/07/12/north-korea-getting-nowhere/#comment-28099</guid>
		<description>Iranian scientists were present at the missile launches last week in North Korea, it has been reported.  Sales may have slipped due to the failure of the multi-stage one that was presumably pointed toward Hawaii, but the alliance of the two members of the &quot;axis of evil&quot; were on show for those watching.  This was not on the front page of the New York Times, because it was not anti-American enough.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Iranian scientists were present at the missile launches last week in North Korea, it has been reported.  Sales may have slipped due to the failure of the multi-stage one that was presumably pointed toward Hawaii, but the alliance of the two members of the &#8220;axis of evil&#8221; were on show for those watching.  This was not on the front page of the New York Times, because it was not anti-American enough.</p>
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		<title>By: Shmo</title>
		<link>http://hotair.com/archives/2006/07/12/north-korea-getting-nowhere/comment-page-1/#comment-27955</link>
		<dc:creator>Shmo</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 13 Jul 2006 16:15:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://hotair.com/archives/the-blog/2006/07/12/north-korea-getting-nowhere/#comment-27955</guid>
		<description>sorry.  I guess the delay got me.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>sorry.  I guess the delay got me.</p>
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		<title>By: Shmo</title>
		<link>http://hotair.com/archives/2006/07/12/north-korea-getting-nowhere/comment-page-1/#comment-27942</link>
		<dc:creator>Shmo</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 13 Jul 2006 16:02:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://hotair.com/archives/the-blog/2006/07/12/north-korea-getting-nowhere/#comment-27942</guid>
		<description>As for the Chinese today, this is the first time they have been the headliner on international diplomacy in a long time, and “face” is important.  I don’t think they are playing a game, but they probably feel that slow and steady wins the race. The bottom line is that North Korea is a mess and China knows it.  They also know that Kim is too far gone and are probably working as we speak to develop regime change there without millions of refugees.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>As for the Chinese today, this is the first time they have been the headliner on international diplomacy in a long time, and “face” is important.  I don’t think they are playing a game, but they probably feel that slow and steady wins the race. The bottom line is that North Korea is a mess and China knows it.  They also know that Kim is too far gone and are probably working as we speak to develop regime change there without millions of refugees.</p>
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		<title>By: Shmo</title>
		<link>http://hotair.com/archives/2006/07/12/north-korea-getting-nowhere/comment-page-1/#comment-27940</link>
		<dc:creator>Shmo</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 13 Jul 2006 16:00:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://hotair.com/archives/the-blog/2006/07/12/north-korea-getting-nowhere/#comment-27940</guid>
		<description>Good analysis, but Zhukov was a fine Russian general and did good things in Mongolia  against Japan and at Kursk against Germany.  Good logistics, planning, movement of armor, not a rabble.  Also, maybe the Chinese invasion of North Korea on Thanksgiving day was a rabble, but very effective against the U.S. forces in the early 1950’s. 

As for the Chinese today, this is the first time they have been the headliner on international diplomacy in a long time, and “face” is important.  I don’t think they are playing a game, but they probably feel that slow and steady wins the race. The bottom line is that North Korea is a mess and China knows it.  They also know that Kim is too far gone and are probably working as we speak to develop regime change there without millions of refugees.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Good analysis, but Zhukov was a fine Russian general and did good things in Mongolia  against Japan and at Kursk against Germany.  Good logistics, planning, movement of armor, not a rabble.  Also, maybe the Chinese invasion of North Korea on Thanksgiving day was a rabble, but very effective against the U.S. forces in the early 1950’s. </p>
<p>As for the Chinese today, this is the first time they have been the headliner on international diplomacy in a long time, and “face” is important.  I don’t think they are playing a game, but they probably feel that slow and steady wins the race. The bottom line is that North Korea is a mess and China knows it.  They also know that Kim is too far gone and are probably working as we speak to develop regime change there without millions of refugees.</p>
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		<title>By: Fritz</title>
		<link>http://hotair.com/archives/2006/07/12/north-korea-getting-nowhere/comment-page-1/#comment-27905</link>
		<dc:creator>Fritz</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 13 Jul 2006 15:00:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://hotair.com/archives/the-blog/2006/07/12/north-korea-getting-nowhere/#comment-27905</guid>
		<description>One can not ignore the danger of Lil Kim&#039;s regime collapsing, leaving a vacuum of power.  China would have to endure millions of refugees and the potential of Warlords taking over WMD pointing them at China.  This lunatic dictator is like Stalin, he doesn&#039;t care if he survives, his end will include all out war.  The Cuban Missile Crisis ended when Castro told Kruschev to launch the nukes for the glory of socialism.  Kruschev wanted the Soviet Union to survive, took away the nukes from the lunatic&#039;s territory.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>One can not ignore the danger of Lil Kim&#8217;s regime collapsing, leaving a vacuum of power.  China would have to endure millions of refugees and the potential of Warlords taking over WMD pointing them at China.  This lunatic dictator is like Stalin, he doesn&#8217;t care if he survives, his end will include all out war.  The Cuban Missile Crisis ended when Castro told Kruschev to launch the nukes for the glory of socialism.  Kruschev wanted the Soviet Union to survive, took away the nukes from the lunatic&#8217;s territory.</p>
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		<title>By: honora</title>
		<link>http://hotair.com/archives/2006/07/12/north-korea-getting-nowhere/comment-page-1/#comment-27886</link>
		<dc:creator>honora</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 13 Jul 2006 14:23:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://hotair.com/archives/the-blog/2006/07/12/north-korea-getting-nowhere/#comment-27886</guid>
		<description>woulda, shoulda, coulda....

I suspect China is playing a very deep game as well, and so far, doing a damn good job.  Kim may or may not believe the Chinese will support him--hard to predict what crazy people will do, much less think.  At the end of the day, China will leverage this to their advantage and squash Kim like a bug when it turns to their advantage.

I&#039;ve worked with Asians a lot, and they have an admirable quality by and large--they take the long view.  I believe China has long abandoned the notion of dominance via military power and is content to slowly eat our lunch economically (or is it ecomonicly???)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>woulda, shoulda, coulda&#8230;.</p>
<p>I suspect China is playing a very deep game as well, and so far, doing a damn good job.  Kim may or may not believe the Chinese will support him&#8211;hard to predict what crazy people will do, much less think.  At the end of the day, China will leverage this to their advantage and squash Kim like a bug when it turns to their advantage.</p>
<p>I&#8217;ve worked with Asians a lot, and they have an admirable quality by and large&#8211;they take the long view.  I believe China has long abandoned the notion of dominance via military power and is content to slowly eat our lunch economically (or is it ecomonicly???)</p>
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		<title>By: darwin</title>
		<link>http://hotair.com/archives/2006/07/12/north-korea-getting-nowhere/comment-page-1/#comment-27866</link>
		<dc:creator>darwin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 13 Jul 2006 12:44:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://hotair.com/archives/the-blog/2006/07/12/north-korea-getting-nowhere/#comment-27866</guid>
		<description>All this crap going on now is the result of NOT being the &quot;imperialist&quot; nation loony lefties always accuse us of being.

1) - We should have listened to Patton and marched into Russia.

2) - We should have pounded the crap outta China during the Korean war and finished the job until North Korea and China both sued for peace.

You give these despots an inch and they take a mile.  That mile becomes so incredibly difficult to reel back in.  Imagine what western Europe would have become if we would have just gone home after WWII.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>All this crap going on now is the result of NOT being the &#8220;imperialist&#8221; nation loony lefties always accuse us of being.</p>
<p>1) &#8211; We should have listened to Patton and marched into Russia.</p>
<p>2) &#8211; We should have pounded the crap outta China during the Korean war and finished the job until North Korea and China both sued for peace.</p>
<p>You give these despots an inch and they take a mile.  That mile becomes so incredibly difficult to reel back in.  Imagine what western Europe would have become if we would have just gone home after WWII.</p>
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		<title>By: DannoJyd</title>
		<link>http://hotair.com/archives/2006/07/12/north-korea-getting-nowhere/comment-page-1/#comment-27862</link>
		<dc:creator>DannoJyd</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 13 Jul 2006 12:06:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://hotair.com/archives/the-blog/2006/07/12/north-korea-getting-nowhere/#comment-27862</guid>
		<description>Even http://www.atimes.com/atimes/Korea/HG14Dg01.htmlSouth Korea&lt;em&gt; isn&#039;t getting through to them.

&lt;blockquote&gt;The sides were absurdly far apart, according to reports from the closed-door sessions, with North Korea insisting the missiles were needed for the defense of all Korea, North and South, not just North Korea. 

Finally, the North Koreans walked out on Thursday after South Korea&#039;s Unification Minister Lee Jeong-seok flatly rejected their claim that the North&#039;s Songun or military first policy covered both Koreas equally. The talks were originally to have gone on until Friday. &lt;/blockquote&gt;

Kim has to believe that China will support him. Nothing else makes sense.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Even <a href="http://www.atimes.com/atimes/Korea/HG14Dg01.htmlSouth" rel="nofollow">http://www.atimes.com/atimes/Korea/HG14Dg01.htmlSouth</a> Korea<em> isn&#8217;t getting through to them.</p>
<blockquote><p>The sides were absurdly far apart, according to reports from the closed-door sessions, with North Korea insisting the missiles were needed for the defense of all Korea, North and South, not just North Korea. </p>
<p>Finally, the North Koreans walked out on Thursday after South Korea&#8217;s Unification Minister Lee Jeong-seok flatly rejected their claim that the North&#8217;s Songun or military first policy covered both Koreas equally. The talks were originally to have gone on until Friday. </p></blockquote>
<p>Kim has to believe that China will support him. Nothing else makes sense.</em></p>
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		<title>By: DannoJyd</title>
		<link>http://hotair.com/archives/2006/07/12/north-korea-getting-nowhere/comment-page-1/#comment-27852</link>
		<dc:creator>DannoJyd</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 13 Jul 2006 10:51:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://hotair.com/archives/the-blog/2006/07/12/north-korea-getting-nowhere/#comment-27852</guid>
		<description>Right on, Bryan, and I believe that China is playing a very deep game. Hip wader deep to be exact.

The only good thing I see comming out of this is that we have the &lt;a href=&quot;http://calsun.canoe.ca/News/Columnists/Levant_Ezra/2006/07/10/1676965.html&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;&#039;Star Wars&#039;&lt;/a&gt; anti-missile program. If it is sucessfully used the next time that Kim launches his missiles that certainly wouldn&#039;t make the nuke desiring militant countries too happpy.

Putin needs a good swift kick. I wonder if Bush is up to the task. He certainly has the &lt;a href=&quot;http://news.monstersandcritics.com/europe/article_1180220.php/Putin_and_Bush_to_seek_deeper_nuclear_cooperation_at_summit&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;opportunity&lt;/a&gt; right now.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Right on, Bryan, and I believe that China is playing a very deep game. Hip wader deep to be exact.</p>
<p>The only good thing I see comming out of this is that we have the <a href="http://calsun.canoe.ca/News/Columnists/Levant_Ezra/2006/07/10/1676965.html" rel="nofollow">&#8216;Star Wars&#8217;</a> anti-missile program. If it is sucessfully used the next time that Kim launches his missiles that certainly wouldn&#8217;t make the nuke desiring militant countries too happpy.</p>
<p>Putin needs a good swift kick. I wonder if Bush is up to the task. He certainly has the <a href="http://news.monstersandcritics.com/europe/article_1180220.php/Putin_and_Bush_to_seek_deeper_nuclear_cooperation_at_summit" rel="nofollow">opportunity</a> right now.</p>
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		<title>By: gmoonster</title>
		<link>http://hotair.com/archives/2006/07/12/north-korea-getting-nowhere/comment-page-1/#comment-27838</link>
		<dc:creator>gmoonster</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 13 Jul 2006 05:39:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://hotair.com/archives/the-blog/2006/07/12/north-korea-getting-nowhere/#comment-27838</guid>
		<description>Yes, great analysis!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Yes, great analysis!</p>
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		<title>By: EFG</title>
		<link>http://hotair.com/archives/2006/07/12/north-korea-getting-nowhere/comment-page-1/#comment-27834</link>
		<dc:creator>EFG</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 13 Jul 2006 05:26:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://hotair.com/archives/the-blog/2006/07/12/north-korea-getting-nowhere/#comment-27834</guid>
		<description>Very compelling analysis, Bryan.  Better than anything I can remember in a very long time.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Very compelling analysis, Bryan.  Better than anything I can remember in a very long time.</p>
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